Who were the key players behind each of Pac's albums since his death?

[TraceOneInfinite Flat Earther 96']

It's way too confusing for me to figure out who has been handling 2pac's music since his death.  The subject really deserves its own documentary.  Not only 2pac albums, but you have all the albums 2pac was featured on, who got paid for that?  Who got paid for "Smile" blowing up Scarface album?  Whose decision was it to keep a perfectly good and origional Pac verse/song "Ghetto Star" off of Bad Ass album?  How was that necessary, but yet Bone was able to get "Thug Luv" on their album?

Still, all things considered, somebody, somewhere has been doing something right.  Because the first few Pac posthumous releases were all classics.

7 Day Theory -  This one came out perfect, in spite of all the legal entanglements which hadn't really had time to develop at this point.  I think we can credit Suge and Death Row for gettin everything done right with this album

R U Still Down -  I think everyone was satisfied with this project.  The remixing of the tracks only made them better in my opinion, look no further than "Wonder If Heaven's Got A Ghetto" being transformed from a boring afterthought, to a larger than life runaway hit, after they touched it up a bit.  It sounded, looked, and felt like a real album, not just like a compilation of leftover tracks.  I think Afeni and Amuru was responsible for this one.

Greatest Hits -  Everyone complaining about Pac's tracks bein remixed needs to look no further than "Because I Had To" being remixed into the mega hit "Changes".  I think the selection of songs and packaging for this album went well.  They also added 3 previously recorded gems to the mix, "God Bless the Dead", "Troublesome 96'" and "Unconditional Love".

Still I Rise -  Everyone was satisfied with this one as well.  The remixes only made the album better, in my opinion.  The Outlawz must of made a fortune off this one.  I know Suge signed them at some point, I wonder if it was for the purpose of their work on this album and other Pac posthumous albums.  They were already on a lot of tracks, and when you add them to other Pac tracks it makes it sound authentic since they were his crew when he was alive.   I think Death Row was responsible for this one.

Until The End of Time -  Again, everyone was satisfied with this album, I know I was.  I couldn't believe that 4 years after his Death they were still able to compile a double album of his material that was as good or better than anything else coming out at the time.  I think Johnny J deserves a lot of credit for Pac's posthumous work.  Again, the remixes only made the album sound better... aside from Lil Mo', I think most everybody used on the album was someone Pac would of worked with while he was alive.  They stayed true to Pac's vision, it was like a real Pac album.   Not sure if Death Row or Amaru was responsible for this?

Better Dayz -  This was the first indication that they were starting to run out of Pac material.  It was still a solid attempt overall, and the album certainly had it's gems, "Never Call You Bitch Again" and "Better Days".  This was one time where I thought the remix for "My Block" was worse than the original for the Show soundtrack, but since I already had that version for years, hearing a new remixed version was cool and I liked it as well.

Everything since Better Dayz has been mostly mishandled.  But then again there wasn't much left to work with anyway.  I think Em did the best he could with the album he put together for free for Afeni.  But all things considered, that was a pretty good run, whoever was responsible for his music up until Better Dayz, somebody was doing something right.

[V2DHeart]

Edgar Bronfman pushed for Makaveli to be heavily promoted while Jimmy Iovine was looking at ways to break ties with Death Row. This is why they only helped back one video for the album. Edgar's son Ben was a huge 2Pac fan, much like Ted Fields daughter Danielle had liked 2Pac's music. These old men didn't have a clue about Rap music and what would sell so went on the advice of their children for this genre. A formula that worked.

Edgar was good friends and business associates with the main reason why 2Pac's music got any notable commercial awareness after 1998 and that man is Tom Whalley. Without him, 2Pac's music would have faded into a Pac's Life album but with more hurdled. Tom was able to smash down a lot of those hurdles and get 2Pac's video and music circulated a lot more than anyone else. He was the former CEO of Warner music group and had a lot of clout in the industry.

Afeni, who wanted only the "angelic" music out was wanting that type of music out for a reason. The same reason that Jimmy dropped Death Row, and the same reason Tom Whalley and Afeni agreed only to put out 2Pac's music was because there was an agenda by the majors to criminalize rap music and to use 2Pac & Biggie as prominent examples of this. Tom's promotion of Tupac Resurrection was what finally caused the industry string pullers to force him out. He refused to agree to use Time Warner money to back real estate developers who were building prison complexes and extensions around the areas where Rap music was at it's height. Afeni was smart and knew what was going on, which is why she would block songs like "Watch Ya Mouth" or anything that could promote violence.

It was after that, this 2Pac's music got less promotion, less airplay and TV spots because they didn't have the power and influence of Tom, Edgar, and other old school music heads.

2Pac was for most part - A fluke. They made the quick buck from him, and eliminated him because he knew what was going on in the Rap genre, and is the reason why he had so many on-record enemies to try and expose the rappers who promoted the agenda.

This sounds like "conspiracy" nonsense, but it's very much real.

[donfathaimmortal]

Still I Rise -  Everyone was satisfied with this one as well.  The remixes only made the album better, in my opinion.  The Outlawz must of made a fortune off this one.  I know Suge signed them at some point, I wonder if it was for the purpose of their work on this album and other Pac posthumous albums.  They were already on a lot of tracks, and when you add them to other Pac tracks it makes it sound authentic since they were his crew when he was alive.   I think Death Row was responsible for this one.

Until The End of Time -  Again, everyone was satisfied with this album, I know I was.  I couldn't believe that 4 years after his Death they were still able to compile a double album of his material that was as good or better than anything else coming out at the time.  I think Johnny J deserves a lot of credit for Pac's posthumous work.  Again, the remixes only made the album sound better... aside from Lil Mo', I think most everybody used on the album was someone Pac would of worked with while he was alive.  They stayed true to Pac's vision, it was like a real Pac album.   Not sure if Death Row or Amaru was responsible for this?

Death Row manage and market this projects. Still I Rise contains Death Row remixes and some songs arranged/remixed by the late Johnny J. Suge got the rights of every songs while The Outlawz were signed on Death Row when the project was made. But Interscope released it without the Death Row imprint. Then, Afeni Shakur wanted Cold 187Um as supervisor for Until The End Of Time, that's why a lot of tracks where produced by Death Row staff (Damon Thomas, Cold 187Um, Darren Vages, Jim Gettum, Crooked I) while Cold 187Um, Death Row VP, mixed 50% of the album. It wasn't the same thang with "Better Dayz" handled by Amaru, without any Tha Row remixes (then Tha Row Hitters worked on Greatest Hits: Nu Mixes For The Streets, released as Nu-Mixx Klazzics)

[Jack Trippa 3z company ho]

Whoever decided to remix all his music post "R U still down" needs to to be Rick james'd five fingers to the face.

[Jack Trippa 3z company ho]

Extensions flying everywhere

[Hack Wilson - real]

infinite living revisionest history here


until the end of time was NOT something everyone was satisfied with...that was when the pop remixes started and NOBODY wanted to hear Lil Moo rape 2pac songs.

[Mietek23]

NOBODY wanted to hear Lil Moo rape 2pac songs.

That was one of the worst remixes ever made for a Tupac song - can't believe QD3 took the OG beat and put this trash instead

The version from "Too Gangsta For Radio" was perfect beat-wise, but they should left Val Young on that hook

[Soopafly DPGC]

I didn't like any of Pac's stuff being remixed, however, i thought they did a decent job on everything up to and including "Still I Rise".  I was mad when "Secretz of War" came out remixed on that album though.  Their formula used to be to remix a few songs and touch up the rest, leaving them close to OG.

As soon as UNTIL THE END OF TIME came out, that's when everything went south, beginning with the title track with the sampled "Broken Wings" beat in which Pac's voice was horribly offbeat, it all went downhill after that.  From that album on, it was "remix everything, maybe leave one or two songs close to OG" instead of the other way around.

As much as i liked "Changes" I do think it was detrimental in that Afeni felt everything needed to be remixed because she found success ONE TIME remixing a song like this.  It worked once, all the other remixes since then were worse for the most part. 

[Hack Wilson - real]

I didn't like any of Pac's stuff being remixed, however, i thought they did a decent job on everything up to and including "Still I Rise".  I was mad when "Secretz of War" came out remixed on that album though.  Their formula used to be to remix a few songs and touch up the rest, leaving them close to OG.

As soon as UNTIL THE END OF TIME came out, that's when everything went south, beginning with the title track with the sampled "Broken Wings" beat in which Pac's voice was horribly offbeat, it all went downhill after that.  From that album on, it was "remix everything, maybe leave one or two songs close to OG" instead of the other way around.

As much as i liked "Changes" I do think it was detrimental in that Afeni felt everything needed to be remixed because she found success ONE TIME remixing a song like this.  It worked once, all the other remixes since then were worse for the most part. 

Still I Rise remixes were all acceptable EXCEPT Tattoo Tears and Secretz of War.  Where this album was butchered was Hussein Fatal being removed from every song he was on (5 of them) and being replaced by inferior Outlawz.


Fatal was buzzing as a solo artist at that time  (underground hit single with Tame 1, collabos with DMX, Ja Rule and 3-6 mafia, signed to Rap-a-lot etc) but fatal fucked his career over by going to jail those 2-3 years.  Ja tried to help him out by putting him all over that Blood In My Eye cd but Ja himself was about to be blackballed by 50 when that cd dropped.



now as for UTEOT this had some unforgivable butchers on it:

1-this ain't livin  (wack beat, removed lyrics)

2-lil homies  (horrible beat, removed outro)

3-when thugs cry  (that hook is just fucking awful...beat isn't that bad)

4-my closest road dawg  (way to ruin those unleaked pac verses putting them over that wackass remix beat)

5-the previously mentioned Lil moo track

6-words to my first born...hate to say it but the DJ Quik remix took away the soul from the original of the track. 

7-worldwide mob figgaz  (too cheap to pay for the movie samples?  young noble's horrible hook...)

and i'll just stop there but i could pick on a few other tracks too....


oh and on a personal note I hate how they took off Kadafi's verse from All Out.

[Jimmy H.]

until the end of time was NOT something everyone was satisfied with...that was when the pop remixes started and NOBODY wanted to hear Lil Moo rape 2pac songs.

Pretty much.  I remember there being a lot of tracks on "Until The End" that I was not pleased with.  I actually think "Better Dayz" had better tracks.  And I think the whole trying to figure out which label was responsible is a moot point without actual research involving facts.  Most fans are going to give Death Row credit when it's good and Amaru blame when it is bad. I don't think Suge or Afeni was so specifically hands-on in a lot of these projects. Without knowing the key decision-makers, it's all hearsay.

[Sccit]

i think "better dayz" and "until the end of time" shoulda been made into 1 disc each...i mean, they were good, but they coulda been great or even classic.



i think they shoulda had a rule where they could only remix 2-3 tracks tops...a whole album worth of remixes kinda starts messin with the aspect of artist creativity



like u said, tho, just the fact that we had so much material comin out years after pac's death, and not only material, but material shittin on most the game, that in itself deserved major props.

[Fresh Bone]

now as for UTEOT this had some unforgivable butchers on it:

1-this ain't livin  (wack beat, removed lyrics)

Whoa, no disrespect my dude, but that beat is so much better than the original. I understand the part about removed lyrics, but it was meant as a reference track for Snoop rather than a 2Pac track.
One of best remixed track after 'Pac died. (If anyone doesn't agree, let's hear some better candidates.)

[Jimmy H.]

I think the posthumous problems were inevitable as everyone has their own opinions and ways of remembering Pac.  We were never going to get "classic" albums because there wasn't a cohesive artistic mind behind it.  If Pac were alive in 2001-02, he wouldn't be putting out albums full of random songs he recorded in 1994-96, his subject matter would have evolved to him addressing newer things. He did have a great deal of gems in the vault but they were never going to equal "albums". They would be "collections".

I THINK "Until The End of Time" was the first time I can recall just being disappointed with the process because having been privy to the bootlegged material that they ended up remixing for the album, some of them songs just sounded terrible and still do. I actually remember making my own solo disc of songs I liked off that project, just so I didn't have to sit through listening to what they did to songs like "When We Ride on Our Enemies".

[Giesuz]

I didn't like any of Pac's stuff being remixed, however, i thought they did a decent job on everything up to and including "Still I Rise".  I was mad when "Secretz of War" came out remixed on that album though.  Their formula used to be to remix a few songs and touch up the rest, leaving them close to OG.

As soon as UNTIL THE END OF TIME came out, that's when everything went south, beginning with the title track with the sampled "Broken Wings" beat in which Pac's voice was horribly offbeat, it all went downhill after that.  From that album on, it was "remix everything, maybe leave one or two songs close to OG" instead of the other way around.

As much as i liked "Changes" I do think it was detrimental in that Afeni felt everything needed to be remixed because she found success ONE TIME remixing a song like this.  It worked once, all the other remixes since then were worse for the most part. 

Still I Rise remixes were all acceptable EXCEPT Tattoo Tears and Secretz of War.  Where this album was butchered was Hussein Fatal being removed from every song he was on (5 of them) and being replaced by inferior Outlawz.


Fatal was buzzing as a solo artist at that time  (underground hit single with Tame 1, collabos with DMX, Ja Rule and 3-6 mafia, signed to Rap-a-lot etc) but fatal fucked his career over by going to jail those 2-3 years.  Ja tried to help him out by putting him all over that Blood In My Eye cd but Ja himself was about to be blackballed by 50 when that cd dropped.



now as for UTEOT this had some unforgivable butchers on it:

1-this ain't livin  (wack beat, removed lyrics)

2-lil homies  (horrible beat, removed outro)

3-when thugs cry  (that hook is just fucking awful...beat isn't that bad)

4-my closest road dawg  (way to ruin those unleaked pac verses putting them over that wackass remix beat)

5-the previously mentioned Lil moo track

6-words to my first born...hate to say it but the DJ Quik remix took away the soul from the original of the track. 

7-worldwide mob figgaz  (too cheap to pay for the movie samples?  young noble's horrible hook...)

and i'll just stop there but i could pick on a few other tracks too....


oh and on a personal note I hate how they took off Kadafi's verse from All Out.

this sums it up pretty good, i agree on every point

Until The End Of Tim and Words To My First Born original versions are classic songs why remix them?

[TraceOneInfinite Flat Earther 96']

Edgar Bronfman pushed for Makaveli to be heavily promoted while Jimmy Iovine was looking at ways to break ties with Death Row. This is why they only helped back one video for the album. Edgar's son Ben was a huge 2Pac fan, much like Ted Fields daughter Danielle had liked 2Pac's music. These old men didn't have a clue about Rap music and what would sell so went on the advice of their children for this genre. A formula that worked.

Edgar was good friends and business associates with the main reason why 2Pac's music got any notable commercial awareness after 1998 and that man is Tom Whalley. Without him, 2Pac's music would have faded into a Pac's Life album but with more hurdled. Tom was able to smash down a lot of those hurdles and get 2Pac's video and music circulated a lot more than anyone else. He was the former CEO of Warner music group and had a lot of clout in the industry.

Afeni, who wanted only the "angelic" music out was wanting that type of music out for a reason. The same reason that Jimmy dropped Death Row, and the same reason Tom Whalley and Afeni agreed only to put out 2Pac's music was because there was an agenda by the majors to criminalize rap music and to use 2Pac & Biggie as prominent examples of this. Tom's promotion of Tupac Resurrection was what finally caused the industry string pullers to force him out. He refused to agree to use Time Warner money to back real estate developers who were building prison complexes and extensions around the areas where Rap music was at it's height. Afeni was smart and knew what was going on, which is why she would block songs like "Watch Ya Mouth" or anything that could promote violence.

It was after that, this 2Pac's music got less promotion, less airplay and TV spots because they didn't have the power and influence of Tom, Edgar, and other old school music heads.

2Pac was for most part - A fluke. They made the quick buck from him, and eliminated him because he knew what was going on in the Rap genre, and is the reason why he had so many on-record enemies to try and expose the rappers who promoted the agenda.

This sounds like "conspiracy" nonsense, but it's very much real.

interesting info... good work.. will respond later