Am I The Only Person Who Thinks 2Pac Was Just Average...

[Mo-D]

Anyone who thinks 2pac was "underrated" or "average" is currently under the age of 30.

It has been 13 years since his death and unless you were at least 16 at the time of his death, you could not even fathom how big he was; how important he was.

From 1992 he was in the public eye, for good and bad reasons - if you were 5 yrs old at this time, you can't even think about making an analysis on the impact he had during this time.

His music is now between 13 and 19 years old. You can't compare it to your Lil Wayne or TI's, because it is a completely different genre now. If you are calling him average or underrated, you needed to be alive and following hip hop in early to mid 90's to really give that point of view.

To put it in perspective - Take eminem just after MMLP came out, take Dre after 2001 came out, take Wayne after Carter 3 came out and take TI after his big album came out (i dont follow TI so I dont remember the name) - add all the hype of these artists at said time, and combine it, then multiply it by 8. That is how big Pac was in August 1996.

[TraceOneInfinite Flat Earther 96']

i dont know how well ur brain works, but try to read my quote one last time..
okay, here we go..

bottomline:
when u are defining mc's worthy of the goat-titles in hiphop - one of the stripes a rapper has to have on his belt - is flow, lyrical wordplay, mic-capabilities etc etc -
there are 4 elements to hiphop - the "master of the crowd"-subject bein one of the more important ones, dat ppl should keep in mind when ranking artists

u got it?
okay, good..
is flow, lyrical wordplay, mic-capabilities etc etc
that's 3 words really - one, two and three (PLUS- there's an "etc" there too. why would i write "etc" if was talkin about only 3 subjects, hm?)

now, check this out..
there are 4 elements to hiphop
why would i write 4 elements, and mention 3 previously in the same post.

i was talkin about 1 element (the mc-aspect) and i was dividing it to 3 words to describe thoroughly what i thought 2pac was lackin as a stripe

to be honest wit u, my impession is dat normaly someone would understand these writings - but if u dont understand, it's cool..  


and don't preach to me about hiphop, cus i will mindrape u like Yoda, if ur willing to discuss history. i got a few Red Bulls wit me.. i can keep goin for a few hours. its  all good

Nice try, again.  But you still can't explain why you would bring up the 4 elements to make the point you were making?   The only reason to bring up the 4 elements would be if you were trying to make a point that Krazy Legs was as great as 2pac because the rapper or "emcee" as you say is just one element and Krazy Legs was the greatest B-boy or something like that, or to say that SEEN was the best graph artist and that 2pac only mastered one element of hip-hop, but that hip-hop culture is 4 elements.

But that wasn't what you were saying at all.  This whole thread has only been about 2pac as a rapper, and your whole post was only regarding 2pac and his rap skills.  So why would you mention the 4 elements of hip-hop at all unless of course you were confused about what the 4 elements actually were, and you are just an ignorant kid who bumps Lil' Wayne everyday and doesn't really know shit about hip-hop culture and it's history.  LOL

And please, I would love for you to try to lecture me on hip-hop history.  So go pull up some articles on wikipedia and let me know what you come up with.  For once I would like you to try to come with some intelligence, even if your attempt fails, I would enjoy the discussion.

[QuietTruth]

the correct impression ppl should have of him, is dat he was a great poet and artist, more than a great rapper

absolutely, pac deserves the halloffame-mention, but he sure as hell isn't goin down as the best fuckin rapper

That's what's up! Greatest Hip Hop artist/poet any day. Legitimate opinion! Greatest MC? How?

You listen to Pac, get the fuckkkkkk outta here? You nigga? YOU? Oh really? Stop playin' nigga, stop playin'.

What's your favorite joint? Only God Can Judge Me? Worddddd nigga, worddd? Ha ha. I know that's what it is.

lo You a fool! Of course it's Lord Knows!

Ahhhh yeah. Why not Life Goes On though? That seems best fit for you. I can see ya ass rappin' along to that. I was expecting you really to say Heaven Ain't Hard 2 Find.

Good for you Fraxxx!!

[Fraxxx]

the correct impression ppl should have of him, is dat he was a great poet and artist, more than a great rapper

absolutely, pac deserves the halloffame-mention, but he sure as hell isn't goin down as the best fuckin rapper

That's what's up! Greatest Hip Hop artist/poet any day. Legitimate opinion! Greatest MC? How?

You listen to Pac, get the fuckkkkkk outta here? You nigga? YOU? Oh really? Stop playin' nigga, stop playin'.

What's your favorite joint? Only God Can Judge Me? Worddddd nigga, worddd? Ha ha. I know that's what it is.

lo You a fool! Of course it's Lord Knows!

Ahhhh yeah. Why not Life Goes On though? That seems best fit for you. I can see ya ass rappin' along to that. I was expecting you really to say Heaven Ain't Hard 2 Find.

Good for you Fraxxx!!

Damn, I really gotta find some agnostic rappers... shit! Guess I gotta stop listening to rap!

[QuietTruth]

the correct impression ppl should have of him, is dat he was a great poet and artist, more than a great rapper

absolutely, pac deserves the halloffame-mention, but he sure as hell isn't goin down as the best fuckin rapper

That's what's up! Greatest Hip Hop artist/poet any day. Legitimate opinion! Greatest MC? How?

You listen to Pac, get the fuckkkkkk outta here? You nigga? YOU? Oh really? Stop playin' nigga, stop playin'.

What's your favorite joint? Only God Can Judge Me? Worddddd nigga, worddd? Ha ha. I know that's what it is.

lo You a fool! Of course it's Lord Knows!

Ahhhh yeah. Why not Life Goes On though? That seems best fit for you. I can see ya ass rappin' along to that. I was expecting you really to say Heaven Ain't Hard 2 Find.

Good for you Fraxxx!!

Damn, I really gotta find some agnostic rappers... shit! Guess I gotta stop listening to rap!

Lol, Lil weirdo.

[weedhead]

there, there now mister preacher..


im fully aware of the correct 4 elements of hiphop -
flow, lyrical wordplay, mic-capabilities - dat was one element, with 4 different words for it  
u misunderstood


i was born in the middle 80's, and my age isn't relevant
and if u don't provide anythin constructive to this thread besides igna'nt blahzay-blahzay, i will most def eat u up within seconds..  

No wonder you think Pac is just average
like i said, i never called pac "average" just "overrated" -

homie u just got EXSPOSED to not knowing anything about hiphop..fuck the 4 elements of hiphop all up..lmao!!this nigga a phony...like i sad..go study your art...in your case(planet rock)would be a perfect start..

[U.N.T.O.U.C.H.A.B.L.E.]

i dont know how well ur brain works, but try to read my quote one last time..
okay, here we go..

bottomline:
when u are defining mc's worthy of the goat-titles in hiphop - one of the stripes a rapper has to have on his belt - is flow, lyrical wordplay, mic-capabilities etc etc -
there are 4 elements to hiphop - the "master of the crowd"-subject bein one of the more important ones, dat ppl should keep in mind when ranking artists

u got it?
okay, good..
is flow, lyrical wordplay, mic-capabilities etc etc
that's 3 words really - one, two and three (PLUS- there's an "etc" there too. why would i write "etc" if was talkin about only 3 subjects, hm?)

now, check this out..
there are 4 elements to hiphop
why would i write 4 elements, and mention 3 previously in the same post.

i was talkin about 1 element (the mc-aspect) and i was dividing it to 3 words to describe thoroughly what i thought 2pac was lackin as a stripe

to be honest wit u, my impession is dat normaly someone would understand these writings - but if u dont understand, it's cool..  


and don't preach to me about hiphop, cus i will mindrape u like Yoda, if ur willing to discuss history. i got a few Red Bulls wit me.. i can keep goin for a few hours. its  all good

lmao, damn u still tryin to prove your point since this morning homie..............

[U.N.T.O.U.C.H.A.B.L.E.]

rakim himself has said pac is the greatest ever so you do the math....

lol, where'd u get dat from? bullshit
he said dat he felt CANIBUS (for christ sake) was the most ultimate rapper to him - in an old interview in Vibe Magazine

he might have said that can-i-bust might have been the best rapper that he heard at that moment but better than even him nah nigga neva that, also i saw him on a source 2pac tribute issue saying that 2pac was the greatest he's seen...see you only look at this whole issue from a rapper's standpoint, yes he couldn't freestyle or flow like rakim or even nas which i believe are both better than biggie n canibust anyday...but the difference between me n u for example is that i look at the whole in 1 you just look at it individually...but you young so i understand homie...

[theillaone]

OMFG how dare you try and strip a man of his nobility in death.  He was taken away from us too soon, by the Illuminati cuz he wouldn't sell his ass like Nas, Jay-Z and yes Biggie too (thanks to faggot ass puffy)....Pac and Big shouldn't even be in the same catagory, there not about the same thing.  You saw the notorious movie right?  they made sure you knew that Biggie sold crack to pregnant mothers, cheats on his wife and abandon his first daughter....while pac is making songs about Killuminati, so many tears and Lord Knows.... Fuck all those post humous albums too, if he didn't release it when he was alive, thats because it sucked!!!!!!   WE elected a legend as a people so the illumanti can never take his music and wisdom from us.  They raped his legacy by selling all those shytty albums after he died and gave his vocals to Eminem, what the fukk?  Anyone who thinks he's average, doesn't go through any of the shyt he used to talk about on records, you can't relate...sounds to me like another rich kid with a fukked up opinion on the greatest artist of all time.  of course he ain't gonna be lyrical to a cat who aint feeling the subject matter in the first place.

G.O.A.T....who knows, u could be the illuminati trying to feel out how many people turned their backs on him.

GTFOH

[LAC/EASTSIDE]

I think the earlier Michael Jordan analogy was a superior point..

MJ obviously wasn't the best in every aspect of the game but he is still the GOAT, no debate would be accepted.

It's like the Pound for Pound rankings in Boxing..
Muhammad Ali is the GOAT and he's been KO'd before.. that would be equivalent to lacking Mic skills as a Hip-Hop Artist.
Ali is the GOAT but we also have Mike Tysons and Floyd Mayweathers who are also the greats of our generation.

you mentioned Ja and Dmx as the imitators but u seemed to only have noted the forerunners..
also whether or not the imitators were significant to the masses is as irrelevant as my point about Pac's lyrical growth if he was alive, right?

did u forget No Limit Records and a slew of other 'significant' rappers Pac also (influenced)? lol.. 

Thanks Shade!!! That was my analogy!!!

[LAC/EASTSIDE]

i dont know how well ur brain works, but try to read my quote one last time..
okay, here we go..

bottomline:
when u are defining mc's worthy of the goat-titles in hiphop - one of the stripes a rapper has to have on his belt - is flow, lyrical wordplay, mic-capabilities etc etc -
there are 4 elements to hiphop - the "master of the crowd"-subject bein one of the more important ones, dat ppl should keep in mind when ranking artists

u got it?
okay, good..
is flow, lyrical wordplay, mic-capabilities etc etc
that's 3 words really - one, two and three (PLUS- there's an "etc" there too. why would i write "etc" if was talkin about only 3 subjects, hm?)

now, check this out..
there are 4 elements to hiphop
why would i write 4 elements, and mention 3 previously in the same post.

i was talkin about 1 element (the mc-aspect) and i was dividing it to 3 words to describe thoroughly what i thought 2pac was lackin as a stripe

to be honest wit u, my impession is dat normaly someone would understand these writings - but if u dont understand, it's cool..  


and don't preach to me about hiphop, cus i will mindrape u like Yoda, if ur willing to discuss history. i got a few Red Bulls wit me.. i can keep goin for a few hours. its  all good

So who is rated higher than Pac in your scale???

[LAC/EASTSIDE]

so the fact dat 2pac gave a good show, makes him the GOAT? i asked for a debate, where is it?.. bring up real proof to back up what ur sayin.. there isn't anythin called "just the way it is" - every opinion is individual - but there seems to also be a general opinion on 2pac the artist - dat he was "the goat", which i (like many else) feel is overrated.. 2pac was a complete artist, yes - in many ways, very much so - but he lacked the skills of an mc (generally speakin) - which DEFINITELY is the most important-factor dat u should have in mind, when rankin ppl wit "the goat"-title. how can he be the fuckin "goat" if he can't rap? should the other things he accomplished outweigh him for dat, and give him a "free-pass"? NO, dat's bullshit!

he could put on a good show like u say, right?
plus - intriguing and captivating charisma/voice
plus - occasionaly great content-matter
plus - a bunch of other things

BUT HE WASN't A GOOD MC/RAPPER period, the most important thing - how can he then be the "goat".?
pac was the best "artist", BUT he wan't the best rapper - therefore, i cant se him bein the goat

the nigga could'nt even offthedome-freestyle for christ sake, and im bettin u 10 stacks dat the nigga would've been slaughtered in a battle-cypher by every other nigga from Tha Row (xcept mayb Daz)

I AM NOT bashin ur hero, im a big fan just like u - but i feel like he is overrated, and im stickin to it - which a million other niggas feel as well

no need to be immature about it, and sream "what are u talkin about! hahaha woot-woot"
come on, now..

Ill murder you on your debate!!!! Bring it on!!! hahaha! I think i can say why he is not overrated!!!

[U.N.T.O.U.C.H.A.B.L.E.]

so the fact dat 2pac gave a good show, makes him the GOAT? i asked for a debate, where is it?.. bring up real proof to back up what ur sayin.. there isn't anythin called "just the way it is" - every opinion is individual - but there seems to also be a general opinion on 2pac the artist - dat he was "the goat", which i (like many else) feel is overrated.. 2pac was a complete artist, yes - in many ways, very much so - but he lacked the skills of an mc (generally speakin) - which DEFINITELY is the most important-factor dat u should have in mind, when rankin ppl wit "the goat"-title. how can he be the fuckin "goat" if he can't rap? should the other things he accomplished outweigh him for dat, and give him a "free-pass"? NO, dat's bullshit!

he could put on a good show like u say, right?
plus - intriguing and captivating charisma/voice
plus - occasionaly great content-matter
plus - a bunch of other things

BUT HE WASN't A GOOD MC/RAPPER period, the most important thing - how can he then be the "goat".?
pac was the best "artist", BUT he wan't the best rapper - therefore, i cant se him bein the goat

the nigga could'nt even offthedome-freestyle for christ sake, and im bettin u 10 stacks dat the nigga would've been slaughtered in a battle-cypher by every other nigga from Tha Row (xcept mayb Daz)

I AM NOT bashin ur hero, im a big fan just like u - but i feel like he is overrated, and im stickin to it - which a million other niggas feel as well

no need to be immature about it, and sream "what are u talkin about! hahaha woot-woot"
come on, now..

Ill murder you on your debate!!!! Bring it on!!! hahaha! I think i can say why he is not overrated!!

the kid is fighting an already lost battle, he lost by just saying what he said....

[LAC/EASTSIDE]

so the fact dat 2pac gave a good show, makes him the GOAT? i asked for a debate, where is it?.. bring up real proof to back up what ur sayin.. there isn't anythin called "just the way it is" - every opinion is individual - but there seems to also be a general opinion on 2pac the artist - dat he was "the goat", which i (like many else) feel is overrated.. 2pac was a complete artist, yes - in many ways, very much so - but he lacked the skills of an mc (generally speakin) - which DEFINITELY is the most important-factor dat u should have in mind, when rankin ppl wit "the goat"-title. how can he be the fuckin "goat" if he can't rap? should the other things he accomplished outweigh him for dat, and give him a "free-pass"? NO, dat's bullshit!

he could put on a good show like u say, right?
plus - intriguing and captivating charisma/voice
plus - occasionaly great content-matter
plus - a bunch of other things

BUT HE WASN't A GOOD MC/RAPPER period, the most important thing - how can he then be the "goat".?
pac was the best "artist", BUT he wan't the best rapper - therefore, i cant se him bein the goat

the nigga could'nt even offthedome-freestyle for christ sake, and im bettin u 10 stacks dat the nigga would've been slaughtered in a battle-cypher by every other nigga from Tha Row (xcept mayb Daz)

I AM NOT bashin ur hero, im a big fan just like u - but i feel like he is overrated, and im stickin to it - which a million other niggas feel as well

no need to be immature about it, and sream "what are u talkin about! hahaha woot-woot"
come on, now..

Ill murder you on your debate!!!! Bring it on!!! hahaha! I think i can say why he is not overrated!!

the kid is fighting an already lost battle, he lost by just saying what he said....

Dont get me wrong homie!! The dude had a good argument but i thinking he is fucking up on his definition of MC!!! I think Pac is an MC!! He claims Pac does not have the 4 levels or whatever the fuck!!! I think he is wrong!

[LAC/EASTSIDE]

so the fact dat 2pac gave a good show, makes him the GOAT? i asked for a debate, where is it?.. bring up real proof to back up what ur sayin.. there isn't anythin called "just the way it is" - every opinion is individual - but there seems to also be a general opinion on 2pac the artist - dat he was "the goat", which i (like many else) feel is overrated.. 2pac was a complete artist, yes - in many ways, very much so - but he lacked the skills of an mc (generally speakin) - which DEFINITELY is the most important-factor dat u should have in mind, when rankin ppl wit "the goat"-title. how can he be the fuckin "goat" if he can't rap? should the other things he accomplished outweigh him for dat, and give him a "free-pass"? NO, dat's bullshit!

he could put on a good show like u say, right?
plus - intriguing and captivating charisma/voice
plus - occasionaly great content-matter
plus - a bunch of other things

BUT HE WASN't A GOOD MC/RAPPER period, the most important thing - how can he then be the "goat".?
pac was the best "artist", BUT he wan't the best rapper - therefore, i cant se him bein the goat

the nigga could'nt even offthedome-freestyle for christ sake, and im bettin u 10 stacks dat the nigga would've been slaughtered in a battle-cypher by every other nigga from Tha Row (xcept mayb Daz)

I AM NOT bashin ur hero, im a big fan just like u - but i feel like he is overrated, and im stickin to it - which a million other niggas feel as well

no need to be immature about it, and sream "what are u talkin about! hahaha woot-woot"
come on, now..

Ill murder you on your debate!!!! Bring it on!!! hahaha! I think i can say why he is not overrated!!

the kid is fighting an already lost battle, he lost by just saying what he said....

Dont get me wrong homie!! The dude had a good argument but i thinking he is fucking up on his definition of MC!!! I think Pac is an MC!! He claims Pac does not have the 4 levels or whatever the fuck!!! I think he is wrong!

4 Elements!!! HAHA! My Bad!!