Author Topic: democracy in the middle east: Hamas wins Palestinian parliamentary majority  (Read 953 times)

Don Rizzle

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I wonder if america is regretting their democracy drive?

Palestinian PM quits after poll
Palestinian Prime Minister Ahmed Qurei has announced his resignation, saying Hamas must form the next government following the parliamentary elections.
It comes as the militant Islamic group appeared to be heading for a shock win.

With counting still under way, officials from the ruling Fatah party said Hamas had won a majority. Official results are due at 1900 (1700 GMT).

Israel, the US and the EU consider Hamas a terrorist group and have said they do not want to deal with it.

"I am going to present my resignation to President Abu Mazen [Mahmoud Abbas] and Hamas should form the [new] government," Mr Qurei told journalists, according to AFP news agency.


 Recognising Israel is not on the agenda
Mushir al-Masri
Hamas politician
 

Hours before official results were due to be released, Fatah officials privately admitted that Hamas had won.
Hamas claimed it had won at least 70 seats in the 132-member parliament.

The BBC's Jon Leyne in Jerusalem says there is no doubt that the Hamas showing has transformed the Palestinian political arena.

For decades, Fatah - the party founded by the late Yasser Arafat - has totally dominated electoral politics, but that time is over, he says.

Hamas is also now a major power and it will enter parliament still committed to its armed confrontation with Israel, our correspondent adds.

With victory looming, senior Hamas official Mushir al-Masri said the group wanted to work with Fatah in a "political partnership".

But he said Hamas would not hold peace talks with Israel.

"Negotiations with Israel is not on our agenda," he said.

"Recognising Israel is not on the agenda either now."

No talks

Speaking before Hamas claimed victory, acting Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert said Israel could not deal with a Palestinian Authority which included Hamas.

"Israel can't accept a situation in which Hamas, in its present form as a terror group calling for the destruction of Israel, will be part of the Palestinian Authority without disarming," Mr Olmert's office reported him as saying.

"I won't hold negotiations with a government that does not stick to its most basic obligation of fighting terror."

The European Union - the biggest provider of aid to the Palestinian Authority - said it would work with any peaceful Palestinian government.

"We are happy to work with any government if that government is prepared to work by peaceful means," said European External Relations Commissioner Benita Ferrero-Waldner.

Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/world/middle_east/4649606.stm

iraq would just get annexed by iran


That would be a great solution.  If Iran and the majority of Iraqi's are pleased with it, then why shouldn't they do it?
 

mauzip

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I know Hamas gives away a lot of money for charity, but it's still a terrorist organization. This goes to show how fucked up the Palestinian minds are :-X They don't want peace, they want war.
 

Don Rizzle

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do you really think israelies want peace? they could of given a palestinian state years ago but they continue to block attempts at every opportunity

iraq would just get annexed by iran


That would be a great solution.  If Iran and the majority of Iraqi's are pleased with it, then why shouldn't they do it?
 

mauzip

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do you really think israelies want peace? they could of given a palestinian state years ago but they continue to block attempts at every opportunity

At least the Israelis don't vote for a terrorist organization.
 

Don Rizzle

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hmm thats debatable

iraq would just get annexed by iran


That would be a great solution.  If Iran and the majority of Iraqi's are pleased with it, then why shouldn't they do it?
 

mauzip

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hmm thats debatable

Your neutral point of view on politics in the Middle East is debatable as well.
 

nibs

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this is just incredible.

i don't think you can even call hamas a terror group now if they are the government.

democracy is on the march!

what is even more amazing is that yasser arafat died under suspicious circumstances (poisoning/assassination???) as he was seen as an obstacle to a u.s. and israeli notion of peace.

his death is what allowed this transition to take place.  would hamas have defeated fateh with arafat at the helm???

« Last Edit: January 26, 2006, 07:12:00 AM by nibs »
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I TO DA GEEZY

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they could of given a palestinian state years ago but they continue to block attempts at every opportunity

Really?.... And didn't Israel agree to a Palestinian state, with a much larger territory than they have nowadays, back in 47- Partition Plan. Why would you choose to disregard this, one wonders. They chose not to have a state when they had most of what today is Israel. What makes you think they want it now? If they wanted to declare a state they could've done it on the territory they possess. Certain factors in the Palestinian Authority and in the Arab World truly profit from the status-quo of the territories<That's the core of the problem.


Quote
"There are no differences between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. We are all part of one nation. It is only for political reasons that we carefully underline our Palestinian identity.... yes, the existence of a separate Palestinian identity serves only tactical purposes. The founding of a Palestinian state is a new tool in the continuing battle against Israel." (Zuheir Muhsin, late Military Department head of the PLO and member of its Executive Council (Dutch daily Trouw, March 1977)
« Last Edit: January 26, 2006, 07:54:39 AM by I TO DA GEEZY »
We are all human beings isn't that a good enough reason for peace?
 

Infinite Trapped in 1996

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Certain factors in the Palestinian Authority and in the Arab World truly profit from the status-quo of the territories<That's the core of the problem.


That's nothing but propaganda.  Your trying to make it sound like the Arab world wants to maintain the status quo and have the Palestinians to live in a continuous state of oppression and occupation.  Which is clearly not the truth. 
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Don Rizzle

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they could of given a palestinian state years ago but they continue to block attempts at every opportunity

Really?.... And didn't Israel agree to a Palestinian state, with a much larger territory than they have nowadays, back in 47- Partition Plan. Why would you choose to disregard this, one wonders. They chose not to have a state when they had most of what today is Israel. What makes you think they want it now? If they wanted to declare a state they could've done it on the territory they possess. Certain factors in the Palestinian Authority and in the Arab World truly profit from the status-quo of the territories<That's the core of the problem.


Quote
"There are no differences between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. We are all part of one nation. It is only for political reasons that we carefully underline our Palestinian identity.... yes, the existence of a separate Palestinian identity serves only tactical purposes. The founding of a Palestinian state is a new tool in the continuing battle against Israel." (Zuheir Muhsin, late Military Department head of the PLO and member of its Executive Council (Dutch daily Trouw, March 1977)
israel never fully backed the partition plan and u know it or ur just a sucker for zoinist properganda

Quote
"Arab rejection was...based on the fact that, while the population of the Jewish state was to be [only half] Jewish with the Jews owning less than 10% of the Jewish state land area, the Jews were to be established as the ruling body - a settlement which no self-respecting people would accept without protest, to say the least...The action of the United Nations conflicted with the basic principles for which the world organization was established, namely, to uphold the right of all peoples to self-determination. By denying the Palestine Arabs, who formed the two-thirds majority of the country, the right to decide for themselves, the United Nations had violated its own charter." Sami Hadawi, "Bitter Harvest."

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"While the Yishuv's leadership formally accepted the 1947 Partition Resolution, large sections of Israel's society - including...Ben-Gurion - were opposed to or extremely unhappy with partition and from early on viewed the war as an ideal opportunity to expand the new state's borders beyond the UN earmarked partition boundaries and at the expense of the Palestinians." Israeli historian, Benny Morris, in "Tikkun", March/April 1998.

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"In internal discussion in 1938 [David Ben-Gurion] stated that 'after we become a strong force, as a result of the creation of a state, we shall abolish partition and expand into the whole of Palestine'...In 1948, Menachem Begin declared that: 'The partition of the Homeland is illegal. It will never be recognized. The signature of institutions and individuals of the partition agreement is invalid. It will not bind the Jewish people. Jerusalem was and will forever be our capital. Eretz Israel (the land of Israel) will be restored to the people of Israel, All of it. And forever." Noam Chomsky, "The Fateful Triangle."

Quote
"In December 1947, the British announced that they would withdraw from Palestine by May 15, 1948. Palestinians in Jerusalem and Jaffa called a general strike against the partition. Fighting broke out in Jerusalem's streets almost immediately...Violent incidents mushroomed into all-out war...During that fateful April of 1948, eight out of thirteen major Zionist military attacks on Palestinians occurred in the territory granted to the Arab state." "Our Roots Are Still Alive" by the People Press Palestine Book Project.

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"Before the end of the mandate and, therefore before any possible intervention by Arab states, the Jews, taking advantage of their superior military preparation and organization, had occupied...most of the Arab cities in Palestine before May 15, 1948. Tiberias was occupied on April 19, 1948, Haifa on April 22, Jaffa on April 28, the Arab quarters in the New City of Jerusalem on April 30, Beisan on May 8, Safad on May 10 and Acre on May 14, 1948...In contrast, the Palestine Arabs did not seize any of the territories reserved for the Jewish state under the partition resolution." British author, Henry Cattan, "Palestine, The Arabs and Israel."

Quote
"Menahem Begin, the Leader of the Irgun, tells how 'in Jerusalem, as elsewhere, we were the first to pass from the defensive to the offensive...Arabs began to flee in terror...Hagana was carrying out successful attacks on other fronts, while all the Jewish forces proceeded to advance through Haifa like a knife through butter'...The Israelis now allege that the Palestine war began with the entry of the Arab armies into Palestine after 15 May 1948. But that was the second phase of the war; they overlook the massacres, expulsions and dispossessions which took place prior to that date and which necessitated Arab states' intervention." Sami Hadawi, "Bitter Harvest."

Quote
"For the entire day of April 9, 1948, Irgun and LEHI soldiers carried out the slaughter in a cold and premeditated fashion...The attackers 'lined men, women and children up against the walls and shot them,'...The ruthlessness of the attack on Deir Yassin shocked Jewish and world opinion alike, drove fear and panic into the Arab population, and led to the flight of unarmed civilians from their homes all over the country." Israeli author, Simha Flapan, "The Birth of Israel."

Quote
"By 1948, the Jew was not only able to 'defend himself' but to commit massive atrocities as well. Indeed, according to the former director of the Israeli army archives, 'in almost every village occupied by us during the War of Independence, acts were committed which are defined as war crimes, such as murders, massacres, and rapes'...Uri Milstein, the authoritative Israeli military historian of the 1948 war, goes one step further, maintaining that 'every skirmish ended in a massacre of Arabs.'" Norman Finkelstein, "Image and Reality of the Israel-Palestine Conflict."
« Last Edit: January 26, 2006, 09:34:26 AM by Don Rizzle »

iraq would just get annexed by iran


That would be a great solution.  If Iran and the majority of Iraqi's are pleased with it, then why shouldn't they do it?
 

Don Rizzle

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and this one smashes on your assertation which you've made many times that arab states told palestinians to leave.....

Quote
"The BBC (British Broadcasting Corporation) monitored all Middle Eastern broadcasts throughout 1948. The records, and companion ones by a United States monitoring unit, can be seen at the British Museum. There was not a single order or appeal, or suggestion about evacuation from Palestine, from any Arab radio station, inside or outside Palestine, in 1948. There is a repeated monitored record of Arab appeals, even flat orders, to the civilians of Palestine to stay put." Erskine Childers, British researcher, quoted in Sami Hadawi, "Bitter Harvest."

iraq would just get annexed by iran


That would be a great solution.  If Iran and the majority of Iraqi's are pleased with it, then why shouldn't they do it?
 

I TO DA GEEZY

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Point is, Israel accepted the Partition Plan, thus accepting the existence of a territorially superior Palestinian State. I've never said it was a unanimous decision, but FACT remains it was made- it was accepted. Your speculations as for Zionists not being fully fond of the Partition Plan, despite their acceptance, can only show you their great vision of the future to come. Practically it didn't have any impact since the Partition Plan was accepted on the part of the Zionists.

You're late homie. Jamal already let me read this piece of propaganda a while back.

READ SOME FACTS NOW:

Quote
The refugees were confident that their absence would not last long, and that they would return within a week or two. Their leaders had promised them that the Arab Armies would crush the "Zionist gangs" very quickly and that there was no need for panic or fear of a long exile. [Sada al Janub, August 16, 1948]

And just so we're clear, you've just tried to refute a FACT with an assumption. Point is, there was some sort of communication between Palestinian Arabs and the Arab States, even if it wasn't broadcasted or cought on tape. Although the Pan-Arabic Brits were known for helping out Arab Propaganda, so it's hard to tell whether this source is even reliable.

Now as for the Arab World being interested in the status-quo. Read it again:
Quote
"There are no differences between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. We are all part of one nation. It is only for political reasons that we carefully underline our Palestinian identity.... yes, the existence of a separate Palestinian identity serves only tactical purposes. The founding of a Palestinian state is a new tool in the continuing battle against Israel." (Zuheir Muhsin, late Military Department head of the PLO and member of its Executive Council (Dutch daily Trouw, March 1977)

Meaning: No Palestinian identity=No battle against Israel.
             Are you saying the Arab World is not interested in a threat to Israel's existence or stability?- Take off your pink glasses homie.
             Now how many wealthy Arabs do you see blowing themselves up? Does the Arab World need poverty in the territories then?
             Are the Arab States or Are they not interested in this constant threat to Israel's stability?
« Last Edit: January 26, 2006, 10:49:45 AM by I TO DA GEEZY »
We are all human beings isn't that a good enough reason for peace?
 

Noname

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I know Hamas gives away a lot of money for charity, but it's still a terrorist organization. This goes to show how fucked up the Palestinian minds are :-X They don't want peace, they want war.



How come when a palestinian killes people he is called a ''terrorist'', and when a israeli killes people its called a ''military repercussion''.

You are just brainwashed by the western media.
 

mauzip

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I know Hamas gives away a lot of money for charity, but it's still a terrorist organization. This goes to show how fucked up the Palestinian minds are :-X They don't want peace, they want war.



How come when a palestinian killes people he is called a ''terrorist'', and when a israeli killes people its called a ''military repercussion''.

You are just brainwashed by the western media.

Listen up, 16-year-old kid that has no pubic hair yet: I have never said I agree with Israel's politics.
« Last Edit: January 26, 2006, 10:57:04 AM by Mauzip Da Gangsta »
 

I TO DA GEEZY

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I'm Israeli, so the media here is the Eastern among the Western my friend. Unlike you I have served in the Israeli Army. So when u say an Israeli soldier is a terrorist you're saying that I'm a terrorist. Thing is I'm not. I have Arab friends. I wonder how many suicide bombers and Hamas activists can claim to have Jewish friends.
Speaking of being brainwashed by the media. For 3 years I've served in the IDF. Which one of us relies more on the Media to mediate between himself and reality in Israel?
We are all human beings isn't that a good enough reason for peace?