West Coast Connection Forum
DUBCC - Tha Connection => West Coast Classics => Topic started by: LakersAlldaWay on August 04, 2007, 12:10:11 AM
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In light of the new XXL blog that has gotten all the angry hip-hop/Dre fans riled up, I made this post for some SERIOUS discussion on Dre's last album. Forget release dates and all the drama...what are you guys hoping Dre does to revitalize hip-hop like he promises to do?
We all know that beats really set the tone in terms of structure and sometimes content of songs. I think Dre's gonna emphasize the "structure" aspect of the music, and shift the paradigm away from three verses and a hook.
I was listening to Don't Get Carried Away and noticed how during Nas' verse the beat sounds different to accompany Nas' voice/flow. Like the strings get more dramatic in the background...it really differentiates Nas from Busta in the song.
What I think Dre could be moving towards for the Detox is having certain "characteristics" of the music repeat when a certain rapper comes on. I know he's expressed how he wants his final album to transcend hip hop into a more cinematic approach (this is what prog and other types of rock have been experimenting with for a long time). Attaching a certain instrument or sound to a rapper makes them more of a character and familiarizes the listener with his/her "character" so to speak. Now some of you might be put off by this, but it could be subtle things like something in the drums that is added in or a certain instrument.
Also, I don't know how much rock you guys listen to, but some artists like The Mars Volta structure albums that seamlessly flow from one song to the next. Usually the songs transform, or carry on a certain sound that gradually switches up. Interesting things come up from this. For example, the beginning and end of the album could sound structurally and musically alike, but the middle reaches depths or heights that don't sound like the intros/finales. Or the entire album completely changes from beginning to end, but the change is gradual and suspenseful.
These ideas might seem to complicated or "not hip hop" but I think Dre could really change the game with a cinematic approach to the Detox. It would truly be a masterpiece if pulled off together. What do you guys think?
...Another thing I want to add is that even though songs may blend, the songs can be taken individually and still satisfy the listener. This creates an effect of being able to get into the CD at different levels - the casual approach where the typical fan just bumps the singles/skips around, and another level where someone could sit down and listen to the whole thing like watching a movie. Same thing goes for a good book...on the outside it could be a gripping action novel that someone reads to pass time, but underneath it could have endless layers you could analyze over and over again.
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Everything u said was on point with makin' the album play like a movie if u wanted to go that deep in listening to the album.........that would be raw........u know that Dre gonna come with something that is new and never thought of........honestly Im just wantin' to hear some raw new Dre beats on an album that has "Detox" on the cover............
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For me honestly, I don't a) even think it'd gonna come out before 2009, and b) am expecting a masterpiece beyond my wildest dreams or something that is totally not my taste...
I hope its a grand masterpiece
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New classic Doctor music, i hope Snoop, Kurupt & Nate gon be on it too (would be dope)
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Really good post man, +1.I gotta say that if Dre has taken up the idea for an album that you described in your post, it would be something spectacular for me, since I haven't been able to experience such an approach in the past.
And if he decides to go anopther route, with an approach we may have or haven't discussed, I expect my reaction to be like the above one, i.e. I'll hope for ALOT when I get the chance to listen to Detox.
And another ting, production aside, I'm also expecting lyrics to be above average at least
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I hope it's not like 2001, with a huge list of guests. I'd prefer if Dre picked like 8 artists, and filled the album with combinations of them. I like the idea of lots of co-producers, get a good mix of sounds going. Nate, Cube and Snoop are must haves, but if he stuck people like Kurupt or Game on their, the album would suffer.
THE WORST would be, if every track featured different artists, just for promotion. Like if he put Lil' Wayne on their or something. Stick to west coast artists, and use good ones.
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I just hope that it actually comes out. ;)
I read somewhere before about him incorporating different signature instruments for each artist like "Peter and the Wolf." That would be interesting and creative for a Hip-Hop album and would definitely give it that cinematic appeal like Lakersalldaway was saying.
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what am i hoping for ......... a classic
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what am i hoping for ......... a classic
On Point Mayne!!!!
Further on this, i would love Music that will echo through the years!!
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what am i hoping for ......... a classic
pretty much
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do you mean what I expect or what I hope for?
I hope for features like DPGC, Roscoe, Kokane, MC Eiht, Xzibit, Ice Cube, MC Ren and maybe a bay collabo with another veteran like Too $hort. I also hope for some singin in the hooks and a bit g-funk sound and of course some new bangin shit. and another skit with people fuckin lol
what I expect:
just nothing. I expect wack features all over the album like g-unit, em, d-10, obie and other bring shit. I expect a release in late 08 if not 09. I expect nothing new musically. I don't think Detox will be the classic that it should be.
I know I sound very pessimistic, but if my fears won't come true, it will be a nice surprise for me.
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timeless music. on point lyrics. clear mastering. top notch production. no g-unit. a track with dre/snoop/game.
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do you mean what I expect or what I hope for?
I hope for features like DPGC, Roscoe, Kokane, MC Eiht, Xzibit, Ice Cube, MC Ren and maybe a bay collabo with another veteran like Too $hort. I also hope for some singin in the hooks and a bit g-funk sound and of course some new bangin shit. and another skit with people fuckin lol
LOL not happening nobody but you and another couple of lames in here wants that kind of shit on detox 8)
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timeless music. on point lyrics. clear mastering. top notch production. no g-unit.
yeah exactly and a good front/back/inside cover...
the 2k1 one was cheap
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dre is gonne give us a classic
bottom line
dre is dre
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I hope "Detox" will not be overflowed with features and I pray to good that people like 50 Cent, Lil Wayne, T.I. and so one will not have a guest appearance on it. Only the classic team from the Death Row days including Snoop, Nate, Cube, Ren maybe Warren an some actually cats like Game and Bishop. Features from Busta and Eminem would be OK too, but I hope that Dre going back to the classic Westcoast sound like in the good old days
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Im hopin for some classic west coast shit
i want on there:
dpg
snoop
xzibit
nate dogg
kokane
butch cassidy
knoc-turn'al
hittman
mc ren
bishop lamont
WC
ice cube
young maylay
warren g
roscoe
king tee
the 1s in colour are the ones i think actually have a chance, the others is wishful thinking
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I don't care who's on it. I just want every song to be so good that I can listen to it for the rest of my life.
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I hope "Detox" will not be overflowed with features and I pray to good that people like 50 Cent, Lil Wayne, T.I. and so one will not have a guest appearance on it. Only the classic team from the Death Row days including Snoop, Nate, Cube, Ren maybe Warren an some actually cats like Game and Bishop. Features from Busta and Eminem would be OK too, but I hope that Dre going back to the classic Westcoast sound like in the good old days
Thats what Im sayin...........old school gangsta spit.........I can only hope that he dont flood the album with 50 but wouldnt be surprised to see 50 on more than 1 track..........I just want to see Snoop, Game, Cube, Nate, Ren and Warren G.........maybe even some Rage, Knoc..........and Butch Cassidy on a hook............
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No doubt detox WILL be filled with features...what's wrong with that? so was the chronic and 2001 and they were classics
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No doubt detox WILL be filled with features...what's wrong with that? so was the chronic and 2001 and they were classics
I hear that..........I could only hope for an album with more Dre than guests but with Dre bein' such a perfectionist then if we wanted that we would have to wait till our next lifetime.......... ;)
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all i ask for is a cd with great longtime continual replay value like his first two.... and in todays rap world, that is asking alot...lol.
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What do you think Detox's sound will be like? Like that snippet "Once Again" (produced by dr dre and kevin farpella) with an Orchestra movement?
Or a smooth piano sound like "Lost Ones" on Jay-Zs album and "Imagine" on Snoop Doggs album.
I think it was going to be all piano like "Imagine", "Lost Ones", "30 Something" and "Been Through The Storm". A whole album like that would be hot. A whole album like that "Once Again" snippet also would be hot I think. I'm just interested in seeing what he will use for Detox.
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i just hope it comes out at all
and that devin tha dude is on there
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01 - Cinematic (Morning to night - a day in compton/california)
02 - Co Producers (Kanye, The Runners, RZA, Lil' Jon, Hi Tek, DJ Paul/Juicy J, Just Blaze, The Neptunes, Mel Man, Daz, Warren G)
03 - Guests (Snoop, Kurupt, 2Pac, Biggie, Eazy, NWA, Eminem, 50 Cent, Spider Loc, Young Buck, Game)
04 - DVD behind the scenes
05 - Remix Disc
06 - The DETOX story in the album credits (the story of the character, kinda like a comic book)
07 - Manaj and Hood Surgeon DVD
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People That Dont Want On It
Eminem
50 Cent
Jay-Z
G-UNIT
Pretty much anybody thats not westcoast
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Something that I personally enjoy as much as 2001 and Chronic. I couldnt give two shits if it doesnt go plat or isnt a world wide hot but as long as its a west coast sounding album then i'm happy. Don't care if non west coast artists are on it cause there arent that many great west coast artists atm.
I'm pretty sure he'll have a couple bangers that are on par with Still Dre, Nuthin But A G Tang, Let Me Ride, Next Episode etc...
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I am secretly hoping that DOC will actually spit a verse... That would be dope as hell!! 8)
I also hope the usual guests: Snoop, DPG, Cube, Bishop Lamont, Game...
But what I just want is Dre to drop that record and to do his thang on it!
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im hoping its worth this fuckin wait!
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- Sick original beats which are still gonna sound fresh in 2020.
- Some tracks with rap legends like Rakim, KRS-One, Scarface or Ice-T for example.
- Some tracks with underground/new rappers.
- No tracks with corny pop stars like Justin Timberlake.
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if Dre were to pony up some pay to get an unreleased Pac verse to throw on there that'd be tight hopefully
it'd be dope to see some Dre solo's
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People That Dont Want On It
Eminem
50 Cent
Jay-Z
G-UNIT
Pretty much anybody thats not westcoast
true homie but to bad cuz all of them will be on that album :-\
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Because Detox is Dre's last album, it will most likely be a double-disc album that is sure to fuck the Cadillacs, clubs and conventions good like foreplay. Dre is a bad ass producer who knows the ins and outs of beat making, but most importantly direction. A lot of producers beef on him because he steals beats, but remember that you can't be a producer if you just make beats. There needs to be coaching, instructions, rules - that's why Dre is nicknamed the Doc for a reason.
Beat handling - keep it all Dre. He did it since The Chronic and Chronic 2001. He will be coaching producers, however, so keep an eye out for some "no-namers."
Guest stars are gonna be very interesting. Most likely, it will be every choice artist that has worked with Dr. Dre throughout his music career. Snoop Dogg, Xzibit, Ice Cube, MC Ren, DJ Quik, Kurupt, Daz Dillinger, The Game, Cypress Hill, Too Short, Knoc'turnal, Warren G, Nate Dogg, Bishop Lamont, Ras Kass, 40 Glocc, Lil' Eazy E, and other familiar west coast names - they'll be in it.
Who's also kicked it with the Surgeon General? Eminem, Jay-Z, Nas, Busta Rhymes, Lil' Wayne, Eve, Jadakiss, Obie Trice, 50 Cent & G-Unit, Gwen Stefani, Mary J. Blige. But do not forget - Joell Ortiz is part of the Aftermath roster, and Omar Cruz might seal one of Doc's beats on his upcoming Sign Of The Cruz album.
Suffice to say, anything can happen.
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I don't give a fuck who is on it. As long as it's good which follows no guidelines.
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fuck that it aint never coming out
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I know we got the full length LA Times interview, but was the GQ interview ever posted?
The LA Times interview was pretty good, but the interviewer didn't ask much about Detox itself.
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First of all, I think Dre should expand Detox over a double CD at LEAST! All these years, it's the least he can do for his fans....How about a "4 CD Set"!!!!! That would be unheard of! And just get the entire westcoast on it!!! He should get everyone back on board from Chronic 2001 PLUS add on a whole new slew of westcoast artists on top of that, and re-unite with The Game! Collaborate with DJ Quik as well as Lil Eazy-E and DJ Yella!!! How about Ice Cube?? Shit, while he's at it he should put that N.W.A. album back on the drawing board and use Lil Eazy-E in place of his late father!!! Dre needs to stop fucking around and go above and beyond anyones expectations whith this album and just really make a unrivaled, unmatchable diamond masterpiece!!!!!!
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01 - Cinematic (Morning to night - a day in compton/california)
02 - Co Producers (Kanye, The Runners, RZA, Lil' Jon, Hi Tek, DJ Paul/Juicy J, Just Blaze, The Neptunes, Mel Man, Daz, Warren G)
03 - Guests (Snoop, Kurupt, 2Pac, Biggie, Eazy, NWA, Eminem, 50 Cent, Spider Loc, Young Buck, Game)
04 - DVD behind the scenes
05 - Remix Disc
06 - The DETOX story in the album credits (the story of the character, kinda like a comic book)
07 - Manaj and Hood Surgeon DVD
spider fucking loc and young buck? what the fucks wrong with you?
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To actually be released.
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Joell Ortiz is part of the Aftermath roster
Is he really signed?
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Im guessin like dude said before i think the production will be like shit he did for Jay-Z (Lost Ones, 30 Something) Snoop (Imagine) with Piano riffs and stuff like dat.
The album will probably be a double disc, if not shit is just stupid cuz he said he was gonna have people he's been workin with through out the years. And truust 50 will be on the album, with a track featuring him, Game and then Dre.
But on some real shit if it was up to me, feature wise, i'd pick:
Suge on the intro
Britney Spears (on a hook)
50 cent & G-Unit
Timbaland
Liiiil Wayne aka the best rappa alive Weezy F. Baby.
and then maybe T.I., Ja Rule., Snoop and Eminem.
LOL im just playin..
Game
Snoop
X-Z
Crooked I
NWA wit Lil-E
Nas, Scarface (or maybe Jay-Z but i dont think he would fit in) on a track
DJ Quik, MC Eith on a track
Butch Cassidy
Ice Cube, WC, Mack 10 on a track (LOL)
Bone Thugs
Bishop
DPG
Nate Dogg
and shiit then maybe give the new cats some shit instead..like Ya Boy, Jay Rock and them.
Yeah i know, im goin overboard LMAO, but like i said this is just what i woulda made cuz he gotta come with somethings that'll go ova our heads (n/h)..
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Be patient. I'm working on a gem for you all.
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01 - Cinematic (Morning to night - a day in compton/california)
02 - Co Producers (Kanye, The Runners, RZA, Lil' Jon, Hi Tek, DJ Paul/Juicy J, Just Blaze, The Neptunes, Mel Man, Daz, Warren G)
03 - Guests (Snoop, Kurupt, 2Pac, Biggie, Eazy, NWA, Eminem, 50 Cent, Spider Loc, Young Buck, Game)
04 - DVD behind the scenes
05 - Remix Disc
06 - The DETOX story in the album credits (the story of the character, kinda like a comic book)
07 - Manaj and Hood Surgeon DVD
spider fucking loc and young buck? what the fucks wrong with you?
if 2Pac and Biggie isn't the dumbest idea I don't know what is...
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I think tuscan raiders are an undervalued benefit to the economy and all this bs about them "leeching off the system" is blown way out of proportion
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True,ppl will be disappointed no matter when it's going to be released (the expectations are so unrealistic)
I obviously don't know how the "2004" Detox would sound like,but even back then, ppl would have been disappointed
(if it's true that the beats that were supposed to be on that Detox,were sold to other artists,I'm glad detox didn't come out in 2004).
about cancelling,he should do that if he can't release it between now&2 years I guess,cause if he's not ready soon,he'll never be ready.
but before the chronic,he also had a lot of pressure
(I mean, he was continuing to develop a different sound,he never knew it would become so popular,what if it flopped?),
even though it's different. But it didn't ruin the quality of the album.
Before The Chronic 2001,he had pressure,to prove that he didn't fall off.
So if he can't complete Detox,that means it's the first time that the pressure is too much for him to release a soloalbum.
I'm not saying it's easy,but so far,the pressure motivated Dre even more (well at least with the first 2 albums).
and yeah i noticed that the subject matter in the topic has changed a lot,but that's good,
cause i think we shouldn't give the topic starter too much attention.
It became another Detox thread ha,ha.
Maybe Jome should merge it with another one?
Like the "The serious DETOX thread: what are y'all hoping for?" thatīs going?
http://www.dubcnn.com/connect/index.php?topic=150187.25
There is some interesting things in the thread like the cinematic approach that no one really picked up on.
I can copy and paste in here? or Jome can merge the threads what do you think?
Yeah,but pressure is even more this time around because he got two certified SOLO albums under his belt this time around.
When he dropped the first Chronic he didnīt have a classic SOLO album to follow up,
you could argue that every top to bottom Dre produced album is a "solo" release (I know I would),
so then I guess youīre right he had to follow up a almost flawless merit.
(Straight outta Compton,Eazy Duz it,No One can do it better,100 Miles and Runnin and Niggaz4Life was all almost flawless classics).
...and on top of that Tim Dog had taken the Hip Hop scene by storm with his hit "Fuck Compton",
so yeah he had to prove that he and the entire West Coast had what takes to make tight shit. So yeah when I think about youīre right.
When it came to The Chronic 2001 it was another scenario,sure he had to follow up a classic SOLO album,
but the Hip Hop scene had doubts that he had what takes anymore.
The Aftermath and The Firm both got luke warm reviews,
even if they should NOT be credited as Dre "solo" work,hell he only produced like 5-7 tracks on each right?
yeah i guess you're right tusken when you say that the pressure for detox is so different from any other dre situation. dre has accomplished so many things, and came up with a few different sounds during his whole career, that after all those years the expectation level is so high.
but i don't think that's a reason not to release the album. i mean, saleswise it will probably do well; ppl may be disappointed at first, but may appreciate the album much more later.
and about the albums you mentioned that could be called a dre soloalbum; well any album that has dre production from top to bottom could be called a dre soloalbum yes ( basically no aftermath release fit in that category, with the exception of 2001, since it's obviously an official dre soloalbum). the aftermath compilation is very close to being one, even though it had some R&B tracks on it, most tracks had a matching sound.
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We all know that beats really set the tone in terms of structure and sometimes content of songs. I think Dre's gonna emphasize the "structure" aspect of the music, and shift the paradigm away from three verses and a hook.
I was listening to Don't Get Carried Away and noticed how during Nas' verse the beat sounds different to accompany Nas' voice/flow. Like the strings get more dramatic in the background...it really differentiates Nas from Busta in the song.
What I think Dre could be moving towards for the Detox is having certain "characteristics" of the music repeat when a certain rapper comes on. I know he's expressed how he wants his final album to transcend hip hop into a more cinematic approach (this is what prog and other types of rock have been experimenting with for a long time). Attaching a certain instrument or sound to a rapper makes them more of a character and familiarizes the listener with his/her "character" so to speak. Now some of you might be put off by this, but it could be subtle things like something in the drums that is added in or a certain instrument.
Interesting things come up from this. For example, the beginning and end of the album could sound structurally and musically alike, but the middle reaches depths or heights that don't sound like the intros/finales. Or the entire album completely changes from beginning to end, but the change is gradual and suspenseful.
i really do hope dre is still using that concept, because don't get carried away is such a great song. even though i don't really like the song don't worry as much as i like don't get carried away, they are both great examples of what you just said ( with "don't worry" the beat is very different when mary J signs, then during the moments the game raps).
and if it's really true that Dre tries to work with ( almost) everybody that he has worked with in the past, the concept will work out well, because then he will have so many different kind of artists on the album and that creates a varied listening experience. besides, dre is very good at making an instrumental that matches a specific artist, so if anybody can pull this off, it's dre.
i mean, 2001 was a good album, but he still played it safe(especially when it comes to lyrics). so i don't think he should do that again, he must go further than that. i mean, "just" creating a new sound that can be recognised in every song is not enough, he should come up with a different beat structure(like you said lakers), so that transition from one song to another is more smooth ( that would mean the whole album is basically one big song, one story; not just a lot of pieces put together and mixed to have a matching sound).
i also hope the concept won't be just put on the cd, but somehow expanded in other things as well ( the booklet, an international tour, additional video material on dvd, internet), so that all those pieces tell a part of the story;it doesn't have to be a soundtrack to a movie( the direction of the music, and the subject matter would be limited that way).
as far as promoting detox, offcourse he should do the things he usually does, but he must really use the internet a lot more ( i mean, other ppl can help him with that).
unfortunately, dre is a behind the scenes type of person, so he'll probably never do record some stuff for youtube.
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Still think Dre should do a track called "The Final Episode".
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hehe, funny that you come up with these quotes again, to keep the discussion going ;) i just felt like i didn't really had anything to add anymore in this topic.
it's just too bad that apart from us, not many have come up with something that would keep the discussion alive ( i know it's hard, that's why not just us should do it)
just to make sure that i know what this concept is all about( after checking this topic again, i got a little confused); so all of the artists that will be on detox are going to be a "character", so they do their part of the story (either by singing or rapping ), and as soon as an other character appears on a song the beat changes ( just like with the song "Don't get carried away"). ok that's pretty clear, but
So instead of just putting out a final album as a vocalist and staying behind a desk or a mix board -in essence watching others do what he still seems to like,which is rapping- he can put the album out the leap right into film,as even more visual way of expressing himself...
that quote got me a little confused. i mean, directing a movie is a lot more visual than doing detox ( i mean, yeah the music tells a story, but it's only audio. unless the whole album is a big music video, i think it's a major switch).
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yeah, but i think it's funny that not many ppl contribute to this topic; some ppl have their mouth full in the "regular" detox topics, but as soon as there is some serious discussion topic about detox, they won't reply. i'm not demanding anybody to contribute here, but if you don't post here, then at least post some constructive criticism about the album in other "serious" detox topics.
anyway, back to the concept:
MTV
www.mtv.com/news/articles/1453255/20020403/dr-dre.jhtml
Dr.Dre;
"I had to come up with something different but still keep it hardcore,so what I decided to do was make my album one story about one person and just do the record trough a characther's eyes,"
Dre said,"And everybody that appears on my album is going to be a characther,so it's basically going to a hip hop musical"
www.hhnlive.com/features/more/239
...Recently,he's been saying he's going to release it. And while he's done this before and failed to deliver,one difference this time is that he now has a new film deal for his imprint crucial.
So instead of just putting out a final album as a vocalist and staying behind a desk or a mix board -in essence watching others do what he still seems to like,which is rapping- he can put the album out the leap right into film,as even more visual way of expressing himself...
well i like the idea of the movie thing, as long as it's more advanced than the wash ( and the soundtrack); the wash wasn't bad, but i'm expecting a bit more from a final solo project. i mean, the connection between the movie "The Wash" and the soundtrack wasn't so strong. and if it's too hard for dre to make a full movie out of detox, he could always reduce the playing time of the movie ( as long as it's not as short as murder was the case; otherwise it's impossible to make a full soundtrack off of it); that way Dre can completely expand the vibe of the story through the music. creating the story is going to be hard though; contentwise it doesn't really matter to me, it doesn't have to be revolutionary, although i hope it will be a bit more original than the wash ( but still have a good representation of each artist's/character's personality involved).
by the way, 50 cent even had his own videogame, he succesfully exploited his own story with different tools(regardless of the quality, he did a good job at promoting himself). i'm not saying that dre should make a deal with a game developer, i'm just saying that a videogame, is just another tool i can think of than can expand the vibe of detox ( so it's more than a gimmick).
Scratch; Did you have any conversation about DETOX?
Mahogany; The road Dre lead me down was like "iīm thinking about making the album like a movie,like having 16 bar jazz pieces,live instruments." So I started looking for jazz loops and found one by the group WAR,a 22-bar loop of keys. I think it just tells a story. Dre is trying to tell a story so the instruments have to do that
Scratch; So what story are you trying to tell?
Mahogany; "Bad Intensions" was about party,exess etc. In the movie "Very Bad Things",four dudes were having a bachelor party in Vegas,doing drugs,sex etc. Then something tragic happens with one of the hookers. So I was thinking it opens with one last party,and something tragic happens to make him want to DETOX
maybe it's just me, but to me the song "Bad Intentions" it not much more than a loop with a few sound effects. don't get me wrong, the song is not bad at all, but the concept wasn't worked out well through the instrumental imo. thankfully, this song is 6 years old, and we've already mentioned better songs that would fit the detox concept better.
What these comments by Dre and Ronin Ro seem to imply is that it will be a soundtrack to a actual movie,
where the artists plays a alter ego characther to go along with whatever story Dre got plans for.
This is very interesting if they manage to pull it off.
Takes a lot of work,maybe thatīs what is "delaying" it?
Dre wantīs this to be the album they remember him for,
so it got to be some next level shit and "just another" album might not be enough?
Maybe Iīm reading to much into it?
nah you got it right; i mean, in 1999 with "2001" he did a good job(even though it wasn't as influential as the Chronic ), but he can't release another "2001" with an updated sound in 2007( i certainly expect dre to at least try to come up with something different, and i'm not just talking about the sound).
lol this topic is good, it got me hyped up for detox :laugh: even though we don't know much about the current state of detox, it's so interesting to have all these interviews put together with our own ideas.
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anyway, back to the concept:
MTV
www.mtv.com/news/articles/1453255/20020403/dr-dre.jhtml
Dr.Dre;
"I had to come up with something different but still keep it hardcore,so what I decided to do was make my album one story about one person and just do the record trough a characther's eyes,"
Dre said,"And everybody that appears on my album is going to be a characther,so it's basically going to a hip hop musical"
www.hhnlive.com/features/more/239
...Recently,he's been saying he's going to release it. And while he's done this before and failed to deliver,one difference this time is that he now has a new film deal for his imprint crucial.
So instead of just putting out a final album as a vocalist and staying behind a desk or a mix board -in essence watching others do what he still seems to like,which is rapping- he can put the album out the leap right into film,as even more visual way of expressing himself...
uuuuuuhhhhh,now you got me worried. The Wash is far from a classic movie and soundtrack.
Hope he donīt think along those lines,like you said,itīs not that the movie and OST was that bad but still.....
I was hoping for a more artistic vision,with the actual music playing along with the movie with the story line and little or non dialog at all. It could be animated,whatever like some shit you can put on at home in the background with images while the music is playing.
No the content donīt have to be revolutnionary,I actually would be prefer if it was abstract and artsy than some shallow corny shit.
Game? Why not? It may sound like a gimmick,but itīs the way the content is presented that matters in the end.
Yeah,thatīs why the story line idea is good.
He has kind of run out of subject matter,
we donīt need to hear the same "resurection" shit that he has been using ever since The Chronic 2001 up until now.
...and good and "easy" way to go around this is to play it out in a alter ego persona.
yeah, that's why i said i was a little confused in one of my previous posts. i guess you're right, if detox would also be like a regular movie, it would have been too big an too risky ( i was already thinking, how is dre going to pull this off, he doesn't really have actors on his team?). so detox (hopefully!) will be similar to murder was the case(there wasn't much dialog in it right?), just a lot longer, that would be awesome! and that will most likely happen, and i think that's what dre had in mind when talking to mtv.
yeah a videogame would be good, because a videogame can have the same story, or it can actually tell the story before detox, or something like that. it's not required though, but like i said, it's one tool that i can think of that can expand the detox vibe, and i hope anybody else can mention a few other tools.
The Mahogany interview is like only a year old,but still...
I donīt think that Mahogany meant that they should use that track again,but a similar scenario played out.
I donīt think Mahogany is involved with record,from what I could gather so far into the production of the album,
The Core Detox team consists of writers and artists that will help Dre to articulate Dreīs ideaīs;
Busta Rhymes,Stat Quo,Bishop Lamont,Eminem and The D.O.C.
yeah i don't think Mahogany is going to be involved with detox either, he's probably just one of the many producers that sold a beat to dre, which might end up on detox.
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im hoping it comes out sometime soon
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At this point I just want the shit to drop already. Not really worried about guests, Dre always has that covered.
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limited guest appearances. i hear people saying they want this guy on a track, and that guy on a track
what for?
do u want a dre album, or a dre compilation album
having a few people on a hook and maybe 1-2 guest rappers definately.
but this is the last dre album, so i dont want verses being taken up by other people
and hopefully the production is cutting edge. something completely out of left-field.
like electronica-type hip hop beats for the West Coast!!
8)
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A before Detox video game is a good idea,thatīs actually a better idea than adopting the movies story line.
The Youtube idea you came with is also great,you know how they promote movies these days where the actors stay in characther when theyīre out there promoting the movies on talk shows and what not,
they can whole gang of fake ones and post them on youtube
another thing they could also do is make some awesome movie "blockbuster" like trailers like they do for those "blockbuster" movies.
You know.... Coming this summer to a hood near you...bla,bla,bla, starring bla,bla,
By the way,I have requested D-Nice (interesting poster) to come in here to join us.
yeah dre definately needs to do something with youtube(...the video with bishop lamont has been viewed 275719 times. and if dre really has something to show(i'm not talking about videos of recording a cetain beat or something like that, that's only extra material), it will probably be viewed a lot more( shouldn't be too hard, by adding a few good tags). i mean, the latest dr.dre interviews have spread across many websites, a youtube video will obviously spread even faster.
a trailer would be a good idea as well, after all, detox is probably not going to be a regular album.
i just hope that dre doesn't continue with this behind closed doors policy (when it comes to promoting detox) until detox is close to being released. sure, interscope will be willing to help out, but dre shouldn't rely too much on interscope. like i said before, i understand that dre doesn't really like the process of promotion, but he doesn't have to do it all by himself.
i know that a lot of people anticipate detox(they don't need promotion), but if dre really wants to set a trend, he needs a more diverse promotion strategy.
Yeah it seems that those that writers/artists that I mentioned above is the core team for Detox
(from what I have read and seen working in the Aftermath studio recently on photoīs and videoīs)
I assume that all those beat makers that has submited beats,
is a way for Dre to look for direction for the sound and the beatmaker
he feels got the sound heīs looking and wants to invite as a co-producer for the project. (This person is probably set by now)
I canīt see Dre making a kind of a compilation type of sounding album like "everybody" is doing these days,
that would be a bad direction if you ask me,
to have all kind of styles of beats will fuck up the albums consistency (like most albums these days).
yeah, it would be very bad idea if dre picked those beats from them and put it on detox. but like you said, he probably won't do that, he will just use them as an inspiration.
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You can't really premiere tracks on concerts these days anymore, because it first leaks on the net in video format and then the mp3 is everywhere, hence the song being played out before the album drops.
I think Dre should do like Kanye and Jay did; organize bunch of listening sessions for the press, so that all the written previews start hitting the net. Look how well that worked for this new Jay's album.
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I have a feeling that if he does too much concept wise, people won't really accept it until later because it might be too ahead of it's time, and it'll go over a lotta people's heads...so they might not appreciate it at the same level. At this point, most fans could care less about lyrics and stories, let alone a concept for an entire album....it's all about damn singles and weak ringtones now. So I'm sure Dre realizes that fans initial reception might not be as valuable in the future...but a lot of people want this album to "bring the west back", and I don't think it's gonna do that at all...so that's not something I hope for.
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Moved your post over here since the convo fits this thread.
DUBCNN: Exclusive Video Interview With Bishop Lamont (NEWS-Reformation/Detox
http://www.dubcnn.com/connect/index.php?topic=158535.0
DUBCNN: Exclusive Video Interview With Bishop Lamont (NEWS-Reformation/Detox
http://www.dubcnn.com/connect/index.php?topic=158535.0
nice interview :)
BISHOP LAMONT (November 2007) | Interview By: Eddie Gurrola
http://www.dubcnn.com/interviews/bishoplamont07/
He wanted to do it like a twelve step program,like if you go to detox,
the Betty Ford Clinic,its a twelve step program. So it could only be twelve records.
DUBCNN: Exclusive Video Interview With Bishop Lamont (NEWS-Reformation/Detox
http://www.dubcnn.com/connect/index.php?topic=158535.0
Well i obviously prefer quality over quantity,but i do hope Dre can put a few more tracks on it though.
Bishop did confirm that Detox is going to be a concept album,which makes sense,
as some of us already predicted that in the serious Detox topic:
http://www.dubcnn.com/connect/index.php?topic=150187.0 (this thread)
(http://www.bettyfordcenter.org/ima06/cm_bfclogomain25th.jpg)
http://www.bettyfordcenter.org/children/parents.php
Step 1
We admitted we were powerless over alcohol-that our lives had become unmanageable. Admit powerlessness over your ability to surrender to your love and not your control.
"Parenting is really a struggle between fear and love." The fear that our children, whom we love so much, can be harmed causes us, as parents, to attempt to control the fear by controlling our children. Managing our children through control creates bitterness in ourselves as parents, and breeds anger and rebellion in our children. The alternative is to accept that pain is a part of living, and that our children can learn from pain just as we do as adults. Admitting powerlessness over our life allows for honest parenting. Through acceptance we can share our love with our children and teach them to protect themselves.
Step 2
Came to believe that a Power greater than ourselves could restore us to sanity. Find hope in the belief that recovery is possible through faith and willingness to work on ourselves.
"Faith is the beginning of hope." The belief in a Power greater than ourselves can help us develop the faith to try new behaviors and create new visions for our families. As members of dysfunctional families, we have all kinds of learned "insanity." These behaviors directly affect our parenting. When we allow a Power greater than ourselves to work in our lives, then miracles are possible.
Step 3
Made a decision to turn our will and our lives over to God as we understood Him. Reach out for help and acknowledge that you are not alone.
"Asking for help is the lifeline for parents." When we turn our will and our lives over to God, we also turn our children over to His care. Letting go helps us to step aside and let a force greater than ourselves work in our lives and our children's lives. Drawing on the resources around us and attempting to find a good orderly direction helps us gain a sense of peace to meet the challenges of parenting.
Step 4
Made a searching and fearless moral inventory of ourselves. Take stock of yourself as a parent .
"Identifying our strengths and weaknesses helps us own reality. When we see how our personality traits affect our children, we realize how we project our fears onto our children, creating self-fulfilling prophecies. By doing the fourth step, we take responsibility for the things we do not like about ourselves instead of projecting them onto our children. When we look at what our family life was like before recovery, we can get a clear picture of where we were and work to avoid repeating past mistakes.
Step 5
Admitted to God, to ourselves, and another human being the exact nature of our wrongs. Learn to share your parenting issues without self-recrimination.
Sharing our inventory with God and another person helps us to see patterns that have caused us problems. The guilt from the excessive baggage of the past separates us from those we love. Sharing the things we see with our spouse, friends, and support groups allows us to find that we were not as bad a parent as we thought and we have all kinds of support and guidance available around us. Honest communication with a spouse is important so that your efforts can begin to work together for more effective parenting.
Step 6
Were entirely ready to have God remove all these defects of character. Become ready to change by giving up the demand to be perfect.
"Be ready to change." Our character defects have been the way the child in us has protected itself from a hostile world. As parents, we must face the child in ourselves and tell ourselves that the time has come to give up the old patterns. We must develop new defenses to use when defenses are necessary. This involves finding new ways that do not involve denying our feelings.
Step 7
Humbly asked Him to remove our shortcomings. Make conscious changes in your parenting by identifying specific strategies for healthy parenting.
Willingness to humbly ask for help sets the stage for our spiritual growth as a parent. Since many of us grew up in alcoholic families, asking for help is especially difficult - asking with humility is even harder. We begin to make conscious changes in our parenting. Our old patterns and responses, as well as those of our children, will still occur as we begin to adjust to these changes. Change takes time; setbacks are natural. Setting firm and consistent limits and learning new ways to relate to our children will help as we adjust to the changes.
Step 8
Made a list of all persons we had harmed and became willing to make amends to them all. Take responsibility for the effect your parenting has had on your children and learn self-forgiveness.
Learn to forgive yourself. Accepting the past as a fact and without guilt is an important part of this step. By taking responsibility for the past, we admit the truth about the past (neither judging too harshly, nor minimizing the effects). We can then commit to changing our behaviors that are harmful and follow through on our commitment. Listing new parenting strategies moves us away from guilt and into responsible action. Deciding to change helps release us from self-recrimination. We need to remember that we did not willfully harm our children; we were doing the best with what we had at the time. Now we have more. Being a recovering parent is like being a recovering alcoholic. We can let go of the shame and guilt when we accept our problem and do something about it.
Step 9
Made direct amends to such people whenever possible except when to do so would harm them or others. Make amends to your children through healthy parenting without over-compensating.
The best way to make amends to our children is by being a better parent. Our children can sense when we are trying to make up for lost time or trying to be the "super parent" because of guilt we have. Children often respond with mistrust or manipulation to our over-compensations. When we commit to be the best parent we can be, we share our lives and attention with our children. We accept each other's differences. We give permission for everyone to express their feelings. We start setting firm loving limits for our children and ourselves. It also means reaching inside to heal the child inside ourselves who cries out for love and attention.
Step 10
Continued to take personal inventory and when we were wrong promptly admitted it. Model being honest with yourself and your children and create acceptance in your family for imperfection.
Our children learn more from what we do than from what we say. This is a step of self-honesty. We must learn to accept our own imperfections and mistakes before we can teach our children that they can be imperfect and still be loved. By modeling self-honesty and self-acceptance, we demonstrate to our children how to deal with life based on "content of their character" and not how close to perfect they can get.
Step 11
Sought through prayer and meditation to improve our conscious contact with God as we understood Him, praying only for knowledge of His will for us and the power to carry that out. Learn to accept your limits in life and find your true spiritual path while allowing your children theirs.
As parents the hardest limit to accept is the truth that in the end our children will be on their own. By nurturing our own spirituality we, as parents, are able to guide our children toward their own path of spiritual growth. We can share our spiritual principles and values with our children best through our guidance and our example. It is easier to "Let go and let God" when we accept that in the end our children are on their own and we cannot control the choices that they will make. The ability to give thanks for each experience (because experience has made us who we are) helps us to be aware that we are part of a larger plan.
Step 12
Having had a spiritual awakening as the result of these steps, we tried to carry this message to alcoholics and to practice these principles in all our affairs. Reach out to other parents in the spirit of giving and community.
"You can't keep it unless you give it away." Sharing our experience, strength, and hope is the cornerstone of our program. We can reach of highest potential through helping others strive to better themselves. We need to be involved in our children's schools, in support groups, and in the community. Carrying the message means reaching out and offering a helping hand to other parents when needed and appropriate. It is learning to lead our children in a loving way and give the child within you all he or she needs to grow.
That the intro is called "Intervention" supports this 12 step concept.
So if it is a movie/musical that will be 12 chapters that he will go trough.
I donīt know if you noticed;
BISHOP LAMONT (November 2007) | Interview By: Eddie Gurrola
http://www.dubcnn.com/interviews/bishoplamont07/
Dubcnn: So its definitely a concept-type album?
Oh yeah! I mean, its his last hoorah. I always tell people to make it make sense [to them,] this is gonna be his Return Of The Jedi in the trilogy of movies. So its gonna go hard! I think thats all youve got to say really.
THX it!
But its his Return of the Jedi.
THX
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/THX
THX is the trade name of a high-fidelity sound reproduction standard for
movie theaters, screening rooms, home theaters, computer speakers, gaming consoles, and car audio systems.
THX stands for Tomlinson Holman's eXperiment.
THX was developed by Tomlinson Holman at George Lucas's company Lucasfilm in 1982 to ensure that the soundtrack for the third Star Wars film, Return of the Jedi, would be accurately reproduced in the best venues.
If you have read some of mellow-mans posts he hints on something like this.
Then I got to invest in a THX system at home,ha,ha :laugh:
thanks for the background information ;) yeah i remember that mellowman talked about something like this.
Dre still considering the 12 step thing ? yep Detox sure looks like it's almost finished ::)
i understand why you're being skeptic, but there's no need to jump to a conclusion. sure, bishop knows something about detox, but he's not with dre for detox most of the time, he's probably invited to do some features, and he may have been able to listen to some tracks, but that's it. besides, just because dre is not sure about the 12 step program, doesn't mean detox is not almost finished? even if he decides to put more than 12 tracks on detox, that doesn't change anything(well unless he's going to do a double cd, but it's very unlikely that dre is going to do that). let's not forget that dre hasn't worked much more than one year in total on detox, he spent a similar amount of time on the chronic if i remember correctly. sure, the eminem album may delay detox a bit, but i don't think dre wants to delay detox for another year, after all the false release dates(yeah that wasn't smart indeed, but aside from that, i don't think we should blame dre for taking the time for his final album). don't get me wrong, i want detox to be released soon, but only if it's really finished.
I have a feeling that if he does too much concept wise, people won't really accept it until later because it might be too ahead of it's time, and it'll go over a lotta people's heads...so they might not appreciate it at the same level. At this point, most fans could care less about lyrics and stories, let alone a concept for an entire album....it's all about damn singles and weak ringtones now. So I'm sure Dre realizes that fans initial reception might not be as valuable in the future...but a lot of people want this album to "bring the west back", and I don't think it's gonna do that at all...so that's not something I hope for.
well the people who keep expecting from the veterans to bring the west back should realise that these veterans won't be around forever. and like i said in an other topic, the world is bigger than the westcoast. besides, if dre comes with another 2001 with an updated sound ppl will be disappointed ( there are a couple of arguments in this topic why he shouldn't release another 2001). like some of us said before, dre cannot prevent that ppl are going to be disappointed (the expectations are unrealistic), he can only do the best he can, and he knows that he can't come up with another 2001 ( he kind of said that in the mtv interview in 2004).
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Damn, Dre got sum crazy shit coming. Hope it's gonna work. That could be dope as fuck. 8)
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I have a feeling that if he does too much concept wise, people won't really accept it until later because it might be too ahead of it's time, and it'll go over a lotta people's heads...so they might not appreciate it at the same level. At this point, most fans could care less about lyrics and stories, let alone a concept for an entire album....it's all about damn singles and weak ringtones now. So I'm sure Dre realizes that fans initial reception might not be as valuable in the future...but a lot of people want this album to "bring the west back", and I don't think it's gonna do that at all...so that's not something I hope for.
fuck bringing tha west back he should just make a timeless classic for all the fans of good music 8)
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I just don't want him making any abrupt changes that would upset his old fans, in example singing through t-pain vocoder or doing songs for bitches. Sticking to old topics, bitches, guns and blunts, suits for me. And no gay-unit on the album.
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I just don't want him making any abrupt changes that would upset his old fans, in example singing through t-pain vocoder or doing songs for bitches. Sticking to old topics, bitches, guns and blunts, suits for me. And no gay-unit on the album.
you might be old but you're still a young fucktard inside 8)
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I just don't want him making any abrupt changes that would upset his old fans, in example singing through t-pain vocoder or doing songs for bitches. Sticking to old topics, bitches, guns and blunts, suits for me. And no gay-unit on the album.
you might be old but you're still a young fucktard inside 8)
Thanks for the knowledge, Yoda.
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Sticking to old topics, bitches, guns and blunts, suits for me.
Don't you get it that this is ecactly what Dre does not want to do. If you want that go listen to Chronic and 2001. I expect tracks like Imagine on Detox, concept wise.
I seriously do hope that this is an album with a concept behind it, 12 tracks does seem short for all that wait but let's not forget that it means there's very little room for filler if that does happen. 2001 had 22 tracks and 3,4 joints were dope but could be left off the album. 15 tracks would be perfect, maybe do those 12 tracks and have 3 as a bonus.
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Sticking to old topics, bitches, guns and blunts, suits for me.
Don't you get it that this is ecactly what Dre does not want to do. If you want that go listen to Chronic and 2001. I expect tracks like Imagine on Detox, concept wise.
I know that he's not going to rap about those topics. If I don't remember wrong, a couple of years ago he said in an interview that blunts and bitches are played out. But if he finds writing of subjects deeper than bitches, blunts and etc too difficult, I'm not mad about hearing 3rd album of same shit. I should have been more precise, but that's what I meant.
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True, I think Bishop has that in plan for the 2nd LP though, "The Impossible Possible" produced by Dr.Dre & Scott Storch. I somehow doubt he'll cancel those Premo, Pete Rock, Lord Finesse, Just Blaze, RZA....
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Matter of fact I think this should be the "new trend",
Bishop said that his album is now 70% Dre,fuck it just cut away the "30%" and let it all be just Dre and Bishop.
I would say the same if Focus,Dae One or any other producer had done 70%,I want the DJ/producer and MC concept back.
Fuck all those compilation albums with all the "hot" producers and guests.
That bullshit can they save for OSTīs and whatever compilations.
i know that 2001 wasn't a concept album, but it basically had one production team, slim shady lp & marshall mathers lp sort of had 2 teams. but it didn't set a trend.
detox is supposed to be more advanced, but why would that album bring the DJ/Producer and MC concept back, while 2001 wasn't able to do that? sure, detox may set a trend when it comes to concept albums and the cinematic approach, but that's not exactly the same as the trend that you were talking about.
i agree with you though, about the consistency of the production of albums.
True, I think Bishop has that in plan for the 2nd LP though, "The Impossible Possible" produced by Dr.Dre & Scott Storch. I somehow doubt he'll cancel those Premo, Pete Rock, Lord Finesse, Just Blaze, RZA....
a dr.dre and scott storch produced album would be dope as hell 8) but he probably already has a lot of tracks completed with the producers that you mentioned, and i don't think he'll put all of the "leftovers" on a free mixtape so they may end up on the 2nd album. but even if bishop is able to complete an album with dre & scott in the studio, interscope can become a problem. what's the deal with bishop anyway; he's signed to aftermath but that's not the same as being signed to interscope right?
i know that he's not listed on the interscope website, so maybe that has got something to do with it(stat quo is listed on the site however; so it probably doesn't make much of a difference)?
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We was talking about the Bishop album not Detox on that one right there ;)
But I see The Chronic 2001 as somewhat a concept album,
he tells a story about how he came up and all the trouble he has encountered troughout his long career.
The way he tells the story may be a little "abstract" but you can follow it torugh the album.
my bad. but i also mentioned the marshall mathers lp and the slim shady lp, i know that it wasn't just dre and eminem(slim shady lp was mainly FBT), but it was close to the "DJ/Producer and MC concept".
so i don't think it would set a trend if bishop works just with dre, or only with dre & scott.
but dre must really like bishop if the statement about the production of the 2nd album is true. cause i remember 50 cent saying in an interview with Julio G that dre would never produce a whole album for him( i know that a dre solo is different from a dre & scott collaboration but still). that's why i doubt that bishop's statement is true, because so far, dre hasn't done such things for aftermath projects ( with the exception of 2001 and detox). i wish he did do that though, like he did before he started aftermath.
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In light of the new XXL blog that has gotten all the angry hip-hop/Dre fans riled up, I made this post for some SERIOUS discussion on Dre's last album. Forget release dates and all the drama...what are you guys hoping Dre does to revitalize hip-hop like he promises to do?
We all know that beats really set the tone in terms of structure and sometimes content of songs. I think Dre's gonna emphasize the "structure" aspect of the music, and shift the paradigm away from three verses and a hook.
I was listening to Don't Get Carried Away and noticed how during Nas' verse the beat sounds different to accompany Nas' voice/flow. Like the strings get more dramatic in the background...it really differentiates Nas from Busta in the song.
What I think Dre could be moving towards for the Detox is having certain "characteristics" of the music repeat when a certain rapper comes on. I know he's expressed how he wants his final album to transcend hip hop into a more cinematic approach (this is what prog and other types of rock have been experimenting with for a long time). Attaching a certain instrument or sound to a rapper makes them more of a character and familiarizes the listener with his/her "character" so to speak. Now some of you might be put off by this, but it could be subtle things like something in the drums that is added in or a certain instrument.
Detox,Scratch Magazine
(http://img59.imageshack.us/img59/414/drdrescratchscan5py4.jpg) (http://imageshack.us)
it's funny that scratch magazine didn't mention the tracks we've mentioned, like don't get carried away, Don't Worry and Oh!. i wonder what other possible leftovers Detox tracks have the same structure as those three tracks( there may be a few more, released on soloalbums, but i can't think of any more tracks).
by the way, i was listening to Marsha Ambrosius' mixtape "Neo Soul is Dead The Chronic mixtape", and i noticed that her singing style sounds very similar to Jewell(death row); she's basically the Jewell of aftermath. i've heard Marsha Ambrosius on various aftermath( related) albums, but this is the first time that i noticed that she sounds similar to Jewell ( maybe it's because of the background singers on those projects).
so i guess she's going to play a similar role on Detox as Jewell did on The Chronic.
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dre has set the standards so high people expect miracles and will never be happy
and yes dre's stuff if fairly simple, yet very complex. believe me if dre wanted to bring a 64 piece orchestra into the studio and put out an album it would be the most incredible shit you've ever heard. dre usually uses 2 or 3 instruments on individual tracks. add 60 or so other musicans and instruments and let dre direct and create parts for each instrument. he could make the most complex beat you've ever heard. but dre knows most fans don't want to hear that and although dre uses some orchestra instruments in his beats he probably won't go that far. they want to hear simplistic yet very original and complex top notch production.
For the last few years we have been building hundreds of instrumentals for Detox. They ranged from really sparse and simple beats to some of the craziest and most complex beats you have ever heard. We have all worked very hard together to create something truly original and groundbreaking. Picking which ones to actually use is easier said than done. We are striving for 100% live instrumental tracks built completely from scratch which takes a lot of work since we do some many of them before Dre wittles them down later on. Dre pushes us to dig deep and put our own ideas into the skeleton instrumentals we have made alongside him for Detox over the last couple of years. We are really pushing the envelope. In my opinion Dre has thrown out some incredible tracks that we and Dre have built together, but Dre is looking for something specific and if he doesn't hear it he will not use it. the dilema is how complex of tracks will the listening audience want to hear. Do they want orchestra like pieces or the tightly focused, yet simple beats you are used to from Dre. Ideally all of us and Dre want the most mindbending and complex original music experience ever heard on record. But will the audience be happy with that? The last thing we want to do is put out a "concept" album that loses people because it so different than what they are used to hearing. So thats been a big dilema. In the end i think you will hear elements of these complex beats but you won't hear the way they originally were created(those versions will go to the "Dr. Dre vault". At least that is the direction Dre has gone so far. I think the early tracks are as good as anything Dre has ever done - but it is still too early to tell how the final album will sound.
offcourse the expectations are a big issue. but as i've said before, disappointments are inevitable. but it's likely that dre fans will appreciate it over time.
i've noticed this with myself as well; for example, with a test, i expected a certain grade. the final results was only 0.5 point lower than my expectations, but i was still disappointed. but i looked at the test differently later, and then i was more satisfied with the results. so i guess we have a one sided view when looking at the results for the first time.
i don't think it matters too much who dre has as co-producers ( although dre had a great team for 2001), since it's dre who makes the beat structure.
with 2001 he and his team came with a different sound, but the structure was basically still dre :laugh: not that it's a bad thing, but the thing is, as mellowman pointed out, how far should dre go with detox?
in the past few years i've seen a few different things from him; sometimes the structure was more simple than i'm used to from dre, and sometimes he was experimenting a bit, like on Oh! and Don't get carried away( not a major difference in structure, but slightly different than what he usually does).
and it's hard to speculate what tracks were meant for detox, but got put on other projects. i mean, in most cases, the artists could say that the track was meant for detox, to promote it for their album. so that's why you can't really tell what structure dre has in mind for detox.
^^^^^
Marsh mix-tape?
I have missed out on that one,so I need to check that one out. PM!
have you checked it already? cause i think it's amazing what she can do with her voice, and it's just a mixtape ;) so i think she would be a great addition to detox.
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i know it's one year old, and all the info is well known, but i thought it would be a good idea to post the link to the power 106 radio interview with Dr.Dre here:
http://power106.com/audioalbum/dre.aspx
The truth,as good example is when those new Star Wars movies.
People was expecting miracles,I mean MIRACLES.... the hype was crazy much like with Detox.
But what happent? People got dissapointed and was mad pissed,but how could you please 30 something fans (ehhh nerds :laugh:).
Lucas made a movie for kids,not for old fucks (like me :laugh:).
When I came out of the midnight screening I was shocked,it was the worst movie I had ever seen. >:(
I went to see it again in the morning,it grew on me for everytime I went to see it.
Sure itīs still a average movie,not the masterpiece "we all" expected... but itīs not as bad as everybody makes it.
Thereīs no way around this :P :P
yeah such a first impression for detox seems very possible. but then again, you could ask yourself, how important is a first impression, like you already pointed out.
the point you made about audience is interesting; while it seems very unlikely that dre will make a Chronic 2000 something album ( especially now that bishop is involved), it still bugs me how far dre is willing to go. i mean, at one point he stopped working on detox; he picked it again up later, and said in interviews, that you've got to give the fans what they want. while i think he had a good impression of what the "people" wanted for 2001, what does he think that the people want for detox this time?
Oh? That was Obie Trice right?
Listening to the more advantgarde Dre tracks like RCīs Fame from The Aftermath Compilation,
even some of the Busta tracks is a little out there like Legends of the fall offs.
Both tracks is a stroke of genius,simply amazing. :o
Will tracks like these throw the (mainstream) fans off,probably will..... :laugh:
but fuck it,this is what I want to hear. :P
What many of Dreīs tracks have missed lately is the "cinamatic" sound,
but with tracks like Don't get carried away,Legends of the fall offs and Murder these murders
heīs in the right direction.
yeah Oh! is from Obie Trice's Cheers album.
i agree with you, but there are also recent productions that i don't really like. the whole area 51 thing around detox has a upside and downside for me; on one hand i like suprises, so in that perspective i think it's a good thing that they are keeping it quiet.
on the other hand, with so little information available, we are ( well i believe so, so correct me if i'm wrong) tend to base our expectations on what we do know/have ( for example, dre's recent productions).
And on another note did you notice Slim The Mobsters comment about working on a movie along with working on Detox?
where did you get that from? pm me about that.
by the way,
I think Dre should do like Kanye and Jay did; organize bunch of listening sessions for the press, so that all the written previews start hitting the net. Look how well that worked for this new Jay's album.
i'd really like this to happen for detox. i believe snoop recently did this for his upcoming album; while reviews are subjective, it's still a great promotion move imo.
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what point?
my bad, you didn't really make a point, but the part of the quote i was referring to inspired me for my post :laugh:
while it seems very unlikely that dre will make a Chronic 2000 something album (especially now that Bishop is involved),
it still bugs me how far dre is willing to go.
How about the involvement of Eminem last time around?
The tracks he did with him before he dropped Chronic 2001 was far from "Gangster" or "Hip Hop" for that matter.
I mean, at one point he stopped working on detox; he picked it again up later,and said in interviews,
that you've got to give the fans what they want.
While i think he had a good impression of what the "people" wanted for Chronic 2001,
what does he think that the people want for detox this time?
Thatīs a hard question to answer,but as I said before I got the impression that the "people" want him to resurect Hip Hop.
...and on top of that he got all those Hip Hop cats in his ears these days.
Bishop and Busta is far from Gangster,pluss the cats they bring along them like Q-Tip (Busta brought him along on The Big Bang).
But remember Chronic 2001 wasnīt exactly gangster either it was a fine mix of Gangster,Hip Hop,Alternative and Pop.
So he covered it all without losing anyone along the ride.
yeah i agree that 2001 was a great mix of different styles, but what i was trying to say ( which was basically said by us before), is that the "gangsta" side still played a huge role on 2001. and for 2001 that was not a problem at all, but this is detox :laugh: :laugh: :laugh: so i'd really hope he will give the "gangsta" style a smaller role on detox, like dre said he was planning to do back in 2004.
but maybe i shouldn't be so worried about that; as you pointed out, some of the people that dre works with aren't really gangsta rappers, neither are (some) of their affiliates.
and the question "how far" is impossible for us to answer offcourse :laugh:
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Trough PMīs me and Dre-Day has been discussing that the "I Dominate" track might be the first single for Detox.
Hereīs why;
-First what is Bishop Lamont dominating?
-Bishop said there will be annoncement VERY SOON! in one of his last interviews. (Dre-Day find this ;))
-The annocement might come on Dreīs birthday.....
-+ Nima said Detox is coming very,very soon. Nima might have some "exclusive" info,yet to be leaked :D?
So letīs see how this plays out :D :D
yeah it's just a theory, but remember this:
Dubcnn: As far as The Reformation is concerned, youre going to do a video for the first single soon. Do you want to tell us anything about that?
Were going to be going somewhere real exotic. Thanks Dre! Were gonna be having a ball and doing something real stupid, doing something real fresh, real fun for the West Coast. [Its] not the typical Im in the parking lot, Im in front of a liquor store. You know what Im sayin? That shit is pretty much played! Ive got a graffiti backdrop! Im hood! Im 29 by the time you see this, so I aint no little kid. Weve got to do things on a classier level, on a grown man level, and still be big kids and be foolish. So youre going to enjoy it! Im gonna leave it alone, but just to let you know, the song is called I Dominate. Thats what were going to do. Were gonna dominate the charts, were gonna dominate hip-hop. Youll see!
so like chad said, how is he going to dominate the charts when he relatively unknown to the mainstream? a dre single could help, but the best promotion you can have is to be introduced by dre on detox. the reformation might still drop before detox, but usually dre introduces somebody before releasing their soloalbum ( snoop dogg, hittman).
Eminem was an exception, but i guess that was because of interscope, and the fact that some "old" material was reused; they really want to put an album out fast.
by the way, chad, you mixed up bishop with Dawaun Parker, look:
Dubcnn: So as we look to the future, one question remains. Can fans expect to hear Detox within the next twelve months?
(Laughs) Ah, twelve months? I don't know. (Laughs) I I think that's a long time! A year from now? I can't I wouldn't see why it would be that long! (Laughs) I I think there will be an announcement or something will be said soon.
dre's birthday comes to mind; last year he got interviewed by power106 on his birthday.
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I hated Onyx and their hit Slam.... their screaming was hella annoying. :P :P
After Tanji brought the album up a year ago that the album was done in
alter ego characthers like Dre had (has?) planned(s?) to. (see quote below)
I was interested in checking this album out,boy was I in for a suprise..... :o :o
The albums best cuts is hella dope,damn I hope Dre still will go trough with his original plans.
I posted three tracks from the album so you can get an idea how the story is going and how Detox could play out.
In case you have missed Dre original plan for Detox;
MTV
www.mtv.com/news/articles/1453255/20020403/dr-dre.jhtml
Dr.Dre;
"I had to come up with something different but still keep it hardcore,so what I decided to do was make my album one story about one person and just do the record trough a characther's eyes,"
Dre said,
"And everybody that appears on my album is going to be a characther,so it's basically going to a hip hop musical"
well the hints we got from the people close to dre confirmed that detox is still a concept album (for those who haven't seen the hints, check other serious detox topic http://www.dubcnn.com/connect/index.php?topic=169127) ;)
it wouldn't make sense if it wasn't; i mean how else would dre be able to put all those different artists on detox and not make it a compilation?
all those people can be characters, and some will obviously get bigger roles than others.
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it wouldn't make sense if it wasn't; i mean how else would dre be able to put all those different artists on detox and not make it a compilation?
all those people can be characters, and some will obviously get bigger roles than others.
Yep just check how briliant you can do a posse cut with alot of
features without making it sound like you just threw a bunch of cats on a track;
Sticky Fingaz; Black trash; The Autobiography of Kirk Jones
(http://bp1.blogger.com/_wvZoLgs0rdQ/R0DoRN1T9ZI/AAAAAAAABHY/6JEU4m36GaM/s320/sticky.jpg)
09 - State Vs Kirk Jones.mp3
http://www.mediafire.com/?ignyczgdxaj
^^^^All the cats featured plays a alter ego characther on the track... genius!!!! ^^^
yeah, that was put together well indeed ;)
Dre has some great writers on his team, so it sure looks promising :)
guilty conscience had characters for example, but it was just for one song.
anyway, whatever the story is gonna be like, RBX won't play the devil, that's for sure :laugh:
in Ronin Ro's book, have gun will travel, RBX was quoted from an interview, saying that he didn't want to play the devil on murder was the case, since it went against his principles :firedevil:
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i'm not expectin anything close to the chronic or 2001
8) 8) 8)
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i just hope the shit comes out. it'll be a dope album regardless just gotta release it
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I can't believe they used Mellowman's posts in that book and called him Mel Man....and we all know he isn't Mel Man
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Haven't been able to read everything in this thread, but here are some of my thoughts -
Who's going to be on the album-
Even though Dre has said everyone he's worked with will be on it, I would personally prefer if he did what he did with the original Chronic and have people who weren't well known to the public. Snoop only had a buzz off Deep Cover, and then Kurupt, Daz, RBX, Rage, Nate were all new and they all blew up on that album and it was fresh because people hadn't heard anything from them before.
So personally I'd like to see all Dre's new guys and none of the old guys, ie. Bishop, Stat Quo, Joell Ortiz (is he still on the label?), etc and NOT Em, snoop, 50, busta, etc - it'd be doper in my opinion to be hearing from all the newer guys and keep the sound really fresh that way (especially to the general public who haven't really heard bishop, stat, etc)
The concept -
I've got a feeling that it'll be hard for Dre to keep a concept together, though he will probably be able to just get everyone to write about similar subjects. The hard part about doing a story or something where it all ties together very tightly is that he makes loads of tracks and replaces old ones as new ones are made which are better, and he does the same thing with rhymes. So if every rapper was a character in a story for instance, then he may have a verse by someone that sounds dope, but then something doper is written and it'd replace the old verse - so the structure and tight theme would fall apart. Though if he just says, ok, write about something positive then the general theme could have a concept, but I really don't think we'll see something like a album that fits to a movie, or something with a detailed story, as his way of making things perfect makes that almost impossible because it would break any intricate conceptual structure
The sound -
Again, I don't think he'll let the concept dictate the sound, he will just go for the dopest shit possible, so if there is a concept where the beat changes with each rapper, that just may not sound that dope when put into practice, so he'll scrap any idea that makes the album not actually sound as good, even if it's a dope concept
As far as whether it's a new sound completely or like the stuff he's being doing recently, I'm guessing it'll probably be just very, very dope beats but in the style he's been doing recently, sparse and hard, with a distinct melody in there somewhere. If it is completely different (eg lush orchestral tracks or whatever), then he's not shown any signs of this in any other tracks... it's possible it'll sound different, but I believe there is some truth to him giving away old Detox beats to other people. He obviously thinks the style he's been doing for ages is really good, or he wouldn't keep doing it, and so I think he'll just be keeping the best sort of beats in that style
Conclusion-
So overall I think the album will be just 12 or so of the dopest beats he's made over quite a long period of time, probably similar to beats he's been doing recently, maybe a bit different, but nothing completely off the wall. With the rapping he'll just go for the best verses people have given him, regardless of whether they completely fit the concept, because he will always pick how it sounds first rather than how good it is theoretically. There will probably be some sort of connecting theme, like Detoxing, but it will be loose rather than a really intricate concept - sound will win over concept
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I think Dre should showcase some new West talent
Bishop
Jay Rock
Ya Boy
Game
Crooked
hopefully give these dudes some exposure so we can be a factor again 8)
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I think Dre should showcase some new West talent
Bishop
Jay Rock
Ya Boy
Game
Crooked
hopefully give these dudes some exposure so we can be a factor again 8)
Gotti, you have to realise that westcoast rap music will never get similar success as it had in the 90's; at least not with the style gangster rap(sure you could argue whether Detox will still be a gangster rap album, but that's another story).
so whether (westcoast) rap artists will be able to benefit from the Detox release, really depends on the impact of Detox on the industry.
Who's going to be on the album-
Even though Dre has said everyone he's worked with will be on it, I would personally prefer if he did what he did with the original Chronic and have people who weren't well known to the public. Snoop only had a buzz off Deep Cover, and then Kurupt, Daz, RBX, Rage, Nate were all new and they all blew up on that album and it was fresh because people hadn't heard anything from them before.
So personally I'd like to see all Dre's new guys and none of the old guys, ie. Bishop, Stat Quo, Joell Ortiz (is he still on the label?), etc and NOT Em, snoop, 50, busta, etc - it'd be doper in my opinion to be hearing from all the newer guys and keep the sound really fresh that way (especially to the general public who haven't really heard bishop, stat, etc)
so i assume that you didn't like the formula dre used for 2001 as fas as guest features: providing a mix of upcoming talents and established artists?
i actually liked that formula, but i see your point. you have to realise that this is dre's final album though.
The concept -
I've got a feeling that it'll be hard for Dre to keep a concept together, though he will probably be able to just get everyone to write about similar subjects. The hard part about doing a story or something where it all ties together very tightly is that he makes loads of tracks and replaces old ones as new ones are made which are better, and he does the same thing with rhymes. So if every rapper was a character in a story for instance, then he may have a verse by someone that sounds dope, but then something doper is written and it'd replace the old verse - so the structure and tight theme would fall apart. Though if he just says, ok, write about something positive then the general theme could have a concept, but I really don't think we'll see something like a album that fits to a movie, or something with a detailed story, as his way of making things perfect makes that almost impossible because it would break any intricate conceptual structure
The sound -
Again, I don't think he'll let the concept dictate the sound, he will just go for the dopest shit possible, so if there is a concept where the beat changes with each rapper, that just may not sound that dope when put into practice, so he'll scrap any idea that makes the album not actually sound as good, even if it's a dope concept
As far as whether it's a new sound completely or like the stuff he's being doing recently, I'm guessing it'll probably be just very, very dope beats but in the style he's been doing recently, sparse and hard, with a distinct melody in there somewhere. If it is completely different (eg lush orchestral tracks or whatever), then he's not shown any signs of this in any other tracks... it's possible it'll sound different, but I believe there is some truth to him giving away old Detox beats to other people. He obviously thinks the style he's been doing for ages is really good, or he wouldn't keep doing it, and so I think he'll just be keeping the best sort of beats in that style
Conclusion-
So overall I think the album will be just 12 or so of the dopest beats he's made over quite a long period of time, probably similar to beats he's been doing recently, maybe a bit different, but nothing completely off the wall. With the rapping he'll just go for the best verses people have given him, regardless of whether they completely fit the concept, because he will always pick how it sounds first rather than how good it is theoretically. There will probably be some sort of connecting theme, like Detoxing, but it will be loose rather than a really intricate concept - sound will win over concept
i see that you haven't got a proper view of what Detox is going to be like yet, so perhaps you could read some more from this topic sometime: http://www.dubcnn.com/connect/index.php?topic=169127 ;)
i see your point of how dre usually works, but, again, you have to realise that this is Dre's last album, so it's going to be different this time.
remember that dre has some great storytellers on his team, like The D.O.C. and Eminem so i don't see why he couldn't come up with a concept album.
offcourse it's not going to be easy to fit all those artists in the story, but if they're just going to be a character it should be possible.
besides, dre's very good at making the instrumentals attach to a certain artist, so if any producer can pull off making some sort of hiphop musical, it's dre.
thanks for putting real effort in your first post for this topic UCC, hopefully you'll come up with more 8)
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Who's going to be on the album-
Even though Dre has said everyone he's worked with will be on it, I would personally prefer if he did what he did with the original Chronic and have people who weren't well known to the public. Snoop only had a buzz off Deep Cover, and then Kurupt, Daz, RBX, Rage, Nate were all new and they all blew up on that album and it was fresh because people hadn't heard anything from them before.
So personally I'd like to see all Dre's new guys and none of the old guys, ie. Bishop, Stat Quo, Joell Ortiz (is he still on the label?), etc and NOT Em, snoop, 50, busta, etc - it'd be doper in my opinion to be hearing from all the newer guys and keep the sound really fresh that way (especially to the general public who haven't really heard bishop, stat, etc)
so i assume that you didn't like the formula dre used for 2001 as fas as guest features: providing a mix of upcoming talents and established artists?
i actually liked that formula, but i see your point. you have to realise that this is dre's final album though.
Yeah, I liked it - I mean I'm not going to complain if Em, 50, Snoop, Busta, etc etc are all on there spitting incredibly hot verses! But I'd also like to see a fresh start, though perhaps he doesn't have enough new artists to carry it off and also it will hugely help sales if Em, 50, etc are on there
i see your point of how dre usually works, but, again, you have to realise that this is Dre's last album, so it's going to be different this time.
remember that dre has some great storytellers on his team, like The D.O.C. and Eminem so i don't see why he couldn't come up with a concept album.
offcourse it's not going to be easy to fit all those artists in the story, but if they're just going to be a character it should be possible.
besides, dre's very good at making the instrumentals attach to a certain artist, so if any producer can pull off making some sort of hiphop musical, it's dre.
I understand that he's trying to do more, but I've got a strong feeling it will come down to choosing just the dopest beats and rhymes. If I'm wrong then I hope he's managed to pull off both having hot music AND a dope concept. I just have the feeling that he's probably going to have to make a choice and if he does then he'll lose the concept, as I'm sure as hell he want to lose the amazingness of the music
Like he may find with all the verses and beats he's got he can put together 2 albums - one is an album with a really awesome concept joining the whole thing, but with some just 'ok' verses and beats in there, OR he has the parts to put together an album with 100% amazing beats and 100% amazing sounding verses. I'd prefer the second album, that just sounds the best and I think that's what he'll go for
Although, maybe you're right, I guess he could work on beats and lyrics separately and even if he does change the beats up all the way until the end, he can still get people in to spit the same verses on the newer, better beats he's come up with. If the DOC, Em, Bishop, etc came up with a great story that worked together, then they could just keep tweaking it, and the other rappers on the album would just spit the lyrics that his team has written for the album
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Who's going to be on the album-
Even though Dre has said everyone he's worked with will be on it, I would personally prefer if he did what he did with the original Chronic and have people who weren't well known to the public. Snoop only had a buzz off Deep Cover, and then Kurupt, Daz, RBX, Rage, Nate were all new and they all blew up on that album and it was fresh because people hadn't heard anything from them before.
So personally I'd like to see all Dre's new guys and none of the old guys, ie. Bishop, Stat Quo, Joell Ortiz (is he still on the label?), etc and NOT Em, snoop, 50, busta, etc - it'd be doper in my opinion to be hearing from all the newer guys and keep the sound really fresh that way (especially to the general public who haven't really heard bishop, stat, etc)
so i assume that you didn't like the formula dre used for 2001 as fas as guest features: providing a mix of upcoming talents and established artists?
i actually liked that formula, but i see your point. you have to realise that this is dre's final album though.
Yeah, I liked it - I mean I'm not going to complain if Em, 50, Snoop, Busta, etc etc are all on there spitting incredibly hot verses! But I'd also like to see a fresh start, though perhaps he doesn't have enough new artists to carry it off and also it will hugely help sales if Em, 50, etc are on there
yeah i think it's inevitable that the big names will be used to boost sales :P
personally i'm not that excited either about 50 cent being on there and i wouldn't mind if Snoop wasn't on Detox at all ( probably going to catch heat for this, but fuck it; i liked his involvement on 2001, but this is 2008 and i feel that the snoop formula has run dry).
but 2001 didn't have any wack singles, so perhaps the outcome for the Detox singles won't be that bad ( somehow i really doubt that dre will just pick 3 or 4 singles for Detox by the way).
i doubt that Bishop Lamont will be featured on Detox as much as Hittman was on 2001, but he will certainly be featured on there a lot more than some of the big names.
Joel Ortiz is not on aftermath anymore by the way, but that doesn't have to mean that he won't be featured on Detox.
i do hope that there will be some fresh talent on there that i haven't heard of before, just like 2001 had.
i see your point of how dre usually works, but, again, you have to realise that this is Dre's last album, so it's going to be different this time.
remember that dre has some great storytellers on his team, like The D.O.C. and Eminem so i don't see why he couldn't come up with a concept album.
offcourse it's not going to be easy to fit all those artists in the story, but if they're just going to be a character it should be possible.
besides, dre's very good at making the instrumentals attach to a certain artist, so if any producer can pull off making some sort of hiphop musical, it's dre.
I understand that he's trying to do more, but I've got a strong feeling it will come down to choosing just the dopest beats and rhymes. If I'm wrong then I hope he's managed to pull off both having hot music AND a dope concept. I just have the feeling that he's probably going to have to make a choice and if he does then he'll lose the concept, as I'm sure as hell he want to lose the amazingness of the music
Like he may find with all the verses and beats he's got he can put together 2 albums - one is an album with a really awesome concept joining the whole thing, but with some just 'ok' verses and beats in there, OR he has the parts to put together an album with 100% amazing beats and 100% amazing sounding verses. I'd prefer the second album, that just sounds the best and I think that's what he'll go for
Although, maybe you're right, I guess he could work on beats and lyrics separately and even if he does change the beats up all the way until the end, he can still get people in to spit the same verses on the newer, better beats he's come up with. If the DOC, Em, Bishop, etc came up with a great story that worked together, then they could just keep tweaking it, and the other rappers on the album would just spit the lyrics that his team has written for the album
don't get me wrong, i also have doubts whether dre is able to pull it off, but i think he has the tools to make it happen.
based on the information of Detox that's available, Dre's camp is striving to make a concept album. based on the interviews with the D.O.C. i get the idea that he's a lot more involved than he was with 2001, which is definately a good thing if they want to make a concept album.
i'm not 100% sure how i should interpret the concept idea, but it could be just lyricwise, or both lyricwise and productionwise.
not every track will sound the same, but will still have a signature sound and fit the certain part of the story( the Chronic and Doggystyle were basically concept albums productionwise; not every track sounds the same but each track has the g-funk sound).
PS: check out the topic i linked to in my previous. i think there is a lot of interesting stuff that you didn't know before and will definately help getting a more clear view of what Detox is going to be like. yes the topic is huge, but there is no time limit ;)
keep up the good work by the way! :)
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Prince Paul had a album a while back, I can't remember the name of it. But it played out like a movie. Each track seamlessly told a story and the next track continued it. But to the average listener it would sound like different tracks. Something like that centered around the whole Detox theme would be dope.
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i hope it come out one day.. :-\
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48 laws of power...
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Prince Paul had a album a while back, I can't remember the name of it. But it played out like a movie. Each track seamlessly told a story and the next track continued it. But to the average listener it would sound like different tracks. Something like that centered around the whole Detox theme would be dope.
A Prince Among Thieves
http://www.amazon.com/Prince-Among-Thieves-Paul/dp/B00000HZVC/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=music&qid=1205698163&sr=8-1
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41YXMGEVJML._AA240_.jpg)
Editorial Reviews
Amazon.com
The concept album has a long history in rock & roll , with the Who's Tommy being by far the most successful (by virtue of its turns on the big screen and Broadway, respectively). Hip-hop has had a few interesting (Kool Keith's Sex Style) and not-so-interesting (RZA's Bobby Digital in Stereo) goes at the form, but not until Prince Paul's A Prince Among Thieves has the genre had a true epic of its own to claim. The album, a cynical story of two friends that turn into rivals over a record deal, is solid on every level, with a full story, great music, and a strong cast. The disc is populated by a bevy of characters, many played by solid veterans--Chris Rock and De La Soul as junkies, Everlast as a crooked cop, Biz Markie and Special Ed as enforcers for Chubb Rock's gangsta don, and Big Daddy Kane as a pimp--but features a pair of talented newcomers (Sha and Breeze) as the leads. Sha and Breeze are dynamic, and they show up some of the bigger stars here--though only a couple of the characters disappoint (most surprising of which is Kool Keith's Crazy Lou). Ultimately, it's a hell of a record, with Breeze, Chubb Rock, Big Daddy Kane, Heroine, De La Soul, Xzibit, Brand Nubian's Sadat X, and Kid Creole taking best advantage of the killer tracks Paul serves up for them. --Randy Silver
Spin
A Prince Among Thieves could be heard as the renaissance of hip-hop's psychedelic edge.... [T]his cartoon panoply of sound never loses a powerful sense of cumulative derangement.
Greatest Concept Album Ever
I put it out there.
This has got to be the great and most complex and complete concept album ever. It is a album that could be made into a movie easily and somewhat is if you ever saw the music video for the album.
The ablum tells the story of Tariq, who is trying to get a record contract and needs to make some money to finish up his tracks and ...well, I don't want to give it away.
This album also has great appearances by: Sadat X, De La Soul, Kool Keith, Xzibit, Big Daddy Kane, Chubb Rock, Everlast, Biz Markie, Chris Rock, and Rza.
And as always Prince Paul put several skits throughout the album.
(Check out Tariq's mom the end of track #3 -- it's hilarious). Chris Rock also does a funny skit as a crack head.
There also is a great remake of the Ice Cube song "Steady Mobbin'" (off the Death Certificate) called "Steady Slobbin'"
This is a true classic hiphop album.
A True Concept Album among those that aren't,
As far as I know, there has never been a hip-hop album like A Prince Among Thieves and i don't know if there ever will be. But to tell you the truth, i really hope there are. The idea of having whole hip-hop albums that tell a single story in a cinematic way could be its own sub-genre and really make for interesting listens.
The story is in a nutshell about the rise and fall of a would be MC named Tariq and his jealous friend True who is a drug dealer. This adventure takes you all over the place including jail and you end up meeting all kinds of interesting characters. The story is mesmerizing and the first time you put it on, you can't turn it off.
This whole thing is the brainchild of the genius producer Prince Paul, who hasn't done anything i haven't enjoyed from De La Soul to MC Paul Barman to Handsome Boy Modeling School. This is probably his definitive statement as an artist as he has masterfully orchestrated an epic hip-hop tale with lots of colorful guest stars (Big Daddy Kane, Kool Keith, De La Soul, Chris Rock) that manages to be powerful, bangin', funny, creative, and just all around enjoyable.
The way that this album is like an opera is that there are the songs (like the arias) and sandwiched in between are little intros with beats (like the recitative).
This album is really good, although the one part i usually skip is the love song by Newkirk (track 24) because after a few listens that track gets old and drags on too long. I think probably the song that works best as part of the story and as a concept is "The Men In Blue" featuring Everlast which has every line making a statement. Songs like "Steady Slobbin'" and the skit with Chris Rock are hilarious. There are some great moments like when True and Tariq are listening to Tariq's beat in the car and they both take turns rhyming over it.
This album is a huge achievement in the world of hip-hop and further cements Prince Paul's genius and should pave the way for more hip-hop concept albums and just more creativity in hip-hop period.
CLASSIC HIP-HOP
Anyone who knows even a little about hip-hop knows that storytelling has been central to hip hop music almost since its inception. Hip-hop fans will also recognize that concept albums are nothing new to the world of hip-hop (Ice Cube's "Death Certificate" immediately comes to mind, though there are countless others that lay claim to the status of concept album). It should also be noted that the use of skits on hip-hop albums is commonplace, if not ubiquitous. This being said, Prince Paul's "A Prince Among Thieves" is not only a bonafide hip-hop album that fits neatly into the tradition, it also redefined the genre. The thing that sets Prince Paul's masterpiece apart from the rest is its consistency in theme, tone and character. Over the course of this album, we see the main character travel through the flipside of the American Dream - the ghetto. As the album chronicles the main character's struggles to garner enough money to present a demo for a record deal, we see Prince Paul production technique in constant flux, embracing a different genre of hip-hop with every turn. From hardcore gangsta posturing to laid-back player/pimp macking to old school freestyle flava, the music fits the storyline flawlessly. The beats are fresh, the story is compelling and the rhymes are simply second to none. With a little help from several of underground hip-hop's luminaries (both past and present) Prince Paul has produced a hip-hop masterpiece on par with the Who's "Tommy." "Prince Among Thieves" tells the story of youth at a crossroads, of a culture on the brink, of life at its most crucial moment. It's patchwork of genre and subject-matter flows effortlessly together into a narrative so strong that only the most detached listener will not be able to relate to the struggles of the main character. In today's culture of shrinking attention spans, this album may be a challenge to most, but a careful listen reveals some insights that we all can learn from. I'll tell you one thing - after listening to the final, self-titled track, I will never listen to a "Dead Homies" song the same way even again. Never. Buy this one. It's a true classic.
I have heard nothing but good things about this album from friends,
but never got my ass to listen to it or buy a copy myself.
So Iīm requesting a Hook up ;),I also would like someone to hook up:
Tommy (1969 Original Concept Album)
(http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51DSQ0X2VAL._AA240_.jpg)
Editorial Reviews
Amazon.com essential recording
Tommy had the dubious distinction of being the first-ever rock opera; however, it's none the worse for that, Ken Russell's adaptation notwithstanding. Due largely to Pete Townshend's skill as a songwriter and composer, Tommy tells a coherent story and includes quality rock and roll at the same time, an impressive feat by itself. While surprisingly more linear than the later Quadrophenia, Tommy boasts several songs that stand up well on their own, including the classic "Pinball Wizard," "The Acid Queen," "I'm Free," and "Sally Simpson." Much of the rest doesn't make much sense lyrically unless you listen to the entire album, but you'll probably want to do that anyway, preferably with the lights low and the stereo cranked. --Genevieve Williams
Thanks for that Chad, I have the album just could not remember the name of it.
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I think Dre should showcase some new West talent
Bishop
Jay Rock
Ya Boy
Game
Crooked
hopefully give these dudes some exposure so we can be a factor again 8)
Gotti, you have to realise that westcoast rap music will never get similar success as it had in the 90's; at least not with the style gangster rap(sure you could argue whether Detox will still be a gangster rap album, but that's another story).
so whether (westcoast) rap artists will be able to benefit from the Detox release, really depends on the impact of Detox on the industry.
true
I just want Dre to get the best new west rappers of the West Coast on it and these to me are the best
If anybody can get us going back again its Dre 8)
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Conclusion-
There will probably be some sort of connecting theme, like Detoxing,
but it will be loose rather than a really intricate concept - sound will win over concept
Then itīs going to be like Chronic 2001,it has a connecting theme going through it.
I hope it's more like the original Chronic or Doggystyle - only having 12 tracks is a great sign in my opinion. I'd like it to have the same thing as Doggystyle where all the tracks are mixed and constructed in a similar style, they have the same style drums, and multiple layers in each track, although each track is so unique within that style, and all the tracks stand out from each other. I liked 2001, but I thought it had way too many tracks and the good verses were spread too thin over it, if he'd trimmed that down to 12 tracks and put nothing but dope verses over them I think it'd have been ever better
To me, Doggystyle is actually more of a Dr Dre album, but with Snoop on it. Snoop was incredible on it, but if you think about it you could have put anyone half decent on those beats and it'd still been amazing. It's kind of like the second version of the Chronic, just with a bit more Snoop on it and no Dre verses. The only concept I'm concerned with for Detox is the idea of having 12 unbelievably dope beats with nothing but dope verses across them, and hopefully having a common production style over them while still making them all stand out. I couldn't really care less what they rap about, Detoxing, guns, bitches, science, kittens, trees, carrots - whatever, just make sure that shit is the hottest sounding shit we ever heard (ie Doggystyle part 2)
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Conclusion-
There will probably be some sort of connecting theme, like Detoxing,
but it will be loose rather than a really intricate concept - sound will win over concept
Then itīs going to be like Chronic 2001,it has a connecting theme going through it.
I hope it's more like the original Chronic or Doggystyle - only having 12 tracks is a great sign in my opinion. I'd like it to have the same thing as Doggystyle where all the tracks are mixed and constructed in a similar style, they have the same style drums, and multiple layers in each track, although each track is so unique within that style, and all the tracks stand out from each other. I liked 2001, but I thought it had way too many tracks and the good verses were spread too thin over it, if he'd trimmed that down to 12 tracks and put nothing but dope verses over them I think it'd have been ever better
To me, Doggystyle is actually more of a Dr Dre album, but with Snoop on it. Snoop was incredible on it, but if you think about it you could have put anyone half decent on those beats and it'd still been amazing. It's kind of like the second version of the Chronic, just with a bit more Snoop on it and no Dre verses. The only concept I'm concerned with for Detox is the idea of having 12 unbelievably dope beats with nothing but dope verses across them, and hopefully having a common production style over them while still making them all stand out. I couldn't really care less what they rap about, Detoxing, guns, bitches, science, kittens, trees, carrots - whatever, just make sure that shit is the hottest sounding shit we ever heard (ie Doggystyle part 2)
i can see why you don't mind if Dre makes a Chronic 3, but i just disagree with that.
it's not that i would discredit a chronic 3 in general, it's just that this is Dre's last album, he will never make another soloalbum after that.
that's why i want more than just an album with a "theme" like 2001 had. that doesn't mean that i think that Detox shouldn't be a gangster rap album; i just want him to update his formula.
that's why i like the idea of a concept album; it gives the feeling of a complete package to me :)
Helter Skelter is basically a conceptalbum; it's far from perfect but i like how it was put together.
as far as the direction of the production of Detox; i think Dre has given hints of the sound of Detox in his recent productions, but not the actual production structure.
as discussed in this topic before;if you look at the production of the past few years, sometimes he kept it simple and sometimes he experimented a little ( like on Oh! from the Obie Trice - Cheers album and on Don't get carried away from The Big Bang by Busta Rhymes; notice how a different instrument is attached to each performer).
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Personally I would love to have a track with Cube and Ren on it, even though I doubt this will happen since Dre hasn't talked to Cube in years but Cube said a few months ago that he would be down if Dre gave him the call
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SOMEBODY PLEASE EXPLAIN TO ME WHY THIS HAS TAKEN SO LONG AND STILL NO RELEASE DATE?
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Personally I would love to have a track with Cube and Ren on it, even though I doubt this will happen
i expect bishop in 3 songs, em on 2, fifty helpin out on at least two hooks, bring nate dogg and kokane for some hooks as well. snoop better be on this motherfucka!, i'd like to see Ras kass in there, bun b, jadakiss, and his aftermath rosters of producers and artists( khalil, busta, focus, gage, eve, ) ohhh and XZIBIT! its been to long man!!
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As far as the guests on the album since this is Dre's final record I think it would be fitting to have some of the old Death Row inmates along with the new Aftermath cats. Specifically Snoop. Kurupt, RBX, Rage, would love to see Ren and Cube but I understand that is pretty much not happening so I am fine with that. Would also like to see Daz on at track as well for my personal perspective but that is not happening IMO either so I am fine with the four I have mentioned. About DOC I would not mind at all if he had some input here, maybe do a hook or something it would fit in well with a dark track. I agree about not having an overload of these old Inmates and focus on the new, Bishop specifically but bascially everybody on the label, would rather not have 50 on it but I can do with a track with him as well, maybe he will be motivated and spit something similar to his first album. Bishop should be the "Hittman" of "Detox" and should be the main focus since he is versatile and can spit lyrical though provoking rhymes much as Hitman was a lyricist on "2001". The album itself does NOT have to have a theme for me, but if Dre goes that way it is fine either way. I understand "2001" had a theme so it might be better to continue on that path but again for me it doesnt matter I will be satisfied either way. Does it have to be a "Gangsta album" well I am a gangsta rap fan but also a fan of good music and lets not forget that music is a form of ART but also a form of ENTERTAINMENT and that is exactly what "gangsta rap" is. Alot of people think at Dre's age 43 or whatever that he should not talk the "gangsta shit" but in reality he can speak on whatever like Chad said eailier "fuck what subgenres rappers belong to", if its dope its dope. I'll be back with more thoughts later in the weekend
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Does it have to be a "Gangsta album" well I am a gangsta rap fan but also a fan of good music and lets not forget that music is a form of ART but also a form of ENTERTAINMENT and that is exactly what "gangsta rap" is. Alot of people think at Dre's age 43 or whatever that he should not talk the "gangsta shit" but in reality he can speak on whatever like Chad said eailier "fuck what subgenres rappers belong to", if its dope its dope.
well i guess that's what seperates the boys from the men ;)
As far as the guests on the album since this is Dre's final record I think it would be fitting to have some of the old Death Row inmates along with the new Aftermath cats. Specifically Snoop. Kurupt, RBX, Rage, would love to see Ren and Cube but I understand that is pretty much not happening so I am fine with that. Would also like to see Daz on at track as well for my personal perspective but that is not happening IMO either so I am fine with the four I have mentioned. About DOC I would not mind at all if he had some input here, maybe do a hook or something it would fit in well with a dark track. I agree about not having an overload of these old Inmates and focus on the new, Bishop specifically but bascially everybody on the label, would rather not have 50 on it but I can do with a track with him as well, maybe he will be motivated and spit something similar to his first album. Bishop should be the "Hittman" of "Detox" and should be the main focus since he is versatile and can spit lyrical though provoking rhymes much as Hitman was a lyricist on "2001". The album itself does NOT have to have a theme for me, but if Dre goes that way it is fine either way. I understand "2001" had a theme so it might be better to continue on that path but again for me it doesnt matter I will be satisfied either way.
i think Cube's comments from the interview which you are referring to about dre were taken out of context, as he was much more positive in an other interview.
i can see why you and Chad doubt that Cube and Ren will perform on a dre track for Detox, but i'm quite sure they'll reunite at least one more time.
as far as the other guest features; i pretty much agree with you; like i said before, i thought 2001 had a great mix of new and already established artists.
i'm not sure about Daz; i wouldn't mind a Dogg pound track, but a lot of things have changed since 1992, so i'm not sure if Daz is "ready" for Detox :P
about the D.O.C.; not sure if you heard the latest news, but he will write his whole next album and let others perform :-\
that doesn't have to mean that he won't perform on Detox either, but i doubt he'll drop a verse since he trusts Dre a lot.
that would really be a shame imo, as they haven't really tried it yet with the "new" voice. as you can hear on Deuce and Helter Skelter it's definately worth a shot.
as a dre fan i know why you probably won't be disappointed with the final product, but try to put yourself in the position of a critic a little more ;) this is his 3rd solo effort, it will be his last album and it's 2008.
indeed, you and Chad made good points about subgenre's.
looking forward to read what you got planned for this topic by the way 8)
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Does it have to be a "Gangsta album" well I am a gangsta rap fan but also a fan of good music and lets not forget that music is a form of ART but also a form of ENTERTAINMENT and that is exactly what "gangsta rap" is. Alot of people think at Dre's age 43 or whatever that he should not talk the "gangsta shit" but in reality he can speak on whatever like Chad said eailier "fuck what subgenres rappers belong to", if its dope its dope.
well i guess that's what seperates the boys from the men ;)
As far as the guests on the album since this is Dre's final record I think it would be fitting to have some of the old Death Row inmates along with the new Aftermath cats. Specifically Snoop. Kurupt, RBX, Rage, would love to see Ren and Cube but I understand that is pretty much not happening so I am fine with that. Would also like to see Daz on at track as well for my personal perspective but that is not happening IMO either so I am fine with the four I have mentioned. About DOC I would not mind at all if he had some input here, maybe do a hook or something it would fit in well with a dark track. I agree about not having an overload of these old Inmates and focus on the new, Bishop specifically but bascially everybody on the label, would rather not have 50 on it but I can do with a track with him as well, maybe he will be motivated and spit something similar to his first album. Bishop should be the "Hittman" of "Detox" and should be the main focus since he is versatile and can spit lyrical though provoking rhymes much as Hitman was a lyricist on "2001". The album itself does NOT have to have a theme for me, but if Dre goes that way it is fine either way. I understand "2001" had a theme so it might be better to continue on that path but again for me it doesnt matter I will be satisfied either way.
i think Cube's comments from the interview which you are referring to about dre were taken out of context, as he was much more positive in an other interview.
i can see why you and Chad doubt that Cube and Ren will perform on a dre track for Detox, but i'm quite sure they'll reunite at least one more time.
as far as the other guest features; i pretty much agree with you; like i said before, i thought 2001 had a great mix of new and already established artists.
i'm not sure about Daz; i wouldn't mind a Dogg pound track, but a lot of things have changed since 1992, so i'm not sure if Daz is "ready" for Detox :P
about the D.O.C.; not sure if you heard the latest news, but he will write his whole next album and let others perform :-\
that doesn't have to mean that he won't perform on Detox either, but i doubt he'll drop a verse since he trusts Dre a lot.
that would really be a shame imo, as they haven't really tried it yet with the "new" voice. as you can hear on Deuce and Helter Skelter it's definately worth a shot.
as a dre fan i know why you probably won't be disappointed with the final product, but try to put yourself in the position of a critic a little more ;) this is his 3rd solo effort, it will be his last album and it's 2008.
indeed, you and Chad made good points about subgenre's.
looking forward to read what you got planned for this topic by the way 8)
about Daz I think that if he gets someone like Bad Azz to write his verse I think it would be great, Daz has been known to recycle his verses numerous times so to make sure that the verse is not something he said back in his last album I think that would be a good idea, besides Bad Azz has written for both him and Snoop and he is a very underrated lyricist. Its hard for me to seperate the fan in me and the critical side because I am pretty much on the postitive when it comes to an album, but I think that Dre is the biggest critic when it comes to his own work so if something is less than dope in his mind he will either work on it again or throw it away, I can't see anything less than dope on "Detox" its not going to be a rushed product, believe it or not "Doggystyle" was rushed into stores because Suge wanted it in time for the Thanksgiving holiday week and Dre was only finished with the first half of the album. Thats when all the rumors started that Daz and others produced the second half of Doggystyle, what happened was Dre heard the tracks but was not happy with them and went in the studio to put the final touches on them like a great producer does and there you go Classic album. Doggystyle was made in less than a year and look how it turned out, could not have been any better. But back to "Detox" I think that as the years have gone by and Dre has seen the direction music has been going he does not want to have something that you bump for a couple of months and get tired of it, thats what I wanted to say is lacking these days is replay value. "2001" was in constant rotation for at least a year and as the years went by since its release numerous other songs have sampled "XXplosive", "Next Episode", "Whats The Difference" so you know it was highly regarded. Another thing that albums these days have are too many tracks on them, as long as they are dope I don't care but the reality is rarely will you have a 21 track album in which all songs are dope, if anybody can do it Dre can but I would prefer for it to be closer to 16 or 17 tracks at the most, now a lot of people might say that you wait almost 10 years and you only get 16 songs well 16 is plenty good, The Chronic had around that amount and it was perfect, "2001" the only problem I had with the album were that I didn't feel a couple of the skits, I thought they took away from it, I would also prefer the skits be kept to a minimum unless the DOC is involved and you get a hilarious one because he is great with those. I'll be back with more later...
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I think that as the years have gone by and Dre has seen the direction music has been going he does not want to have something that you bump for a couple of months and get tired of it, thats what I wanted to say is lacking these days is replay value. "2001" was in constant rotation for at least a year and as the years went by since its release numerous other songs have sampled "XXplosive", "Next Episode", "Whats The Difference" so you know it was highly regarded. Another thing that albums these days have are too many tracks on them, as long as they are dope I don't care but the reality is rarely will you have a 21 track album in which all songs are dope, if anybody can do it Dre can but I would prefer for it to be closer to 16 or 17 tracks at the most, now a lot of people might say that you wait almost 10 years and you only get 16 songs well 16 is plenty good, The Chronic had around that amount and it was perfect, "2001" the only problem I had with the album were that I didn't feel a couple of the skits, I thought they took away from it, I would also prefer the skits be kept to a minimum unless the DOC is involved and you get a hilarious one because he is great with those. I'll be back with more later...
good point about replay value; that's why i said that a chronic 3 album is not good enough for a final Dre album.
but try to go a little further if you can; i marked a lot of good points/comments in black in my topic, so check my signature to see the topic and try to find things to pick up on, as i know that you can pull it off ;)
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believe it or not "Doggystyle" was rushed into stores because Suge wanted it in time for the Thanksgiving holiday week and Dre was only finished with the first half of the album. Thats when all the rumors started that Daz and others produced the second half of Doggystyle, what happened was Dre heard the tracks but was not happy with them and went in the studio to put the final touches on them like a great producer does and there you go Classic album. Doggystyle was made in less than a year and look how it turned out, could not have been any better.
I've always wondered about this... because that's what it basically says in Ronin Ro's 'Have Gun Will Travel' book, BUT then in a dubcnn interview (I think) with Daz he said which tracks he did and I think there were tracks off both sides, so it wasn't like a Dr Dre first half and other people second half (and I think Daz said he only co-produced 3 beats anyway). Then in the same book it says that then Dre was a perfectionist and went away and mixed all the tracks and fixed them up, taking it around various studios to mix it until it was perfect...
So which is it? Either they had to rush part of the album or he had loads of time to keep on mixing it until it was perfect - it seems kind of contradictory to me. And none of it seems rushed either because there are no obvious weak tracks
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believe it or not "Doggystyle" was rushed into stores because Suge wanted it in time for the Thanksgiving holiday week and Dre was only finished with the first half of the album. Thats when all the rumors started that Daz and others produced the second half of Doggystyle, what happened was Dre heard the tracks but was not happy with them and went in the studio to put the final touches on them like a great producer does and there you go Classic album. Doggystyle was made in less than a year and look how it turned out, could not have been any better.
I've always wondered about this... because that's what it basically says in Ronin Ro's 'Have Gun Will Travel' book, BUT then in a dubcnn interview (I think) with Daz he said which tracks he did and I think there were tracks off both sides, so it wasn't like a Dr Dre first half and other people second half (and I think Daz said he only co-produced 3 beats anyway). Then in the same book it says that then Dre was a perfectionist and went away and mixed all the tracks and fixed them up, taking it around various studios to mix it until it was perfect...
So which is it? Either they had to rush part of the album or he had loads of time to keep on mixing it until it was perfect - it seems kind of contradictory to me. And none of it seems rushed either because there are no obvious weak tracks
yeah I went with what Ro wrote in his book, I have to look over it again but that is what I remember he said, about Daz I remember what the interview you are talking about now its a matter of who is more credible Daz or Ro? I am one of the biggest Daz fans ever but I know whatever comes out of his mouth should be taken with a grain of salt, the 3 beats in question which ones are they?. It seems like "Ain't No Fun" sounds more Warren G than Daz, and also "Next Episode" would be more Warren than Daz. I agree no weak tracks on the album including "Next Episode" and if you include "Doggystyle" the unreleased song as well. I think you can probably put most of the unreleased tracks that were meant for the album and get 16 or 17 5/5 quality songs.
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I just read some interesting things about the concept of this album. I agree in order for this to go down as a classic that will be remembered it just can't be "The Chronic 3" with a bunch of guests old and new even if it is dope music. I like the idea of Dre doing something bad and then going to "Detox". Maybe this could be the opening of Dre doing some dark gangsta tracks in the beginning of the album with some of the old guests that were mentioned in this thread, former Death Row inmates, maybe Ren and Cube hey anything is possible and then having the theme of him going into a "Detox" type of thing and changing the production up to incorporate this new style with more jazzy beats and it would be a great way to introduce his protege Bishop Lamont into the world. I thought previoulsy that Crooked I would be dope to be included but now that I think of it maybe he is not a good "fit" for any of this album so I am leaving him off, except if maybe he were to be included in a cut with Bishop, the two of them on a song together would sound intriguing. But for the most part I think Bishop should be the feature for the "Detox" part which would comprise the second half of the album, I am thinking most of the cuts like Chad said earlier in the thread 70% Bishop would be a great idea. One thing I am having trouble though is the part of picking a first single, what should it be the "Detox" part or the early dark gangsta type track? Which would make more of an impact the way "Still DRE" did because Dre dropped a track right there which is a signature one and will be remembered as his comeback single? It has been a longer wait for a Dre single this time because he had "Been There Done That" in '96 so he dropped one 3 years later
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I just read some interesting things about the concept of this album. I agree in order for this to go down as a classic that will be remembered it just can't be "The Chronic 3" with a bunch of guests old and new even if it is dope music. I like the idea of Dre doing something bad and then going to "Detox". Maybe this could be the opening of Dre doing some dark gangsta tracks in the beginning of the album with some of the old guests that were mentioned in this thread, former Death Row inmates, maybe Ren and Cube hey anything is possible and then having the theme of him going into a "Detox" type of thing and changing the production up to incorporate this new style with more jazzy beats and it would be a great way to introduce his protege Bishop Lamont into the world. I thought previoulsy that Crooked I would be dope to be included but now that I think of it maybe he is not a good "fit" for any of this album so I am leaving him off, except if maybe he were to be included in a cut with Bishop, the two of them on a song together would sound intriguing. But for the most part I think Bishop should be the feature for the "Detox" part which would comprise the second half of the album, I am thinking most of the cuts like Chad said earlier in the thread 70% Bishop would be a great idea. One thing I am having trouble though is the part of picking a first single, what should it be the "Detox" part or the early dark gangsta type track? Which would make more of an impact the way "Still DRE" did because Dre dropped a track right there which is a signature one and will be remembered as his comeback single? It has been a longer wait for a Dre single this time because he had "Been There Done That" in '96 so he dropped one 3 years later
good stuff!
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I just read some interesting things about the concept of this album. I agree in order for this to go down as a classic that will be remembered it just can't be "The Chronic 3" with a bunch of guests old and new even if it is dope music. I like the idea of Dre doing something bad and then going to "Detox". Maybe this could be the opening of Dre doing some dark gangsta tracks in the beginning of the album with some of the old guests that were mentioned in this thread, former Death Row inmates, maybe Ren and Cube hey anything is possible and then having the theme of him going into a "Detox" type of thing and changing the production up to incorporate this new style with more jazzy beats and it would be a great way to introduce his protege Bishop Lamont into the world.
i see, so you want some sort of transition from "old" to new?
but don't you think that your idea could mean a less consistent album if he makes the album consist of 2 parts?
One thing I am having trouble though is the part of picking a first single, what should it be the "Detox" part or the early dark gangsta type track? Which would make more of an impact the way "Still DRE" did because Dre dropped a track right there which is a signature one and will be remembered as his comeback single? It has been a longer wait for a Dre single this time because he had "Been There Done That" in '96 so he dropped one 3 years later
the intro of Detox is called intervention.
not sure how dre is going to kick it off though; you'd expect him to come with some sort of warmup single.
he better not come with another still dre or forgot about dre.
don't get me wrong , i love those tracks, but the formula is too simple for me.
but the track will offcourse be considered as Dre's "comeback" :P
the Detox part should come at the end; at least that would make sense to me ;)
it's going to be a concept album after all.
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I just read some interesting things about the concept of this album. I agree in order for this to go down as a classic that will be remembered it just can't be "The Chronic 3" with a bunch of guests old and new even if it is dope music. I like the idea of Dre doing something bad and then going to "Detox". Maybe this could be the opening of Dre doing some dark gangsta tracks in the beginning of the album with some of the old guests that were mentioned in this thread, former Death Row inmates, maybe Ren and Cube hey anything is possible and then having the theme of him going into a "Detox" type of thing and changing the production up to incorporate this new style with more jazzy beats and it would be a great way to introduce his protege Bishop Lamont into the world.
i see, so you want some sort of transition from "old" to new?
but don't you think that your idea could mean a less consistent album if he makes the album consist of 2 parts?
I think the overall sound of the album would not be as consistent but I think the album itself as far as being a dope and classic album can be done. I'm not saying put in a whole bunch of different sounds and bunch them all together or even put in G-funk, just some gangsta type tracks in the beginning similar to a few that he had on "2001" bet even with a darker sounding vibe. Dre is great at sequencing the songs on an album so one track kind of flows on to the other one so I don't think it would be a problem for him.
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the intro of Detox is called intervention.
not sure how dre is going to kick it off though; you'd expect him to come with some sort of warmup single.
he better not come with another still dre or forgot about dre.
don't get me wrong , i love those tracks, but the formula is too simple for me.
but the track will offcourse be considered as Dre's "comeback" :P
the Detox part should come at the end; at least that would make sense to me ;)
it's going to be a concept album after all.
yeah I don't think the same I'm Back type single would do the trick, I guess a street warmup single, I remember when "2001" came out there were leaks of songs like the OG "What's the Difference" with the unfinished beat. I remember hearing "Forgot About Dre" too. Both before "Still DRE" dropped
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I just read some interesting things about the concept of this album. I agree in order for this to go down as a classic that will be remembered it just can't be "The Chronic 3" with a bunch of guests old and new even if it is dope music. I like the idea of Dre doing something bad and then going to "Detox". Maybe this could be the opening of Dre doing some dark gangsta tracks in the beginning of the album with some of the old guests that were mentioned in this thread, former Death Row inmates, maybe Ren and Cube hey anything is possible and then having the theme of him going into a "Detox" type of thing and changing the production up to incorporate this new style with more jazzy beats and it would be a great way to introduce his protege Bishop Lamont into the world.
i see, so you want some sort of transition from "old" to new?
but don't you think that your idea could mean a less consistent album if he makes the album consist of 2 parts?
I think the overall sound of the album would not be as consistent but I think the album itself as far as being a dope and classic album can be done. I'm not saying put in a whole bunch of different sounds and bunch them all together or even put in G-funk, just some gangsta type tracks in the beginning similar to a few that he had on "2001" bet even with a darker sounding vibe. Dre is great at sequencing the songs on an album so one track kind of flows on to the other one so I don't think it would be a problem for him.
from a fan point of view i could probably still appreciate it, but i don't like the idea of dividing it roughly in 2 parts.
like Chad said:
fuck what sub-generes the rappers belong to.
Detox is going to have a wider mix of different styles/subgenres than 2001, because more people are involved this time.
i know that Dre is able to put it all together without making it seem like a compilation but am i really the only one that thinks that a general "theme" for the album is not enough :-\ the way i see it, with all the people involved the only way to do it is to make a conceptalbum or am i mixing up a few things :-\
yeah I don't think the same I'm Back type single would do the trick, I guess a street warmup single, I remember when "2001" came out there were leaks of songs like the OG "What's the Difference" with the unfinished beat. I remember hearing "Forgot About Dre" too. Both before "Still DRE" dropped
at least one snippet, and perhaps another youtube video; the bishop video had spread fast.
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I always thought of Dre's albums as compilations so I don't really mind that part, but I didn't really mean to divide the album into 2 parts, just have maybe 3 tracks lets say featuring for instance on one Kurupt, RBX and Rage in a throwback type gangsta track. Dre, Cube and Ren on another one and then have a Snoop/Dre one. The rest could be Aftermath artists from the label primarily featuring on Bishop but of course I expect Em, Busta and even 50 on a track, hopefully just one with 50. I definitey think this would work along with the concept.
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^^^^^
-Dre is learning "how" to score movies,he says (at the time of the interview) that it will take him 5-6 years to get it down.
This can explain;
*Why Detox is taking a minute to finished.
*Support the "movie" concept idea.
-It also has a part of Dre introducing new producers,so itīs not like Dre ainīt working. :P
yeah that interview is from 2004:
Dr.Dre Scratch magazine Volume 1 Summer 2004
(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2035/1889566536_c2f3b13ed2_b.jpg)
(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2009/1889575968_a1d416275e_b.jpg)
(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2336/1888752765_1abcf6efa0_b.jpg)
(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2025/1889595798_d73b461f59_b.jpg)
(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2411/1888772657_14bc976245_b.jpg)
(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2394/1888781655_1b6c65b57f_b.jpg)
(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2219/1889624402_d96981e739_b.jpg)
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I am hoping for a westcoast classic fatass g-funk sound fatass bass line's and all the people that dre has worked with only the westcoast cats of course also i wanna hear westside connection on there suga free j rock g malone
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I have a feeling Detox will be out by the end of the year, Not to say that Dre will follow the same pattern but "The Chronic" came out in December of '92 and "2001" in November of '99.
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That would be great if the "Detox" project had a story line like G malone's Beach Cruiser (dies at the beggining then wake up from a nightmare). As others said it could be Dre showing his dark gangsta side at the beggining. And then, he goes to a club and something wrong happens (murder !) which makes him want to detox. And that would also be a chronology of his carreer with the features that go from kurupt to bishop.
Another possibilty would be a kind of compilation album but with a particular sound which is all over the album (like 2001 and the chronic).
The tracks would then go through alot of crazy subjects and ideas like "imagine" or "cycle of dre" (jonathan rotem who produced it talked about it in 2005 or something) where dre goes back to all his carreer (like snoop did recently).
Another rumored track is about hip hop missing dr dre.
The album could be a compilation of classic tracks like these about party, the good and bad things in life, youth violence, fucking bitches, drugs, and more serious topics about death and hip hop in general...
I think the track "Imagine" is great tell of what detox will sound like...
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I'd rather it never come out, than for it to come out and suck and be full of rappers that I hate. I would lose so much respect for dre.
True, this is a good question you brought up. A lot of people aren't really seeing your idea through, and they are putting Dr. Dre under an aura of invincibility, but it's not guaranteed that, if Detox comes out, it will be great. If he drops something average or worse, it could severly tarnish his legacy. I would rather have him never come out than come with something weak, it's always better to leave your fans wanting more than getting tired of him. It's possible that if he came out weak he could come back hungry with something else, but the fact that he has had so much time for this would kind of cancel that thought out for me. Interesting discussion.
i think it was already clear that the disappointment when Detox finally drops is inevitable.
but then i ask you, how important is a first impression for you?
i mean, that Detox will be classic, according to "dre" standards is subjective and that expectation level is unrealistic.
that doesn't mean it will be very unlikely that Detox is going to be a good Dre soloalbum.
I have a feeling Detox will be out by the end of the year, Not to say that Dre will follow the same pattern but "The Chronic" came out in December of '92 and "2001" in November of '99.
i see.
but would it really hurt the sales that bad if interscope chose to release it in the beginning of a new year ( in Detox case, january 2009 for example) ?
:P
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I'd rather it never come out, than for it to come out and suck and be full of rappers that I hate. I would lose so much respect for dre.
True, this is a good question you brought up. A lot of people aren't really seeing your idea through, and they are putting Dr. Dre under an aura of invincibility, but it's not guaranteed that, if Detox comes out, it will be great. If he drops something average or worse, it could severly tarnish his legacy. I would rather have him never come out than come with something weak, it's always better to leave your fans wanting more than getting tired of him. It's possible that if he came out weak he could come back hungry with something else, but the fact that he has had so much time for this would kind of cancel that thought out for me. Interesting discussion.
i think it was already clear that the disappointment when Detox finally drops is inevitable.
but then i ask you, how important is a first impression for you?
i mean, that Detox will be classic, according to "dre" standards is subjective and that expectation level is unrealistic.
that doesn't mean it will be very unlikely that Detox is going to be a good Dre soloalbum.
I have a feeling Detox will be out by the end of the year, Not to say that Dre will follow the same pattern but "The Chronic" came out in December of '92 and "2001" in November of '99.
i see.
but would it really hurt the sales that bad if interscope chose to release it in the beginning of a new year ( in Detox case, january 2009 for example) ?
:P
I think Interscope would probably love to have it by late Novemeber, Black Friday week, to around the week before Christmas when sales are at the highest of the year. I don't think January is a good month because it is the lowest sales month of the year and people are just coming off spending tons of money on holiday season shopping, March/April would be better. I am speaking of course from Interscope's point of view, personally I don't mind it coming out in January, I will buy it regardless
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I'd rather it never come out, than for it to come out and suck and be full of rappers that I hate. I would lose so much respect for dre.
True, this is a good question you brought up. A lot of people aren't really seeing your idea through, and they are putting Dr. Dre under an aura of invincibility, but it's not guaranteed that, if Detox comes out, it will be great. If he drops something average or worse, it could severly tarnish his legacy. I would rather have him never come out than come with something weak, it's always better to leave your fans wanting more than getting tired of him. It's possible that if he came out weak he could come back hungry with something else, but the fact that he has had so much time for this would kind of cancel that thought out for me. Interesting discussion.
i think it was already clear that the disappointment when Detox finally drops is inevitable.
but then i ask you, how important is a first impression for you?
i mean, that Detox will be classic, according to "dre" standards is subjective and that expectation level is unrealistic.
that doesn't mean it will be very unlikely that Detox is going to be a good Dre soloalbum.
I have a feeling Detox will be out by the end of the year, Not to say that Dre will follow the same pattern but "The Chronic" came out in December of '92 and "2001" in November of '99.
i see.
but would it really hurt the sales that bad if interscope chose to release it in the beginning of a new year ( in Detox case, january 2009 for example) ?
:P
I think Interscope would probably love to have it by late Novemeber, Black Friday week, to around the week before Christmas when sales are at the highest of the year. I don't think January is a good month because it is the lowest sales month of the year and people are just coming off spending tons of money on holiday season shopping, March/April would be better. I am speaking of course from Interscope's point of view, personally I don't mind it coming out in January, I will buy it regardless
yeah i'm sure that Interscope knows when it's best to drop it.
well april has just started, so let's hope Dre can finish Detox this year, otherwise it will probably automatically be delayed (according to your view; offcourse you could be wrong, but i think your impression of Interscope's release strategy makes sense).
True, this is a good question you brought up. A lot of people aren't really seeing your idea through, and they are putting Dr. Dre under an aura of invincibility, but it's not guaranteed that, if Detox comes out, it will be great. If he drops something average or worse, it could severly tarnish his legacy. I would rather have him never come out than come with something weak, it's always better to leave your fans wanting more than getting tired of him. It's possible that if he came out weak he could come back hungry with something else, but the fact that he has had so much time for this would kind of cancel that thought out for me. Interesting discussion.
i think it was already clear that the disappointment when Detox finally drops is inevitable.
but then i ask you, how important is a first impression for you?
I answered this one above,lets say it took me a couple of days to really get into his previous albums.
Iīm not easily sold :P,the first impression counts.
But with an artist like Dre,Iīll give it a chance or two before I dismiss it.
After all itīs Dre :P :P ;)
i see; well i can only speak for myself offcourse :laugh:
i've caught myself liking certain tracks of an album that i didn't like before so many times :laugh:
so as far as Detox, i think the critic "attitude" is definitely a good thing, but i think that's why a first impression when listening to Detox is probably going to be a disappointment.
i could be wrong, as i said, i can only speak for myself.
when listening to Detox a couple of times, "we" may notice things that we didn't notice before or we start to like the direction etc. :laugh:
that's why i try to prepare myself for a dissapointment when i finally get the chance to hear it for the first time(offcourse this isn't really possible, since i haven't gotten a proper view of Detox, but still :P ),
I always thought of Dre's albums as compilations so I don't really mind that part
i see, but Dre's "soloalbums" do give a different feeling than a regular compilation/soundtrack right?
( or would you put the aftermath compilation and the wash soundtrack in the same category as The Chronic and 2001?).
despite the various guest features, they do give me the feeling of a regular album.
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It has been a longer wait for a Dre single this time because he had "Been There Done That" in '96 so he dropped one 3 years later
he had Zoom in 98 with LL and I believe the wild wild west soundtrack with "bad guys always die" came out in 99 before 2001 too ...so there was a lot more dre (vocal) presence overall
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It has been a longer wait for a Dre single this time because he had "Been There Done That" in '96 so he dropped one 3 years later
he had Zoom in 98 with LL and I believe the wild wild west soundtrack with "bad guys always die" came out in 99 before 2001 too ...so there was a lot more dre (vocal) presence overall
Yeah. That presence is what the game's been missing.
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These are some parts of the comments from "mellow man". Do you know who is this guy for real ? I read it would mike elizondo. If that shit is real the album is gonna be like that : 8)
"The Vibe award incident really had a big impact on Dre. I have never seen Dre as determined and focused as he is right now. His anger and will to defeat all those who try to bring him down are having a direct impact on the aggressive nature of his recent productions. I promise you that no one is as driven as Dre is to make Detox FUBAR the competition or anyone who stands in his way.
Dre is looking for a new sound and for that he is working with some people with fresh ideas and grooves. Right now if I were to guess, I would guess that Focus and/or Hi-Tek will be to Detox what Mel-Man was to 2001.
Every time Dre has changed sounds he has always done it with a new group of musicians. Detox will be no different. So although some of us on the 2001 crew will be a part of Detox it will probably be a much smaller role and a fresh group of musicians and co producers will get a shot to make their mark. The only thing I know is that Detox will not sound anything like 2001. Dre is really trying to leave a permanent dent on the sound of music with the musical atomic bomb he hopes Detox will be.
He will unleash a new sound when he's confident it will be good enough and creative enough that the 99 percent who are followers will start to try to recreate and copy the new dre sound.
dre is just going to mix, arrainge and create sounds and instruments in a way that has never been heard before- a Andre Mozart Young orchestral piece. like i mentioned before dre is always concerned about his legacy. Detox is going to be the last thing they remember dre with as an artist. he wants to drop music that people will remember forever.
i really can't describe the sound. just think of a wall of sound being shaken by a cali earthquake. i don't know what else to say. i just find myself laughing at some of the stuff cause its so goofy. but the aggression of the pace combined with the crazy instrumentations and swirling arsenal of sounds makes for some funky
and crazy ****. plus Detox will include by far the best collection of mc's for any of his solo albums.
i will only say that people who say that dre's sound has become basic and repetitive will be shocked at Detox. dre's new sound will be really innovative, melodic and musical using a huge array of live instruments and orchestral sounds. there is a reason dre has used a lot of the same style the last few years. it has been done on purpose. one, people used to his current sound, Detox will amaze them cause it is so different. and two, dre refused to copy anyone else - he will stick with one sound til he creates another innovative sound to change the game. and believe me dre will change the game on detox. each song will contionously change in pace, agressiveness, pitch and instruments. it will be nothing as you have ever quite heard before. yes dre has been getting instrumentals from top producers all over the hip hop nation. mostly for backup in case dre just can't come up with enough on his own, but some will probably appear as part of a track. right now dre is a mad scientist and orchestra conducter at the same time. he's preparing a atomic bomb that will destroy the sound barrier. Detox may fail, but its defintely going to be interesting and will cause a lot of differing opinions and discussion. the mc's on the album may be the finest group of mc's to ever appear on one album, and dre will match their lyrical genius with his musical genius. "
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These are some parts of the comments from "mellow man". Do you know who is this guy for real ? I read it would mike elizondo. If that shit is real the album is gonna be like that : 8)
I wish mellow man would come back to the forums, he hasn't posted here in like 2 years. I think he is Mike Elizondo.
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These are some parts of the comments from "mellow man". Do you know who is this guy for real ? I read it would mike elizondo. If that shit is real the album is gonna be like that : 8)
I wish mellow man would come back to the forums, he hasn't posted here in like 2 years. I think he is Mike Elizondo.
yeah i thought he was Mike too.
whoever he is, i really doubt it was an act; he seemed to mature and had too much knowlegde to make it look like an act.
i wish i was there when he was active on this board :P
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These are some parts of the comments from "mellow man". Do you know who is this guy for real ? I read it would mike elizondo. If that shit is real the album is gonna be like that : 8)
I wish mellow man would come back to the forums, he hasn't posted here in like 2 years. I think he is Mike Elizondo.
yeah i thought he was Mike too.
whoever he is, i really doubt it was an act; he seemed to mature and had too much knowlegde to make it look like an act.
i wish i was there when he was active on this board :P
I wasn't a member at the time but I did read the boards alot and I think he was Elizondo too, he dropped some indepth info but I think there were alot of doubters who eventually chased him away
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These are some parts of the comments from "mellow man". Do you know who is this guy for real ? I read it would mike elizondo. If that shit is real the album is gonna be like that : 8)
I wish mellow man would come back to the forums, he hasn't posted here in like 2 years. I think he is Mike Elizondo.
yeah i thought he was Mike too.
whoever he is, i really doubt it was an act; he seemed to mature and had too much knowlegde to make it look like an act.
i wish i was there when he was active on this board :P
I wasn't a member at the time but I did read the boards alot and I think he was Elizondo too, he dropped some indepth info but I think there were alot of doubters who eventually chased him away
i don't think that's the reason why he left; he's been around for years, so if the skeptism really bothered him that much he would not have been around that long.
would be great if he returns in the future though, since he would be a perfect contributor for this topic
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These are some parts of the comments from "mellow man". Do you know who is this guy for real ? I read it would mike elizondo. If that shit is real the album is gonna be like that : 8)
I wish mellow man would come back to the forums, he hasn't posted here in like 2 years. I think he is Mike Elizondo.
yeah i thought he was Mike too.
whoever he is, i really doubt it was an act; he seemed to mature and had too much knowlegde to make it look like an act.
i wish i was there when he was active on this board :P
I wasn't a member at the time but I did read the boards alot and I think he was Elizondo too, he dropped some indepth info but I think there were alot of doubters who eventually chased him away
i don't think that's the reason why he left; he's been around for years, so if the skeptism really bothered him that much he would not have been around that long.
would be great if he returns in the future though, since he would be a perfect contributor for this topic
people actually thought he was Mel-Man, I remember going to other websites and seeing quotes stating Mel-Man said this about Rakims album and stuff like that
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Chad I agree with Dre-Day, he would have been perfect to discuss this topic with now that we are all on the board and especially since only a few of us are willing to serioulsly talk about it
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What Mr. Porter means by "before I go back out there" is supplying beats for Dr Dres swan song Detox. He - along with quite a few other notable producers - have been hard at work supplying the good Doctor with a plethora of beats. Many are curious what is going on with the project but Porter can give some insight.
He just needs that first record, he says of the hold up on the album. Hes got records. Weve busted our ass and I hope Dre feels that way. We really came to the table with different things. But Dres going to do that record. Were not going to do it, were just giving him ideas. But Andre Young is going to come with it! Its just his last record and hes gotta go out with a bang!
http://www.hiphopdx.com/index/news/id.6711/title.mr-porter-reveals-details-on-eminem-detox-solo-album-more
not sure how to interpret this, but somehow i get the feeling that the album is close to being complete (Dre just needs to pick/make the first 1single).
lol, that will probably take some time, but still ;)
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http://www.hiphopdx.com/index/news/id.6711/title.mr-porter-reveals-details-on-eminem-detox-solo-album-more
Denaun Porter aka Mr. Porter aka Kon Artis from D12 has been a busy man as of late. While putting in work for artists like Little Brother, Pharoahe Monch and Jay Electronica, Mr. Porter revealed to HipHopDX what he has coming up in 2008.
I definitely am going to help get this D12 album done, he states about working with his crew. I got 6 songs that Im in love with not just because I did them but because the guys are spitting their hearts out.
Porter also reveals a solo production album coming out this year titled Who Is John Doe.
Im putting out the Who Is John Doe project this year and its a great thing because it gives you a CD of all of the beats that didnt make it (on other albums), the Detroit producer explains. Its all chops and niggas aint never heard me do that. They are hearing beats that arent even put together. They are raggedy.
The guest list is full of some of the Motor City's finest.
The album has got Guilty Simpson, its got Black Milk, myself doing solo songs, Phat Kat. Its got all these cats I came up to listening with Jay Dee. Its got Slum Village. Elzhi has a solo song on there. Dwele. So I made that project for myself before I go back out there.
What Mr. Porter means by "before I go back out there" is supplying beats for Dr Dres swan song Detox. He - along with quite a few other notable producers - have been hard at work supplying the good Doctor with a plethora of beats. Many are curious what is going on with the project but Porter can give some insight.
He just needs that first record, he says of the hold up on the album. Hes got records. Weve busted our ass and I hope Dre feels that way. We really came to the table with different things. But Dres going to do that record. Were not going to do it, were just giving him ideas. But Andre Young is going to come with it! Its just his last record and hes gotta go out with a bang!
The one thing that piques the curiosity of many is the whereabouts of Porter's close friend, Slim Shady.
Eminems been recording, hes always working. Me and him havent talked much because I have my own career.
But although he hasn't talked as frequently with his friend as many would think, Porter did take the time to squash a few rumors that had been hovering.
Em aint fat, Porter laughs as he talks about the blond emcee from 8 Mile. He fucked his ACL up. What people dont know is that Em got sick around Christmas and he had pneumonia. Then he fucked his ACL up right after that and thats a serious injury. Hes straight. He just hurt himself and hes good. He aint high or fucked up somewhere. That nigga is working. Im going to help him get his record done. I need an Eminem record in my life for my own self. I need that.
Porter also says that Eminem is completely clean and in great spirits.
Hes the most clear and at his brightest point. Thats my family. We bump heads because we competitors. Im cuter than him and he hates it. Bitches love me, they love him too but he got more money than me.
This is what I suspected. The album is pretty much done, but Dre can't decide on the singles just yet. I understand that though--if he comes with anything that's less than Still D.R.E. or Nuthin But a G Thang level, it could totally change how his album is perceived and disappoint a lot of fans and potential buyers.
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What Mr. Porter means by "before I go back out there" is supplying beats for Dr Dres swan song Detox. He - along with quite a few other notable producers - have been hard at work supplying the good Doctor with a plethora of beats. Many are curious what is going on with the project but Porter can give some insight.
He just needs that first record, he says of the hold up on the album. Hes got records. Weve busted our ass and I hope Dre feels that way. We really came to the table with different things. But Dres going to do that record. Were not going to do it, were just giving him ideas. But Andre Young is going to come with it! Its just his last record and hes gotta go out with a bang!
http://www.hiphopdx.com/index/news/id.6711/title.mr-porter-reveals-details-on-eminem-detox-solo-album-more
not sure how to interpret this, but somehow i get the feeling that the album is close to being complete (Dre just needs to pick/make the first 1single).
lol, that will probably take some time, but still ;)
I think it is close to done too. The same thing happened with "2001" the album was just about finished about this time that year but Dre was searching for that first single. I think we will probably start to hear some tracks leak during the summer. I am still looking for a November/December release date
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All I want..is Dre to put together an Album, that Other up and Coming producer will try to mimic for the next 5-10 yrs-Just like what 2001 did..
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What Mr. Porter means by "before I go back out there" is supplying beats for Dr Dres swan song Detox. He - along with quite a few other notable producers - have been hard at work supplying the good Doctor with a plethora of beats. Many are curious what is going on with the project but Porter can give some insight.
He just needs that first record, he says of the hold up on the album. Hes got records. Weve busted our ass and I hope Dre feels that way. We really came to the table with different things. But Dres going to do that record. Were not going to do it, were just giving him ideas. But Andre Young is going to come with it! Its just his last record and hes gotta go out with a bang!
http://www.hiphopdx.com/index/news/id.6711/title.mr-porter-reveals-details-on-eminem-detox-solo-album-more
not sure how to interpret this, but somehow i get the feeling that the album is close to being complete (Dre just needs to pick/make the first 1single).
lol, that will probably take some time, but still ;)
I think it is close to done too. The same thing happened with "2001" the album was just about finished about this time that year but Dre was searching for that first single. I think we will probably start to hear some tracks leak during the summer. I am still looking for a November/December release date
i see, yeah november/december makes sense ;)
so with 2001 a few tracks were leaked too?
only the singles , or?
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What Mr. Porter means by "before I go back out there" is supplying beats for Dr Dres swan song Detox. He - along with quite a few other notable producers - have been hard at work supplying the good Doctor with a plethora of beats. Many are curious what is going on with the project but Porter can give some insight.
He just needs that first record, he says of the hold up on the album. Hes got records. Weve busted our ass and I hope Dre feels that way. We really came to the table with different things. But Dres going to do that record. Were not going to do it, were just giving him ideas. But Andre Young is going to come with it! Its just his last record and hes gotta go out with a bang!
http://www.hiphopdx.com/index/news/id.6711/title.mr-porter-reveals-details-on-eminem-detox-solo-album-more
not sure how to interpret this, but somehow i get the feeling that the album is close to being complete (Dre just needs to pick/make the first 1single).
lol, that will probably take some time, but still ;)
I think it is close to done too. The same thing happened with "2001" the album was just about finished about this time that year but Dre was searching for that first single. I think we will probably start to hear some tracks leak during the summer. I am still looking for a November/December release date
i see, yeah november/december makes sense ;)
so with 2001 a few tracks were leaked too?
only the singles , or?
the single "Still Dre" was the last song to be finished, it leaked right around early September that year. But songs like "What's The Difference" the OG version with Hitman on it and an slightly different beat were leaked around summer time. I also remember hearing the Royce Track with the "XXXplosive" beat as well.
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What Mr. Porter means by "before I go back out there" is supplying beats for Dr Dres swan song Detox. He - along with quite a few other notable producers - have been hard at work supplying the good Doctor with a plethora of beats. Many are curious what is going on with the project but Porter can give some insight.
He just needs that first record, he says of the hold up on the album. Hes got records. Weve busted our ass and I hope Dre feels that way. We really came to the table with different things. But Dres going to do that record. Were not going to do it, were just giving him ideas. But Andre Young is going to come with it! Its just his last record and hes gotta go out with a bang!
http://www.hiphopdx.com/index/news/id.6711/title.mr-porter-reveals-details-on-eminem-detox-solo-album-more
not sure how to interpret this, but somehow i get the feeling that the album is close to being complete (Dre just needs to pick/make the first 1single).
lol, that will probably take some time, but still ;)
I think it is close to done too. The same thing happened with "2001" the album was just about finished about this time that year but Dre was searching for that first single. I think we will probably start to hear some tracks leak during the summer. I am still looking for a November/December release date
i see, yeah november/december makes sense ;)
so with 2001 a few tracks were leaked too?
only the singles , or?
the single "Still Dre" was the last song to be finished, it leaked right around early September that year. But songs like "What's The Difference" the OG version with Hitman on it and an slightly different beat were leaked around summer time. I also remember hearing the Royce Track with the "XXXplosive" beat as well.
that's quite a few leaks :laugh:
i can imagine that it's going to be bigger this time though ( sure Detox doesn't need much promo, but there hasn't been a slim shady LP type of album when it comes to success, to hype Detox so :laugh: )
he might as well drop a warmup single with a video ;)
or a trailer like Chad once suggested :D
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speaking of club tracks, no typical club tracks for Detox please :P
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Damn, only two verses!!
Damn it would really be something if Dre put something like this on Detox, and start off right where he ended this track
Probably never happen,Cuz Suge probably owns the rights to this song...
i don't think it will be released properly mastered, but i don't see why such a song/concept can't be used for Detox ;)
but i think it would be too simple for Detox; it's like Neva have 2 worry ;)
but the element of talking about his life can definitely be used in whatever concept he has planned for the whole album.
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I want to hear a lil Detox sample, just 10 seconds....
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Damn, only two verses!!
Damn it would really be something if Dre put something like this on Detox, and start off right where he ended this track
Probably never happen,Cuz Suge probably owns the rights to this song...
i don't think it will be released properly mastered, but i don't see why such a song/concept can't be used for Detox ;)
but i think it would be too simple for Detox; it's like Neva have 2 worry ;)
but the element of talking about his life can definitely be used in whatever concept he has planned for the whole album.
? what the hell are you guys talking about? :P (two verses? , what unmastered tracks? , what concept?)
Dr.Dre - My Life.
i quoted it from an other topic ;)
http://www.dubcnn.com/connect/index.php?topic=160576.msg1829625#msg1829625
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Damn, only two verses!!
Damn it would really be something if Dre put something like this on Detox, and start off right where he ended this track
Probably never happen,Cuz Suge probably owns the rights to this song...
i don't think it will be released properly mastered, but i don't see why such a song/concept can't be used for Detox ;)
but i think it would be too simple for Detox; it's like Neva have 2 worry ;)
but the element of talking about his life can definitely be used in whatever concept he has planned for the whole album.
? what the hell are you guys talking about? :P (two verses? , what unmastered tracks? , what concept?)
Dr.Dre - My Life.
i quoted it from an other topic ;)
ohhh I see :P ;)
I was a little confused,tried to look for the original post in this thread :P
You should have copied and posted the link to the OG thread (or post) you jacked it from as well ;)
anyway,i got it on vinyl.
Note that itīs a promotional copy :P (yeah right :P :laugh:)
(http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3077/2453539771_e8a2d258ce_b.jpg)
I can't see the pic Chad, I guess this was the promo to "My Life" that was being discussed
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^^^why canīt you see the pic? ^^^
anyway hereīs a link to the flick;
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3077/2453539771_e8a2d258ce_b.jpg
I can't see this one either, must be the settings on my work computer, I'll have to check it when I get home
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^^^why canīt you see the pic? ^^^
anyway hereīs a link to the flick;
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3077/2453539771_e8a2d258ce_b.jpg
I can't see this one either, must be the settings on my work computer, I'll have to check it when I get home
maybe they blocked flickr?
probably, there's quite a few sites I don't have access from here
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Detox serioullsy aint coming out muthafuckas why get ya hopes up?
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so which thought has the upperhand for you; frustration due of the area 51 policy, or curiousness when it comes to the suprises that Detox will bring?
for me it's the 2nd option.
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THe first single should feature snoop dogg nate dogg and game
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Trough PMīs me and Dre-Day has been discussing that the "I Dominate" track might be the first single for Detox.
Hereīs why;
-First what is Bishop Lamont dominating?
-Bishop said there will be annoncement VERY SOON! in one of his last interviews. (Dre-Day find this ;))
-The annocement might come on Dreīs birthday.....
-+ Nima said Detox is coming very,very soon. Nima might have some "exclusive" info,yet to be leaked :D?
So letīs see how this plays out :D :D
yeah it's just a theory, but remember this:
Dubcnn: As far as The Reformation is concerned, youre going to do a video for the first single soon. Do you want to tell us anything about that?
Were going to be going somewhere real exotic. Thanks Dre! Were gonna be having a ball and doing something real stupid, doing something real fresh, real fun for the West Coast. [Its] not the typical Im in the parking lot, Im in front of a liquor store. You know what Im sayin? That shit is pretty much played! Ive got a graffiti backdrop! Im hood! Im 29 by the time you see this, so I aint no little kid. Weve got to do things on a classier level, on a grown man level, and still be big kids and be foolish. So youre going to enjoy it! Im gonna leave it alone, but just to let you know, the song is called I Dominate. Thats what were going to do. Were gonna dominate the charts, were gonna dominate hip-hop. Youll see!
so like chad said, how is he going to dominate the charts when he relatively unknown to the mainstream? a dre single could help, but the best promotion you can have is to be introduced by dre on detox. the reformation might still drop before detox, but usually dre introduces somebody before releasing their soloalbum ( snoop dogg, hittman).
Eminem was an exception, but i guess that was because of interscope, and the fact that some "old" material was reused; they really want to put an album out fast.
so now this "single" is called Grown Man; i think you were onto something Chad ;)
focus said this in an interview
How do the songs you heard compare to Dres most recent album 2001?
Dre is going to have his listeners understand that growing up is not being uncool. The whole 30 is the new 20 movement, were just trying to show that youre not getting wack. Youre not getting uncool. The thing about it is that everybody is afraid to get older and theres nothing you can do about that. But Dre has his finger on the pulse of the world and he knows whats going on and were going to show that with his new maturity, his new music is crazy.
so no way that Grown Man is a single for the reformation; Detox is coming first, no question about that.
the aftermath camp needs to stop playing around though :laugh:
perhaps Grown man is the tentative title for Detox' warmup single or first single ( since i don't know what the plans are with Detox).
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I dominate and Grown Man definitely sounds like titles that would fit Dre and not Bishop.
And Reformation before Detox,common who are the kidding?
yeah lol, interscope is not stupid.
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I've been thinking the same thing since i heard the news about the single. Both those titles seem more like they would be for Dre
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so in the DJ Skee radio interview Bishop said that Dre's making two versions of Detox and decide from there :-\
i don't see how that would make it easier for Dre.
sounds like yet another change of plans ::)
he can go on as long as he wants, but it seems like he changes his mind so many times, which makes me wonder if Dre will ever be satisfied with a certain version of Detox :P
and even if he's satisfied with a certain version, that doesn't necessarily mean that this vision will be shared by others; I mean, who knows what Dre has in the vaults.
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Dre should've just release that album in 04-05 and then if it was crap, they could've tried a comeback together with Eminem...
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so in the DJ Skee radio interview Bishop said that Dre's making two versions of Detox and decide from there :-\
I don't see how that would make it easier for Dre.
I think this is a interesting way to work,he actually wants to see/hear what route/concept comes out best (in his opinion). ;)
I mean instead of setling for one route/concept.
more material=more trouble for Dre; that's what i suspect.
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This whole thing on page 7 about Denaun saying Dre's got all these bangers and he's just waiting for the perfect single... how good does a first single for Detox actually have to be? I mean, are people supposed to fall into orgasm upon first listen or something? lol... I mean, it's crazy the way this thing has been biult up. I avoided the hype for a long time, because I learned my lesson waiting for Dre's last solo album, I never believed any of these so-called "release dates" people were puttin out there, it was funny Dre had a Summer of 99 Source cover cause they thought the album was coming and it didn't come out for several more months... but now the Detox hype is really gettin to me.
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so in the DJ Skee radio interview Bishop said that Dre's making two versions of Detox and decide from there :-\
I don't see how that would make it easier for Dre.
I think this is a interesting way to work,he actually wants to see/hear what route/concept comes out best (in his opinion). ;)
I mean instead of setling for one route/concept.
more material=more trouble for Dre; that's what i suspect.
Itīs not like Dre donīt work anyway,so why not try to build a couple of visions/concepts instead of scrapping them?
For all we know he got 5 or more "Detox albums" in works. :P
nah i'm just saying that, he's now "keeping" two versions, so i don't see how that would make it easier for him to choose, in compared to one.
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2001 has a 2 versions ;)
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so in the DJ Skee radio interview Bishop said that Dre's making two versions of Detox and decide from there :-\
I don't see how that would make it easier for Dre.
I think this is a interesting way to work,he actually wants to see/hear what route/concept comes out best (in his opinion). ;)
I mean instead of setling for one route/concept.
more material=more trouble for Dre; that's what i suspect.
Itīs not like Dre donīt work anyway,so why not try to build a couple of visions/concepts instead of scrapping them?
For all we know he got 5 or more "Detox albums" in works. :P
nah i'm just saying that, he's now "keeping" two versions, so i don't see how that would make it easier for him to choose, in compared to one.
I got that ;)
But as I said,you never know what Bishop and/or Dre is keeping away from us. :P
Yes,it will hard for him to choose. But he should do what he feels is right,trust his instinct. ;)
ok, but i don't trust Dre's instinct.
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Just read this rumor over at allhiphop.com -
"I am hearing that neither 50 Cent nor Game will be on Detox. I did hear that Snoop (you know this), Bishop Lamont (you know this too), Eminem (this too), Cashis, Busta Rhymes and even Diddy will be on the final product."
Sounds good to me! Well... maybe not Diddy
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Just read this rumor over at allhiphop.com -
"I am hearing that neither 50 Cent nor Game will be on Detox. I did hear that Snoop (you know this), Bishop Lamont (you know this too), Eminem (this too), Cashis, Busta Rhymes and even Diddy will be on the final product."
Sounds good to me! Well... maybe not Diddy
:P
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Well, everything in the whole thread and everything mentioned over the last several years is a rumor until we have the CD in our hands!
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Well, everything in the whole thread and everything mentioned over the last several years is a rumor until we have the CD in our hands!
lol :laugh:
a lot of things are unknown, that's a whole different story ;)
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Just read this rumor over at allhiphop.com -
"I am hearing that neither 50 Cent nor Game will be on Detox. I did hear that Snoop (you know this), Bishop Lamont (you know this too), Eminem (this too), Cashis, Busta Rhymes and even Diddy will be on the final product."
Sounds good to me! Well... maybe not Diddy
What's the source? Oh right! Heartalk...although he could co-produce something with diddy, maybe Grow Up was with diddy? You never know.
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I hope to hear a verse from The D.O.C... Even short, but to hear.. Everybody iz everybody.
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Well, everything in the whole thread and everything mentioned over the last several years is a rumor until we have the CD in our hands!
;) :laugh:
Maybe the topic title should be changed to the serious rumors and speculations thread about Detox?
It should be fun to see if any of the shit in this thread will come true :laugh:
but if we're going to lower ourselves to gossip :-X
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I think with Detox people have been expecting the big new innovation to be musical - as in the beats... but I'm starting to think that the new innovation will be mainly the lyrical content... basically a huge mainstream album with different subject matter than we're used to - that's exactly what 'Grow Up' is
The beats will bang hard, no doubt, but I don't think they will be where the 'difference' is. Critics mainly criticized 2001 for it's cliched, tired lyrical content, and so I think Dre picked up on that and that's why he he's going to change the content with Detox - no more out and out gangsta shit (and therefore no room for Game or 50)
And if you think about it, Dre has never really be an innovator in beats... he has simply taken ideas that are already there and done them the best... G-Funk was already around, he just made two of the finest examples of that style with Chronic and Doggystyle... then people had been doing keyboard, minimalist beats for awhile when he brought out 2001... his shit was just louder and bigger and harder and clearer and all 5/5 beats on one album
I don't think Dre will do a Paul's Boutique on us. He's always had a very commercial ear and I think this album will sound very similar to what he's been doing for the past few years (though it will be some of the best beats of that type), and you may not even notice any difference until you've heard it several times... just like with 'Grow Up', because the difference will be in what's being said, not how it's being said or what beats it's over, at least that's what I'm guessing
So the revolution will probably be a subtle one... not an out and out sonic revolution with crazy new sounds and unpredictable song structures like on Paul's Boutique... 'Grow Up' is verse chorus verse chorus verse chorus... because that is what works on a large scale to get a big audience
I think the plan is to get that audience hooked with the typical structure and big banging beats they're used to, whilst slowly feeding them some new content instead of the same tired gangsta re-treads we've heard for the past 15 or so years
you're right, as it was pointed out so many times before, let's not expect a miracle.
but i think you should expect more from Detox than just an "upgrade" of the lyrics.
come on, the album has been re-worked so many times now, so i think it's only right to expect more improvement on the production side.
that doesn't necessarily imply that Detox won't sound somewhat similar to Dre's recent productions.
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you're right, as it was pointed out so many times before, let's not expect a miracle.
but i think you should expect more from Detox than just an "upgrade" of the lyrics.
come on, the album has been re-worked so many times now, so i think it's only right to expect more improvement on the production side.
that doesn't necessarily imply that Detox won't sound somewhat similar to Dre's recent productions.
Now I'm just expecting banging beats, but in the same way 2001 was banging... several of them were some of the best Dre beats ever, though they weren't like groundbreaking in terms of doing something totally different
I think before I was expecting something totally different, like beats that change all the way through, or more layers, or whatever... I don't think we'll be seeing a big leap like that, it'll just be a collection of some of the best Dre beats he's ever done
Looking around the net at reactions to 'Grow Up' - it seems like 95% of people who hear it say the beat is awesome... compared to the initial reaction to it on here...
I think that's mainly because most music listeners haven't been following all the Detox info over the years... they probably heard it's going to come out, but aren't expecting it to be insanely different... so to most people who hear the 'Grow Up' beat, it's just a really big, dope, chilled beat... like I think if the Grow Up beat had been on Snoop's last album or on Game's new album, people here would have been like :o :o ... because they wouldn't expect that 'new' style they think Dre is going to bring
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you're right, as it was pointed out so many times before, let's not expect a miracle.
but i think you should expect more from Detox than just an "upgrade" of the lyrics.
come on, the album has been re-worked so many times now, so i think it's only right to expect more improvement on the production side.
that doesn't necessarily imply that Detox won't sound somewhat similar to Dre's recent productions.
Now I'm just expecting banging beats, but in the same way 2001 was banging... several of them were some of the best Dre beats ever, though they weren't like groundbreaking in terms of doing something totally different
I think before I was expecting something totally different, like beats that change all the way through, or more layers, or whatever... I don't think we'll be seeing a big leap like that, it'll just be a collection of some of the best Dre beats he's ever done
agreed, 2001 wasn't a miracle, but you could say it wasn't just a chronic 2 ;)
i think it's good that your expectations for Detox aren't unrealistically high; maybe that'll help you take the album for what it's worth quicker if/when it drops.
i wonder why your expectations have changed though; i thought that reading info, like the stuff from my Detox topic, would lead to higher expectations :laugh:
by the way, so you're basically expecting the best out of the current Dre production style/structure to be kept for Detox?
wouldn't you agree that it sounds disappointing, considering what's been told and how long the album has been worked on so far?
Dre didn't experiment much in the last few years :P
Looking around the net at reactions to 'Grow Up' - it seems like 95% of people who hear it say the beat is awesome... compared to the initial reaction to it on here...
I think that's mainly because most music listeners haven't been following all the Detox info over the years... they probably heard it's going to come out, but aren't expecting it to be insanely different... so to most people who hear the 'Grow Up' beat, it's just a really big, dope, chilled beat... like I think if the Grow Up beat had been on Snoop's last album or on Game's new album, people here would have been like :o :o ... because they wouldn't expect that 'new' style they think Dre is going to bring
i don't think it would make much of a difference to whom the beat had went to; Dre beats automatically lead to high expectations :P
just look at how the stuff from the blue carpet treatment was criticised for example ;)
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i wonder why your expectations have changed though; i thought that reading info, like the stuff from my Detox topic, would lead to higher expectations :laugh:
by the way, so you're basically expecting the best out of the current Dre production style/structure to be kept for Detox?
wouldn't you agree that it sounds disappointing, considering what's been told and how long the album has been worked on so far?
Dre didn't experiment much in the last few years :P
My expectations changed kind of based off of 'Grow Up'... they didn't really change, that track just more confirmed to me what I already suspected - that Dre will go with what sounds good over some crazy new thing that is different for the sake of being different. I was open to it being crazily different (and I was kind of hoping it would be), but after hearing 'Grow Up', that kind of did it for me... now all I am expecting are dope beats in the same style or only slightly different - I hope I'm wrong, but I won't be disappointed if it's what I think it will be
Concept albums often screw up because the concept becomes the focus and you get some weak tracks which make the concept work but sound like shit, so it always made sense that a lot of it would go out of the window in favor of what just sounds good. Like you could come up with a crazy idea that looks good on paper, like let's make the whole thing change throughout the track, use this instrument to represent this, etc, but if it doesn't sound as dope as just looping something up with massive drums, then Dre seems like the type who will just go for the better sounding option every time (which is good IMO)
i don't think it would make much of a difference to whom the beat had went to; Dre beats automatically lead to high expectations :P
just look at how the stuff from the blue carpet treatment was criticised for example ;)
They always do lead to high expectations, but Detox is that plus like 10000% on top... even though people say they thought those beats on blue carpet treatment weren't some of Dre's best, people often still say they're the best beats on the album!
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i wonder why your expectations have changed though; i thought that reading info, like the stuff from my Detox topic, would lead to higher expectations :laugh:
by the way, so you're basically expecting the best out of the current Dre production style/structure to be kept for Detox?
wouldn't you agree that it sounds disappointing, considering what's been told and how long the album has been worked on so far?
Dre didn't experiment much in the last few years :P
My expectations changed kind of based off of 'Grow Up'... they didn't really change, that track just more confirmed to me what I already suspected - that Dre will go with what sounds good over some crazy new thing that is different for the sake of being different. I was open to it being crazily different (and I was kind of hoping it would be), but after hearing 'Grow Up', that kind of did it for me... now all I am expecting are dope beats in the same style or only slightly different - I hope I'm wrong, but I won't be disappointed if it's what I think it will be
Concept albums often screw up because the concept becomes the focus and you get some weak tracks which make the concept work but sound like shit, so it always made sense that a lot of it would go out of the window in favor of what just sounds good. Like you could come up with a crazy idea that looks good on paper, like let's make the whole thing change throughout the track, use this instrument to represent this, etc, but if it doesn't sound as dope as just looping something up with massive drums, then Dre seems like the type who will just go for the better sounding option every time (which is good IMO)
i see, well in that case Detox could be a very dope album for you ;)
anyway, you're right, some things may not turn out as well as they look on paper, but i already expect Detox to sound good, so i would feel cheated if Dre takes the fast route.
i don't think it would make much of a difference to whom the beat had went to; Dre beats automatically lead to high expectations :P
just look at how the stuff from the blue carpet treatment was criticised for example ;)
They always do lead to high expectations, but Detox is that plus like 10000% on top... even though people say they thought those beats on blue carpet treatment weren't some of Dre's best, people often still say they're the best beats on the album!
yep Detox is a special case :laugh:
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First let me say I'm anticipating Detox, I really want it to raise the bar production wise and lyrically, but my opinion is that Detox is not going to be as good as 2001 and definitally not as good as The Chronic. When The Chronic came out and I heard it for the first time, I was hooked on it instantly, that album changed the sound for the whole westcoast, it was "the new shit" and the westcoast dominated for the next several years from that style. After a few years the westcoast influence wasn't as big and the eastcoast was on top, westcoast artist we're still doing their thing but not getting nearly as much recognition. Then came 2001, it was a great album but I can honestly say that it took me a few listens to fully appreciate Dre's new sound, to me it sounded more stipped down and simple compared to The Chronic. I think 2001 broke new ground sonically, more so than it did from the actual beats, based on how clean and hard hitting the beats were (basically the mixing and mastering of the album). People now are still trying to make their beats "bang" as hard as Dre's do. 2001 didn't change the game and and did not give the westcoast a new sound to run with like The Chronic did, aside from a few artist's albums affiliated with Dre (Snoop's Last Meal, which wasn't all that, Em's Marshall Mathers LP which was tight but he's not westcoast though, Xzibits Restless was tight too) the westcoast still got overlooked and the east coast still had it locked and now the south is getting their shot at it. I think Detox might be more along the lines of 2001, I don't think it's gonna be a drastic change from the type of beats/songs he's been producing in the last few years, but Dre might improve once again the quality of his sound. I mean ofcorse there will be a few songs that are gonna be, without a doubt, the best out of the album, real classics, but I don't really see Detox changing the game. After it comes out there will be a few artist affiliated with Dre that will come out with great, successful albums (Bishop being one of them) but after that it will be back to whatever. I think Dre has the ear to do something really creative production wise and come up with some really new shit but I don't think he'll do it. Some of the more recent songs that Dre produced left me unsatisfied, the songs he did on Jay-Z Kingdom Come album as well as Snoops Blue Carpet treatment sounded lazy. The new Bishop Lamont song Grow Up is again very simple and is not breaking any new ground, don't get me wrong, it's a good song but if it was the exact same song with a different rapper spittin the lyrics and no Dr. Dre stamp on the production side, I doubt that people would be talking about how great the song is. For being the first official single off of Bishop's upcoming album The Reformation, after all the re-working and pushing back of Detox because Dre's not satisfied, it sounds like Dre didn't "take his time to perfect a beat", I expected more. I think that if you think about all the lead singles that Dre has produced in all his years, 95% of them kill this song. That's why I don't really have high hopes for the album to do anything different, with such high expectations for Detox, most of the music Dre's produced in the last couple of years has been, ehhh...alright. I don't want to come off as a Dr. Dre hater or nothing, I love all his work from the N.W.A. days up until the 2001 days, I like what he did on the Game's first album, even that Dr. Dre presents Aftermath album has some tight tracks on it and the King T album Dre produced that was going to come out before Eminem's first album was tight as hell (he should have put it out). Maybe he's saving all his best work for Detox? I hope so. Come on Dre, change the game one more time...
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First let me say I'm anticipating Detox, I really want it to raise the bar production wise and lyrically, but my opinion is that Detox is not going to be as good as 2001 and definitally not as good as The Chronic. When The Chronic came out and I heard it for the first time, I was hooked on it instantly, that album changed the sound for the whole westcoast, it was "the new shit" and the westcoast dominated for the next several years from that style. After a few years the westcoast influence wasn't as big and the eastcoast was on top, westcoast artist we're still doing their thing but not getting nearly as much recognition. Then came 2001, it was a great album but I can honestly say that it took me a few listens to fully appreciate Dre's new sound, to me it sounded more stipped down and simple compared to The Chronic. I think 2001 broke new ground sonically, more so than it did from the actual beats, based on how clean and hard hitting the beats were (basically the mixing and mastering of the album). People now are still trying to make their beats "bang" as hard as Dre's do. 2001 didn't change the game and and did not give the westcoast a new sound to run with like The Chronic did, aside from a few artist's albums affiliated with Dre (Snoop's Last Meal, which wasn't all that, Em's Marshall Mathers LP which was tight but he's not westcoast though, Xzibits Restless was tight too) the westcoast still got overlooked and the east coast still had it locked and now the south is getting their shot at it. I think Detox might be more along the lines of 2001, I don't think it's gonna be a drastic change from the type of beats/songs he's been producing in the last few years, but Dre might improve once again the quality of his sound. I mean ofcorse there will be a few songs that are gonna be, without a doubt, the best out of the album, real classics, but I don't really see Detox changing the game. After it comes out there will be a few artist affiliated with Dre that will come out with great, successful albums (Bishop being one of them) but after that it will be back to whatever. I think Dre has the ear to do something really creative production wise and come up with some really new shit but I don't think he'll do it. Some of the more recent songs that Dre produced left me unsatisfied, the songs he did on Jay-Z Kingdom Come album as well as Snoops Blue Carpet treatment sounded lazy. The new Bishop Lamont song Grow Up is again very simple and is not breaking any new ground, don't get me wrong, it's a good song but if it was the exact same song with a different rapper spittin the lyrics and no Dr. Dre stamp on the production side, I doubt that people would be talking about how great the song is. For being the first official single off of Bishop's upcoming album The Reformation, after all the re-working and pushing back of Detox because Dre's not satisfied, it sounds like Dre didn't "take his time to perfect a beat", I expected more. I think that if you think about all the lead singles that Dre has produced in all his years, 95% of them kill this song. That's why I don't really have high hopes for the album to do anything different, with such high expectations for Detox, most of the music Dre's produced in the last couple of years has been, ehhh...alright. I don't want to come off as a Dr. Dre hater or nothing, I love all his work from the N.W.A. days up until the 2001 days, I like what he did on the Game's first album, even that Dr. Dre presents Aftermath album has some tight tracks on it and the King T album Dre produced that was going to come out before Eminem's first album was tight as hell (he should have put it out). Maybe he's saving all his best work for Detox? I hope so. Come on Dre, change the game one more time...
congrats on your first post :cheers:
i appreciate your honesty ;)
well as you read in this topic, others are sceptical too due to similar reasons as yours ;)
anyway, keep up the good work :sun:
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Nice input from B.A.,UCC and Dre-Day ;)
;)
i wonder why your expectations have changed though; i thought that reading info, like the stuff from my Detox topic, would lead to higher expectations :laugh:
by the way, so you're basically expecting the best out of the current Dre production style/structure to be kept for Detox?
wouldn't you agree that it sounds disappointing, considering what's been told and how long the album has been worked on so far?
Dre didn't experiment much in the last few years :P
My expectations changed kind of based off of 'Grow Up'... they didn't really change, that track just more confirmed to me what I already suspected - that Dre will go with what sounds good over some crazy new thing that is different for the sake of being different. I was open to it being crazily different (and I was kind of hoping it would be), but after hearing 'Grow Up', that kind of did it for me... now all I am expecting are dope beats in the same style or only slightly different - I hope I'm wrong, but I won't be disappointed if it's what I think it will be
Concept albums often screw up because the concept becomes the focus and you get some weak tracks which make the concept work but sound like shit, so it always made sense that a lot of it would go out of the window in favor of what just sounds good. Like you could come up with a crazy idea that looks good on paper, like let's make the whole thing change throughout the track, use this instrument to represent this, etc, but if it doesn't sound as dope as just looping something up with massive drums, then Dre seems like the type who will just go for the better sounding option every time (which is good IMO)
i don't think it would make much of a difference to whom the beat had went to; Dre beats automatically lead to high expectations :P
just look at how the stuff from the blue carpet treatment was criticised for example ;)
They always do lead to high expectations, but Detox is that plus like 10000% on top... even though people say they thought those beats on blue carpet treatment weren't some of Dre's best, people often still say they're the best beats on the album!
well i hope you're wrong too, cause i'm expecting gold from Detox, so i hope Detox to be silver; nothing less, so that the disappointment is not too big.
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i wonder why your expectations have changed though; i thought that reading info, like the stuff from my Detox topic, would lead to higher expectations :laugh:
by the way, so you're basically expecting the best out of the current Dre production style/structure to be kept for Detox?
wouldn't you agree that it sounds disappointing, considering what's been told and how long the album has been worked on so far?
Dre didn't experiment much in the last few years :P
My expectations changed kind of based off of 'Grow Up'... they didn't really change, that track just more confirmed to me what I already suspected - that Dre will go with what sounds good over some crazy new thing that is different for the sake of being different. I was open to it being crazily different (and I was kind of hoping it would be), but after hearing 'Grow Up', that kind of did it for me... now all I am expecting are dope beats in the same style or only slightly different - I hope I'm wrong, but I won't be disappointed if it's what I think it will be
on a second thought, you may be right.
Dre could get away with it, due to his mixing skills :laugh:
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It'll be a hybrid of melodies (various styles of r&b/soul funk/crunk/westcoast/jazz music), concepts that won't get played out after a few listens, live instruments, and soundbreaking mixing that'll cause an industry shakedown. detox will be groundbreaking for hip hop MUSIC and engineering, and will go un-noticed in 3 months (you'll see with Tha Carter 3 and DigiSnax).
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It'll be a hybrid of melodies (various styles of r&b/soul funk/crunk/westcoast/jazz music), concepts that won't get played out after a few listens, live instruments, and soundbreaking mixing that'll cause an industry shakedown. detox will be groundbreaking for hip hop MUSIC and engineering, and will go un-noticed in 3 months (you'll see with Tha Carter 3 and DigiSnax).
what makes you so sure of that?
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I can't wait to take my unborn child to the store and buy it when this comes out.
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I feel what Bishop i s saying about Dre...we (or at least I) do want to know what transpired with the Death Row situation, Eazy-E, 2Pac and all that...cuz we've never heard Dre speak on those situations...we've heard Suge's side, we heard what Pac was callin' Dre before his death, and we know Dre was there with Eazy at the hospital...but aside from "The Watcher", we haven't heard Dre's thoughts & feelings about everything becuz he holds that personal to him...
Going along the lines of "Grow Up", "Imagine" and other songs on that reflective tip, I think Detox would be a good airing-out session for Dre, where he can still do his gangsta shit, but be more reflective and grown up about the shit....that would change the game IMHO...cuz rap music needs to grow up and be taken ffrom these kiddie-boppers like Souljah Boy...
well Bruce revealed a couple of things in the rollin wit' dre book, but yeah Dre didn't speak on those issues by himself so i see your point ;)
I feel what Bishop i s saying about Dre...we (or at least I) do want to know what transpired with the Death Row situation, Eazy-E, 2Pac and all that...cuz we've never heard Dre speak on those situations...we've heard Suge's side, we heard what Pac was callin' Dre before his death, and we know Dre was there with Eazy at the hospital...but aside from "The Watcher", we haven't heard Dre's thoughts & feelings about everything becuz he holds that personal to him...
Going along the lines of "Grow Up", "Imagine" and other songs on that reflective tip,
I think Detox would be a good airing-out session for Dre, where he can still do his gangsta shit,
but be more reflective and grown up about the shit....that would change the game IMHO...
cuz rap music needs to grow up and be taken from these kiddie-boppers like Souljah Boy...
I feel Chronic 2001 sort of covered most of that.
The Watcher spoke on the Suge/Death Row thing,Still DRE and Forgot About Dre spoke on his rise,fall and redemption.
He touched on Eazy (barely) on What's the Difference and his brothers death on the message.
Not sure if I want to hear this again,he should write a book or do a movie about his life instead.
when taking into account that Dre faces difficulties with speaking on such personal things
and the fact that it's hard to fit in these stories with the previous plans, i'd say scrap it.
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I hope I'm still alive when Detox drops.
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I feel what Bishop i s saying about Dre...we (or at least I) do want to know what transpired with the Death Row situation, Eazy-E, 2Pac and all that...cuz we've never heard Dre speak on those situations...we've heard Suge's side, we heard what Pac was callin' Dre before his death, and we know Dre was there with Eazy at the hospital...but aside from "The Watcher", we haven't heard Dre's thoughts & feelings about everything becuz he holds that personal to him...
Going along the lines of "Grow Up", "Imagine" and other songs on that reflective tip,
I think Detox would be a good airing-out session for Dre, where he can still do his gangsta shit,
but be more reflective and grown up about the shit....that would change the game IMHO...
cuz rap music needs to grow up and be taken from these kiddie-boppers like Souljah Boy...
I feel Chronic 2001 sort of covered most of that.
The Watcher spoke on the Suge/Death Row thing,Still DRE and Forgot About Dre spoke on his rise,fall and redemption.
He touched on Eazy (barely) on What's the Difference and his brothers death on the message.
Not sure if I want to hear this again,he should write a book or do a movie about his life instead.
what was wrong with the whole alter ego plan :P
scrap the autobiography shit, it's too predictable
i doubt Dre would take the route that Erotic seems to head for with the Black Bruce Willis;
but he can always go for a different story and write from that perspective.
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JUST HOPE IT KNOCKS.. CANT WAIT TO GET MY HEADPHONES....WOULD BE NICE TO HEAR DETOX THRU EM...
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lmao this Chad Vader and Dre-Day (the same person) dude is a fuckin nerd
all he does is spam the whole shit with quotes, and the million dre books he bought and the million "the serious detox thread" wearing a fuckin Star Wars
gear.
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I feel what Bishop i s saying about Dre...we (or at least I) do want to know what transpired with the Death Row situation, Eazy-E, 2Pac and all that...cuz we've never heard Dre speak on those situations...we've heard Suge's side, we heard what Pac was callin' Dre before his death, and we know Dre was there with Eazy at the hospital...but aside from "The Watcher", we haven't heard Dre's thoughts & feelings about everything becuz he holds that personal to him...
Going along the lines of "Grow Up", "Imagine" and other songs on that reflective tip,
I think Detox would be a good airing-out session for Dre, where he can still do his gangsta shit,
but be more reflective and grown up about the shit....that would change the game IMHO...
cuz rap music needs to grow up and be taken from these kiddie-boppers like Souljah Boy...
I feel Chronic 2001 sort of covered most of that.
The Watcher spoke on the Suge/Death Row thing,Still DRE and Forgot About Dre spoke on his rise,fall and redemption.
He touched on Eazy (barely) on What's the Difference and his brothers death on the message.
Not sure if I want to hear this again,he should write a book or do a movie about his life instead.
what was wrong with the whole alter ego plan :P
scrap the autobiography shit, it's too predictable
i doubt Dre would take the route that Erotic seems to head for with the Black Bruce Willis;
but he can always go for a different story and write from that perspective.
Did I say that? I would love love if Dre took the alter ego route ;) ;)
no, it was just a question in general ;)
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Theres loads of stuff Dre has yet to talk about. Most notably the VIBE award incident and The Game & 50 situation. I don't want to hear too much hos, cars and guns shit cause The Chronic did that. I'd expect Dre to be on some grown man type shit although i guess hes gotta appeal to the youngins.
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lmao this Chad Vader and Dre-Day (the same person) dude is a fuckin nerd
all he does is spam the whole shit with quotes, and the million dre books he bought and the million
"the serious detox thread" wearing a fuckin Star Wars gear.
Has I ever talked to you or bothered you? NO
So stop assuming shit and do your thing with The Game. ;)
Its DID i ever talk to you or DID/HAVE i ever bother/bothered you. Read a little more books, and a little less Dre while wearing Star Wars gears and you'll be alright ;)
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lmao this Chad Vader and Dre-Day (the same person) dude is a fuckin nerd
all he does is spam the whole shit with quotes, and the million dre books he bought and the million
"the serious detox thread" wearing a fuckin Star Wars gear.
Has I ever talked to you or bothered you? NO
So stop assuming shit and do your thing with The Game. ;)
Its DID i ever talk to you or DID/HAVE i ever bother/bothered you.
Read a little more books, and a little less Dre while wearing Star Wars gears and you'll be alright ;)
Whatever... ;)
Iīm buzy reading,so I will talk to you in a another life ;)
(http://38.114.207.25/c1706985dfce8e53b391786eb684c71f4g.jpg)
yeah exactly what i was sayin, you're the ultimate geek ;)
it's a shame cuz i bet you're like in your 30s and shit lmao.
omg, what are you gonna do now, secretly give me bad karma like you always do to people on this site :o ::)
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lmao this Chad Vader and Dre-Day (the same person) dude is a fuckin nerd
all he does is spam the whole shit with quotes, and the million dre books he bought and the million "the serious detox thread" wearing a fuckin Star Wars
gear.
yep, i have a few more accounts: UCC and Mackin4life for example :nahnah2:
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what i really hope is that it'll never see the light of day ^^
seriously i dont understand that hype about this album.
i dont want to hate on this project but from what i heard
this will suck anyways ...
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what i really hope is that it'll never see the light of day ^^
seriously i dont understand that hype about this album.
i dont want to hate on this project but from what i heard
this will suck anyways ...
so you don't know much about the album, but you are convinced of what you heard ;)
that's funny cause there isn't much known about the final product :laugh:
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lmao this Chad Vader and Dre-Day (the same person) dude is a fuckin nerd
all he does is spam the whole shit with quotes, and the million dre books he bought and the million "the serious detox thread" wearing a fuckin Star Wars
gear.
Not the same person, and both know more about hip hop then about 90% of this board.
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lmao this Chad Vader and Dre-Day (the same person) dude is a fuckin nerd
all he does is spam the whole shit with quotes, and the million dre books he bought and the million "the serious detox thread" wearing a fuckin Star Wars
gear.
Not the same person, and both know more about hip hop then about 90% of this board.
^Real spit.
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lmao this Chad Vader and Dre-Day (the same person) dude is a fuckin nerd
all he does is spam the whole shit with quotes, and the million dre books he bought and the million "the serious detox thread" wearing a fuckin Star Wars
gear.
Not the same person, and both know more about hip hop then about 90% of this board.
^Real spit.
I never understood why people question they knowledge on hip hop.
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when I first joined I thought Chad and Dre-Day were the same person too
they both are Dre fans but they are two differnt people
both 2 of the coolest posters on the board and learned alot of things from reading their posts 8)
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thanks for all the feedback ;)
but none of you are really surprised right?
shit happens all the time, when you're not the average joe ;)
and i don't mean that in an arrogant way.
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thanks for all the feedback ;)
but none of you are really surprised right?
shit happens all the time, when you're not the average joe ;)
and i don't mean that in an arrogant way.
Very true
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yeah i wasn't sure if i were going to put it in my detox topic.
i don't really trust bishop
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If only Bishop wasn't talking so much shit. Just like I said, he is like Ca$his with Eminems album.
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yeah i wasn't sure if i were going to put it in my detox topic.
I don't really trust Bishop
They go back and forth everyday over at Aftermath,they're playing with us.
So there's no reason to get hyped already.. :-\ :-\ :-[
If only Bishop wasn't talking so much shit. Just like I said, he is like Ca$his with Eminems album.
yeah, it's such a good way to promote an album like Detox :P
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remember that Dre started studying musical theory a couple of years ago?
i assume he completed that by now?
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At this point....I really don't know what's gonna happen. Most people who are 21+ are somewhat anticipating it, but that's really just the dudes from what I see...most females, especially those who aren't West Coast fans or fans of his old work, don't care about it right now. The younger crowd who's in their teens really doesn't know much about it, since they were only like 5-8 when 2001 dropped.
He might have to put out a bullshit single just to get everybody's attention. I still feel he's gonna drop a test single...if the buzz is good, it'll be the main single and he'll do a video...if not, he'll act like it was a leftover that won't even be on the album.
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At this point....I really don't know what's gonna happen. Most people who are 21+ are somewhat anticipating it, but that's really just the dudes from what I see...most females, especially those who aren't West Coast fans or fans of his old work, don't care about it right now. The younger crowd who's in their teens really doesn't know much about it, since they were only like 5-8 when 2001 dropped.
He might have to put out a bullshit single just to get everybody's attention. I still feel he's gonna drop a test single...if the buzz is good, it'll be the main single and he'll do a video...if not, he'll act like it was a leftover that won't even be on the album.
i doubt it would win certain people over, but a single could spark several conversations, which is exactly what this board needs ( as long as it's constructive).
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I hate to say this (especially as a fan) but expect a big dissapointmant. Jimmy Iovine has his hand in this album more than before (same with Em)... and it's not looking good. Also, expect Em to come out before 50... plus, Dre still doesn't know which direction to go... so right now he's going the corperate route :(
The shit that Bruce Williams, author of "Rollin' With Dre: The Unauthorized Account" said about DETOX was true, btw.
i know aftermathmusic got connections, but where is this coming from?