Pac & Dre

[k-dogg]

Tupac was DeathRow?? Damn, the ultimate Tupac Groupie. I will give u the fact that he initially helped to elevate Deathrow's visibility and sales and whatever and I will give u points on pointing out that Pac was always outspoken before and after DR. Having said that, when someone especially someone as powerful and connected (at that time) as Suge Knight buys you out of prison, sets u up with a recording contract and all that comes with that (even though u know there is a payback down the road), you are BOUGHT AND  PAID FOR FOOL. That's right, hard for u Tupac groupies to accept but everyone has a price even Pac especially when it comes to being bailed out of prison with a brand new recording contract.. It would have been ok to have an opinion on Dre or whatever but dude was way over the top. I mean dude just came to the damn company. Tupac was DR...Fuck outta here. That is some disrespectful shit that could only come from a Pac Groupie, as if DR was nothing before Pac. Now as far as me putting Eazy in the same category as the rest of them other dudes, perhaps u are right about that. Who knows how that might have turned out. 

[Jimmy H.]

I don't think Pac was Suge's puppet but I think he felt a loyalty to Suge and Frank Alexander has more or less confirmed that there was never a personal issue between Pac and Dre prior to Dre leaving the label outside of him not being in the studio. I've heard so many conflicting stories from so many people that it's hard to tell but again, what is weird is there is more of a feel for why Dre and Pac clashed then why Suge and Dre have problems.

An interesting tidbit from a Bruce Williams interview though was Dre was supposedly going to extend an olive branch to Suge to end their beef before the Vibe incident happened.

[V2DHeart]

^that's a nice story but wtf!!! We're supposed to believe your paragraph on what happened over anyone elses? Lol, were you there? Source or get out.

You don't have to believe anything I say. You can choose to believe that Suge bullied Dr Dre into handing over beats - the majority thesis on this thread, or any other theory you want to believe in

[Triple OG Rapsodie]

^that's a nice story but wtf!!! We're supposed to believe your paragraph on what happened over anyone elses? Lol, were you there? Source or get out.

You don't have to believe anything I say. You can choose to believe that Suge bullied Dr Dre into handing over beats - the majority thesis on this thread, or any other theory you want to believe in

I'd rather hear it from someone who was there, rather than fanboys imagining what went down on dubcc. Lol @ you acting like you know what happened.

[krzieg]

^that's a nice story but wtf!!! We're supposed to believe your paragraph on what happened over anyone elses? Lol, were you there? Source or get out.

You don't have to believe anything I say. You can choose to believe that Suge bullied Dr Dre into handing over beats - the majority thesis on this thread, or any other theory you want to believe in

I'd rather hear it from someone who was there, rather than fanboys imagining what went down on dubcc. Lol @ you acting like you know what happened.

[love33]

I'm takin my information from the "Welcome to Death Row" DVD -- Go watch that one (it's biased against Death Row, but they have some great insight and footage) and also watch the "Death Row Uncut" DVD (biased for Death Row obviously) -- The key here is the interview that Tupac did with KMEL Radio in the Bay Area, he explains the whole situation and calls Dre out.  Anyone who wants insight on this story don't listen to me or some groupie trying to act like Dre and Pac were cool, go hear it from Pac himself on that DVD he comes out and actually explains it and says that Dre wasn't doing shit and he is a bomb producer, but wasn't makin any of the beats, wasn't showin up to the studio while he was out reppin the label.



"He wasn't producing shit...Other niggaz was doin the beats..and Dre was given credit...And I gotta go on MTV and say 'yeah he did this he did that'..No he ain't do it....He is a dope producer but he ain' worked in years...I got tired of that...He's ownin the company...suckin dick and eattin pussy...and I'm out here in the streets whoppin niggaz ass....puttin it down droppin albums....this nigga was takin 3 years to do one song...I couldn't have it"

He called him a homo and dissed him hardcore when they were doin the video shoot for Toss It Up with K-Ci and JoJo from Jodeci

Case closed

[NoobCake]

And who told him to say all that shit?  His owner Suge Knight.  Tupac WAS his own man before death row.  With Suge he became his servant, slave, lackey, catcher, property, and yes BITCH.  People who knew him before death row ( Shock G, Money B, Treach, etc) all said he changed completely once Suge became his slave master.  There's an interview with Shock about it from some documentary that's on youtube.

[k-dogg]

Case Closed?? Not hardly. Oh because "Tupac Said"?? Please. Like I said before ...You act like DR did not exist before Pac came. I really don't care what Tupac said in a DVD. Perhaps if Suge had listened to Dre in the first place, (never signed Pac for one thing) and took into account Dre's vision for the company considering he was supposedly part-owner (wink), somehow DR might have survived in one form or another. Once again, Suge's puppet, perhaps not but Bought and Paid for, damn right he was. It was none of his business what Dre produced or did not produce before he came aboard. That was between Dre and Suge. Alot of work and sacrifice was put into building DR and Tupac was NOT a part of that. If I am looking for a top notch rapper, give me Pac but if I am running a record label, give me Dre all day  cause of his historic production and vision. What successful label did Pac ever have a hand in running??

[Jimmy H.]

I'm takin my information from the "Welcome to Death Row" DVD -- Go watch that one (it's biased against Death Row, but they have some great insight and footage) and also watch the "Death Row Uncut" DVD (biased for Death Row obviously) -- The key here is the interview that Tupac did with KMEL Radio in the Bay Area, he explains the whole situation and calls Dre out.  Anyone who wants insight on this story don't listen to me or some groupie trying to act like Dre and Pac were cool, go hear it from Pac himself on that DVD he comes out and actually explains it and says that Dre wasn't doing shit and he is a bomb producer, but wasn't makin any of the beats, wasn't showin up to the studio while he was out reppin the label.



"He wasn't producing shit...Other niggaz was doin the beats..and Dre was given credit...And I gotta go on MTV and say 'yeah he did this he did that'..No he ain't do it....He is a dope producer but he ain' worked in years...I got tired of that...He's ownin the company...suckin dick and eattin pussy...and I'm out here in the streets whoppin niggaz ass....puttin it down droppin albums....this nigga was takin 3 years to do one song...I couldn't have it"

He called him a homo and dissed him hardcore when they were doin the video shoot for Toss It Up with K-Ci and JoJo from Jodeci

Case closed

That to me is artist-level P.R. You're gonna go full-out on a guy for being lazy? It's not gonna be bitterness some 15 years later between certain camps if it's just over Dre sitting home and not contributing.

[love33]

And who told him to say all that shit?  His owner Suge Knight.  Tupac WAS his own man before death row.  With Suge he became his servant, slave, lackey, catcher, property, and yes BITCH.  People who knew him before death row ( Shock G, Money B, Treach, etc) all said he changed completely once Suge became his slave master.  There's an interview with Shock about it from some documentary that's on youtube.

I don't understand how you could try to paint Pac out to be some sort of mindless "Yes Man" dude always gave 100 and spoke from the heart.  People forget that Dr. Dre, as great as a producer as he is, was going through a personality change.  When the original Chronic came out, he was percieved as a badass much like Pac, and he was running around beefing with Luke, Tim Dog, Eazy-E -- he got in trouble for slappin some woman, and he was carryin around guns and even posed with them on magazines.  So he all of a sudden decides he doesn't want to do that anymore that was a complete personality change -- fair enough, but why couldn't he produce some tracks for Tupac and the other Row artists?  And Tupac said he was supposeably lieing to the media about what tracks Dre produced when someone else was really producing them (Daz? DJ Pooh? Johnny J?).  And proven by us waiting over 10 years for Detox, was Pac lyin when he said it takes Dre forever to complete a project?

Also, ask yourself this question.  Why did everyone side with Tupac and nobody stood up for Dre, including Snoop, who was the second biggest artist after Pac.  So you had all these artists -- Snoop, Daz, Kurupt, Hammer, Nate Dogg, OFTB, Bad Azz, Trey D, The Outlawz, Danny Boy, and some of the lesser known artists and you didn't see any of them siding with Dre when this all went down.  Snoop didn't patch it up with Dre until he went to Master P's No Limit Records.  So how was Pac bein a "yes man" when none of the other artists disagreed with him or ran to Dre who was part-owner at the time?  Artists can say whatever they want now, but at the time when this was goin down nobody ran to Dre's side.  Wouldn't that tell you that either Pac was speakin the real truth or Dre really wasn't doin shit for the label (which is what Pac was sayin)?

[NoobCake]

Again, this is not just me saying this.  People who were close to tupac before death row have said the same things repeatedly.  I don't remember anyone other than tupac choosing any sides at that time, but even if they did of course they would side with Suge.  They were signed to death row.  Suge was their slave master at that time. 
As it turns out we now know that the only person who was his own man an that label was Dre.  Everybody else was just content to suck Suge's cock.

[Jimmy H.]

Also, ask yourself this question.  Why did everyone side with Tupac and nobody stood up for Dre, including Snoop, who was the second biggest artist after Pac.  So you had all these artists -- Snoop, Daz, Kurupt, Hammer, Nate Dogg, OFTB, Bad Azz, Trey D, The Outlawz, Danny Boy, and some of the lesser known artists and you didn't see any of them siding with Dre when this all went down.  Snoop didn't patch it up with Dre until he went to Master P's No Limit Records.  So how was Pac bein a "yes man" when none of the other artists disagreed with him or ran to Dre who was part-owner at the time?  Artists can say whatever they want now, but at the time when this was goin down nobody ran to Dre's side.  Wouldn't that tell you that either Pac was speakin the real truth or Dre really wasn't doin shit for the label (which is what Pac was sayin)?

None of these artists oustide of the people already closer affiliated with Suge or Pac were siding with anyone. They were friends with Pac and artists on Suge's label but it wasn't like it was in their best interests to go out of their way to big up Dre when they were on Death Row. If you look at Pac's last months, many people say him and Snoop weren't even cool with one another. I don't think Pac would have even been in the position to judge what Dre's role was. By the time he was at Death Row, Dre was already removed from that enviroment. And Snoop actually patched things up with Dre while he was still on Death Row. The track, "Zoom", which ended up being a Dre collabo with LL Cool J was actually originally going to be a Dre-Snoop reunion track but Death Row wouldn't clear any of their artists to work with him. It's not a secret how all these artists who jumped from Death Row like Nate Dogg and Kurupt suddenly found themselves working with Dr. Dre again almost immediately. I think if you look at the mind state of those artists at the time, it was that they were still locked into deals with Death Row. Whoever was going to work with Dre, left with him right away, and the only guy who tried to be friendly with both (Sam Sneed) ended up getting his ass kicked at a label meeting. Like I said, nothing publicly said at the time adds up to what was going on. If it was Suge's decision for Dre to leave the label which Pac claimed in the interview you brought up, why does Pac say he "jumped ship" on Toss It Up? You're not gonna force a guy off the label and threaten violence against him and everyone involved with his team based strictly on the kind of stuff Tupac was claiming he did. There's HUGE sections of this story missing... and maybe Suge and Tupac were right but to me, it seems like Pac and Dre were just in two very different stages of their lives. Pac was thriving off of beef and Dre had had enough of it.

[Lucifuge]

Just because "Tupac Said"?? Please... Mobb Deep's said that he was raped in jail, how bout that? case closed, pac was fucked in the ass...

[Triple OG Rapsodie]

Again, this is not just me saying this.  People who were close to tupac before death row have said the same things repeatedly.  I don't remember anyone other than tupac choosing any sides at that time, but even if they did of course they would side with Suge.  They were signed to death row.  Suge was their slave master at that time.  
As it turns out we now know that the only person who was his own man an that label was Dre.  Everybody else was just content to suck Suge's cock.

lmao are you a Dre stan as well? Lol @ Dre being his own man when he's the one who got fucked over the most at Death Row. He lost half of an extremely successful company and all the rights to the music he created because he was too chickenshit to stand up to Suge. I mean damn the guy could've at least sold his stake in Death Row. For someone who's all about the money he must've been scared shitless to give all that up.

Everyone else at Death Row might've lost the rights to their music, but Dre lost the company HE created and made. He was Suge's bitch to the fullest more than any of those dudes. And now apparently he's Jimmy's bitch as well. At least he's a rich bitch tho right?

[NoobCake]

Again, this is not just me saying this.  People who were close to tupac before death row have said the same things repeatedly.  I don't remember anyone other than tupac choosing any sides at that time, but even if they did of course they would side with Suge.  They were signed to death row.  Suge was their slave master at that time.  
As it turns out we now know that the only person who was his own man an that label was Dre.  Everybody else was just content to suck Suge's cock.

lmao are you a Dre stan as well? Lol @ Dre being his own man when he's the one who got fucked over the most at Death Row. He lost half of an extremely successful company and all the rights to the music he created because he was too chickenshit to stand up to Suge. I mean damn the guy could've at least sold his stake in Death Row. For someone who's all about the money he must've been scared shitless to give all that up.

Everyone else at Death Row might've lost the rights to their music, but Dre lost the company HE created and made. He was Suge's bitch to the fullest more than any of those dudes. And now apparently he's Jimmy's bitch as well. At least he's a rich bitch tho right?

When you're sure of yourself and know who you are and what you can do it's ok to lose one battle.  Dre won the war.  Suge is broke and is getting punched out in cheap clubs, the former death row dick riders are all either dead or broke.  So who won?