THANK YOU AMERICA!

[JTSimon]

I never said I was smarter than the guy...but in his first post he portrayed Italians as victims of Nazi-fascist when their own government was fascist  

Antonio go back to your first post and edit Nazi-fascism to fascism.

And I have no problem

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In October 1940, Benito Mussolini declared war on Greece. Attempts by the Italian Army to invade Greece ended in failure. The war was also going badly in North Africa. Although outnumbered, General Archibald Wavell ordered a British counter-offensive on 9th December, 1940. The Italians suffered heavy casualties and were pushed back more than 800km (500 miles). British troops moved along the coast and on 22nd January, 1941, they captured the port of Tobruk in Libya from the Italians.
The only success the Italian army had was versus small African countries.

The loss of Sicily created serious problems for Benito Mussolini. It was now clear that the Allies would use the island as a base for invading Italy. A meeting of the Fascist Grand Council was held on 24th July and Galaezzo Ciano got support for his idea that Italy should sign a separate peace with the Allies. The following day Victor Emmanuel III told Mussolini he was dismissed from office. His successor, Pietro Badoglio, declared martial law and placed Mussolini under arrest.

Italy failed on several fronts and merely switched sides. Just that easy.


Btw this site is gold when it comes to history.

http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/2WWitaly.htm

[Smoke]

Error honestly now i dont follow you no more. Are you playing a childish game i aint understanding?

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"in his first post he portrayed Italians as victims of Nazi-fascist when their own government was fascist"Now please! Since you only trust your website, let me quote something straight from it: "After the war Benito Mussolini attacked Vittorio Orlando for failing to achieve Italy's objectives at the Versailles Peace Treaty and helped to organize the various right-wing groups in Italy into the Fascist Party. The next prime minister, Francesco Nitti, also came under attack and he was forced to resign in 1920. After a series of riots in 1922 King Victor Emmanuel III appointed Benito Mussolini in an attempt to prevent a communist revolution in Italy. Mussolini headed a coalition of fascists and nationalists and parliamentary government continued until the murder of the socialist leader, Giacomo Matteotti in 1924. Left-wing parties were suppressed and in 1929 Italy became a one-party state.. Like i said, you, living in San Diego, dont really know what that means. That means that Italy DIDNT HAVE A GOVERNMENT! Get it? They killed everybody but fascists. They killed the Prime Minister who was at the Government before them. They occupied Roma in the famous "March to Rome". They instaured a military dictatorship. So no, our own Government wasnt fascist. Italy was, like you can read from your own site, a "one-party state" with no Parliament, no elections, no chances to choose our destiny. Now, once i've explained it, YES, Americans saved us from Nazi's AND from fascists.

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"Antonio go back to your first post and edit Nazi-fascism to fascism."Well man. You just contraddicted yourself. For sure they saved us from fascism (but wasnt you saying we had a fascist Government?). But they saved us from Nazi's too. Just check you website. It's written like 20 times that Italy was pratically occupied by Nazi's.

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"The only success the Italian army had was versus small African countries"That's right. But why you quoted it? Nobody said the opposite. Actually we failed in Africa too, cause we've lost so many lives and we took the control of the poorest states of Africa, with no utility at all.

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Btw this site is gold when it comes to history.Maybe. But just read it a lil bit and you'll understand a lot of things.

No offence. You just cant know Italian history more than me.

[Smoke]

Other than that (i understand you dont know shit about Italian history, just like i know just a lil bit of American history, cause i'm Italian), you said

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Italians were fascists
If you think something like that, why instead of dissing Bush for bombing Iraq dont you write Iraqi are fucking terrorists, Nazi's (Saddam's party was filo-Nazi), dictators and bastards who loves to use nervino gas against civils just for the fuck of it?

Remember that:

Mussolini was not Italy. He was a dictator. Italians were innocent and victims.
Saddam was not Iraq. He was a dictator. Iraqi are innocent and victims.
Bush is America. America voted him to be their leader and he is your leader. Respect that.

If Bush made some mistakes, you people will judge him and vote for another guy. Respect that. You've never lived dictature in your existence. You lucky.

[M Dogg™]

Bush is America. America voted him to be their leader and he is your leader. Respect that.

Correct that, Bush lost the popular election, only the third president to do so and still be president. He lost by over half a million votes, but won the electoral college, which I've been saying we need to take out for years, but that's a whole 'nother thread all together.

In your arguments about the Facist in Italy, I agree, I studied WWII history a lot and I know exactly what you are saying. I was wondering though, wasn't it the Italians that finally killed Mussolini?

[Smoke]

Yeah, i know what you mean about Bush, but see, that's something strictly political, you know what i mean? I mean that's you system. You got a federal system, with those kind of elections. Here in Europe we use a different system (here in Italy we dont vote for the Prime Minister directly, but trought the party which supports him). But still, what i mean is that, with your electoral systems, you voted him. He was not been forced to you like a dictator. That's the main difference between Bush, Mussolini and Saddam.

About Mussolini being killed by Italians, once again you are right. Italian Resistence captured him and killed him. That's just to reply to the "italians were fascists". It's an offence to the thousands of Italians who died to save Italy from fascism and Nazi's. Exactly like Americans. We did it for us, they (Americans) did it for themselves (they had to save Italy). But no matter what we cant forget the biggest campain of the history! The road to Rome. Soldiers from 15 countries saved us. Americans lost 25,000 guys. That's what i'm commemorating. And you Americans should do the same. 20 years old Americans dying in Italy. And trust me, they died like animals. Oww boy!

[M Dogg™]

Great picture. World War II was the most violent, and bloody war in the history of man. The United States send it's troops to Europe because it was the right thing to do. Before we joined, many Americans were afriad to get in European business, but had we not, the evil of Fascism and Nazism would rule over Europe for many years. God bless the souls that dies for a better world. Without them, we would not be were we are today.

[Smoke]

Yeah man. Fascism ruined Italy for more than 20 years!
A lot of people forget that. MORE THAN 20 YEARS!! Not just the 5 ones of the WWII. It was a real dictature just like the Saddam Hussein one. For sure they saved Europe from fascism and nazism, man. Plus remember the D-DAY pratically made the Campaign to Rome unnecessary. I mean Italy wasnt really a military power man. We declared war to Greece, Albania, and Somalia and we've lost, lol. We wasnt a problem for nobody. We was occupied by Nazi's. Americans invaded Italy cause they wanted to go straight to Berlin from Italy. But the D-DAY changed everything. But still, no matter what, they finished their job. They could have used just the D-DAY (i mean France) to go straight to Berlin and to win the war. No. They've had 25.000 deads to "clean" Italy in the biggest "campaign" ever. That's appreciated. It's nothing "political", and it has nothing to do with Iraq.

[Montana00]

I read when they dedicated the ww2 memorial in D.C. (which is breathtaking) that 16 million us people joined the army. i never knew that many people faught in ww2 from the US. You'll never see a number that high for US military EVER AGAIN. Yea without these guys all of europe would have fell to the nazis. Thank the soliders (and thank the 13 billion we gave europe to rebuild it )

[Smoke]

Man just immagine over 20 millions guys died in Russia to defend Russia from Nazi's.

[Montana00]

it was a horrible war

[JTSimon]

Antonio please tell me what the King of Italy was doing when Mussolini created a pact with Hitler ?

If Mussolini was a dictator he would have killed King Victor Emmanuel III. Mussolini was a servant of the King.

Man just immagine over 20 millions guys died in Russia to defend Russia from Nazi's.

Germany put the smack down.

[Smoke]

Antonio please tell me what the King of Italy was doing when Mussolini created a pact with Hitler ?

If Mussolini was a dictator he would have killed King Victor Emmanuel III. Mussolini was a servant of the King.

Hold on, hold on. The King Victor Emmanuel III, "after a series of riots in 1922, appointed Benito Mussolini in an attempt to prevent a communist revolution in Italy" (i'm quoting from Error's website, since it's already in english!). After that, Mussolini thought he was invincible (Victor Emmanuel III is considered as much responsable as Mussolini for that) and started to kill every political opponents and to pratically close the Parliament, making Italy a one-party state and instauring a dictature. He didnt kill Victor Emmanuel III cause it wasnt necessary, since Mussolini already military-controlled Italy, and Italy didnt have a real army to face him. The King already didnt do shit, before Mussolini (there was a Parliament): after Mussolini, the King became unnecessary (so much that Mussolini didnt kill him).

Let's say it was actually the opposite: the King (and even the Pope) was the servant of Mussolini. The Pope, yeah. He blessed him when he autoproclamed himself the "Duce", and he blessed the interracial laws (against jews), when Mussolini signed them.

About the pact with Hitler, they did it in 1939. 17 years later. And after some political leaders in France and Britain tried to persuade him to form an alliance with Nazi Germany. It was a complete dictacure by the time.

[7even]

mussolini was the role-model for hitler. hitler didnt love the germans. he just hated the jews and used the germans to kill jews. then he got so damn powerful so he wanted to take over europe. no problem. then he wanted to take russia over as well.. that was too much. hitler doesnt represent germany and never did.

lol@america saved italy. lol it's right, italy couldnt do shit against the nazis. but then again, america just saved itself. if america had not joined the war, the usa would probably speak german too by now lol. so please dont act like if americans loved italians/europeans that much that they thought "let's save them".

[infinite59]

Bush is America. America voted him to be their leader and he is your leader. Respect that.

Correct that, Bush lost the popular election, only the third president to do so and still be president. He lost by over half a million votes, but won the electoral college, which I've been saying we need to take out for years, but that's a whole 'nother thread all together.

That's right... so not only was Bush not voted in by the majority of American's, half of Americans elegible to vote, have no representation of their views by these corporate political parties and they don't vote.  Therefore, even a president like George Bush Senior, who won the popular vote, really only recieved 35% of the vote.  That's almost 2 out of 3 eligible voters who did not choose him as president.

[Smoke]

lol@america saved italy. lol it's right, italy couldnt do shit against the nazis. but then again, america just saved itself. if america had not joined the war, the usa would probably speak german too by now lol. so please dont act like if americans loved italians/europeans that much that they thought "let's save them".

Is it really so hard to understand? From YOUR point of view, you saved YUORSELF. From MY point of view, you saved US. Then it's probably true that Americans did it to fight Nazi's and to save themselves from Nazi's. Do you honestly think i care? No i dont. I care that I dont speak German. Point. And yes, i thank them 25,000 soldiers who died in Italy.