This series proves why Duncan is better than Shaq

[Now_Im_Not_Banned]

lmao, did you watch the 2006 finals? hahahaha

and in 2004, shaq's last year with the lakers, he was just much better than kobe in the finals, no point in stepping behind him lol

LOL@Shaq being much better than Kobe' in '04, when Shaq had trouble getting off the ground and grabbing boards in double digits or scoring 20 or more points. And LMAO@2006, where Shaq put up games of 6 points and 5 rebounds and couldn't score over 20 points ONCE in the finals...You're funny, 7even. If Shaq was smarter, we'd be talking 6peat+. You know this.

I'm not talking about the 90+ games the Lakers had in 2003-04, but in the Finals he was the much better player. Kobe had that clutch 3 in Game 2, that was as good as he got in the series. Shaq was still an animal. Not as much as back in his prime, but he was still pretty damn good if you don't ignore the fact that he was like 32 playing against the best defensive team and the best big man defender in the game. Anyways, that's not so important, what's important is that it is retarded to argue that Shaq didn't defer to Kobe in the '04 Finals when he should have.

Of course Shaq couldn't contribute like back in the day in the '06 Finals, but he deferred to Wade and sometimes even to Zo when he had to. It's not like Duncan was absolutely dominating offensively this post-season, either.

I also refuse to believe that it was all Shaq's fault how the situation with Kobe didn't work out.


Shaq >> Duncan, bottom line.


What do you mean if Shaq was smarter? Was he supposed to stay with the Lakers after 04? Kobe wouldn't have re-signed, you know this. And I'm sure you're the last one who would argue that the Lakers with Shaq instead of Kobe and Odom would win 3 more titles.

You can read all the Lakerbooks you want, Kobe and Shaq had problems for many years. The only difference is as long as you are winning, you can look past that. As soon as you're not even successful, it can become a huge problem.

DUDE... Did you watch the series? We lost because Ben Wallace was holding Shaq down, and Shaq INSISTED that the offence keeps running through him...Yes, Kobe had a bad series shooting-wise, but he was still holding it down on defense and doing his...LMAO@pretending like Shaq was on Kobe's level in '04 because of one series, where Shaq was considered "shut down" by his standards...If the offence runs through Kobe in '04, and Shaq lets loose, just doing his, it's a whole nother story. If Shaq wasn't a primadonna who was afraid of sharing spotlight, then the whole situation with Kobe never woulda' happened to begin with...Kobe was gunna opt out either way, every star does this, you can get more money that way...But the point is, Kobe said he wouldn't mind playing alongside Shaq for his whole career. It was Shaq who didn't want his legacy tarnished when Kobe began taking over...WHY DO YOU THINK WE STARTED LOSING WHEN SHAQ WAS EXITING HIS PRIME? He coulda' done what Kareem did for Magic...But no, he decided to do what he did for Penny...ONCE AGAIN.

[Now_Im_Not_Banned]

Didn't Wade win the last NBA Finals MVP?

So Shaq is 3x MVP Finals and 1x he didn't win it by giving the young Wade the spotlight.

Where's the difference with Duncan?

Good point man; however, the thing with Duncan is he is only 31 and likely has more titles in him.  Shaq?  Not likely, unless he gets his shit together.

Still, Shaq at his peak was far more dominant than Duncan in his prime, this is not debatable.

See, you guys should consider two things that made Duncan the guy he is now:

- he was drafted by a team who already had one of the best big men of all time in the roster, the Admiral. He made Duncan's life easier.
- he was (and still is) coached by a great underrated coach (talking about best coach in the League?): Greg Popovic. A coach who doesn't give a flying fuck about who you are. A coach who only cares about the Team. A coach who teachs players how to play TEAM offence and TEAM defence. A coach that if you make a mistake, you have to apologize to him first. A coach that if you don't play/train with the right attitude he kicks you in your ass. Fuck that "Zen" shit, Greg uses his kicks in the ass. He's "that" type of coach.

Those two things, mixed with the fact he's selfish by himself and that he's a silent leader makes him what he is.

Shaq lived a totally different life and career. He was signed by the L.A. Lakers in one of the most memorable moves of all time. He had the keys of L.A. in his hands. He was the boss of the most important franchise ever. And, like you guys said, when he was on his prime he was UNSTOPPABLE.

I like them both.

Let's say Duncan and Shaq are the two best big men i've ever seen playing (i know there are some people better than them in the history of the NBA, MAYBE, but i'm talking about guys i've actually watched playing, live. So guys who played in the last 20 years, basically. Duncan, Hakeem, Shaq. This one is the magic trio. If you talk about one of those three you're talking about a legend).

NOOO. The main difference is that Duncan conditioned and kept himself in shape, and didn't have the same primaddonna "me first" attitude that Shaq had...Had Shaq kept his shit together, he could possibly be known as the greatest player to ever play the game nowadays. He unquestionably had the tools to surpass Kareem as the greatest Laker big, but dude flat out held himself back with his attitude...PeACe

Exactly NIK, Shaq has held himself back with his attitude, much like Kobe has done.  Both are two of the best ever, but both could be even better without their massive egos.  Bitches

Explain to me how the hardest working man in the NBA has held himself back with his attitude? Unlike what I'm saying, there is no basis to your claims...PeACe

[Now_Im_Not_Banned]

- he was (and still is) coached by a great underrated coach (talking about best coach in the League?): Greg Popovic. A coach who doesn't give a flying fuck about who you are. A coach who only cares about the Team. A coach who teachs players how to play TEAM offence and TEAM defence. A coach that if you make a mistake, you have to apologize to him first. A coach that if you don't play/train with the right attitude he kicks you in your ass. Fuck that "Zen" shit, Greg uses his kicks in the ass. He's "that" type of coach.

Gregg Popovich is a great coach, but to act like he's anywhere near the greatest coach of all time is absurd, man. What's wrong with you? "fuck that zen shit"?? Put Popovich in Phil's shoes, and I guarantee you that the Lakers would not have made the playoffs in at least 1 of the last 2 years...You're heavily disrespecting Phil Jackson, bro...PeACe

[7even]

lmao, did you watch the 2006 finals? hahahaha

and in 2004, shaq's last year with the lakers, he was just much better than kobe in the finals, no point in stepping behind him lol

LOL@Shaq being much better than Kobe' in '04, when Shaq had trouble getting off the ground and grabbing boards in double digits or scoring 20 or more points. And LMAO@2006, where Shaq put up games of 6 points and 5 rebounds and couldn't score over 20 points ONCE in the finals...You're funny, 7even. If Shaq was smarter, we'd be talking 6peat+. You know this.

I'm not talking about the 90+ games the Lakers had in 2003-04, but in the Finals he was the much better player. Kobe had that clutch 3 in Game 2, that was as good as he got in the series. Shaq was still an animal. Not as much as back in his prime, but he was still pretty damn good if you don't ignore the fact that he was like 32 playing against the best defensive team and the best big man defender in the game. Anyways, that's not so important, what's important is that it is retarded to argue that Shaq didn't defer to Kobe in the '04 Finals when he should have.

Of course Shaq couldn't contribute like back in the day in the '06 Finals, but he deferred to Wade and sometimes even to Zo when he had to. It's not like Duncan was absolutely dominating offensively this post-season, either.

I also refuse to believe that it was all Shaq's fault how the situation with Kobe didn't work out.


Shaq >> Duncan, bottom line.


What do you mean if Shaq was smarter? Was he supposed to stay with the Lakers after 04? Kobe wouldn't have re-signed, you know this. And I'm sure you're the last one who would argue that the Lakers with Shaq instead of Kobe and Odom would win 3 more titles.

You can read all the Lakerbooks you want, Kobe and Shaq had problems for many years. The only difference is as long as you are winning, you can look past that. As soon as you're not even successful, it can become a huge problem.

DUDE... Did you watch the series? We lost because Ben Wallace was holding Shaq down, and Shaq INSISTED that the offence keeps running through him...Yes, Kobe had a bad series shooting-wise, but he was still holding it down on defense and doing his...LMAO@pretending like Shaq was on Kobe's level in '04 because of one series, where Shaq was considered "shut down" by his standards...If the offence runs through Kobe in '04, and Shaq lets loose, just doing his, it's a whole nother story. If Shaq wasn't a primadonna who was afraid of sharing spotlight, then the whole situation with Kobe never woulda' happened to begin with...Kobe was gunna opt out either way, every star does this, you can get more money that way...But the point is, Kobe said he wouldn't mind playing alongside Shaq for his whole career. It was Shaq who didn't want his legacy tarnished when Kobe began taking over...WHY DO YOU THINK WE STARTED LOSING WHEN SHAQ WAS EXITING HIS PRIME? He coulda' done what Kareem did for Magic...But no, he decided to do what he did for Penny...ONCE AGAIN.

Yes I watched the series and for the record I really enjoyed the Pistons upsetting the Lakers. "Shut down" by his standards doesn't mean suckage for Shaq. Anyways I disagree, Kobe claiming he wouldn't mind to play alongside Shaq for his whole career is just some talk meant to be heard by people such as yourself. It's a lie to make you feel better. I don't believe it. It's a great coincidence how Kobe re-signed with the Lakers right after Shaq was traded. Love that. Anyways we 2 will never share the same view on Kobe/Shaq, let's fuck it.

[Now_Im_Not_Banned]

lmao, did you watch the 2006 finals? hahahaha

and in 2004, shaq's last year with the lakers, he was just much better than kobe in the finals, no point in stepping behind him lol

LOL@Shaq being much better than Kobe' in '04, when Shaq had trouble getting off the ground and grabbing boards in double digits or scoring 20 or more points. And LMAO@2006, where Shaq put up games of 6 points and 5 rebounds and couldn't score over 20 points ONCE in the finals...You're funny, 7even. If Shaq was smarter, we'd be talking 6peat+. You know this.

I'm not talking about the 90+ games the Lakers had in 2003-04, but in the Finals he was the much better player. Kobe had that clutch 3 in Game 2, that was as good as he got in the series. Shaq was still an animal. Not as much as back in his prime, but he was still pretty damn good if you don't ignore the fact that he was like 32 playing against the best defensive team and the best big man defender in the game. Anyways, that's not so important, what's important is that it is retarded to argue that Shaq didn't defer to Kobe in the '04 Finals when he should have.

Of course Shaq couldn't contribute like back in the day in the '06 Finals, but he deferred to Wade and sometimes even to Zo when he had to. It's not like Duncan was absolutely dominating offensively this post-season, either.

I also refuse to believe that it was all Shaq's fault how the situation with Kobe didn't work out.


Shaq >> Duncan, bottom line.


What do you mean if Shaq was smarter? Was he supposed to stay with the Lakers after 04? Kobe wouldn't have re-signed, you know this. And I'm sure you're the last one who would argue that the Lakers with Shaq instead of Kobe and Odom would win 3 more titles.

You can read all the Lakerbooks you want, Kobe and Shaq had problems for many years. The only difference is as long as you are winning, you can look past that. As soon as you're not even successful, it can become a huge problem.

DUDE... Did you watch the series? We lost because Ben Wallace was holding Shaq down, and Shaq INSISTED that the offence keeps running through him...Yes, Kobe had a bad series shooting-wise, but he was still holding it down on defense and doing his...LMAO@pretending like Shaq was on Kobe's level in '04 because of one series, where Shaq was considered "shut down" by his standards...If the offence runs through Kobe in '04, and Shaq lets loose, just doing his, it's a whole nother story. If Shaq wasn't a primadonna who was afraid of sharing spotlight, then the whole situation with Kobe never woulda' happened to begin with...Kobe was gunna opt out either way, every star does this, you can get more money that way...But the point is, Kobe said he wouldn't mind playing alongside Shaq for his whole career. It was Shaq who didn't want his legacy tarnished when Kobe began taking over...WHY DO YOU THINK WE STARTED LOSING WHEN SHAQ WAS EXITING HIS PRIME? He coulda' done what Kareem did for Magic...But no, he decided to do what he did for Penny...ONCE AGAIN.

Yes I watched the series and for the record I really enjoyed the Pistons upsetting the Lakers. "Shut down" by his standards doesn't mean suckage for Shaq. Anyways I disagree, Kobe claiming he wouldn't mind to play alongside Shaq for his whole career is just some talk meant to be heard by people such as yourself. It's a lie to make you feel better. I don't believe it. It's a great coincidence how Kobe re-signed with the Lakers right after Shaq was traded. Love that. Anyways we 2 will never share the same view on Kobe/Shaq, let's fuck it.

Uhhh, actually, Kobe was still in some serious talks with the Clippers AFTER Shaq was traded...Shows how much you know about the subject...

P.S. Where did you gain all your knowledge on the situation? Because you've been making a lot of invalid claims, homie...PeACe

[GangstaBoogy]

Didn't Wade win the last NBA Finals MVP?

So Shaq is 3x MVP Finals and 1x he didn't win it by giving the young Wade the spotlight.

Where's the difference with Duncan?

The difference is Shaq is obviously doing this just to make himself look like the good guy. When he left the Lakers he said he would take a backseat to D.Wade, he started practicing his free-throws, he lost 30 pounds...all the things he REFUSED to do in Los Angeles. That childish attitude is going to catch up with him eventually.

[Antonio_]

Didn't Wade win the last NBA Finals MVP?

So Shaq is 3x MVP Finals and 1x he didn't win it by giving the young Wade the spotlight.

Where's the difference with Duncan?

The difference is that Shaq wasn't willing to do for KOBE BRYANT what he was willing to do for DWYANE WADE...That should be self-evident to you, being a Laker fan and all....

The comparision is Duncan after 3 NBA Finals MVP vs Shaq after 3 NBA Finals MVP.

Ok, he didn't want Kobe to be the man. But he wanted Wade to be the man. It was something personal, obviously.

[Antonio_]

Didn't Wade win the last NBA Finals MVP?

So Shaq is 3x MVP Finals and 1x he didn't win it by giving the young Wade the spotlight.

Where's the difference with Duncan?

The difference is Shaq is obviously doing this just to make himself look like the good guy. When he left the Lakers he said he would take a backseat to D.Wade, he started practicing his free-throws, he lost 30 pounds...all the things he REFUSED to do in Los Angeles. That childish attitude is going to catch up with him eventually.

Again: it was something personal. And when he found a team who didn't believe he was that dominant no more, he took it personal and he thought he had something to prove. He won a ring tho.

[Antonio_]

Didn't Wade win the last NBA Finals MVP?

So Shaq is 3x MVP Finals and 1x he didn't win it by giving the young Wade the spotlight.

Where's the difference with Duncan?

Good point man; however, the thing with Duncan is he is only 31 and likely has more titles in him.  Shaq?  Not likely, unless he gets his shit together.

Still, Shaq at his peak was far more dominant than Duncan in his prime, this is not debatable.

See, you guys should consider two things that made Duncan the guy he is now:

- he was drafted by a team who already had one of the best big men of all time in the roster, the Admiral. He made Duncan's life easier.
- he was (and still is) coached by a great underrated coach (talking about best coach in the League?): Greg Popovic. A coach who doesn't give a flying fuck about who you are. A coach who only cares about the Team. A coach who teachs players how to play TEAM offence and TEAM defence. A coach that if you make a mistake, you have to apologize to him first. A coach that if you don't play/train with the right attitude he kicks you in your ass. Fuck that "Zen" shit, Greg uses his kicks in the ass. He's "that" type of coach.

Those two things, mixed with the fact he's selfish by himself and that he's a silent leader makes him what he is.

Shaq lived a totally different life and career. He was signed by the L.A. Lakers in one of the most memorable moves of all time. He had the keys of L.A. in his hands. He was the boss of the most important franchise ever. And, like you guys said, when he was on his prime he was UNSTOPPABLE.

I like them both.

Let's say Duncan and Shaq are the two best big men i've ever seen playing (i know there are some people better than them in the history of the NBA, MAYBE, but i'm talking about guys i've actually watched playing, live. So guys who played in the last 20 years, basically. Duncan, Hakeem, Shaq. This one is the magic trio. If you talk about one of those three you're talking about a legend).

NOOO. The main difference is that Duncan conditioned and kept himself in shape, and didn't have the same primaddonna "me first" attitude that Shaq had...Had Shaq kept his shit together, he could possibly be known as the greatest player to ever play the game nowadays. He unquestionably had the tools to surpass Kareem as the greatest Laker big, but dude flat out held himself back with his attitude...PeACe

No doubt Shaq was always been a lazy muthafucka with a bad attitude. No doubt.

[7even]

Ok, he didn't want Kobe to be the man. But he wanted Wade to be the man. It was something personal, obviously.

You have to understand they think this is only Shaq's fault LOL. Nobody else's. Hell, according to Baby G Shaq basically only deferred to Wade to hurt Kobe, make him jealous and shit. Lol... he really must hate Kobe a lot. And only Shaq is to blame for that. Also, when Kobe told the media that Shaq is paying bitches he fucked/raped to keep it quiet, that was also just Shaq's fault cause he was just too mean to Kobe. Kobe is the nicest guy ever and Shaq is just an obnoxious excuse for a human being. 

[Antonio_]

- he was (and still is) coached by a great underrated coach (talking about best coach in the League?): Greg Popovic. A coach who doesn't give a flying fuck about who you are. A coach who only cares about the Team. A coach who teachs players how to play TEAM offence and TEAM defence. A coach that if you make a mistake, you have to apologize to him first. A coach that if you don't play/train with the right attitude he kicks you in your ass. Fuck that "Zen" shit, Greg uses his kicks in the ass. He's "that" type of coach.

Gregg Popovich is a great coach, but to act like he's anywhere near the greatest coach of all time is absurd, man. What's wrong with you? "fuck that zen shit"?? Put Popovich in Phil's shoes, and I guarantee you that the Lakers would not have made the playoffs in at least 1 of the last 2 years...You're heavily disrespecting Phil Jackson, bro...PeACe

Phil is a great coach when he has great players. And no, don't take me wrong: it's not easy at all!! It's hella difficult to win with guys like Jordan, Kobe, Shaq, Pippen, Rodman, etc.. in your team (so difficult that nobody did it before and after him, except with Riley - another great coach - with Shaq). But i don't think he's doing a great work in the post-Shaq era. I mean the team depends too much from Kobe. They don't play good TEAM defence and they don't play good TEAM offence. They rely too much on Kobe, and we can't repeat the same excuse of the injuries again and again. What i've seen in the 4th quarter of Game1 of this years PO against the Suns is not THE BEST COACH EVER should make it happens in his team.

[Now_Im_Not_Banned]

Ok, he didn't want Kobe to be the man. But he wanted Wade to be the man. It was something personal, obviously.

You have to understand they think this is only Shaq's fault LOL. Nobody else's. Hell, according to Baby G Shaq basically only deferred to Wade to hurt Kobe, make him jealous and shit. Lol... he really must hate Kobe a lot. And only Shaq is to blame for that. Also, when Kobe told the media that Shaq is paying bitches he fucked/raped to keep it quiet, that was also just Shaq's fault cause he was just too mean to Kobe. Kobe is the nicest guy ever and Shaq is just an obnoxious excuse for a human being. 

LMAO@Claiming Kobe told the media that Shaq "paid bitches he fucked/raped"...You really have your facts straight, don't you, 7even?


Answer my question.

[Now_Im_Not_Banned]

- he was (and still is) coached by a great underrated coach (talking about best coach in the League?): Greg Popovic. A coach who doesn't give a flying fuck about who you are. A coach who only cares about the Team. A coach who teachs players how to play TEAM offence and TEAM defence. A coach that if you make a mistake, you have to apologize to him first. A coach that if you don't play/train with the right attitude he kicks you in your ass. Fuck that "Zen" shit, Greg uses his kicks in the ass. He's "that" type of coach.

Gregg Popovich is a great coach, but to act like he's anywhere near the greatest coach of all time is absurd, man. What's wrong with you? "fuck that zen shit"?? Put Popovich in Phil's shoes, and I guarantee you that the Lakers would not have made the playoffs in at least 1 of the last 2 years...You're heavily disrespecting Phil Jackson, bro...PeACe

Phil is a great coach when he has great players. And no, don't take me wrong: it's not easy at all!! It's hella difficult to win with guys like Jordan, Kobe, Shaq, Pippen, Rodman, etc.. in your team (so difficult that nobody did it before and after him, except with Riley - another great coach - with Shaq). But i don't think he's doing a great work in the post-Shaq era. I mean the team depends too much from Kobe. They don't play good TEAM defence and they don't play good TEAM offence. They rely too much on Kobe, and we can't repeat the same excuse of the injuries again and again. What i've seen in the 4th quarter of Game1 of this years PO against the Suns is not THE BEST COACH EVER should make it happens in his team.

The fact of the matter is, Popovich has never been in a situation like Phil's...I doubt if Popovich makes the playoffs both of the previous seasons in Phil's shoes. Great coach, no doubt, but Phil is on a whole nother level, bro...PeACe

[Antonio_]

Ok, he didn't want Kobe to be the man. But he wanted Wade to be the man. It was something personal, obviously.

You have to understand they think this is only Shaq's fault LOL. Nobody else's. Hell, according to Baby G Shaq basically only deferred to Wade to hurt Kobe, make him jealous and shit. Lol... he really must hate Kobe a lot. And only Shaq is to blame for that. Also, when Kobe told the media that Shaq is paying bitches he fucked/raped to keep it quiet, that was also just Shaq's fault cause he was just too mean to Kobe. Kobe is the nicest guy ever and Shaq is just an obnoxious excuse for a human being. 

Man it's obvious both the guys made a mistake. And Phil Jackson is imho the one to blame. Cause he was the coach, and he wasn't good enought to explain them they was wasting a great chance at making the best dynasty ever. I blame Phil. More than Shaq and Kobe themselves. Phil is the guy who has coached them 24/7 for years, he's the one who had to work on team chemestry, he's the one who let the two destroy his own team because of their egos. Then we can argue who started it. We can argue about Shaq's bad work attitude (i mean we CAN'T discuss about this thing: it's a fact). We can say whatever we want, but both the guys did a mistake, and Phil is the one who didn't force them to take personal issues away from business.

That said, Shaq was been very unprofessional in his last years in purple&gold. You know. And when the Lakers chosed Kobe over him, he felt like they disrespected him (big ego, you know) and took it personal, starting to act professional all of a sudden and giving Wade props. But everything was already damaged, at that point. Imho they should have handled things better, in the looker room. And the coach is the one to blame. Nothing to say about Phil as a coach, he has won 9 fucking rings, it speaks for himself. But he didn't do "the miracle" with Kobe & Shaq.

[Antonio_]

- he was (and still is) coached by a great underrated coach (talking about best coach in the League?): Greg Popovic. A coach who doesn't give a flying fuck about who you are. A coach who only cares about the Team. A coach who teachs players how to play TEAM offence and TEAM defence. A coach that if you make a mistake, you have to apologize to him first. A coach that if you don't play/train with the right attitude he kicks you in your ass. Fuck that "Zen" shit, Greg uses his kicks in the ass. He's "that" type of coach.

Gregg Popovich is a great coach, but to act like he's anywhere near the greatest coach of all time is absurd, man. What's wrong with you? "fuck that zen shit"?? Put Popovich in Phil's shoes, and I guarantee you that the Lakers would not have made the playoffs in at least 1 of the last 2 years...You're heavily disrespecting Phil Jackson, bro...PeACe

Phil is a great coach when he has great players. And no, don't take me wrong: it's not easy at all!! It's hella difficult to win with guys like Jordan, Kobe, Shaq, Pippen, Rodman, etc.. in your team (so difficult that nobody did it before and after him, except with Riley - another great coach - with Shaq). But i don't think he's doing a great work in the post-Shaq era. I mean the team depends too much from Kobe. They don't play good TEAM defence and they don't play good TEAM offence. They rely too much on Kobe, and we can't repeat the same excuse of the injuries again and again. What i've seen in the 4th quarter of Game1 of this years PO against the Suns is not THE BEST COACH EVER should make it happens in his team.

The fact of the matter is, Popovich has never been in a situation like Phil's...I doubt if Popovich makes the playoffs both of the previous seasons in Phil's shoes. Great coach, no doubt, but Phil is on a whole nother level, bro...PeACe

9 rings, no doubt.

But damn, those Lakers need some kicks in their asses. Like Odom, like Kwame... those guys can play great basketball, if only they have their mind focused on the game every fucking minute of the game. That's why i think a coach like Popovich could help them. And Kobe. When he makes too many ugly shots he deserves some kicks in his ass too. And his teammates if they refuse to take good shots. Fuck, everybody! LOL.