I Want To Start A Discussion On The Issue Of Low Record Sales This Year...

[TraceOneInfinite Flat Earther 96']

some observations I want to make to get the discussion started...

-First off, how did T.I. sell 500,000 the first week?  That's the only example of a hip-hop artist who has done really well this year.  His record was wack, his singles were bullshit, he's an average artist at best.  The only thing I can think of is that movie he was in helped him sell all those records.

-Downloading, bootlegging have messed up the game.  Seems like only women, or mostly 14 year old girls, are the only ones still buying cd's.

-What really stood out to me, was the fact that Busta Rhymes and Young Joc aren't even selling that well.  Busta Rhymes had a big-budget, blockbuster, Aftermath, style record, and Busta was already a big name, he had two singles blowing up on the radio, and still he only managed 200,000.  That really shocked me.  Then you got Young Joc (who I think is horrible personally) has that song "It's Goin Down" that is blowing up everywhere!  That single is HUGE, it's a people's favorite, and the hood gave it a thumbs up, and Suge Knight says once the hood gives you the thumbs up everybody will be buying your stuff... but in this case, Joc is selling even less than Busta.  wtf?

-Ya'll think Game, Nas, Young Buck, can sell?  I think they will struggle to go platinum.

-It's interesting, because in the golden age of hip-hop, which for me is 93-96, artists used to only sell gold and platinum, and Death Row artists could sell multi-platinum.  But now, it seems like it's going back to that, where artists are selling gold and platinum, and only a couple big names sell multi-platinum.  With the reduced cd prices, and the big budgets for these albums, gold and platinum isn't generating as much profits.  It used to be back in 96' when Crucial Conflict sold 500,000 it was a big deal for them, everybody got paid, and the album was a huge success. 

....anyway, what ya'll think.     

[Don Seer]

i'm waiting for a special edition of the busta.. great album.. but i always get stiffed buying shit i like when it comes out.. for a special edition to then come and be there for "johnny come lately" fans...

IMO busta's is a great album

downloading etc is a poor excuse.. quality isnt always there.. and this is the poorest time of year for retail



you're touching on the right kinda shit with the gold+plat thing.. you have to be doing it REALLY big to hit those numbers.. some artists are really only expected to reach 50K units.. but their budget etc reflects that.. rappers talking it big to get 100,000s of budget money end up in debt when they don't sell as well as they can big themselves up.

[Meho]

In 4,5 years gold will be GREAT.

[youngmessnucca]

Maybe someone needs to put out there 1st single as a different song, something with style, instead of following the formulas that everyone is getting sick off.

[Don Seer]

times change.

formulas make albums all "samey"...

in the 60s.. the time of greatest (retail) musical innovation the single was king and LPs were unheard of...

singles would go diamond on their own..


(edit.. just posted this and phillyboy said exactly what i said about formulas!)

[J Bananas]

well yeah, bootleggers are hurting sales, thats a given. but i'd like to place a little blame on the industry itself and the artists too. if we were shown better product, we might be inclined to shell out 15-20 bucks. but right now, an hour and twenty minutes of club rhymes over a techno pop synth isnt gonna convince anyone besides dj's and radio companies that the album is worth copping. that i put on the artist, fuck you niggas for killing hip hop and still demanding our money. Then there's the business of selling music. when it used to be a major industry, corporations decided they could take less chances and still make money if they had A&R firms find artists who would bring in the most dollars, regardless of lyrical talent. this started the decline because if a rapper wanted to make money, he'd have to kiss the A&R firms ass just to get a shot a record deal, then whatever A list producer was in the house, the A&R guy in the house, and the guy from the label are all standing over dude in the studio like, lets make dough. sooner or later there is no art, just manufactured noise that will get drunk ppl who have no artistic sense at all dancing in a bar. anyways, i'm rambling cuz i have a lot of hate for major media, but yeah, case in point. if you want to sell big, which is what all poor black niggas want, you have to sacrifice artistic control which in turn alienates you from real fans, which in turn means declining sales. is there an end in sight to this? i dont know. i for one will continue to bootleg the shit out of every new album i want until they start either PUTTING OUT GOOD ALBUMS, or LOWERING THE PRICE TO BELOW 10 DOLLARS. simple as that.

[Don Seer]

10 dollars..lol.. its over double that in the UK/europe.. now wonder why sales are down?

10 years ago i would walk to back to work with my buddy and we'd have a CD each nearly EVERY DAY!

[Trauma-san]

i'm waiting for a special edition of the busta.. great album.. but i always get stiffed buying shit i like when it comes out.. for a special edition to then come and be there for "johnny come lately" fans...

IMO busta's is a great album

downloading etc is a poor excuse.. quality isnt always there.. and this is the poorest time of year for retail

... but yet you haven't bought busta's great album.  NOT a poor excuse, a dead-on excuse.  Downloading has probably halfed hiphop record sales.  JUST MY OPINION, I could be wrong although it's never... EVER happened before. 

[Don Seer]

yup.. i will buy it when theres a special edition.. or if it doesnt come.. i'll get it cheaper... i win both ways 

['EclipZe]

i only buy old cds before 2000 like outkast, nas, snoop , nwa, mobb deep etc when i see some, only new albums i bought last year are trauma and in the midnite hour

[Teddy Roosevelt]

Maybe someone needs to put out there 1st single as a different song, something with style, instead of following the formulas that everyone is getting sick off.

In the end it is all about creativity. There is too much formulaic rap out there that causes people to lose intrest eventually. Busta put out a good first single that was different and created a buzz. Interscope fucked up by delyaing his album, and a terrible second single.

-First off, how did T.I. sell 500,000 the first week?  That's the only example of a hip-hop artist who has done really well this year.  His record was wack, his singles were bullshit, he's an average artist at best.  The only thing I can think of is that movie he was in helped him sell all those records.

I have to disagree. T.I. has slowed down since Trap Muzik, but he is still a good rapper. As far as him selling 500K his firsy week he had buzz going on with no competetion for airplay for his first single, a good single at that, and a new movie coming out. Plus he's from the South so he's almost garunteed good airplay/sales.

-Downloading, bootlegging have messed up the game.  Seems like only women, or mostly 14 year old girls, are the only ones still buying cd's.

That is part of it, but that can't be a the factor, becuase it is still entirely possible to sell a lot. If bootleggins stopped though, it would make selling a lot easier.

-Ya'll think Game, Nas, Young Buck, can sell?  I think they will struggle to go platinum.

Only groupies think they have no problem in selling. In reality, your right, they will struggle. But I think each one of them have a good chance of selling well.

[PLANT]

some observations I want to make to get the discussion started...

-First off, how did T.I. sell 500,000 the first week?  That's the only example of a hip-hop artist who has done really well this year.  His record was wack, his singles were bullshit, he's an average artist at best.  The only thing I can think of is that movie he was in helped him sell all those records.

TI's first single "What you Know" was fuckin HUGE man.....were you hiding under a rock or something?  that track was off the hook!  TI has a huge fan base aswell, with all of the south behind him, he also is respected by the east, west and north....

[West Coast Veteran]

I'm glad record sales are down. Hopefully this will result in better quality music because it proves that "formulas" won't always work but quality music will always go gold ie. Common - Be.

[Throwback]

times change, i think hiphop is over its top.

[Trauma-san]

yup.. i will buy it when theres a special edition.. or if it doesnt come.. i'll get it cheaper... i win both ways 

What I'm saying is, though, that you have the benefit of hearing the album, because of downloading, without paying.  If you weren't able to download it, you likely would have bought it hearing the buzz about how dope it is... so whether it's right or wrong, or you'll buy eventually, or whatever... downloading in this instance clearly hurt album sales.  Now maybe for decades album sales were inflated and they NEVER should have sold what they were in the first place, and maybe NOW album sales are at an equilibrium and where they should be (where only big fans of certain artists buy their albums)... but anyway you look at it, downloading clearly hurts artists sales numbers, and the industry is built so as to give most artists almost no money unless they sell huge, overinflated amounts (which is almost impossible with downloading).