Pac was really The King of the West

[Jaydc555]

kings rise and fall, so to say pac is still the king is silly, and he was imported but he did hold this coast down like no one else ever has. its a touchy subject but it is what it is. pac isnt the king at the moment

READ the title of the thread  
Pac WAS really The King of the West

fuck that, kings don't stop being kings just cause they pass.....pac will alwayz b tha king of the west & east as well, the whole eastcoast gotta swallow that no matter what.....especially 301 baltimore, maryland  

Eh, 2pac is one of the greats, and a legend on the west, but he can't truly be called that cause of a few things.

1. He didn't impact anything in rap until Me Against The World.
2. All Eyez, sold out to The G-Funk Sound that was hot at the time. Strange how Lethal Injection was Chastise, yet All Eyez gets nothing but praise, despite a entire second disk of Filler?
3. The Fact that unlike Dr. Dre or even Snoop, his First Album wasn't innovated, didn't become a major critical success that truly affected how California Rap grew.

Basically he didn't get huge until Me Against The World, eventually becoming huger with All Eyez, and Reaching a Crucial point with Makaveli Post-Death.

So, Is he the king? No, other artist are more deserving then him, given they helped build West Coast Rap into what it was. But people keep buying into the hype that he was always a success as he was near his death. When in reality he was some what notable, and his Film Carrier had given him more attention then the average rapper, but with Dr. Dre's The Chronic, Snoops Doggystyle, Ice Cubes own carrier and his own films. He basically was stuck in the backround for awhile.

Me Against The World and Makaveli is were he left his mark in the industry.

Sorry but i couldnt agree less.Saying All eyez on me didnt effect the industry?Please.The first double album in rap history.Listen to albums that came out that same year and compare the production.All eyez on me still sounds fresh today where as everything else feels dated that year.The second disc had great tracks I dont where you get filler from.Wonda why they call u bitch is filler?Shorty wanna be a thug?The second disc is better then 95 percent of albums that come out today.

So because his first album wasnt game changing that matters?Id much rather take an artist that got better each album then an artist who peaked at his first album like snoop.2pacs best album was argueably his last.Snoop peaked with doggystyle and its been down hill ever since.Snoop is nowhere near a king.He just jumps from bandwagon to bandwagon each album.He went from death row to the most popular label at the time which was no limit.Then he worked with pharell,then timbo,had a lil jon track when it was hot,then did auto tune when it was hot,did a hyphy song,now his new album will have a jerkin song on it.Snoop is a follower not aleader.He doesnt set trends he follows them.That is not a king.

And what has dre done for the west in the last lets say ten years?NOTHING.Even game would have just been another artist dropped never to be heard from again if it werent for 50 cent.Dre himself had his career saved by eminem.Lets face it before eminem came along dre was going nowhere fast.

[Jimmy H.]

Sorry but i couldnt agree less.Saying All eyez on me didnt effect the industry?Please.The first double album in rap history.Listen to albums that came out that same year and compare the production.All eyez on me still sounds fresh today where as everything else feels dated that year.The second disc had great tracks I dont where you get filler from.Wonda why they call u bitch is filler?Shorty wanna be a thug?The second disc is better then 95 percent of albums that come out today.

All Eyez On Me definitely affected the industry in a big way. Outside of that statement, I don't know where you're going. All Eyez is the only album from 1996 that still sounds fresh but EVERYTHING ELSE is dated?!?! How is it any more or less fresh than say, The Fugees' "The Score", Nas' "It Was Written", or Westside Connection's "Bow Down" for a few examples? And in comparing the second disc of AEOM to 95% of today's music, I'll give you that too. Seeing as 95% of today's music is probably three and a half stars or worse.

And what has dre done for the west in the last lets say ten years?NOTHING.Even game would have just been another artist dropped never to be heard from again if it werent for 50 cent.Dre himself had his career saved by eminem.Lets face it before eminem came along dre was going nowhere fast.

Nothing? Give me a fucking break! Cut the biased bullshit. What was the biggest national hip-hop tour headlined by West Coast rappers in the last ten years? And I'm guessing "2001" wasn't one of the biggest West Coast records in the last ten years. Or was it that way simply on the strength of Eminem and not based onyway on Dre's value as a producer/artist? Yes, Eminem and 50 Cent have brought quite a bit to Dre's empire but that does not by virtue of their involvement make his influence or input invalid? If Dre wasn't important in the last ten years, why are people still talking about Detox? We just got a Dre-produced Eminem album, this year, so if Eminem was the big factor in keeping Dre's name alive, his album should have made the whole world forget about Detox. 50 was a factor in Game's success but him being the first Dre protege to come out of the West in awhile was also a huge (and I'd say even bigger overall) factor in selling him as an artist. His entire second album was a dedication to Dr. Dre, both in sound and content. Then there was Xzibit who gained some pretty big national exposure once he started fucking with Dre's camp.

So let's call it how it is. Tupac created the ONLY album in 1996 that is actually timeless and Dre has done nothing for the West in ten years. It was all Eminem and 50 Cent. Nobody cared about Dre at all but all of a sudden by signing a white rapper that nobody had ever heard of, millions of people gave a shit all over again.

[Jaydc555]

Give me a break game sold because of 50 cent not because of dre.G unit was the hottest thing in the industry at that point and games first two singles featured him.Thats why he sold.Lke I said if 50 didnt take game in,game would just be another joe beast.

Like it or not eminem made dre relevant again.Aftermath compilation was a flop commerically and musically as was The firm.Dre seemed to be fading away to obscurity when jimmy iovine found eminem.Most of the slim shady lp was produced by the bass brothers,not dre.What artist from the west has dre helped in the last ten years?Xzibit was already a name when dre started working with him.2001 was full of people dre had already worked with.The only new name it produced was hittman and we all know where he went,the same place game would have gone without 50.

[Jaydc555]

And 2pac had people like c-bo,e-40,richie rich on his albums.He worked with everyone from the west and showed them all love.Dr.Dre doesnt seem interest in the coast at all so how can you call him the king of it.
Besides dre is only as good as his supporting cast.Thats why his beats right when he left death row were mediocre and generic.He had little money and couldnt afford a good supporting cast.Then eminem goes triple platinum and now hes got the resources to hire better musicians.Dr.Dre is only as good as the people around him.On his own,hes like snoop.

[Triple OG Rapsodie]

Give me a break game sold because of 50 cent not because of dre.G unit was the hottest thing in the industry at that point and games first two singles featured him.Thats why he sold.Lke I said if 50 didnt take game in,game would just be another joe beast.

Like it or not eminem made dre relevant again.Aftermath compilation was a flop commerically and musically as was The firm.Dre seemed to be fading away to obscurity when jimmy iovine found eminem.Most of the slim shady lp was produced by the bass brothers,not dre.What artist from the west has dre helped in the last ten years?Xzibit was already a name when dre started working with him.2001 was full of people dre had already worked with.The only new name it produced was hittman and we all know where he went,the same place game would have gone without 50.

Its a two way street. For sure Eminem helped Dre stay relevant. But I sincerely doubt Eminem would have been the star he became without Dre. It was his association with Dre and the two Dre-produced hit singles that made him big. Lets not forget he already had a rap career before he signed to Aftermath. But the hype didn't come until he started working with Dre.

[BiggBoogaBiff]

Eminem is from the Westside... the MidWest.  Sounds like Dre helped the West to me. 

[Blasphemy]

Eminem is from the Westside... the MidWest.  Sounds like Dre helped the West to me. 

No, he helpped Detroit and Midwest. When they signed 50 they both helped show how marketable Club tracks are, as such the market is saturated with them.Fact is Dre is 1 of the legends and pretty much one of the main reasons why West Coast has stayed alive even though he doesn't claim.

First he help bring attention via N.W.A (Though it was more of a group effort). Then he defined a West Coast album with The Chronic. He rebrought back attention with his album 2001, and then in 2005 he brought the game who's pretty much the only other visible west Coast rapper currently.

He may not claim sides or anything, but the fact is what ever he puts his work into, he helps it gain popularity. It takes him and the artist he work with to do it though.

[Jimmy H.]

Give me a break game sold because of 50 cent not because of dre.G unit was the hottest thing in the industry at that point and games first two singles featured him.Thats why he sold.Lke I said if 50 didnt take game in,game would just be another joe beast.

Like it or not eminem made dre relevant again.Aftermath compilation was a flop commerically and musically as was The firm.Dre seemed to be fading away to obscurity when jimmy iovine found eminem.Most of the slim shady lp was produced by the bass brothers,not dre.What artist from the west has dre helped in the last ten years?Xzibit was already a name when dre started working with him.2001 was full of people dre had already worked with.The only new name it produced was hittman and we all know where he went,the same place game would have gone without 50.

50 had a hand in because G-Unit was more of an active movement and they were able to actively push Game but again, you can have more than one person behind someone's success. You don't think the fact that The Game was one of the first new breakout artists from the West to have the Dre stamp had anything to do with it at all? Bullshit. When you look at G-Unit's previous two releases by Lloyd Banks and Young Buck, they did 2 million a piece while Game did 5 million. 50 was involved in all three but Dre was only directed credit with one.

Aftermath and Firm compilations were flops? Both releases went platinum and Firm debuted at #1. They were critically-panned no doubt but keep in mind that creatively, they were going in a much different direction than most Dre fans were accustomed to. There was only one Dre performance on the Aftermath album and more than half of it was produced by other producers. He hadn't worked with Snoop since Death Row and while you're eager to point out that Eminem brought him back to the spotlight, a lot of 2001's selling power and interest was created off the publicity of the Dre-Snoop reunion. The capper of an ensemble Dre performance at the VMA's was Snoop coming onstage to perform "G Thang" with him. A lot of fucking publicity was directed around this. He was in no danger of fading into obscurity at all. People were waiting on 2001, the same way they are waiting on Detox. Eminem's arrival certainly helped him picking up some white fans in the process but Em's big breakout was the Marshall Mathers LP. His first album actually sold less than "2001" and took some time to get off the ground. It was a hit record no doubt but many people weren't sure if Eminem was authentic or a one-hit wonder.

Xzibit was not a superstar before Dre. Plain and simple. His first two albums while highly praised in underground circles did not push major units and were certainly not crossover hits. Xzibit was an MTV darling when he got with Dre, Snoop, and the rest of them. Restless was his first album to go platinum. Between 40 Days and Restless, he hopped on a Snoop single produced by Dre, appeared on 2001, and then did the Up In Smoke tour. His sales went from around 600,000 copies on that album to 1.5 million. Hey, his albums sales more than doubled. I wonder how his audience grew that fucking big. Must have just been a coincidence. I'm not arguing in this 2Pac vs. Dre comparison. I'm simply calling you on some pretty biased-ass statements. Dre's done a lot of stuff for the West and so has Tupac. I really couldn't give a fuck about who has done more or who is the king. Tupac is dead and Dre is taking his sweet-ass time to make Detox. In the mean time, the West Coasts fans have become so bored and dissatisfied that they've now begun rambling on and on about who should wear some hypothetical crown and rule the magical land of Los Angeles. WHO GIVES A SHIT?!?! Pac's not around to claim the crown and Dre doesn't want to wear it.

[3rd Coast]

controversy sells..and it helps to have a machine pac without=javg rapper

imo ice cube n ren > pac

ice cube is more of a king than pac ever was...u never saw when shit hit the fan with cube..he ran and regrouped n repped a whole nother section of america kuz shit aint right at home

all cube did was get a new production team...

cali never got as bad for cube he had niggas outside of his circle(other rappers) goin for his throat like pac had in new york