West Coast Connection Forum
Lifestyle => Train of Thought => Topic started by: infinite59 on April 10, 2002, 10:29:53 PM
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KEEP THIS DEBATE RESPECTABLE. IF YOU DISAGREE WITH THIS THEORY, COOL, WE CAN HAVE A GOOD DEBATE, AND WE'LL BOTH COME AWAY SMARTER.
Pat Roberson was on national T.V. He's a hugely popular Christian minister. He was saying that the bible prophesizes that the world community will be against Isreal in the last days. He believes that these are the last days ahead. Roberson is in direct support of Isreal, and in total disregard the Arab world.
Now. Why do Christians believe these are the last days? Religoin is in the mind, and in the spirit, the unseen world, and it may be that Pat Roberson's vision of the Christian world is in fact dying, and reaching it's last days. While the Muslim world is slowly gaining more support and acceptance, and in our "minds" and "spirits" we may begin to inherit the earth.
Let the debate begin.
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Nah, not true. By saying that, you're denying all the prophesies in the New Testament of the bible. Of course, you don't believe any of those, but the reason Christians believe the end of the world is near, is because the new testament tells them it is. Slowly, slowly, slowly, every prophesy is nearing fullfilization.
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Nah, not true. By saying that, you're denying all the prophesies in the New Testament of the bible. Of course, you don't believe any of those, but the reason Christians believe the end of the world is near, is because the new testament tells them it is. Slowly, slowly, slowly, every prophesy is nearing fullfilization.
Exactly, maybe the "Christian World" is really dying, that's what I'm saying, in a way, I'm agreeing with Pat Roberson and the new testament, but in a mental and spiritual way, rather than a physical.
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I don't really see the christian faith as dying anyyyyyytime soon. The catholic church is still WAY, WAY strong. I cannot deny that Islam is growing faster than any other religion in the world, but want to hear something interesting? Proportionally, guess which church has the fastest growing membership in the world? Latter day saints... there's only 11 million of us, but we've only been around 180 years, LOL. Membership is growing at a rate of about 2% a year, faster than any other religion, even Islam.
Peace~
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Oh, and you forgot the end of that prophesy, LOL.
Jesus returns to earth, and Is seen standing on a hill, speaking to someone, everyone there immediately realizes he is the son of god, etc, repents, all hell breaks loose, christians rule the earth, etc. etc.
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Oh, and you forgot the end of that prophesy, LOL.
Jesus returns to earth, and Is seen standing on a hill, speaking to someone, everyone there immediately realizes he is the son of god, etc, repents, all hell breaks loose, christians rule the earth, etc. etc.
Yes. They would "rule" the earth in the "last days" because they believe in their "minds" and "spirit" that they are right. I'm looking at this from a metaphyical perspective.
Also, that was interesting what you said about the growth of the Mormon church.
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I don't catch ya on the physical thing you're talking about... This is what we believe, maybe it's all illusion, but...
We will live, here, on earth, with perfect, immortal bodies, that never get sick, or die, with no hate, evil, or sin, and 1 Lord, Jesus, living in his temple. Forever. Maybe that's all illusion, and we'll just 'think' we're ruling, but that's fine with me....
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havent Christians been saying for a LONG time that tha end is near?
i got a question. Do u believe that when sumthing as strong as religion makes a prophecy that the "end is coming", followers will take action to fulfill that prophecy? Not necessarily on purpose. But, i think that when u truly believe sumthing is GOING to happen...u subconsciously take steps to making it happen. And that has nothing to do with religion, just human nature. So do u think when people believe sumthing like this so strongly...they are really basically writing their own end?? jus wonder inwhat u guyz think.
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i got a question. Do u believe that when sumthing as strong as religion makes a prophecy that the "end is coming", followers will take action to fulfill that prophecy? Not necessarily on purpose. But, i think that when u truly believe sumthing is GOING to happen...u subconsciously take steps to making it happen. And that has nothing to do with religion, just human nature. So do u think when people believe sumthing like this so strongly...they are really basically writing their own end?? jus wonder inwhat u guyz think.
Yes I agree that if one believed something would happen, subconsciously it could be made to happen i.e. a self fulfilling prophecy. But, when talking about the "end of the world" or rather the second coming, you have to understand that this is prophesised to happen in Israel, in Megiddo. As the orthodox Jewish religion doesn't accept that Jesus (in the sense of the representative of God on Earth) has come yet they certainly won't be expecting a second coming. So IMO it's unlikely that the Jewish people will indirectly cause the "end of the world". The Christians may well be nervous about the tension in the Middle East but again IMO I doubt they aren't in a position to directly influence anything of that nature. Maybe it will happen but like it says in Revelation, you won't be able to work out it's happened until it's too late anyway.
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Quick answer to Infinite's question:
Pat Roberson is an Evangelist prick.
As for growth, the Christian church is still growing in Africa and Asia. Maybe Islam and Mormonism are growing faster, but Christianity is not becoming smaller. It is Hinduism and the various minor African religions which are losing out.
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Cause it is.
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Basically I think that humans in general, especially Christains, are interested in the end of the world. Billy Graham used to preach in the 50-60's that the world would end, and people from all around would go to see him preach on the world ending. Protestains have researched Revolations and are trying to make sense of it. But this can also be seen as a difference between Catholics and Protestains. As a Catholic, I have yet to hear end of the world from a priest's mouth. Heard swearing, and what not, even priest jokes about little kids, but not the end of the world. But it's what the people want. After 9/11, Nostrodamus was the most looked up person in the internet, why? Because that's what people want. And most Protestain religion are not like Catholics in the sense that they don't have the Vatican looking over what they preach. They have the freedom to give the people what they want, so if people want to hear about the end of the world, especially since 9/11, then they can give that to them.
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well, for one thing. tha "world" isnt going anywhere. People might disappear...but tha "World", naw. Earth, Sun, Moons, Stars will all be here LONG after we're gone. It takes a pretty big ego to think that people could actually destroy tha earth lol. And for tha end of human life coming soon...well, tha term "soon" is pretty relative cus it aint gonna happen in OUR lifetime. And as it seemz, tha only single driving force that is strong enough (that ive seen) to make people completely destroy tha whole human race...is religion.
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^^^ That above is straight subjective bullshit. If God created the earth, surely when he decides to, he can destroy it?
Anyways, we don't believe he will destroy the Earth. He will purify it, and the pure will live upon it.
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^^^ That above is straight subjective bullshit. If God created the earth, surely when he decides to, he can destroy it?
Anyways, we don't believe he will destroy the Earth. He will purify it, and the pure will live upon it.
nice to see tha religion fanatics can keep it "respectible" as Infinite asked LOL. AND..tha key word in yur WHOLE response was tha first word of yur second sentence....."IF". I was responding to tha notion that tha world is coming to an end, which many people believe. If u DONT believe that, well then...what i was saying had NOTHING to do with u...obviously. And according to yur "purity" believe. Isnt God (in most religion) considered tha only "perfect" being? Well, then in tha end....i guess its only him/her that survives. we all die. So see u on tha otha side playa lol.
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Purity is different to perfection.
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And NONE of us our "pure"...
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Nah, not true. By saying that, you're denying all the prophesies in the New Testament of the bible. Of course, you don't believe any of those, but the reason Christians believe the end of the world is near, is because the new testament tells them it is. Slowly, slowly, slowly, every prophesy is nearing fullfilization.
Amen to that.
I read Revelations sometimes and it shocks me that it pretty much explains everything that is happeneing today and everything that will happen but yet people don't consider it.
Even Infinite pointed out the prophecy that the acceptance of Christianity is slowly declining and Islam and other religions are on the uprise. It just shows we are getting closer.
The whole freaking Israeli/Palestinian thing and the whole "war on Terrorism" is pretty much said in Revelation.
I mean just think about it a minute. How will this whole mess in Israel get fixed? No one is able to fix it and it is getting worse. The demands from both sides are near unrealistic to be met. That's where I think the anti-christ will come and bring temporary peace. (of course I can be wrong).
Now I'm not saying it is gonna happen tomorrow, next year, in 100 years, WHO KNOWS? It's for God to decide when he wants his Son to return. I can't wait for it to happen cause at least I won't be here to experience the Tribulation.
And all the doubters just remember, when the christians misteriously dissapear, that it was prophecied in Revelations many many years ago.
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pat robertson is full of crap, just about every real christian laughs at him
in the bible it clearly states that you will not know the date or year when christ comes back....it WON"T be precicly predicted
also about the making prophicies unconciously come true......that's a good argument , but why are most of the prophocies by the new testiment being fufilled by people who don't even beleive in it...something enlightening to think about
and about the 'rise of islam' did you know that some countries FORCE their people to worship islam, i've heard this from more than one place but when a general census of relgions are taken peope who really are christians or hindus or buddists are labled islam...something to marinate to. also did you know that just about every christian church in the world openly allows christianity to be questioned and scientifically studied , and alot of stuff in the bible has been scientifically proven to be tru by athiest scientist (like in the bible where it says the moon/sun turned to blood when jesus died on the cross....well just recently it was proven by athiest astrologers that on april 3 {the date christians have maintained that jesus died on} the same year and day the church has always maintained jesus died ....there was a solor/lunar eclipse that would've turned the sun to a nasty blood red. but most islamic countries disallow the questioning and scientific study of their religion and the penalty is jail/ death and that many things in the qua'ran (i don't know what but i've heard from many sources and books) can be scientifiacally dismissed??
not dissing anyone who follows islam but just somethng to think about. and if you can question my religion i can question yours, no beef at all ;)
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I read a little about what our chutch believes about the return of Jesus (the end of the world). Basically, they said all signs point to the years 2000-2050 as being very important, (and this is a statement from a 60 year old book). Nostradomus prophesized 1999, if I remember correctly. The temple of Solomon still needs to be rebuilt, that'll take forever.
One interesting thing to think about. The mayan calander. It has been used to prophesy many things (by the ancient mayans) which all came true. It's a perfect calendar... Our Gregorian calendar is seriously flawed, we actually lose time, it doesn't accurately measure time. That's why we have leap year, etc. There were also 6 years 'lost' because the monk who made the calendar up forgot about them.
Anyways, the Mayan calendar features Huge, Huge cycles of things similar to our years, or decades, or whatever, except they're based on the number 13. Guess what? They're largest cycle ends in 2012, and they prophesized that the world would return to nature at that time. December 23rd, 2012 - It's the end of their calendar, theirs is cyclical, instead of linear, like ours. I'd point to AROUND that date, lol.
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Nostradomus predicted like 3000 something. I resurched in high school. But this is after 1000 years of peace, so the end that everyone is thinking of is 2000 something. I think 2073, but I'm not sure.
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how come no one told me about the end coming?? ;D
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how come no one told me about the end coming?? ;D
Dad will tell you... LOL... of course you know it will come when no one else knows, as someone stated earlier. So predictions are just non sense. Go by the Bible, and be surprised.
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Dad will tell you... LOL...
hey what are you trying to say?? i depend to much on dad's word then my own sense or what?? ;D
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Yeah I've heard the date Dec. 23, 2012 being the end. Of course it's not gonna be that day, but either before or after because we are not suppose to know what day the Lord is coming.
All I know is I got nothing to worry about since I am saved so I will continue to live my life and when those things happen then they can happen.
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Not all Christians think the world is coming to an end soon. I sure don't. And even if it does, I know where I'll end up. I just feel sorry for those who don't believe.
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Not all Christians think the world is coming to an end soon. I sure don't. And even if it does, I know where I'll end up. I just feel sorry for those who don't believe.
dont worry, we feel sorry for u too....
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Why do you feel sorry for me?
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Why do you feel sorry for me?
if u can manage to think that because i dont believe what u believe...then i need to be felt "sorry for", then i feel just as sorry for u...for youre closed-mindedness. I dont mean tah diss really. But yur beliefs are yours, and mine are mine...and neither one of us should be pitied because of them.
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I had some other stuff written, but nevermind. I don't want to get into words with you. Peace.
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I had some other stuff written, but nevermind. I don't want to get into words with you. Peace.
itz coo man. i aint tryna argue wit u. but im sho u can see my side. im not tryna tell u yur beliefs are wrong...but im sure u wouldnt like me saying "i feel sorry for u" because of them. yah know?
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^^ I feel you dogg. I just want to see us all in heaven someday so we can keep on having crazy discussions. No offense meant by what I said.
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^^ Man, I still struggle with that. I try to be like Christ, but I fall way short... as such, I can think of a ton of people I wouldn't want to see in Heaven, because they do nothing but bring me down. I heard a country song that goes "Honey, all ya do is bring me down" by the Mavericks... that's how I feel about some people in my life, so I wish I could say I want to see them in heaven, but I can't... I'm not that perfect yet.
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^^ Can't tell if that was a compliment, or an insult. I'm far from perfect, and I'm far from being like Jesus. So if I came across arrogant, I guess I'm sorry.
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^^^^^^^^^^^^ No, no no. I'm christian, too, dogg. LOL. I try to be like Jesus in everyway, but just fall way short. I was just remarking, that you say you hope to see everyone in heaven some day... well, I'm not at that level yet. I can honestly say that there are people in my life I do not want to see in heaven, if I get there. I know, inside, that Jesus would hope everyone makes it, but I can't really say that myself, so that's just another area that I need to grow in.
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Okay man, I know you are christian, I read most of your posts, and agree with a ton of your points, so yeah, I know your religious stance. I just took the comment wrong. Sorry man. I got nothin but respect for you.
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It's all good like a chinese buffett.
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^^^^^^^^^^^^ No, no no. I'm christian, too, dogg. LOL. I try to be like Jesus in everyway, but just fall way short. I was just remarking, that you say you hope to see everyone in heaven some day... well, I'm not at that level yet. I can honestly say that there are people in my life I do not want to see in heaven, if I get there. I know, inside, that Jesus would hope everyone makes it, but I can't really say that myself, so that's just another area that I need to grow in.
well....i got a glass of water right now. So since u wanna be like Jesus, can u come turn thiz shit into wine fah me?! im tryna get mah fade on. LOL
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That's the most idiotic post you've ever made, congratulations. That's disgusting.
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That's the most idiotic post you've ever made, congratulations. That's disgusting.
LOL, i agree, that was kinda dumb ToNe, by sayin he wants to be like Jesus means he wants to do good, and love all etc...but sometimes, you cant always achive that, so he addmitted he couldnt be totatly like Jesus, but hes trying, n hes only human....
-{bLaDe}
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ill tell u who bout tah see tha "end" soon. Tha next muthafuckin Jahovas Witness who walks up tah me tryna give me sum damn pamplets lolol
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ill tell u who bout tah see tha "end" soon. Tha next muthafuckin Jahovas Witness who walks up tah me tryna give me sum damn pamplets lolol
I Dont Like Jahovas Witnesses, No Offence To Them But When They Knocking On My House It Pisses Me Off.
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i"ve read the first page of the debate...and i would like to say somethin bout why Islam"s growth is the highest....well...Islam is the easiest entred religion ever...if i ain"t mistaken...there is this one sentece that you"re supposed to say , after sayin" it u"re considered muslim.
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Yeah, that's part of it. Then there's the whole part about, you know, if you practice any other religion in certain countries, you're killed.