Lifestyle > Sports & Entertainment
NINTENDO UNVEILS REVOLUTION CONTROLLER
Shallow:
--- Quote from: Overseer on September 26, 2005, 03:59:48 PM ---
--- Quote from: Shallow on September 26, 2005, 01:36:50 PM ---
--- Quote from: Overseer on September 26, 2005, 11:15:25 AM ---
--- Quote from: Shallow on September 26, 2005, 07:22:00 AM ---I don't get what the point is of taking a game like Mario Revolution and making it look like it was made by some guy.
--- End quote ---
you have it all wrong. you're over simiplifying things.. trauma understood and reexplained what i meant in the last paragraph of his post. i cant say it any better than he did. I dont think you're reading posts here properly or aren't able to understand some of the finer points seeing how wide you missed the mark with this one. shallow indeed...
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Okay I think I get it. Trauma means that you can reprogram original games when burning them and that way have your system play bootleg games. If that's all it is then big fucking deal. That's been going on since the Game Doctor and mod chips are easy to find. If I got it wrong again ten please explain it to me.
--- End quote ---
the big deal is the the "bypass" would be in software.. and therefore wouldnt require hardware mods..
i.e.. its an easier hack..
and yes it is a BIG FUCKING DEAL to someone trying to get software houses to develop for their console if they can't promise a certain level of security.
your final points show you understand piracy to be a big issue since you admit that PC piracy is massive in comparison to console piracy. this is why people want to develop for consoles.. their investment is safer. (not safe.. safeR)
decent mod's chips do often take a long time to come out after console's are released.
--- Quote from: Shallow on September 26, 2005, 01:36:50 PM ---Why are you making this personal? Clicking the diss button (I just assumne it was you), and throwing out personal insults. I expect that kind of shit from Trauma, (which he didn't even do in this thread).
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no it wasn't me.. you're WAY over reacting.. you came out all defensive and actually ended up showing that you couldn't comprehend (and still cant by the looks of it) the implications of certain things
all i've said was the homebrew thing was a cool idea and that i liked it, i never said it would carry the console saleswise. just that its a cool thing to have... and that i like the idea of the controller.. i'm not going to buy one, i'm not even going to by a PS3 _OR_ an xbox 360. I only have an Xbox coz i was given it.. and if it weren't for xbmc i'd have sold it long ago. as it stands i can't do without it.
if you look back in this section i think xbox360 is far superior to the PS3 and have explained why i think the architecture is a winner. M$ had to get the release day jump on Sony this time round.. its a big risk.. but they're gonna get a lot of unit's in houses this Xmas which will be massively in their favour.
and no.. i still haven't clicked diss... i'm not on some childish petty shit like that
--- End quote ---
1) By the time there are enough games to need a mod chip (meaning when it gets to the point where you don't want to spend all that cash on 10+ games), there will be a mod chip. It's not like everyone that buys it is going to know how to reprogram the games. I'll bet the number of people that know where to get mod chips and pirated games greatly outnumber the number of people that would know how to use this techonology.
2) I disagree that it's safer to develop for a console these days. If it's CD or DVD based then anyone that can ind a PC game online can find a console game online.
3) I hardly "WAY" overreacted. I came online and saw my karma down and then the only post responding to one of my posts was by you and you took the time to personally insult me in that post. You can see how I came to my conclusion. You say it wasn't you and I'll take your word for. I really don't care about my Karma. I just found it petty and called you on it, but it wasn't you so I'm sorry. But I was wrong to think that.
4) Since I can't "by the looks of it" comprehend certain implications, why don't you explain it to me? This isn't a challenge; merely a request. I'm not trying to be stubborn or purposely ignoring what you said. If I've missed something I'd like to know what it was.
5) All you said was it was a cool idea, and I agreed with that, but I said it won't mean anything significant sales wise. Then you called my attitude the problem with gamers today. What was I supposed to think you wee referring to? I had said it was a cool idea and that it could create a nice cult fan base, and I said it wouldn't work mainstream because the games coming out wouldn't look like the games people have become accustomed to. I could only imagine you were associating my "problem" with the latter and disagreed with my opinion on the sucess of the system financially when compared to PS3. So I argued with you based on that. If we both think it'sa cool idea that won't take off in the mainstream then why are we arguing?
6) XBox wil get the jump and maybe sell a lot of units. Much like Dreamcast did, and just like Dreamcast it'll fall behind in sales by the end of the next Christmas. Sony has far too great a core fan base, and it'sa fan base of people in their 20s and 30s who have no problem withhte price tag. By Christmas 2006 the price will be smaller and a lot more people will buy and the X-Box 369 will have fallen to number 2 by January 2007. That's my prediction. Remember it, because I'll be glad to say I was wrong it come January 2007 X Box is ahead.
Trauma-san:
--- Quote from: Shallow on September 26, 2005, 07:22:00 AM ---
--- Quote from: I Want My Donation Back on September 26, 2005, 06:45:35 AM ---In my opinion, I doubt it's true. I read something, in an interview, that led me to believe that Nintendo will be working with smaller companies with some sort of templates, if that's possible, that will reduce some of the start up costs of developing games (they're saying around 50%). I didn't read anything that led me to believe they would be releasing homebrew friendly software.
Ultimately, the move they're making isn't to satiate fans who want to do their own games, it's to please third-party developers, whom Nintendo has had a rocky road with over the last several years. The main reason Nintendo is in 3rd place right now is because they didn't make it easy for third party developers to thrive on their system. Their first party titles are head and shoulders above the other two companies games, but that's not enough to win the battle anymore.
So now they're making it cheaper to make games for the revolution, they're saying you'll be able to make two or three revolution games for the price it would take to make 1 360 game or ps3 game. I think it's an effective strategy that will probably help them out tremendously.
I think the company with the most to lose this time around is Sony. I don't see the PS3 being the #1 console, that will probably belong to X-box, and Nintendo may or may not regain the '2nd' spot. The Gamecube has been outperforming the X-box in sales for nearly a year now, although in terms of overall sales it hasn't caught up.
Shallow; you're basically a pessimist. It comes across in all of your conversations.
"Make it look like homebrew" means that if Nintendo allows you to make a homebrew game for their system, then you could just copy "Super Mario Bros Revolution" or whatever onto a disc, hack it with a small code that makes it look like an original, homebrew creation, and run pirated software on the system. The revolution, to be able to play homebrew games, would have to be able to play pirated software.
--- End quote ---
There's a fine line between pessimistic and realistic. You are over optimistic and unrealistic. You actually said PS3 might fall to number 3. Gamecube and XBox combined didn't even sell half the systems PS2 sold. Sony is starting with a much bigger market. They have 90 million buyers to get to buy a PS3, while Microsoft and Nintendo have about 20 million to start with. Sony could only attract half their audience while Nintendo and Microsoft could each double, and Sony would still be number 1. Sony may lose down the line but anyone that thinks that Sony is going to lose the next round thinks with hte same logic that caused people to think Genesis would beat out SNES.
I don't get what the point is of taking a game like Mario Revolution and making it look like it was made by some guy.
--- End quote ---
That's because you're basically a fucking idiot. You don't get the point a LOT of the time.
Shallow:
--- Quote from: I Want My Donation Back on September 27, 2005, 07:04:04 AM ---
--- Quote from: Shallow on September 26, 2005, 07:22:00 AM ---
--- Quote from: I Want My Donation Back on September 26, 2005, 06:45:35 AM ---In my opinion, I doubt it's true. I read something, in an interview, that led me to believe that Nintendo will be working with smaller companies with some sort of templates, if that's possible, that will reduce some of the start up costs of developing games (they're saying around 50%). I didn't read anything that led me to believe they would be releasing homebrew friendly software.
Ultimately, the move they're making isn't to satiate fans who want to do their own games, it's to please third-party developers, whom Nintendo has had a rocky road with over the last several years. The main reason Nintendo is in 3rd place right now is because they didn't make it easy for third party developers to thrive on their system. Their first party titles are head and shoulders above the other two companies games, but that's not enough to win the battle anymore.
So now they're making it cheaper to make games for the revolution, they're saying you'll be able to make two or three revolution games for the price it would take to make 1 360 game or ps3 game. I think it's an effective strategy that will probably help them out tremendously.
I think the company with the most to lose this time around is Sony. I don't see the PS3 being the #1 console, that will probably belong to X-box, and Nintendo may or may not regain the '2nd' spot. The Gamecube has been outperforming the X-box in sales for nearly a year now, although in terms of overall sales it hasn't caught up.
Shallow; you're basically a pessimist. It comes across in all of your conversations.
"Make it look like homebrew" means that if Nintendo allows you to make a homebrew game for their system, then you could just copy "Super Mario Bros Revolution" or whatever onto a disc, hack it with a small code that makes it look like an original, homebrew creation, and run pirated software on the system. The revolution, to be able to play homebrew games, would have to be able to play pirated software.
--- End quote ---
There's a fine line between pessimistic and realistic. You are over optimistic and unrealistic. You actually said PS3 might fall to number 3. Gamecube and XBox combined didn't even sell half the systems PS2 sold. Sony is starting with a much bigger market. They have 90 million buyers to get to buy a PS3, while Microsoft and Nintendo have about 20 million to start with. Sony could only attract half their audience while Nintendo and Microsoft could each double, and Sony would still be number 1. Sony may lose down the line but anyone that thinks that Sony is going to lose the next round thinks with hte same logic that caused people to think Genesis would beat out SNES.
I don't get what the point is of taking a game like Mario Revolution and making it look like it was made by some guy.
--- End quote ---
That's because you're basically a fucking idiot. You don't get the point a LOT of the time.
--- End quote ---
I already admitted I was wrong and misinterpreted what you meant and corrected myself. Then I showed the reprograming method obsolete and still pointless. It's easier just get a mod chip and even if it were easier to reprogram, how does that help Nintendo's game sales?
Don Seer:
--- Quote from: Shallow on September 27, 2005, 07:12:51 AM ---
--- Quote from: I Want My Donation Back on September 27, 2005, 07:04:04 AM ---
--- Quote from: Shallow on September 26, 2005, 07:22:00 AM ---
--- Quote from: I Want My Donation Back on September 26, 2005, 06:45:35 AM ---In my opinion, I doubt it's true. I read something, in an interview, that led me to believe that Nintendo will be working with smaller companies with some sort of templates, if that's possible, that will reduce some of the start up costs of developing games (they're saying around 50%). I didn't read anything that led me to believe they would be releasing homebrew friendly software.
Ultimately, the move they're making isn't to satiate fans who want to do their own games, it's to please third-party developers, whom Nintendo has had a rocky road with over the last several years. The main reason Nintendo is in 3rd place right now is because they didn't make it easy for third party developers to thrive on their system. Their first party titles are head and shoulders above the other two companies games, but that's not enough to win the battle anymore.
So now they're making it cheaper to make games for the revolution, they're saying you'll be able to make two or three revolution games for the price it would take to make 1 360 game or ps3 game. I think it's an effective strategy that will probably help them out tremendously.
I think the company with the most to lose this time around is Sony. I don't see the PS3 being the #1 console, that will probably belong to X-box, and Nintendo may or may not regain the '2nd' spot. The Gamecube has been outperforming the X-box in sales for nearly a year now, although in terms of overall sales it hasn't caught up.
Shallow; you're basically a pessimist. It comes across in all of your conversations.
"Make it look like homebrew" means that if Nintendo allows you to make a homebrew game for their system, then you could just copy "Super Mario Bros Revolution" or whatever onto a disc, hack it with a small code that makes it look like an original, homebrew creation, and run pirated software on the system. The revolution, to be able to play homebrew games, would have to be able to play pirated software.
--- End quote ---
There's a fine line between pessimistic and realistic. You are over optimistic and unrealistic. You actually said PS3 might fall to number 3. Gamecube and XBox combined didn't even sell half the systems PS2 sold. Sony is starting with a much bigger market. They have 90 million buyers to get to buy a PS3, while Microsoft and Nintendo have about 20 million to start with. Sony could only attract half their audience while Nintendo and Microsoft could each double, and Sony would still be number 1. Sony may lose down the line but anyone that thinks that Sony is going to lose the next round thinks with hte same logic that caused people to think Genesis would beat out SNES.
I don't get what the point is of taking a game like Mario Revolution and making it look like it was made by some guy.
--- End quote ---
That's because you're basically a fucking idiot. You don't get the point a LOT of the time.
--- End quote ---
I already admitted I was wrong and misinterpreted what you meant and corrected myself. Then I showed the reprograming method obsolete and still pointless. It's easier just get a mod chip and even if it were easier to reprogram, how does that help Nintendo's game sales?
--- End quote ---
you still dont get the point.
i'll try explain.
first put yourself in the position of a person who works for a 3rd party development house wanting to develop games for revolution.
you want to know that the games you write wont be copied easily (originally i made the difference between not being SAFE but being SAFER without the homebrew interface)
mod chips are not easy to fit and source for the average joe, they're scared of fitting them, they dont understand flashing them and all that business.
on the other hand take a backdoor that is exploited by a legitimate interface which lets you run homegrown software _without_ invalidating the console's warranty.
there are two likely ways people would provide a hack via the homegrown interface.
option 1 : the need for each game to be modified to run via the homebrew thing.
option 2 : a homebrew 'loader' for copied games. this would be more desireable and a major problem
now.. go back to where you're meant to be thinkin about things from.
therefore... would you rather produced a game for a console with a limited number of users capable of doing hardware modding or one where a supported interface for homebrew stuff allows anyone to easily get around the security?
obviously the hardware modding "risk" is a far better option...
i'm not saying that a homebrew interface _would_ be hacked.. but given the history of things its very likely in one of the 2 methods i mentioned above.
this is why its likely a homebew interface isn't likely until a secure or very limited operating environment is available.
second point. you said something about cd's/dvd's being esay to copy.. yes thats true.. which is why several posts ago i pointed out how actually all console manufacturers do something clever with the media.
you're misinformed if you think they use "normal" cd's in the "normal" fashion.. put a xbox game in a dvd drive you wont read jack shit.
xbox games _have_ to be ripped over a network via the xbox drive itself..
Trauma-san:
--- Quote from: Shallow on September 26, 2005, 04:39:55 PM --- Remember it, because I'll be glad to say I was wrong it come January 2007 X Box is ahead.
--- End quote ---
I'm still waiting for you to admit that you were wrong when you said the DS was gonna "Flop"... when the fuckign thing STILL is selling like a motherfucker. Or what about the Gameboy Micro? Everybody alive would think that thing wouldn't sell, but it just opened up in Japan with 155,000 units sold the first week, more than the SP's 110 thousand it sold it's first week. Or what about Nintendogs? You're always saying Nintendo makes childish games, there's a childish game people are buying complete systems just to get.
FINALLY, to round this all out, about 2 months ago, the major three released their quarterly profit reports. Nintendo saw huge declines in profit and how many units it was selling and moving, but Microsoft and Sony did too.
Sony reported quarterly losses of 52.6 million dollars. LOST. in the quarter before that, Sony lost 532 million dollars. LOST.
Microsoft's game division reported quarterly losses of 179 million dollars. LOST.
Nintendo's profits in the slow quarter? 630 MILLION DOLLARS. Profit. Nintendo doesn't like Red.
You're talking about what an Idiot I am by saying the PS3 may slip to #3, Sony just announced thursday they're cutting 10 thousand jobs. I'm not the only one (including Sony) who doesn't see a rosy outlook for them.
So while Sony's firing 10 thousand people, and losing money the past two consecutive quarters, Nintendo's putting along earning 700 million dollars a quarter. And you're telling me I don't know what I'm talking about? Look the numbers up. What difference does it make how many systems and games sony and xbox are selling if they're LOSING MONEY?
X-Box has made a profit, one quarter. ONE QUARTER. Last December, they posted their first profits, ever, then immediately sat about losing money again.
Now I realize Microsoft and Sony can afford to lose money, but don't talk to me about how Crazy it is to say Sony might fall to Nintendo when all you have to do is look at the profit margins. Nintendo refuses to lose money, Sony and Xbox frequently do.
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