Author Topic: I Want To Start A Discussion On The Issue Of Low Record Sales This Year...  (Read 2231 times)

TraceOneInfinite Flat Earther 96'

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Hip-hop lost it's edge, it's too safe now.

No doubt.  Your exactly right.  It's bubble-gum music now.  The only time they supposedly push the envelop is when it comes to sexual content (like Nelly's "Tip Drill" video or somethin like that), the problem is the video hoe doesn't come with the cd, so to me all that sexual content is useless, and it's just something artists do to stay relevant when they lose their creativity (see LL Cool J).
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TraceOneInfinite Flat Earther 96'

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^ bullshit.  Name 1 artist who went 'independent' and then got BETTER or doper on the mic.  Now, go ahead and name the 10 in your head that you can think of that turned to SHIT as soon as they got an independent deal because they didn't have to answer to anybody and could release whatever wack ass shit they wanted to. 

Good point, because you would think that going independant would make the artists music better, because he would have creative control; although I can't think of any example off the top of my head where an artist was iller on an independant than he was on a major label... however I can think of many examples of artists who whose quality drastically deteriorated when they went independant...

Dead Prez
Talib Kweli
Public Enemy
Daz Dillinger

just to name a few.
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Trauma-san

i'm waiting for a special edition of the busta.. great album.. but i always get stiffed buying shit i like when it comes out.. for a special edition to then come and be there for "johnny come lately" fans...

IMO busta's is a great album

downloading etc is a poor excuse.. quality isnt always there.. and this is the poorest time of year for retail


... but yet you haven't bought busta's great album.  NOT a poor excuse, a dead-on excuse.  Downloading has probably halfed hiphop record sales.  JUST MY OPINION, I could be wrong although it's never... EVER happened before. 

Downloading can be a good thing...i rather hear the whole shit before buying...ya know what i'm saying?

Exxxxxxactly.  That's the whole point.  You'd rather download it than pay for it.  So sales are down. 

ITS NOT ROCKET SCIENCE, FOLKS.  The albums don't sale as much because you can get them free.  DUH who the fuck can't figure that out????
you people actually are suggesting, that If I open up a pizza store, and let people come in and eat as much pizza as they want for free, but don't let them use the plates, they have to stand up to eat... that I'm going to get MORE business because my pizza tastes good?  I tell them it's illegal, but the cops won't do anything about it, and I won't call the cops on them.  You think they're going to say "O.K., well I'll buy the pizza then".  No, i'm just going to get a bunch of people standing up in my restauraunt, eating all the pizza they want, and leaving without paying.  Everyonce in a while, I'll get some rich people coming in who want to sit down and they'll pay for it. 

Just because the cd doesn't have the book and isn't a stamped cd doesn't mean that people aren't cool with it.  A lot of people don't give a shit.
 

Shallow

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^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^


Dubbing was free too, and so was recording off the radio. Why don't you go back and find some articles on the audio cassette and it's recorder and see how scared the industry was about that detroying sales of music. The result was millions of people dubbing albums from friends and and recording hit singles right off the radio. It also during the time of the largest sales boom in the history of music because the prices were low, the income was high and the disposable cash was ready to be wasted.

Like I said, if the prices todat dropped and the economy turned around hte sales would rise. Of course there will be people that won't buy and just download just like there were people that didn't buy and just recorded, but there will also be people that buy after downloading due to quality of music and exposure to it, like what happened with Radiohead.
 

TraceOneInfinite Flat Earther 96'

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^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^


Dubbing was free too, and so was recording off the radio. Why don't you go back and find some articles on the audio cassette and it's recorder and see how scared the industry was about that detroying sales of music. The result was millions of people dubbing albums from friends and and recording hit singles right off the radio. It also during the time of the largest sales boom in the history of music because the prices were low, the income was high and the disposable cash was ready to be wasted.

Like I said, if the prices todat dropped and the economy turned around hte sales would rise. Of course there will be people that won't buy and just download just like there were people that didn't buy and just recorded, but there will also be people that buy after downloading due to quality of music and exposure to it, like what happened with Radiohead.

I used to dub stuff off the radio all the time back in the day, first of all, it's a tape not a cd, and second of all, it's usually just a single.  I also borrowed from friends, and dubbed whole albums, but the big difference there was nobody heard the album until it was released, now there is no such thing as big release date events anymore because everybody has the album weeks and months before it's released.
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Trauma-san

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^


Dubbing was free too, and so was recording off the radio. Why don't you go back and find some articles on the audio cassette and it's recorder and see how scared the industry was about that detroying sales of music. The result was millions of people dubbing albums from friends and and recording hit singles right off the radio. It also during the time of the largest sales boom in the history of music because the prices were low, the income was high and the disposable cash was ready to be wasted.

Like I said, if the prices todat dropped and the economy turned around hte sales would rise. Of course there will be people that won't buy and just download just like there were people that didn't buy and just recorded, but there will also be people that buy after downloading due to quality of music and exposure to it, like what happened with Radiohead.

You're an idiot.  To copy an album before, you had to have special equipment, you had to borrow somebody's copy, the tape wasn't long enough to copy the whole album, the sound was degraded with each generation, etc., etc.  Surely you know this.  Surely you realized before you even came at me with your BULLSHIT argument that I would tear it into a million fucking pieces.  why would you even step to me with such weak, pathetic drivel knowing damn good and well I would destroy everything that came out of your cunt mouth?

To get a free cd before it's released... you have to click a fucking button.  CLICK A FUCKING BUTTON.  CLICK. A. Fucking. BUTTON.  It couldn't BE EASIER! The only way it could be easier, is if the record company let you pick it up for free at the store, and that wouldn't even be easier because you'd have to drive there, then open that shitty plastic wrap they put on it.  If I want to hear the new Busta cd, all I have to do is click the left button on my mouse.  CLICK THE LEFT BUTTON ON MY MOUSE.

I have thorougly consumed your little petty argument.  Bow down to a power greater than you. 
 

Trauma-san

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^


Dubbing was free too, and so was recording off the radio. Why don't you go back and find some articles on the audio cassette and it's recorder and see how scared the industry was about that detroying sales of music. The result was millions of people dubbing albums from friends and and recording hit singles right off the radio. It also during the time of the largest sales boom in the history of music because the prices were low, the income was high and the disposable cash was ready to be wasted.

Like I said, if the prices todat dropped and the economy turned around hte sales would rise. Of course there will be people that won't buy and just download just like there were people that didn't buy and just recorded, but there will also be people that buy after downloading due to quality of music and exposure to it, like what happened with Radiohead.

I used to dub stuff off the radio all the time back in the day, first of all, it's a tape not a cd, and second of all, it's usually just a single.  I also borrowed from friends, and dubbed whole albums, but the big difference there was nobody heard the album until it was released, now there is no such thing as big release date events anymore because everybody has the album weeks and months before it's released.

You're dealing with idiots.  I mean, you're an idiot too, but when you're right you're right, and you're right about this one. 

Here's some more proof: Thriller sold 52 million copies.  Nothing's came close since.  That's not because Thriller is the greatest album ever, that's because anymore you don't have to BUY anything! I don't! I download all kinds of shit, I used to pay, now I don't.

Here, i'll make it easy again.

1. I used to pay for albums.
2. Now I don't because I can download them.

Do all the little children see where this is leading? See, if you 'sell' something in a store, people use 'money' to buy it.  If they don't have to use 'money' to buy it because they get it free, then you don't make any 'money' and 'sales' are down because they don't 'buy' it anymore.

This is so fucking unbelievably simple it blows my mind why people can't figure it out.  A fucking monkey could figure this out. 
 

7even

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LMAOOOO Im Dying!!! LOOOOL
Cause I don't care where I belong no more
What we share or not I will ignore
And I won't waste my time fitting in
Cause I don't think contrast is a sin
No, it's not a sin
 

The King

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Someone explain to me why downloading helps sales. It doesn't in any way. It only hurts sales, downloading also hurts television ratings, radio ratings, DVD sales, movies sales, it hurts almost all media. If you can dl it for free, why buy it or even watch on TV. And bullshit you download an album, realize its good, then buy it. How does that help anything. You download 100 albums a year and buy maybe 5 of them, as apposed to buying 100 albums. Music is getting worse and worse, movies are getting worse and worse, television is getting worse and worse, and people downloading it all for free is partially to blame.
 

T-Dogg

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I'd imagine that spreading mixtape cuts online for free and having singles online somewhere for streaming would help promotion and arouse interest for an upcpming album, but there's no way downloading full albums helps anybody. There's also the snippet route though - like Ice Cube had that collection of snippets from his album. I dunno about its effect as a whole, but it definately made me want to get the album more.
 

'EclipZe




To get a free cd before it's released... you have to click a fucking button.  CLICK A FUCKING BUTTON.  CLICK. A. Fucking. BUTTON.  It couldn't BE EASIER! The only way it could be easier, is if the record company let you pick it up for free at the store, and that wouldn't even be easier because you'd have to drive there, then open that shitty plastic wrap they put on it.  If I want to hear the new Busta cd, all I have to do is click the left button on my mouse.  CLICK THE LEFT BUTTON ON MY MOUSE.

I have thorougly consumed your little petty argument.  Bow down to a power greater than you. 

LMFAO PROPS

Shallow

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I used to dub stuff off the radio all the time back in the day, first of all, it's a tape not a cd, and second of all, it's usually just a single.  I also borrowed from friends, and dubbed whole albums, but the big difference there was nobody heard the album until it was released, now there is no such thing as big release date events anymore because everybody has the album weeks and months before it's released.



Then explain why the last 5 years or so have been the best years for first week in album history. I'm not saying it's because of downloading but every year you have all these #1 debuts from artists that never see that spot again. In '84 the number of #1 albums that year you could count on 1 hand; Thriller by MJ, Footloose the Soundtrack, Sports by Huey Lewis, Born in the USA by Springsteen, and Purple Rain by Prince. No other album reached number 1 that year. Twenty years later in 2004 you had over 25 #1 albums and most were only on for a week or two when they have there big debut and then they fall off.



You're an idiot.  To copy an album before, you had to have special equipment, you had to borrow somebody's copy, the tape wasn't long enough to copy the whole album, the sound was degraded with each generation, etc., etc.  Surely you know this.  Surely you realized before you even came at me with your BULLSHIT argument that I would tear it into a million fucking pieces.  why would you even step to me with such weak, pathetic drivel knowing damn good and well I would destroy everything that came out of your cunt mouth?

To get a free cd before it's released... you have to click a fucking button.  CLICK A FUCKING BUTTON.  CLICK. A. Fucking. BUTTON.  It couldn't BE EASIER! The only way it could be easier, is if the record company let you pick it up for free at the store, and that wouldn't even be easier because you'd have to drive there, then open that shitty plastic wrap they put on it.  If I want to hear the new Busta cd, all I have to do is click the left button on my mouse.  CLICK THE LEFT BUTTON ON MY MOUSE.

I have thorougly consumed your little petty argument.  Bow down to a power greater than you. 

Someone once told me that people that feel the need to praise themselves do so to hide their inabilities. You can bow down to yourself if you want. I will simply use logic to argue your claims. In the last census of 2003 in was shown that about 55% of US households have the internet, and of that 55% about 60% have broadband. So about 30% of the US households have highspeed internet. Let's say have of those households are music fans, shit I'll bump it up to 70% just to be generous even though the number of music fans in the states is no where near 100%. So about 22% of American households have high speed internet and are able to properly access websites that offer albums. Now of those millions that have high speed, only a small margin use torrent sites, the place where full albums are at the click of a "FUCKING BUTTON" as you so eloquintly put it. Go to any major torrent site which caters to the world and you'll notice that even of the top downloaded items the number of seeders is usually inthe hudreds and leechers is in the thousands, so where are these millions of people downloading. A study at Harvard recently said that it takes 5000 downloads of an album to drop just 1 sales ( http://news.com.com/2100-1027_3-5181562.html ). The same article also mentions how DVD sales and video game sales which are also easily available on the net for free have both drastically grown in the past several years. I personally could have downloaded King Kong before it was released on DVD the week before and it was one of the highest downloaded movies on the torrent sites, yet it sold 6.5 million copies in 6 days. That's nearly 7 platinum in one week. Explain that oh great knowledgable one. Movies break records every year in some form another for the last wlittle while while music struggles along.

Thriller sold well for various reasons, many bought multiple copies because of change in technology. When it came out the LP was the norm, then the tape became popular very soon after and people wanted a copy for their walkman and car, and the the CD was released and people slowly bought that one too, and thanks to low prices and a very string economy this could all happen quite easily. Look at any big album fro that era, they all destroy the sales of today and even 10 years ago.Thriller never would have touched 26 million if it came out in '92.

Someone explain to me why downloading helps sales. It doesn't in any way. It only hurts sales, downloading also hurts television ratings, radio ratings, DVD sales, movies sales, it hurts almost all media. If you can dl it for free, why buy it or even watch on TV. And bullshit you download an album, realize its good, then buy it. How does that help anything. You download 100 albums a year and buy maybe 5 of them, as apposed to buying 100 albums. Music is getting worse and worse, movies are getting worse and worse, television is getting worse and worse, and people downloading it all for free is partially to blame.


I never said it helped sales in general. I said it helped some artists, mainly unknowns trying to get exposure. It with out a doubt helped radiohead sell Kid A. Even dubbed tapes helped Metallica become huge. With every million tapes bootlegged Metallica saw huge increases at live shows. Today it's not just ticket sales falling it's concert sales. You can't download a live show and come even close to being there, yet particularly in new acts they aren't filling up shit. What's the last new act that filled up a football stadium?

TV ratings are soaring. NBC may be in the shitter but America Idoil does better every year. CSI has like three shows all smashing the ratings, and I already mentioned how well movies are doing. Superman does 60 million and they call it disappointing. In the early 90s, with inflation added in, doing 30 million in the first week would have been huge.
 

Trauma-san

click a button. 
 

jeromechickenbone

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Illegal downloading obviously affects artists and record labels.  But illegal downloading is nothing more than a by-product of the internet.  At this stage in the game, illegal downloading is basically unstoppable.  I know...lets shut down the internet(I can hear it already).

What most people fail to acknowledge or even contemplate is the NUMEROUS positive effects of music and the internet.  I've been exposed to exponentially more music via the internet than mainstream media in the past 5 years.  I could probably attribute 75% of my music purchased in that time to being exposed to that particular artist online, not on the radio / tv. That goes for both new and old musicians.  I've been able to locate and BUY numerous CD's that I could NEVER find in the town I lived in.  Many people don't get too many choices when it comes to hearing alternative music styles / artists in their home town.  The internet is the only way.

All you ever hear about from record labels is how illegal downloading is destroying their business.  But that arguement is only viable if record sales are zero...which they are not.  True, sales are down in probably every genre of new music released.  But I still believe that if people heard top notch quality artistic music that the sales would follow.  There are still albums released that are going multiplatinum like Kanye, 50, Em, Mariah Carey, which fit into the young / hiphop R&B genre.  You know these people are being dl'd like a motherfucker but they are still pushing crazy units. 

Record execs love the downloading excuse because it absolves them of any guilt.  It's not their fault the sales are down, it's these thieving downloaders!! :tosser:  They never mention how they promote the disposable nature of music.  All they do is find some puppet who dresses / says whatever they tell them to, hype the shit out of them, and then toss them to the curb quicker than they picked them up.  And they wonder why they can't sell that shit?  It's because the public isn't as stupid as they believe. 

I could keep going, but the bottom line is that illegally downloading music is strictly a by-product of the internet.  The internet provides as many positives for music, it's just that no labels ever talk about it because that would mean that their wack ass industry is suffering cuz those assholes have no fucking clue about music.
 

Diabolical

Blaming downloading is bullshit in my opinion. Downloading only helps if the music is good, and if the music sucks people either delete or never listen to the albums anyway.

... but yet Overseer starts it off by saying Bustas album is great (so he obviously listens to it frequently) but he hasn't bought it.... why? ... because he downloaded it.  So, blaming downloading is bullshit.  riiiiight. 

He told you why he hasn't bought it ffs.