West Coast Connection Forum
DUBCC - Tha Connection => Outbound Connection => Topic started by: TraceOneInfinite Flat Earther 96' on September 18, 2012, 11:26:06 AM
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Don't believe the hype. I know Slaughterhouse are marketed as being "great lyricists" or a "supergroup". But are you trying to tell me that the members of D-12 don't have lyrics? Let's compare for a minute...
- Lyrics - I don't even know if it's totally their fault. The way the tracks were so over-produced with the melody's and emo-singing hooks, it made it hard for them to shine lyrically. Not to mention, I think Slaughterhouse is mostly just good at punchlines. I can see Eminem's vision was to turn them into artists that could make great songs and not just great punches, but it's not their style.
- Shock Value - Slaughterhouse attempts shock value on their album and fails. D-12 never fell short in the "shock value" category
- Character development - Bizzare developed a great character in D-12. Crazy fat mutherfucker who would say or do anything. They all had their alter-ego's. They repped Detroit, hard-core underground hip-hop, with a touch of hardcore, horrorcore type of shit. Their video's, promotion, artwork all matched their sound. Slaughterhouse on the other hand can't decide if they want to be grimey or if they want to be pretty boys. The best song on the album "Hammerdance" was a grimey cut, but they tried to make a pretty boy video to go with it. Seems they can't figure out what they want their image to be.
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I agree with about half of this post.
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uITb6p0l13Q yeah they made gems like this
shut up brian and go feed your kid
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haha, hell no.
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Personally, I would rather listen to a D12 album due to the fact that their debut was dope. Much more dope compared to Slaughterhouse's. Haven't listened to the 2nd SH album yet in fear that its going to be wack. If SH were rapping over the right production, then I would have to say that they are the better group.
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Personally, I would rather listen to a D12 album due to the fact that their debut was dope. Much more dope compared to Slaughterhouse's. Haven't listened to the 2nd SH album yet in fear that its going to be wack. If SH were rapping over the right production, then I would have to say that they are the better group.
the second SH album has some dope production...check out "Frathouse" "The Other Side" and "Die" specifically
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This is dumb. Outside of Proof, nobody else in D-12 comes close to Slaughterhouse.
The only thing that D-12 has on Slaughterhouse is that D-12 had Eminem on 80% of the songs. Eminem in his prime too.
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This is dumb. Outside of Proof, nobody else in D-12 comes close to Slaughterhouse.
The only thing that D-12 has on Slaughterhouse is that D-12 had Eminem on 80% of the songs. Eminem in his prime too.
So you disagree with my premise that Slaughterhouse doesn't have a consistent identity? I mean I don't get it. Are they emo or are the hood? Are they gonna hit you over the head with it or lull you to sleep with signing? Is the production going to be gutter or is it going to be a track originally produced for Skylar Grey?
Seriously, these dudes have an identity crisis. Crooked was stranded on Death Row, so that fact alone gives him street cred. Royce burned up the underground for a whole decade. Joel Ortiz is an underground sensation who never had fame or fortune. Why the fuck didn't these guys just make their shit grimey, gutter style. They should of came like Wu-Tangs first album and made it grimey, or hard-core, crazy, shock value like D-12's first album.
For real that "Hammer Dance" video should of looked like the "Westside Slaughterhouse" video Westside Connection did when they wanted to diss Common and Masta Ace. Yet, Slaughterhouse didn't have the balls to challenge anyone on their album. And the video for "hammerdance" was on some pretty boy shit, trying to market their music to white females.
This album doesn't reflect Slaughterhouse. It's clear this was a case of Eminem trying to turn these cats into song writers that make great songs not just great punchlines.. and the project failed.
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This is dumb. Outside of Proof, nobody else in D-12 comes close to Slaughterhouse.
The only thing that D-12 has on Slaughterhouse is that D-12 had Eminem on 80% of the songs. Eminem in his prime too.
So you disagree with my premise that Slaughterhouse doesn't have a consistent identity? I mean I don't get it. Are they emo or are the hood? Are they gonna hit you over the head with it or lull you to sleep with signing? Is the production going to be gutter or is it going to be a track originally produced for Skylar Grey?
Seriously, these dudes have an identity crisis. Crooked was stranded on Death Row, so that fact alone gives him street cred. Royce burned up the underground for a whole decade. Joel Ortiz is an underground sensation who never had fame or fortune. Why the fuck didn't these guys just make their shit grimey, gutter style. They should of came like Wu-Tangs first album and made it grimey, or hard-core, crazy, shock value like D-12's first album.
For real that "Hammer Dance" video should of looked like the "Westside Slaughterhouse" video Westside Connection did when they wanted to diss Common and Masta Ace. Yet, Slaughterhouse didn't have the balls to challenge anyone on their album. And the video for "hammerdance" was on some pretty boy shit, trying to market their music to white females.
This album doesn't reflect Slaughterhouse. It's clear this was a case of Eminem trying to turn these cats into song writers that make great songs not just great punchlines.. and the project failed.
first off there are some truths in this but overall it's aimed at the wrong people Brian
Slaughterhouse probably had very little control over the beat selection and the ending tracklist.
Slaughter DID get to sneak in a few hardcore songs like Die and Asylum but the two most hardcore songs they've released in 2012 are Sucka MC's and I See Dead People which were left on the mixtape for god knows what reason
the blame for all of this goes squarely on Eminem's shoulders and his so called illuminati friends at Interscope like Iovene....Slaughter just put their trust in Shady. and tell me one verse on this album where Crooked or Royce come across as emo rappers because I'd like to hear it. and don't say Rescue Me lol
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I mean, it's not really an identity crisis. Notice you said Skylar Grey was on the hook. That's your big point. What part of "Our House" or "Rescue Me" wasn't Slaughterhouse? The lyrics? The message? Stop looking at the fact Shady spiced it up to make it appealing to more audiences. To me it's just retarded that you'd view the song as amazing if you kept everything identical but replaced Skylar with Royce rapping the hook. Like it's just closed minded to me. Pac had bitches singing hooks. The difference is you didn't know them & it wasn't Madonna.
They had a girl on "Killaz" on the debut whose name I'll probably never care about knowing, but nobody said shit. But the exact same song with Rhianna as the girl would be a "problem". I just don't understand. Eminem had that girl who featured on "Superman" & shit & those are classics. But he does "I Love The Way You Lie" with a more poppish beat & a big time pop star, but lyrically is more on point than any other mainstream song you can name & it's "selling out".
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Cham you have to remember that Brian just discovered rakim a month ago hahaha
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to the fans:
http://www.hiphopdx.com/index/videos/id.11470/title.slaughterhouse--to-the-fans
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I agree...D12 had much better chemistry, and was just better as a group. They were an actual team, whereas Slaughterhouse is more like a collection of random talent making an album together. and yes, that shit is watered down for mainstream appeal...anyone who says otherwise is in denial. Sure, Eminem in his prime made songs with bitches singin' the hook, like "Superman", but those were still classics and true to his sound. they were NOT watered down, generic bullshit.. all his shit he put out in his prime had a signature Eminem sound. even the commercial shit... But like the post-Relapse Eminem, Slaughterhouse uses a borrowed sound to fit in with the current trends...check:
http://www.youtube.com/v/iB9nFiJChDo
Infinite is right, they shoulda came out 100% grimey, on some real, raw hip-hop shit, developing their own sound. Identity crisis? No...because they don't have an identity, as a group. They were thrown together, unlike D12, who grew up together and became a group on their own terms.
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SH make an album before eminem. so they're a group by themselfs.
d12?
Nobody cares about d12 before eminem became a superstar.
or the last decade after d12 wolrd. (just 8 years, not a decade)
any question?
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SH make an album before eminem. so they're a group by themselfs.
d12?
Nobody cares about d12 before eminem became a superstar.
or the last decade after d12 wolrd. (just 8 years, not a decade)
any question?
not really a question, but more of a statement...
i never said eminem made them a group, but they did become a group in hopes that they could blow as a supergroup, not because they grew up together and developed a chemistry as actual homies...as for D12, the point is not that nobody cared about them (even though they did have a strong following in Detroit), but rather that they had better chemistry and made better music as a group. "Devils Night" is a great album...much better than Slaughterhouse's albums. and i agree, D12 hasn't done shit lately....but were not talkin about now, we're talkin about Slaughterhouse now vs. D12 in their prime. D12 wins.
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devil's night just an average album.
average eminem album.
average debut album.
average group album.
average from-detroit album.
Nothin more.
sorry.
and d12 world is less than average.
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devil's night just an average album.
average eminem album.
average debut album.
average group album.
average from-detroit album.
Nothin more.
sorry.
and d12 world is less than average.
this
d12 world sucked
devils night had it's moments but overall was considered a huge disappointment. em should have just started a group of himself, Royce and Proof lol
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Joe Budden mixtape/album catalog >> d12
Only person that was cool n d12 was proof
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I agree with this thread to some degree. I mean maybe d-12 wouldnt have gone so big without EM being a member of the group but they made dope as fuck songs and the album(first one i never really heard the second one) it was definitely a great album it was just dope and so well produced and all the songs fit in together, the album had a good feel and just flowed.
But i was alot younger then cant say i've heard the album for a long time.
Guess they had Dre production also and yep EM in his prime.
Of course Slaughter better rappers individually but its fair to say they havent made an album as good as d-12.
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devil's night just an average album.
average eminem album.
average debut album.
average group album.
average from-detroit album.
Nothin more.
sorry.
and d12 world is less than average.
this
d12 world sucked
devils night had it's moments but overall was considered a huge disappointment. em should have just started a group of himself, Royce and Proof lol
huh? "devil's night" was dope as fuck...had some classic tracks, as well as some other bangers. no filler. duno what yall talkin bout.
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Joe Budden mixtape/album catalog >> d12
Only person that was cool n d12 was proof
i duno bout that...i think they all good at what they do. only proof? eminem and proof were the best, no doubt, but swift and kuniva had good flows too.. and kon artist is a really good producer. bizarre was good as far as adding character to the group, and had some great shock value in his rhymes.. real Detroit shit.
as for Budden, i always thought he was overrated
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Infinite has a point, SH have been trying to hard to cross over and their shit is watered down to the fullest. all the rappers did their thing and brought their A game. but their efforts were ruined by the label's attempt to market them. so it's an album with no real chemistry and identity, and it's a shame considering the potential they had. but that's one of the risks with supergroups though. a bunch of renowned rappers thrown together that can create dope songs here and there but when it comes to albums one of the main ingredients is lacking, identity. I still bought the album, just like I bought the first one when it came out.
now I don't know too much about D-12, never checked their shit, never checked Eminem's shit for that matter, it just never appealed to me. but I understand what Brian is trying to highlight with this comparison.
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Individually everyone in SH shits on D-12 (outside of Em in his prime of course) but I liked Devil's Night more than either SH album. Now, D-12 world was crap, but it's not like Welcome To Our House was a masterpiece either. You can make the case that they don't have much creative control, but that doesn't change the fact that the music isn't very good. On paper SH is a super group but they've been pretty disappointing, which sucks cause I was pumped when I heard talk of them forming.
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Individually everyone in SH shits on D-12 (outside of Em in his prime of course)
Proof > Ortiz, Budden
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can't understand why is this compare???
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lol
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lol
why, fan/stan won't change statement.
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lmao
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http://www.youtube.com/v/DlK1ughUIns
anyway they're being compared cause D-12 is Eminem's group and SH are on Shady and their album is overseen by Eminem, simple as that.
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http://www.youtube.com/v/DlK1ughUIns
anyway they're being compared cause D-12 is Eminem's group and SH are on Shady and their album is overseen by Eminem, simple as that.
i just watched ALL the videos in your sig
it was AWESOME!!
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Devills night got 10 bangers, album is dope for me, beter than both SH album's
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Devills night got 10 bangers, album is dope for me, beter than both SH album's
10 bangers?? do we have the same CD here? :eh:
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Individually everyone in SH shits on D-12 (outside of Em in his prime of course)
Proof > Ortiz, Budden
i never would have said this before Mood Muzik 4 came out...but Joe Budden > Proof
one thing Proof has on all of Slaughterhouse was he was an AMAZING live preformer but Proof in the studio didn't always equal amazingness for some reason. Sometimes his voice sounded weird on D12 songs and it was disappointing knowing he was far more talented than Kuniva or Kon Artis but yet he didn't always prove it like Em did on every d12 song.
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http://www.youtube.com/v/DlK1ughUIns
anyway they're being compared cause D-12 is Eminem's group and SH are on Shady and their album is overseen by Eminem, simple as that.
i just watched ALL the videos in your sig
it was AWESOME!!
glad you liked it (if you were being serious)
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I mean, it's not really an identity crisis. Notice you said Skylar Grey was on the hook. That's your big point. What part of "Our House" or "Rescue Me" wasn't Slaughterhouse? The lyrics? The message? Stop looking at the fact Shady spiced it up to make it appealing to more audiences. To me it's just retarded that you'd view the song as amazing if you kept everything identical but replaced Skylar with Royce rapping the hook. Like it's just closed minded to me. Pac had bitches singing hooks. The difference is you didn't know them & it wasn't Madonna.
They had a girl on "Killaz" on the debut whose name I'll probably never care about knowing, but nobody said shit. But the exact same song with Rhianna as the girl would be a "problem". I just don't understand. Eminem had that girl who featured on "Superman" & shit & those are classics. But he does "I Love The Way You Lie" with a more poppish beat & a big time pop star, but lyrically is more on point than any other mainstream song you can name & it's "selling out".
I have no problem with females on hooks in general...
Skylar Grey is not the problem. I like Skylar Grey, I actually thought "I Need A Doctor" was a classic. But Dre and Em both brought a lot to that track, conceptually and lyrically. "Rescue Me" was one of only three tracks I actually liked on the album. But "Rescue Me" was dope ONLY because of Skylar Grey. It wasn't really a collaborative effort. And like Sccit was saying, Slaughterhouse doesn't have good chemistry.
Skylar Grey usually pre-records those tracks. Just like there is an original Skylar Grey joint of "Love The Way You Lie". Those tracks get turned into the label and they pay Skylar Grey to use those songs. So they take a song that was originally hers and turn it into something else.
So while "Rescue Me" is a good song, it's not good because of Slaughterhouse. Slaughterhouse really added nothing significant to the track. Skylar Grey already had a great song before she even turned it over to them, and they failed to add anything worthwhile to the song. They didn't screw it up, but didn't add anything either.
...Also I just used Skylar Grey as a metaphor for the overall sound of the album. It's not a bad sound, but I fail to see any chemistry or synergy between the overall sound, production, melody of the album and the Slaughterhouse identity as hardcore underground emcee's.
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See now I have to call you out for just trolling. "Slaughterhouse added nothing to that song". Nigga please.
What did any member of D-12 add to any song that they made? Kuniva occasionally came through with a dope verse, but you listened to a D-12 song for Proof & Eminem.
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See now I have to call you out for just trolling. "Slaughterhouse added nothing to that song". Nigga please.
What did any member of D-12 add to any song that they made? Kuniva occasionally came through with a dope verse, but you listened to a D-12 song for Proof & Eminem.
he was trolling for that remark about INAD being "classic" too... GTFOHWTBS lol
Swifty McVey was dope too, and yes Kuniva as well
Proof's solo album was cool too, I still own it
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Oh yeah, complete joke.
Proof's album was actually a little disappointing to me. Only because I held him in such high regard.
But "Forgive Me" & "Kurt Kobain" are classics for me.
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See now I have to call you out for just trolling. "Slaughterhouse added nothing to that song". Nigga please.
What did any member of D-12 add to any song that they made? Kuniva occasionally came through with a dope verse, but you listened to a D-12 song for Proof & Eminem.
I can agree with that, but as a group I just thought they sounded better together than the SH guys. Again, I like the SH members as solo artists but I just feel like as a group they've been all hype without a whole lot to back it up.
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See now I have to call you out for just trolling. "Slaughterhouse added nothing to that song". Nigga please.
What did any member of D-12 add to any song that they made? Kuniva occasionally came through with a dope verse, but you listened to a D-12 song for Proof & Eminem.
I can agree with that, but as a group I just thought they sounded better together than the SH guys. Again, I like the SH members as solo artists but I just feel like as a group they've been all hype without a whole lot to back it up.
pretty simple concept, which stays goin over simple heads
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D-12 and Slumberhouse are both wack if you ask me.
But at least D-12 had a few stand outs in Em and Proof.
Slumberhouse is just 4 guys who were drowning in a sea of mediocrity and are using each other to keep a float.
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Slumberhouse is just 4 guys who were drowning in a sea of mediocrity and are using each other to keep a float.
:grumpy:
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See now I have to call you out for just trolling. "Slaughterhouse added nothing to that song". Nigga please.
What did any member of D-12 add to any song that they made? Kuniva occasionally came through with a dope verse, but you listened to a D-12 song for Proof & Eminem.
I can agree with that, but as a group I just thought they sounded better together than the SH guys. Again, I like the SH members as solo artists but I just feel like as a group they've been all hype without a whole lot to back it up.
I can accept that as your view. I don't see it as a ridiculous way to think. But I mean, take Eminem out of the equation & it isn't even close. Eminem kept a lot of those songs together because he came in & just tore shit down. We're talking about arguably the greatest rapper of all-time in his prime. That chain of command could play a role in how they sound over a record though. Like you knew what to expect. Slaughterhouse doesn't really have a standout. Doesn't really have a headliner or show stealer. Sometimes Joe kills it, sometimes Crooked owns it. Sometimes Royce owns it. I see Slaughterhouse for what they say outside of the production & sound around it because Hip Hop after all is an art form designed off what you say.
There aren't many D-12 songs I think off the top of my head that I can go back & bump that don't feature Eminem. "The Good Die Young" off "D-12 World". But then I honestly can't name you another one lol.
But this thread did get me in the mood to go back & bump song old D-12 joints.
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See now I have to call you out for just trolling. "Slaughterhouse added nothing to that song". Nigga please.
What did any member of D-12 add to any song that they made? Kuniva occasionally came through with a dope verse, but you listened to a D-12 song for Proof & Eminem.
I can agree with that, but as a group I just thought they sounded better together than the SH guys. Again, I like the SH members as solo artists but I just feel like as a group they've been all hype without a whole lot to back it up.
I can accept that as your view. I don't see it as a ridiculous way to think. But I mean, take Eminem out of the equation & it isn't even close. Eminem kept a lot of those songs together because he came in & just tore shit down. We're talking about arguably the greatest rapper of all-time in his prime. That chain of command could play a role in how they sound over a record though. Like you knew what to expect. Slaughterhouse doesn't really have a standout. Doesn't really have a headliner or show stealer. Sometimes Joe kills it, sometimes Crooked owns it. Sometimes Royce owns it. I see Slaughterhouse for what they say outside of the production & sound around it because Hip Hop after all is an art form designed off what you say.
There aren't many D-12 songs I think off the top of my head that I can go back & bump that don't feature Eminem. "The Good Die Young" off "D-12 World". But then I honestly can't name you another one lol.
But this thread did get me in the mood to go back & bump song old D-12 joints.
Yeah I don't disagree that Em carried the majority of the work, to me the music just came out better overall.
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http://www.youtube.com/v/DlK1ughUIns
anyway they're being compared cause D-12 is Eminem's group and SH are on Shady and their album is overseen by Eminem, simple as that.
i just watched ALL the videos in your sig
it was AWESOME!!
glad you liked it (if you were being serious)
of course i wasn't serious. you're the reason people turn off signatures. :p
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Devills night got 10 bangers, album is dope for me, beter than both SH album's
10 bangers?? do we have the same CD here? :eh:
Shit Can Happen,Pistol Pistol,Nasty Mind,American Psycho,That's How,Pimp Like Me,Blow My Buzz,Devil's Night,Revelation... shit this is mega dope cd 8) 8)
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Devills night got 10 bangers, album is dope for me, beter than both SH album's
10 bangers?? do we have the same CD here? :eh:
Shit Can Happen,Pistol Pistol,Nasty Mind,American Psycho,That's How,Pimp Like Me,Blow My Buzz,Devil's Night,Revelation... shit this is mega dope cd 8) 8)
i love american psycho and pistol pistol
deivils night, fight music and revelation are also dope but just not on the level of those others
besides those i can't say i ever cared for the rest of the CD :eh:
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http://www.youtube.com/v/DlK1ughUIns
anyway they're being compared cause D-12 is Eminem's group and SH are on Shady and their album is overseen by Eminem, simple as that.
i just watched ALL the videos in your sig
it was AWESOME!!
glad you liked it (if you were being serious)
of course i wasn't serious. you're the reason people turn off signatures. :p
lmfao
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Devills night got 10 bangers, album is dope for me, beter than both SH album's
10 bangers?? do we have the same CD here? :eh:
Shit Can Happen,Pistol Pistol,Nasty Mind,American Psycho,That's How,Pimp Like Me,Blow My Buzz,Devil's Night,Revelation... shit this is mega dope cd 8) 8)
i love american psycho and pistol pistol
deivils night, fight music and revelation are also dope but just not on the level of those others
besides those i can't say i ever cared for the rest of the CD :eh:
u dont like:
shit can happen
nasty mind
nutthin but music
thats how
instigator
pimp like me
blow my buzz
girls
shit on you (special edition)
these drugs (special edition)
damn
and "american psycho" is easily the best song on the album
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does Girls count as a D12 song?
i know it's on the CD but I always considered that an Eminem solo but yes I do love that song
those others? not really
and American Psycho is one of the best beats I've ever heard, did you guys ever hear Proof's remake of it?? Proof did a solo over it and does it justice
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does Girls count as a D12 song?
i know it's on the CD but I always considered that an Eminem solo but yes I do love that song
those others? not really
and American Psycho is one of the best beats I've ever heard, did you guys ever hear Proof's remake of it?? Proof did a solo over it and does it justice
Girls is not a D12 song, but it's part of the D12 album.....honestly, i'm surprised u dont think the album is good. give it another spin.
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Truth be told, D12 are very under-rated as emcee's/lyricists. And Slaughterhouse is very over-rated. I would put D12's lyrics up against Slaughterhouse any day of the week. I would even take the D12 World album over the Slaughterhouse album.
D12 World had some bangers. Like...
"6 In The Morning"
"Good Die Young" (which had no Eminem, btw... Just like the first album had two bangers that didn't include Eminem, "Instigator" and "That's How")
"How Come"
"American Psycho 2"
Also, I have another question for Cham and the other Slaughterhouse fans on here. What the hell was the point of the intro on the album? I really don't get what message they were trying to get across with that wack ass intro
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I'm a fan of both groups. To me, the most fair way to try to judge the two would be to compare their best material. It gets more complicated depending on what criteria you're using to judge them. If it's lyrics, I would say imo, for D12, their best stuff would be on "The Underground EP," for Slaughterhouse, their best stuff lyrically would probably be either their first album or those tracks that they released prior to their first album. From D12, I've always been a fan of Eminem, Proof, and Swifty McVeigh. That's not to say that Kon Artist and Kuniva didn't drop good verses too, but Em, Proof, and Swifty always seemed the most consistent to me. While Bizarre is often entertaining, I don't really consider him to be of the same caliber, lyrically.
On Slaughterhouse's early tracks, I think all four of them brought their A game lyrically. If you look at their first album, I think there were some really good tracks, lyrically, and probably a couple tracks were not so great. I really liked Budden's verses on early Slaughterhouse tracks like "Move On," but thought that some of his lyrics on the first album were pretty forgettable. On the other hand, I think much of Budden's solo material is fantastic, it just seemed that some of his verses on the first album didn't fit the group dynamic as well. I'm not really sure why it seems that way to me, as I liked a lot of his verses on the early Slaughterhouse tracks, and like his verses on the "Welcome to Our House" album as well. At any rate, lyrically, I would give the advantage to Slaughterhouse. I think if you compare both groups' best material, lyrically, Slaughterhouse would come out on top. But again, it's a pretty subjective argument, because everyone is going to have a different criteria for comparing them.
Perhaps if you compared them based completely on which groups' albums you prefer, D12 might get the advantage. That wouldn't be the case with me, but I could at least see an argument being made for some people liking the two D12 albums more than the two Slaughterhouse albums. Personally, I still prefer both Slaughterhouse albums, but I like both groups.
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Maybe Em executive produced a wack LP so D12 looks better?
Plus if the LP lived up to the talent in the group no one would buy it.