Can some one brief me on the Ireland/IRA conflict?

[techniec]

from what i know

Ireland was Catholic, the Protestant British took it over,
Catholic Ireland wants independance, but a small northern enclave called Ulster wants to be down with Britain cuz they protestant too

that it?

[Joachim]

It is a mad long story but basically, Ireland was catholic, protestant Britain invaded and controlled Ireland, Ireland fought back, and Britain drafted in protestants from Scotland and prisoners from british jails to repel  the uprising, then an Irish cat named Michael Collins sought peace, and Britain offered him/catholics 26 (not quite sure of the number) of the counties and Britain would keep 6, he agreed and returned to Ireland where he was killed in his hometown of Cork by the IRA, today the 26 'free' counties are called the Republic Of Ireland and the 6 British counties called Northern Ireland.

The beef between catholics and Britain/protestant still exists in Northern Ireland, the Republic is beef free but does resent the British. Michael Collins was made a martyr by the people of the Republic Of Ireland.

The IRA were formed to 'protect' Catholics in the north from persecution, but later became a terrorist organization and bombed London constantly in a poor attempt to 'free' Northern Ireland from British rule, they have since stopped the bombings and have commited to a political peace process.

Thats the BASIC story but a grip of shit has happened along the way, including terrorism, murder, racketeering, drug trafficing and violence involving both sides. I will go into detail tomorrow maybe, when i aint so tired. BTW this all happened over many, many years.

R.I.P to The blessed Michael Collins he who found peace and he whom died a martyr, in the fair city of Cork.

Peace

[TheSheriff]

The 6 counties in Northern Ireland have a majority population, VAST majority, who want to retain the Union.

[Joachim]

The 6 counties in Northern Ireland have a majority population, VAST majority, who want to retain the Union.

Yes theres more protestants(people placed there by british) then catholics in Northern Ireland, but with the catholic populations rate of growth in the province, within 4 years the catholics will have the majority of people, which is the reason David Blunkett wants a referendum now instead of then, cause he knows the loyalists will win as things stand but in 4 years they will no longer have the majority.

[TheSheriff]

Catholic growth rate of overall NI growth rate: 38%

Protestant: 58%

Hmm. Where's your logic from, homez?

[Joachim]

Catholic growth rate of overall NI growth rate: 38%

Protestant: 58%

Hmm. Where's your logic from, homez?

Much publicised fact, it isnt logic, it was taken from the 2001 census of Northern Ireland, i read it in the 'Daily Mail'...

[TheSheriff]

Yet the growth rates don't seem to measure up. *shrugs*

Unless the IRA decides to blow up tons of Protestants, I don't see it happening with the relevant growth. It may be, in some areas, Catholics have higher growth rate, but not overall.

Hell, if you listen to the Mail (I read it, don't listen to the news items, just the columns), you'll also believe there are 18 million people of Palestinian origin, and that that the population of India is falling.

[Joachim]

Yet the growth rates don't seem to measure up. *shrugs*

Unless the IRA decides to blow up tons of Protestants, I don't see it happening with the relevant growth. It may be, in some areas, Catholics have higher growth rate, but not overall.

Hell, if you listen to the Mail (I read it, don't listen to the news items, just the columns), you'll also believe there are 18 million people of Palestinian origin, and that that the population of India is falling.

See you try to discredit the Daily Mail to prove your point, clearly they printed lies, becuase you know better, the census muts've been bullshit right? maybe The Sun is more reliable, please.

Get off my nuts, you seem to have this complex about me ever since you labled me a fucker and a wanna be Irishman, i really dont care for your little grudges, or your little disses, stop being such a chief all the time its already mad old...

[TheSheriff]

For FUCK'S sake, I NEVER, EVER, EVER meant that about you, I was referring to the IRA! Dear holy fuck, someone got a chip the size of London on their shoulder...

As for my "attempts to discredit the Daily Mail", it's a proven fact they've had dodgy figures.

I don't read the Sun, I wouldn't know.

[Joachim]

For FUCK'S sake, I NEVER, EVER, EVER meant that about you, I was referring to the IRA! Dear holy fuck, someone got a chip the size of London on their shoulder...

As for my "attempts to discredit the Daily Mail", it's a proven fact they've had dodgy figures.

I don't read the Sun, I wouldn't know.

You were reffering to the IRA as 'You fuckers' aight i mean it makes sense.

The Daily Mail didnt make the figures they were taken from the 2001 cencus of Northern Ireland compiled by the british government, being a british citizen i filled one out aswell.

[TheSheriff]

My point about the Daily Mail it that it's posted statistics which sound bullshit before. It's my fave paper, but I'm just saying we shouldn't say straight away it's right. But if it's directly census info, the census seems fucked up.

(In that Ulster's 2000 census and Eire's 2001 survey both gave the stats as mine, though they may be wrong.)

[Joachim]

My point about the Daily Mail it that it's posted statistics which sound bullshit before. It's my fave paper, but I'm just saying we shouldn't say straight away it's right. But if it's directly census info, the census seems fucked up.

(In that Ulster's 2000 census and Eire's 2001 survey both gave the stats as mine, though they may be wrong.)

Well then we will have to agree to differ, as i cannot prove the cencus is right nor wrong, and quite frankly i couldnt care less at the moment...

[Joachim]

Owen, it seems i owe you an apology, i must have misinterpretated the 'Daily Mail' article, and caused a misunderstanding, i apologise...

Now, after a conversation with my grandmother, she told me that 4 years to draw Catholic and Protestant numbers even is turely absurd, she said that at the moment catholic growth is larger then protestant, its no where as near as what i thought i had seen. So after she hit me with some more facts i did some research.

http://www.csmonitor.com/2002/0304/p09s01-woeu.html

http://www.firstcoastnews.com/news/2002-03-09/usw_nireland.asp

http://www.guardian.co.uk/Northern_Ireland/Story/0,2763,472196,00.html

http://www.independent.co.uk/story.jsp?story=273097

http://www.sinnfein.org/releases/02/pr020402.html  - This one mentions unionist leaders addmitting the change in numbers.

The reason the unionists commited to the peace process is because soon they will be a minority in a United Ireland (provided a referendum is given), thus its better to seek peace now rather then later when they are a minority with little say.

[ITW [the irish boy]]

We have some true information and some misinformation here.

Ireland was and is a majority catholic state ever since about 600AD. The island of Ireland was colonised by the British Empire around the 16th century. Plantations were made and towns such as Derry in the North were founded. The Irish rebelled but all rebellions were squashed, mainly because of inner bickering. Until 1916. The easter rising of 1916 was a failure. The perpetrators were villified by the general public for provoking britain to turn our streets into war zones. However, Britain executed the leaders, causing uproar in the country. A huge rebellion for independence ensued, and for the first time, guerrilla warfare was used in an urban environment.
In 1921, the British decided enough was enough and brokered an agreement. Michael Collins got a 26 county Ireland, but the country was split on his return. The British promised the last 6 would be handed over in the coming years but Ireland didnt believe it. A civil war ensued, brother fighting brother and it was in that war that Collins was shot. But bear in mind, Collins himself was no stranger to violence. That effectively ended the civil war and those opposing it finally realised they couldnt change it

1960 - now

While the south struggled with freedom, the North's catholic population were under huge persectution. The IRA had formed a while back in response to the UVF being formed to oppose a united ireland. The IRA started a wave of violence against the british in retaliation to the injustices. Communities were segragated for their own security. 25 years of violence followed and after numerous attempts a peace package was decided upon. Today in Ireland there is a lot of anti-british sentiment. Riots are occuring on a daily basis in NI and the RUC, the police, are believed to be biased towards protestants. Increasing population shows that 45% want to be reunited with Ireland and 55% want to remain unified. Higher birth rates among catholics however proves that in the coming years those figures will be reversed. But if ireland was reunified surely violence will begin again. Thats basically it. Thenationalists want to be free again and be rid of British rule.Unionists want to remain with Britain.  The majority down here would like a united ireland but would prefer no violence. However, an immense bitterness still remains after british rule.

Please dont try and say that the above is biased. I've lived in Dublin all my life and i know whats going on. The conflict is overshadowed by major world events but violence is ongoing. I'm an athiest so i have no catholic-prod beef. i know a lot of british people but id still love to have our whole country back.+sumone said theres a vast majority of pro-union in the north. All i can say is that is bull. I have read numerous polls in credidable newspapers like the Irish Times and the Independant that show the opposite.

Peace
ITW

PS i hope that answers ur question tiecniec

[Joachim]

We have some true information and some misinformation here.

Ireland was and is a majority catholic state ever since about 600AD. The island of Ireland was colonised by the British Empire around the 16th century. Plantations were made and towns such as Derry in the North were founded. The Irish rebelled but all rebellions were squashed, mainly because of inner bickering. Until 1916. The easter rising of 1916 was a failure. The perpetrators were villified by the general public for provoking britain to turn our streets into war zones. However, Britain executed the leaders, causing uproar in the country. A huge rebellion for independence ensued, and for the first time, guerrilla warfare was used in an urban environment.
In 1921, the British decided enough was enough and brokered an agreement. Michael Collins got a 26 county Ireland, but the country was split on his return. The British promised the last 6 would be handed over in the coming years but Ireland didnt believe it. A civil war ensued, brother fighting brother and it was in that war that Collins was shot. But bear in mind, Collins himself was no stranger to violence. That effectively ended the civil war and those opposing it finally realised they couldnt change it

1960 - now

While the south struggled with freedom, the North's catholic population were under huge persectution. The IRA had formed a while back in response to the UVF being formed to oppose a united ireland. The IRA started a wave of violence against the british in retaliation to the injustices. Communities were segragated for their own security. 25 years of violence followed and after numerous attempts a peace package was decided upon. Today in Ireland there is a lot of anti-british sentiment. Riots are occuring on a daily basis in NI and the RUC, the police, are believed to be biased towards protestants. Increasing population shows that 45% want to be reunited with Ireland and 55% want to remain unified. Higher birth rates among catholics however proves that in the coming years those figures will be reversed. But if ireland was reunified surely violence will begin again. Thats basically it. Thenationalists want to be free again and be rid of British rule.Unionists want to remain with Britain.  The majority down here would like a united ireland but would prefer no violence. However, an immense bitterness still remains after british rule.

Please dont try and say that the above is biased. I've lived in Dublin all my life and i know whats going on. The conflict is overshadowed by major world events but violence is ongoing. I'm an athiest so i have no catholic-prod beef. i know a lot of british people but id still love to have our whole country back.+sumone said theres a vast majority of pro-union in the north. All i can say is that is bull. I have read numerous polls in credidable newspapers like the Irish Times and the Independant that show the opposite.

Peace
ITW

PS i hope that answers ur question tiecniec

Props for spittin whats real homie, it would be great too see one Ireland with no violence or persecution, and hopefully one day we will.