Author Topic: Religious Brainwashing  (Read 224 times)

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Religious Brainwashing
« on: June 05, 2002, 02:25:37 AM »
Don't be too offended by the heading, please read what i have to say first.

My point is, from birth, most babies these days are christend or baptised when they are only a few months old, even by families who are not religious and don't go to church, my first point is, why bother christening them if u have no intention of teaching them to follow a certain religion? why not leave it up to them to decide?

Secondly, take a jewish man for example, i saw one on sum bollox talk show my mum was watching once, and he said that he would not marry any woman and that he wanted to marry a jewish woman so that his kids could be jewish. i think that is wrong, because the child is circumcised and baptised (or whatever jews do) at birth, and i can think of no betta way to put it than the child is 'brainwashed' from the moment they can speak. the way i was brought up is, that i was allowed to hear 2 sides of a story, then decide what i wanted to believe for myself. but with religious families, no disrespect to them, but from a young age thry are told what they're parents want them to hear, so they never really have the chance to hear what else they can believe, so by the time they are old enough to understand properly that other people have different views, they already strongly believe what their parents have taught them.

now most ppl who arn't going to agree with me at all will be religious themselves, and one of the main reasons u will be disagreeing is because u believe strongly in ur religions, that were taught to u from birth, proving my point, although a lot of people might well have decided for themselves.

and lastly, i just want to ask u religious people, would u let your child hear 2 sides of a story, or would u only marry a woman / man, who even have a family of the same religion so that u could 'force' that particular religion on your child. one place u could at this is the film 'east is east,' although a very funny film, most aspects of it are tru, whereby the mother is aithiest and the father is a muslim, and it causes problems because the kids don't want to be muslims, which doesn't bother their mother, but bothers the father because he wants them to be muslims, and the film shows that although many ppl call the muslim children/teenagers, it isn't always what they want, but what their father and his family is forcing upon them. and another thing is with pakistani muslims living in england, like shown on the film, the children are brought up around a whole community of whites with little religion who can basically do as they plz in life and can enjoy it, and they are the only muslims in the community with their father 'MAKING' them follow pakistani traditions, but like they say to they're father, they are ENGLISH, and they want to be like they're english friends. they were born in england, and everyone they know is english, so they too want to be regarded as english and not as 'the pakiz from the chippy.'

what a father like this needs to realise, and it's happening everywhere might i add, is that if they live in a place where religion is not enforced, then the children should have that choice to grow up the same.

the way my life has been is: my mother never christened me, she let me hear one thing religious, then contradicting things from sum1 who isn't religious, but at a young age when all my friends had been baptised from birth, i felt left out and asked if i cud be, to which my mam and dad sed no, because i wasn't old enough to make that decision in their eyes, and i am glad i was given that choice. but unlike the family in 'east is east' my family think no less of me as a so called 'aithiest' than if i was a christian, they let me have that choice and let me decide for myself what i wanted to believe, and it's no problem to them whatsoever, just as long as i respect their beliefs they respect mine.

anyways, just wanna know what u think on these kinds of mattaz, and whether u think it is right to only let a child hear what u want them to hear, rather than letting them decide what they want for themselves. and i don't mean any disrespect to anyone religious up in here, so no beef or arguments plz!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by 1034398800 »
 

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Re: Religious Brainwashing
« Reply #1 on: June 05, 2002, 03:59:09 AM »
bro you got no respond....... :'(
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by 1034398800 »
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Re: Religious Brainwashing
« Reply #2 on: June 05, 2002, 04:06:44 AM »
why arent u at school now Dock?


i slept in..... ;D
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by 1034398800 »
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Re: Religious Brainwashing
« Reply #3 on: June 05, 2002, 09:20:47 AM »
The way I see it, is this.  I'm gonna marry someone the same religion as me, because we have more to talk about, and more in common.  My children will be my religion, until they're old enough to choose on their own, and then it's their choice.  I'm not gonna keep them from hearing things about other religions, my church even teaches the good aspects of other religions (I just finished a class on muslims, sikh's, jains, hindus, zoroastrians, jews, christians,  buddists, and a few others), and they only give you the good aspects of the religions, lest they be accused of downtalking other faiths.  It's designed to help people understand the similarities between religions, so there isn't as much religious hate goin' on.  Anyways, truth will always win out, and I know for a fact that my religion is the best for me, and it'll be the best for my wife.  If I raise my children properly, and treat them with respect, I dont' have to worry about them wanting another religion, because they will be exposed to just how good my religion (which is based on family) is, and will feel they want to be a part of it. Also, every latter day saint has a testimony of Christ, if they don't, that's something for them to pray about, if they feel in their heart that it's wrong, then I won't mind at all if my child wants to be another religion.  I'd probably be dissapointed, but I wouldn't disown them , or kick them out of the house or anything, it's their decision.  I honestly feel that won't happen though, becuase I'm going to raise my kids properly, introduce them to my church, and I don't think they'll have a problem with it.  That's not brainwashing.  
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by 1034398800 »
 

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Re: Religious Brainwashing
« Reply #4 on: June 05, 2002, 09:40:11 AM »
Quote
The way I see it, is this.  I'm gonna marry someone the same religion as me, because we have more to talk about, and more in common.  My children will be my religion, until they're old enough to choose on their own, and then it's their choice.  I'm not gonna keep them from hearing things about other religions,  Anyways, truth will always win out, and I know for a fact that my religion is the best for me, and it'll be the best for my wife.  If I raise my children properly, and treat them with respect, I dont' have to worry about them wanting another religion, because they will be exposed to just how good my religion (which is based on family) is, and will feel they want to be a part of it. I'm going to raise my kids properly, introduce them to my moque, and I don't think they'll have a problem with it.  That's not brainwashing.  


;)
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by 1034398800 »
"One day Alice came to a fork in the road and saw a Cheshire cat in a tree. "Which road do I take?" she asked. "Where do you want to go?" was his response. "I don't know," Alice answered. "Then," said the cat, "it doesn't matter."

- Lewis Carroll
 

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Re: Religious Brainwashing
« Reply #5 on: June 05, 2002, 10:19:17 AM »
Im gonna marry anyone who I like and get along with, frankly i dont care about her religion....My kids will be tought about religion, which in my eyes means diciplen and behaviour, and let them choose...enforcing religion upon a person is stupid.....and if they convert later on in their life i wont care either, u know whtever makes em happy, all religions basicly preach of peace n diciplen anyway...

 -{bLaDe}
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by 1034398800 »
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4 KiN L

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Re: Religious Brainwashing
« Reply #6 on: June 05, 2002, 11:22:47 AM »
Quote
The way I see it, is this.  I'm gonna marry someone the same religion as me, because we have more to talk about, and more in common.  My children will be my religion, until they're old enough to choose on their own, and then it's their choice.  I'm not gonna keep them from hearing things about other religions, my church even teaches the good aspects of other religions (I just finished a class on muslims, sikh's, jains, hindus, zoroastrians, jews, christians,  buddists, and a few others), and they only give you the good aspects of the religions, lest they be accused of downtalking other faiths.  It's designed to help people understand the similarities between religions, so there isn't as much religious hate goin' on.  Anyways, truth will always win out, and I know for a fact that my religion is the best for me, and it'll be the best for my wife.  If I raise my children properly, and treat them with respect, I dont' have to worry about them wanting another religion, because they will be exposed to just how good my religion (which is based on family) is, and will feel they want to be a part of it. Also, every latter day saint has a testimony of Christ, if they don't, that's something for them to pray about, if they feel in their heart that it's wrong, then I won't mind at all if my child wants to be another religion.  I'd probably be dissapointed, but I wouldn't disown them , or kick them out of the house or anything, it's their decision.  I honestly feel that won't happen though, becuase I'm going to raise my kids properly, introduce them to my church, and I don't think they'll have a problem with it.  That's not brainwashing.  

u just proved my point, u r gonna bring them up in your religion, therefore u have to get them baptised orhowever u accept them into your religion from a young birth, i wud ask u, if u have kids, by right u can teach them your religion, but don't get them accepted into it as soon as they r a few months old.

another point u prooved is that if u marry sum1 of the same religion, and not just sum1 u like, then the child is always gonna believe what their mother and father tell them, in this case its all the same. no objections to u marrying a woman of the same religion, but why do they 'have' to be?

and in my eyes, it is brainwashing, whereby you wash their brains of all other thoughts and only let them believe what u want them to believe, and it's wrong.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by 1034398800 »
 

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Re: Religious Brainwashing
« Reply #7 on: June 05, 2002, 06:27:42 PM »
It is quite obvious that you don't really understand the meaning of the word brainwashing so here is a definition for you:Intensive, forcible indoctrination, usually political or religious, aimed at destroying a person's basic convictions and attitudes and replacing them with an alternative set of fixed beliefs. The situation you describe does not fit because if you are taught such things from the beginning you have no convictions to destroy.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by 1034398800 »
 

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Re: Religious Brainwashing
« Reply #8 on: June 06, 2002, 01:51:58 AM »
I know, this guys' just tryin' to press buttons.  I'd like to ask him how he would suggest I do it? LOL He's just stupid.  Of COURSE I'm gonna marry someone the same religion as me.  What would he want me to do, not let my kids even think about god until they're 20? What, does he want me to drive them to a jewish synagogue one week, a muslim mosque the next, and never let them go to my church, lest I be brainwashing them?  This really is an ignorant conversation.  

BTW, Latter Day Saints don't baptise at a few months old.  How the hell could they, the kid wouldn't know what they were doing, or even remember it.  They baptise at 8, any child beneath 8 is without sin, anyways.  
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by 1034398800 »
 

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Re: Religious Brainwashing
« Reply #9 on: June 06, 2002, 04:49:38 AM »
Quote
I know, this guys' just tryin' to press buttons.  I'd like to ask him how he would suggest I do it? LOL He's just stupid.  Of COURSE I'm gonna marry someone the same religion as me.  What would he want me to do, not let my kids even think about god until they're 20? What, does he want me to drive them to a jewish synagogue one week, a muslim mosque the next, and never let them go to my church, lest I be brainwashing them?  This really is an ignorant conversation.  

BTW, Latter Day Saints don't baptise at a few months old.  How the hell could they, the kid wouldn't know what they were doing, or even remember it.  They baptise at 8, any child beneath 8 is without sin, anyways.  

But if a person turned round and sed they'd never marry a jew it or a muslim it would be seen as racist u know? and i never sed don't let teach ur kids ur religion, i just sayin let them b teenagers so they can fully understand and choose to be accepted in the religion, not at 8, cos 8 is the age where when all ur friends are baptised they get jealous and want to b done theirselves for the wrong reasons...and i didn't know they did it at 8 cos most religions do their children asap!

and ultimate warrior, read what i put, i put that u tell them everything else they hear around them is bullshit and u make them believe what u believe, therefore whatever else they hear is washed from their brain and replaced by your version of the story or whatever.

and i aint being ignarent, but this kinda shit just seems wrong to me, especially when u make out that to be happy u have to marry a woman of the same religion, if i turned round and sed i aint ecer marryin a jew i wud be seen as a racist.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by 1034398800 »
 

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Re: Religious Brainwashing
« Reply #10 on: June 06, 2002, 07:06:27 AM »
Well, I"ll put it like this, you draw your own conclusions.  I'm white, I like white women.  I don't want to marry a black woman.  I'm a latter day saint, I don't want to marry a jewish woman, or an islamic woman, because we have totally different life styles, and it wouldn't work.  I want to marry an lds woman.  If that makes me racist, or whatever then I'm guilty of all charges.  Everybody does that! Would you marry a woman who was really religious, and goes to church every sunday, and won't drink, won't smoke, won't have premarital sex?  Probably not.  But that doesn't mean you're prejudiced against them.

And like I said, should I NOT let my children go to church with me, until they're old enough?  That's rediculous, when your 3 year old daughter wants to know where you're going every sunday, and wants to be with her daddy, then  you take her to church.  It would be akward and even detrimental to not let your children have anything to do with your personal religion, dogg, I don't know where your'e comin' from on this one.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by 1034398800 »
 

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Re: Religious Brainwashing
« Reply #11 on: June 06, 2002, 10:40:01 AM »
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Well, I"ll put it like this, you draw your own conclusions.  I'm white, I like white women.  I don't want to marry a black woman.  I'm a latter day saint, I don't want to marry a jewish woman, or an islamic woman, because we have totally different life styles, and it wouldn't work.  I want to marry an lds woman.  If that makes me racist, or whatever then I'm guilty of all charges.  Everybody does that! Would you marry a woman who was really religious, and goes to church every sunday, and won't drink, won't smoke, won't have premarital sex?  Probably not.  But that doesn't mean you're prejudiced against them.

And like I said, should I NOT let my children go to church with me, until they're old enough?  That's rediculous, when your 3 year old daughter wants to know where you're going every sunday, and wants to be with her daddy, then  you take her to church.  It would be akward and even detrimental to not let your children have anything to do with your personal religion, dogg, I don't know where your'e comin' from on this one.

oh yeah man i suppose u have proved your point about marryin a woman of the same religion...

and your puttin fuckin words in my mouth, i sed 'by all right teach your children your religion.' i didn't say don't take them to your church, i didn't mean that at all. i'm just saying it like this: teach them about your religion, take them to church, DON'T BAPTISE THEM INTO THAT RELIGION UNTIL THEY CAN DECIDE FOR THEMSELVES.

take them to church and shit, just don't get them accepted into that religion until they are 12/13 at least when they have the maturity to decide for themselves whether they want to be a 'latter saint' or not.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by 1034398800 »
 

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Re: Religious Brainwashing
« Reply #12 on: June 06, 2002, 11:19:44 AM »
So your whole argument has been reduced down to what age they get baptised at? LOL Oh, I gotcha.  Sounds like you're clingin' onto a thread, homie.  If they don't want to be part of my religion they can leave after they get baptised, LOL.  Hey, while we're at it...

What age do I let my kids decide what clothes they want to wear? What age do I let my kids decide what's for dinner?  What age do I let my kids decide whether or not they go on vacation with me?  What age do I let my kids decide whether or not they go to school? What age do I let my kids decide whether or not they can drink? You seem to know all the answers about my kids (who aren't even born yet, lol), so I'm just lookin for pointers.  
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by 1034398800 »
 

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Re: Religious Brainwashing
« Reply #13 on: June 06, 2002, 02:12:27 PM »
Quote
So your whole argument has been reduced down to what age they get baptised at? LOL Oh, I gotcha.  Sounds like you're clingin' onto a thread, homie.  If they don't want to be part of my religion they can leave after they get baptised, LOL.  Hey, while we're at it...

What age do I let my kids decide what clothes they want to wear? What age do I let my kids decide what's for dinner?  What age do I let my kids decide whether or not they go on vacation with me?  What age do I let my kids decide whether or not they go to school? What age do I let my kids decide whether or not they can drink? You seem to know all the answers about my kids (who aren't even born yet, lol), so I'm just lookin for pointers.  

theres no need to be like that cos u know that they are totally different matters...and i didn't in fact know that u can leave a religion like that...u learn sumthing every day.

and theres no point really arguin about it, cos its sumthin that is never going to be stopped, and obviously u r gonna do it.

and in fact, since u mentioned it:
kids know the best clothes to wear because of fashion, so u let them wear what clothes they want, cos it aint no kind of commitment like religion anyways.

if ur kids don't like whats bein made for dinner they make thir own, just like if they don't like ur religion they can go and find sumthing else to believe.

as soon as your kids are old enough to take care of themselves and u can trust them enough, then u let them decide whether or not they come on holiday with u, cos it will save u money anyways, just like u shud wait until they are old enough to know if they can take care of themselves without being part of a religion, then they can decide not to come to church with u, and makes it less hassle for u having to wait for them.

it is against the law for kids not to atend school until they reach a certain age, so u can let them decide but u will get the fine, and maybe go to jail. but with religion, u shud let them decide if they don't want to go to church, because it isn't against the law. same as u can make them go to school until they reach a certain age, u can make them go to church until they readh an age were u know they don't wanna go to church for reasons other than going out with their friends, which would be the reasons if they were younger.

and like it or not, in your childrens' lifetimes they are gonna start drinkin with their friends, so it doesn't matter if u say they can't, cos they r gonna make that choice anyway, especially when they sleep at a friends house. just like in religion, when they are gonna commit what u would class as a sin at one time or another in their lives despite what u have taught them.

and i can tell u were tryin to take the piss outta me and wasn't expecting an answer like that...
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by 1034398800 »
 

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Re: Religious Brainwashing
« Reply #14 on: June 16, 2002, 12:59:50 PM »
How can you say you will only marry some one of the same religion as you, Do you only sleep with people of the same religion as yourself, I know it's your choice to marry who you want but don't you marry bassed on your wife being the one you love above all other women, What would you do if you met the perfect girl nothing could be wrong with the relationship you love her as much as she loves you and your both completely honest and open with each other but she is of another faith, Would that be it, Would the relationship be over.
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969, 05:00:00 PM by 1034398800 »
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