Lifestyle > Train of Thought
Keith Olbermann goes hard at Obama
TraceOneInfinite:
--- Quote from: M Dogg on December 17, 2009, 07:09:04 PM ---
In the industrial world, we have the worst health system. We are just above Cuba, and if you have no money in our country you are shit out of luck. The free market has no business in certain areas and peoples lives is one of them. In Canada, there is an issue with their health care, but at the same time you have a better health care than we do. You look at it like this. We are tied to jobs because we need health care, we have an issue because people that have ideas are tied to their jobs. If you have an idea for a small business, and you want to invest your money in this, you can't. You are tied to a job just so you can have health care, and leaving your job means you and your family are not protected. This system does not foster creativity and allow people to venture out and grow, what this system creates is conservative minded people afraid to invest in themselves and stay at their jobs. Are countries creativity comes from 20 somethings that are not afraid of their health, and they are not afraid of risk, but it cripples are older population that may have had a great idea but can't risk leaving their job. That's how our system, in case you wanted it in free market terms.
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homie, you got it backwards, it's your socialism that discourages creativity. With government taking over health care back in the 60's (with Medicare, Medicaid, FDA and expanding it ever since), criminal charges can be placed upon anyone who tries to come up with better medicine, or practice health care at a reduced price, or think outside the box in ways to manage health care. No, it's a one size fits all government system.
If government had been in charge of the computer, we would still have a gigantic computer in front of us that could only add and subtract. So why do we want government to control health care?
TraceOneInfinite:
--- Quote from: Russell Bell on December 18, 2009, 09:35:42 AM ---In my opinion the government handing out so-called free health care to the masses is a great idea. But thats in theory. I just do not have faith in this government, or any for that matter, to run it correctly. When you have government run industry mixed with the need to serve mass amounts of people you get legal red tape everywhere. Look at the school system, hell, look at the DMV. Why does it take 3 hours to get a new pic for a license? Better question: how long would it take if the government didnt run that place? Not three hours.
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Exactly, government is slow and inefficient. While the free market is streamlined and user-friendly. If the free-market was handling education a high school kid could go to school for 3 hours a day and learn what a government student learns in an 8 hour day. Also, it would be cheaper because there would be dozens of private institutions competing to provide him the most cost-efficient and effective education.
TraceOneInfinite:
--- Quote from: virtuoso on December 18, 2009, 11:44:18 AM ---
Word, the other thing is governments want to run every facet of the health system (like in the UK) therefore constantly dictating to the doctors what is and isn't acceptable, constantly being judged on "efficiency". The government actually degrades the quality of the health care by setting target after target, which aren't actually improving, instead it forces the hospitals to meet them to the detriment of care.
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Co-sign +1
Your exactly right. I work in hospitals and nursing homes, and employees and administration are more focused on meeting "state regulations" than actually providing the most effective care. So much time and money is wasted in following bullshit state regulations made by politicians the doing the shit that actually matters in the real world.
M Dogg™:
--- Quote from: Infinite... Be and It Is on December 22, 2009, 09:03:26 PM ---
--- Quote from: M Dogg on December 17, 2009, 06:34:48 PM ---
--- Quote from: Shallow on December 17, 2009, 08:29:20 AM ---Do these American idiots actually want something that even resembles the Canadian model? Because it would collapse in the US, and maybe collapse the US. Keep an eyer out in Canada please and see how we slowly pay more and coverage slowly becomes less, and we slowly increase debt because of it. It's a horrible model that will self destruct soon. The US needs to change their system, but more government is not the answer.
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Then what is, because right now with less government, that's not the answer either.
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Uhhh.. MDogg.. haven't you heard of Medicare, Medicaid and the FDA? The US government is already submerged in health care, and has been for around 50 years, and it's been fucked up ever since.
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Government was in charge of the space mission, we got to the moon just fine, government is in charge of the military, we do a good job of getting shit that goes boom, government has brought us fire fighters, they seem to respond on time, government produces the mail system, which delivers mail on time, government fought a couple of World Wars, we seem to have won those.
TraceOneInfinite:
--- Quote from: M Dogg on December 22, 2009, 10:41:29 PM ---
Government was in charge of the space mission, we got to the moon just fine, government is in charge of the military, we do a good job of getting shit that goes boom, government has brought us fire fighters, they seem to respond on time, government produces the mail system, which delivers mail on time, government fought a couple of World Wars, we seem to have won those.
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-The space mission was hugely expensive, and hasn't proved it's worth just because astronauts reached the moon. If spending billions to travel to space leads to inventions, technology or wisdom that improves the standard of living, then their may be some worth to it; but then why couldn't a private company do it if it is in fact profitable?
-Military is fucked up. The defense department wasn't enough so they created the FBI. The Defense department and FBI weren't enough so they created the CIA. The Defense department, CIA, FBI, weren't enough so they created the Department of Homeland Security, INS, and so on... A trillion dollars later people still don't feel safe! When you cause massive destruction worldwide then money and resources are being squandered in an effort to repair and rebuild what was already there; rather then being used to increase the goods and services we enjoy and that elevate our happiness and raise our standard of living.
-US postal service is another waste. Private companies like FedEx are just as capable or more capable of providing such services in an efficient and affordable manner, without the violations of privacy one may experience with the government.
-US involvement in the first world war led to the second World War. The war was drawing to a stalemate, in which all parties would have been neutralized. Yet, when the US entered the war, they were victorious, and insisted on a subjugation of the Central Powers that was neither practical nor sustaining and ultimately led to the extreme measures taken by those nations ever since, such as WW2.
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