Author Topic: Arafat Death Probe Inconclusive  (Read 1189 times)

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Re: Arafat Death Probe Inconclusive
« Reply #100 on: October 27, 2005, 04:20:48 PM »
What do you mean "regardless"? LOL after you're proven wrong... then you try to pull something else up...

What am I arguing that I can't prove? My whole argument is that Palestinians have been victims of Zionism.

Have innocent Palestinians been killed? Yes.
Has Israel demolished homes of innocent people? Yes.
Does every Palestinian refugee have the right to return to his home? No.

Those are all facts. That's all I'm arguing. You're the one that claims that the Israeli government has nothing to do with the demolishing of homes and that it's all in the hands of the soldiers... which is the dumbest thing I've read in this thread... and that's saying a lot considering that I Geezy has been making quite a few posts.
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Re: Arafat Death Probe Inconclusive
« Reply #101 on: October 27, 2005, 04:33:27 PM »
Nice job ignoring your contradictions, keep it up. And thank you Tech, maybe the moment Propaganda victims get reinforced by their likes they calm down.

LOL... nice job ignoring the entire argument and your flip-flopping... LOL @ propaganda victims coming from the guy who blindly supports the regime that calls a wall 30 times larger than the Berlin Wall a fence.... we won't even talk about actions it has taken (Lavon Affair  ;))

Now go read your history books written by Zionists.


lol And you've called me brainwashed even though I've told you that I'm against this fence. Damn, so thick headed and blind to the facts, you really frustrate me homie.

I can understand you being frustrated... I would be too if I didn't know what the fuck was going on and I got involved in some argument with someone I can't bullshit.  :)

Anyways, this and you are over. Peace.

I could go on for days pointing out facts and refuting your ungrounded statements but what good does talking to a wall?
Good luck, hope your self-persuasion works out for you, you're a lucky dude if you can live in peace with yourself without minding reality.

Says the guy who supports the government with over 60 UN resolutions against it... the government that kills off innocent people... the government that bulldozes the homes of innocent people... the government that illegally occupies the land of others... the government that attacks U.S. navy vessels hoping that the blame will be put on someone else.... LOL.. yeah, I'm not minding reality. Good luck, hope your ignorance works out for you, you're a lucky dude if you can live in peace with yourself without minding the truth.  :)


I never knew it was the "government" bulldozing homes and killing innocent people, I thought it was the Israeli soldiers performing these actions. Oh wait, it was..."Government" does not approve the killings of innocent people, I Geezy has been saying that...

LOL@  it's not the government, it's the soldiers.... I seriously can't believe this... that's like saying it's not our government's fault that we went to war... it's the military's fault because they're the ones that went there... LOLLLLL what the fuck.... you think the soldiers just go out there and do whatever the fuck they want? Did our troops decide "damn, let's go to Iraq and take out Saddam"... or was it our government? Come on man, you gotta be smarter than this.


Like I said and you ignored, the government does not approve killings of innocent people. Soldiers are sent out to war, innocent people get harmed, it is not the main intention...Why do you choose to ignore that and bring up Iraq?

I was referring to the line about the bulldozing of homes... where you claimed that it was the soldiers doing that and not the government... I hope you realize and understand that the government makes such decisions and not the military. Why do you choose to ignore that?


Have they ever approved the bulldozing of a civilians home out in the open? No. So how else would you be able to provide proof for that statement unless you knew the Israeli government personally and they admitted this to you?

What the hell are you talking about? Have they approved it? LOL they're the ones doing it... the government bulldozes homes, not the military. That's like saying construction workers make the decision to build freeways.. and then asking "has the government approved that action by the construction workers?" LOL


You ignored my question. Is that your signature method of debating? Like I asked, has the government openly admitted to intentionally targeting Palestinian civilians or not? If they haven't, there is no possible way you can prove it, everything else is just speculation...That's what I'm talkin' about.

No the government hasn't openly admitted to it... but what government would? If the government tries to hide the shit it does... then why would it just openly admit something? There is no possible way I can prove it for the present. However, you made 2 points in your original statement, the other being that about the bulldozing of homes. That's what I addressed... that's what I argued... I didn't argue the part about killing civilians...  you're ignoring your own comments... I didn't ignore anything...

Let's clear something out, Israel does not bulldoze homes cause the IDF or the Israeli government feel like it, if this was the case I don't believe there would be a single building left standing on Palestinian territory. However Israel does uphold a penal policy in the address of those who choose to comply with terrorist power structures. How would you choose to supply observed negative reinforcement to up and coming suicide bombers(that high percentage among Palestinian youth that dreams about becoming Shahids)?? Israel does not demolish homes just for the heck of it.


LOL the way you try to justify these things is hilarious.... what gives Israel the right to go into Palestinian territory, and demolish the homes of Palestinians? Actually.... homes were demolished because they were "in the way" of the wall built.... in addition to the land stolen, etc... LOL get the fuck outta here man

What gives Israel the right??? Are you worried more about some terrorist's house than you are worried about the lives of Israeli civilians?Well of course you are, I almost forgot who I'm talking to. And I do not need to justify shit man, these terrorists are the ones doing it for me.What gives them a right to send brainwashed fucktards to blow themselves up on Israeli civilians?
Man you're lost in your own bullshit, you keep contradicting yourself time after time, one moment you're against suicide bombing next moment you're worried more about terrorists homes than you are about human lives, the normal humans, not the ones that decide to die and to take along with them more people. Did you know that thanks to this policy there were cases when Palestinian families that knew their sons were about to blow themselves up submited them to the IDF preventing many losses of human lives? I know of at least 20 cases....tell me it wasn't worth it you hypocrite.

1. Israel has no right to demolish the homes of Palestinian homes... and you haven't been able to show that it has the RIGHT... your reasoning for why you feel it's a good thing doesn't mean it's justified...

2. You're assuming that ONLY the homes of terrorists are being demolished, which is not the case. Even if it were... a terrorist has a family, and you can't punish an entire family for the action of one member.

3. Obviously they don't have the RIGHT to go and blow up shit. That's what makes them "terrorists"... do you see the difference between the terrorists and the Israeli government? If you say there's a difference, then I agree because a government is supposed to adhere to laws... if you say there's no difference, I'd still agree.

4. According to your logic... or lack of one... it's okay to kill someone because you believe there's a chance that in the future that person might kill you... try that in court (you know the place where they look at and observe laws... I hope you know what laws are)



1. What I feel??? man I haven't even started talking about my feelings on the issue. As for rights- Israel has the right to defend its civilians from terrorist atacks and Israel has the right to prevent such atacks. Being that the Palestinian authority proves itself to be impotent or non-willing to prevent such assaults, Israel has even more than a right IT HAS A MORAL OBLIGATION TO DO WHATEVER IS IN ITS POWER TO DEFUSE SUCH ENDEAVORS.

2.Since you are not sure whether only the homes of terrorists are being demolished, why are you even commenting on this? for the sake of speculation?...-Well of course.
How else would you punish a person that decided to commit mass murder along with a suicide? Would you kill him again? Israel supplies observed negative reinforcement for likely to emerge future bombers and for their families, there's no other treatment except for from within the Palestinian authority which they are not willing to inflict.

3.You're damn right they don't have the right to blow up Israeli civilians although I know that you are saying it only for the sake of political correctness. And there IS a huge difference between terrorists and governments in most of the world but in the Palestinian Autonomy these structures seem to be accomplices.

4. How in hell did you conclude that according to my logic it is OK to kill people in advance to their crime? STOP PUTING WORDS IN MY MOUTH, go argue with yourself man you seem to be in disagreement with your own bullshit.

1. Moral obligation doesn't equal adhering to law. When I'm talking about RIGHT.. I'm talking about the lawful right. You're not able to justify it, so you give me reasons why you think it's okay for them to do it... AKA your feelings, Mr. We Todd It

2. It goes against international law... so now you can understand why the UN resolutions are in place. As long as you know... I'm not asking you to agree or disagree... just as long you realize what's going on.

3. So Palestinians don't have the right to harm innocent Israelis... because that would make them terrorists... but the Israeli government harming Palestinians is okay... if Palestinians blow shit up, they're terrorists... if Israel blows shit up, it's defense...
And once again, after I fuck your argument up, you decide to assume that you know what my thoughts or views are... when the fuck did you become psychic? Just because I'm fucking up your argument, doesn't mean you should wrongfully assume what my views are. You lost the argument a long time ago, yet you're acting like this is the first time you've been proven wrong. Keep your assumptions to yourself.

4. Ok.. you really must be retarded....
"Did you know that thanks to this policy (REFERRING TO THE DEMOLISHING OF HOMES) there were cases when Palestinian families that knew their sons were about to blow themselves up submited them to the IDF preventing many losses of human lives? I know of at least 20 cases....tell me it wasn't worth it you hypocrite"
This is the Israeli government bulldozing homes because they believe that someone in the family might commit an act in the future... you justify this... so I made the analogy, hence the words "according to your logic" which we all now know you lack.... do you know what an analogy is?

my throat hurts, its hard to swallow, and my body feels like i got a serious ass beating.

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Re: Arafat Death Probe Inconclusive
« Reply #102 on: October 27, 2005, 04:43:13 PM »
What do you mean "regardless"? LOL after you're proven wrong... then you try to pull something else up...

What am I arguing that I can't prove? My whole argument is that Palestinians have been victims of Zionism.

Have innocent Palestinians been killed? Yes.
Has Israel demolished homes of innocent people? Yes.
Does every Palestinian refugee have the right to return to his home? No.

Those are all facts. That's all I'm arguing. You're the one that claims that the Israeli government has nothing to do with the demolishing of homes and that it's all in the hands of the soldiers... which is the dumbest thing I've read in this thread... and that's saying a lot considering that I Geezy has been making quite a few posts.


Again, missing the whole point. I never said Palestinians haven't been killed. I never said Israel hasn't demolished the homes of innocent people. The point is, you're arguing that the Israeli government is an evil power, while I've BEEN saying that you have no proof that the Israeli government has any evil intentions...You just keep completely disregarding that and repeating "Israeli's kill innocent people!" when I never denied that...The Israeli government does demolish homes, but do you have any proof that they KNOW it's the house of an innocent civilian when they demolish it? Again, I didn't think so...So why argue something you CAN'T prove?
 

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Re: Arafat Death Probe Inconclusive
« Reply #103 on: October 27, 2005, 04:48:31 PM »
BTW, I know that the Israeli supreme court ruled that the fence should be built closer to the green line to prevent impact on the Palestinian population near by to such an extent Jewish settlers from near by are even threatening to protest. Not something that makes me anymore fond of this plan but this is something that may answer your question.
We are all human beings isn't that a good enough reason for peace?
 

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Re: Arafat Death Probe Inconclusive
« Reply #104 on: October 27, 2005, 04:50:56 PM »
What do you mean "regardless"? LOL after you're proven wrong... then you try to pull something else up...

What am I arguing that I can't prove? My whole argument is that Palestinians have been victims of Zionism.

Have innocent Palestinians been killed? Yes.
Has Israel demolished homes of innocent people? Yes.
Does every Palestinian refugee have the right to return to his home? No.

Those are all facts. That's all I'm arguing. You're the one that claims that the Israeli government has nothing to do with the demolishing of homes and that it's all in the hands of the soldiers... which is the dumbest thing I've read in this thread... and that's saying a lot considering that I Geezy has been making quite a few posts.


Again, missing the whole point. I never said Palestinians haven't been killed. I never said Israel hasn't demolished the homes of innocent people. The point is, you're arguing that the Israeli government is an evil power, while I've BEEN saying that you have no proof that the Israeli government has any evil intentions...You just keep completely disregarding that and repeating "Israeli's kill innocent people!" when I never denied that...The Israeli government does demolish homes, but do you have any proof that they KNOW it's the house of an innocent civilian when they demolish it? Again, I didn't think so...So why argue something you CAN'T prove?

You're missing the whole point. How can you prove intentions? I'm just telling you what they're doing, not what's going through their heads.

Yes the Israeli government does demolish homes, but previously you stated that it's not the government's choice to do that, and that it's the soldiers doing it... LMAO... so now you realize how retarded that was...

The Israeli government demolished homes when they were building the wall because the homes were in the way of the planned position of the wall... and EVEN if it was the home of a terrorist... what gives the Israeli government the right to demolish the home of his family?  LOL I think you need to realize what's being argued before you say "you can't prove that"... all I'm saying is that Israel has no right to do that, just like a Palestinian suicide bomber doesn't have the right to blow up a falafel stand and kill innocent people... I guess I'm taking an objective approach by looking at laws and rights... and you guys are throwing in assumptions, feelings,etc

"He killed someone, but you have no proof that he has bad intentions" ... yeah, like anyone really gives a fuck...
« Last Edit: October 27, 2005, 04:54:21 PM by JML - no vowels, disembowel your Colin Powell, throw in the towel »
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J @ M @ L

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Re: Arafat Death Probe Inconclusive
« Reply #105 on: October 27, 2005, 04:55:40 PM »
BTW, I know that the Israeli supreme court ruled that the fence should be built closer to the green line to prevent impact on the Palestinian population near by to such an extent Jewish settlers from near by are even threatening to protest. Not something that makes me anymore fond of this plan but this is something that may answer your question.

Good job, son.
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Re: Arafat Death Probe Inconclusive
« Reply #106 on: October 27, 2005, 05:05:17 PM »
Nice job ignoring your contradictions, keep it up. And thank you Tech, maybe the moment Propaganda victims get reinforced by their likes they calm down.

LOL... nice job ignoring the entire argument and your flip-flopping... LOL @ propaganda victims coming from the guy who blindly supports the regime that calls a wall 30 times larger than the Berlin Wall a fence.... we won't even talk about actions it has taken (Lavon Affair  ;))

Now go read your history books written by Zionists.


lol And you've called me brainwashed even though I've told you that I'm against this fence. Damn, so thick headed and blind to the facts, you really frustrate me homie.

I can understand you being frustrated... I would be too if I didn't know what the fuck was going on and I got involved in some argument with someone I can't bullshit.  :)

Anyways, this and you are over. Peace.

I could go on for days pointing out facts and refuting your ungrounded statements but what good does talking to a wall?
Good luck, hope your self-persuasion works out for you, you're a lucky dude if you can live in peace with yourself without minding reality.

Says the guy who supports the government with over 60 UN resolutions against it... the government that kills off innocent people... the government that bulldozes the homes of innocent people... the government that illegally occupies the land of others... the government that attacks U.S. navy vessels hoping that the blame will be put on someone else.... LOL.. yeah, I'm not minding reality. Good luck, hope your ignorance works out for you, you're a lucky dude if you can live in peace with yourself without minding the truth.  :)


I never knew it was the "government" bulldozing homes and killing innocent people, I thought it was the Israeli soldiers performing these actions. Oh wait, it was..."Government" does not approve the killings of innocent people, I Geezy has been saying that...

LOL@  it's not the government, it's the soldiers.... I seriously can't believe this... that's like saying it's not our government's fault that we went to war... it's the military's fault because they're the ones that went there... LOLLLLL what the fuck.... you think the soldiers just go out there and do whatever the fuck they want? Did our troops decide "damn, let's go to Iraq and take out Saddam"... or was it our government? Come on man, you gotta be smarter than this.


Like I said and you ignored, the government does not approve killings of innocent people. Soldiers are sent out to war, innocent people get harmed, it is not the main intention...Why do you choose to ignore that and bring up Iraq?

I was referring to the line about the bulldozing of homes... where you claimed that it was the soldiers doing that and not the government... I hope you realize and understand that the government makes such decisions and not the military. Why do you choose to ignore that?


Have they ever approved the bulldozing of a civilians home out in the open? No. So how else would you be able to provide proof for that statement unless you knew the Israeli government personally and they admitted this to you?

What the hell are you talking about? Have they approved it? LOL they're the ones doing it... the government bulldozes homes, not the military. That's like saying construction workers make the decision to build freeways.. and then asking "has the government approved that action by the construction workers?" LOL


You ignored my question. Is that your signature method of debating? Like I asked, has the government openly admitted to intentionally targeting Palestinian civilians or not? If they haven't, there is no possible way you can prove it, everything else is just speculation...That's what I'm talkin' about.

No the government hasn't openly admitted to it... but what government would? If the government tries to hide the shit it does... then why would it just openly admit something? There is no possible way I can prove it for the present. However, you made 2 points in your original statement, the other being that about the bulldozing of homes. That's what I addressed... that's what I argued... I didn't argue the part about killing civilians...  you're ignoring your own comments... I didn't ignore anything...

Let's clear something out, Israel does not bulldoze homes cause the IDF or the Israeli government feel like it, if this was the case I don't believe there would be a single building left standing on Palestinian territory. However Israel does uphold a penal policy in the address of those who choose to comply with terrorist power structures. How would you choose to supply observed negative reinforcement to up and coming suicide bombers(that high percentage among Palestinian youth that dreams about becoming Shahids)?? Israel does not demolish homes just for the heck of it.


LOL the way you try to justify these things is hilarious.... what gives Israel the right to go into Palestinian territory, and demolish the homes of Palestinians? Actually.... homes were demolished because they were "in the way" of the wall built.... in addition to the land stolen, etc... LOL get the fuck outta here man

What gives Israel the right??? Are you worried more about some terrorist's house than you are worried about the lives of Israeli civilians?Well of course you are, I almost forgot who I'm talking to. And I do not need to justify shit man, these terrorists are the ones doing it for me.What gives them a right to send brainwashed fucktards to blow themselves up on Israeli civilians?
Man you're lost in your own bullshit, you keep contradicting yourself time after time, one moment you're against suicide bombing next moment you're worried more about terrorists homes than you are about human lives, the normal humans, not the ones that decide to die and to take along with them more people. Did you know that thanks to this policy there were cases when Palestinian families that knew their sons were about to blow themselves up submited them to the IDF preventing many losses of human lives? I know of at least 20 cases....tell me it wasn't worth it you hypocrite.

1. Israel has no right to demolish the homes of Palestinian homes... and you haven't been able to show that it has the RIGHT... your reasoning for why you feel it's a good thing doesn't mean it's justified...

2. You're assuming that ONLY the homes of terrorists are being demolished, which is not the case. Even if it were... a terrorist has a family, and you can't punish an entire family for the action of one member.

3. Obviously they don't have the RIGHT to go and blow up shit. That's what makes them "terrorists"... do you see the difference between the terrorists and the Israeli government? If you say there's a difference, then I agree because a government is supposed to adhere to laws... if you say there's no difference, I'd still agree.

4. According to your logic... or lack of one... it's okay to kill someone because you believe there's a chance that in the future that person might kill you... try that in court (you know the place where they look at and observe laws... I hope you know what laws are)



1. What I feel??? man I haven't even started talking about my feelings on the issue. As for rights- Israel has the right to defend its civilians from terrorist atacks and Israel has the right to prevent such atacks. Being that the Palestinian authority proves itself to be impotent or non-willing to prevent such assaults, Israel has even more than a right IT HAS A MORAL OBLIGATION TO DO WHATEVER IS IN ITS POWER TO DEFUSE SUCH ENDEAVORS.

2.Since you are not sure whether only the homes of terrorists are being demolished, why are you even commenting on this? for the sake of speculation?...-Well of course.
How else would you punish a person that decided to commit mass murder along with a suicide? Would you kill him again? Israel supplies observed negative reinforcement for likely to emerge future bombers and for their families, there's no other treatment except for from within the Palestinian authority which they are not willing to inflict.

3.You're damn right they don't have the right to blow up Israeli civilians although I know that you are saying it only for the sake of political correctness. And there IS a huge difference between terrorists and governments in most of the world but in the Palestinian Autonomy these structures seem to be accomplices.

4. How in hell did you conclude that according to my logic it is OK to kill people in advance to their crime? STOP PUTING WORDS IN MY MOUTH, go argue with yourself man you seem to be in disagreement with your own bullshit.

1. Moral obligation doesn't equal adhering to law. When I'm talking about RIGHT.. I'm talking about the lawful right. You're not able to justify it, so you give me reasons why you think it's okay for them to do it... AKA your feelings, Mr. We Todd It

2. It goes against international law... so now you can understand why the UN resolutions are in place. As long as you know... I'm not asking you to agree or disagree... just as long you realize what's going on.

3. So Palestinians don't have the right to harm innocent Israelis... because that would make them terrorists... but the Israeli government harming Palestinians is okay... if Palestinians blow shit up, they're terrorists... if Israel blows shit up, it's defense...
And once again, after I fuck your argument up, you decide to assume that you know what my thoughts or views are... when the fuck did you become psychic? Just because I'm fucking up your argument, doesn't mean you should wrongfully assume what my views are. You lost the argument a long time ago, yet you're acting like this is the first time you've been proven wrong. Keep your assumptions to yourself.

4. Ok.. you really must be retarded....
"Did you know that thanks to this policy (REFERRING TO THE DEMOLISHING OF HOMES) there were cases when Palestinian families that knew their sons were about to blow themselves up submited them to the IDF preventing many losses of human lives? I know of at least 20 cases....tell me it wasn't worth it you hypocrite"
This is the Israeli government bulldozing homes because they believe that someone in the family might commit an act in the future... you justify this... so I made the analogy, hence the words "according to your logic" which we all now know you lack.... do you know what an analogy is?

 MAYBE these are just us sentimental Israelis who don't view LAWS and MORAL OBLIGATIONS as different aspects. That is unlike The UN you so very much like to mention without willing to admit whether you view it as a moral compass or as a reflection of international consensus cause that would get you in trouble but still you do not see the contradiction in bringing up its resolutions concerning Israel. And you're acting as if you haven't fucked your own arguments up with the previous page of this thread when you admited that you simply do not see the connection between spending billions of dollars of support money on terrorism instead of investing it in bettering the life of the Palestinian population and the way things work out for the Palestinians, whose interests you're trying to defend with your nonsensical bullshit approach.
« Last Edit: October 27, 2005, 05:08:05 PM by I TO DA GEEZY »
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Re: Arafat Death Probe Inconclusive
« Reply #107 on: October 27, 2005, 05:10:39 PM »
Nice job ignoring your contradictions, keep it up. And thank you Tech, maybe the moment Propaganda victims get reinforced by their likes they calm down.

LOL... nice job ignoring the entire argument and your flip-flopping... LOL @ propaganda victims coming from the guy who blindly supports the regime that calls a wall 30 times larger than the Berlin Wall a fence.... we won't even talk about actions it has taken (Lavon Affair  ;))

Now go read your history books written by Zionists.


lol And you've called me brainwashed even though I've told you that I'm against this fence. Damn, so thick headed and blind to the facts, you really frustrate me homie.

I can understand you being frustrated... I would be too if I didn't know what the fuck was going on and I got involved in some argument with someone I can't bullshit.  :)

Anyways, this and you are over. Peace.

I could go on for days pointing out facts and refuting your ungrounded statements but what good does talking to a wall?
Good luck, hope your self-persuasion works out for you, you're a lucky dude if you can live in peace with yourself without minding reality.

Says the guy who supports the government with over 60 UN resolutions against it... the government that kills off innocent people... the government that bulldozes the homes of innocent people... the government that illegally occupies the land of others... the government that attacks U.S. navy vessels hoping that the blame will be put on someone else.... LOL.. yeah, I'm not minding reality. Good luck, hope your ignorance works out for you, you're a lucky dude if you can live in peace with yourself without minding the truth.  :)


I never knew it was the "government" bulldozing homes and killing innocent people, I thought it was the Israeli soldiers performing these actions. Oh wait, it was..."Government" does not approve the killings of innocent people, I Geezy has been saying that...

LOL@  it's not the government, it's the soldiers.... I seriously can't believe this... that's like saying it's not our government's fault that we went to war... it's the military's fault because they're the ones that went there... LOLLLLL what the fuck.... you think the soldiers just go out there and do whatever the fuck they want? Did our troops decide "damn, let's go to Iraq and take out Saddam"... or was it our government? Come on man, you gotta be smarter than this.


Like I said and you ignored, the government does not approve killings of innocent people. Soldiers are sent out to war, innocent people get harmed, it is not the main intention...Why do you choose to ignore that and bring up Iraq?

I was referring to the line about the bulldozing of homes... where you claimed that it was the soldiers doing that and not the government... I hope you realize and understand that the government makes such decisions and not the military. Why do you choose to ignore that?


Have they ever approved the bulldozing of a civilians home out in the open? No. So how else would you be able to provide proof for that statement unless you knew the Israeli government personally and they admitted this to you?

What the hell are you talking about? Have they approved it? LOL they're the ones doing it... the government bulldozes homes, not the military. That's like saying construction workers make the decision to build freeways.. and then asking "has the government approved that action by the construction workers?" LOL


You ignored my question. Is that your signature method of debating? Like I asked, has the government openly admitted to intentionally targeting Palestinian civilians or not? If they haven't, there is no possible way you can prove it, everything else is just speculation...That's what I'm talkin' about.

No the government hasn't openly admitted to it... but what government would? If the government tries to hide the shit it does... then why would it just openly admit something? There is no possible way I can prove it for the present. However, you made 2 points in your original statement, the other being that about the bulldozing of homes. That's what I addressed... that's what I argued... I didn't argue the part about killing civilians...  you're ignoring your own comments... I didn't ignore anything...

Let's clear something out, Israel does not bulldoze homes cause the IDF or the Israeli government feel like it, if this was the case I don't believe there would be a single building left standing on Palestinian territory. However Israel does uphold a penal policy in the address of those who choose to comply with terrorist power structures. How would you choose to supply observed negative reinforcement to up and coming suicide bombers(that high percentage among Palestinian youth that dreams about becoming Shahids)?? Israel does not demolish homes just for the heck of it.


LOL the way you try to justify these things is hilarious.... what gives Israel the right to go into Palestinian territory, and demolish the homes of Palestinians? Actually.... homes were demolished because they were "in the way" of the wall built.... in addition to the land stolen, etc... LOL get the fuck outta here man

What gives Israel the right??? Are you worried more about some terrorist's house than you are worried about the lives of Israeli civilians?Well of course you are, I almost forgot who I'm talking to. And I do not need to justify shit man, these terrorists are the ones doing it for me.What gives them a right to send brainwashed fucktards to blow themselves up on Israeli civilians?
Man you're lost in your own bullshit, you keep contradicting yourself time after time, one moment you're against suicide bombing next moment you're worried more about terrorists homes than you are about human lives, the normal humans, not the ones that decide to die and to take along with them more people. Did you know that thanks to this policy there were cases when Palestinian families that knew their sons were about to blow themselves up submited them to the IDF preventing many losses of human lives? I know of at least 20 cases....tell me it wasn't worth it you hypocrite.

1. Israel has no right to demolish the homes of Palestinian homes... and you haven't been able to show that it has the RIGHT... your reasoning for why you feel it's a good thing doesn't mean it's justified...

2. You're assuming that ONLY the homes of terrorists are being demolished, which is not the case. Even if it were... a terrorist has a family, and you can't punish an entire family for the action of one member.

3. Obviously they don't have the RIGHT to go and blow up shit. That's what makes them "terrorists"... do you see the difference between the terrorists and the Israeli government? If you say there's a difference, then I agree because a government is supposed to adhere to laws... if you say there's no difference, I'd still agree.

4. According to your logic... or lack of one... it's okay to kill someone because you believe there's a chance that in the future that person might kill you... try that in court (you know the place where they look at and observe laws... I hope you know what laws are)



1. What I feel??? man I haven't even started talking about my feelings on the issue. As for rights- Israel has the right to defend its civilians from terrorist atacks and Israel has the right to prevent such atacks. Being that the Palestinian authority proves itself to be impotent or non-willing to prevent such assaults, Israel has even more than a right IT HAS A MORAL OBLIGATION TO DO WHATEVER IS IN ITS POWER TO DEFUSE SUCH ENDEAVORS.

2.Since you are not sure whether only the homes of terrorists are being demolished, why are you even commenting on this? for the sake of speculation?...-Well of course.
How else would you punish a person that decided to commit mass murder along with a suicide? Would you kill him again? Israel supplies observed negative reinforcement for likely to emerge future bombers and for their families, there's no other treatment except for from within the Palestinian authority which they are not willing to inflict.

3.You're damn right they don't have the right to blow up Israeli civilians although I know that you are saying it only for the sake of political correctness. And there IS a huge difference between terrorists and governments in most of the world but in the Palestinian Autonomy these structures seem to be accomplices.

4. How in hell did you conclude that according to my logic it is OK to kill people in advance to their crime? STOP PUTING WORDS IN MY MOUTH, go argue with yourself man you seem to be in disagreement with your own bullshit.

1. Moral obligation doesn't equal adhering to law. When I'm talking about RIGHT.. I'm talking about the lawful right. You're not able to justify it, so you give me reasons why you think it's okay for them to do it... AKA your feelings, Mr. We Todd It

2. It goes against international law... so now you can understand why the UN resolutions are in place. As long as you know... I'm not asking you to agree or disagree... just as long you realize what's going on.

3. So Palestinians don't have the right to harm innocent Israelis... because that would make them terrorists... but the Israeli government harming Palestinians is okay... if Palestinians blow shit up, they're terrorists... if Israel blows shit up, it's defense...
And once again, after I fuck your argument up, you decide to assume that you know what my thoughts or views are... when the fuck did you become psychic? Just because I'm fucking up your argument, doesn't mean you should wrongfully assume what my views are. You lost the argument a long time ago, yet you're acting like this is the first time you've been proven wrong. Keep your assumptions to yourself.

4. Ok.. you really must be retarded....
"Did you know that thanks to this policy (REFERRING TO THE DEMOLISHING OF HOMES) there were cases when Palestinian families that knew their sons were about to blow themselves up submited them to the IDF preventing many losses of human lives? I know of at least 20 cases....tell me it wasn't worth it you hypocrite"
This is the Israeli government bulldozing homes because they believe that someone in the family might commit an act in the future... you justify this... so I made the analogy, hence the words "according to your logic" which we all now know you lack.... do you know what an analogy is?

 MAYBE these are just us sentimental Israelis who don't view LAWS and MORAL OBLIGATIONS as different aspects. That is unlike The UN you so very much like to mention without willing to admit whether you view it as a moral compass or as a reflection of international consensus cause that would get you in trouble but still you do not see the contradiction in bringing up its resolutions concerning Israel. And you're acting as if you haven't fucked your own arguments up with the previous page of this thread when you admited that you simply do not see the connection between spending billions of dollars of support money on terrorism instead of investing it in bettering the life of the Palestinian population and the way things work out for the Palestinians, whose interests you're trying to defend with your nonsensical bullshit approach, for all these years.

LOL. You lost. I don't know which played a larger role... me fucking your arguments up, or you just making retarded comments... either way, now you can save yourself the embarassment.

By the way, where did I admit that I "do not see the connection between spending billions of dollars of support money on terrorism instead of investing it in bettering the life of the Palestinian population and the way things work out for the Palestinians". The Palestinian leadership has fucked up...  but that doesn't mean that Palestinians haven't been victims of Zionism. That's all I was arguing, and that's what I have proven. You call the adherence of laws and rights nonsensical... which I can understand  :)

SHALOM.
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I TO DA GEEZY

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Re: Arafat Death Probe Inconclusive
« Reply #108 on: October 27, 2005, 05:30:06 PM »
Nice job ignoring your contradictions, keep it up. And thank you Tech, maybe the moment Propaganda victims get reinforced by their likes they calm down.

LOL... nice job ignoring the entire argument and your flip-flopping... LOL @ propaganda victims coming from the guy who blindly supports the regime that calls a wall 30 times larger than the Berlin Wall a fence.... we won't even talk about actions it has taken (Lavon Affair  ;))

Now go read your history books written by Zionists.


lol And you've called me brainwashed even though I've told you that I'm against this fence. Damn, so thick headed and blind to the facts, you really frustrate me homie.

I can understand you being frustrated... I would be too if I didn't know what the fuck was going on and I got involved in some argument with someone I can't bullshit.  :)

Anyways, this and you are over. Peace.

I could go on for days pointing out facts and refuting your ungrounded statements but what good does talking to a wall?
Good luck, hope your self-persuasion works out for you, you're a lucky dude if you can live in peace with yourself without minding reality.

Says the guy who supports the government with over 60 UN resolutions against it... the government that kills off innocent people... the government that bulldozes the homes of innocent people... the government that illegally occupies the land of others... the government that attacks U.S. navy vessels hoping that the blame will be put on someone else.... LOL.. yeah, I'm not minding reality. Good luck, hope your ignorance works out for you, you're a lucky dude if you can live in peace with yourself without minding the truth.  :)


I never knew it was the "government" bulldozing homes and killing innocent people, I thought it was the Israeli soldiers performing these actions. Oh wait, it was..."Government" does not approve the killings of innocent people, I Geezy has been saying that...

LOL@  it's not the government, it's the soldiers.... I seriously can't believe this... that's like saying it's not our government's fault that we went to war... it's the military's fault because they're the ones that went there... LOLLLLL what the fuck.... you think the soldiers just go out there and do whatever the fuck they want? Did our troops decide "damn, let's go to Iraq and take out Saddam"... or was it our government? Come on man, you gotta be smarter than this.


Like I said and you ignored, the government does not approve killings of innocent people. Soldiers are sent out to war, innocent people get harmed, it is not the main intention...Why do you choose to ignore that and bring up Iraq?

I was referring to the line about the bulldozing of homes... where you claimed that it was the soldiers doing that and not the government... I hope you realize and understand that the government makes such decisions and not the military. Why do you choose to ignore that?


Have they ever approved the bulldozing of a civilians home out in the open? No. So how else would you be able to provide proof for that statement unless you knew the Israeli government personally and they admitted this to you?

What the hell are you talking about? Have they approved it? LOL they're the ones doing it... the government bulldozes homes, not the military. That's like saying construction workers make the decision to build freeways.. and then asking "has the government approved that action by the construction workers?" LOL


You ignored my question. Is that your signature method of debating? Like I asked, has the government openly admitted to intentionally targeting Palestinian civilians or not? If they haven't, there is no possible way you can prove it, everything else is just speculation...That's what I'm talkin' about.

No the government hasn't openly admitted to it... but what government would? If the government tries to hide the shit it does... then why would it just openly admit something? There is no possible way I can prove it for the present. However, you made 2 points in your original statement, the other being that about the bulldozing of homes. That's what I addressed... that's what I argued... I didn't argue the part about killing civilians...  you're ignoring your own comments... I didn't ignore anything...

Let's clear something out, Israel does not bulldoze homes cause the IDF or the Israeli government feel like it, if this was the case I don't believe there would be a single building left standing on Palestinian territory. However Israel does uphold a penal policy in the address of those who choose to comply with terrorist power structures. How would you choose to supply observed negative reinforcement to up and coming suicide bombers(that high percentage among Palestinian youth that dreams about becoming Shahids)?? Israel does not demolish homes just for the heck of it.


LOL the way you try to justify these things is hilarious.... what gives Israel the right to go into Palestinian territory, and demolish the homes of Palestinians? Actually.... homes were demolished because they were "in the way" of the wall built.... in addition to the land stolen, etc... LOL get the fuck outta here man

What gives Israel the right??? Are you worried more about some terrorist's house than you are worried about the lives of Israeli civilians?Well of course you are, I almost forgot who I'm talking to. And I do not need to justify shit man, these terrorists are the ones doing it for me.What gives them a right to send brainwashed fucktards to blow themselves up on Israeli civilians?
Man you're lost in your own bullshit, you keep contradicting yourself time after time, one moment you're against suicide bombing next moment you're worried more about terrorists homes than you are about human lives, the normal humans, not the ones that decide to die and to take along with them more people. Did you know that thanks to this policy there were cases when Palestinian families that knew their sons were about to blow themselves up submited them to the IDF preventing many losses of human lives? I know of at least 20 cases....tell me it wasn't worth it you hypocrite.

1. Israel has no right to demolish the homes of Palestinian homes... and you haven't been able to show that it has the RIGHT... your reasoning for why you feel it's a good thing doesn't mean it's justified...

2. You're assuming that ONLY the homes of terrorists are being demolished, which is not the case. Even if it were... a terrorist has a family, and you can't punish an entire family for the action of one member.

3. Obviously they don't have the RIGHT to go and blow up shit. That's what makes them "terrorists"... do you see the difference between the terrorists and the Israeli government? If you say there's a difference, then I agree because a government is supposed to adhere to laws... if you say there's no difference, I'd still agree.

4. According to your logic... or lack of one... it's okay to kill someone because you believe there's a chance that in the future that person might kill you... try that in court (you know the place where they look at and observe laws... I hope you know what laws are)



1. What I feel??? man I haven't even started talking about my feelings on the issue. As for rights- Israel has the right to defend its civilians from terrorist atacks and Israel has the right to prevent such atacks. Being that the Palestinian authority proves itself to be impotent or non-willing to prevent such assaults, Israel has even more than a right IT HAS A MORAL OBLIGATION TO DO WHATEVER IS IN ITS POWER TO DEFUSE SUCH ENDEAVORS.

2.Since you are not sure whether only the homes of terrorists are being demolished, why are you even commenting on this? for the sake of speculation?...-Well of course.
How else would you punish a person that decided to commit mass murder along with a suicide? Would you kill him again? Israel supplies observed negative reinforcement for likely to emerge future bombers and for their families, there's no other treatment except for from within the Palestinian authority which they are not willing to inflict.

3.You're damn right they don't have the right to blow up Israeli civilians although I know that you are saying it only for the sake of political correctness. And there IS a huge difference between terrorists and governments in most of the world but in the Palestinian Autonomy these structures seem to be accomplices.

4. How in hell did you conclude that according to my logic it is OK to kill people in advance to their crime? STOP PUTING WORDS IN MY MOUTH, go argue with yourself man you seem to be in disagreement with your own bullshit.

1. Moral obligation doesn't equal adhering to law. When I'm talking about RIGHT.. I'm talking about the lawful right. You're not able to justify it, so you give me reasons why you think it's okay for them to do it... AKA your feelings, Mr. We Todd It

2. It goes against international law... so now you can understand why the UN resolutions are in place. As long as you know... I'm not asking you to agree or disagree... just as long you realize what's going on.

3. So Palestinians don't have the right to harm innocent Israelis... because that would make them terrorists... but the Israeli government harming Palestinians is okay... if Palestinians blow shit up, they're terrorists... if Israel blows shit up, it's defense...
And once again, after I fuck your argument up, you decide to assume that you know what my thoughts or views are... when the fuck did you become psychic? Just because I'm fucking up your argument, doesn't mean you should wrongfully assume what my views are. You lost the argument a long time ago, yet you're acting like this is the first time you've been proven wrong. Keep your assumptions to yourself.

4. Ok.. you really must be retarded....
"Did you know that thanks to this policy (REFERRING TO THE DEMOLISHING OF HOMES) there were cases when Palestinian families that knew their sons were about to blow themselves up submited them to the IDF preventing many losses of human lives? I know of at least 20 cases....tell me it wasn't worth it you hypocrite"
This is the Israeli government bulldozing homes because they believe that someone in the family might commit an act in the future... you justify this... so I made the analogy, hence the words "according to your logic" which we all now know you lack.... do you know what an analogy is?

 MAYBE these are just us sentimental Israelis who don't view LAWS and MORAL OBLIGATIONS as different aspects. That is unlike The UN you so very much like to mention without willing to admit whether you view it as a moral compass or as a reflection of international consensus cause that would get you in trouble but still you do not see the contradiction in bringing up its resolutions concerning Israel. And you're acting as if you haven't fucked your own arguments up with the previous page of this thread when you admited that you simply do not see the connection between spending billions of dollars of support money on terrorism instead of investing it in bettering the life of the Palestinian population and the way things work out for the Palestinians, whose interests you're trying to defend with your nonsensical bullshit approach, for all these years.

LOL. You lost. I don't know which played a larger role... me fucking your arguments up, or you just making retarded comments... either way, now you can save yourself the embarassment.

By the way, where did I admit that I "do not see the connection between spending billions of dollars of support money on terrorism instead of investing it in bettering the life of the Palestinian population and the way things work out for the Palestinians". The Palestinian leadership has fucked up...  but that doesn't mean that Palestinians haven't been victims of Zionism. That's all I was arguing, and that's what I have proven. You call the adherence of laws and rights nonsensical... which I can understand  :)

SHALOM.

LMAO Weren't you taught to loose with respect?....This is like the 100th time you're trying to bail out of this debate proclaiming yourself the winner only to return again and to embarrass yourself even more with bullshit arguments and topic dodging. If you do not recall yourself admitting your ignorance just go back to the previous page man, I hope you can at least fathom your own bullshit. The fact Palestinian governments and Palestinian so called freedom fighters had been fuckin up for all these years didn't disappear into oblivion only because you chose to admit it, this fact casts on the frustration within the Palestinian people, the large predisposition to terrorism due to the frustration, the docility for manipulation by terroristic power structures. With the amounts of money they received they could've already lived like a decent developing state just like Israel had been at the dawn of its existence but these so called leaders chose FOR THEM a way of terrorism and you my friend are in the deepest of denials if you do not see this.
So yea, GOOD LUCK ON YOUR MIDTERMS, MAN.... Too bad my college year is gonna be accompanied by Kassams flying over my head while studying. Salam...!
« Last Edit: October 27, 2005, 05:40:39 PM by I TO DA GEEZY »
We are all human beings isn't that a good enough reason for peace?
 

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Re: Arafat Death Probe Inconclusive
« Reply #109 on: October 27, 2005, 06:16:39 PM »
What do you mean "regardless"? LOL after you're proven wrong... then you try to pull something else up...

What am I arguing that I can't prove? My whole argument is that Palestinians have been victims of Zionism.

Have innocent Palestinians been killed? Yes.
Has Israel demolished homes of innocent people? Yes.
Does every Palestinian refugee have the right to return to his home? No.

Those are all facts. That's all I'm arguing. You're the one that claims that the Israeli government has nothing to do with the demolishing of homes and that it's all in the hands of the soldiers... which is the dumbest thing I've read in this thread... and that's saying a lot considering that I Geezy has been making quite a few posts.


Again, missing the whole point. I never said Palestinians haven't been killed. I never said Israel hasn't demolished the homes of innocent people. The point is, you're arguing that the Israeli government is an evil power, while I've BEEN saying that you have no proof that the Israeli government has any evil intentions...You just keep completely disregarding that and repeating "Israeli's kill innocent people!" when I never denied that...The Israeli government does demolish homes, but do you have any proof that they KNOW it's the house of an innocent civilian when they demolish it? Again, I didn't think so...So why argue something you CAN'T prove?

You're missing the whole point. How can you prove intentions? I'm just telling you what they're doing, not what's going through their heads.

Yes the Israeli government does demolish homes, but previously you stated that it's not the government's choice to do that, and that it's the soldiers doing it... LMAO... so now you realize how retarded that was...

The Israeli government demolished homes when they were building the wall because the homes were in the way of the planned position of the wall... and EVEN if it was the home of a terrorist... what gives the Israeli government the right to demolish the home of his family?  LOL I think you need to realize what's being argued before you say "you can't prove that"... all I'm saying is that Israel has no right to do that, just like a Palestinian suicide bomber doesn't have the right to blow up a falafel stand and kill innocent people... I guess I'm taking an objective approach by looking at laws and rights... and you guys are throwing in assumptions, feelings,etc

"He killed someone, but you have no proof that he has bad intentions" ... yeah, like anyone really gives a fuck...

It's the government's choice to demolish homes of TERRORISTS, that is the intention. The Israeli government does not CHOOSE to kill innocent people, but innocent people get killed. It's amazing how many times I have to say the same thing for you to just completely disregard it in your next post. The Israeli's have no right to kill innocent Palestinians, correct. But the innocent people dying are not intended to be killed...A Palestinian suicide bomber is completely different, as his main intention IS to harm innocent people...Get the dreezy?
 

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Re: Arafat Death Probe Inconclusive
« Reply #110 on: October 28, 2005, 12:52:01 AM »
Yes, but I wasn't arguing that... you're making a statement that I didn't even argue...

In regards to what the government does on purpose, I mentioned the demolishing of homes.... not just "terrorist homes"... the government demolished homes that were in the way of the wall being built on Palestinian land. Comprende?
my throat hurts, its hard to swallow, and my body feels like i got a serious ass beating.

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Re: Arafat Death Probe Inconclusive
« Reply #111 on: October 28, 2005, 12:54:11 AM »
Nice job ignoring your contradictions, keep it up. And thank you Tech, maybe the moment Propaganda victims get reinforced by their likes they calm down.

LOL... nice job ignoring the entire argument and your flip-flopping... LOL @ propaganda victims coming from the guy who blindly supports the regime that calls a wall 30 times larger than the Berlin Wall a fence.... we won't even talk about actions it has taken (Lavon Affair  ;))

Now go read your history books written by Zionists.


lol And you've called me brainwashed even though I've told you that I'm against this fence. Damn, so thick headed and blind to the facts, you really frustrate me homie.

I can understand you being frustrated... I would be too if I didn't know what the fuck was going on and I got involved in some argument with someone I can't bullshit.  :)

Anyways, this and you are over. Peace.

I could go on for days pointing out facts and refuting your ungrounded statements but what good does talking to a wall?
Good luck, hope your self-persuasion works out for you, you're a lucky dude if you can live in peace with yourself without minding reality.

Says the guy who supports the government with over 60 UN resolutions against it... the government that kills off innocent people... the government that bulldozes the homes of innocent people... the government that illegally occupies the land of others... the government that attacks U.S. navy vessels hoping that the blame will be put on someone else.... LOL.. yeah, I'm not minding reality. Good luck, hope your ignorance works out for you, you're a lucky dude if you can live in peace with yourself without minding the truth.  :)


I never knew it was the "government" bulldozing homes and killing innocent people, I thought it was the Israeli soldiers performing these actions. Oh wait, it was..."Government" does not approve the killings of innocent people, I Geezy has been saying that...

LOL@  it's not the government, it's the soldiers.... I seriously can't believe this... that's like saying it's not our government's fault that we went to war... it's the military's fault because they're the ones that went there... LOLLLLL what the fuck.... you think the soldiers just go out there and do whatever the fuck they want? Did our troops decide "damn, let's go to Iraq and take out Saddam"... or was it our government? Come on man, you gotta be smarter than this.


Like I said and you ignored, the government does not approve killings of innocent people. Soldiers are sent out to war, innocent people get harmed, it is not the main intention...Why do you choose to ignore that and bring up Iraq?

I was referring to the line about the bulldozing of homes... where you claimed that it was the soldiers doing that and not the government... I hope you realize and understand that the government makes such decisions and not the military. Why do you choose to ignore that?


Have they ever approved the bulldozing of a civilians home out in the open? No. So how else would you be able to provide proof for that statement unless you knew the Israeli government personally and they admitted this to you?

What the hell are you talking about? Have they approved it? LOL they're the ones doing it... the government bulldozes homes, not the military. That's like saying construction workers make the decision to build freeways.. and then asking "has the government approved that action by the construction workers?" LOL


You ignored my question. Is that your signature method of debating? Like I asked, has the government openly admitted to intentionally targeting Palestinian civilians or not? If they haven't, there is no possible way you can prove it, everything else is just speculation...That's what I'm talkin' about.

No the government hasn't openly admitted to it... but what government would? If the government tries to hide the shit it does... then why would it just openly admit something? There is no possible way I can prove it for the present. However, you made 2 points in your original statement, the other being that about the bulldozing of homes. That's what I addressed... that's what I argued... I didn't argue the part about killing civilians...  you're ignoring your own comments... I didn't ignore anything...

Let's clear something out, Israel does not bulldoze homes cause the IDF or the Israeli government feel like it, if this was the case I don't believe there would be a single building left standing on Palestinian territory. However Israel does uphold a penal policy in the address of those who choose to comply with terrorist power structures. How would you choose to supply observed negative reinforcement to up and coming suicide bombers(that high percentage among Palestinian youth that dreams about becoming Shahids)?? Israel does not demolish homes just for the heck of it.


LOL the way you try to justify these things is hilarious.... what gives Israel the right to go into Palestinian territory, and demolish the homes of Palestinians? Actually.... homes were demolished because they were "in the way" of the wall built.... in addition to the land stolen, etc... LOL get the fuck outta here man

What gives Israel the right??? Are you worried more about some terrorist's house than you are worried about the lives of Israeli civilians?Well of course you are, I almost forgot who I'm talking to. And I do not need to justify shit man, these terrorists are the ones doing it for me.What gives them a right to send brainwashed fucktards to blow themselves up on Israeli civilians?
Man you're lost in your own bullshit, you keep contradicting yourself time after time, one moment you're against suicide bombing next moment you're worried more about terrorists homes than you are about human lives, the normal humans, not the ones that decide to die and to take along with them more people. Did you know that thanks to this policy there were cases when Palestinian families that knew their sons were about to blow themselves up submited them to the IDF preventing many losses of human lives? I know of at least 20 cases....tell me it wasn't worth it you hypocrite.

1. Israel has no right to demolish the homes of Palestinian homes... and you haven't been able to show that it has the RIGHT... your reasoning for why you feel it's a good thing doesn't mean it's justified...

2. You're assuming that ONLY the homes of terrorists are being demolished, which is not the case. Even if it were... a terrorist has a family, and you can't punish an entire family for the action of one member.

3. Obviously they don't have the RIGHT to go and blow up shit. That's what makes them "terrorists"... do you see the difference between the terrorists and the Israeli government? If you say there's a difference, then I agree because a government is supposed to adhere to laws... if you say there's no difference, I'd still agree.

4. According to your logic... or lack of one... it's okay to kill someone because you believe there's a chance that in the future that person might kill you... try that in court (you know the place where they look at and observe laws... I hope you know what laws are)



1. What I feel??? man I haven't even started talking about my feelings on the issue. As for rights- Israel has the right to defend its civilians from terrorist atacks and Israel has the right to prevent such atacks. Being that the Palestinian authority proves itself to be impotent or non-willing to prevent such assaults, Israel has even more than a right IT HAS A MORAL OBLIGATION TO DO WHATEVER IS IN ITS POWER TO DEFUSE SUCH ENDEAVORS.

2.Since you are not sure whether only the homes of terrorists are being demolished, why are you even commenting on this? for the sake of speculation?...-Well of course.
How else would you punish a person that decided to commit mass murder along with a suicide? Would you kill him again? Israel supplies observed negative reinforcement for likely to emerge future bombers and for their families, there's no other treatment except for from within the Palestinian authority which they are not willing to inflict.

3.You're damn right they don't have the right to blow up Israeli civilians although I know that you are saying it only for the sake of political correctness. And there IS a huge difference between terrorists and governments in most of the world but in the Palestinian Autonomy these structures seem to be accomplices.

4. How in hell did you conclude that according to my logic it is OK to kill people in advance to their crime? STOP PUTING WORDS IN MY MOUTH, go argue with yourself man you seem to be in disagreement with your own bullshit.

1. Moral obligation doesn't equal adhering to law. When I'm talking about RIGHT.. I'm talking about the lawful right. You're not able to justify it, so you give me reasons why you think it's okay for them to do it... AKA your feelings, Mr. We Todd It

2. It goes against international law... so now you can understand why the UN resolutions are in place. As long as you know... I'm not asking you to agree or disagree... just as long you realize what's going on.

3. So Palestinians don't have the right to harm innocent Israelis... because that would make them terrorists... but the Israeli government harming Palestinians is okay... if Palestinians blow shit up, they're terrorists... if Israel blows shit up, it's defense...
And once again, after I fuck your argument up, you decide to assume that you know what my thoughts or views are... when the fuck did you become psychic? Just because I'm fucking up your argument, doesn't mean you should wrongfully assume what my views are. You lost the argument a long time ago, yet you're acting like this is the first time you've been proven wrong. Keep your assumptions to yourself.

4. Ok.. you really must be retarded....
"Did you know that thanks to this policy (REFERRING TO THE DEMOLISHING OF HOMES) there were cases when Palestinian families that knew their sons were about to blow themselves up submited them to the IDF preventing many losses of human lives? I know of at least 20 cases....tell me it wasn't worth it you hypocrite"
This is the Israeli government bulldozing homes because they believe that someone in the family might commit an act in the future... you justify this... so I made the analogy, hence the words "according to your logic" which we all now know you lack.... do you know what an analogy is?

 MAYBE these are just us sentimental Israelis who don't view LAWS and MORAL OBLIGATIONS as different aspects. That is unlike The UN you so very much like to mention without willing to admit whether you view it as a moral compass or as a reflection of international consensus cause that would get you in trouble but still you do not see the contradiction in bringing up its resolutions concerning Israel. And you're acting as if you haven't fucked your own arguments up with the previous page of this thread when you admited that you simply do not see the connection between spending billions of dollars of support money on terrorism instead of investing it in bettering the life of the Palestinian population and the way things work out for the Palestinians, whose interests you're trying to defend with your nonsensical bullshit approach, for all these years.

LOL. You lost. I don't know which played a larger role... me fucking your arguments up, or you just making retarded comments... either way, now you can save yourself the embarassment.

By the way, where did I admit that I "do not see the connection between spending billions of dollars of support money on terrorism instead of investing it in bettering the life of the Palestinian population and the way things work out for the Palestinians". The Palestinian leadership has fucked up...  but that doesn't mean that Palestinians haven't been victims of Zionism. That's all I was arguing, and that's what I have proven. You call the adherence of laws and rights nonsensical... which I can understand  :)

SHALOM.

LMAO Weren't you taught to loose with respect?....This is like the 100th time you're trying to bail out of this debate proclaiming yourself the winner only to return again and to embarrass yourself even more with bullshit arguments and topic dodging. If you do not recall yourself admitting your ignorance just go back to the previous page man, I hope you can at least fathom your own bullshit. The fact Palestinian governments and Palestinian so called freedom fighters had been fuckin up for all these years didn't disappear into oblivion only because you chose to admit it, this fact casts on the frustration within the Palestinian people, the large predisposition to terrorism due to the frustration, the docility for manipulation by terroristic power structures. With the amounts of money they received they could've already lived like a decent developing state just like Israel had been at the dawn of its existence but these so called leaders chose FOR THEM a way of terrorism and you my friend are in the deepest of denials if you do not see this.
So yea, GOOD LUCK ON YOUR MIDTERMS, MAN.... Too bad my college year is gonna be accompanied by Kassams flying over my head while studying. Salam...!

So you say that I admitted it... then I ask you to show me where... and you come with this? LOLLL ... don't make statements you can't back.

Did the Palestinian leadership fuck up and let down its own people? Yes.
Is that the ONLY reason for their condition? No.

I wish I could draw diagrams out for you guys...
« Last Edit: October 28, 2005, 12:57:57 AM by JML - no vowels, disembowel your Colin Powell, throw in the towel »
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Re: Arafat Death Probe Inconclusive
« Reply #112 on: October 28, 2005, 01:09:49 AM »
Just to show you how brainwashed you are.... you kept referring to the wall as a fence... The Berlin Wall was about 96 miles long, and on average about 4 meters high. The Israeli FENCE LOOOL is supposed to be over 400 miles long when done, and is about 8 meters high (25 feet).



Fence? I think not... but then again, this picture must be propaganda used to brainwash me...
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makaveli11

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Re: Arafat Death Probe Inconclusive
« Reply #113 on: October 28, 2005, 01:54:37 AM »
 :o 400 miles long and 8 meters when done. Damn!!!
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Re: Arafat Death Probe Inconclusive
« Reply #114 on: October 28, 2005, 02:34:25 AM »


5. Israel receives money from the U.S to maintain it's existence and yes that includes the military budget taken into consideration the risks Israel is facing but look what Israel had done with its funding throughout its short existence. Despite a constant threat to our existence we have here a stable first world state and that's in such a short time period, many nations struggle for centuries before they are stabilized . With the International support money Arafat recieved - BILLIONS OF DOLLARS - He could've created infrastructures and he could've built schools but the money went for terrorism at times when Oslo was supposed to be his main goal and in addition the Fatah received weapons from Israel to maintain order- NICELY DONE!. Oslo was just a tactical step for Arafat.
Israel has done good for itself.. Arafat was an idiot... I agree, but what's your point? You can't stick to the argument.

OH GUESS WHO'S BACK....LOL weren't you leaving this debate??....WELCOME HOME SON!! CLOWN

Obviously YOU CAN'T fathom your own bullshit, I've lost all hope.

Here you go, just read your response, YOU SAID THAT YOU AGREE but that THIS HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE ARGUMENT and this is exactly what PROVES Palestinians are VICTIMS OF THEIR OWN LEADERSHIP and that Israel is coerced to overcome Palestinian terrorism since the Palestinian government refuses to handle\eradicate Palestinian terrorism despite condemning it in front of the media afterwards!-YOU OPENLY CHOSE TO IGNORE IT which is an unequivocal proof of you being either truly brainwashed or (since you claim you are not brainwashed) ignorant. When Abu Mazen reacted to this last bombing and Israel's response he actualy said something very interesting, you should grab onto his thought "This time we were the aggressors, this happned due to an internal flaw(meaning previous attacks were coordinated with the government??), I DO NOT WANT TO DEFEND ISRAEL BUT THIS IS THE TRUTH and it is important to be said" His advisers tried to correct him while saying this!...and truth is this is how this entire conflict started people just choose not to look back.



p.s What's up with you and this WALL (here u go " WALL"!!) I told you for like a billion times I'm against it.
« Last Edit: October 28, 2005, 03:02:01 AM by I TO DA GEEZY »
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Re: Arafat Death Probe Inconclusive
« Reply #115 on: October 28, 2005, 03:09:11 AM »
1. The whole point was that Palestinians have been victims to Zionism. That's a fact. Yes there are other factors which add to their condition, including their own leadership... I've always stated that Arafat was a fuck-up... but to deny that Zionism is not a factor, is just retarded.

2. The statement I made about the wall had nothing to do with you being for or against it... I was just pointing out who the brainwashed one is and to what extent... to call that a fence...
my throat hurts, its hard to swallow, and my body feels like i got a serious ass beating.

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I TO DA GEEZY

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Re: Arafat Death Probe Inconclusive
« Reply #116 on: October 28, 2005, 04:11:48 AM »
1. The whole point was that Palestinians have been victims to Zionism. That's a fact. Yes there are other factors which add to their condition, including their own leadership... I've always stated that Arafat was a fuck-up... but to deny that Zionism is not a factor, is just retarded.

2. The statement I made about the wall had nothing to do with you being for or against it... I was just pointing out who the brainwashed one is and to what extent... to call that a fence...

OK buddy read carefully now so you understand everything, I want you to know I mean exactly what I'm saying-

The Palestinian people ARE IN NO WAY VICTIMS OF ZIONISM- Your most notable Zionist right wing precursor wanted to embrace this population and the way things are today for the Israeli Arabs is a PROOF of his vision. LMAO try deporting one of these Israeli Arabs to the Palestinian Autonomy none of them will ever go, Israeli Arabs live tens of times better than the Palestinian population within the Palestinian Autonomy,there are many wealthy families among them, many Palestinians from within the Autonomy seek to marry girls out of Israeli Arabs' families to escape the poverty that had been stimulated within the Autonomy by Arafat and his accomplices through spending billions of dollars of support money on reinforcement of terrorist power structures, that is the same poverty that causes deep frustration within the the Palestinian population increasing its docility to manipulation by terrorist power structures- it's a WIN\WIN situation for terroristic organizations.The lack of cooperation on the part of the Palestinian government in eradication of terrorism is a direct cause to Israel's military coercion. You truly are a phenomenon man, I do not know what goes down inside of your mind, whether you really are in denial due to a nice brainwash or whether you're simply too damn ignorant to see the obvious,this is not clear to me.
« Last Edit: October 28, 2005, 04:14:40 AM by I TO DA GEEZY »
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Re: Arafat Death Probe Inconclusive
« Reply #117 on: October 28, 2005, 04:42:46 AM »
When money is used for peaceful purposes the public gains however when it is used for militant purposes only certain indeviduals profit from it, both financially and in reinforcement of their position of power.
« Last Edit: October 28, 2005, 04:49:19 AM by I TO DA GEEZY »
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7even

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Re: Arafat Death Probe Inconclusive
« Reply #118 on: October 28, 2005, 05:01:39 AM »
The whole idea of Israel is ridiculous.. planting an artificial state right where the "enemies" are and then slowly take their land.. don't tell me that wasn't the plan. About anyone who argues "it's our holy land, the bible says!!!11" I can only laugh, really. Im going to write a book in which it's stated that the whole world belongs to me, then go around from house to house, showing everybody my book and bulldoze their house. Everybody who fights back is a terrorist.
Cause I don't care where I belong no more
What we share or not I will ignore
And I won't waste my time fitting in
Cause I don't think contrast is a sin
No, it's not a sin
 

I TO DA GEEZY

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Re: Arafat Death Probe Inconclusive
« Reply #119 on: October 28, 2005, 06:48:06 AM »
The whole idea of Israel is ridiculous.. planting an artificial state right where the "enemies" are and then slowly take their land.. don't tell me that wasn't the plan. About anyone who argues "it's our holy land, the bible says!!!11" I can only laugh, really. Im going to write a book in which it's stated that the whole world belongs to me, then go around from house to house, showing everybody my book and bulldoze their house. Everybody who fights back is a terrorist.

First of all, these enemies you're refering to are our enemies by their own choice, this is history man.Up untill the Jews came here to gradually found their state these people were never our enemies, do I have to start over this debate?- we've covered this, ignoring facts is pointless however most of the world at those times was drenched with anti-semitism so there weren't many choices as for the geographical location of the upcoming Jewish national home.What was a not so great idea was proclaiming an arbitrary group of people as a NATION seeking for SELF-DETERMINATION only for the sake of removing an already established nation from land it was trying to regain after centuries without a national home espcially when this nation expressed its peaceful intentions and especially when this nation had been persecuted everywhere else . Second of all, according to what you're saying you must also be opposing to the existence of the US since the people who founded it despite its native population already had land, unlike Jews. This has little to do with religion but you're the one mentioning the bible, tell me, are you religious? - I believe you're not since you made the statement about writing a book about the whole world belonging to you, I mean that I hope you aren't religious otherwise this would be an empty statement.
« Last Edit: October 28, 2005, 06:54:06 AM by I TO DA GEEZY »
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7even

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Re: Arafat Death Probe Inconclusive
« Reply #120 on: October 28, 2005, 07:14:49 AM »
The whole idea of Israel is ridiculous.. planting an artificial state right where the "enemies" are and then slowly take their land.. don't tell me that wasn't the plan. About anyone who argues "it's our holy land, the bible says!!!11" I can only laugh, really. Im going to write a book in which it's stated that the whole world belongs to me, then go around from house to house, showing everybody my book and bulldoze their house. Everybody who fights back is a terrorist.

First of all, these enemies you're refering to are our enemies by their own choice, this is history man.Up untill the Jews came here to gradually found their state these people were never our enemies, do I have to start over this debate?- we've covered this, ignoring facts is pointless however most of the world at those times was drenched with anti-semitism so there weren't many choices as for the geographical location of the upcoming Jewish national home.What was a not so great idea was proclaiming an arbitrary group of people as a NATION seeking for SELF-DETERMINATION only for the sake of removing an already established nation from land it was trying to regain after centuries without a national home espcially when this nation expressed its peaceful intentions and especially when this nation had been persecuted everywhere else . Second of all, according to what you're saying you must also be opposing to the existence of the US since the people who founded it despite its native population already had land, unlike Jews. This has little to do with religion but you're the one mentioning the bible, tell me, are you religious? - I believe you're not since you made the statement about writing a book about the whole world belonging to you, I mean that I hope you aren't religious otherwise this would be an empty statement.

1. Im not religious and no matter how religious some people might be, there is no way a state should be created upon a quote from an ancient book. No matter if it's the bible, the qu'ran or detective story.

2. What the pilgrims did to the Indians was of course wrong, Im not here to argue that. How does that change anything?

3. What exactly are you now? A religion, a race or a nation? Seriously, I'm lost on that one. I heard it all now. "I'm not white, I'm Jewish." "We're a nation." I suppose Jews weren't hated in America, why didnt you make a state in Oregon, USA, or so? Canada is pretty huge with few people, why not creating a Jewish state in Canada? Why the fuck creating a state right there, when it's OBVIOUS there gon be trouble? Argueing that you claimed to have peaceful intentions is ridiculous, it's like a little child claiming it didnt mean to piss anyone off when it sits on the toy someone else wants to play with.. "Im just sitting there, hey, I ain't doing nothing, man".. that doesn't really work.
Why the hell you need a Jewish state anyway for that matter? Do we have a black state? Or a catholic state?


Anyways, this whole land grabbing thing is ridiculous from its very start, I'm sure everybody sees that, but has to stand up for his people, which I understand. The American government sure as hell sees this as well, but we all know how much the US loves to have control there and we all know how much power Jews have in the US. It's not about right or wrong, it's about power and money.
Cause I don't care where I belong no more
What we share or not I will ignore
And I won't waste my time fitting in
Cause I don't think contrast is a sin
No, it's not a sin
 

I TO DA GEEZY

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Re: Arafat Death Probe Inconclusive
« Reply #121 on: October 28, 2005, 08:51:43 AM »
The whole idea of Israel is ridiculous.. planting an artificial state right where the "enemies" are and then slowly take their land.. don't tell me that wasn't the plan. About anyone who argues "it's our holy land, the bible says!!!11" I can only laugh, really. Im going to write a book in which it's stated that the whole world belongs to me, then go around from house to house, showing everybody my book and bulldoze their house. Everybody who fights back is a terrorist.

First of all, these enemies you're refering to are our enemies by their own choice, this is history man.Up untill the Jews came here to gradually found their state these people were never our enemies, do I have to start over this debate?- we've covered this, ignoring facts is pointless however most of the world at those times was drenched with anti-semitism so there weren't many choices as for the geographical location of the upcoming Jewish national home.What was a not so great idea was proclaiming an arbitrary group of people as a NATION seeking for SELF-DETERMINATION only for the sake of removing an already established nation from land it was trying to regain after centuries without a national home espcially when this nation expressed its peaceful intentions and especially when this nation had been persecuted everywhere else . Second of all, according to what you're saying you must also be opposing to the existence of the US since the people who founded it despite its native population already had land, unlike Jews. This has little to do with religion but you're the one mentioning the bible, tell me, are you religious? - I believe you're not since you made the statement about writing a book about the whole world belonging to you, I mean that I hope you aren't religious otherwise this would be an empty statement.

1. Im not religious and no matter how religious some people might be, there is no way a state should be created upon a quote from an ancient book. No matter if it's the bible, the qu'ran or detective story.

2. What the pilgrims did to the Indians was of course wrong, Im not here to argue that. How does that change anything?

3. What exactly are you now? A religion, a race or a nation? Seriously, I'm lost on that one. I heard it all now. "I'm not white, I'm Jewish." "We're a nation." I suppose Jews weren't hated in America, why didnt you make a state in Oregon, USA, or so? Canada is pretty huge with few people, why not creating a Jewish state in Canada? Why the fuck creating a state right there, when it's OBVIOUS there gon be trouble? Argueing that you claimed to have peaceful intentions is ridiculous, it's like a little child claiming it didnt mean to piss anyone off when it sits on the toy someone else wants to play with.. "Im just sitting there, hey, I ain't doing nothing, man".. that doesn't really work.
Why the hell you need a Jewish state anyway for that matter? Do we have a black state? Or a catholic state?


Anyways, this whole land grabbing thing is ridiculous from its very start, I'm sure everybody sees that, but has to stand up for his people, which I understand. The American government sure as hell sees this as well, but we all know how much the US loves to have control there and we all know how much power Jews have in the US. It's not about right or wrong, it's about power and money.

I never said I was religious and the reasons for creating a Jewish state lay within the Jewish history and not within the Jewish religion, I'm very sorry that you haven't been taught Jewish history. Judaism is a religion, Jews are a nation and we are semites racialy. Jews wouldn't need a national home if it wasn't for the anti-semitism they've encountered throughout the centuries and its most prominent outlet- The Holocaust, history showed us Jews would've been extinct without a state.
The US is a country based on occupation of land for imperialistic purposes despite its native population by people who owned land by the time they got there, unlike Israel that was founded for purposes of refuge and survival of the Jewish people by people who didn't have any land before. Coming with peaceful intentions toward the native population unlike the American pilgrims, yet you choose to oppose Israels existence much more, I wonder why?
Zionists did come with peaceful intentions-IT'S A FACT....Hostility was triggered first by Palestinian puppet freedom fighters to prevent the creation of a Jewish state however not so that the Palestinians would have their own state but so that Egypt and Syria  could unite, bridging through Palestine. In 48 the UN didn't only decide on the creation of a Jewish state but of a Palestinian state as well and they had much more land than they have today. Have you ever wondered why it was never created?- Because the Arab nations that controlled the Palestinian freedom fighters weren't interested in granting these so called "Palestinians" with a state, they made up the Palestinian self-determination to claim at least some of the land,most of it as a matter of fact, do you not get this?

LMAO@ YOU SUPPOSING JEWS WEREN'T HATED IN AMERICA....This is ridiculous...OMG MAN! DID YOU JUST RETURN FROM OUTER SPACE??? Have you heared about the Saint Louis ship after Kristalnacht that left Hamburg  on May 13th  1939? It had 936 Jewish refugees from Nazi Germany and your Jewish loving USA REFUSED to let them in despite the fact 734 entrance clearances
among the passengers....How's that for your anti-semitism free USA?-FYI most of these refugees were MURDERED during The Holocaust.  Some of you people really crack me up with your fairy tale solutions.
« Last Edit: October 28, 2005, 09:08:29 AM by I TO DA GEEZY »
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7even

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Re: Arafat Death Probe Inconclusive
« Reply #122 on: October 28, 2005, 09:06:56 AM »
Quite frankly, I don't really care about stuff like you are "semites" racially, or that Jews are a nation. That's on some Star Trek shit to me. I don't like when people refrain from what really goes on and decide to hold on to some theoretical stuff, like "good intentions" or that  "the govt of Israel never ordered the murder of civil palestians". I see what I see. Now, my knowledge on this topic is indeed limited, I don't know much about your history and I also don't really bother to. And I don't need to. ALL that is relevent is this: You can't just take one's land and act like it's normal, LOL. It's really not much more complex than that. The issue is shockingly simple, really.
Cause I don't care where I belong no more
What we share or not I will ignore
And I won't waste my time fitting in
Cause I don't think contrast is a sin
No, it's not a sin
 

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Re: Arafat Death Probe Inconclusive
« Reply #123 on: October 28, 2005, 09:21:36 AM »
I see what I see. Now, my knowledge on this topic is indeed limited, I don't know much about your history and I also don't really bother to. And I don't need to. ALL that is relevent is this: You can't just take one's land and act like it's normal, LOL. It's really not much more complex than that. The issue is shockingly simple, really.

This conflict is anything but simple, arguing on this issue with insufficient knowledge is straight up GIBBERISH!!!

Simple huh?? If I remember correctly you're an American? Pack your stuff homeboy you're moving since you're occupying the land of Native Americans, BECAUSE I KNOW USA'S HISTORY AND YOU'RE LIVING ON THAT LAND IN CONTRADICTION OF YOUR OWN VIEWS,you're right, when it's simple, IT'S SIMPLE!!!
« Last Edit: October 28, 2005, 09:23:35 AM by I TO DA GEEZY »
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Re: Arafat Death Probe Inconclusive
« Reply #124 on: October 28, 2005, 10:03:12 AM »

The Palestinian people ARE IN NO WAY VICTIMS OF ZIONISM-

AHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAH....Damn, i needed that on a friday afternoon
"One day Alice came to a fork in the road and saw a Cheshire cat in a tree. "Which road do I take?" she asked. "Where do you want to go?" was his response. "I don't know," Alice answered. "Then," said the cat, "it doesn't matter."

- Lewis Carroll