Will anybody EVER step to the beatles?

[TraceOneInfinite Flat Earther 96']

i actually agree with hip hop is dead...to pass off your personal prefrences as fact is prejudice. To even go as far a to say that Jay-z cant have a cd called The Black Album beause Metallica does is borderline racist.. Which is kinda funny cause it was officially just self-titled(Metallica-Metallia) its called that only cause the cover is black. " there are better political figures out there in music than chuck d"...How do you prove such a statement? Hip Hop/Rap may not be a mature art form in your eyes but clearly around here it is. We all have diffrent tastes and opinions on music but thats all they are... Opinions. You want One persons veiw on whats right or wrong or what music is relevant move to China or N.Korea.

Word.  That's real.

What's sad is that these people equate growth and maturity with musical listening habits anyway.  Maturity is about many things, such as responsibility, upright character, moral values, leadership, patience, knowledge, character, discipline, knowledge of self, self-respect, respect for others, cultural awareness, many things, I don't see where Rock in Roll[/i] music fits into that list.

[Shallow]

yeah and you got to realize that just about everyone on this board are a bunch of 15 and 16 year olds and if they're ot 15 or 16 they still think they are


the thing about people like you is  YOU DON"T UNDERSTAND MUSIC  that isn't rap, all these kids running around saying "adults dont' understand hip hop that's why they don't like it" well the same applies for you too. i use to run around saying stupid shit like "fuck anything that has guitars and drums sets in it" but then as i got older i had an epiphany and got an open mind and now i'd rather listen to dark side of the moon rathe than listen to the chronic....i'd rather listen to the white album as opposed to jay-z's black album (metallica has the REAL black album btw)

it's about maturity, when i think about rap all it bascially is as a whole and from where it started from is party music, when it gets serious and deep it's applaudable and great  but you got to understand that there are deeper artists out there than 2pac, there are better political figures out there in music than chuck d, there are better word smiths than Rakim, there are better producers out there than dre and premo

This is a blatant fallacy, borderline racist, and definitely prejudice.  One becoming a more frequent listener of Rock and Roll music has absolutely nothing to do with one's "maturity".  In America, we have a deep history of racism that dates all the way back to commiting genocide on the Indians, to enslaving blacks, and the current war against Arabs.  If you notice the general nature of white men is distrust.  On the opposite extreme, sometimes African's trust too soon, and get taken advantage of.  Look at Africans, they are quick to permenantly accept other cultures, art forms, and ways of life.  A good example of this, is the fact that West Africa actually made it over to America before Spain. 

The West African Leader, Mansa Musa used to send many ships over to America, long before the genocides of Columbus.  But rather than conquering the indigenous natives, Africans mixed with the indigenous population, and there is proof of this in the history books, and still now today, Native American Indians have a history of West African words in their languages, proof is that some of our cities and states are named with names imported from West Africa and the Moors (Moreskos).  (California-Khalifa, Hon-o-lulu, Hawiai, Koran Lousiana, Mecca California, etc.)  Whites named these cities and states with the same names that the Native population was already using at that time. 

Yet, then you see the downside of African's natural instinct to trust other cultures.  The West Africans who were imported into America as slaves, you see now how they have accepted all the habits of drug abuse, alcoholism, classism, racism, from imitating their oppressor.  An example of this is when free slaves were given the oppurtunity to be leaders in Liberia, West Africa, and they treated the natives of that land, their former brothers and sisters and tribesmen, as inferior, and they were highly oppressive. This is the effects of the racism being projected onto them as African Americans.  There former brothers and sisters still living in places like Senegal, a major port city, show none of these characteristics that are prevelant in African Americans.

Now, through hip-hop culture (breaking, grafiti, dj, mc), African American's were able to carve their own culture out of the diaspora of America.  Rather than openly accepting this beautiful culture from African Americans, racist whites view it as an immature phase, and an inferior form of art.  They forget that it was these same African Americans that created Rock and Roll in the first place, before whites stole and manipulated that culture away from them.

I'm only being real.  That's cool that you love Rock and Roll, but please don't identify it as being the "mature" form of music.  This only displays either A) your lack of culture or B) the most shameful, fanatical, fawning, sycophantic love of whites. 

First off, I think a lot of the maturity the guy was speaking about was his ability to look past his original prejudice or non rap and accept it. It would be foolish to say that 70s rock as a whole is more mature than 80s hip hop as a whole.

Secondly, Mansa Musa, a Muslim leader, was theorized to have sent ships over North America, but the theories date back long before his existence. There is no absolute proof, but even if there was let's look at how it probably went down. Ships would go from Muslim Spain to North America. How did Muslims get into Spain? By taking over. I thought only white people did that? I must've been wrong.

You speak of the genocide that Columbus was a part of, what about the Armenian genocide that the Turks were responsible for? These were Muslims killing Christians, and it was hardly in defense. The Ottoman Empire had enslaved all of what used to be Eastern Rome and had done so for hundreds of years. Greece in the 1800s started a revolution and drove the Turks out, Armenia wasn't as lucky. Just before WWI the Turks murdered all high powered Armenians and proceeded with the genocide. How can this be? Non whites acting evil? They must've been brainwashed by the white way of life, right?

Seriously though, are you really stupid enough to believe that the human mind is different with in races?

Do you really think it is part of nature that causes whites to hate and non whites to love?

How many people do you think were slave owners in America?

[Trauma-san]

Hey Shallow, I've got a quote for ya... Jesus said don't cast your pearls before Swine. 

[Kill]

Seriously though, are you really stupid enough to believe that the humsan mind is different with in races?

Do you really think it is part of nature that causes whites to hate and non whites to love?

How many people do you think were slave owners in America?

you beat me to it

[TraceOneInfinite Flat Earther 96']

First off, I think a lot of the maturity the guy was speaking about was his ability to look past his original prejudice or non rap and accept it. It would be foolish to say that 70s rock as a whole is more mature than 80s hip hop as a whole.

Secondly, Mansa Musa, a Muslim leader, was theorized to have sent ships over North America, but the theories date back long before his existence. There is no absolute proof, but even if there was let's look at how it probably went down. Ships would go from Muslim Spain to North America. How did Muslims get into Spain? By taking over. I thought only white people did that? I must've been wrong.

You speak of the genocide that Columbus was a part of, what about the Armenian genocide that the Turks were responsible for? These were Muslims killing Christians, and it was hardly in defense. The Ottoman Empire had enslaved all of what used to be Eastern Rome and had done so for hundreds of years. Greece in the 1800s started a revolution and drove the Turks out, Armenia wasn't as lucky. Just before WWI the Turks murdered all high powered Armenians and proceeded with the genocide. How can this be? Non whites acting evil? They must've been brainwashed by the white way of life, right?

Seriously though, are you really stupid enough to believe that the human mind is different with in races?

Do you really think it is part of nature that causes whites to hate and non whites to love?

How many people do you think were slave owners in America?

You can take all of that to Train of Thought, I'm not interested in talking to anybody at this forum about anything but hip-hop music.  Someone dissed hip-hop music and claimed that they were more mature now because they listened to Rock&Roll, so I had to set the record straight, that's it.  I'm only here for the music, peace.

[Shallow]

First off, I think a lot of the maturity the guy was speaking about was his ability to look past his original prejudice or non rap and accept it. It would be foolish to say that 70s rock as a whole is more mature than 80s hip hop as a whole.

Secondly, Mansa Musa, a Muslim leader, was theorized to have sent ships over North America, but the theories date back long before his existence. There is no absolute proof, but even if there was let's look at how it probably went down. Ships would go from Muslim Spain to North America. How did Muslims get into Spain? By taking over. I thought only white people did that? I must've been wrong.

You speak of the genocide that Columbus was a part of, what about the Armenian genocide that the Turks were responsible for? These were Muslims killing Christians, and it was hardly in defense. The Ottoman Empire had enslaved all of what used to be Eastern Rome and had done so for hundreds of years. Greece in the 1800s started a revolution and drove the Turks out, Armenia wasn't as lucky. Just before WWI the Turks murdered all high powered Armenians and proceeded with the genocide. How can this be? Non whites acting evil? They must've been brainwashed by the white way of life, right?

Seriously though, are you really stupid enough to believe that the human mind is different with in races?

Do you really think it is part of nature that causes whites to hate and non whites to love?

How many people do you think were slave owners in America?

You can take all of that to Train of Thought, I'm not interested in talking to anybody at this forum about anything but hip-hop music.  Someone dissed hip-hop music and claimed that they were more mature now because they listened to Rock&Roll, so I had to set the record straight, that's it.  I'm only here for the music, peace.

You brought it up moron, not me. I always that you were stupid, but now I lost respect for your stupidity, because you can't even stand behind it. Just stop posting if your going to bring up stupid arguments and then run off on technicalities when someone proves you wrong.

[MidoriHaze]

hrm... my opinion..

Well to be honest and go against the flow of the topic, The Beatles had their moments, but for my taste in music they kinda bored me, actually preferred The Stones. However for any group that can achieve as many #1 hits as they did, i respect them.

Music wise they probably were the most influencial, individually they weren't the greatest (i.e. John Bonham > Ringo Starr, Hendrix was a better guitarist etc etc), however together they were able to pull off this combination of amazing talent that a lot of other .

There's also another factor that plays into it... Time-Related Bias. When one group emerges on to and creates a scene of mass influence it's hard for to people to try and see past comparing new artists to old artists.

Another factor that has to been compared is the music diversity of back in 60's to the present. Now days there's so many different forms of genres and sub genres that exist that it would be hard for a new band to come up and ster people away to an exclusive type of music. For example back in the 60's The Beatles didn't have to compete with a wide music diversity, i.e. punk, rap, metal, etc did not exist. So when a group comes along with a mixture of talent and doesn't have to compete with as many different styles of music as there is today, then it's going to be hard for people to ignore them.

I guess that could be likened to Nirvana's success, when they came through with the so called "grunge" sound, they basically decreased the amount of metal/hard rock music along with a change in pop music and with an anthem of Teen Spirit it's hard to ignore them. Not by any means am I saying it was easy for The Beatles to gain popularity, but i think it's a reason why it's hard for bands today to outshine.

As for still being classes into todays standards there are plenty of groups that have with stood the test of time. i.e. Led Zeppelin/Jimi Hendrix - over 35yrs, Black Sabbath - almost 35yrs, The Eagles - over 32yrs, AC/DC - over 30yrs, U2 - almost 25yrs, Metallica - over 20yrs, Nirvana - over 15yrs, etc etc. But it's hard to compare these to The Beatles because only time holds the answers to which turned out bigger.

I think the biggest disaster in music was the progression into industry made music, along with girl/boy-bands and the new era of that emo shit.

I can't remember the exact quote or who said (maybe someone might know) but it went something along the lines of "trying to review music is like trying to teach architects to dance" .. basically saying it's pointless. If you told a die-hard Metallica fan that The Beatles are better than their favourite group they'd probably tell you to fuck off.

Because in the end their greatness is all a matter of opinions, and there are no right or wrong opinions. However their influences are more a measure of their talent, however one band that is influencial upon another doesn't neccessarily make them greater. In some cases it does, but not always.

Music is what it is...

[white Boy]

john bonham is sick.. is he considered one of the best ever?

[Shallow]

john bonham is sick.. is he considered one of the best ever?

Yes he is.

[white Boy]

john bonham is sick.. is he considered one of the best ever?

Yes he is.

damn, thats sick, Plant, Page, and Bonham, all some of the best in their "field".. amazing band

[Trauma-san]

Well, not really Plant.  Of course he had a great voice, but I think the guy's a loser myself.  Page and Bonham were incredible. 

[white Boy]

Well, not really Plant. Of course he had a great voice, but I think the guy's a loser myself. Page and Bonham were incredible.

who cares about the guy himself if his voice is great...

[white Boy]

lets bring this bitch back 1 more time ...
to luke .. ive recently got more into death cab for cutie, i like the guys voice, and musicaly they are above average, but they are not inovative,
and can someone tell me some solo beatles shit, i got imagine but lennon, wats some other great albums

[Lincoln]

and can someone tell me some solo beatles shit

Get Paul's Band On The Run and both George and Ringo's self titled albums.

[ColdManey]

JIMI HENDRIX - Greatest Rock Musician of all time. Come on, he changed the sound of rock forever. And if you wanna talk about pure talent, this is a man who never learned to even read music. Just pure natural talent and vision. I aint a Beatles fan, but I respect them for the contributions they made, but they cant compare to Jimi.