Author Topic: Democrats pass health care reform bill  (Read 1181 times)

Javier

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Re: Democrats pass health care reform bill
« Reply #15 on: March 23, 2010, 10:42:58 AM »
The Public Option didn't even pass.  Why are people acting like if Universal Health Care just passed?  If U.S. is going to fail because of Health Insurance, then we were well on our way to fail because the real problem was there and the real problem continues to be there. 
 

Turf Hitta

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Re: Democrats pass health care reform bill
« Reply #16 on: March 23, 2010, 12:02:41 PM »
I am suprised no one else started a thread about this.

This truly is a sad day for America.........

why? is the sky falling again?
 

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Re: Democrats pass health care reform bill
« Reply #17 on: March 23, 2010, 12:14:52 PM »
healthcare IS shit, i dont know how this is WORSE...its either the same or BETTER than what we have now.  Republicans are just bunch of whiny little kids who are gonna oppose everything obama says until he's out of office, not cuz it makes sense but because they dont like him cuz of his color.  They dont like america being nice to other races, they want white supremacy. 

in the end, this country is so screwed that it doesnt matter what bill passes...what they need to fix is the mortgage crisis cuz that has put a major halt in everything...if they just accept the truth and give up these loans, start over with lower priced homes and let business pick up, they'll make their money back and more.  Whats the point of holding on to a foreclosed home for years cuz u dont wanna sell it for $100k less when u just lost money by holding on to it all these years?? 
 

Matty

Re: Democrats pass health care reform bill
« Reply #18 on: March 23, 2010, 12:15:25 PM »
I am suprised no one else started a thread about this.
This truly is a sad day for America.........

in 5 years you're gonna be like "health care is the shit"


But in 25 to 50 years you're gonna be saying "health care is shit". I don't know about you but I'd rather be in debt my whole life rather than dead because of lower quality care, rushed misdiagnosis, and less money to pay for better technologies.

The US does not have the money to pay for this even if they could run it right, which no one can. I predict that China will overtake the US as the World power by the end of our life time, and by te end of our grand children's lifetime the US will be a 2nd world country.

you won't need to wait until the end of your life time. give it a decade and the world will be a very different place, barring any crazy wars or disasters...

socialised healthcare can work and does work in some places, but these are places with crazy income taxes (wealthier european nations) so it ultimately comes at a high expense. at least it works though.

america on the other hand is already internally corrupted to the core so trying to reform anything for the better is kind of futile. thing is even the private healthcare system could be run more efficiently if insurance was what it said on the tin and it wasn't such a huge government subsidized market. you got people claiming for everything, whereas it should just be for the real bad shit and normal healthcare on a pay as you go basis.


All those places that it "works" are bankrupt to shit and borrowing money from countries that treat their citizens like servants. When the US falls Europe will too.

I just wonder if the Chinese will learn from our mistakes and take even more from their successes in Hong Kong. I think China knows it has to be like Hong Kong was if it wants to create a real first world Super Power and Empire and I think the major steps will be taken. They are communist now just like the West was Monarchist for all those centuries, but soon they'll come to true democratic capitalism and hopefully they'll do it better than the US did.

yeah, not all of europe though. the wealthier nations run a big surplus, have far less debt and most importantly, have plentiful resources. sure they get hurt when the shit hits the fan in all the poor and overextended countries, but they don't collapse or suffer as badly. places like norway, sweden, germany, switzerland, france, etc.

bit like the america-china balance of trade. in the long run china won't collapse, they'll take a big hit and need to readjust, but they're very busy preparing for that day now, whereas america is not.
« Last Edit: March 23, 2010, 12:18:37 PM by Matty »
 

The Overfiend

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Re: Democrats pass health care reform bill
« Reply #19 on: March 24, 2010, 03:34:33 AM »
Goddamnit its a shame....I don't want the US to fuck out and elano...you guys paint a depressing picture of the US future, but theres some good analysis here so respect all around.






Sure China is growing, but don't forget their government are so uptight...that is going to hold them back, keep companies from expanding there..



The US is still the world's largest economy (so says the CIA factbook)...its still dwarfes China...China would have to DOUBLE its economy to overtake the US. The US economy still dwarfs the fuck out of any country's economy. Only the EU (as a collective of many many countries) is bigger than the US.
 

jeromechickenbone

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Re: Democrats pass health care reform bill
« Reply #20 on: March 24, 2010, 06:37:09 AM »
I think this health care bullshit was purely a distraction from real issues going on. Gave it crazy media hype.

The audit the fed bill was infintesmally more important than this bullshit. And I could give you a lot more examples than that.

And yes this leans toward socialism but if u think this type of shit hasn't been going on for years then u clearly haven't been paying attention.

I don't think anyone should be deprived health care but I don't want the scum running the show or else its nothing more than a BS scam to me.
 

M Dogg™

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Re: Democrats pass health care reform bill
« Reply #21 on: March 24, 2010, 07:14:23 AM »
Goddamnit its a shame....I don't want the US to fuck out and elano...you guys paint a depressing picture of the US future, but theres some good analysis here so respect all around.






Sure China is growing, but don't forget their government are so uptight...that is going to hold them back, keep companies from expanding there..



The US is still the world's largest economy (so says the CIA factbook)...its still dwarfes China...China would have to DOUBLE its economy to overtake the US. The US economy still dwarfs the fuck out of any country's economy. Only the EU (as a collective of many many countries) is bigger than the US.


the people on this board are mainly libertarians who don't like the direction of the US, and feel that this will bring the US down. There will be forces that are against our freedoms and that we are suppose to agree to a national health care system so that we will eventually die off and there will be less people for the Illuminati to control.
 

M Dogg™

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Re: Democrats pass health care reform bill
« Reply #22 on: March 24, 2010, 07:18:54 AM »
Watch and be educated my fine Aussie friend on the ways of the Illuminati

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/eAaQNACwaLw&amp;hl=en_US&amp;fs=1&amp;" target="_blank" class="new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/eAaQNACwaLw&amp;hl=en_US&amp;fs=1&amp;</a>
 

the ghost

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Re: Democrats pass health care reform bill
« Reply #23 on: March 24, 2010, 10:10:35 AM »
Well being as how currently whenever someone without healthcare gets really fucked up, they go to the hospital where they are treated regardless of their ability to pay.  In those cases which are millions of dollars worth daily, the federal government pays (taxpayer).  So now it's just another name for the same ol song and dance.  And if Obama thinks that healthcare and pharma companies are going to pass any cost savings on to us , he is high.  You cannot tax/charge hospital or pharma company....they will only pass those charges on to the users.  But any profits, they will keep.
 

Javier

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Re: Democrats pass health care reform bill
« Reply #24 on: March 24, 2010, 10:43:19 AM »
  But any profits, they will keep.

Which is the main problem of health care before and after the bill.  The good thing is that any type of success, you'll be able to slowly change things.
 

Matty

Re: Democrats pass health care reform bill
« Reply #25 on: March 24, 2010, 11:52:23 AM »
and m dogg stop trolling with the alex jones nonsense, we know you don't really agree with anything strongly against the status quo.

and we know alex jones makes wild speculations and doesn't really understand bigger picture or any solutions beyond 'conspiracies' and 'rising up'. but you can come to some similar conclusions regarding the future just by having a logical overview being pragamatic about the physical world and allocation of resources.

to be pro-establishment at this point in time is simply to be deluded or in denial. the very idea of things somehow righting themselves from anything resembling the current political/monetary system is fairy tales. it'll become unglued long before then...


virtuoso

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Re: Democrats pass health care reform bill
« Reply #26 on: March 24, 2010, 01:49:34 PM »

Yeah that was my point, that this is a distraction because it implements a system which can't be sustained but while the last taxes are being taken, they can portray this as something wonderful, while on the ground people more and more people will get increasingly poorer and then health will suffer, so then there will need to be bigger tax rises, more government intervention and more decisions on who lives and who dies. I hate to paint it in those stark terms because my life was saved courtesy of the social health system here and I wouldn't disagree that there are a lot of good caring people in the health service but the system itself is an altogether much more dangerous proposition.

However I guess if I was being absolutely pragmatic, I would say this is just another piece being picked off an already rotting carcass. I am not a libertarian per sa, I am conflicted somewhat because both alternatives being offered are much the same, the banks did all this and the banks are being given complete control and so this isn't changing. In fact I am not even going to say this is the beginning of the end, the demise is already well under way.

You don't need to paint it in the loud beligerent tones of alex jones or anyone else for that matter, to realise that things are completely fucked up. What would be interesting to note is who was it that lobbied for this? I think this notion that this is civilian servants (governments) vs big corporations (insurance companies) is more about romanticism and less about reality.
 

virtuoso

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Re: Democrats pass health care reform bill
« Reply #27 on: March 24, 2010, 01:58:43 PM »
Goddamnit its a shame....I don't want the US to fuck out and elano...you guys paint a depressing picture of the US future, but theres some good analysis here so respect all around.






Sure China is growing, but don't forget their government are so uptight...that is going to hold them back, keep companies from expanding there..



The US is still the world's largest economy (so says the CIA factbook)...its still dwarfes China...China would have to DOUBLE its economy to overtake the US. The US economy still dwarfs the fuck out of any country's economy. Only the EU (as a collective of many many countries) is bigger than the US.


http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/economics/article6996208.ece within about a decade at current rates, China will have overtaken America. Perhaps it will take a few more years, or even a few less years, it depends how rapidly the U.S decline is. What we know is that conservatively China has a surplus of over a trillion and America well who really knows the true debt figure. The U.S is a great innovator that is true, but it's the U.S companies who are based in China who are the juggernauts. You are right it is a very depressing picture, but then again under this current system there is nothing to feel jubilant or optimistic about, they giveth, then they taketh away.
 

Matty

Re: Democrats pass health care reform bill
« Reply #28 on: March 24, 2010, 02:54:48 PM »
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch/v/kk_1_SCEQKE" target="_blank" class="new_win">http://www.youtube.com/watch/v/kk_1_SCEQKE</a>

Javier

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Re: Democrats pass health care reform bill
« Reply #29 on: March 24, 2010, 03:34:53 PM »
Kucinich in principle wants more government involvement of the health care industry.  He actually settled for less.