ready to die or life after death

[Eihtball]

Do you realize that if every hip-hop artist thought like you, no rapper in the world would attempt to put out quality music?...Wait a minute, that's already the case. People like you are what's wrong with hip-hop nowadays, no lie.

LOL, a cracker telling ME that I'm what's wrong with hip-hop?  Hip-hop started going wrong entirely because suburban kids decided it was cool to be ghetto and gangsta and whatnot, and that's what the major labels started putting out.  No, no, no, son...what's wrong with hip-hop is a bunch of Eurotrash honkeys trying to shape a culture they know nothing about to fit THEIR standards and expectations.

Besides, nobody is saying quality has ZERO effect...it's just that I insist (but you deny) that if an album isn't well-remembered 10 years from the time it came out, that's a good indication it didn't change its genre significantly enough to deserve the status of "classic".

You obviously don't know shit about Tech N9ne, he revolutionized the whole KC rap scene, more than half of it only exists because of people he put on. So many people have tried biting his style and failed at it. LMAO@he's a nobody outside of KC. WOW! Shows how much you know, Tech N9ne gets soooo much love from the Bay to LA, he had ties with everyone, from E40, to Yukmouth, to Roger Troutman, to 2Pac...In fact, he currently lives in LA, and his music is very popular amongst LA heads...

Wow, revolutionized the KC rap scene...now please tell me, who gives a fuck about Kansas City outside of Kansas City niggas themselves?  You must be from KC and heavily biased if you think ANYONE really gives a shit at all about you muthafuckas.  I have lived in the West, the Northeast, and the Dirty South during my lifetime, and I don't know anyone but a handful of underground heads who even know who Tech N9ne is.  I'm sure he has followers outside of KC, but really, how many?  Let's do some counting here...how many units did his best-selling album move?  And more importantly, how many of those units were outside of his home town?

Oh, and BTW, I know somebody from Boston who makes the same argument about Krumb Snatcha, but we all know how seriously that's to be taken.

Unfortunately, you're too busy believing "Baby One More Time" is anything more than trash to realize that.

I never said "Baby One More Time" wasn't trash, and I don't listen to white redneck bitches' pop shit anyways.  But like it or not, that song IS going to be remembered 20 years from now, even if it's remembered as a nostalgia piece (like "U Can't Touch This" and "Ice Ice Baby" in hip-hop).

How is "Dogg Food" a classic? Ummm, maybe because it was the biggest fucking Dogg Pound (<<a legendary group amonst the west coast) album ever. Maybe because it had bangin track after bangin track all the way through. Maybe because it is flawlessly produced. Maybe because Daz & Kurupt would probably be crackhead bums on the streets if it wasn't for that album. "Dogg Food" > "Life After Death"

Key words are underlined here: "amongst the West Coast".  It did sell 2x Platinum (largely because of a now-forgotten controversy), but the fact is, Kurupt and Daz remain largely unknown outside of Cali, and if it wasn't for Snoop getting behind "Cali Iz Active" and Daz's new deal with So So Def, it would have stayed that way.  A lot of heads do respect Kurupt as an MC, but he has still yet to fulfill the potential he showed on "Dogg Food", anyway, and he has never held on to mainstream stardom.  There is almost nobody who remembers "NY, NY" the way "Gin and Juice" is remembered.

And LOL at "Dogg Food" being better than "Life After Death".  "Dogg Food" was good, but it was a paint-by-numbers G-Funk albums by and large..."Life After Death" pushed musical boundaries for the time.

...And I know all about the bullshit ass 5%er beliefs, believeing you are superior due to race=Nazi. You have a lot of growing up to do...PeACe

Wrong...Nazi = belief in fascism.  I am a leftist, not a rightest, stupid white boy.  And it is true that I am descended from a race of kings and queens...read Genesis 7:6.

[Now_Im_Not_Banned]

Do you realize that if every hip-hop artist thought like you, no rapper in the world would attempt to put out quality music?...Wait a minute, that's already the case. People like you are what's wrong with hip-hop nowadays, no lie.

LOL, a cracker telling ME that I'm what's wrong with hip-hop?  Hip-hop started going wrong entirely because suburban kids decided it was cool to be ghetto and gangsta and whatnot, and that's what the major labels started putting out.  No, no, no, son...what's wrong with hip-hop is a bunch of Eurotrash honkeys trying to shape a culture they know nothing about to fit THEIR standards and expectations.

Besides, nobody is saying quality has ZERO effect...it's just that I insist (but you deny) that if an album isn't well-remembered 10 years from the time it came out, that's a good indication it didn't change its genre significantly enough to deserve the status of "classic".

Nice try, moron, I'm not even white. You implied quality had zero effect by saying that "Baby One More Time" was a classic...

Wow, revolutionized the KC rap scene...now please tell me, who gives a fuck about Kansas City outside of Kansas City niggas themselves?  You must be from KC and heavily biased if you think ANYONE really gives a shit at all about you muthafuckas.  I have lived in the West, the Northeast, and the Dirty South during my lifetime, and I don't know anyone but a handful of underground heads who even know who Tech N9ne is.  I'm sure he has followers outside of KC, but really, how many?  Let's do some counting here...how many units did his best-selling album move?  And more importantly, how many of those units were outside of his home town?

You're just too dumb to understand that how much an album sells doesn't mean shit..Tech N9ne might not sell millions of records, but he makes his cheese, the underground hip-hop scene is much stronger than the mainstream hip-hop scene nowadays, and by your definition, the underground hip-hop scene simply CANT put out a classic, which is simply the biggest load of bullshit ever...You sound like a record exec yourself, "give them what sells and it'll become classic"...You're more of a cracker then me, son, that is not the mind-state true heads have...In fact, hip-hop stands for everything against what you're saying...So please, do yourself a big favor, and shut the fuck up.

Oh, and BTW, I know somebody from Boston who makes the same argument about Krumb Snatcha, but we all know how seriously that's to be taken.

LMFAO@the comparison of Tech N9ne and Krumb Snatcha...

I never said "Baby One More Time" wasn't trash, and I don't listen to white redneck bitches' pop shit anyways.  But like it or not, that song IS going to be remembered 20 years from now, even if it's remembered as a nostalgia piece (like "U Can't Touch This" and "Ice Ice Baby" in hip-hop).

This just brings me back to your quote, "nobody is saying quality has ZERO effect"...Oh wow, not only are you a fake Black Panther, but now you're a fucking schizo too...

Key words are underlined here: "amongst the West Coast".  It did sell 2x Platinum (largely because of a now-forgotten controversy), but the fact is, Kurupt and Daz remain largely unknown outside of Cali, and if it wasn't for Snoop getting behind "Cali Iz Active" and Daz's new deal with So So Def, it would have stayed that way.  A lot of heads do respect Kurupt as an MC, but he has still yet to fulfill the potential he showed on "Dogg Food", anyway, and he has never held on to mainstream stardom.  There is almost nobody who remembers "NY, NY" the way "Gin and Juice" is remembered.

And LOL at "Dogg Food" being better than "Life After Death".  "Dogg Food" was good, but it was a paint-by-numbers G-Funk albums by and large..."Life After Death" pushed musical boundaries for the time.

Your argument: "Life After Death" was more popular. Okay, so Vin Disel is a better actor than Crispen Glover. Yao Ming is a better basketball player than Jermaine O'Neal...IT DOESNT WORK THAT WAY!

Wrong...Nazi = belief in fascism.  I am a leftist, not a rightest, stupid white boy.  And it is true that I am descended from a race of kings and queens...read Genesis 7:6.

Once again, idiot, I am not a white boy...You probably descended from crackheads and drugdealers...

[westkoastanostra]

Wrong...Nazi = belief in fascism.  I am a leftist, not a rightest, stupid white boy.  And it is true that I am descended from a race of kings and queens...read Genesis 7:6.

Once again, idiot, I am not a white boy...You probably descended from crackheads and drugdealers...

LMAO! he probably did...thats y he brags about being a "GOD"....but deep down he's hurt...

[7even]

Eihtball, lol, you shouldn't spit that GOD crap outside of ToT... people who don't know you might actually take this seriously.

[Eihtball]

Eihtball, lol, you shouldn't spit that GOD crap outside of ToT... people who don't know you might actually take this seriously.

And that's why I do it...I like seeing people react.  And both of these white boys have given me excellent reactions.

LMAO! he probably did...thats y he brags about being a "GOD"....but deep down he's hurt...

Not at all.  I know you're hurting because I have proven your cracker views wrong.

Nice try, moron, I'm not even white. You implied quality had zero effect by saying that "Baby One More Time" was a classic...

No, I did not...that's just how YOU interpret it.  I have already explained this elusive (to you) difference between music that is classic for nostalgic purposes vs. music that's remembered for being exceptionally good.

And of course you're white, or something equally sub-par to the GODS.  Only a white person would have such a stupid backpacker-esque attitude towards hip-hop like you do.

You're just too dumb to understand that how much an album sells doesn't mean shit..Tech N9ne might not sell millions of records, but he makes his cheese, the underground hip-hop scene is much stronger than the mainstream hip-hop scene nowadays, and by your definition, the underground hip-hop scene simply CANT put out a classic, which is simply the biggest load of bullshit ever...You sound like a record exec yourself, "give them what sells and it'll become classic"...You're more of a cracker then me, son, that is not the mind-state true heads have...In fact, hip-hop stands for everything against what you're saying...So please, do yourself a big favor, and shut the fuck up.

LOL, how much an album sells doesn't mean shit?  No, son, I don't think you understand...it may be mistaken to assume that just because an album sells millions, it's dope, but it is not at all incorrect to say that if an artist is still maintaining a dedicated following and consistently selling a million records with every release, then clearly, they are exceptional.  The mainstream is certainly stupid, but the thing is, the mainstream has such a short attention span that if an artist CAN manage to stay in the spotlight, it's usually a safe bet that they have found their own niche.  Look at Snoop Dogg...almost 15 years and he's still putting out Platinum albums.  Look at his homes, Warren G, Kurupt, and Daz...back in the mid-90s, they were selling Platinum, but now, nobody except West Coast heads buy their shit.  Why?  Because they are now irrelevent.  Snoop, in comparison, knows how to reinvent himself when necesary to stay relevent to hip-hop.  And that is why he is now a Godfather figure in the game while DPG are just riding on his coattails to stay alive.

The underground can never put out a classic?  Never said that.  But if an underground artist doesn't expand beyond an underground following, it's a safe bet that they probably haven't done anything exceptional.  Tribe, GangStarr, Mobb Deep, Nas, Wu Tang Clan, etc. all started out as "underground" artists, but they were so good that through word-of-mouth, people learned about them and started buying their records, and before long, they worked their way up to Gold and then Platinum sales.  Generally speaking, they all never really "crossed over", but they had so many underground heads buzzing that they didn't need constant MTV or BET exposure to sell lots of records.

And I don't care if Tech N9ne is making his cheese independently.  The fact is, if he hasn't expanded his following significantly, then clearly, there are millions of people that don't give a fuck about him.  Underground heads can easily be as stupid as mainstream heads (sometimes moreso)...they are just as divided and equally closed-minded in a lot of cases.

LMFAO@the comparison of Tech N9ne and Krumb Snatcha...

I never said that...he did.  But this dude says, Krumb Snatcha is respected in Boston and has a big underground following, so according to him, Krumb Snatcha has dropped "classic" albums.  How is that opinion any more or less valid than yours?  To put it bluntly, it ISN'T.  Underground heads are always biased towards certainly artists that they like even if those artists haven't really done anything worthy of "classic" status.

This just brings me back to your quote, "nobody is saying quality has ZERO effect"...Oh wow, not only are you a fake Black Panther, but now you're a fucking schizo too...

LOL, no, it's just that your illiterate ass can never comprehend the extremely valid points I am making.

Your argument: "Life After Death" was more popular. Okay, so Vin Disel is a better actor than Crispen Glover. Yao Ming is a better basketball player than Jermaine O'Neal...IT DOESNT WORK THAT WAY!

No, my argument is not that "Life After Death" was more popular - my argument is that it is STILL more popular.  Both "Life After Death" and "Dogg Food" sold millions of copies, so clearly, the mainstream was well-aware of both of them at the time they were released.  But 10 years later, "Life After Death" is still remembered (and being bumped today) while "Doog Food" has been mostly forgotten.  Why is this?  Again, because "Dogg Food" was not an exceptional piece of music at all when it came out, while "Life After Death" was and still is.

As far as the actor argument goes, Vin Diesel has been steadily falling off the past few years.  Why?  Because he was a flash-in-the pan whose time is now almost up - just as Warren G and DPG were 10 years ago.  That is the legitimate comparison.

Once again, idiot, I am not a white boy...You probably descended from crackheads and drugdealers...

Yes, you are white, or something else that's equally bad.

I am descended from a family of kings and queens.  Only a non-black would fail to appreciate that and respond the way you do.

[westkoastanostra]

^^^got damn negroe...essays and essays...i aint reading that shit!

[Now_Im_Not_Banned]

Eihtball, lol, you shouldn't spit that GOD crap outside of ToT... people who don't know you might actually take this seriously.

And that's why I do it...I like seeing people react.  And both of these white boys have given me excellent reactions.

LMAO! he probably did...thats y he brags about being a "GOD"....but deep down he's hurt...

Not at all.  I know you're hurting because I have proven your cracker views wrong.

Nice try, moron, I'm not even white. You implied quality had zero effect by saying that "Baby One More Time" was a classic...

No, I did not...that's just how YOU interpret it.  I have already explained this elusive (to you) difference between music that is classic for nostalgic purposes vs. music that's remembered for being exceptionally good.

And of course you're white, or something equally sub-par to the GODS.  Only a white person would have such a stupid backpacker-esque attitude towards hip-hop like you do.

You're just too dumb to understand that how much an album sells doesn't mean shit..Tech N9ne might not sell millions of records, but he makes his cheese, the underground hip-hop scene is much stronger than the mainstream hip-hop scene nowadays, and by your definition, the underground hip-hop scene simply CANT put out a classic, which is simply the biggest load of bullshit ever...You sound like a record exec yourself, "give them what sells and it'll become classic"...You're more of a cracker then me, son, that is not the mind-state true heads have...In fact, hip-hop stands for everything against what you're saying...So please, do yourself a big favor, and shut the fuck up.

LOL, how much an album sells doesn't mean shit?  No, son, I don't think you understand...it may be mistaken to assume that just because an album sells millions, it's dope, but it is not at all incorrect to say that if an artist is still maintaining a dedicated following and consistently selling a million records with every release, then clearly, they are exceptional.  The mainstream is certainly stupid, but the thing is, the mainstream has such a short attention span that if an artist CAN manage to stay in the spotlight, it's usually a safe bet that they have found their own niche.  Look at Snoop Dogg...almost 15 years and he's still putting out Platinum albums.  Look at his homes, Warren G, Kurupt, and Daz...back in the mid-90s, they were selling Platinum, but now, nobody except West Coast heads buy their shit.  Why?  Because they are now irrelevent.  Snoop, in comparison, knows how to reinvent himself when necesary to stay relevent to hip-hop.  And that is why he is now a Godfather figure in the game while DPG are just riding on his coattails to stay alive.

The underground can never put out a classic?  Never said that.  But if an underground artist doesn't expand beyond an underground following, it's a safe bet that they probably haven't done anything exceptional.  Tribe, GangStarr, Mobb Deep, Nas, Wu Tang Clan, etc. all started out as "underground" artists, but they were so good that through word-of-mouth, people learned about them and started buying their records, and before long, they worked their way up to Gold and then Platinum sales.  Generally speaking, they all never really "crossed over", but they had so many underground heads buzzing that they didn't need constant MTV or BET exposure to sell lots of records.

And I don't care if Tech N9ne is making his cheese independently.  The fact is, if he hasn't expanded his following significantly, then clearly, there are millions of people that don't give a fuck about him.  Underground heads can easily be as stupid as mainstream heads (sometimes moreso)...they are just as divided and equally closed-minded in a lot of cases.

LMFAO@the comparison of Tech N9ne and Krumb Snatcha...

I never said that...he did.  But this dude says, Krumb Snatcha is respected in Boston and has a big underground following, so according to him, Krumb Snatcha has dropped "classic" albums.  How is that opinion any more or less valid than yours?  To put it bluntly, it ISN'T.  Underground heads are always biased towards certainly artists that they like even if those artists haven't really done anything worthy of "classic" status.

This just brings me back to your quote, "nobody is saying quality has ZERO effect"...Oh wow, not only are you a fake Black Panther, but now you're a fucking schizo too...

LOL, no, it's just that your illiterate ass can never comprehend the extremely valid points I am making.

Your argument: "Life After Death" was more popular. Okay, so Vin Disel is a better actor than Crispen Glover. Yao Ming is a better basketball player than Jermaine O'Neal...IT DOESNT WORK THAT WAY!

No, my argument is not that "Life After Death" was more popular - my argument is that it is STILL more popular.  Both "Life After Death" and "Dogg Food" sold millions of copies, so clearly, the mainstream was well-aware of both of them at the time they were released.  But 10 years later, "Life After Death" is still remembered (and being bumped today) while "Doog Food" has been mostly forgotten.  Why is this?  Again, because "Dogg Food" was not an exceptional piece of music at all when it came out, while "Life After Death" was and still is.

As far as the actor argument goes, Vin Diesel has been steadily falling off the past few years.  Why?  Because he was a flash-in-the pan whose time is now almost up - just as Warren G and DPG were 10 years ago.  That is the legitimate comparison.

Once again, idiot, I am not a white boy...You probably descended from crackheads and drugdealers...

Yes, you are white, or something else that's equally bad.

I am descended from a family of kings and queens.  Only a non-black would fail to appreciate that and respond the way you do.

You're OBVIOUSLY a fucking character, and nothing more. Now shut your trap, because you're not impressing anyone...Snoop Dogg is more popular than Warren G and Kurupt because he is a CHARACTER, not a rapper. He expanded, he kept his face in the public, he did movies, sports, television, hell, even porn! It has absolutely nothing to do with the value of his music, Snoop could record himself taking shits and it would sell...Unfortunately, you're so black that you only see shit in black...Mobb Deep, Nas, Gangstarr, all those artists you listed put out albums on MAJOR labels...Who cares where they started, some people choose to stay independant, because record companies ain't the same nowadays. You're not a hip-hop head, in fact, you don't know the first thing to hip-hop. You're just a black crackhead...Now shut the fuck up before I starve you and give you crackers...


P.S. still LMFAO@comparing Krumb Snatcha's value to Tech N9ne's...

[Eihtball]

^^^got damn negroe...essays and essays...i aint reading that shit!

I know, that's because like all kids today, you have ZERO fucking attention span.  See how far that gets you in life, son.

You're OBVIOUSLY a fucking character, and nothing more. Now shut your trap, because you're not impressing anyone...

Nope, I am a GOD.  The only person who needs to shut the fuck up is YOU, son.  When a supreme being talks to you and says you are wrong, you accept what he says.

Snoop Dogg is more popular than Warren G and Kurupt because he is a CHARACTER, not a rapper. He expanded, he kept his face in the public, he did movies, sports, television, hell, even porn! It has absolutely nothing to do with the value of his music, Snoop could record himself taking shits and it would sell...

Bullshit.  That's only been within the past few years that he made himself into a pop icon ("character" is the wrong word).  10 years ago, people were saying Snoop would be done for after "Tha Doggfather" did poorly and didn't produce any hit singles.  But Snoop showed that he could keep putting out popular, quality music, and that's what he did...first on No Limit (except for "Da Game Is To Be Sold Not Told"...that was shit), then on Doggystyle Records.  AFTER he had successfully re-established himself as a rapper, he began doing mouthwash commercials and Girls Gone Wild specials, because the continuing popularity of his music gave him that kind of power.

Nothing to do with the value of his music?  LOL, typical of the kind of bullshit you talk.  12 years into his career, Snoop scored his biggest hit ever with "Drop It Like It's Hot".  Clearly, most people still enjoy Snoop's music and would like to disagree with you.  Snoop's music still sells because even if it isn't always what West Coast fans want (and they're overly-critical, anyway), it is still good music and it still crosses over successfully.  He is obviously doing something right with his music that Warren G and Kurupt aren't doing, because for every 1 out of 10 fans who calls him a sellout, he still has 9 other fans who still buy his albums.

And if keeping your face public is all you have to do to remain a rap star, then why didn't Warren G and Kurupt try it?  You think they really don't mind being on indie labels and selling 50,000 records (if that) per release?  And Kurupt DID try acting, which didn't do shit for him.

Unfortunately, you're so black that you only see shit in black...

Or maybe you're just so white that you only see shit in white.

Mobb Deep, Nas, Gangstarr, all those artists you listed put out albums on MAJOR labels...

And they often got their deals from underground popularity.  Nas got his start essentially because of ONE VERSE on "Live At The Barbeque" with Main Source.  The Wu got their deal after they put out "Protect Ya Neck" as a single (independently) and it blew up across NYC.  And even if those artists did put out their music on major labels, the fact is that they had little promotion even then (especially Mobb and the Wu...Loud was always terribly managed) and they never had their singles getting big exposure on MTV; they sold millions of records almost entirely through underground word-of-mouth.

Who cares where they started, some people choose to stay independant, because record companies ain't the same nowadays.

Bullshit.  The only rappers who say that are the ones who are trying to convince themselves they're just too good for the average cat to listen to.  ALL rappers love having money and bling and ho's, even the underground ones.  There are a VERY FEW exceptions (Immortal Technique being an example), artists who can sell lots of records without a deal and make serious dough.  But even the average underground rapper would LOVE to get some huge advance so that he can buy himself an Escalade and a crib out of the projects.  There is almost nobody in the rap game who ain't ballin for shit they didn't have growing up, except of course for the backpackers (losers).

You're not a hip-hop head, in fact, you don't know the first thing to hip-hop. You're just a black crackhead...

LOL, and you really are?  Haha...faggot.

Now shut the fuck up before I starve you and give you crackers...

Try that, cracker.  The GOD will never shut up, and you can't shut him up (especially on a fucking computer...ha!)

P.S. still LMFAO@comparing Krumb Snatcha's value to Tech N9ne's...

I'm not comparing those two rappers...I'm comparing two types of IDIOTS, you and this other dude.  That ain't the same, get it straight, cracker.

[Bomb-A®]

I don't think this deserves to be a question...


"Ready To Die" >> "Life After Death"

[Now_Im_Not_Banned]

^^^got damn negroe...essays and essays...i aint reading that shit!

I know, that's because like all kids today, you have ZERO fucking attention span.  See how far that gets you in life, son.

You're OBVIOUSLY a fucking character, and nothing more. Now shut your trap, because you're not impressing anyone...

Nope, I am a GOD.  The only person who needs to shut the fuck up is YOU, son.  When a supreme being talks to you and says you are wrong, you accept what he says.

Snoop Dogg is more popular than Warren G and Kurupt because he is a CHARACTER, not a rapper. He expanded, he kept his face in the public, he did movies, sports, television, hell, even porn! It has absolutely nothing to do with the value of his music, Snoop could record himself taking shits and it would sell...

Bullshit.  That's only been within the past few years that he made himself into a pop icon ("character" is the wrong word).  10 years ago, people were saying Snoop would be done for after "Tha Doggfather" did poorly and didn't produce any hit singles.  But Snoop showed that he could keep putting out popular, quality music, and that's what he did...first on No Limit (except for "Da Game Is To Be Sold Not Told"...that was shit), then on Doggystyle Records.  AFTER he had successfully re-established himself as a rapper, he began doing mouthwash commercials and Girls Gone Wild specials, because the continuing popularity of his music gave him that kind of power.

Nothing to do with the value of his music?  LOL, typical of the kind of bullshit you talk.  12 years into his career, Snoop scored his biggest hit ever with "Drop It Like It's Hot".  Clearly, most people still enjoy Snoop's music and would like to disagree with you.  Snoop's music still sells because even if it isn't always what West Coast fans want (and they're overly-critical, anyway), it is still good music and it still crosses over successfully.  He is obviously doing something right with his music that Warren G and Kurupt aren't doing, because for every 1 out of 10 fans who calls him a sellout, he still has 9 other fans who still buy his albums.

And if keeping your face public is all you have to do to remain a rap star, then why didn't Warren G and Kurupt try it?  You think they really don't mind being on indie labels and selling 50,000 records (if that) per release?  And Kurupt DID try acting, which didn't do shit for him.

Unfortunately, you're so black that you only see shit in black...

Or maybe you're just so white that you only see shit in white.

Mobb Deep, Nas, Gangstarr, all those artists you listed put out albums on MAJOR labels...

And they often got their deals from underground popularity.  Nas got his start essentially because of ONE VERSE on "Live At The Barbeque" with Main Source.  The Wu got their deal after they put out "Protect Ya Neck" as a single (independently) and it blew up across NYC.  And even if those artists did put out their music on major labels, the fact is that they had little promotion even then (especially Mobb and the Wu...Loud was always terribly managed) and they never had their singles getting big exposure on MTV; they sold millions of records almost entirely through underground word-of-mouth.

Who cares where they started, some people choose to stay independant, because record companies ain't the same nowadays.

Bullshit.  The only rappers who say that are the ones who are trying to convince themselves they're just too good for the average cat to listen to.  ALL rappers love having money and bling and ho's, even the underground ones.  There are a VERY FEW exceptions (Immortal Technique being an example), artists who can sell lots of records without a deal and make serious dough.  But even the average underground rapper would LOVE to get some huge advance so that he can buy himself an Escalade and a crib out of the projects.  There is almost nobody in the rap game who ain't ballin for shit they didn't have growing up, except of course for the backpackers (losers).

You're not a hip-hop head, in fact, you don't know the first thing to hip-hop. You're just a black crackhead...

LOL, and you really are?  Haha...faggot.

Now shut the fuck up before I starve you and give you crackers...

Try that, cracker.  The GOD will never shut up, and you can't shut him up (especially on a fucking computer...ha!)

P.S. still LMFAO@comparing Krumb Snatcha's value to Tech N9ne's...

I'm not comparing those two rappers...I'm comparing two types of IDIOTS, you and this other dude.  That ain't the same, get it straight, cracker.

Chink-boy, all that shit you're typing up is useless, shut the fuck up. You didn't change my opinion, quality is the first characteristic of a classic. PERIOD. It'll never change... No matter what the fuck you say, no matter how many essays you type about being a God to try and convince me otherwise...The bottom line is that you're stupid. You talk about Wu and their 5%er beliefs, yet you don't even realize Remedy, who's Jewish, is known as a Wu-Tang Killa Bee...You talk about Mobb Deep and Wu-Tang selling independently, when their albums were to be found in every record store in every city...The game ain't the same, with downloading and bootlegging, some artists who would have sold 10 years ago won't sell today...An artist can make an album at home, and if it was good enough, it would be classic...Even if 5 people heard it, and they all thought it was brilliant, it could still be classic...Unfortunately, you think like a WHITE GIRL...For you, shit needs to be POPULAR to have classic value...Goddamn chinks always think they know shit...

[westkoastanostra]

^^^got damn negroe...essays and essays...i aint reading that shit!

I know, that's because like all kids today, you have ZERO fucking attention span.  See how far that gets you in life, son.

You're OBVIOUSLY a fucking character, and nothing more. Now shut your trap, because you're not impressing anyone...

Nope, I am a GOD.  The only person who needs to shut the fuck up is YOU, son.  When a supreme being talks to you and says you are wrong, you accept what he says.

Snoop Dogg is more popular than Warren G and Kurupt because he is a CHARACTER, not a rapper. He expanded, he kept his face in the public, he did movies, sports, television, hell, even porn! It has absolutely nothing to do with the value of his music, Snoop could record himself taking shits and it would sell...

Bullshit.  That's only been within the past few years that he made himself into a pop icon ("character" is the wrong word).  10 years ago, people were saying Snoop would be done for after "Tha Doggfather" did poorly and didn't produce any hit singles.  But Snoop showed that he could keep putting out popular, quality music, and that's what he did...first on No Limit (except for "Da Game Is To Be Sold Not Told"...that was shit), then on Doggystyle Records.  AFTER he had successfully re-established himself as a rapper, he began doing mouthwash commercials and Girls Gone Wild specials, because the continuing popularity of his music gave him that kind of power.

Nothing to do with the value of his music?  LOL, typical of the kind of bullshit you talk.  12 years into his career, Snoop scored his biggest hit ever with "Drop It Like It's Hot".  Clearly, most people still enjoy Snoop's music and would like to disagree with you.  Snoop's music still sells because even if it isn't always what West Coast fans want (and they're overly-critical, anyway), it is still good music and it still crosses over successfully.  He is obviously doing something right with his music that Warren G and Kurupt aren't doing, because for every 1 out of 10 fans who calls him a sellout, he still has 9 other fans who still buy his albums.

And if keeping your face public is all you have to do to remain a rap star, then why didn't Warren G and Kurupt try it?  You think they really don't mind being on indie labels and selling 50,000 records (if that) per release?  And Kurupt DID try acting, which didn't do shit for him.

Unfortunately, you're so black that you only see shit in black...

Or maybe you're just so white that you only see shit in white.

Mobb Deep, Nas, Gangstarr, all those artists you listed put out albums on MAJOR labels...

And they often got their deals from underground popularity.  Nas got his start essentially because of ONE VERSE on "Live At The Barbeque" with Main Source.  The Wu got their deal after they put out "Protect Ya Neck" as a single (independently) and it blew up across NYC.  And even if those artists did put out their music on major labels, the fact is that they had little promotion even then (especially Mobb and the Wu...Loud was always terribly managed) and they never had their singles getting big exposure on MTV; they sold millions of records almost entirely through underground word-of-mouth.

Who cares where they started, some people choose to stay independant, because record companies ain't the same nowadays.

Bullshit.  The only rappers who say that are the ones who are trying to convince themselves they're just too good for the average cat to listen to.  ALL rappers love having money and bling and ho's, even the underground ones.  There are a VERY FEW exceptions (Immortal Technique being an example), artists who can sell lots of records without a deal and make serious dough.  But even the average underground rapper would LOVE to get some huge advance so that he can buy himself an Escalade and a crib out of the projects.  There is almost nobody in the rap game who ain't ballin for shit they didn't have growing up, except of course for the backpackers (losers).

You're not a hip-hop head, in fact, you don't know the first thing to hip-hop. You're just a black crackhead...

LOL, and you really are?  Haha...faggot.

Now shut the fuck up before I starve you and give you crackers...

Try that, cracker.  The GOD will never shut up, and you can't shut him up (especially on a fucking computer...ha!)

P.S. still LMFAO@comparing Krumb Snatcha's value to Tech N9ne's...

I'm not comparing those two rappers...I'm comparing two types of IDIOTS, you and this other dude.  That ain't the same, get it straight, cracker.

thanks...but got damn negroe...essays and essays...i aint reading that shit!

[Eihtball]

Chink-boy, all that shit you're typing up is useless, shut the fuck up.

Chink?  Where the fuck did that come up from?  Must be psychologic projection, so that's what I'll call your ass from now on: A chink.

And of course I won't shut the fuck up.  When you gon learn that a GOD speaks his mind and is never wrong.

You didn't change my opinion, quality is the first characteristic of a classic. PERIOD. It'll never change... No matter what the fuck you say, no matter how many essays you type about being a God to try and convince me otherwise...

Convince you?  Where'd you get that idea?  I ain't trying to change your opinion at all, cause of course you're too stubborn to agree with me.  I'm simply trying to make you look stupid (which I have already done repeatedly now) and show other people, once again, how it is that I earned my status as a GOD on DubCC in the first place.

And for the last fuckin time, I never argued quality isn't part of what defines a classic; I'm simply arguing that it's less important than YOU believe compared to this thing that dictionary.com calls "enduring significance".

The bottom line is that you're stupid. You talk about Wu and their 5%er beliefs, yet you don't even realize Remedy, who's Jewish, is known as a Wu-Tang Killa Bee...

I know who Remedy is.  But you think that matters?  Wu Tang albums are littered with disapproving references to the white devil, as well as Judgment Day.  The fact that they make a few exceptions here and there is hardly redeeming.  Pretty much all rappers that aren't backpackers do not welcome the majority of crackers into hip-hop.  From the days of PE on, the white man has always been seen as hip-hop's enemy.

So you call me stupid, and yet you get mad at me for saying the same shit that your favorite rapper has probably said on record way before me.

You talk about Mobb Deep and Wu-Tang selling independently, when their albums were to be found in every record store in every city...

LOL, no, chink, that's just your illiterate ass not reading again.  All I said was that Mobb Deep and the Wu were on a label that was notorious for being mis-managed and doing a terrible job of promoting its artists.

And it IS true that the reason the Wu got their record deal was because they put out "Protect Ya Neck" (which was a single, not an album) and the underground was feeling them.

Even if 5 people heard it, and they all thought it was brilliant, it could still be classic...

LOL, and this pretty much proves how stupid you are in a nutshell.  So if 5 people think Dem Franchise Boyz "On Top Of Our Game" is a classic, that makes them right?  I don't think so.

If an album is not embraced by the larger hip-hop community (NOT just some local scene such as Kansas City) and it is not remembered by the larger hip-hop community 10 years later, then no, it cannot legimately be considered a classic.  I was listening to my own hometown's (Durham) Little Brother years before they got their record deal, and I thought they were ill.  But I would have never called their first album a classic, even though I thought it was extremely dope.  Now, on the other hand, they've put out "The Minstrel Show" which is getting mad acclaim from just about everybody.  Will it be a classic?  I dunno, but it's getting major props and recognition from cats all over the U.S. and has won a zillion awards from music publications.  If it is remembered 5-10 years from now, then yes, I think it probably deserves classic status.

Unfortunately, you think like a WHITE GIRL...For you, shit needs to be POPULAR to have classic value...Goddamn chinks always think they know shit...

No, you just think like a white boy, or a chink for that matter (which is clearly what you are).  Fucking crackers and chinks always act like they know what's up, when they have no business trying to run Blackman's culture.  We created it, and we don't need your input.

Shit doesn't have to be POPULAR to have classic value; it has to be MEMORABLE.  That shows that it's unique and exceptional in some way.  And generally speaking, it isn't at all inaccurate to say that if something becomes widely embraced by a lot of people and is remembered 10 years later, then that means it's earned "classic" status.

So let me break it down for you:

Bad music = Forgettable music
Quality music = Good, but not necesarily memorable
Exceptional music = Memorable and quality

So thus, it is only "exceptional" music that equals "classic" music.  It's that simple.

[jeromechickenbone]

^^^^People not reading your posts has less to do with their attention span and more to do with not wanting to sift through your played out black panther gimmick.  At least interject some comedy or something.  I mean, the other retard characters on here have some redeeming values in their posts. 

You're horrible at trying to be the villain,  you're not funny or provactive, your shit is VANILLA.  Boring as a motherfucker.

[Now_Im_Not_Banned]

Chink-boy, all that shit you're typing up is useless, shut the fuck up.

Chink?  Where the fuck did that come up from?  Must be psychologic projection, so that's what I'll call your ass from now on: A chink.

And of course I won't shut the fuck up.  When you gon learn that a GOD speaks his mind and is never wrong.

You didn't change my opinion, quality is the first characteristic of a classic. PERIOD. It'll never change... No matter what the fuck you say, no matter how many essays you type about being a God to try and convince me otherwise...

Convince you?  Where'd you get that idea?  I ain't trying to change your opinion at all, cause of course you're too stubborn to agree with me.  I'm simply trying to make you look stupid (which I have already done repeatedly now) and show other people, once again, how it is that I earned my status as a GOD on DubCC in the first place.

And for the last fuckin time, I never argued quality isn't part of what defines a classic; I'm simply arguing that it's less important than YOU believe compared to this thing that dictionary.com calls "enduring significance".

The bottom line is that you're stupid. You talk about Wu and their 5%er beliefs, yet you don't even realize Remedy, who's Jewish, is known as a Wu-Tang Killa Bee...

I know who Remedy is.  But you think that matters?  Wu Tang albums are littered with disapproving references to the white devil, as well as Judgment Day.  The fact that they make a few exceptions here and there is hardly redeeming.  Pretty much all rappers that aren't backpackers do not welcome the majority of crackers into hip-hop.  From the days of PE on, the white man has always been seen as hip-hop's enemy.

So you call me stupid, and yet you get mad at me for saying the same shit that your favorite rapper has probably said on record way before me.

You talk about Mobb Deep and Wu-Tang selling independently, when their albums were to be found in every record store in every city...

LOL, no, chink, that's just your illiterate ass not reading again.  All I said was that Mobb Deep and the Wu were on a label that was notorious for being mis-managed and doing a terrible job of promoting its artists.

And it IS true that the reason the Wu got their record deal was because they put out "Protect Ya Neck" (which was a single, not an album) and the underground was feeling them.

Even if 5 people heard it, and they all thought it was brilliant, it could still be classic...

LOL, and this pretty much proves how stupid you are in a nutshell.  So if 5 people think Dem Franchise Boyz "On Top Of Our Game" is a classic, that makes them right?  I don't think so.

If an album is not embraced by the larger hip-hop community (NOT just some local scene such as Kansas City) and it is not remembered by the larger hip-hop community 10 years later, then no, it cannot legimately be considered a classic.  I was listening to my own hometown's (Durham) Little Brother years before they got their record deal, and I thought they were ill.  But I would have never called their first album a classic, even though I thought it was extremely dope.  Now, on the other hand, they've put out "The Minstrel Show" which is getting mad acclaim from just about everybody.  Will it be a classic?  I dunno, but it's getting major props and recognition from cats all over the U.S. and has won a zillion awards from music publications.  If it is remembered 5-10 years from now, then yes, I think it probably deserves classic status.

Unfortunately, you think like a WHITE GIRL...For you, shit needs to be POPULAR to have classic value...Goddamn chinks always think they know shit...

No, you just think like a white boy, or a chink for that matter (which is clearly what you are).  Fucking crackers and chinks always act like they know what's up, when they have no business trying to run Blackman's culture.  We created it, and we don't need your input.

Shit doesn't have to be POPULAR to have classic value; it has to be MEMORABLE.  That shows that it's unique and exceptional in some way.  And generally speaking, it isn't at all inaccurate to say that if something becomes widely embraced by a lot of people and is remembered 10 years later, then that means it's earned "classic" status.

So let me break it down for you:

Bad music = Forgettable music
Quality music = Good, but not necesarily memorable
Exceptional music = Memorable and quality

So thus, it is only "exceptional" music that equals "classic" music.  It's that simple.

"Dogg Food" isn't memorable? LMAO...Wow, what an idiot...You musta been drowning in crack during the 90's. "Dogg Food" is extremely memorable to true hip-hop heads (which doesn't include you), and is KNOWN for being a HUGE part of the east-coast/west-coast rivalry...You're not funny, you bring down the quality of WCC with your posts, bitch be gone...PeACe

[Eihtball]

^^^^People not reading your posts has less to do with their attention span and more to do with not wanting to sift through your played out black panther gimmick.  At least interject some comedy or something.  I mean, the other retard characters on here have some redeeming values in their posts. 

You're horrible at trying to be the villain,  you're not funny or provactive, your shit is VANILLA.  Boring as a motherfucker.

Hold up, son.  1 cracker (singular) who says he isn't going to read my "essays" does not equal "people" (plural).

My shit isn't comedy?  Most people know when to laugh and when not to.  But I don't seek to amuse anyone but myself, and this chink "Now I Know" has definitely entertained me with his own stupidity as well as his reactions to my posts.  Look at how angry I've made him.  If my shit is so boring ("vanilla" implies it's white, and you know I hate all that is white), then why does this idiot keep on reacting?

"Dogg Food" isn't memorable? LMAO...Wow, what an idiot...You musta been drowning in crack during the 90's. "Dogg Food" is extremely memorable to true hip-hop heads (which doesn't include you), and is KNOWN for being a HUGE part of the east-coast/west-coast rivalry...You're not funny, you bring down the quality of WCC with your posts, bitch be gone...PeACe

About the only thing memorable about "Dogg Food" is the fact that it was the whole reason Interscope got kicked off their original distribution deal, as well as the "New York, New York" video's minor role in sparking beef.  If "Dogg Food" is so memorable, why is it that almost nobody besides West Coast fans aren't talking about it these days?  You will rarely hear it mentioned alongside "The Chronic", "Doggystyle", and "All Eyez On Me".  I may listen to it still, but I also recognize that as a West Coast fan and former resident, it's more likely I'll remember DPG than anyone from outside of the West.

The only people bringing down the quality of DubCC are crackers.  This whole site is a wasteland for Eurohonkey trash to act like they're black when they're not.  As one of the few Blackmen on here, and as someone who grew up during hip-hop's glory days of the late-80s to early-90s, I am quite possibly one of the most knowledgeable people here.  That is how I became a GOD in DubCC.

So...devil be gone.  No PeACe to crackers/chinks.