West Coast Connection Forum
Lifestyle => Train of Thought => Topic started by: morbidenigma on April 01, 2008, 08:25:55 AM
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Do u believe whatever happens throughout ur life, its already bin written and planned out, and whatever happens, its meant to happen?
Or do u think life is full of random choices?do you think its down to random coincidences ?
do you elieve that what happens in our lifes is all down to our own choice and we control our lives and what we make of them is up to us?
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I feel that everything in life sometimes happens for a reason but we still maintain some control of our destiny...
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kinda like the show LOST, that show is so fucking amazing
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u know whats really cool? is that shows theme song " i still believe" if u dont know, and ur interested look it up on youtube.
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i don't know what you're talking about
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I believe in fate in the sense that there are more factors out of your control than factors that you can con control that have the potential to act on your existence. But on the other hand, the factors that you can control can be the determining factors of whether or not you are a success. I do not believe in fate in the sense that everything is preplanned and there is no course of action to change your possibilities.
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Do u believe whatever happens throughout ur life, its already bin written and planned out, and whatever happens, its meant to happen?
Or do u think life is full of random choices?do you think its down to random coincidences ?
do you elieve that what happens in our lifes is all down to our own choice and we control our lives and what we make of them is up to us?
NOOO to all your questions. I'm going to be very brief, because I'm not in the mood to post.
Question 1: NOOOO.. not even a little bit. How absurd would that be? No "higher entity" would give a damn about what the fuck happens in my life. Or your life, for that matter. Why the FUCK would all the BULLSHIT that happens in the world be meant to happen, anyways? People who think like that make me angry. Written my ass.
Question 2 and 3: Those come way closer to reality, but are all waaaay over-simplyfied. Technically, nothing is really random. That does not mean that everything is "meant to happen" or some bullshit-phrase similiar to that. LOL@black and white way of thinking.
Question 4: Not at all. Most importantly, there's this little thingy called genetics. Not our choice what genes we are born with, and trust me, they have waaaaaaay more influence on EVERYTHING in our lives than all those "you can do it!!!"-types of people would ever be willing to admit.
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Yes, I believe in fate. The fate of the pale faces is to burn in hell for being Yakub Crew scum. It is Allah's will, destined to come.
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I feel that everything in life sometimes happens for a reason but we still maintain some control of our destiny...
that makes no sense :P
bugger that, you control your fate to the fullest, your life can go in every direction, lifes all about opportunity, its what you do with it that counts.
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I agree with 7even... The black and white reasoning here is ridiculous.
Down to a certain point, you can say that everything that happens is only a reaction to the other things that are happening, which happen as a logical reaction to other things, etc. You can compare this to rack breaking in a game of eight-ball: all the balls interact, and a highly complicated formula probably could predict exactly where each of the balls would end. It's all logical and predictable, albeit extremely complicated. To a certain degree, you could say the very same is constantly going on on a way larger scale, determining all the courses of existance. That's the world we as humans live in.
And yes, the environment obviously does influence who you are as a person. Great inventions become possible only after someone else made some other inventions first. It's a social environment you're born in, that determines your culture, your language and all the things you get in touch with. That's where you learn. That's what determines what happens to your genes, and how they evolve into a person.
One aspect of all of this should not be overlooked. Amidst all the influences, at the end of the day, you're still a human being. Human beings have a thinking faculty. They reason. No matter how comforting the thought of not being responsible for the things that happen in your life might be, the fact is that you're a thinking human being, and your thinking does influence the things you do. The things you do, influence what happens. Your life isn't totally beyond your control. Don't act like it is - don't back out of responsibility, because your life will become a mysterious misery if you practice what such beliefs preach.
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Down to a certain point, you can say that everything that happens is only a reaction to the other things that are happening, which happen as a logical reaction to other things, etc. You can compare this to rack breaking in a game of eight-ball: all the balls interact, and a highly complicated formula probably could predict exactly where each of the balls would end. It's all logical and predictable, albeit extremely complicated. To a certain degree, you could say the very same is constantly going on on a way larger scale, determining all the courses of existance. That's the world we as humans live in.
Yes. But to say that things "are written" and "meant to be" is basically like raping that theory. You know what I mean.
And yes, the environment obviously does influence who you are as a person. Great inventions become possible only after someone else made some other inventions first. It's a social environment you're born in, that determines your culture, your language and all the things you get in touch with. That's where you learn. That's what determines what happens to your genes, and how they evolve into a person.
Of course. Still, I think our genes have significantly more influence on us than our environment does.
One aspect of all of this should not be overlooked. Amidst all the influences, at the end of the day, you're still a human being. Human beings have a thinking faculty. They reason. No matter how comforting the thought of not being responsible for the things that happen in your life might be, the fact is that you're a thinking human being, and your thinking does influence the things you do. The things you do, influence what happens. Your life isn't totally beyond your control. Don't act like it is - don't back out of responsibility, because your life will become a mysterious misery if you practice what such beliefs preach.
To be honest, I think that point is stronly connected to the one before. Genes and environment. We, as human beings, DO reason.. but come the fuck on. If you were some random nigga born in Panama, you would not be doing whatever the heck you are doing right now. Especially not if you were also dumb as fuck, 5'0'', female and 230lbs on top of that. Genes DO mean a FUCKING lot.
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Yes, I believe in fate. The fate of the pale faces is to burn in hell for being Yakub Crew scum. It is Allah's will, destined to come.
the term "pale faces" is so poignant. I love it.
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i dunno no man, i have mixed feelings.
http://www.youtube.com/v/zJM4EBuL82o&hl=en
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Down to a certain point, you can say that everything that happens is only a reaction to the other things that are happening, which happen as a logical reaction to other things, etc. You can compare this to rack breaking in a game of eight-ball: all the balls interact, and a highly complicated formula probably could predict exactly where each of the balls would end. It's all logical and predictable, albeit extremely complicated. To a certain degree, you could say the very same is constantly going on on a way larger scale, determining all the courses of existance. That's the world we as humans live in.
Yes. But to say that things "are written" and "meant to be" is basically like raping that theory. You know what I mean.
Well, that depends on whether you mean "written" and "meant to be" in a metaphorical or in a divine context. I strongly disagree with the latter, but you could make a case for the first. That's basically just because all things come from somewhere, and their status is a reaction to everything else. Butterfly effect theories and such.
And yes, the environment obviously does influence who you are as a person. Great inventions become possible only after someone else made some other inventions first. It's a social environment you're born in, that determines your culture, your language and all the things you get in touch with. That's where you learn. That's what determines what happens to your genes, and how they evolve into a person.
Of course. Still, I think our genes have significantly more influence on us than our environment does.
One aspect of all of this should not be overlooked. Amidst all the influences, at the end of the day, you're still a human being. Human beings have a thinking faculty. They reason. No matter how comforting the thought of not being responsible for the things that happen in your life might be, the fact is that you're a thinking human being, and your thinking does influence the things you do. The things you do, influence what happens. Your life isn't totally beyond your control. Don't act like it is - don't back out of responsibility, because your life will become a mysterious misery if you practice what such beliefs preach.
To be honest, I think that point is stronly connected to the one before. Genes and environment. We, as human beings, DO reason.. but come the fuck on. If you were some random nigga born in Panama, you would not be doing whatever the heck you are doing right now. Especially not if you were also dumb as fuck, 5'0'', female and 230lbs on top of that. Genes DO mean a FUCKING lot.
There's potential geniusses born in Africa every day, but we don't hear from them. They don't get a chance to develop. That's their environment fucking with them.
Why, being dumb as fuck is merely a state of not properly having learned to cope with the world. Being clueless. Someone who's really born with a great capacity for intelligence, will find his own way through a lot of every day things. Just don't expect young kids to know deeper mathematics when they've never been in touch with a math book. Don't expect them to grasp philosophy, when theoretical philosophy is kept far away from them in every day life. They may grasp some very intelligent things by themselves, but you definately do need a fertile environment to get anywhere. That's how the cognitive faculty works. The greatest machine wouldn't work without power. The greatest brain doesn't function without stimuli.
Being 230lbs is another thing that may seem very much genetic, but honestly, don't you think food patterns and physical exercise are rather much culturally determined?
At the end of the day, it's a mixture of influences that determines who we are and what we do. The most fanatical religion might tell you to turn off your reasoning capacity and hand it over to some god, but that can't fully stop the fact that you're a reasoning human being with senses and a cognitive faculty. Such influences can strongly corrupt the way you perceive every day life, but it cannot stop you from perceiving. People who live in environments without the right stimuli, still won't really get far by just relying on their genes. At the same time, there's lots of idiots born in prosperous countries with plenty libraries. That's either their genes keeping them down, or their environment stopping them from making that small step towards gathering that knowledge.
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I don't think there's a real difference between the brain and other parts of the body, except that the brain is a lot more complex. Just as there are people with the physical potential to become NBA stars and people who could never even come close to do that even if they dedicate their lives to it, there are people with more brain capacity and people with less; and that is all based on genetics. The environment can be helpful or hurtful in regards of developping the potential, but the potential as such is purely based on genetics. I hate people who think that everybody could be a genius if only raised right. That's like saying everybody could play tennis like Federer if raised that way. What a load of crap.
Like when your ass is saying: Being 230lbs is another thing that may seem very much genetic, but honestly, don't you think food patterns and physical exercise are rather much culturally determined?
It doesn't just seem genetic, it is. Of course, with a different personality and environment, some people tend to be more or less likely to be that way. No question about that. Still, there are people who could eat exactly what I eat and turn out completely different after a few months or even weeks. Most people tend to underrate genetics, because it hurts them that they are not in full control, they feel like robots. They rather believe that everything is up to them and they can be anything they want to be and whatever else retarded stuff they want to think.
Which brings me to my next point. Even things like traits, whims or even the entire personality of someone is mostly based on genetics. One would then argue that certain experiences and such can shape a person. Which of course is true... but the way you react towards stuff that happens to you... even towards parental treatment and such... again has its roots in the genes you are born with.
Bottom line: Just because a lot of stuff affects your character, your potential, your life etc, the very basis of who you are still lies in your genes. A potential NBA player who doesn't get proper nutrition and training because he lives in a fucked up environment has of course a very different life compared to LeBron James... I'm aware of that, so don't get it twisted. I'm not under-estimating environment at all.
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I believe in ying & yang...if you doing/living in a way in tune wit either current, you meet things along the way that are also traveling along that current, thats why we gets deju vu, dats why shit seems to click sometimes, dats why sometimes shit seems to be fate...
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I believe we agree, 7even. Like when:
I hate people who think that everybody could be a genius if only raised right. That's like saying everybody could play tennis like Federer if raised that way. What a load of crap.
Like when your ass is saying: Being 230lbs is another thing that may seem very much genetic, but honestly, don't you think food patterns and physical exercise are rather much culturally determined?
It doesn't just seem genetic, it is. Of course, with a different personality and environment, some people tend to be more or less likely to be that way. No question about that. Still, there are people who could eat exactly what I eat and turn out completely different after a few months or even weeks.
I didn't mean that it's all about physical exercise and food patterns. Your physical basis is what everything about you is based off. That's your genes, ever since your fertilisation putting together a body and a brain. All else is simply a matter of what happens to those physical aspects.
What I did mean to say with that example, is that it's next to impossible for a human being to weigh 230lbs without being responsible for it. Someone who runs for three hours each day, simply CANNOT weigh 230lbs. Someone with a totally healthy food pattern, simply CANNOT weigh 230lbs. Unless the 230lbs is all muscles, that is; else it would mean some serious overweight. And what is overweight, but a flood of nutrients (often in the form of carbohydrates) entering your body without being burnt? The answer is simple: lessen the input, and your body won't have so much to store. No matter how much your genes promote overweight, at the end of the day, your body doesn't generate energy out of the blue, nor does it function without burning energy. You surely can control what you eat and the amount of energy you use, can't you? Anyone can. There's genetic differences between people when it comes to how fast their bodies store fat, but the functioning is the same.
People often say practice will take them anywhere, but my usual response is that no matter how much I'd practice, I'll never break the marathon world record. But that doesn't mean I couldn't be a much better athlete than I am now. It's a matter of exercise.
You're right about the potential for intelligence, but that's hardly what we as humans consider 'true intelligence'. Hence why in psychology, they (see Philip E. Vernon) determine three different aspects of intelligence: on one side the genetical basis, on another your 'true' intellectual skills as influenced by genetics, culture and social environment, and the third aspect is measurable behavior as influenced by motivation, intellectual skills, personal situation and personality. All of which, with the exception of personal situation, are indirectly the results both genetics and environmental influences.
The conclusion is that you're neither in total control, nor totally helpless. You can do a whole lot about yourself, by simply being reasonable with reality. You can know the boundaries of what's possible, and reach for it.
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I believe we agree
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8)
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yeah but it isn't exact and it's never set in stone.
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yeah but it isn't exact and it's never set in stone.
If it's not exact, then what is it?
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yeah but it isn't exact and it's never set in stone.
If it's not exact, then what is it?
it's just a set of circumstances that tips the scale towards an outcome, not an exact set of events and happenings
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Nope, fate is just an excuse. No such thing.
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7even, you gonna change that sig since its about as wrong as it could be?
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7even, you gonna change that sig since its about as wrong as it could be?
Lmao, I wanted to do a new one for days, but I never found a proper picture. Have you played a pick-up game with your injured superstar yet?
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Well it's funny. Cuz if you believe in psychics, they tell you your future. Well how do they know your future? Your life's gotta be pre-planned word?
There's somethang to think about your 'life being predetermined' question.
But, come on.
Your life is a done deal. Everythang happens for a reason, point blank. Point blank. If it ain't meant to be did, it ain't gon be did. I don't understand how people don't believe that?
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Are you a plant?
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Well it's funny. Cuz if you believe in psychics, they tell you your future. Well how do they know your future? Your life's gotta be pre-planned word?
There's somethang to think about your 'life being predetermined' question.
But, come on.
Your life is a done deal. Everythang happens for a reason, point blank. Point blank. If it ain't meant to be did, it ain't gon be did. I don't understand how people don't believe that?
thats just the attitude people adopt to make themselves feel better for themselves.
if something is meant to happen, you need to make it happen yourself. if you fail the first time try again... otherwise you're just not cut out for hwat you're doing, i guess that can be fate because there are some peeps out there better at doing shit than others.
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^ Aight, I hear you Aaliyah. 8)
Are you a plant?
LMFAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! What?
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Are you a plant?
LMFAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! What?
Why, well:
Your life is a done deal. Everythang happens for a reason, point blank. Point blank. If it ain't meant to be did, it ain't gon be did. I don't understand how people don't believe that?
"All energy flows according to the whims of the Great Magnet" - Hunter S. Thompson.
That much is true. But if what you said there is true, then why does everything happen for a reason, and what do you consider a reason? Does that mean that everything has a purpose, or just that everything is part of a game of cause and effect?
Example: If I point a well aimed and loaded gun at you and I pull the trigger, you die. But did you die because I pulled the trigger? Definately (but also because the gun was loaded, and operating, and nothing else got in the way, and I aimed well, etc.). But did I pull that trigger for a reason? I must have, because fingers don't flex at random; neither do guns have a will of their own. But do I have a reason for having a reason? Perhaps - because unless my shooting you was an accident, I wouldn't have done it if I were a strong advocate against violence regardless of its cause (such as a buddhist, just to name something you could think of).
The question is, was I destined to pull that trigger, much like a plant grows towards the sun, or was it a conscious decision I made? Was it something I personally had an influence on, not through my fate, but by my conscious (or even unconscious or subconscious) actions?
Plants do things just because they so happen to be. They grow towards the sun, if thats what their genetic material tells them. They suck up water if they can, whenever their reserves run low, because their genetic material tells them so. Why does their genetic material tell them so? It was a game of chance that made one plant's genetic material like that; it was those specific traits that made such plants more fit for survival through the "whims of the great magnet". There you have it: "the origin of species" (Darwin) in a nutshell.
There's nothing personal about a plant. A plant has no identity because it has no consciousness, no cognition. Still, plants do influence the world. They prevent the earth from eroding, and trees and bushes can change the course of rivers, and of the places animals live, and the decisions of humans as to where to build their homes, etc. But since plants, trees and bushes have no cognition and no consciousness, the way they are and where and how they are is a matter of where other circumstances happen to take them. They're powerless. If a fire comes, they burn. If a flood is on its way, they drown.
We as humans (as well as all animals, only to a lesser degree) are more complex than that. We've got a cognitive faculty, we've got a consciousness. When a fire comes, we either run because we know we can't stand the heat so we get out of the way of the fire, or we think of ways to extinguish the fire. Was that too meant to happen - the way we think, or the way humanity has developed through the inventions, beliefs and doctrines that have guided us the ages? Are you a puppet in the hands of God, or do you have authority over your life, your actions and the direction you're taking? I sure hope it's the latter, because you don't want to be a plant or a puppet, at the mercy of the whims of anything that could, might and will control your destiny?
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See your way of thinkin' is so complicated.
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See your way of thinkin' is so complicated.
Perhaps you're right, but it's a complicated issue. The conclusions are very clear though. You've got the capacity to think, thus to control your actions. That means you can do just about as much as your thinking capacity allows you to. The world doesn't control you.
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And you're right. But what chu choose, you choose for a reason. ;)
Yeah, you choose it, you make the decision on your own, but it was meant to happen. You control your actions but that action was fate. It was designed to happen. There's a meaning behind every little thang.
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Yeah, you choose it, you make the decision on your own, but it was meant to happen.
So, according to you, somebody or something does control your decisions, indirectly turning you into a higher level puppet?
You control your actions but that action was fate. It was designed to happen. There's a meaning behind every little thang.
I just wonder what you mean by "designed to happen" and "a meaning behind every little thing". What sort of meaning - is it all working towards a goal? Designed for what purpose?
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If I lock you in a cave and give you nothing to eat for 5 days, then give you the choice between a piece of shit and some dope turkey, you will eat the turkey, it will be your decision, but I sure as hell had enough influence on the decision to claim control over you. The world / the social environment / culture, etc definitely controls you to some degree.
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Yeah, you choose it, you make the decision on your own, but it was meant to happen.
So, according to you, somebody or something does control your decisions, indirectly turning you into a higher level puppet?
You control your actions but that action was fate. It was designed to happen. There's a meaning behind every little thang.
I just wonder what you mean by "designed to happen" and "a meaning behind every little thing". What sort of meaning - is it all working towards a goal? Designed for what purpose?
I wouldn't call him a puppet. But yeah to your questions. :-\