Canelo vs. Angulo

[DeeezNuuuts83]

A lot to discuss here...

Cotto is taking an big risk going to 160 (especially if they are going to the full weight limit), but if he wins, it will be a BIG statement. I don't see Floyd wanting a rematch with him, but Cotto-Alvarez would be a big fight, if they both win their upcoming fights. Golden Boy supposedly offered Cotto $10 million to fight Canelo, so if he beats Martinez, then he'll likely warrant a significantly bigger guarantee.

Mayorga isn't shit in the ring, but the guy is mad entertaining and talks a lot of shit... It's a shame he doesn't speak English. But I give the guy credit, he helps generate interest in the fight (particularly within the Spanish speaking demographic) but makes his peace with his opponents after. I thought it was cool how he legitimately apologized to Vargas and hugged him afterward, saying that it's just what he does to fuck with his opponents minds. And on that topic...

I used to root for Vargas (mostly because I grew up in Oxnard), but like someone else said, he had a hard time beating relevant guys toward the end of his career, losing to Trinidad, Oscar, Mosley, and even Mayorga. (But you could also say the same thing about Oscar.) He had an attitude, but it wasn't anything bad... just kind of typical of the Chicano bad asses from his age group in Oxnard. A lot of entertaining talk.

I never felt like Ortiz (ironically also from Oxnard) ever reminded me of Vargas, but I agree... if he loses his fight tomorrow, then that might be his swan song, as there won't really be any interest in watching him, given some of his more difficult losses that we've seen from him in the past several years. But if he wins, maybe they'll try to create buzz for Alvarez-Ortiz again (which was the plan before, until Ortiz got his jaw broken and lost).

Regarding the promoters... it's not all on Arum. If he isn't promoting anymore, whether he passes away or just bows out, yeah, it will be easier to make a lot more fights. But you could say the same thing if Golden Boy's leadership got dismantled. They basically deep throat Floyd all of the time, and it often involves them flinging dirt at Top Rank or whoever just to appease him and make it look like they're riding for him to keep his business. Obviously making the client happy is how to keep them, but they're firing a lot of warning shots in the process. They aren't even negotiating, but they have made it clear that there won't be a chance of a Mayweather-Pacquiao match unless Manny leaves Top Rank... and then a week ago, Richard Schaefer straight up called Manny a "desperate man." Seriously, that's not going to encourage Manny to leave his promoter to work with a guy who just called him desperate. Arum definitely isn't innocent, but as of recent, he hasn't been the one to talk shit worth mentioning to Golden Boy.

But if Floyd were truly independent (call it what you want, but when he fights only Golden Boy fighters exclusively and always uses their promotional services, then he's basically a Golden Boy fighter until he does a whole fight under his own steam or with some other promoter even once and not involve Golden Boy), then I have a feeling Golden Boy and Top Rank would play nice with each other. They used to... until Floyd came out of retirement.

[whoisthis]

^Props.

Just to touch on the promoter situation:

If blame was a pie, the biggest slice would be given to Arum. He's been around forever. A lot of his tactics that he's using today are the same he used back in the day with Don King. There's a reason why he's still a top promoter so many years later. He's always had the leverage needed. But, with Floyd he lost that leverage. Al Haymon is the real reason why Golden Boy is in the driver seat.

Haymon should just be a promoter. But for whatever reason he loves to just be the "adviser." Almost every interview with his fighters is "I want to Thank God and Al Haymon." Haymon controls Floyd. Danny Garcia. Broner. Lara. Berto. Trout. Quillin. Keith Thurman. And more. These are some of the top guys and guess what banner they "fight" under? Golden Boy. So, now, all the leverage goes to Golden Boy because Arum's top guy fights in and around the weight class that all of Haymon's guys do. Golden Boy and Al Haymon are basically trying to force Arum out and he's refusing to leave.

If he was easier to work with, we would've seen a ton of fights happen by now. But, he has to face the fact that he's not getting Floyd back. And Manny might just go "independent" when his contract is up. If Arum left Top Rank, the last wall to break would be HBO. They are another large share of the blame pie.

Much like Arum, they've been on top forever. Losing Floyd hurt them, too. When Stephen Espinoza went to head up their competition, they threw down an ultimatum. Golden Boy called their bluff and really left HBO with very little.

SI.com: Taking Floyd away from HBO was a major coup for Showtime. Looking back, how were you able to do it?

SE: It was the result of a couple of things. One, the CBS platform was a big attraction for Floyd. Being able to be exposed not just on the CBS television network, but bringing in CBS Outdoor, CBS Interactive, CNET, TV Guide, TV.com and the whole range of assets, including the CBS Sports radio network, an outlet he didn't have access to. That was, from a business standpoint, the fundamental attraction.

From a non-business point, I think some irritations had built up [with HBO] over the years. A fresh start with someone that had a different perspective was probably appealing to him. After a year, in hindsight, I couldn't have asked for it to have gone any better. There were things I'd like to improve on, but overall, I'm thrilled with it


Read More: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/mma/news/20131223/showtime-stephen-espinoza-interview/#ixzz2rus1KWvk

It had nothing to do with the CBS Platform for Floyd. It was the latter part. HBO is notorious for wanting to control the situation. With the ex-attorney for Golden Boy having all of Golden Boy's fighters to himself, all the control is in the hands of Golden Boy. Why? Because Showtime is essentially an extension of Golden Boy. It's virtually their own network. They don't have competition. The Promoter can do as they please.

HBO now has Top Rank and the lesser options like Goosen, DiBella and even 50 Cent since he has dudes like Kirkland and Gamboa. That's a lot of Chiefs who do not want to be Indians. It's a free for all and old style Boxing politics made it that way for HBO and Top Rank.

[DeeezNuuuts83]

Just to touch on the promoter situation:

If blame was a pie, the biggest slice would be given to Arum. He's been around forever. A lot of his tactics that he's using today are the same he used back in the day with Don King. There's a reason why he's still a top promoter so many years later. He's always had the leverage needed. But, with Floyd he lost that leverage.

But if the guy has been around so long and acquiring talent, then he's been doing something right.  Yes, he and Don King are from the old school, but it's not like we've been seeing Don King make a lot of moves or sign any of today's most prominent boxers.  But you have to give him credit... he did help a lot of boxers become superstars.  Yes, Oscar's and Floyd's biggest paydays came after their departures from Top Rank, but it's not like their popularity didn't increase from Arum's promotion.  The kind of money they got after was just a result of striking out on your own, which happens in a number of industries... just look at the recording industry, when big successes finish up their recording contracts with whichever company signed them, then move on to form their own record label and release their own albums through it.

Al Haymon is the real reason why Golden Boy is in the driver seat.

Haymon should just be a promoter. But for whatever reason he loves to just be the "adviser." Almost every interview with his fighters is "I want to Thank God and Al Haymon." Haymon controls Floyd. Danny Garcia. Broner. Lara. Berto. Trout. Quillin. Keith Thurman. And more. These are some of the top guys and guess what banner they "fight" under? Golden Boy. So, now, all the leverage goes to Golden Boy because Arum's top guy fights in and around the weight class that all of Haymon's guys do. Golden Boy and Al Haymon are basically trying to force Arum out and he's refusing to leave.

Haymon is definitely in a powerful position, but staying out of the promotion category gives him a little bit of flexibility since he doesn't represent a specific brand that would get in the way... kind of like how trainers work with the fighter(s) specifically and don't really care much for the promotional banner.  He and Golden Boy together, in an unofficial alliance, have a strong hand, but they don't quite have the leverage to force Arum out... at least not this year.  Golden Boy does have Floyd essentially and a lot of other up-and-coming talent (which helps stack their undercards legitimately, which helps get another couple hundred thousand PPV buys -- as something like Canelo vs. Mosley definitely helped encourage people to buy Mayweather vs. Cotto), but Top Rank is still home to Manny, at least until the end of 2014.  Bradley re-signed for another year (and, when asked about why, made a good point about declining a contract extension with Top Rank wouldn't guarantee him a Mayweather fight).  Marquez is still there.  Cotto is on his own and did do some business with Golden Boy, but he maintains good ties with Top Rank and is working with them again, so Arum can't be THAT bad if Cotto has the freedom to go wherever but still works with them willingly.  Rios-Alvarado III is still something we want to see, even if they're both coming off of losses.

If he was easier to work with, we would've seen a ton of fights happen by now. But, he has to face the fact that he's not getting Floyd back. And Manny might just go "independent" when his contract is up. If Arum left Top Rank, the last wall to break would be HBO. They are another large share of the blame pie.

Top Rank and Golden Boy did play nice for quite a while, like I said, and we got a lot of memorable fights out of it... Cotto-Mosley, De La Hoya-Pacquiao, Mosley-Margarito, Pacquiao-Hatton, etc.  De La Hoya-Cotto was even supposed to happen, until Cotto lost to Margarito.  So they made it work before.  And like I said before, the rift wasn't there until Floyd came back.  Not saying it's Floyd's fault, but it's just an interesting coincidence.

But Arum was never going to get Floyd "back."  He never said anything about making Floyd sign to Top Rank, as it's generally always been a joint effort between Top Rank and Golden Boy negotiating the terms, with both sides talking shit about each other and blaming the other side for some reason while going to the media to say whatever (it's happening, it's not happening, it's close to being finalized, the fight is off, etc.).  However, outside of Mayweather-Pacquiao negotiations, I will say that Golden Boy has probably made more concessions than Top Rank... but in the actual Mayweather-Pacquiao negotiations, I personally place more blame on Golden Boy and Team Mayweather.

With the talk of trying to chop down Top Rank and HBO... you're basically just talking about creating a monopoly, which would obviously make fights easier to make, but a monopoly isn't always a good thing.

Much like Arum, they've been on top forever. Losing Floyd hurt them, too. When Stephen Espinoza went to head up their competition, they threw down an ultimatum. Golden Boy called their bluff and really left HBO with very little.

It had nothing to do with the CBS Platform for Floyd. It was the latter part. HBO is notorious for wanting to control the situation. With the ex-attorney for Golden Boy having all of Golden Boy's fighters to himself, all the control is in the hands of Golden Boy. Why? Because Showtime is essentially an extension of Golden Boy. It's virtually their own network. They don't have competition. The Promoter can do as they please.

HBO now has Top Rank and the lesser options like Goosen, DiBella and even 50 Cent since he has dudes like Kirkland and Gamboa. That's a lot of Chiefs who do not want to be Indians. It's a free for all and old style Boxing politics made it that way for HBO and Top Rank.

I wouldn't say that HBO was on top forever.  Remember that a lot of the older fights from the '90s were Showtime... I believe Holyfield-Tyson II was on Showtime, and that held the PPV record until De La Hoya-Mayweather.  I could be wrong, but I feel like Showtime did a good job at getting the heavyweight fights, while HBO seemed to get a lot of the other fights.

HBO had a stronghold on boxing for a lot of the 2000s to now, but realistically, you have to give some props to Arum for Showtime coming back.  Remember that he took his fights to Showtime in 2011, and they did really well... only then did we hear about the possibility of utilizing CBS and a lot of the associated networks.  (Remember that when Floyd was asked if he was going to watch Pacquiao-Mosley on Showtime, he said that he would instead be watching Lady Gaga perform on HBO.)  That move lost HBO some money, and they even fired one of their execs for losing that business, particularly Pacquiao-Mosley (which did generate 1.3 million PPV buys).  I'm not saying that Arum is what helped Showtime become what they are, but the short stint with Showtime deserves to be on a timeline of events leading to what you are describing.  It shook up HBO a little bit while giving Showtime a shot to flex in modern day boxing promotion.

But I don't think it's a problem of "old style boxing politics" causing the rifts.  It's just a clash between the old promoters who still manage to stay relevant (otherwise they'd have faded away by now and lost all of their talent) and the new promoters, who learned from their previous experiences as fighters themselves but now work with fighters who they give far more control to and let them dictate their own terms... yes, it's great for the fighters, but when the fighter is being unreasonable, there's really no one in a position to tell them to stop being a diva.  It's like that in basketball too (except it's teams instead of promoters)... in a day and age where damn near everyone good enough to be on the All-Star team is getting eight figures annually -- remember that Michael Jordan didn't get that until his last two seasons with the Bulls when he had already won four rings going into that -- people are bowing down to the players a little more than they should to the point where the players think that they are bigger than the sport.  It's not to say that they aren't good at what they do or deserve what they are getting paid, but people are being extremely ungrateful and acting like they rule the world.

50 is part of the new generation of promoters, but it seems like he understands it.  He's a good businessman (you don't build a $300 million fortune by accident), and he's said time and time again that he thought it was stupid for Floyd to brush aside a fight with Manny when interest was at its peak.  Yes, it's Manny's fault for not having won either of his fights in 2012, but you can't expect interest to continuously peak (or at least stay at its peak) over the course of a number of years when considering that boxing is a risky sport where anything could happen.  It would've been a good time for someone down with Floyd to sit down with him and just tell him to just take the fight when the other guy has already agreed to the terms that he has changed time and time again.  But think about it... 50 was viewed as being best friends with Floyd but eventually split from TMT and did his own thing, and maintains a decent relationship with Arum (remember he put Gamboa on the Pacquiao-Marquez IV undercard).  Does that say anything?

[DeeezNuuuts83]

Aaaand good night, Mr. Ortiz

[O.G A.Geesta'z]

well that was short.. didnt see that coming... have fun being a janitor Victor Ortiz

[DeeezNuuuts83]

Yeah... three straight early endings (and not even losses by decision) means it's time to hang up his gloves and just enjoy the cash he made, unless he invested poorly... then he'll be at the temp agency.

[whoisthis]

well that was short.. didnt see that coming... have fun being a janitor Victor Ortiz

You called it dude. Wow.

@Deez

A monopoly in Boxing wouldn't be a bad thing, per se. Think about MMA. When the UFC bought out and brought over Pride, WEC and Strikeforce, they were able to make fights that people wanted to see. From a fans perspective, it's great. This is what I like about the GBP/Showtime relationship. I wouldn't mind if all of Boxing was like this.

Arum has done great things, I'm not taking away anything from him. But, it's time to move on. You cannot hold on to past achievements forever. And that's what we're doing with Arum. I still contend that he's lacking the fire power for leverage. He has 2 of the best fighters in the world in Ward and Rigo and either fighters are avoiding them or the network is avoiding them (or both). He has Bradley that most people don't want to fight. Marquez who's too busy crying after every single loss. Rios, Alvarado and Prodvodnikov are essentially he's biggest draws. He has no real say over what Cotto can and can't do and quite frankly wouldn't shoot himself in the foot and send over another big name to Golden Boy. That's why he's open to working with 50. DiBella. etc. Because they A, have fighters he needs to put on good fights with own fighters and B, they're name's are not big enough to take up half the banner.

Beyond Floyd and Manny, they struggled to put together Mares/Donaire. At the time, Donaire was the man and Mares was the up and comer. Top Rank used that leverage. So, now, the shoe is on the other foot and Golden Boy is doing the same. They all have blame in this, but that's why I really put it on Arum. All of his tactics that he's pulled on others are being shoved back in his face and it's hurting boxing. I feel Floyd has been a huge problem in making the fight with Manny, but that's why I don't like the idea of Boxers essentially calling their own shots. Even when the Alaphabets try to force a fighter into a fight, they'll just drop the belt, move weight classes or flat out decline.

As for HBO, they've always been in the drivers seat. There's been pockets where Showtime would sneak in and have a good year or 2, but when you thought Boxing, you always thought HBO. When you thought of big fights, you thought of HBO. Until of course Showtime got Floyd.

[DeeezNuuuts83]

A monopoly in Boxing wouldn't be a bad thing, per se. Think about MMA. When the UFC bought out and brought over Pride, WEC and Strikeforce, they were able to make fights that people wanted to see. From a fans perspective, it's great. This is what I like about the GBP/Showtime relationship. I wouldn't mind if all of Boxing was like this.

I agree, and MMA is a great example, but what Golden Boy is trying to do is a little different.  They don't want to merge or unite under a single banner, they straight up want to kill off Top Rank and pick up the pieces (in this case, the fighters) because they hate Arum while basically dissing their fighters in the process.  And whether they merge, overtake, etc., that still doesn't guarantee fights happening.  Floyd always talks about being his own boss, and in a lot of ways he is, but again the diva shit gets in the way.  Like Bradley said in a recent interview when asked about why he agreed to a contract extension when it would prevent him from taking some fights (i.e. Floyd), he said that it's not like NOT re-signing with Top Rank would have guaranteed him a shot.  And it's not like Golden Boy would force Floyd to fight anyone anyway, versus MMA having mandatory matches that they make happen.

Arum has done great things, I'm not taking away anything from him. But, it's time to move on. You cannot hold on to past achievements forever. And that's what we're doing with Arum. I still contend that he's lacking the fire power for leverage. He has 2 of the best fighters in the world in Ward and Rigo and either fighters are avoiding them or the network is avoiding them (or both). He has Bradley that most people don't want to fight. Marquez who's too busy crying after every single loss. Rios, Alvarado and Prodvodnikov are essentially he's biggest draws. He has no real say over what Cotto can and can't do and quite frankly wouldn't shoot himself in the foot and send over another big name to Golden Boy. That's why he's open to working with 50. DiBella. etc. Because they A, have fighters he needs to put on good fights with own fighters and B, they're name's are not big enough to take up half the banner.

Arum has definitely lost some ground, but he still has firepower.  He has the second-biggest draw in all of boxing.  And legally speaking, Golden Boy doesn't even have the first, since Floyd is not officially signed to Golden Boy (even though he works with them exclusively).  But outside of Floyd, who does Golden Boy have who is actually a big draw (when not fighting Floyd)?  They have a lot more of a supporting cast, and it helps them build more solid undercards that help fuel PPV buys, but it's not like they have an arsenal of fighters who rack up buys as good as Manny.  Cotto-Margarito II and Marquez-Bradley were both pretty successful for what they were, and it's not like Golden Boy's best non-Floyd matches were any better in terms of PPV success.

Beyond Floyd and Manny, they struggled to put together Mares/Donaire. At the time, Donaire was the man and Mares was the up and comer. Top Rank used that leverage. So, now, the shoe is on the other foot and Golden Boy is doing the same. They all have blame in this, but that's why I really put it on Arum. All of his tactics that he's pulled on others are being shoved back in his face and it's hurting boxing. I feel Floyd has been a huge problem in making the fight with Manny, but that's why I don't like the idea of Boxers essentially calling their own shots. Even when the Alaphabets try to force a fighter into a fight, they'll just drop the belt, move weight classes or flat out decline.

I agree.  And the Floyd thing you mentioned is something I also addressed.  Just as the sanctioning bodies can't exactly "force" a fight (since the belt can always be vacated, if the fighter doesn't feel like fighting the mandatory challenger), again, a single boxing promotion banner would not force any fights either... not to say that it wouldn't make it easier, but again, there's still no guarantee.  Floyd could still say no, or make his conditions even more absurd than before.

[O.G A.Geesta'z]

what a shame HBO didnt broadcast GGG's excellent fight today...

i say Golvkin vs Martinez soon... thats of course if Cotto isnt in the way,

i think there is gonna be a good tournament going on in friday night fights, between lightweights and middleweights...
but i hate how Barthemy got his title tooken away because supposedly he hit after the bell but really its the ref's fault, but the sounds Teddy's weird ass  were making during that knockout  were funny, but for once i agree with Teddy and think Barthemy shouldnt have been stripped, but a rematch will atleast be anticipated now

Friday Night Fights on ESPN is becoming fun again just because Tyson is promoting now, and last year i even saw Vince Vaughn promoting a fight, i never thought one of my favorite actors would even promote lol this could be 50 Cents gateway into boxing if FNF can keep putting good matches for the rest of the year

[whoisthis]

I agree, and MMA is a great example, but what Golden Boy is trying to do is a little different.  They don't want to merge or unite under a single banner, they straight up want to kill off Top Rank and pick up the pieces (in this case, the fighters) because they hate Arum while basically dissing their fighters in the process.  And whether they merge, overtake, etc., that still doesn't guarantee fights happening.  Floyd always talks about being his own boss, and in a lot of ways he is, but again the diva shit gets in the way.  Like Bradley said in a recent interview when asked about why he agreed to a contract extension when it would prevent him from taking some fights (i.e. Floyd), he said that it's not like NOT re-signing with Top Rank would have guaranteed him a shot.  And it's not like Golden Boy would force Floyd to fight anyone anyway, versus MMA having mandatory matches that they make happen.

Yeah, I agree. Golden Boy is trying to cut off the head of Top Rank, but I really think a lot of that is a function of who's running Top Rank. I honestly feel that if there was a younger person running Top Rank, it'd be easier for all sides to work together. All fighters to an extent are their own boss, especially when they're as big as Floyd. As far as Bradley goes, he realizes that he's too good defensively to get a shot at Floyd. Floyd and his people only take fights against young inexperienced fighters or fighters with absolutely no power/no defense. Bradley has the Defense and sticks to his game plan, something that Floyd hates. THAT, to me, is why Bradley has no issue sticking with TR. The whole idea of running Boxing like MMA wouldn't work with these fighters. It'd have to be put in place and ran with young fighters. But, what you'll see is more "stars" and belts will mean something.

Arum has definitely lost some ground, but he still has firepower.  He has the second-biggest draw in all of boxing.  And legally speaking, Golden Boy doesn't even have the first, since Floyd is not officially signed to Golden Boy (even though he works with them exclusively).  But outside of Floyd, who does Golden Boy have who is actually a big draw (when not fighting Floyd)?  They have a lot more of a supporting cast, and it helps them build more solid undercards that help fuel PPV buys, but it's not like they have an arsenal of fighters who rack up buys as good as Manny.  Cotto-Margarito II and Marquez-Bradley were both pretty successful for what they were, and it's not like Golden Boy's best non-Floyd matches were any better in terms of PPV success.

Broner is actually a big draw, surprisingly. He put up great numbers all year and that was on Showtime. Canelo obviously will still sell PPV's because he'll have the entire Mexican community behind him. They might not put up numbers like Manny, but lately his numbers haven't been great. Broner and Canelo are still really young. They have the opportunity of growing and becoming even bigger draws. Manny is still number 2, but he's not really improving numbers wise. By the way, did you see what Arum said about undercards? This is why this dude needs to go.

what a shame HBO didnt broadcast GGG's excellent fight today...

i say Golvkin vs Martinez soon... thats of course if Cotto isnt in the way,

i think there is gonna be a good tournament going on in friday night fights, between lightweights and middleweights...
but i hate how Barthemy got his title tooken away because supposedly he hit after the bell but really its the ref's fault, but the sounds Teddy's weird ass  were making during that knockout  were funny, but for once i agree with Teddy and think Barthemy shouldnt have been stripped, but a rematch will atleast be anticipated now

Friday Night Fights on ESPN is becoming fun again just because Tyson is promoting now, and last year i even saw Vince Vaughn promoting a fight, i never thought one of my favorite actors would even promote lol this could be 50 Cents gateway into boxing if FNF can keep putting good matches for the rest of the year

GGG is such a beast. HBO screwed up, big time. He picked the guy apart, as usual.

I heard about the tournament on FNF, I'll have to check that out.

[Nutty]

Has Mayweather announced his next fight? As for ducking Bradley, you really think so?

[whoisthis]

Has Mayweather announced his next fight? As for ducking Bradley, you really think so?

Mayweather is "letting fans" decide whether he fights Khan or Maidana. I don't know if it's necessarily ducking Bradley, but you do not see a ton of fighters clamoring to fight the guy. He struggled to find a fight after the 1st Pacquiao fight. His style has a lot to do with it. Kinda like Rigondeaux.

[DeeezNuuuts83]

Yeah, I agree. Golden Boy is trying to cut off the head of Top Rank, but I really think a lot of that is a function of who's running Top Rank. I honestly feel that if there was a younger person running Top Rank, it'd be easier for all sides to work together. All fighters to an extent are their own boss, especially when they're as big as Floyd. As far as Bradley goes, he realizes that he's too good defensively to get a shot at Floyd. Floyd and his people only take fights against young inexperienced fighters or fighters with absolutely no power/no defense. Bradley has the Defense and sticks to his game plan, something that Floyd hates. THAT, to me, is why Bradley has no issue sticking with TR. The whole idea of running Boxing like MMA wouldn't work with these fighters. It'd have to be put in place and ran with young fighters. But, what you'll see is more "stars" and belts will mean something.

While Arum runs Top Rank, Todd Duboef does help out too... and his responsibilities do vary (as he's stepped in when Arum wasn't available) and apparently has a much better relationship with people outside of Top Rank.  But at the same time, the HEAD guy only does so much.  Oscar has been in rehab and Golden Boy is still sailing along, even though Schaefer is a PR nightmare, with all of the trash he talks.  He doesn't know how to ignore stuff or let stuff go, he always needs to throw one last jab in.

But at the end of the day, it's the promotional companies that are paying the boxers who claim that they are their own boss, and not the boxers putting up the money to have the event set up.  What would be great would be if Golden Boy could man up for once with Floyd and say, "Fight this guy who we and the boxing world wants you to fight, then you get your $50 million guarantee, but if you fight who YOU want to fight but very few people care to see you fight him, then you get a $25 million guarantee... take it or leave it."  Seriously, what is Floyd going to do?  All he knows is Top Rank (who he won't go back to) and Golden Boy.  He's not realistically going to just put together some random team of people who are going to have the promotional capabilities of those giants.  Lou DiBella probably doesn't have the capital to do it.  He won't want to go back to 50 Cent when they already split from each other.  It would be a good wake up call to him, with how much he has toyed with the boxing world.  Even Floyd fans have suffered for it at times, as they (like every other fan) have wanted to see him fight Manny while cringing at some of the garbage we've been given instead in the meantime, regardless of how successful it was... yet his guarantees have only gone up.

Broner is actually a big draw, surprisingly. He put up great numbers all year and that was on Showtime. Canelo obviously will still sell PPV's because he'll have the entire Mexican community behind him. They might not put up numbers like Manny, but lately his numbers haven't been great. Broner and Canelo are still really young. They have the opportunity of growing and becoming even bigger draws. Manny is still number 2, but he's not really improving numbers wise. By the way, did you see what Arum said about undercards? This is why this dude needs to go.

Canelo is much more famous now than he used to be, but he's not really supported by the entire Mexican community to the point where they will all buy his fights... don't let the 2.2 million PPV buys of Mayweather-Alvarez fool you.  I'd say Marquez has a more loyal following, within the Mexican community.  Expect Canelo's next PPV fight to do 300,000 at best, especially since it's not like he made any statements against Floyd or won any new fans by losing and not really being able to tag him.

Manny's numbers will improve, though the dip in his PPV sales was expected, though 475,000 buys was a little disappointing regardless.  But it was ONE disappointing event, one that happened to be following two losses while being against another guy coming off of a loss and taking place overseas in China.  Off the top of my head:

De La Hoya-Pacquiao: 1.25M
Pacquiao-Hatton: 850k
Pacquiao-Cotto: 1.25M
Pacquiao-Clottey: 700k
Pacquiao-Margarito: 1.15M
Pacquiao-Mosley: 1.3M
Pacquiao-Marquez III: 1.45M
Pacquiao-Bradley: 900k
Pacquiao-Marquez IV: 1.15M
Pacquiao-Rios: 475k

Big dip, for sure.  But the circumstances going into the fight justify it, but there wasn't really a significant pattern of decreasing interest that can't be explained.  And coming off of the momentum of winning again and returning to Vegas, it should bring back some interest.  Not to legitimize the win over Rios (who we didn't really expect to come close to winning unless he got off a lucky punch), but he was always someone who struggled making weight in the lower categories, so people figured he'd be right at home at 147.  He even said that he could focus more on actually training, since a lot of his previous training camps involved him having to cut a lot of weight.

Has Mayweather announced his next fight? As for ducking Bradley, you really think so?

I don't think Mayweather is ducking Bradley, but Bradley re-signing with Top Rank makes it just as difficult as a Manny fight.  While Floyd is likely more confident about beating Bradley than Manny, to be consistent, he'll have to use the same excuse about his opponents having no ties to Arum as one of his requirements.  Floyd won't need to fear Bradley's punches (which really aren't that hard), but maybe Floyd knows Bradley might be a little harder to tag than most of his opponents who are generally more offensive-minded and try to go in for the money shot.

Mayweather is "letting fans" decide whether he fights Khan or Maidana. I don't know if it's necessarily ducking Bradley, but you do not see a ton of fighters clamoring to fight the guy. He struggled to find a fight after the 1st Pacquiao fight. His style has a lot to do with it. Kinda like Rigondeaux.

But how is that happening?  Unless things changed and Broner is giving up on the rematch clause with Maidana, then Maidana isn't going to be available for May.  While Floyd has a shit ton of money either way, I think he'll definitely want to cover that $10 million loss from betting on the Broncos.  He can deny that he made the bet all he wants, but when the denial only comes out AFTER the Broncos lost though the initial reports of the alleged bet came out a week ago... it's a little suspect, especially when the one report coming out denying it was from somebody who is his massage therapist, who apparently is well aware of what bets Floyd makes.

[whoisthis]

I hate Schaefer. He's a douche, just like Arum. But, I think he has far less influence over any fights and such in comparison to Arum.

I'd love for GB to give Floyd an ultimatum like that, they'd never do it. Promoters are too afraid of losing out on a pay day. At the end of it all, Floyd will go where ever he has to for the money. He bad mouths Oscar every chance he gets, but he's lining his pockets nicely. Floyd can put any feelings to the side for the money. There are no other promoters with the money or clout to promote Floyd properly. Not even 50.

We'll see what numbers Canelo does with this next fight. He's not quite at Marquez's status, but he's also 15 or so years younger. He'll be there sooner than later. Manny is getting older and his competition isn't getting better. Better promotion and a better story line will give this fight with Bradley more buys, but where does he go from here? Marquez V? Ruslan?

Maidana fighting Floyd is Golden Boy (and more importantly Haymon) telling everyone else: Floyd gets first pick, you get what he leaves behind. And I agree 100%. Floyd did bet that money. He just didn't want to look like a loser. Had he not bet, why didn't he say something sooner?

[DeeezNuuuts83]

I hate Schaefer. He's a douche, just like Arum. But, I think he has far less influence over any fights and such in comparison to Arum.

Well yeah... Arum is actually a promoter who has been promoting for decades, including a lot of the greatest fights in boxing history.  Schaefer's background is in banking and finances, and he got involved in promotion with Oscar around ten years ago or so.  Schaefer has definitely helped Oscar build Golden Boy into a huge company, particularly if you focus on the money generated -- can't deny that.  But very few of their fights had an epic feel to them, when the fight was over, in the sense of knowing that it's a fight that would be talked about for years.

I'd love for GB to give Floyd an ultimatum like that, they'd never do it. Promoters are too afraid of losing out on a pay day. At the end of it all, Floyd will go where ever he has to for the money. He bad mouths Oscar every chance he gets, but he's lining his pockets nicely. Floyd can put any feelings to the side for the money. There are no other promoters with the money or clout to promote Floyd properly. Not even 50.

They would never do it... but they could.  Again, the only other company large enough and with the proper experience to work with Floyd would be Top Rank, but he'll never do that.  I would say that 50 might have the money and clout to do it... but the problem with 50 is that he doesn't have enough fighters signed to him exclusively to put together an event (since it would require some undercard matches) unless he did a joint effort with someone else (hence negating using SMS Promotions in the first place instead of Golden Boy or Top Rank), plus he only recently got his promoters license in Nevada (as at first he only had it in New York).

We'll see what numbers Canelo does with this next fight. He's not quite at Marquez's status, but he's also 15 or so years younger. He'll be there sooner than later. Manny is getting older and his competition isn't getting better. Better promotion and a better story line will give this fight with Bradley more buys, but where does he go from here? Marquez V? Ruslan?

We can forecast what might happen to him in the future, but it doesn't necessarily serve as an indication of how successful his next fight will be.  And while Canelo was a good opponent for Floyd, he doesn't have that warrior spirit or the flair that sells that fighter (rather than the fighter pairing).  People watched Oscar because he was the Golden Boy.  People watch Floyd because they want to see him either completely outclass his opponent or lose for the first time, since he's a big talker.  People watch Manny because they know the other person is going to get his face bruised up.  Canelo doesn't have that factor yet, and it comes from doing something that pulls a crowd beyond your own community.

Considering how the Pacquiao-Bradley I did 900k buys when Bradley was still relatively unknown, it's very possible that the next fight should break a million, considering how Manny dominated Rios in his last fight (so there's the "he's back" view), plus Bradley has built up his credibility as a fighter by beating Provodnikov in a war (one that really helped him regain some respect with it being a potential fight-of-the-year since a lot of people were hating on him after he got the split decision win over Manny) and also beating Marquez.  And then there's the storyline about the first fight's outcome.