Author Topic: The Bible v The Qur'an  (Read 385 times)

Da Flamboyant 1

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Re: The Bible v The Qur'an
« Reply #25 on: August 18, 2005, 12:37:32 AM »
fuck the bible. besides, even if all that christianity bullshit was true, why is god such an asshole that he cant let us get drunk or be adulterous or do anything else thats in our nature to do? i want one of you churchies to give me a good fuckin reason why he is the one worshipped, what does he do that is so fucking great? please someone give me a legit answer, or does no one really read other peoples posts?

lmao. u gotta first realize if u believe in god or not. u cant talk about what god does unless u actually believe in him.
 

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Re: The Bible v The Qur'an
« Reply #26 on: August 18, 2005, 12:43:26 AM »
fuck the bible. besides, even if all that christianity bullshit was true, why is god such an asshole that he cant let us get drunk or be adulterous or do anything else thats in our nature to do? i want one of you churchies to give me a good fuckin reason why he is the one worshipped, what does he do that is so fucking great? please someone give me a legit answer, or does no one really read other peoples posts?

i heard jesus could levitate and heal people well levitating used to be a great thing but nowadays lots of pple know how to do it and im gona learn it pretty soon too !!!!!!!YEEEEEE. Then i need to learn how to heal people so i can be the next jesus  :D well thats gona be pretty hard but w.e
 

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Re: The Bible v The Qur'an
« Reply #27 on: August 18, 2005, 12:47:41 AM »
i heard jesus could levitate and heal people well levitating used to be a great thing but nowadays lots of pple know how to do it and im gona learn it pretty soon too !!!!!!!YEEEEEE. Then i need to learn how to heal people so i can be the next jesus :D well thats gona be pretty hard but w.e

Jesus may have existed, but for all we know, all of the miracles that are talked about in the Bible could be made up so weak minded people believe.
 

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Re: The Bible v The Qur'an
« Reply #28 on: August 18, 2005, 03:20:04 AM »
god... we got another infinite ::)

I just assumed it was Infinte.


Anyway, I'll play along.


What unknown sciences did the Qur'an prove?

Well firstly, the Qur'an contain's many scientific revelation's, that were presented to man, however they were not proven to be correct until modern time's due to technological advances which showed direct correlation to Qur'anic statement's and modern science.

Here are some:

1) The Qur'an said the world/earth was a spherical shape, human's did not know this until many hundered's of year's later.
2) The Qur'an say's the world, moon and sun has orbit's. Again, this was not known until many hundered's of year's later.
3) The Qur'an talks about the initial stages of an embryo, it say's the embryo look's like a clot intially and then a leach. Dr Keith Moore, head of embryology in Canada, checked this and prove it to be correct.
4) The Qur'an talk's about mountain's having deep underlying root's in the Earth, the mountain's act like stabilizer's to the Earth. Again this was not known until recently.
5) The Qur'an also states that the atmosphere has 7 different layer's. Due to technological advances this has been proven correct.
6) The Qur'an also states that everything is made in pair's. This was proven correct by Physicist, Prof. Paul Dirac, who siad “...every particle has its antiparticle of opposite charge… …and the uncertainty relation tells us that pair creation and pair annihilation happen in the vacuum at all times, in all places.”
7) The Qur'an also states that the Universe is expanding and because of modern Astronomy this has been proven correct.
8) The Qur'an states that the sea/ocean's can be set on fire, this has been proven correct as scientists have recently discovered that all of the present day oceans and some seas (such as the Red Sea and the Arabian Sea) are physically set on fire, while others (such as the Mediterranean, the Black and the Caspian Seas) are not.
9) The Qur'an states that it is best for a person to sleep on the right side, this has been proven correct as the smaller of the lung's does not then put pressure on the heart and this allows for quicker digestion of food. Also if someone slept on the left side, the heart would be under a lot of pressure from the bigger right lung.

These are only some of the science revealed in the Qur'an. Having said this, I would like you to know that the Qur'an is a book of guidance and not merely a science book, therefore it does not have every science in it, but it gives makind guidance on sciences and on life. Many people convert to Islam on other finding's of the Qur'an and not merely on the scientific facts.

The Qur'an also challenged/challenges people to prove it is not the word of God by creating a book that is equal in liguistic term's to the Qur'an.

The Qur'an/Surah 7/Verse 88:  " Say: If the whole of mankind and Jinn were together to produce the like of this Qur'an, they could not produce the like thereof, even if they back up each other with help and support."

This challenge was not met for many year's.

The Quran made it easier, Surah 11/Verse 13:  " or they may say, "He forged it" Say, "Bring ye then ten Suras forged, like unto it, and call (to your aid) whomsoever ye can, other than Allah! If ye speak the truth"

Still this was not met. Furthermore the Qur'an made it more easier, Surah 2/Verse 23:  "And if ye are in doubt as to what We have revealed from time to time to Our servant, then produce a Sura like thereunto; and call your witnesses or helpers besides Allah, if what you say is true."

But over 1400 year's have passed and no one has met this challenge and they never will.

I would like you to please visit this link, where 7 of the world's most leading scientist's in different field's where as ked to  study the Qur'an and give finding's to the accuracy of science in the Qur'an.

Link: http://www.islamic-awareness.org/Quran/Science/scientists.html

« Last Edit: August 18, 2005, 03:22:44 AM by lazarus »


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Don Seer

Re: The Bible v The Qur'an
« Reply #29 on: August 18, 2005, 04:31:51 AM »
and what about mistakes?

like thinking the breast or heart (depending upon translation) is where your thoughts come from..

the qu'ran saying there are 7 earths.. where are they?


and the stars are closer than the moon? lol..



Qur'an Contradiction:

Embryonic Development

Take, for example, the Quran's highly controversial statement that human beings are formed from a clot of blood. "Then We made the sperm into a clot of congealed blood; then of that clot We made a (foetus) lump; then We made out of that lump bones and clothed the bones with flesh" (23:14).

This is hardly a scientific description of embryonic development. It ignores to mention the female egg (the second and equally important half) and the process of fertilization when egg and sperm unite to form one new cell.

It mentions the obvious [the sperm], the visible, that which all mankind knew for a long time that it is necessary to "make" a baby. The Qur'an does NOT mention the invisible, that which we know only through modern medicine. Had God really wanted to reveal something nobody could know at that time, in order to prove the divine origin of his revelation, he would have talked e.g. about the "equal contribution of the female through the ovum to form the new person and how the two come together and form one being".
 

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Re: The Bible v The Qur'an
« Reply #30 on: August 18, 2005, 04:45:39 AM »
the bible is fucked up. People changed it 2 many times, man lol it's such bullshit... and the church omfg, I even used to be a acolite (dunno how u call that in english correct, those lil boys that help the pastors in the church :P ) and I believed all that shit, but I just realized 80% of it is bullshit, church's just a cult that tries to make money of ppl who believe in god.

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Re: The Bible v The Qur'an
« Reply #31 on: August 18, 2005, 04:47:12 AM »
Firstly, like I said before, the Qur'an is not a science book and therefore it does not reveal all science. Islam teaches us to seek knowledge and learn thing's for ourselves, if Allah/God simply gave us all knowledge and told us everything, then the world would not be like it is today. However, having said this, Dr Keith Moore examined the verses in the Qur'an extensively and I am sure if you have visited the link then you should know his finding's.

Like I said the Qur'an does not contain all science but merely a guidance. Therefore we cannot make conclusion's based on what it may/should say but on what it does say.

It say's in the Qur'an, there will be people whom when you show them evidence for the first time will know it is the truth and accept, but some may require you to show it 10 times and some 1000 times and still they will not accept it, the Qur'an refer's to this people as the blind, the deaf, the dumb and there will be no changing these people.



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mauzip

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Re: The Bible v The Qur'an
« Reply #32 on: August 18, 2005, 04:49:12 AM »
You know what people I hate the most? People that try to convert other people.
 

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Re: The Bible v The Qur'an
« Reply #33 on: August 18, 2005, 05:03:18 AM »
I am not here to convert anyone, I am simply putting my view across. You can make you're own decision, I am not going to hate or respect you any more whatever you choose to do, but I am just, in a sense, widening you're knowledge on Islam jsut the same as you can tell me more about Christianity and more on why you don't believe in a religion.


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Re: The Bible v The Qur'an
« Reply #34 on: August 18, 2005, 11:51:05 AM »
god... we got another infinite ::)

I just assumed it was Infinte.


Anyway, I'll play along.


What unknown sciences did the Qur'an prove?

Well firstly, the Qur'an contain's many scientific revelation's, that were presented to man, however they were not proven to be correct until modern time's due to technological advances which showed direct correlation to Qur'anic statement's and modern science.

Here are some:

1) The Qur'an said the world/earth was a spherical shape, human's did not know this until many hundered's of year's later.
2) The Qur'an say's the world, moon and sun has orbit's. Again, this was not known until many hundered's of year's later.
3) The Qur'an talks about the initial stages of an embryo, it say's the embryo look's like a clot intially and then a leach. Dr Keith Moore, head of embryology in Canada, checked this and prove it to be correct.
4) The Qur'an talk's about mountain's having deep underlying root's in the Earth, the mountain's act like stabilizer's to the Earth. Again this was not known until recently.
5) The Qur'an also states that the atmosphere has 7 different layer's. Due to technological advances this has been proven correct.
6) The Qur'an also states that everything is made in pair's. This was proven correct by Physicist, Prof. Paul Dirac, who siad “...every particle has its antiparticle of opposite charge… …and the uncertainty relation tells us that pair creation and pair annihilation happen in the vacuum at all times, in all places.”
7) The Qur'an also states that the Universe is expanding and because of modern Astronomy this has been proven correct.
8) The Qur'an states that the sea/ocean's can be set on fire, this has been proven correct as scientists have recently discovered that all of the present day oceans and some seas (such as the Red Sea and the Arabian Sea) are physically set on fire, while others (such as the Mediterranean, the Black and the Caspian Seas) are not.
9) The Qur'an states that it is best for a person to sleep on the right side, this has been proven correct as the smaller of the lung's does not then put pressure on the heart and this allows for quicker digestion of food. Also if someone slept on the left side, the heart would be under a lot of pressure from the bigger right lung.




1) The Earth was known as spherical at least as far back as the Greeks. One Greek mathemitician correctly calculated the circumference of the Earth over 700 years before the Qur'an was written.

2) Again the Greeks had orbiting models. The popular one was everything orbiting around the Earth, but there was heliocentric model as well, but was discard by most.

I'll also bet I could find cultures that new about the other things as well.
 

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Re: The Bible v The Qur'an
« Reply #35 on: August 18, 2005, 12:10:58 PM »
 

Da Flamboyant 1

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Re: The Bible v The Qur'an
« Reply #36 on: August 18, 2005, 12:57:26 PM »
I even used to be a acolite (dunno how u call that in english correct, those lil boys that help the pastors in the church :P )

damn nigga u musta got ur asshole torn apart
 

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Re: The Bible v The Qur'an
« Reply #37 on: August 18, 2005, 05:40:30 PM »
from wut i hav been taught, they are both the word of God.

the difference is that the Quran has never been changed because of the way it was written. as for ppl sayin a man wrote it, another thing i learned is this: when the Quran was being revealed, God had sent Gabriel to Muhammad. Gabreil made Muhammad say the verses in the Quran, but not in order. Muhammad's followers wrote down the verses (because Muhammad was illiterate, and couldn't read or write) and after his death, his son-in-law Ali compiled the Quran together.

the Bible is also the word of God (at least he original is) but it has been changed overtime so that it would be easier for people to understand it. now ive also heard that ppl changed it to benefit them, but im not 100% sure. I hope i havent offended any Christian brothers and sisters cause that is not my goal, and if i have my apologies.

but anyways, they are both from God.

      
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Re: The Bible v The Qur'an
« Reply #38 on: August 19, 2005, 08:54:13 AM »
I even used to be a acolite (dunno how u call that in english correct, those lil boys that help the pastors in the church :P )

damn nigga u musta got ur asshole torn apart

no, i haven't been raped.

rafsta

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Re: The Bible v The Qur'an
« Reply #39 on: August 19, 2005, 06:31:08 PM »
Firstly, like I said before, the Qur'an is not a science book and therefore it does not reveal all science. Islam teaches us to seek knowledge and learn thing's for ourselves, if Allah/God simply gave us all knowledge and told us everything, then the world would not be like it is today. However, having said this, Dr Keith Moore examined the verses in the Qur'an extensively and I am sure if you have visited the link then you should know his finding's.

Like I said the Qur'an does not contain all science but merely a guidance. Therefore we cannot make conclusion's based on what it may/should say but on what it does say.

It say's in the Qur'an, there will be people whom when you show them evidence for the first time will know it is the truth and accept, but some may require you to show it 10 times and some 1000 times and still they will not accept it, the Qur'an refer's to this people as the blind, the deaf, the dumb and there will be no changing these people.



listen buddy, its cool and all youre reppin the qu'ran, but if youre gonna play the scientific card, then you have to play it all the way, you cant just say it has scientific facts, then flip the script and say only look at the scientific facts that are correct, and ignore the incorrect statements...

other than that, the quaran and the bible pretty much teach the same thing, be a good person... main differences: the bible brings in alot of mythology and peace, the quran brings in science, violence and demeaning women... throw that aside, and you have two books that promote similar values.
 

rafsta

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Re: The Bible v The Qur'an
« Reply #40 on: August 21, 2005, 10:39:25 AM »
 8)
 

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Re: The Bible v The Qur'an
« Reply #41 on: August 21, 2005, 01:03:48 PM »
Firstly, like I said before, the Qur'an is not a science book and therefore it does not reveal all science. Islam teaches us to seek knowledge and learn thing's for ourselves, if Allah/God simply gave us all knowledge and told us everything, then the world would not be like it is today. However, having said this, Dr Keith Moore examined the verses in the Qur'an extensively and I am sure if you have visited the link then you should know his finding's.

Like I said the Qur'an does not contain all science but merely a guidance. Therefore we cannot make conclusion's based on what it may/should say but on what it does say.

It say's in the Qur'an, there will be people whom when you show them evidence for the first time will know it is the truth and accept, but some may require you to show it 10 times and some 1000 times and still they will not accept it, the Qur'an refer's to this people as the blind, the deaf, the dumb and there will be no changing these people.



listen buddy, its cool and all youre reppin the qu'ran, but if youre gonna play the scientific card, then you have to play it all the way, you cant just say it has scientific facts, then flip the script and say only look at the scientific facts that are correct, and ignore the incorrect statements...

other than that, the quaran and the bible pretty much teach the same thing, be a good person... main differences: the bible brings in alot of mythology and peace, the quran brings in science, violence and demeaning women... throw that aside, and you have two books that promote similar values.
But I have stated many time's over, there are no scientific error's in the Qur'an, what I was pointing out to the other person was that OK the Qur'an may not go into much detail but the main point of the statement is correct. Thus we cannot make assumption's on what should be said but on what is actually written and then say if that is correct or incorrect.

On you're second point, the Qur'an does not bring violence, many of the verses in the Qur'an that are used today are taken out of context, the verses relate to the war's that the Muslim's fought and said, only battle in war's and kill no women and children and firstly try to promote peace before fighting. It does not state go killing every day.

Demeaning Women ?!??! I admit it seem's odd to a westerner when they see women dressed in Islamic clothes as they are not used to it. The women clearly feel that they are comfortable and feel safe in the particular dress so they wear it, no one forces them to wear such dress.


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Re: The Bible v The Qur'an
« Reply #42 on: August 21, 2005, 01:13:28 PM »


Demeaning Women ?!??! I admit it seem's odd to a westerner when they see women dressed in Islamic clothes as they are not used to it. The women clearly feel that they are comfortable and feel safe in the particular dress so they wear it, no one forces them to wear such dress.


Are you an Arab from the Middle East? Because I know a lot of them and they all feel that they should have control over any woman in their family. Most I know even say that they'd kill their daughter if she had premarital sex. The North American born arabs don't feel this way but the ones raised in the middle east and then moved here do. Please don't be an idiot. To say Islam isn't filled with sexists is like saying the Catholic Church isn't filled with sexists.
 

rafsta

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Re: The Bible v The Qur'an
« Reply #43 on: August 21, 2005, 11:21:15 PM »
^you cant compare the sexism in the church to the sexism in islam... sexism in christianity only streches as far as church on sundays, islam the sexism is an ongoing thing every-day...

how is it the women have a choice ? they HAVE to wear a veil, they are comfortable with it, just like a dog can get used to wearing a flea collar, sure its weird at first, but then conditioning allows it to forget ! so why dont they make it optional ? i am sure that over 50% of women would stop wearing it if they werent punished for it in any way...

 

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Re: The Bible v The Qur'an
« Reply #44 on: August 21, 2005, 11:22:29 PM »
the veil is a pathetic way for islamic men to control women...
 

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Re: The Bible v The Qur'an
« Reply #45 on: August 22, 2005, 02:41:52 AM »
^you cant compare the sexism in the church to the sexism in islam... sexism in christianity only streches as far as church on sundays, islam the sexism is an ongoing thing every-day...

how is it the women have a choice ? they HAVE to wear a veil, they are comfortable with it, just like a dog can get used to wearing a flea collar, sure its weird at first, but then conditioning allows it to forget ! so why dont they make it optional ? i am sure that over 50% of women would stop wearing it if they werent punished for it in any way...
This is exactly what I mean, you cannot relate the distorted vew's of countries that are predominantly Muslim and say that, that is what the Qur'an and Islam teaches. If you spent the time in analysing and researching the Qur'an and Islam, you come to know that what many of these countries enforce upon their people, is totally against the teaching's of Islam. But the fact remain's that many people in the west only get one view of Islam and that is the totally wrong view.

Like I said, if you research the Qur'an you would come to know that what happen's in these nation's has nothing in relevance to Islam.


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Re: The Bible v The Qur'an
« Reply #46 on: August 22, 2005, 08:57:50 AM »
^you cant compare the sexism in the church to the sexism in islam... sexism in christianity only streches as far as church on sundays, islam the sexism is an ongoing thing every-day...

how is it the women have a choice ? they HAVE to wear a veil, they are comfortable with it, just like a dog can get used to wearing a flea collar, sure its weird at first, but then conditioning allows it to forget ! so why dont they make it optional ? i am sure that over 50% of women would stop wearing it if they werent punished for it in any way...
This is exactly what I mean, you cannot relate the distorted vew's of countries that are predominantly Muslim and say that, that is what the Qur'an and Islam teaches. If you spent the time in analysing and researching the Qur'an and Islam, you come to know that what many of these countries enforce upon their people, is totally against the teaching's of Islam. But the fact remain's that many people in the west only get one view of Islam and that is the totally wrong view.

Like I said, if you research the Qur'an you would come to know that what happen's in these nation's has nothing in relevance to Islam.


You said no one forces them to wear the hijab, but clearly they are forced since they are not allowed to take it off. Whether this is a teaching of Islam isn't my concern. You said they aren't forced. You are wrong.
 

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Re: The Bible v The Qur'an
« Reply #47 on: August 22, 2005, 09:54:50 AM »
What I mean't to say was, and I apologize, that Islam and the Qur'an do not force a woman to wear Hijab, yes there are statement's which  advise a woman to "cover" herself but they do not tell the woman to i.e. "Wear the Hijab or you will die", but like I said the Qur'an is a book of guidance, I believe, and I don't blame the western people or people who do not know much about Islam/Qur'an, that if you really want to question Islam, read the Qur'an/Hadith's and saying's of the Prophet Muhammad (p.b.u.h) and that is the only authentic source for the "true" and "pure" Islam, rather than reading anti-Islamic sites and watching the news in which you get a one sided view of Islam.


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Re: The Bible v The Qur'an
« Reply #48 on: August 22, 2005, 10:33:19 AM »
Simple question to lazarus: Do you think the treatment of women in islamic countries is good and how it is supposed to be?
Cause I don't care where I belong no more
What we share or not I will ignore
And I won't waste my time fitting in
Cause I don't think contrast is a sin
No, it's not a sin
 

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Re: The Bible v The Qur'an
« Reply #49 on: August 22, 2005, 12:23:17 PM »
The treatment of women in some countries that are predominantly Muslim, in my opinion, is totally against what I percieve to be the teaching's of Islam and the Qur'an. I think many of the ruler's use Islam as an excuse to what they do, just like people against Islam, they take verses out of context to use for their own means. I once saw a documentary a couple of year's back, which showed treatment of women in Pakistan and when questioned and asked "Are you allowed to do this ?", the people said verses in the Qur'an that did not even corellate to their excuse, that show's that many of these so called "Muslim's" have a weak view of Islam.

But the world is like this and we cannot do much about it, this thing's occur everywhere and we cannot really quell it. I think we should live our own lives the best we can and voice view's against such atoricities and let the judging be done by Allah or whoever you follow.


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