Author Topic: German Defense Minister zu Guttenberg resigns over plagiarism.  (Read 620 times)

Fraxxx

Until now on over 82% of the pages of his dissertation unmarked parts from other's works have been found. How could a dissertation like this get rated with "summa cum laude". Hmm, well, that arrogant aristocratic fuck's family has donated over 750.000€ over different channels. Also he is a member of the American Council on Germany (ACG), the American Academy, the Council on Foreign Relations (CFR) and its German offshoot the Deutsche Gesellschaft für Auswärtige Politik (German Society for Foreign Politics).

Unless all this shit many Germans still think he's one of the most credible political figures. Will he return to a major political function? Go figure...
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Furor Teutonicus

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Re: German Defense Minister zu Guttenberg resigns over plagiarism.
« Reply #1 on: March 02, 2011, 08:51:23 AM »
I think the rest of the world doesn't care ;)


Was about time... Fuck this faker
 

7even

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Re: German Defense Minister zu Guttenberg resigns over plagiarism.
« Reply #2 on: March 02, 2011, 02:54:45 PM »
I don't care really, as a conservative csu-supporter I still prefer him over any politician I know.. all that fake ass "science" shit is bs anyways. it's all about prestige, many rich, influential or accomplished people get their dissertations written by someone else, it's nothing new really. it's just that guttenberg is about 100x more interesting than them.
Cause I don't care where I belong no more
What we share or not I will ignore
And I won't waste my time fitting in
Cause I don't think contrast is a sin
No, it's not a sin
 

Fraxxx

Re: German Defense Minister zu Guttenberg resigns over plagiarism.
« Reply #3 on: March 02, 2011, 04:31:36 PM »
I don't care really, as a conservative csu-supporter I still prefer him over any politician I know.. all that fake ass "science" shit is bs anyways. it's all about prestige, many rich, influential or accomplished people get their dissertations written by someone else, it's nothing new really. it's just that guttenberg is about 100x more interesting than them.

Shit, really? So you think him being "interesting" makes up for being the blueprint of an elitist who gives two fucks about you or me? Did he do anything you'd consider to be positive?

all that fake ass "science" shit is bs anyways. And what's this supposed to mean? :)
i don´t need any medicate shit im 100 normal.
 

7even

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Re: German Defense Minister zu Guttenberg resigns over plagiarism.
« Reply #4 on: March 02, 2011, 04:53:20 PM »
I don't care really, as a conservative csu-supporter I still prefer him over any politician I know.. all that fake ass "science" shit is bs anyways. it's all about prestige, many rich, influential or accomplished people get their dissertations written by someone else, it's nothing new really. it's just that guttenberg is about 100x more interesting than them.

Shit, really? So you think him being "interesting" makes up for being the blueprint of an elitist who gives two fucks about you or me? Did he do anything you'd consider to be positive?

all that fake ass "science" shit is bs anyways. And what's this supposed to mean? :)

The point is that it is not about science at all and never was. People who pretend that dissertations like that one are somehow contributing to science and make the world a better place are blatantly fooling themselves. The Dr. title (and pretty much any Phd for that matter) exists mostly for prestige reasons, not for science. No real doctor needs a dissertation about some random ass topic to heal anyone. He needs it to get patients because doctors without one aren't taken seriously.
As for politicians, most of them don't show their dissertation to the public because they know it's mostly bullshit. Maybe most of them don't blatantly buy their summa cum laude like Guttenberg did, but come on, pretty much NONE of them actually contributed anything to "science" by writing it.

I also greatly prefer an elitist aristocrat over a leftist socialist, but that's just me. The thing that mainly bothers me is the fake madness of people who pretend to believe that science got a bad name now or something. To even call dissertations about inane unwordly topics "science" is ridiculous from the get-go. Many people with Dr. Dr. Prof. Prof. hc. hc. hc. didn't really write most of their later stuff themselves, but got it written by assistants. Many rich students get their dissertations written by other people. It's nothing new, nothing surprising, nothing crazy. It happens all the time and it also gets proven frequently, it's just that in Guttenberg's case the liberal media is all on his nuts, whereas with other, much less interesting people, noone cares.

The whole incident is unfortunate in my point of view because Guttenberg is or was the only conservative German politician with a future. Merkel is basically a social democrat at heart, "CDU" is just her career tag. Apart from that, he can speak English unlike most of our politicians, he knows how to sell himself, looks good and talks well - he's no dull ass politically correct grey-suit wearing wussbag like most in the Kabinett Merkel II are. And yes, that DOES matter.
Anywho, what he did in abandoning the Wehrpflicht and his general ambitions regarding the Bundeswehr is more than any minister of defense did in decades. It's all something leftist parties always wanted, never dared to actually do and now that a conservative does it - they bitch about it. Usual bullshit.

And he might not give a shit about you and me - then again, who the hell does? Gabriel for Kanzler in 2013?  :-X :-X
« Last Edit: March 02, 2011, 04:56:34 PM by 7even »
Cause I don't care where I belong no more
What we share or not I will ignore
And I won't waste my time fitting in
Cause I don't think contrast is a sin
No, it's not a sin
 

Furor Teutonicus

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Re: German Defense Minister zu Guttenberg resigns over plagiarism.
« Reply #5 on: March 03, 2011, 01:38:13 AM »
I don't care really, as a conservative csu-supporter I still prefer him over any politician I know.. all that fake ass "science" shit is bs anyways. it's all about prestige, many rich, influential or accomplished people get their dissertations written by someone else, it's nothing new really. it's just that guttenberg is about 100x more interesting than them.

Shit, really? So you think him being "interesting" makes up for being the blueprint of an elitist who gives two fucks about you or me? Did he do anything you'd consider to be positive?

all that fake ass "science" shit is bs anyways. And what's this supposed to mean? :)

The point is that it is not about science at all and never was. People who pretend that dissertations like that one are somehow contributing to science and make the world a better place are blatantly fooling themselves. The Dr. title (and pretty much any Phd for that matter) exists mostly for prestige reasons, not for science. No real doctor needs a dissertation about some random ass topic to heal anyone. He needs it to get patients because doctors without one aren't taken seriously.
As for politicians, most of them don't show their dissertation to the public because they know it's mostly bullshit. Maybe most of them don't blatantly buy their summa cum laude like Guttenberg did, but come on, pretty much NONE of them actually contributed anything to "science" by writing it.

I also greatly prefer an elitist aristocrat over a leftist socialist, but that's just me. The thing that mainly bothers me is the fake madness of people who pretend to believe that science got a bad name now or something. To even call dissertations about inane unwordly topics "science" is ridiculous from the get-go. Many people with Dr. Dr. Prof. Prof. hc. hc. hc. didn't really write most of their later stuff themselves, but got it written by assistants. Many rich students get their dissertations written by other people. It's nothing new, nothing surprising, nothing crazy. It happens all the time and it also gets proven frequently, it's just that in Guttenberg's case the liberal media is all on his nuts, whereas with other, much less interesting people, noone cares.

The whole incident is unfortunate in my point of view because Guttenberg is or was the only conservative German politician with a future. Merkel is basically a social democrat at heart, "CDU" is just her career tag. Apart from that, he can speak English unlike most of our politicians, he knows how to sell himself, looks good and talks well - he's no dull ass politically correct grey-suit wearing wussbag like most in the Kabinett Merkel II are. And yes, that DOES matter.
Anywho, what he did in abandoning the Wehrpflicht and his general ambitions regarding the Bundeswehr is more than any minister of defense did in decades. It's all something leftist parties always wanted, never dared to actually do and now that a conservative does it - they bitch about it. Usual bullshit.

And he might not give a shit about you and me - then again, who the hell does? Gabriel for Kanzler in 2013?  :-X :-X

Of course they have no interest in science, we all know that his university career was for his political prestige. Still I can't accept that 70% of his dissertation are fake.
It's not only that he cheated but his behaviour afterwards that made him a persona non grata for me. First he calls all allegations bullshit, then he speaks about 'mistakes', then he wants to rest his title temporary ( :loco:), and last Wednesday he still tells infront of the Bundestag that he never cheated intentionally, to a time where over 100 plagiarized pages are already discovered. How stupid is this guy? Fuck this liar.

His only qualification is that he knows how to present himself. He is and always was a fake. The rest was all hype from the Bild to promote his  plebeian tribune, and the people fall for it. :-\
What did he actually do to justify his popularity aside from PR-trips to Afgahnistan with his hot wife? He was the first to call it a war, wow, super achievment. And because of that he already was the new messias. Ok, Bundeswehrreform, we'll see what comes out of that. But it's good that the times of the Wehrpflicht seem to be over.

But yeah, Gabriel for Kanzler is a horrific scenario. But which is not? I'm from Rheinland-Pfalz where Kurt Beck is Ministerpräsident, there's nothing that can shock me anymore.

Yeah, Guttenberg is a competent minister ::)



Look how arrogant he is. He is popular within the army, I'll give him that. Maybe he should act as an mascot for the troops, like Bob Hope or sth. He could take his hot wife with him. They are destined to provide entertainment for the troops. This is also a great way to serve the country.
Or maybe a reality show about the Guttenbergs in Afgahnistan? They can count on the support of RTl II and Bild.
You see, the Guttenbergs have a future, just not in politics I hope.
« Last Edit: March 03, 2011, 01:54:50 AM by still not decided »
 

Fraxxx

Re: German Defense Minister zu Guttenberg resigns over plagiarism.
« Reply #6 on: March 03, 2011, 04:16:30 AM »
"Ok, Bundeswehrreform, we'll see what comes out of that. But it's good that the times of the Wehrpflicht seem to be over."

Agree with you on everything else but this. This shit brings us just on step nearer to U.S. type conditions. The Bundeswehr will soon consist of exclusevly the poor and undereducated
Plus they said it had to be done for cost matters, now they say they'll need extra money for it. smh
i don´t need any medicate shit im 100 normal.
 

7even

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Re: German Defense Minister zu Guttenberg resigns over plagiarism.
« Reply #7 on: March 03, 2011, 08:35:21 AM »
Well, everybody lies. You guys did too in the past, I'm sure. Everybody always talks about how politicians do nothing but lie, then when Guttenberg is proven to be a liar everybody acts shocked as if politicians would never lie.

Let's be real, this whole incident is mainly about if you like Guttenberg/aristocratic and conservative tendacies or if you hate it all from the beginning. The press and the people would have behaved completely different if, say, Gysi, Trittin or Steinmeier were caught with a ghostwritten dissertation.

Fact is this: the Süddeutsche Zeitung is a leftist liberal paper who always wanted to bring down politicians like Koch and now Guttenberg. I'm sure they had the information about the dissertation for a long time and waited for the perfect moment to release it.

For a politician who's only been relatively powerful for like 3-4 years, Guttenberg has done a lot more than the average known politician.

The leftist media and leftist intellectuals have always hated him, because he represents absolutely everything they loath. Aristocratic, born rich, hot wife with prominent heritage, blue blood, good looks, conservative party, arrogance, able to mobilize the masses, support for German soldiers, doesn't like criminals, etc etc.. basically anything a leftist would hate. The smear campaign against him has a lot more to do with those factors than with plagiarism in science.

I personally am disappointed of course. I was pretty impressed that he did a summa cum laude dissertation while having young kids and getting into politics. I'm also disappointed by how he handled the situation - granted it was a situation that was very difficult to handle. Deep down Merkel and Seehofer are probably relieved because they were fucking afraid of his success. He had no true supporters because everybody knew that he could be the top dog very soon if it wasn't for a major scandal. Well, now they have it. Let's see where German politics go from now... either way one thing I know for sure: Merkel doesn't have a backbone, neither do politicians who aren't conservative. If Merkel or some SPD-politician is leading us through that European crisis, we gonna end up giving all our money to countries who hate us. We are also gonna keep having young foreigners beat people into a coma without anyone doing anything about it. Guttenberg was the only successful politician who would have opposed to those things, and now he's gone over a bought Dr. title. Makes me sad.
« Last Edit: March 03, 2011, 08:37:28 AM by 7even »
Cause I don't care where I belong no more
What we share or not I will ignore
And I won't waste my time fitting in
Cause I don't think contrast is a sin
No, it's not a sin
 

Furor Teutonicus

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Re: German Defense Minister zu Guttenberg resigns over plagiarism.
« Reply #8 on: March 03, 2011, 10:57:20 AM »
Well, everybody lies. You guys did too in the past, I'm sure. Everybody always talks about how politicians do nothing but lie, then when Guttenberg is proven to be a liar everybody acts shocked as if politicians would never lie.

Let's be real, this whole incident is mainly about if you like Guttenberg/aristocratic and conservative tendacies or if you hate it all from the beginning. The press and the people would have behaved completely different if, say, Gysi, Trittin or Steinmeier were caught with a ghostwritten dissertation.

Fact is this: the Süddeutsche Zeitung is a leftist liberal paper who always wanted to bring down politicians like Koch and now Guttenberg. I'm sure they had the information about the dissertation for a long time and waited for the perfect moment to release it.

For a politician who's only been relatively powerful for like 3-4 years, Guttenberg has done a lot more than the average known politician.

The leftist media and leftist intellectuals have always hated him, because he represents absolutely everything they loath. Aristocratic, born rich, hot wife with prominent heritage, blue blood, good looks, conservative party, arrogance, able to mobilize the masses, support for German soldiers, doesn't like criminals, etc etc.. basically anything a leftist would hate. The smear campaign against him has a lot more to do with those factors than with plagiarism in science.

I personally am disappointed of course. I was pretty impressed that he did a summa cum laude dissertation while having young kids and getting into politics. I'm also disappointed by how he handled the situation - granted it was a situation that was very difficult to handle. Deep down Merkel and Seehofer are probably relieved because they were fucking afraid of his success. He had no true supporters because everybody knew that he could be the top dog very soon if it wasn't for a major scandal. Well, now they have it. Let's see where German politics go from now... either way one thing I know for sure: Merkel doesn't have a backbone, neither do politicians who aren't conservative. If Merkel or some SPD-politician is leading us through that European crisis, we gonna end up giving all our money to countries who hate us. We are also gonna keep having young foreigners beat people into a coma without anyone doing anything about it. Guttenberg was the only successful politician who would have opposed to those things, and now he's gone over a bought Dr. title. Makes me sad.

Sorry, but his behaviour was pathetic. Basta. I can only speak for myself but if Gysi, Trittin or Steinmeier would do this I would want to see them go too. I never understood the hype surrounding him, but I didn't despise him until now. This has nothing to do with my political attitude. I don't like Roth, Gabriel or Trittin, and yeah I don't like Guttenberg, but I was pretty neutral until now, or better said I didn't care that much about him.
Yeah Guttenberg is a red rag for the left media, but he only has to blame himself. The manipulation of the BILD is way more disgusting. They act like a German Fox to everything Guttenberg related.
And lol @ thinking Guttenberg would have the balls to oppose our European policy. With Guttenberg, we would be bitch of the USA anyway.
« Last Edit: March 03, 2011, 11:04:50 AM by still not decided »
 

jeromechickenbone

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Re: German Defense Minister zu Guttenberg resigns over plagiarism.
« Reply #9 on: March 05, 2011, 02:24:00 PM »
I don't know the intricacies of Germany's govt...I know enough about Merkel to have an idea though, and judging by this guys background with CFR and similar associations tells me all I need to know...sounds like NWO swine to me. Trust me, plagiarizing his dissertation is an absolute joke compared to what agendas he likely supports.