Kinda funny shit about Lakers....

[The Big Bad Ass]

Odom was considered the next Magic Johnson back when he was in college and his first year in the NBA. Everyone said he had the tools to be the next great point guard... but he was put into the foward position when he got to the NBA. And now he has bulked up... but there aren't many better or more creative passers at his size in the leage.

[.:DayGoStyLz:.]

The trangle is made for a big man in the middle. Jordan took the place of a center as the main peace. Tex Winters readjusted the system to fit it around Jordan, and then made a REAL trangle with Shaq. Jackson and Winters would put the trangle around Shaq over Jordan anyday of the week, since the Trangle fits a center. But since Winters made the system, he can readjust it anyway he wants.

Yeah, but the triangle thrives on a GOOD PASSING big man. Not necessarily a big man who scores. And no coach would put Shaq over Jordan in ANY offense lol

who happens to be the most dominate player in NBA history

Wilt

[Don Jacob]

i love wilt and all but it's kinda easy to be the most dominant player in the 1960's and 70's when your biggest challenge is an undersized center named bill russle who weighs as much as wilts left arm. then you got all these 5'9 and 5'7 white dudes playing shooting guard and 6'3 6'4 white dudes playing power and small forward.

Shaq woulda had a 150 point game playing back in those days.

I'm sorry but shaq has been the most dominating force in the nba for damn near his whole career, and who has he been put up against?  Ewing, Bark, Hakeem, Zo, your two boys robinson and duncan, webber, ect.  big and TALENTED guys , then on top of that endures quadruple teamed defenses, and is still scores!?!?  Shaq over wilt any day of the week

[7even]

i love wilt and all but it's kinda easy to be the most dominant player in the 1960's and 70's when your biggest challenge is an undersized center named bill russle who weighs as much as wilts left arm. then you got all these 5'9 and 5'7 white dudes playing shooting guard and 6'3 6'4 white dudes playing power and small forward.

Shaq woulda had a 150 point game playing back in those days.

I'm sorry but shaq has been the most dominating force in the nba for damn near his whole career, and who has he been put up against?  Ewing, Bark, Hakeem, Zo, your two boys robinson and duncan, webber, ect.  big and TALENTED guys , then on top of that endures quadruple teamed defenses, and is still scores!?!?  Shaq over wilt any day of the week

you shouldnt ignore the evolution man.. most good players nowadays wouldve kicked legendary players from the 60's ass. it's evolution.

[.:DayGoStyLz:.]

i love wilt and all but it's kinda easy to be the most dominant player in the 1960's and 70's when your biggest challenge is an undersized center named bill russle who weighs as much as wilts left arm. then you got all these 5'9 and 5'7 white dudes playing shooting guard and 6'3 6'4 white dudes playing power and small forward.

Shaq woulda had a 150 point game playing back in those days.

I'm sorry but shaq has been the most dominating force in the nba for damn near his whole career, and who has he been put up against?  Ewing, Bark, Hakeem, Zo, your two boys robinson and duncan, webber, ect.  big and TALENTED guys , then on top of that endures quadruple teamed defenses, and is still scores!?!?  Shaq over wilt any day of the week

U cant say that Shaq woulda had 150 points back then, cus any athlete these days would murder athletes of the 60's/70's. there are 14 year old kids right now, that would easily had been able to play NBA ball back then. But as far as dominant for your time...Wilt takes it to me. Yeah, Wilt's size made him dominant. But Shaq's size has been whats made him dominant. U cant say its been his unbelievable footwork, low post moves, or jumper lol. Its been size. And i dont see him dominating players of today, nearly as much as Wilt did...with players of his time. U named alot of players that he didnt really dominate. One thing, their primes have been at different times. Robinson's prime was when Shaq FIRST entered the league...and Robinson schooled him several times at that point. Hakeem's prime was at the same time, and Hakeem absolutly murdered him in the Finals. Duncan now, holds his own VERY well with Shaq. Shaq really has no answer for Duncan defensively (check their head to head matchups in 2003 playoffs where the Lakers used Shaq to stick Duncan). Ewing, Zo, ill give you. If u throw the "size" card in for Wilt...then u cant count Webber in a matchup with Shaq, and DEFINETELY cant count Barkely who is shorter then half of the 2 guards in the league.

[Don Jacob]

i can throw them up first webber and shaq were about the same size back 93.  and barkley too because dude was a mound of muscle and held his own very well against all the big men of his time. dude even fought shaq . then on top of that ......you put barkly and webber back in the 60's and 70's and they'd mass murder the league just like wilt did.


also what i'm saying, of corse wilt was going to dominate at his time......who was he playing against??? you put shaq in the same era and it's almost like an old school tyson fight 1st rnd KO. You put wilt in shaq's time and wilt wouldn't be doing half of what he did


Also i don't see duncan making shaq's life difficult offensively

[M Dogg™]

I was just saying that the trangle with Michael Jordan was not the true trangle that was designed. The trangle that was ran with Jordan was adjusted to fit the Bulls team because the Bills never had a great passing center, or actually a center in general outside of Stacey King in the early days. With Shaq, the trangle was ran exactly how a trangle was suppose to be ran, with Shaq playing the passing center, who happen to be the most physically dominating player in the history in the NBA, who is also a great passer. Who's the best big man, honestly who care, I like Kareem, but I'm a Showtime person myself. But Shaq was the perfect center for the trangle. Now if Jordan and Shaq where on the same team, Shaq would be the center, but the greatest player ever would get the points. Phil and Tex would run plays that go to Jordan because no player is as good as Jordan. Shaq and Jordan would go perfect together, as if young Kobe looked that great playing next to Shaq, imagion Jordan. The Bulls offense was basically Pippen playing point guard, Jordan playing center, with everyone looking for open shots, and later Rodman just doing Rodman things. It was not a pure trangle. The Lakers had Shaq at center, basically Kobe playing point guard but slashing like a shooting guard, and the rest, including the power forward Robert Horry... lol... looking for open shots. Now the Lakers have changed their team, and they are build like the old Chicago Bulls, but if you look at the early Chicago Bulls teams, they were built to play Michael Jordan isolation plays, until Phil took over. Phil just changed the Bulls, and his system to fit the situation. Because everyone eventually burried their egos, everyone was better for it. Now with the Lakers, they have Rudy who is a great coach, and coaches to the situation. Phil, this time, was not willing to change his system, because he actually had a situation where his system could be ran correctly. He would not coach without Shaq as the focus of the offense, and Shaq would not play without Phil as coach. They both are right for it, but nothing can last forever, and last two years Kobe has badly outplayed Shaq, so the Lakers had to rebuild. How will it end up, this year I don't think we are teh best team, but I can't see us not going to the finals because the ratings for Lakers/Heat will be record breaking if both teams make the finals. Honestly Detroit and Minnesota have the best teams, but L.A./Miami would just make too much money for David Stern to pass up.

[.:DayGoStyLz:.]

i can throw them up first webber and shaq were about the same size back 93.  and barkley too because dude was a mound of muscle and held his own very well against all the big men of his time. dude even fought shaq . then on top of that ......you put barkly and webber back in the 60's and 70's and they'd mass murder the league just like wilt did.


also what i'm saying, of corse wilt was going to dominate at his time......who was he playing against??? you put shaq in the same era and it's almost like an old school tyson fight 1st rnd KO. You put wilt in shaq's time and wilt wouldn't be doing half of what he did


Also i don't see duncan making shaq's life difficult offensively

Are u serious? LA didnt stick Shaq on Duncan too much this year at all cus he was getting into foul trouble tryin to stick him. Plus, the year before Duncan was murdering Shaq in the playoffs. His footwork was far too good, and he was too quik for Shaq to stop. Plus, he doesnt hesitate on shots....he gets them off fast as hell usually, making them hard to defend....similar to how Danny Manning used to be back in the day. On the other side, the same goes for Shaq. SA had different people sticking him, just like LA used different people on Duncan. But Shaq DEFINETELY didnt get the best of Duncan in those matchups, especially in any one on one situations.

Im not trying to argue whether Shaq is dominant, its just HOW dominant. Some of u guys ( *cough* Mdogg *cough*) have really clinged to this "dominant" word. Probably cus u heard some sports reporters use it. Remember, sports reporters want to be part of something just like everyone else. Everyone wants to feel like they are covering the greatest thing ever...that, in someway makes them feel important IMO. A reporters popularity is based on the leagues popularity. The leagues popularity is based on its players popularity. Get it? If they create interest...they create work for themselves. So of course theyll build up Shaq as big as possible with the "dominant" word. But u cant say Shaq has dominated HIS TIME nearly as much as Wilt did HIS TIME. He scored 100 points in a game...now THAT is dominant. Yeah, he wasnt dominating players of today...just like Shaq wont be dominating players of 2040. But for his time, he takes it...easily. Shaq isnt even the best big man in the game right NOW, just the biggest.

[.:DayGoStyLz:.]

I don't think we are teh best team, but I can't see us not going to the finals because the ratings for Lakers/Heat will be record breaking if both teams make the finals. Honestly Detroit and Minnesota have the best teams, but L.A./Miami would just make too much money for David Stern to pass up.

in other words, u think things will be fixed this year? For LA to make the finals, things will have to be REALLY fixed. And i seriously doubt Miami in the East either. They will be the most improved team in the league probably...but Detroit is definetely still the favorite.

[M Dogg™]

I don't think we are teh best team, but I can't see us not going to the finals because the ratings for Lakers/Heat will be record breaking if both teams make the finals. Honestly Detroit and Minnesota have the best teams, but L.A./Miami would just make too much money for David Stern to pass up.

in other words, u think things will be fixed this year? For LA to make the finals, things will have to be REALLY fixed. And i seriously doubt Miami in the East either. They will be the most improved team in the league probably...but Detroit is definetely still the favorite.

yep yep...    My dad once worked for an autobody shop that was ran by the mob, and the guy told my dad, if it has anything to do with man, it can be fixed.

[.:DayGoStyLz:.]

I don't think we are teh best team, but I can't see us not going to the finals because the ratings for Lakers/Heat will be record breaking if both teams make the finals. Honestly Detroit and Minnesota have the best teams, but L.A./Miami would just make too much money for David Stern to pass up.

in other words, u think things will be fixed this year? For LA to make the finals, things will have to be REALLY fixed. And i seriously doubt Miami in the East either. They will be the most improved team in the league probably...but Detroit is definetely still the favorite.

yep yep...    My dad once worked for an autobody shop that was ran by the mob, and the guy told my dad, if it has anything to do with man, it can be fixed.

lol@ the mob.


Welcome to 2004 homie...and welcome to California. Which mob controls basketball?! lol. Cus there isnt a whole lotta damn "mob" out here other then Asian and Mexican, and i dont think they have their hand in the NBA.

[Don Jacob]

i can throw them up first webber and shaq were about the same size back 93.  and barkley too because dude was a mound of muscle and held his own very well against all the big men of his time. dude even fought shaq . then on top of that ......you put barkly and webber back in the 60's and 70's and they'd mass murder the league just like wilt did.


also what i'm saying, of corse wilt was going to dominate at his time......who was he playing against??? you put shaq in the same era and it's almost like an old school tyson fight 1st rnd KO. You put wilt in shaq's time and wilt wouldn't be doing half of what he did


Also i don't see duncan making shaq's life difficult offensively

Are u serious? LA didnt stick Shaq on Duncan too much this year at all cus he was getting into foul trouble tryin to stick him. Plus, the year before Duncan was murdering Shaq in the playoffs. His footwork was far too good, and he was too quik for Shaq to stop. Plus, he doesnt hesitate on shots....he gets them off fast as hell usually, making them hard to defend....similar to how Danny Manning used to be back in the day. On the other side, the same goes for Shaq. SA had different people sticking him, just like LA used different people on Duncan. But Shaq DEFINETELY didnt get the best of Duncan in those matchups, especially in any one on one situations.

Im not trying to argue whether Shaq is dominant, its just HOW dominant. Some of u guys ( *cough* Mdogg *cough*) have really clinged to this "dominant" word. Probably cus u heard some sports reporters use it. Remember, sports reporters want to be part of something just like everyone else. Everyone wants to feel like they are covering the greatest thing ever...that, in someway makes them feel important IMO. A reporters popularity is based on the leagues popularity. The leagues popularity is based on its players popularity. Get it? If they create interest...they create work for themselves. So of course theyll build up Shaq as big as possible with the "dominant" word. But u cant say Shaq has dominated HIS TIME nearly as much as Wilt did HIS TIME. He scored 100 points in a game...now THAT is dominant. Yeah, he wasnt dominating players of today...just like Shaq wont be dominating players of 2040. But for his time, he takes it...easily. Shaq isnt even the best big man in the game right NOW, just the biggest.

first off Duncan didn't do jack shit to effect shaq's game offensively , he was in the same category as Greg Ostrertag and Nesterovic  when it came to "stopping shaq"

second that whole reporter excuse is total bull shit , if that was true Jason Williams would be the best point guard since john stockton  Jordan was the best and mother fuckers called it and it's true. Bird was the best small  forward and it's held true Magic is one of the greatest period and that too has held true. Shaq has BEEEN the most dominant figure since 93"! he was dominating back then and he's still dominating now. again you're saying "well wilt dominated more in his time " well no shit daygo i'd fucking dominate back then too if i was 7 foot and 280! you can't say that now! which brings me to my next point....

you say shaq's not the best big man in the game just the biggest.....LMAO!!! shaq is no where near the biggest center in the league  nor is he the heaviest, as a matter of fact there is no center his size that is as talented as shaq. duncan might have cuter moves but in no way is he a better leader, in no way is he a better scorer and defensively he's not better than shaq, i'm not saying shaq is  a defensive god but neither is duncan . there is no way  duncan is a better passer, and duncan definately doesn't make his teammates better  like shaq does. orando magic in 91 then orlando 94? look what shaq did. Lakers 95...lakers 98 l(60 wins) look waht shaq did, duncan is nice and all but he fell into a contender team when he was drafted, the only reason why the went to lottery was obviousl injuries. i bet my whole soul that if he was drafted by the clippers or nuggest they'd still fail to make the playoffs with duncan back in 97'

[M Dogg™]

I don't think we are teh best team, but I can't see us not going to the finals because the ratings for Lakers/Heat will be record breaking if both teams make the finals. Honestly Detroit and Minnesota have the best teams, but L.A./Miami would just make too much money for David Stern to pass up.

in other words, u think things will be fixed this year? For LA to make the finals, things will have to be REALLY fixed. And i seriously doubt Miami in the East either. They will be the most improved team in the league probably...but Detroit is definetely still the favorite.

yep yep...    My dad once worked for an autobody shop that was ran by the mob, and the guy told my dad, if it has anything to do with man, it can be fixed.

lol@ the mob.


Welcome to 2004 homie...and welcome to California. Which mob controls basketball?! lol. Cus there isnt a whole lotta damn "mob" out here other then Asian and Mexican, and i dont think they have their hand in the NBA.

as the guy said, if it has to do with man, it can be fixed. And I didn't say the mob was fixing, I'm saying David Stern is fixing to get the highest ratings.

Also, taking my Showtime bias aside, the best center in history is Shaq. DayGo, how in the blue hell are you saying Duncan. Duncan has some cool moves, but he is not as dominate as Shaq, hell his not as good as Kevin Garnett in his own position. Had he been drafted by the Celtics who actually had the worst record that year, I can tell you right now he wouldn't have won a title ever.

The best at each position is common knowledge, Magic at point, Mike at 2 guard, Bird at small, Malone at power forward, and Shaq in the middle. Wilt in his day was great, no questions are asked about that, but Shaq would tear up Wilt. Wilt could not hang in a season playing against Hakeem, David Robinson, Patrick Ewing, Morning, Mutombo and the host of others.

Now for using the term, most dominate ever. I ask you, how did San Antonio stop Shaq. How did the twin towers stop Shaq. They doubled him with Robinson and Duncan and Shaq still got his 25-30 a night. Shaq is so strong, so fast in the paint, and his size helps. But Yao Ming is bigger, but Shaq is stronger, faster, better. Now in 4 years, Yao will be better, just like Hakeem was better than Shaq, then he got old, and Shaq got better. It happens, but first, before you ever include Duncan with Shaq, tell me how his better than Kevin Garnett in his own position, then we'll talk.

[.:DayGoStyLz:.]

i can throw them up first webber and shaq were about the same size back 93.  and barkley too because dude was a mound of muscle and held his own very well against all the big men of his time. dude even fought shaq . then on top of that ......you put barkly and webber back in the 60's and 70's and they'd mass murder the league just like wilt did.


also what i'm saying, of corse wilt was going to dominate at his time......who was he playing against??? you put shaq in the same era and it's almost like an old school tyson fight 1st rnd KO. You put wilt in shaq's time and wilt wouldn't be doing half of what he did


Also i don't see duncan making shaq's life difficult offensively

Are u serious? LA didnt stick Shaq on Duncan too much this year at all cus he was getting into foul trouble tryin to stick him. Plus, the year before Duncan was murdering Shaq in the playoffs. His footwork was far too good, and he was too quik for Shaq to stop. Plus, he doesnt hesitate on shots....he gets them off fast as hell usually, making them hard to defend....similar to how Danny Manning used to be back in the day. On the other side, the same goes for Shaq. SA had different people sticking him, just like LA used different people on Duncan. But Shaq DEFINETELY didnt get the best of Duncan in those matchups, especially in any one on one situations.

Im not trying to argue whether Shaq is dominant, its just HOW dominant. Some of u guys ( *cough* Mdogg *cough*) have really clinged to this "dominant" word. Probably cus u heard some sports reporters use it. Remember, sports reporters want to be part of something just like everyone else. Everyone wants to feel like they are covering the greatest thing ever...that, in someway makes them feel important IMO. A reporters popularity is based on the leagues popularity. The leagues popularity is based on its players popularity. Get it? If they create interest...they create work for themselves. So of course theyll build up Shaq as big as possible with the "dominant" word. But u cant say Shaq has dominated HIS TIME nearly as much as Wilt did HIS TIME. He scored 100 points in a game...now THAT is dominant. Yeah, he wasnt dominating players of today...just like Shaq wont be dominating players of 2040. But for his time, he takes it...easily. Shaq isnt even the best big man in the game right NOW, just the biggest.

first off Duncan didn't do jack shit to effect shaq's game offensively , he was in the same category as Greg Ostrertag and Nesterovic  when it came to "stopping shaq"

second that whole reporter excuse is total bull shit , if that was true Jason Williams would be the best point guard since john stockton  Jordan was the best and mother fuckers called it and it's true. Bird was the best small  forward and it's held true Magic is one of the greatest period and that too has held true. Shaq has BEEEN the most dominant figure since 93"! he was dominating back then and he's still dominating now. again you're saying "well wilt dominated more in his time " well no shit daygo i'd fucking dominate back then too if i was 7 foot and 280! you can't say that now! which brings me to my next point....

you say shaq's not the best big man in the game just the biggest.....LMAO!!! shaq is no where near the biggest center in the league  nor is he the heaviest, as a matter of fact there is no center his size that is as talented as shaq. duncan might have cuter moves but in no way is he a better leader, in no way is he a better scorer and defensively he's not better than shaq, i'm not saying shaq is  a defensive god but neither is duncan . there is no way  duncan is a better passer, and duncan definately doesn't make his teammates better  like shaq does. orando magic in 91 then orlando 94? look what shaq did. Lakers 95...lakers 98 l(60 wins) look waht shaq did, duncan is nice and all but he fell into a contender team when he was drafted, the only reason why the went to lottery was obviousl injuries. i bet my whole soul that if he was drafted by the clippers or nuggest they'd still fail to make the playoffs with duncan back in 97'

First, im assuming (maybe i shouldnt) that when u say best...it has to do with who is the most skilled. If u think Shaq is more skilled then Duncan, u are definetely basketball retarded and this conversation shouldnt go any further. I wasnt saying that Duncan was STOPPING Shaq. Im saying, Shaq couldnt STOP Duncan. Shaq couldnt STOP Hakeem. Shaq struggled with Robinson until after Robinsons prime. I will give u this, Shaq is more talented then any center who has been his size in years. But how many has that really been? Cmon Jake, i give u credit for knowing more about basketball then some of these fools on here. But if Shaq was smaller, say even Duncans size...or Garnetts size...he wouldnt even be an All Star. Duncan is a smaller player then Shaq, yet can take him in the post and score on him as easy as Shaq can score on him. And as for what Shaq has done, whos more the main focus for the other teams defense...Shaq, or Duncan? Cmon. The Lakers supposedly had all these options to go to offensively..to take pressure off Shaq. SA has one option, and anyone else is basically a 3rd choice.

Footwork=Duncan
Jump Shot=Duncan
Opposite Hand ability=Duncan
Free Throws=They both suck lol But Duncan still takes it
Ball Handling=Duncan
Low Post Moves=Duncan
Low Post Power=Shaq
Shot Blocking=Shaq
One on One defense=tie
Team D=tie
Leadership=tie (no, u dont have to be loud to be a leader)
Face up moves=Duncan
Size=Shaq

[.:DayGoStyLz:.]

tell me how his better than Kevin Garnett in his own position, then we'll talk.

based on head to head matchups...


ok, lets talk.


How is Shaq better then Duncan? Like i said, its simple. Shaq is size...size...and more size. He is agile FOR his size, which helps him out alot. But he is no where NEAR as pollished as Duncan. Duncan is a smarter player, more versatile, quicker, more consistent, and better overall.

Now, i actually like Shaq. He's cool to me. As youve seen, i respected him FAR more then Kobe. And probably more then any of the Lakers recently. When he first came into the league i couldnt stand him cus he was so overrated. The media jumped on the bandwagon (which was expected), and he was just big and clumsy his first year. His skills got better, and i did respect him more and more. And after their last championship i really respected him. Mostly for one reason (which is a big reason why i didnt like Kobe even more). Because Shaq didnt whine about his injuries, Kobe did. Maybe Shaq knew that in the playoffs, EVERYone is injured. If u look it up, SA had more then they did that year. But i liked that Shaq kept his mouth shut and just played. Now, even though i do respect the guy...that wouldnt cloud my sensibility. He's a good player. But its obvious what players are...and what they are not. Shaq doesnt have a wide variety of moves. He does travel, ALOT. He has no jumper. He's not too great with his left. He cant shoot free throws. He complains about being fouled alot cus he is so big, well that goes both ways. He fouls alot of people, cus he is so big. Shit, just because youre a fan doesnt mean u have to be blind. You dont have to think Yao is a better Center in order to know he has a FAR better jumper then Shaq. lol. So im just comparing him and Duncan, based on ability. Take Shaqs size out the picture...he hardly compares to Duncan in ANY category. Maybe about 2 or 3.