Kobe for finals MVP...

[teecee]

What you guys don't understand is if he has a capable supporting cast,Kobe finds ways to win, no matter what. That's his greatness...If his shot is not falling, his defense is spectacular, and Kobe grabbed 15 boards last night, knowing that every team who had won the rebounding battle has won the game. People who are saying Artest or Gasol or any one of the supporting players meant as much to this title run as Kobe are really tryna downplay the greatness of the team leader...You take Kobe out of that series, and it changes the whole outcomes, 100%...you take any other player out, either team, and there would still be competition. Lakers played amazing, the supporting players stepped up, but there is clearly an incredible player driving our team, and some of you need to appreciate being spoiled with the chance to watch such greatness unfold before your eyes.

Like I said in this thread, and before, Kobe was Clearly the best player in this series...no other player was consistent.   Kobe, in the biggest game maybe of his career, grabbed a shitload of rebounds and put forth a great effort.   HOWEVER, he shot 25 percent...pretty bad for a game 7 of the NBA finals, right?  


I respect Kobe for doing what he had to do to win the title; he DID miss some big shots in the playoffs, including two game winners where Gasol and Artest bailed him about, but that is what TEAMS are made of.  If anything, Kobe stans are straight realizing how importand Gasol and Artest and Fisher are...Gasol was a n absolute beast in Lakers wins in the series.


I don't think Kobe played great last night- he himself said he was pressing too much, maybe a little nervous, and was therefore off.   He played well enough to win...which makes him the best player by far in the series, and by far the most consitent.   I have no problem with even calling him the best player in the game...what this series does do, however, is kind of remove Kobe from the GOAT talks, at least for a while.  He just was not dominate, especially in moments during the playoffs where you expected him to be.  

I MEAN, consistenly, from game to game...surely, you get that, right?   The Lakers could be straight winning series 4 straight with their talent, like the Lakers in 2001.  Ya dig?

NIK, I asked you the question before...WHAT DOES KOBE NEED TO DO, IN YOUR EYES, TO BE CONSIDERED BETTER THAN MJ?

You realize most of those shots Kobe took were extremely difficult shots, right? Celtics were smothering him with all their hearts, ALWAYS throwing 2 or 3 guys on him at once. he couldnt get ANY easy opportunities...It was the most amazing defense I have ever seen. But the offense was horrible BOTH WAYS...because, honestly, that was one of the greatest defensive efforts I've ever seen, from both teams. we shot 32% AS A TEAM, and still won..We did it on the defense and glass, and that doesn't get as appreciated as pretty offense, but it's just as big, especially in a grind it out game like that... Kobe has already matched or surpassed Jordan from a talent standpoint, in my eyes. what it will take for him to be considered GREATER would be more titles on the resume. if he takes this team to 2 or 3 more titles, it would be stupid not to put him up there...he's already in the discussion, no doubt, as Fisher said last night...but we'll really be able to judge once he reaches that ceiling, which is not any time soon.

It was great defense by both teams, but also some horrible shots by both at times.   And NIK, i do NOT give a FUCK about talent...its all about what you do on the court.   There are a alot of smart people in the world who aren't as accomplished as others...lots of great tathletes who don't make it, etc


II'm saying, what does Kobe need to accomplish?   What if  the Lakers win two more titles, and Kobe gets two more MVP's?   Then, he would likely have 4 finals mvp's to Jordan's 6, way less scoring titles, lless MVP's, lower averages in EVERYTHING, but one more title?  Is Kobe then better?   If so, Is Bill Russell better than Kobe?!   

Look, stats don't mean shit...LeBron James will probably end his career breaking most of Jordan's scoring records, and will definitely break his rebounding and assists records...THAT DOES NOT MAKE HIM A BETTER PLAYER. It seems as if Steve Nash has a chance at ending his career with more MVP awards than Kobe...THAT DOES NOT MAKE HIM A BETTER PLAYER. In their prime, on the basketball court, Kobe has every ability Jordan did and then some...Sure, Kobe was brought into the league under different circumstances than Jordan, thus giving him less of a chance to capture all those scoring titles and early MVP awards...That's because he started out as a student of the game, and he played behind people and worked his way up, unlike Jordan, who was handed the Bulls franchise from day one...but that is part of Kobe's greatness...The fact that he had to climb that ladder is what made him peak so hard. Harder than anyone. Now, all he needs is those titles...that's what the great players play this game for. If he can take this team to a couple more titles, he's there. Fuck all the awards, the scoring titles, all that shit...doesn't mean shit...what can the player do for the team?...and clearly, Kobe is currently doing for the Lakers what Magic did for the Lakers in the 80s, and what Jordan did for the Bulls in the 90s...it's spectacular, and to try and take away from that is pretty stupid...PeACe

You are right, MJ and Kobe came into the league in different sistuations...Kobe was put on a team with SHAQ, the most dominant player at the time.  MJ, like other top draftpicks, were put on shit teams and had to BE THE MAN FROM THE BEGINNING< WITHOUT THE GRACE PERIOD of throwing up airballs in the playoffs.   


What, do you think if Kobe was put on a team as bad as the Bulls were at the beginining of his career, that he would have 5 chips right now?!   

[teecee]

What you guys don't understand is if he has a capable supporting cast,Kobe finds ways to win, no matter what. That's his greatness...If his shot is not falling, his defense is spectacular, and Kobe grabbed 15 boards last night, knowing that every team who had won the rebounding battle has won the game. People who are saying Artest or Gasol or any one of the supporting players meant as much to this title run as Kobe are really tryna downplay the greatness of the team leader...You take Kobe out of that series, and it changes the whole outcomes, 100%...you take any other player out, either team, and there would still be competition. Lakers played amazing, the supporting players stepped up, but there is clearly an incredible player driving our team, and some of you need to appreciate being spoiled with the chance to watch such greatness unfold before your eyes.

Like I said in this thread, and before, Kobe was Clearly the best player in this series...no other player was consistent.   Kobe, in the biggest game maybe of his career, grabbed a shitload of rebounds and put forth a great effort.   HOWEVER, he shot 25 percent...pretty bad for a game 7 of the NBA finals, right?  


I respect Kobe for doing what he had to do to win the title; he DID miss some big shots in the playoffs, including two game winners where Gasol and Artest bailed him about, but that is what TEAMS are made of.  If anything, Kobe stans are straight realizing how importand Gasol and Artest and Fisher are...Gasol was a n absolute beast in Lakers wins in the series.


I don't think Kobe played great last night- he himself said he was pressing too much, maybe a little nervous, and was therefore off.   He played well enough to win...which makes him the best player by far in the series, and by far the most consitent.   I have no problem with even calling him the best player in the game...what this series does do, however, is kind of remove Kobe from the GOAT talks, at least for a while.  He just was not dominate, especially in moments during the playoffs where you expected him to be.  

I MEAN, consistenly, from game to game...surely, you get that, right?   The Lakers could be straight winning series 4 straight with their talent, like the Lakers in 2001.  Ya dig?

NIK, I asked you the question before...WHAT DOES KOBE NEED TO DO, IN YOUR EYES, TO BE CONSIDERED BETTER THAN MJ?

You realize most of those shots Kobe took were extremely difficult shots, right? Celtics were smothering him with all their hearts, ALWAYS throwing 2 or 3 guys on him at once. he couldnt get ANY easy opportunities...It was the most amazing defense I have ever seen. But the offense was horrible BOTH WAYS...because, honestly, that was one of the greatest defensive efforts I've ever seen, from both teams. we shot 32% AS A TEAM, and still won..We did it on the defense and glass, and that doesn't get as appreciated as pretty offense, but it's just as big, especially in a grind it out game like that... Kobe has already matched or surpassed Jordan from a talent standpoint, in my eyes. what it will take for him to be considered GREATER would be more titles on the resume. if he takes this team to 2 or 3 more titles, it would be stupid not to put him up there...he's already in the discussion, no doubt, as Fisher said last night...but we'll really be able to judge once he reaches that ceiling, which is not any time soon.

It was great defense by both teams, but also some horrible shots by both at times.   And NIK, i do NOT give a FUCK about talent...its all about what you do on the court.   There are a alot of smart people in the world who aren't as accomplished as others...lots of great tathletes who don't make it, etc


II'm saying, what does Kobe need to accomplish?   What if  the Lakers win two more titles, and Kobe gets two more MVP's?   Then, he would likely have 4 finals mvp's to Jordan's 6, way less scoring titles, lless MVP's, lower averages in EVERYTHING, but one more title?  Is Kobe then better?   If so, Is Bill Russell better than Kobe?!   

Look, stats don't mean shit...LeBron James will probably end his career breaking most of Jordan's scoring records, and will definitely break his rebounding and assists records...THAT DOES NOT MAKE HIM A BETTER PLAYER. It seems as if Steve Nash has a chance at ending his career with more MVP awards than Kobe...THAT DOES NOT MAKE HIM A BETTER PLAYER. In their prime, on the basketball court, Kobe has every ability Jordan did and then some...Sure, Kobe was brought into the league under different circumstances than Jordan, thus giving him less of a chance to capture all those scoring titles and early MVP awards...That's because he started out as a student of the game, and he played behind people and worked his way up, unlike Jordan, who was handed the Bulls franchise from day one...but that is part of Kobe's greatness...The fact that he had to climb that ladder is what made him peak so hard. Harder than anyone. Now, all he needs is those titles...that's what the great players play this game for. If he can take this team to a couple more titles, he's there. Fuck all the awards, the scoring titles, all that shit...doesn't mean shit...what can the player do for the team?...and clearly, Kobe is currently doing for the Lakers what Magic did for the Lakers in the 80s, and what Jordan did for the Bulls in the 90s...it's spectacular, and to try and take away from that is pretty stupid...PeACe

So stats only mattered when Kobe scored 81 points against a shit team, or when he averaged 35- you've never used those as a basis for Kobe being the best scorer, or the MVP that year?

[Sccit]

What you guys don't understand is if he has a capable supporting cast,Kobe finds ways to win, no matter what. That's his greatness...If his shot is not falling, his defense is spectacular, and Kobe grabbed 15 boards last night, knowing that every team who had won the rebounding battle has won the game. People who are saying Artest or Gasol or any one of the supporting players meant as much to this title run as Kobe are really tryna downplay the greatness of the team leader...You take Kobe out of that series, and it changes the whole outcomes, 100%...you take any other player out, either team, and there would still be competition. Lakers played amazing, the supporting players stepped up, but there is clearly an incredible player driving our team, and some of you need to appreciate being spoiled with the chance to watch such greatness unfold before your eyes.

Like I said in this thread, and before, Kobe was Clearly the best player in this series...no other player was consistent.   Kobe, in the biggest game maybe of his career, grabbed a shitload of rebounds and put forth a great effort.   HOWEVER, he shot 25 percent...pretty bad for a game 7 of the NBA finals, right?  


I respect Kobe for doing what he had to do to win the title; he DID miss some big shots in the playoffs, including two game winners where Gasol and Artest bailed him about, but that is what TEAMS are made of.  If anything, Kobe stans are straight realizing how importand Gasol and Artest and Fisher are...Gasol was a n absolute beast in Lakers wins in the series.


I don't think Kobe played great last night- he himself said he was pressing too much, maybe a little nervous, and was therefore off.   He played well enough to win...which makes him the best player by far in the series, and by far the most consitent.   I have no problem with even calling him the best player in the game...what this series does do, however, is kind of remove Kobe from the GOAT talks, at least for a while.  He just was not dominate, especially in moments during the playoffs where you expected him to be.  

I MEAN, consistenly, from game to game...surely, you get that, right?   The Lakers could be straight winning series 4 straight with their talent, like the Lakers in 2001.  Ya dig?

NIK, I asked you the question before...WHAT DOES KOBE NEED TO DO, IN YOUR EYES, TO BE CONSIDERED BETTER THAN MJ?

You realize most of those shots Kobe took were extremely difficult shots, right? Celtics were smothering him with all their hearts, ALWAYS throwing 2 or 3 guys on him at once. he couldnt get ANY easy opportunities...It was the most amazing defense I have ever seen. But the offense was horrible BOTH WAYS...because, honestly, that was one of the greatest defensive efforts I've ever seen, from both teams. we shot 32% AS A TEAM, and still won..We did it on the defense and glass, and that doesn't get as appreciated as pretty offense, but it's just as big, especially in a grind it out game like that... Kobe has already matched or surpassed Jordan from a talent standpoint, in my eyes. what it will take for him to be considered GREATER would be more titles on the resume. if he takes this team to 2 or 3 more titles, it would be stupid not to put him up there...he's already in the discussion, no doubt, as Fisher said last night...but we'll really be able to judge once he reaches that ceiling, which is not any time soon.

It was great defense by both teams, but also some horrible shots by both at times.   And NIK, i do NOT give a FUCK about talent...its all about what you do on the court.   There are a alot of smart people in the world who aren't as accomplished as others...lots of great tathletes who don't make it, etc


II'm saying, what does Kobe need to accomplish?   What if  the Lakers win two more titles, and Kobe gets two more MVP's?   Then, he would likely have 4 finals mvp's to Jordan's 6, way less scoring titles, lless MVP's, lower averages in EVERYTHING, but one more title?  Is Kobe then better?   If so, Is Bill Russell better than Kobe?!   

Look, stats don't mean shit...LeBron James will probably end his career breaking most of Jordan's scoring records, and will definitely break his rebounding and assists records...THAT DOES NOT MAKE HIM A BETTER PLAYER. It seems as if Steve Nash has a chance at ending his career with more MVP awards than Kobe...THAT DOES NOT MAKE HIM A BETTER PLAYER. In their prime, on the basketball court, Kobe has every ability Jordan did and then some...Sure, Kobe was brought into the league under different circumstances than Jordan, thus giving him less of a chance to capture all those scoring titles and early MVP awards...That's because he started out as a student of the game, and he played behind people and worked his way up, unlike Jordan, who was handed the Bulls franchise from day one...but that is part of Kobe's greatness...The fact that he had to climb that ladder is what made him peak so hard. Harder than anyone. Now, all he needs is those titles...that's what the great players play this game for. If he can take this team to a couple more titles, he's there. Fuck all the awards, the scoring titles, all that shit...doesn't mean shit...what can the player do for the team?...and clearly, Kobe is currently doing for the Lakers what Magic did for the Lakers in the 80s, and what Jordan did for the Bulls in the 90s...it's spectacular, and to try and take away from that is pretty stupid...PeACe

You are right, MJ and Kobe came into the league in different sistuations...Kobe was put on a team with SHAQ, the most dominant player at the time.  MJ, like other top draftpicks, were put on shit teams and had to BE THE MAN FROM THE BEGINNING< WITHOUT THE GRACE PERIOD of throwing up airballs in the playoffs.   


What, do you think if Kobe was put on a team as bad as the Bulls were at the beginining of his career, that he would have 5 chips right now?!   

If Kobe had the love and support MJ had from day 1, the possibilities are really endless, to tell you the truth...LOL

[Sccit]

What you guys don't understand is if he has a capable supporting cast,Kobe finds ways to win, no matter what. That's his greatness...If his shot is not falling, his defense is spectacular, and Kobe grabbed 15 boards last night, knowing that every team who had won the rebounding battle has won the game. People who are saying Artest or Gasol or any one of the supporting players meant as much to this title run as Kobe are really tryna downplay the greatness of the team leader...You take Kobe out of that series, and it changes the whole outcomes, 100%...you take any other player out, either team, and there would still be competition. Lakers played amazing, the supporting players stepped up, but there is clearly an incredible player driving our team, and some of you need to appreciate being spoiled with the chance to watch such greatness unfold before your eyes.

Like I said in this thread, and before, Kobe was Clearly the best player in this series...no other player was consistent.   Kobe, in the biggest game maybe of his career, grabbed a shitload of rebounds and put forth a great effort.   HOWEVER, he shot 25 percent...pretty bad for a game 7 of the NBA finals, right?  


I respect Kobe for doing what he had to do to win the title; he DID miss some big shots in the playoffs, including two game winners where Gasol and Artest bailed him about, but that is what TEAMS are made of.  If anything, Kobe stans are straight realizing how importand Gasol and Artest and Fisher are...Gasol was a n absolute beast in Lakers wins in the series.


I don't think Kobe played great last night- he himself said he was pressing too much, maybe a little nervous, and was therefore off.   He played well enough to win...which makes him the best player by far in the series, and by far the most consitent.   I have no problem with even calling him the best player in the game...what this series does do, however, is kind of remove Kobe from the GOAT talks, at least for a while.  He just was not dominate, especially in moments during the playoffs where you expected him to be.  

I MEAN, consistenly, from game to game...surely, you get that, right?   The Lakers could be straight winning series 4 straight with their talent, like the Lakers in 2001.  Ya dig?

NIK, I asked you the question before...WHAT DOES KOBE NEED TO DO, IN YOUR EYES, TO BE CONSIDERED BETTER THAN MJ?

You realize most of those shots Kobe took were extremely difficult shots, right? Celtics were smothering him with all their hearts, ALWAYS throwing 2 or 3 guys on him at once. he couldnt get ANY easy opportunities...It was the most amazing defense I have ever seen. But the offense was horrible BOTH WAYS...because, honestly, that was one of the greatest defensive efforts I've ever seen, from both teams. we shot 32% AS A TEAM, and still won..We did it on the defense and glass, and that doesn't get as appreciated as pretty offense, but it's just as big, especially in a grind it out game like that... Kobe has already matched or surpassed Jordan from a talent standpoint, in my eyes. what it will take for him to be considered GREATER would be more titles on the resume. if he takes this team to 2 or 3 more titles, it would be stupid not to put him up there...he's already in the discussion, no doubt, as Fisher said last night...but we'll really be able to judge once he reaches that ceiling, which is not any time soon.

It was great defense by both teams, but also some horrible shots by both at times.   And NIK, i do NOT give a FUCK about talent...its all about what you do on the court.   There are a alot of smart people in the world who aren't as accomplished as others...lots of great tathletes who don't make it, etc


II'm saying, what does Kobe need to accomplish?   What if  the Lakers win two more titles, and Kobe gets two more MVP's?   Then, he would likely have 4 finals mvp's to Jordan's 6, way less scoring titles, lless MVP's, lower averages in EVERYTHING, but one more title?  Is Kobe then better?   If so, Is Bill Russell better than Kobe?!   

Look, stats don't mean shit...LeBron James will probably end his career breaking most of Jordan's scoring records, and will definitely break his rebounding and assists records...THAT DOES NOT MAKE HIM A BETTER PLAYER. It seems as if Steve Nash has a chance at ending his career with more MVP awards than Kobe...THAT DOES NOT MAKE HIM A BETTER PLAYER. In their prime, on the basketball court, Kobe has every ability Jordan did and then some...Sure, Kobe was brought into the league under different circumstances than Jordan, thus giving him less of a chance to capture all those scoring titles and early MVP awards...That's because he started out as a student of the game, and he played behind people and worked his way up, unlike Jordan, who was handed the Bulls franchise from day one...but that is part of Kobe's greatness...The fact that he had to climb that ladder is what made him peak so hard. Harder than anyone. Now, all he needs is those titles...that's what the great players play this game for. If he can take this team to a couple more titles, he's there. Fuck all the awards, the scoring titles, all that shit...doesn't mean shit...what can the player do for the team?...and clearly, Kobe is currently doing for the Lakers what Magic did for the Lakers in the 80s, and what Jordan did for the Bulls in the 90s...it's spectacular, and to try and take away from that is pretty stupid...PeACe

So stats only mattered when Kobe scored 81 points against a shit team, or when he averaged 35- you've never used those as a basis for Kobe being the best scorer, or the MVP that year?

thats not what makes Kobe's the best player, no...

[Chamillitary Click]

What you guys don't understand is if he has a capable supporting cast,Kobe finds ways to win, no matter what. That's his greatness...If his shot is not falling, his defense is spectacular, and Kobe grabbed 15 boards last night, knowing that every team who had won the rebounding battle has won the game. People who are saying Artest or Gasol or any one of the supporting players meant as much to this title run as Kobe are really tryna downplay the greatness of the team leader...You take Kobe out of that series, and it changes the whole outcomes, 100%...you take any other player out, either team, and there would still be competition. Lakers played amazing, the supporting players stepped up, but there is clearly an incredible player driving our team, and some of you need to appreciate being spoiled with the chance to watch such greatness unfold before your eyes.

Oh, so the one game Kendrick Perkins is out & the Lakers (as a team) grab a ridiculous amount of offensive rebounds & Kobe got in on that, that's not coincidental at all?

That's just "Kobe stepping up".

He had the worst imaginable game offensively after I can quote you 40 million times "he's the best scorer in Basketball history" & he's "so clutch" & "Kobe would never come up flat like LeBron in a game like that" & was LUCKY that Gasol & Artest came to play on both sides of the ball or else we would really be shitting on Kobe.

They should of given the award to multiple people lol.

It's honestly a joke to give Kobe all the credit for what Gasol & Artest did throughout the series; especially in the deciding Game 7.

Kobe reffered to his teammates as his "supporting cast".

Lebron calls his teammates his supporting cast as well.

Deservingly so lol.

They are a supporting cast; Gasol, Artest & Odom are the reason why the Lakers won.

Sure, Kobe is the leader, Kobe is the best, they couldn't do it without Kobe; but likewise they couldn't do it without any of the people I named either.

They are a team, plain & simple; Kobe is as much Gasol's "supporting cast" as Gasol is part of Kobe's "supporting cast".

I am in no way a Kobe fan, but he IS the most important player on that team.   Having said that, throughout the playtoffs, the rest of the team has had some biug moments, no ibgger than Artests and Gasol's game winners in the first and third round, and their play last night.   

Whaty is scary is that team is so incredibly talented...what will happen if they learn to play cionsistently, as a team? 

I'm not denying Kobe is the best, but he gets credit like he makes Gasol & he is the reason Artest came up big in Game 7; acting as if it could of been anybody in the world & they would of gotten the job done; don't mean to beat a dead horse here, but act as if he had the Cavs squad (minus LeBron) he could of had the same result.

It's not true, Gasol is arguably the best big man in the West (offensively), Artest is an elite defender & Odom would be the 2nd or 3rd best player on just about every other team in the league & he's coming off the bench; Derek Fisher is almost as big a leader as Kobe for them & without that core of guys, Kobe couldn't get it done.

He's blessed to be in the situation he's in; people give Kobe too much credit like he's the soul reason they win, he's the biggest piece, but then again, he's just a piece.

[Teddy Roosevelt]

What you guys don't understand is if he has a capable supporting cast,Kobe finds ways to win, no matter what. That's his greatness...If his shot is not falling, his defense is spectacular, and Kobe grabbed 15 boards last night, knowing that every team who had won the rebounding battle has won the game. People who are saying Artest or Gasol or any one of the supporting players meant as much to this title run as Kobe are really tryna downplay the greatness of the team leader...You take Kobe out of that series, and it changes the whole outcomes, 100%...you take any other player out, either team, and there would still be competition. Lakers played amazing, the supporting players stepped up, but there is clearly an incredible player driving our team, and some of you need to appreciate being spoiled with the chance to watch such greatness unfold before your eyes.

Oh, so the one game Kendrick Perkins is out & the Lakers (as a team) grab a ridiculous amount of offensive rebounds & Kobe got in on that, that's not coincidental at all?

That's just "Kobe stepping up".

He had the worst imaginable game offensively after I can quote you 40 million times "he's the best scorer in Basketball history" & he's "so clutch" & "Kobe would never come up flat like LeBron in a game like that" & was LUCKY that Gasol & Artest came to play on both sides of the ball or else we would really be shitting on Kobe.

They should of given the award to multiple people lol.

It's honestly a joke to give Kobe all the credit for what Gasol & Artest did throughout the series; especially in the deciding Game 7.

Kobe reffered to his teammates as his "supporting cast".

Lebron calls his teammates his supporting cast as well.

Deservingly so lol.

They are a supporting cast; Gasol, Artest & Odom are the reason why the Lakers won.

Sure, Kobe is the leader, Kobe is the best, they couldn't do it without Kobe; but likewise they couldn't do it without any of the people I named either.

They are a team, plain & simple; Kobe is as much Gasol's "supporting cast" as Gasol is part of Kobe's "supporting cast".

I am in no way a Kobe fan, but he IS the most important player on that team.   Having said that, throughout the playtoffs, the rest of the team has had some biug moments, no ibgger than Artests and Gasol's game winners in the first and third round, and their play last night.   

Whaty is scary is that team is so incredibly talented...what will happen if they learn to play cionsistently, as a team? 

I'm not denying Kobe is the best, but he gets credit like he makes Gasol & he is the reason Artest came up big in Game 7; acting as if it could of been anybody in the world & they would of gotten the job done; don't mean to beat a dead horse here, but act as if he had the Cavs squad (minus LeBron) he could of had the same result.

It's not true, Gasol is arguably the best big man in the West (offensively), Artest is an elite defender & Odom would be the 2nd or 3rd best player on just about every other team in the league & he's coming off the bench; Derek Fisher is almost as big a leader as Kobe for them & without that core of guys, Kobe couldn't get it done.

He's blessed to be in the situation he's in; people give Kobe too much credit like he's the soul reason they win, he's the biggest piece, but then again, he's just a piece.

Didn't people do the same shit for Jordan, Duncan (too a lesser degree), Julius Erving, etc. The main person is always hyped up unless the team is someone like the 2004 Pistons. Why do you have such a hard on for Kobe?

[7even]

If 6-24 along with 2 Assists and 4 Turnovers in a Finals Game 7 at home is not deserving the Finals MVP, I don't know what is

[Chamillitary Click]

^I guess, but this is just a bit ridiculous.

I've never seen such a poorly played game & then hand him the credit like "oh, he came through in the end!".

He didn't though, THEY came through in the end.

All those players you named had solid players as well; Tony & Manu get equal love to Duncan; Duncan is the best players, but the other two get recognition as focal points; Pippen gets recognized as one of the 50 greatest.

& all those names also never came up THAT bad in a key situation.

But you look at Kobe & "it's him, HE did it again"; a "little" help from Pau, a "few" shots from Ron, but my god, "Kobe did it".

It's sickening as a sports fan lol.

[Teddy Roosevelt]

^I guess, but this is just a bit ridiculous.

I've never seen such a poorly played game & then hand him the credit like "oh, he came through in the end!".

He didn't though, THEY came through in the end.

All those players you named had solid players as well; Tony & Manu get equal love to Duncan; Duncan is the best players, but the other two get recognition as focal points; Pippen gets recognized as one of the 50 greatest.

& all those names also never came up THAT bad in a key situation.

But you look at Kobe & "it's him, HE did it again"; a "little" help from Pau, a "few" shots from Ron, but my god, "Kobe did it".

It's sickening as a sports fan lol.

Well like NIK pointed out Jordan did go 5-19 in the final game of 1996. But no one will question his greatness even in the 1996 finals. It's just how it goes sometimes.
And Kobe at least pointed out that his team mates picked him up. "I wanted it so bad, and sometimes when you want it so bad, it slips away from you. My guys picked me up." > http://www.cbssports.com/nba/gamecenter/recap/NBA_20100617_BOS@LAL After the presentation of one of the trophies (I can't remember if it was the Championship or Finals MVP) he signaled out Gasol for helping the team win it all.

[Chamillitary Click]

^Props to Kobe for saying that, but if it doesn't get the recognition to everyone else, it doesn't help lol.

[Sccit]

What you guys don't understand is if he has a capable supporting cast,Kobe finds ways to win, no matter what. That's his greatness...If his shot is not falling, his defense is spectacular, and Kobe grabbed 15 boards last night, knowing that every team who had won the rebounding battle has won the game. People who are saying Artest or Gasol or any one of the supporting players meant as much to this title run as Kobe are really tryna downplay the greatness of the team leader...You take Kobe out of that series, and it changes the whole outcomes, 100%...you take any other player out, either team, and there would still be competition. Lakers played amazing, the supporting players stepped up, but there is clearly an incredible player driving our team, and some of you need to appreciate being spoiled with the chance to watch such greatness unfold before your eyes.

Oh, so the one game Kendrick Perkins is out & the Lakers (as a team) grab a ridiculous amount of offensive rebounds & Kobe got in on that, that's not coincidental at all?

That's just "Kobe stepping up".

He had the worst imaginable game offensively after I can quote you 40 million times "he's the best scorer in Basketball history" & he's "so clutch" & "Kobe would never come up flat like LeBron in a game like that" & was LUCKY that Gasol & Artest came to play on both sides of the ball or else we would really be shitting on Kobe.

They should of given the award to multiple people lol.

It's honestly a joke to give Kobe all the credit for what Gasol & Artest did throughout the series; especially in the deciding Game 7.

Kobe reffered to his teammates as his "supporting cast".

Lebron calls his teammates his supporting cast as well.

Deservingly so lol.

They are a supporting cast; Gasol, Artest & Odom are the reason why the Lakers won.

Sure, Kobe is the leader, Kobe is the best, they couldn't do it without Kobe; but likewise they couldn't do it without any of the people I named either.

They are a team, plain & simple; Kobe is as much Gasol's "supporting cast" as Gasol is part of Kobe's "supporting cast".

I am in no way a Kobe fan, but he IS the most important player on that team.   Having said that, throughout the playtoffs, the rest of the team has had some biug moments, no ibgger than Artests and Gasol's game winners in the first and third round, and their play last night.   

Whaty is scary is that team is so incredibly talented...what will happen if they learn to play cionsistently, as a team? 

I'm not denying Kobe is the best, but he gets credit like he makes Gasol & he is the reason Artest came up big in Game 7; acting as if it could of been anybody in the world & they would of gotten the job done; don't mean to beat a dead horse here, but act as if he had the Cavs squad (minus LeBron) he could of had the same result.

It's not true, Gasol is arguably the best big man in the West (offensively), Artest is an elite defender & Odom would be the 2nd or 3rd best player on just about every other team in the league & he's coming off the bench; Derek Fisher is almost as big a leader as Kobe for them & without that core of guys, Kobe couldn't get it done.

He's blessed to be in the situation he's in; people give Kobe too much credit like he's the soul reason they win, he's the biggest piece, but then again, he's just a piece.

every player on the team shot bad, don't you get it? even gasol and artest...it was a defense oriented game, and that's where kobe got the job done. lebron could never win a game like that, so don't even put him in this discussion.

[Sccit]

^I guess, but this is just a bit ridiculous.

I've never seen such a poorly played game & then hand him the credit like "oh, he came through in the end!".

He didn't though, THEY came through in the end.

All those players you named had solid players as well; Tony & Manu get equal love to Duncan; Duncan is the best players, but the other two get recognition as focal points; Pippen gets recognized as one of the 50 greatest.

& all those names also never came up THAT bad in a key situation.

But you look at Kobe & "it's him, HE did it again"; a "little" help from Pau, a "few" shots from Ron, but my god, "Kobe did it".

It's sickening as a sports fan lol.

Every great player whos won numerous rings has had a great supporting cast to go along.

[teecee]

What you guys don't understand is if he has a capable supporting cast,Kobe finds ways to win, no matter what. That's his greatness...If his shot is not falling, his defense is spectacular, and Kobe grabbed 15 boards last night, knowing that every team who had won the rebounding battle has won the game. People who are saying Artest or Gasol or any one of the supporting players meant as much to this title run as Kobe are really tryna downplay the greatness of the team leader...You take Kobe out of that series, and it changes the whole outcomes, 100%...you take any other player out, either team, and there would still be competition. Lakers played amazing, the supporting players stepped up, but there is clearly an incredible player driving our team, and some of you need to appreciate being spoiled with the chance to watch such greatness unfold before your eyes.

Oh, so the one game Kendrick Perkins is out & the Lakers (as a team) grab a ridiculous amount of offensive rebounds & Kobe got in on that, that's not coincidental at all?

That's just "Kobe stepping up".

He had the worst imaginable game offensively after I can quote you 40 million times "he's the best scorer in Basketball history" & he's "so clutch" & "Kobe would never come up flat like LeBron in a game like that" & was LUCKY that Gasol & Artest came to play on both sides of the ball or else we would really be shitting on Kobe.

They should of given the award to multiple people lol.

It's honestly a joke to give Kobe all the credit for what Gasol & Artest did throughout the series; especially in the deciding Game 7.

Kobe reffered to his teammates as his "supporting cast".

Lebron calls his teammates his supporting cast as well.

Deservingly so lol.

They are a supporting cast; Gasol, Artest & Odom are the reason why the Lakers won.

Sure, Kobe is the leader, Kobe is the best, they couldn't do it without Kobe; but likewise they couldn't do it without any of the people I named either.

They are a team, plain & simple; Kobe is as much Gasol's "supporting cast" as Gasol is part of Kobe's "supporting cast".

I am in no way a Kobe fan, but he IS the most important player on that team.   Having said that, throughout the playtoffs, the rest of the team has had some biug moments, no ibgger than Artests and Gasol's game winners in the first and third round, and their play last night.   

Whaty is scary is that team is so incredibly talented...what will happen if they learn to play cionsistently, as a team? 

I'm not denying Kobe is the best, but he gets credit like he makes Gasol & he is the reason Artest came up big in Game 7; acting as if it could of been anybody in the world & they would of gotten the job done; don't mean to beat a dead horse here, but act as if he had the Cavs squad (minus LeBron) he could of had the same result.

It's not true, Gasol is arguably the best big man in the West (offensively), Artest is an elite defender & Odom would be the 2nd or 3rd best player on just about every other team in the league & he's coming off the bench; Derek Fisher is almost as big a leader as Kobe for them & without that core of guys, Kobe couldn't get it done.

He's blessed to be in the situation he's in; people give Kobe too much credit like he's the soul reason they win, he's the biggest piece, but then again, he's just a piece.

every player on the team shot bad, don't you get it? even gasol and artest...it was a defense oriented game, and that's where kobe got the job done. lebron could never win a game like that, so don't even put him in this discussion.

Wouldn't you say Artest was better defensively?   

[Sccit]

What you guys don't understand is if he has a capable supporting cast,Kobe finds ways to win, no matter what. That's his greatness...If his shot is not falling, his defense is spectacular, and Kobe grabbed 15 boards last night, knowing that every team who had won the rebounding battle has won the game. People who are saying Artest or Gasol or any one of the supporting players meant as much to this title run as Kobe are really tryna downplay the greatness of the team leader...You take Kobe out of that series, and it changes the whole outcomes, 100%...you take any other player out, either team, and there would still be competition. Lakers played amazing, the supporting players stepped up, but there is clearly an incredible player driving our team, and some of you need to appreciate being spoiled with the chance to watch such greatness unfold before your eyes.

Oh, so the one game Kendrick Perkins is out & the Lakers (as a team) grab a ridiculous amount of offensive rebounds & Kobe got in on that, that's not coincidental at all?

That's just "Kobe stepping up".

He had the worst imaginable game offensively after I can quote you 40 million times "he's the best scorer in Basketball history" & he's "so clutch" & "Kobe would never come up flat like LeBron in a game like that" & was LUCKY that Gasol & Artest came to play on both sides of the ball or else we would really be shitting on Kobe.

They should of given the award to multiple people lol.

It's honestly a joke to give Kobe all the credit for what Gasol & Artest did throughout the series; especially in the deciding Game 7.

Kobe reffered to his teammates as his "supporting cast".

Lebron calls his teammates his supporting cast as well.

Deservingly so lol.

They are a supporting cast; Gasol, Artest & Odom are the reason why the Lakers won.

Sure, Kobe is the leader, Kobe is the best, they couldn't do it without Kobe; but likewise they couldn't do it without any of the people I named either.

They are a team, plain & simple; Kobe is as much Gasol's "supporting cast" as Gasol is part of Kobe's "supporting cast".

I am in no way a Kobe fan, but he IS the most important player on that team.   Having said that, throughout the playtoffs, the rest of the team has had some biug moments, no ibgger than Artests and Gasol's game winners in the first and third round, and their play last night.   

Whaty is scary is that team is so incredibly talented...what will happen if they learn to play cionsistently, as a team? 

I'm not denying Kobe is the best, but he gets credit like he makes Gasol & he is the reason Artest came up big in Game 7; acting as if it could of been anybody in the world & they would of gotten the job done; don't mean to beat a dead horse here, but act as if he had the Cavs squad (minus LeBron) he could of had the same result.

It's not true, Gasol is arguably the best big man in the West (offensively), Artest is an elite defender & Odom would be the 2nd or 3rd best player on just about every other team in the league & he's coming off the bench; Derek Fisher is almost as big a leader as Kobe for them & without that core of guys, Kobe couldn't get it done.

He's blessed to be in the situation he's in; people give Kobe too much credit like he's the soul reason they win, he's the biggest piece, but then again, he's just a piece.

every player on the team shot bad, don't you get it? even gasol and artest...it was a defense oriented game, and that's where kobe got the job done. lebron could never win a game like that, so don't even put him in this discussion.

Wouldn't you say Artest was better defensively?   

considering that rebounding is a huge part of defense, no

[Elano]

THERE'S ALREADY A LAKERS THREAD, SOMEBODY SHOULD LOCK THIS THREAD