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Sccit, do u like Phil Jackson?
TraceOneInfinite:
--- Quote from: Sccit on June 30, 2024, 04:06:02 PM ---
the difference is… usually hard ass coaches who run their players to the ground lose their players’ attention fast… players turn on them as those methods typically have repercussions that are not met well by those being worked hard…. but wit riley it was a different story… all the players always respected him .. u can’t argue wit the results.
he’s also up there with Phil as far as managing egos and personalities ..
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Okay then what you are saying is he gets the most out of players. But still... how? Like okay, they respect him so much that he can push them harder in practice then other coaches. Okay, why? Why do they respect him more. I still don't get why Riley is a great coach. I know he's a great coach, I'm just saying I don't get why.
And yes he is good at managing egos and personalities but again... how and why?
...To Compare..
I think Phil Jackson managed the egos on the Bulls by using Jerry Krause as a target. That wasn't fair to Jerry, because Jerry was is the one who hired Phil when Phil didn't really have that deep of a resume. Then Phil stabbed him in the back. But it was all worth it you can't argue with the results. Even Jerry was happy in the end with the results. But I feel like Phil filter all their negative emotions Jerry's way. It would sort of be like rather than having Shaq and Kobe go at it -- turn their frustrations to the GM
Sccit:
--- Quote from: TraceOneInfinite Flat Earther 96' on July 31, 2024, 07:03:58 PM ---Okay then what you are saying is he gets the most out of players. But still... how? Like okay, they respect him so much that he can push them harder in practice then other coaches. Okay, why? Why do they respect him more. I still don't get why Riley is a great coach. I know he's a great coach, I'm just saying I don't get why.
And yes he is good at managing egos and personalities but again... how and why?
...To Compare..
I think Phil Jackson managed the egos on the Bulls by using Jerry Krause as a target. That wasn't fair to Jerry, because Jerry was is the one who hired Phil when Phil didn't really have that deep of a resume. Then Phil stabbed him in the back. But it was all worth it you can't argue with the results. Even Jerry was happy in the end with the results. But I feel like Phil filter all their negative emotions Jerry's way. It would sort of be like rather than having Shaq and Kobe go at it -- turn their frustrations to the GM
--- End quote ---
watch winning time .. an hbo show about the 80s lakers
to sum it up a bit more, from an ego managing perspective, paul westhead (the previous coach who riley was an assistant to) was starting to lose his team .. he was a real “my way or the highway” type of coach who did things on his terms only and wanted the players to fall in line.. to the point where some of the players started to feel so isolated that even magic johnson eventually requested a trade…. but once that happened, westhead was fired and pat riley had a certain aura about him that made him very relatable. he was more willing to listen to the players while still maintaining that toughness and commanding that high level of respect .. that’s what made him great in managing egos.
and from a basketball standpoint, he took the run and gun showtime offense that he and westhead were running to another level .. and it really revolutionized basketball. because if u watch basketball today, every team runs a version of that offense. but in the 80s, it was the lakers thing and pat riley was one of the early orchestrators who perfected it.
TraceOneInfinite:
--- Quote from: Sccit on July 31, 2024, 09:16:58 PM ---watch winning time .. an hbo show about the 80s lakers
to sum it up a bit more, from an ego managing perspective, paul westhead (the previous coach who riley was an assistant to) was starting to lose his team .. he was a real “my way or the highway” type of coach who did things on his terms only and wanted the players to fall in line.. to the point where some of the players started to feel so isolated that even magic johnson eventually requested a trade…. but once that happened, westhead was fired and pat riley had a certain aura about him that made him very relatable. he was more willing to listen to the players while still maintaining that toughness and commanding that high level of respect .. that’s what made him great in managing egos.
and from a basketball standpoint, he took the run and gun showtime offense that he and westhead were running to another level .. and it really revolutionized basketball. because if u watch basketball today, every team runs a version of that offense. but in the 80s, it was the lakers thing and pat riley was one of the early orchestrators who perfected it.
--- End quote ---
Winning Time seemed wack—like it was made for women and casual fans. It’s actually a serious sports show?
…and fast breaks? Okay great, but he wasn’t doing fast breaks in NY and Miami
Sccit:
--- Quote from: TraceOneInfinite Flat Earther 96' on August 01, 2024, 02:16:50 AM ---Winning Time seemed wack—like it was made for women and casual fans. It’s actually a serious sports show?
…and fast breaks? Okay great, but he wasn’t doing fast breaks in NY and Miami
--- End quote ---
watch it .. it’s a good show. definitely not for women.
that’s another great thing about riley.. he was able to adjust his style based on personnel .. so in new york and miami, he adjusted to a more defensive oriented game. most coaches insist on their own style regardless of personnel, but Riley was a wizard with the fluidity and knowing which team needed what.
TraceOneInfinite:
--- Quote from: Sccit on August 01, 2024, 07:39:53 AM ---watch it .. it’s a good show. definitely not for women.
that’s another great thing about riley.. he was able to adjust his style based on personnel .. so in new york and miami, he adjusted to a more defensive oriented game. most coaches insist on their own style regardless of personnel, but Riley was a wizard with the fluidity and knowing which team needed what.
--- End quote ---
Yeah I mean props to Riley for being able to change styles, but I'm definitely more of a Phil Jackson/Tex Winter or Don Nelson type of guy who would want to run my style of basketball wherever I went and then I'd try to find guys who would fit that style.
Like to use another sport as an example Bill Walsh is my favorite NFL coach. So Jackson is my favorite NBA coach and then Bill Walsh my favorite NFL coach.
So Bill Walsh had his system the West Coast Offense and then even when his team was 1-15 his first years with the 9ers he didn't give a fucc cause he was implementing his god damn system. Then he just kept pushing it till he got the right players that could run his system. That style makes more sense to me.
Again, I like Riley as a person, an analyst, and there is no denying what a great coach he is. I use these coaches as inspiration in the work that I do as a teacher. And some I can gleen knowledge from like Jackson and Walsh—but others I study and I get nothing from them.
I have the same problem with Bill Belicheck of the Patriots. I've studied him a lot trying to gleen anything useful from the guy and never gotten anything I can use. Obviously a great coach but nothing I could get from him.
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