Lifestyle > Train of Thought
Question for the Moslems
nibs:
--- Quote from: africas seed on March 26, 2006, 09:13:39 AM ---well said man. true shit. u dont have to be religious. God may be just as pleased if one lived a good life and was more spiritual than religious.
--- End quote ---
what is this distinction between religion and spirituality that you are drawing? by most definitions the two are intimately tied together.
across several religions there is the notion that it is more than just the actions and type of life one leads, but also the nature of what one believes that determines what happens after death.
there is pretty much consistency that nothing bad will happen to a person that has led a good life, but there is some debate to how much good will happen.
nibs:
--- Quote from: Wessia4LiaNia on March 26, 2006, 07:40:20 AM ---Let me tell you something...God may have one thousand names or faces. all you gotta do is believe in one and follow Him. He is there for all of us !
It doesn't matter what religion are you following, because they all have the same purpose and beliefs.
--- End quote ---
all religions have similar purposes, but they all do not have the same purpose. all religions can fit together in a sense. i agree with you to the extent that no religion is horribly bad, and all do some good. the extent of the good that they do varies. there is actually a great contrast between most religions, especially with the modern interpretations of these religions.
--- Quote ---Religion exists for us to believe in hope and try to be better persons...to realize that we have a meaning on this fuckin earth, love, have kids, enjoy the life cause it's short...
<snip>
It's not about following ANY religion, you follow the religion you were born into. The thing is to follow goodness, peace, wisdom. you are missing the point KAIN
--- End quote ---
there is disagreement even there across religions.
you mentioned wisdom, where do people gain wisdom if not through religion? if we agree that there is wisdom in religion; and we agree that various religions teach subtly and oft vastly different things, then we agree that the question of "which religion" is a completely valid and utterly important question. different religions provide varying degrees of wisdom
let's get specific.
the quran teaches the notion that the more pious are rewarded with access to higher heavens and thus closer proximity to god. thus, regular prayer and devotion to god is better.
the vedas and the gitas teach that there is one god that is in everything and everyone, and to escape the cycle of birth and death it is important to continually meditate on god, and at death, (and also in life) to clear one's self of all desires & negative karma, such that the soul will return to god/oneness and not to birth.
pay attention to the notion of "escape" there. individuals not wishing to escape the cycle of birth & death would still benefit from leading "a good life" to prevent building up negative karma and preserving dharma.
people look to religion for more than just guidance on how to act; but for an explanation to the nature of existence, man and god.
different religions paint different pictures on the nature of god as well as the potential outcomes to life.
you suggest that "loving, and having kids" is a fundamental part of life. this illustrates an interesting point. religions like buddhism and hinduism will reveal that these sorts of love are both temporary, and create greater ties to the false identity which makes an individual more susceptible to remaining trapped within the cycle of life and death. this is largely why priests, monks...etc lead celibate lives. individuals attaining the highest levels of spiritual enlightenment need not be concerned with families and children. choose a different profession...this is not condemning love, but merely revealing aspects to it's nature. in contrast the qu'ran encourages marriage and families.
in this sense, all religions are not the same, and do not teach the same things. the path does matter.
[sepehr]:
--- Quote from: nibs on March 26, 2006, 01:55:05 PM ---
--- Quote from: africas seed on March 26, 2006, 09:13:39 AM ---well said man. true shit. u dont have to be religious. God may be just as pleased if one lived a good life and was more spiritual than religious.
--- End quote ---
what is this distinction between religion and spirituality that you are drawing? by most definitions the two are intimately tied together.
across several religions there is the notion that it is more than just the actions and type of life one leads, but also the nature of what one believes that determines what happens after death.
there is pretty much consistency that nothing bad will happen to a person that has led a good life, but there is some debate to how much good will happen.
--- End quote ---
What would be the point of that then ? God won't care if you do good stuff, lead a good life, please others, but if you dont directly associate with him then you're screwed? Seems very dumb
africas seed:
nibs, ima have to give u a prop on ur breakdown on contrasting the diff religions and i agree wit u on many points in ur agrument.
--- Quote from: nibs on March 26, 2006, 01:55:05 PM ---
--- Quote from: africas seed on March 26, 2006, 09:13:39 AM ---well said man. true shit. u dont have to be religious. God may be just as pleased if one lived a good life and was more spiritual than religious.
--- End quote ---
what is this distinction between religion and spirituality that you are drawing? by most definitions the two are intimately tied together.
--- End quote ---
religious vs spiritual. one can be religious without being spiritual or vice versa. theres a lot of ppl out there that just go to church cuz they have to and not cuz they want to. i would say that these ppl r religious in that they adhere to certain traditions in a certain religion but i would describe them as not being spiritual as they arent practicing their faith actively and arent at peace with themselves and God or their faith.
nibs:
--- Quote from: africas seed on March 26, 2006, 04:02:24 PM ---religious vs spiritual. one can be religious without being spiritual or vice versa. theres a lot of ppl out there that just go to church cuz they have to and not cuz they want to. i would say that these ppl r religious in that they adhere to certain traditions in a certain religion but i would describe them as not being spiritual as they arent practicing their faith actively and arent at peace with themselves and God or their faith.
--- End quote ---
the purpose to the rituals in religion is to become more spiritual. without question people can engage in the rituals and get nothing out of it. i think it would be hard to be spiritual without the ritual aspect. without prayer or meditation it would be hard to be spiritual mean? how else do people connect with their spirituality.
the rest of the rituals, whether they be offerings, charitable behavior & donations; going to church or the masjid (group worship in any form)...these are all for the seeker to enhance the spirituality of the individual. whether it is developing humility, elinating the desire for selfishness, or developing the idea of community, togetherness, oneness...
these rituals are a large part of developing the spirituality of individuals, and this is across religions. i think the dispute is over that the idea that the rituals are obligations. ultimately the rituals are for the spiritual benefit of the doer, and not obligations that are needed.
this is why i question this notion of separating the rituals from spirituality. even if one rejects commonly accepted rituals, without rituals of some sort how do they realize their own spirituality?
Navigation
[0] Message Index
[#] Next page
[*] Previous page
Go to full version