West Coast Connection Forum

DUBCC - Tha Connection => Outbound Connection => Topic started by: Knuckles on May 11, 2005, 05:19:45 PM

Title: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: Knuckles on May 11, 2005, 05:19:45 PM
Makaveli - The Don Kiluminati: The 7 Day Theory (1996)
(http://image.allmusic.com/00/amg/cov200/dre700/e771/e77183v60jy.jpg) (http://)
 
    This album strikes a nice balance between a hardcore 2Pac at his most thugged out with songs that betray his intelligence and also give tastes of why All Eyez On Me crossed over so successfully. For each song like "Toss it Up" featuring K-Ci and JoJo that sounds pop, hardcore anthems like "Me And My Girlfriend" bring things into balance. Although the sound of his lady firing off an automated weapon and grunting like Master P is quasi-comical, it makes sense when you consider that this clever song is a double-entendre comparing his weapons of choice to a female lover. As an ode to weaponry it rivals "I Gave You Power" by Nas and as an ode to thug girls it's the West coast sequel to Notorious B.I.G.'s infamous "Me And My Bitch".

    Now some argue that All Eyez On Me is his best but this album shows 2Pac his most aggressive and agruably the deepest album he ever made.  On the opener, "Bomb First", he spits raw lyrics dissin' on Bad Boy, Mobb Deep & Jay-Z.  Even Young Noble spits heat about how he only hangs wit real eastcoast niggas who are from New Jersey. Now the best thing about this album is that it's just like a movie, each track is an opening for the next track... "Hail Mary" is great track but yet errie at the same time with the bells, lyrics and Prince Ital Joe's vocals. 2Pac comes through with Val Young on "To Live and Die In L.A." over a nice laid-back beat laced by QD3. He mentions all the dope hot spots in L.A. and about life in L.A. as well as the Death Row Family members Snoop Doggy Dogg, Suge Knight, O.F.T.B. & Tha Dogg Pound.  "Blasphemy" is another great Hurt-M-Badd produced track but the intro of the track is freaky enough to the point to not make you wanna play it. Since there's a strange evil echo-sounding voice talking about Jesus Christ. Overall, the track is good as he discusses the negative things in his life and what he feels about death.   On "White Man'z World" he discusses the issue how blacks live in a world controlled, populated and influenced by whites. This is one of the most deepest tracks espcially since it features some words from Malcom X's speech.

    "Against All Odds", the last track where 2Pac comes lyrically ill and goes after all his enemies.  He goes off on Puffy, De La Soul, Mobb Deep, Nas & Jay-Z.  Overall, this album is excellent and my favourite of his.  Unlike All Eyez On Me, this album is more rough, rugged and raw.  He spits his most serious, deepest & painful thoughts all on this album.  Not every song on this album is a sure-fire hit, but on such a shortened and intensified dose of 2Pac's work the results are much more even than the overly long All Eyez On Me.  As tight as this album is, most of the allure of this album is that it's the last album he recorded and the mysterious nature surrounding this album, from the name change, the album cover and title, to the legions of fans calling this is some proof he's still with us.  Despite the speed at which this album was put together none of the songs here sound rushed, it's actually pretty fluid. This album's success and the further releases that it spawned solidified 2Pac's reputation as one of the all-time greats, but what this CD illustrates best and most sadly is what kind of work 2Pac could have continued to do were it not for his untimely death. 1996 robbed us of his physical presence, but his spirit lived on through the music and still haunts us to this very day.


50. Dr. Dre – 2001 (1999) (http://www.dubcnn.com/connect/index.php?topic=73625.0)
49. Outkast – Southernplayalisticaddicmuzik (1994) (http://www.dubcnn.com/connect/index.php?topic=73777.0)
48. Jay-Z – Reasonable Doubt (1996) (http://www.dubcnn.com/connect/index.php?topic=74040.0)
47. Kool G Rap & DJ Polo – Wanted: Dead Or Alive (1990) (http://www.dubcnn.com/connect/index.php?topic=74218.0)
46. Redman – Whut? Thee Album (1992) (http://www.dubcnn.com/connect/index.php?topic=74531.0)
45. De La Soul - De La Soul Is Dead (1991) (http://www.dubcnn.com/connect/index.php?topic=74834.0)
44. Fugees – The Score (1996) (http://www.dubcnn.com/connect/index.php?topic=75061.0)
43. The D.O.C. – No One Can Do It Better (1989) (http://www.dubcnn.com/connect/index.php?topic=75381.0)
42. Common Sense - Resurrection (1994) (http://www.dubcnn.com/connect/index.php?topic=75589.0)
41. Makaveli - The Don Kiluminati: The 7 Day Theory (1996)
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: Knuckles on May 11, 2005, 05:23:56 PM
Number 41-50 was the most difficult part to do.  I forgot about The D.O.C. and the Fugees when started this list and had to cut two albums to get them in there.  The ordering of these ten were kinda hard to.

The top 40 albums are solid, they definetely belong in the top 50.


And yousendit.com was fucking up on me.  The album ain't up.
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: Larrabee on May 11, 2005, 05:33:11 PM
Great job on the ongoing countdown, homie. So I'm assuming "All Eyez On Me" didn't make the final cut, right?
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: Knuckles on May 11, 2005, 06:07:26 PM
So I'm assuming "All Eyez On Me" didn't make the final cut, right?

Well, I can't say that.
I do like this album better than All Eyez On Me but that doesn't automatically make it a higher rank.  This isn't my personal top 50, if it was number #40 wouldn't be on it.
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: SGV on May 11, 2005, 06:10:15 PM
Let the crying begin.

*Grabs 100's of boxes of tissues for the Pac dickriders*
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: JTPlatnum on May 11, 2005, 07:04:05 PM
although i disagree with you on this being #41, i think it's more of a personal preference to me that this one is in my top 10. nice fuckin work with the review though...again...
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: Wicked977 on May 11, 2005, 07:28:15 PM
I read another a review just like dis  ???
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: eS El Duque on May 11, 2005, 08:17:43 PM
I read another a review just like dis  ???

he siad in the beginning that he wont be writing most of the review for each album. Well, $41 ain't a big shock, i thought it was gonna be a snoop dogg album
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: Wicked977 on May 11, 2005, 09:25:05 PM
I read another a review just like dis  ???

he siad in the beginning that he wont be writing most of the review for each album. Well, $41 ain't a big shock, i thought it was gonna be a snoop dogg album
Ohh My Bad
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: Elevz on May 12, 2005, 12:12:20 AM
Good looking & props on another dope review
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: Traumatized on May 12, 2005, 04:12:49 AM
Number 1 for me.
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: Kill on May 12, 2005, 04:30:45 AM
i´d rank it higher, but there is a lot of personal preference to that
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: makaveli11 on May 12, 2005, 06:59:28 AM
Makaveli number #41?  :yikes: :o ???. Whatever I guess it's all personal preference even though I would put that album in the top five of all time. I can't wait 'till I see your top ten and it better be a fuckin good top ten list. I must see the completion of this list so I can see the other 40 albums you put over 7 day theory.
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: Leggy Hendrix on May 12, 2005, 07:47:21 AM
Let the crying begin.

*Grabs 100's of boxes of tissues for the Pac dickriders*

lol

this may have been slightly higher imo, but to each his own...im betting that for most of the albums in the list, there are some positions that even now your not totally happy about yourself...

props
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: ToOoOoN!!! on May 12, 2005, 07:57:28 AM
prop for the review and the list,keep it comming!
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: Minkaveli on May 12, 2005, 09:35:39 AM
I hope there is a Roots album on here. 
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: Kill on May 12, 2005, 09:38:10 AM
I hope there is a Roots album on here. 

not very on topic, but true
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: Mac 10 † on May 12, 2005, 10:48:01 AM
i only coming into these threads for the hookups of the albums now

i know that the list of 50 is of personal preference but come on this album @ #41?  :-\

i cant take that seriously
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: 'EclipZe on May 12, 2005, 10:57:27 AM
nice read, props  :)
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: DonRafaele on May 12, 2005, 11:20:19 AM
Number 1 for me.


4 me too.....
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: Knuckles on May 12, 2005, 11:41:24 AM
i know that the list of 50 is of personal preference but come on this album @ #41?  :-\

i cant take that seriously

This isn't my personal top 50, if it was number #40 wouldn't be on it.
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: Machiavelli on May 12, 2005, 01:55:05 PM
This album should be in the top 10 and is  my favorite album of all time behind rythm-al-ism.

Is this your list or someone elses. I dont get it?
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: gchild213 on May 12, 2005, 01:58:38 PM
this album is one of my faves, props
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: white Boy on May 12, 2005, 02:01:23 PM
This album should be in the top 10 and is my favorite album of all time behind rythm-al-ism.

Is this your list or someone elses. I dont get it?
No its not his list, read the post above yours, btw i bet u no quik album makes it :)
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: Mac 10 † on May 12, 2005, 02:03:50 PM
how exactly is this list being decided then?
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: Knuckles on May 12, 2005, 02:11:38 PM
It's my list, I put it together.  It's just not a list of my personal favourites.
The Score isn't one of my favourite albums but I realize the impact it made and it's held in high regard.  Just cause an album isn't my cup of tea doesn't mean isn't a great album.  Influencial and impact are very important factors here.
Title: Re: The - #41...
Post by: Mac 10 † on May 12, 2005, 02:16:34 PM
so this is a list of what you think are the "Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever"?

but not neccessarily your favourite 50 Albums Ever?
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: Leggy Hendrix on May 12, 2005, 02:17:45 PM
^^ BING! finally
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: Machiavelli on May 13, 2005, 02:41:48 PM
It's my list, I put it together.  It's just not a list of my personal favourites.
The Score isn't one of my favourite albums but I realize the impact it made and it's held in high regard.  Just cause an album isn't my cup of tea doesn't mean isn't a great album.  Influencial and impact are very important factors here.

okay now I understand..

So its like All Eyez on Me is a better album then 7 day theory because of its impact and how influential it is even though it isnt really as good skill wise as 7 day theory or like 36 chambers is a better album then Cuban Linx because of its impact...

and white boy i know quik wont make the list. No quik album had really any impact. But you cant deny Rythm-al-ism is one of the best and most advanced records ever recorded overall.
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: Just Another Sunny day in California on May 13, 2005, 02:59:00 PM
It's my list, I put it together.  It's just not a list of my personal favourites.
The Score isn't one of my favourite albums but I realize the impact it made and it's held in high regard.  Just cause an album isn't my cup of tea doesn't mean isn't a great album.  Influencial and impact are very important factors here.

How is the Don Killuminati number 41???? You say it's based on impact and being influencial, if that's the case Don Killuminati should be top 10.  It's Pac's best album along with Me Against The World.
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: Mac 10 † on May 13, 2005, 03:03:16 PM
It's my list, I put it together.  It's just not a list of my personal favourites.
The Score isn't one of my favourite albums but I realize the impact it made and it's held in high regard.  Just cause an album isn't my cup of tea doesn't mean isn't a great album.  Influencial and impact are very important factors here.

How is the Don Killuminati number 41???? You say it's based on impact and being influencial, if that's the case Don Killuminati should be top 10. It's Pac's best album along with Me Against The World.


i was kinda thinking that

if this list is based on those reasons above then surely the 7 day theory must be higher than #41 ???
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: Machiavelli on May 13, 2005, 03:33:06 PM
It's my list, I put it together.  It's just not a list of my personal favourites.
The Score isn't one of my favourite albums but I realize the impact it made and it's held in high regard.  Just cause an album isn't my cup of tea doesn't mean isn't a great album.  Influencial and impact are very important factors here.

How is the Don Killuminati number 41???? You say it's based on impact and being influencial, if that's the case Don Killuminati should be top 10. It's Pac's best album along with Me Against The World.


if this list is based on those reasons above then surely the 7 day theory must be higher than #41 ???

Not necessarily, theres are lots of albums with greater impact and influence then 7 day theory. Even though its pacs best album AEOM and even MATW are greater in the sence of impact and infuence.
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: Kill on May 13, 2005, 03:45:20 PM
^^^ exactly, in terms of impact and influence Makaveli can NEVER make even top 25 (and it´s in my personal hiphop top 15 too)
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: Knuckles on May 13, 2005, 03:56:59 PM
This album isn't more influencial then his previous two and as excellent as this album is in my mind it's not enough to earn a higher spot.
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: makaveli11 on May 13, 2005, 08:11:31 PM
It's my list, I put it together.  It's just not a list of my personal favourites.
The Score isn't one of my favourite albums but I realize the impact it made and it's held in high regard.  Just cause an album isn't my cup of tea doesn't mean isn't a great album.  Influencial and impact are very important factors here.

okay now I understand..

So its like All Eyez on Me is a better album then 7 day theory because of its impact and how influential it is even though it isnt really as good skill wise as 7 day theory or like 36 chambers is a better album then Cuban Linx because of its impact...

and white boy i know quik wont make the list. No quik album had really any impact. But you cant deny Rythm-al-ism is one of the best and most advanced records ever recorded overall.
I get it now... kind of missed that quote... if influence and impact are very important factors then it definitely does change things around. The whole time I thought it was based on skill level. In that case like some one else said 7 day theory could never make top 25 at least.
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: M Dogg™ on May 14, 2005, 12:08:15 PM
Makaveli did influence Ja Rule's Blood In My Eye... lol... that alone knocks it down a few spots.

I think this album influence too many things that are wrong with how Hip-Hop beef is now, but some may think it's for better.

My top 5 personal list, no question though.

Now in terms of this list, when I see Chronic 2001 and Makaveli in the 40's, it makes me wonder what does it take to be in the top 25. I mean, it's like when the Source didn't give the OG Chronic 5 mics, people were like what you gotta do, and then Nas released Illmatic and it wasn't so much it was a classic, but the fact that it got 5 mics and the Chronic didn't made people buy it to listen. So now that I see Makaveli so low, and 2001 so low, I am basically looking to see what it takes to make the top 40, 25, 10, this list is interesting for sure.
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: HD on May 29, 2005, 04:50:09 AM
good job, this cd doesn't deserve top 10
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: Kill on May 29, 2005, 02:05:27 PM
btw Knuckles, I love the quote in your sig

















































 :sign_offtopic:
sorry
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: bigdogg2001 on May 30, 2005, 10:46:05 AM
makaveli is one of the best albums in any genre period
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: ImmortalOne on May 31, 2005, 07:54:58 PM
Good review, but #41??

Even though this is my fav album ever, it should still be in ANYONE'S top 10 even from an unbiased point of view. Pac is one of the greatest hip hop artists ever (and the official goat in many peoples opinion), and this is his best work. Based on that consideration alone, this HAS to be a top 10 if not top 5 album.

And true, AEOM had more impact then this album, but only in a direct sense in that it became a blueprint for commercial artists of today to use. Are we basing this list on impact/influence, or just straight up quality?? If its just on the music alone, Makaveli takes shits all over AEOM....musically and lyrically. If it is based on impact, I could see why someone might rate AEOM higher, but even so, I would still rate Makaveli as being Pac's best and one of the best albums period because:

it did actually have alot of impact, just a different kind of impact. This album was ahead of its time, and it blew peoples minds when it came out. AEOM didnt do that. People loved it, yes, but they werent calling it "the deepest album ever made" or the hip hop bible as Makavel is often called. Plus the fact he recorded it in just 3 days =  :o "Blasphemy" alone gotta make this one of the best albums ever. I remember the first time I heard that song, my jaw nearly fell to the ground.

From about 96'-2000, most people considered MATW or AEOM to be Pac's best (depending on who u asked), but for the last several years, ive met more and more people that consider 7 Day Theory to be his finest....and now that seems to be the consensus. Remember, this album was out of print for about 2 years, so some people may have forgotten about it, but when it was remastered in 2001 and brought back into circulation, I think it reminded people. Since that time on, most people I come across agree that it is indeed his watershed release.
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: ImmortalOne on May 31, 2005, 08:18:38 PM
Makaveli did influence Ja Rule's Blood In My Eye... lol... that alone knocks it down a few spots.

I think this album influence too many things that are wrong with how Hip-Hop beef is now, but some may think it's for better.



U cant really knock the album for that though, as Pac doesnt have control over people biting his shit.....

The disses on this album are crazy, because he truly didnt give a fuck. He took on a whole coast by himself and wasnt afraid to call all his enemies out. Its pretty much a reflection of the times.....
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: ImmortalOne on May 31, 2005, 08:20:12 PM
good job, this cd doesn't deserve top 10

You're right. It deserves top FIVE.  8)
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: Just Another Sunny day in California on May 31, 2005, 08:32:14 PM
Since it's based on impact i expect to see AEOM in the top 5.
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: Elevz on June 01, 2005, 02:45:25 AM
Since it's based on impact i expect to see AEOM in the top 5.

Read again... It's not ONLY based on impact. That would mean 50 Cent and Eminem would have to be somewhere up there too  :-X

I'm not even sure if we should expect All Eyez On Me in this top50 at all. Maybe, but not in the top 10.
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: Kill on June 01, 2005, 08:43:31 AM
"official GOAT in many people´s opinion" ::)
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: Thuglife on June 01, 2005, 11:00:26 AM
this album should be top 10
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: ImmortalOne on June 01, 2005, 12:20:29 PM
Since it's based on impact i expect to see AEOM in the top 5.

Read again... It's not ONLY based on impact. That would mean 50 Cent and Eminem would have to be somewhere up there too  :-X

I'm not even sure if we should expect All Eyez On Me in this top50 at all. Maybe, but not in the top 10.

Eminem and 50 Cent have had almost no impact or influence whatsoever on the rap game. They're just very popular. There is a difference.

AEOM was an album that set countless trends and formulas for other rappers to use (ironically, Eminem and 50 Cent are two of the primary examples of this). Pac's double cd changed the rap game forever, for better or worse.
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: Elevz on June 01, 2005, 01:53:15 PM
That's just what I was saying... All Eyez On Me stirred up the game as in making 2Pac the biggest rapper of all time. That's the same Get Rich Or Die Tryin' and The Slim Shady LP (and more The Marshall Mathers LP) did: they turned the rappers into world famous icons. Then again, All Eyez On Me definately has had more influence on the game ever since it's release than any of 50 or Eminem's cd's. But still... What I was trying to say...

They're popular records. They had their impact, even though Eminem and 50 haven't really been copied much. But are they classics? All Eyez On Me probably is a classic, in the sense of the type of tracks Pac had on that album, that's been copied a lot ever since. They were nice. There were some REAL nice tracks on AEOM. But is it really ground breaking? Mind blowing? A once in a lifetime experience?

Nah. I'm not trying to hate on 'Pac, but in my opinion AEOM didn't really have the CONTENT that most of the albums around the top 10 probably will have. A blueprint when it comes to making successful party tracks, but it's not mindblowing.


I'll just prepare to get hated on & see my karma drop by at least 10 just for making this post & thinking this way ;)
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: Machiavelli on June 01, 2005, 02:11:18 PM
If this list was just based on quality of the music The 7 Day Theory should be in the top 5.

I wonder how this list would be different if the list was just based on quality rather then impact and influence...
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: Knuckles on June 01, 2005, 04:19:30 PM
Even though this is my fav album ever, it should still be in ANYONE'S top 10 even from an unbiased point of view. Pac is one of the greatest hip hop artists ever (and the official goat in many peoples opinion), and this is his best work. Based on that consideration alone, this HAS to be a top 10 if not top 5 album.

And true, AEOM had more impact then this album, but only in a direct sense in that it became a blueprint for commercial artists of today to use. Are we basing this list on impact/influence, or just straight up quality?? If its just on the music alone, Makaveli takes shits all over AEOM....musically and lyrically. If it is based on impact, I could see why someone might rate AEOM higher, but even so, I would still rate Makaveli as being Pac's best and one of the best albums period because:

it did actually have alot of impact, just a different kind of impact. This album was ahead of its time, and it blew peoples minds when it came out. AEOM didnt do that. People loved it, yes, but they werent calling it "the deepest album ever made" or the hip hop bible as Makavel is often called. Plus the fact he recorded it in just 3 days =  :o "Blasphemy" alone gotta make this one of the best albums ever. I remember the first time I heard that song, my jaw nearly fell to the ground.

From about 96'-2000, most people considered MATW or AEOM to be Pac's best (depending on who u asked), but for the last several years, ive met more and more people that consider 7 Day Theory to be his finest....and now that seems to be the consensus. Remember, this album was out of print for about 2 years, so some people may have forgotten about it, but when it was remastered in 2001 and brought back into circulation, I think it reminded people. Since that time on, most people I come across agree that it is indeed his watershed release.

I don't know if you are friends with a bunch of people from the 2Pac fan club or something and they have a heavy influence on your thoughts because I'd have to say, most people don't hold this album in such high regard.
Most people don't think this album was "ahead of its time".
Most people don't call it "the deepest album ever made" or "the hip hop bible.  Infact I've never heard anyone say that.
Most people didn't care that it was rerelased and didn't remind people of anything.
Most people wouldn't have this in their top 5, 10 or 20 greatest albums ever.

It's an excellent album without a doubt but it's not in the same league of the real hip-hop classics you'll see in the top 10.
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: Knuckles on June 01, 2005, 04:23:22 PM
I don't have time to get number thirty-five up today or even tomorrow.  Hopefully I'll get it up on Friday.
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: ImmortalOne on June 01, 2005, 05:42:43 PM
That's just what I was saying... All Eyez On Me stirred up the game as in making 2Pac the biggest rapper of all time. That's the same Get Rich Or Die Tryin' and The Slim Shady LP (and more The Marshall Mathers LP) did: they turned the rappers into world famous icons. Then again, All Eyez On Me definately has had more influence on the game ever since it's release than any of 50 or Eminem's cd's. But still... What I was trying to say...

They're popular records. They had their impact, even though Eminem and 50 haven't really been copied much. But are they classics? All Eyez On Me probably is a classic, in the sense of the type of tracks Pac had on that album, that's been copied a lot ever since. They were nice. There were some REAL nice tracks on AEOM. But is it really ground breaking? Mind blowing? A once in a lifetime experience?

Nah. I'm not trying to hate on 'Pac, but in my opinion AEOM didn't really have the CONTENT that most of the albums around the top 10 probably will have. A blueprint when it comes to making successful party tracks, but it's not mindblowing.


I'll just prepare to get hated on & see my karma drop by at least 10 just for making this post & thinking this way ;)

Naw, you aint gonna get hated on, because you came at me correct.

Artistically speaking AEOM wasnt groundbreaking....Pac was rapping about things that had been rapped about before. What made it big though was that it was the first album of its kind: a deluxe street album designed to crossover to the mainstream but still retaining hip hop respect.

Content wise its very versatile but its not his deepest album.....MATW and Makaveli were both much deeper.
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: ImmortalOne on June 01, 2005, 05:48:40 PM
Even though this is my fav album ever, it should still be in ANYONE'S top 10 even from an unbiased point of view. Pac is one of the greatest hip hop artists ever (and the official goat in many peoples opinion), and this is his best work. Based on that consideration alone, this HAS to be a top 10 if not top 5 album.

And true, AEOM had more impact then this album, but only in a direct sense in that it became a blueprint for commercial artists of today to use. Are we basing this list on impact/influence, or just straight up quality?? If its just on the music alone, Makaveli takes shits all over AEOM....musically and lyrically. If it is based on impact, I could see why someone might rate AEOM higher, but even so, I would still rate Makaveli as being Pac's best and one of the best albums period because:

it did actually have alot of impact, just a different kind of impact. This album was ahead of its time, and it blew peoples minds when it came out. AEOM didnt do that. People loved it, yes, but they werent calling it "the deepest album ever made" or the hip hop bible as Makavel is often called. Plus the fact he recorded it in just 3 days =  :o "Blasphemy" alone gotta make this one of the best albums ever. I remember the first time I heard that song, my jaw nearly fell to the ground.

From about 96'-2000, most people considered MATW or AEOM to be Pac's best (depending on who u asked), but for the last several years, ive met more and more people that consider 7 Day Theory to be his finest....and now that seems to be the consensus. Remember, this album was out of print for about 2 years, so some people may have forgotten about it, but when it was remastered in 2001 and brought back into circulation, I think it reminded people. Since that time on, most people I come across agree that it is indeed his watershed release.

I don't know if you are friends with a bunch of people from the 2Pac fan club or something and they have a heavy influence on your thoughts because I'd have to say, most people don't hold this album in such high regard.
Most people don't think this album was "ahead of its time".
Most people don't call it "the deepest album ever made" or "the hip hop bible.  Infact I've never heard anyone say that.
Most people didn't care that it was rerelased and didn't remind people of anything.
Most people wouldn't have this in their top 5, 10 or 20 greatest albums ever.

It's an excellent album without a doubt but it's not in the same league of the real hip-hop classics you'll see in the top 10.

Apparantly alot of people agree with me, because the album went #1 and sold over 5 million......and its STILL selling by the bucketloads almost 9 years after its release. I have a gut feeling it is selling more today then the albums that will be in your top 10 are. Sales dont mean much, but that isnt the point im making anyway. The fact its selling so long after its release must mean ALOT of people consider it classic.

And you crazy as fuck if you think people didnt care when this album dropped.......This shit sold like 750,000 in its first week alone then like another 400K in its second week, which back then was almost unheard of. I remember alot of retailers reporting that the album was selling so fast they couldnt keep it in stock. I even remember going to the Tower Records down the street from where I live when it first came out, and seeing the line like 200 deep at midnight. I wasnt even able to get my copy until the second week it was out, thats how much it was selling.

You lying if you say most people dont have this album in their top 20.......almost everyone I meet has this album in their top 10, much less the top 20.

I dont know, you must live in a completley different area then I do......around these parts, Pac is a hip hop god.
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: Knuckles on June 01, 2005, 10:18:33 PM
Apparantly alot of people agree with me, because the album went #1 and sold over 5 million......and its STILL selling by the bucketloads almost 9 years after its release. I have a gut feeling it is selling more today then the albums that will be in your top 10 are. Sales dont mean much, but that isnt the point im making anyway. The fact its selling so long after its release must mean ALOT of people consider it classic.

And you crazy as fuck if you think people didnt care when this album dropped.......This shit sold like 750,000 in its first week alone then like another 400K in its second week, which back then was almost unheard of. I remember alot of retailers reporting that the album was selling so fast they couldnt keep it in stock. I even remember going to the Tower Records down the street from where I live when it first came out, and seeing the line like 200 deep at midnight. I wasnt even able to get my copy until the second week it was out, thats how much it was selling.

You lying if you say most people dont have this album in their top 20.......almost everyone I meet has this album in their top 10, much less the top 20.

I dont know, you must live in a completley different area then I do......around these parts, Pac is a hip hop god.

-first point means nothing
-I said rerelease
-you're wrong, maybe on this message board and to your friends and 2Pac groupies but this is not a top 20 album
-2Pac is a hip-hop god to some, I'm not debating that.  Rakim, KRS, Kane, Nas, Jay, Big, G Rap, 'Face & Cube are all hip-hop gods to some people too.
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: ImmortalOne on June 01, 2005, 10:23:54 PM
Apparantly alot of people agree with me, because the album went #1 and sold over 5 million......and its STILL selling by the bucketloads almost 9 years after its release. I have a gut feeling it is selling more today then the albums that will be in your top 10 are. Sales dont mean much, but that isnt the point im making anyway. The fact its selling so long after its release must mean ALOT of people consider it classic.

And you crazy as fuck if you think people didnt care when this album dropped.......This shit sold like 750,000 in its first week alone then like another 400K in its second week, which back then was almost unheard of. I remember alot of retailers reporting that the album was selling so fast they couldnt keep it in stock. I even remember going to the Tower Records down the street from where I live when it first came out, and seeing the line like 200 deep at midnight. I wasnt even able to get my copy until the second week it was out, thats how much it was selling.

You lying if you say most people dont have this album in their top 20.......almost everyone I meet has this album in their top 10, much less the top 20.

I dont know, you must live in a completley different area then I do......around these parts, Pac is a hip hop god.

-first point means nothing
-I said rerelease
-you're wrong, maybe on this message board and to your friends and 2Pac groupies but this is not a top 20 album
-2Pac is a hip-hop god to some, I'm not debating that.  Rakim, KRS, Kane, Nas, Jay, Big, G Rap, 'Face & Cube are all hip-hop gods to some people too.

It does mean something......it means the album has stood the test of time.

ok, you mean the re-release. Well, even then, the album was immediatly back on the catalog charts. So, my point still stands.

Im wrong?? No im not. Im not necessarily right either, but there is NO WAY for you to prove with concrete facts that Makaveli isnt a top 10 album. Just like I cant prove with concrete facts that it IS a top 10 album. Cause in the end, all this hip hop shit is so subjective anyway. All im saying is, most people i meet/talk to/ or come across (both on and offline), Pac fan or not, that love hip hop, have this album as a top 20 album.....most actually as a top 10 album and some even agree with me fully and have it as their #1 album all time. And they arent necessarily Pac fans. I know people who hate almost all his work but absolutly love this album.

I have yet still to see anyone counter my point that Pac being one of the top hip hop artists ever and this being his best work would make this a top 10 album by default.....
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: Elevz on June 02, 2005, 04:12:56 AM
What made it big though was that it was the first album of its kind: a deluxe street album designed to crossover to the mainstream but still retaining hip hop respect.

Doggystyle, 3 Feet High And Rising, Regulate G-Funk Era... There's more people that did it before Pac did it. And keep in mind, a great artist doesn't necessarily make great albums. I definately feel like Pac would've had it in him to make the #1 album of all time, no doubt, but I just don't feel like neither MATW, nor AEOM, nor the 7 day theory deserve to even be near that spot. Pac could've and maybe even should've done better. It's not in my top10 of all time. Not even in my top20. I'm sorry.
Title: Re: The Greatest 50 Hip-hop Albums Ever - #41...
Post by: ImmortalOne on June 02, 2005, 04:26:59 AM
What made it big though was that it was the first album of its kind: a deluxe street album designed to crossover to the mainstream but still retaining hip hop respect.

 but I just don't feel like neither MATW, nor AEOM, nor the 7 day theory deserve to even be near that spot. Pac could've and maybe even should've done better. It's not in my top10 of all time. Not even in my top20. I'm sorry.

wow, I dont even know what to say to that.......its like you want the man to do back flips or something. LOL.

Ive always thought all three of those albums were stellar, with 7 Day Theory being practically flawless.

Doggystyle, 3 Feet High, or G-Funk Era didnt have the sheer scope that AEOM did......technically speaking AEOM was the first of its kind. It isnt the best hip hop album ever by any means, but its w/o a doubt the most complete.