It's May 16, 2024, 09:38:12 AM
Not really, it's not like anyone believed Suge to begin with... plus it's not like his deals were the best either, and when they were, the artists didn't get paid in accordance with their contract terms.
If that's what he meant (which is possible), then he's confusing things that Suge said but from different interviews. I think in the other interview (maybe with Arsenio) was where he talked about their record deals having to split with Interscope
Quote from: DeeezNuuuts83 on April 17, 2014, 02:49:32 PMIf that's what he meant (which is possible), then he's confusing things that Suge said but from different interviews. I think in the other interview (maybe with Arsenio) was where he talked about their record deals having to split with Interscope But when he said that thing about the tour money, it was his explanation for the first interview. He was expanding on it like, "This is why I said that". I think what Top Dawg is getting at is addressing the confusion. You can't say, "Death Row was different because we weren't giving tour money to Interscope" and not expect clarification if that statement is false. I've never heard it explained why Suge saw his artist deals as "different". As I recall and I could be mistaken on this one, his wife, was the manager for nearly everybody at the label when it first popped off, besides Dre. Their legal representation was the same lawyer for the label. Now, your manager is supposed to negotiate with the label on your behalf to get you the best deal. If that person is working with the label, what are the odds of that happening?
I've never heard it explained why Suge saw his artist deals as "different". As I recall and I could be mistaken on this one, his wife, was the manager for nearly everybody at the label when it first popped off, besides Dre. Their legal representation was the same lawyer for the label. Now, your manager is supposed to negotiate with the label on your behalf to get you the best deal. If that person is working with the label, what are the odds of that happening?
The deals were different because number one Death Row saved Interscope. Due to that Suge could do whatever he wanted in Interscope's eyes. It wasn't Interscope telling Suge and DR what to do, it was the other way around because DR was on point and Interscope was making alot of money with DR.
The only person who came close was 50 and Jimmy Ivonne cut him off the same way he did Suge even though bit were loyal to him. That's one major difference.
Two, his artist were signed to Death Row/Interscope with maybeone other imprint in between. This was before the merger with Universal. With the case of Kendrick and Game there are more imprints to go through before they see a cut. That's all Suge was saying. Which obviously isn't a good position to be in and anyone in the business will tell you that.
Next point is the touring aspect which Suge may be wrong about as far as Interscope getting a piece, it wasn't like that during the DR days. That's generally associated with 360 deals which came well after DR. I'm not familiar with Suge's wife being manager but if so that isn't uncommon and it doesn't necessarily mean that the artist is being ripped off. It's just a conflict of interest which may lead to abuse. Sha Money XL was manager for some G-Unit members even though he had a top position at G-Unit.
Suge was/is Dre manager. I say "is" because he claims to have a lifetime agreement with him on that. I know Dre isn't honoring it, don't get me wrong but surely that was a conflict, however was it really bad for business in Dre's case?
Suge also mentioned royalties and publishing which TDE didn't deny. That has always been an issue in the industry but in recent years labels have wanted more from their artist, the same as they want the artist touring money to compensate for the lack of record sales. I will go out on a limb an say that Game and Kendrick contracts have them seeing less than past death row artist simply because the times that they are in where the music industry has basically collapsed.
Despite what everyone thinks, according to former DR artist, DR artist were all eating well over there. Yes there was f*ckery but even if there wasn't it doesn't mean that Suge isn't on point with his comments. Everything he is saying could apply to his artist but that wouldn't make a word of this untrue. It would just be hypocritical for him to say.
It's a conflict of interest, but it's not as if anyone (other than maybe Pac) had an attorney before signing with Death Row, or hired one on their own when wanting to negotiate.
Suge was calling shots at Interscope, period! So was 50, probably Em and Dre as well. You give the label to much credit , look at them now. Once again they are failing waiting for the next person to come in and set things back in order. They don't know Hip Hop. People like Suge do, they had no choice but to follow suit. If they had any sense they would have seen what they had in Pac instead of closing the books on him. At the end of the day, no DR no Interscope.
Suge did a deal elsewhere worth millions but he turned it down for Jimmy out of loyalty. I'll continue to look for the source but in the meantime I'm sure someone here can confirm Suge saying that. It was like $60-80 million if I remember correctly and he specifically said it was out of loyalty to Jimmy.
Just because the artist make money doesn't mean it's a good deal. What's a good deal? You as the artist with the least amount of hands in your pocket as possible. Artist sign too quickly or sign deals for too many albums or for too many years that allows others to continue to profit off of the work that they the artist do while the ones they are signed to benefit simply because they have the paperwork on them. In many cases the people they are signed to don't uphold their end of the contract and the artist are the ones who grind and make themselves hot enough to bring in the money. That's why it's best to do as much as you can independently, try to keep everything in house and put on your people. (Just make sure your people are qualified to work for you.)
What you said @DeeezNuuuts83 is what The D.O.C. experienced fooling with Dre for over twenty years. Once it was over he had nothing to show for it. But that's his fault for never learning the game. Suge knows about all of this because he tried to help The D.O.C. and Dre with their Ruthless contracts. He knows what he's talking about from experience. I'll take his word over TDE's or Game's anyday of the week.
Quote from: abusive on April 23, 2014, 08:26:20 AMSuge was calling shots at Interscope, period! So was 50, probably Em and Dre as well. You give the label to much credit , look at them now. Once again they are failing waiting for the next person to come in and set things back in order. They don't know Hip Hop. People like Suge do, they had no choice but to follow suit. If they had any sense they would have seen what they had in Pac instead of closing the books on him. At the end of the day, no DR no Interscope. I think Suge and Death Row were given the keys to palace over there but I don't think they were running it. Quote from: abusive on April 23, 2014, 08:26:20 AMSuge did a deal elsewhere worth millions but he turned it down for Jimmy out of loyalty. I'll continue to look for the source but in the meantime I'm sure someone here can confirm Suge saying that. It was like $60-80 million if I remember correctly and he specifically said it was out of loyalty to Jimmy. Are you referring to the deal he was offered by C. Delores Tucker for a "cleaner Death Row" overseen by her and her watchdog group? I don't know what the deal was he didn't say, I just heard him mention it in a interview or documentary or something. One of the DR oligist can confirm this. If not it's still true. lolQuote from: abusive on April 23, 2014, 08:26:20 AMJust because the artist make money doesn't mean it's a good deal. What's a good deal? You as the artist with the least amount of hands in your pocket as possible. Artist sign too quickly or sign deals for too many albums or for too many years that allows others to continue to profit off of the work that they the artist do while the ones they are signed to benefit simply because they have the paperwork on them. In many cases the people they are signed to don't uphold their end of the contract and the artist are the ones who grind and make themselves hot enough to bring in the money. That's why it's best to do as much as you can independently, try to keep everything in house and put on your people. (Just make sure your people are qualified to work for you.) I think that's debatable. If the people you're giving that money to are doing what they need to do for that money, it can work in the artist's favor but it's also about how much the artist is willing to do for himself. 50 had a deal with Dre, Eminem, and Jimmy plus whatever managers he had at that time but he still managed to work into one of the most lucrative deals in the industry. That's 3 entities you named where Kendrick and Game have more than 3. I fail to see your point. Also, Kendrick and Game haven't seen anywhere near the level of success that 50 has had. 50 was doing in a few weeks what it has taken Kendrick a year to deal.I would certainly favor independent money over the major labels is if the artist truly has their grind down but if what you are making as an independent artist doesn't add up to what you would on a label deal, it's not that much better of an option in some cases. Most people will agree that in the case of Kendrick that it was him and TDE that him where he is. Not Aftermath/Interscope. Did you peep the recent comments by School Boy Q about staying independent? Schoolboy Q Wishes He Could’ve Stayed Independenthttp://thesource.com/2014/03/11/schoolboy-q-wishes-he-couldve-stayed-independent/TDE’s Schoolboy Q, who’s debut album, Oxymoron, is still in the top 10 on the Billboard 200 three weeks after being released–recently vented to Hot 93.7 on how he regrets signing to Interscope Records, wishing that he remained independent at TDE instead of being under a “rap contract”. Being under Interscope he states that he isn’t allowed to put out mixtapes anymore, saving all of his creative energy for his studio albums instead. Although he was grateful for having the title of having the #1 album in the country last week, he states that he doesn’t really care about having a top radio single, and he was much more into being independent. It seems like he is staying away from major endorsement deals as well, stating that everyone wants to collaborate on a bucket hat collection with him. “There’s so many bucket hat companies offering me so much money, but I’d rather do it myself. If you wanted to give me that much money, I know I could make that much money on my own.” He states that he believes that he can enter the world of side projects such as fashion (bucket hats) on his own, and as far as that goes, he has everything covered.Notice what he says about the bucket hat thing. It's probably in his contract with Interscope to get a portion of that money! I wouldn't be surprised if true that he doesn't want to do the deal just so he doesn't have to split the money up with them. From what I can see he has been riding the wave of Kendrick's success in a similar way that Game rode the success of 50. (Don't get me wrong, I know he's been grinding for a minute and putting out good content but a large part of his exposure comes strategically from TDE associating him with Kendrick.) He could have easily put his album out without the majors and done similar numbers. Even if the numbers were smaller he would have been able to keep a larger piece of the pie and in turn made more by doing so. Quote from: abusive on April 23, 2014, 08:26:20 AMWhat you said @DeeezNuuuts83 is what The D.O.C. experienced fooling with Dre for over twenty years. Once it was over he had nothing to show for it. But that's his fault for never learning the game. Suge knows about all of this because he tried to help The D.O.C. and Dre with their Ruthless contracts. He knows what he's talking about from experience. I'll take his word over TDE's or Game's anyday of the week. I wouldn't even really speculate on who is right and who is wrong from simple conversation. The Game deal seems funny because time has revealed some inconsistencies about that deal but TDE until more information comes out, I can't say if it's bad or good. The Game was screwed from the get go. He was shelved at Interscope for a minute, 50 saved him from that and blew him up, when he did blow up JT came in and wanted his piece. So you already had Interscope/Aftermath/50/JT eating off of him then Jimmy Henchman and whoever else is in the picture. Regardless of whether or not Game has/had certain aspects of a 360 deal such as forking over part of endorsements/tour money/acting gigs etc. his deal isn't good. I don't see why you would even consider debating this. You tell me at DR who had that many hands in an artist pocket. Even if you could the business model of labels eating off of artist deals outside of their music was non existent so they were automatically better off. You think Snoop had to pay DR/Interscope a piece of his St. Ides money? Unless St. Ides licensed part of the music that was under the labels they didn't see a piece. Now a days with these deals the labels get a piece even if the music isn't being used. You think they ate off of Pac's Versace deal? No! They were better off back in the day, I stand by that. The money was way bigger in the DR hey day than it is now, everyone knows that. Alot of cats made alot of money for bs albums, albums that flopped and even albums that were shelved.