West Coast Connection Forum
Lifestyle => Train of Thought => Topic started by: LONDON!! on November 14, 2008, 06:03:20 AM
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its a new time, a new day, maybe a new dawn, maybe, its a critical time in human being history, it's the first time since JFK and RFK that most of the world feels a human being thats in control of the capitalist system can bring forth important changes to the world that will have lasting positive effects
i feel like yeah, Obama has a chance to finally lift this childish embargo on Cuba that America has had on the country since the 60's, it only hurts the people on the ground, everyone knows this, it ain't changing anything over there, it was first put in place there only because Castro stopped US imperialism there and nationalise Cuba's resources and nothing else, before Castro the US supported the brutal dictator Batista wit no problems, the embargo is cruel, i hope now people can be mature and lift these sanctions and move on, for real
this is taken from http://www.globalresearch.ca ...
Russia Urges Obama to Lift Cuba Embargo, Respect World Opinion
Global Research, November 12, 2008
Metro International - 2008-11-11
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Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov called on U.S. President-elect Barack Obama to rethink the U.S. economic embargo against Cuba, which has been in place for nearly half a century.
Lavrov said after talks in Moscow today with his Cuban counterpart Felipe Perez Roque that the ``overwhelming majority'' of countries, including Russia, opposed the U.S. trade embargo and had voted against it in the United Nations General Assembly.
The U.S. imposed a trade embargo against Cuba in 1962 to put pressure on its Communist government, which rose to power in a 1959 revolution led by Fidel Castro, who ceded power to his brother in February. In 2000, U.S. lawmakers eased the rules to allow the export of agricultural and medical goods to Cuba. Shipments increased 31 percent last year to $447 million.
The UN General Assembly on Oct. 29 voted for the 17th consecutive year in favor of a resolution that calls on the U.S. to lift the embargo. Three countries -- the U.S., Israel and Palau -- opposed the resolution, while 185 countries voted in favor and two, the Federated States of Micronesia and the Marshall Islands, abstained.
Obama has promised to review U.S. policy toward Cuba. While this is a U.S. decision, Russia hopes that Obama will take into account ``the voice of the international community,'' Lavrov said in comments broadcast on state television.
Russia is reviving its influence in Latin America, lost after the collapse of the Soviet Union, and challenging the U.S. in its backyard. It has developed friendly ties with Venezuela, a U.S. opponent, and is also rebuilding relations with its Soviet-era ally Cuba.
Russia may lend Cuba as much as $335 million to spend on Russian goods and services, RIA Novosti reported on Nov. 6. Cuba may use funds provided under the state loan to cover as much as 90 percent of a contract, with a 10 percent advance paid, the state-run news service said, citing a government order dated Nov. 1.
...on top of this issue discussed in this article, i hope Obama can finally start an authentic peace process in the middle east, i know people on here will think i'm asking for too much, but people have to understand, the biggest sticking point in the middle east is the palestine/israeli issue if that got dealt wit along wit the lebanese/Syrian/Israeli shebaa farns issue, it would take away a recruting tool for would be terrorist and squash the beef wit hezbollah/iran and syria and israel, there wouldn't be any excuses left to beef about, then you would really know whose the troublemaker that can't move on, true stories, if these legitimate issues were dealt wit you know
1.Palestinian brothers and sisters have to be given a state wit a shared capital jerusalem wit Israel, wit Palestinans controlling there Palestinan borders and the removal of settlements in the West Bank. These settlements wouldn't be tolerated anywhere in any peace loving country on this planet and thats real. The world has to respect the voting decision of the Palestinan public aswell because that is true democracy, even if outside people don't like it.
2.Israel's right to exist has to be respected wit no arguments
3.Israel has to give back the area's of Lebanon and Syria they are occupying in the shebaa farms regions
4.the closure of the disgraceful Guantanamo bay camp and the right to a fair trial on US soil for the prisoners in the camp
5.authentic negotiations wit Iran on the nuclear issue, because even the CIA on Bush's term said Iran stopped there nuclear weapons programme in 2003, everyone knows that the program is for civilian use, every country has a right to this
to resolve these issues will not be easy, but its the true show of authentic change in US foreign policy, that shows true strength of character to bring about a positive outcome of these issues. if you check it deeper now, these issues are not that complex to resolve wit perserverance
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Fuck Russia. They were one of the reasons why America and Cuba don't get along in the first place.
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....the Cold War ended 18 years ago.
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....the Cold War ended 18 years ago.
exactly
@low key
the reason why the US goverment is one of the only countrys on this planet to still support this childish, evil embargo on Cuba, is because Castro nationalise US imperialist interests and that reason only, before then the US supported Castro just like they supported the previous brutal dictator Batista, thats why Castro ran wit the Russians, true stories
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Russia and America still don't see eye to eye. Nuking the world would be a very bad idea so both countries are more diplomatic, but don't pretend everyone gets along now.
I can still buy up to 2 boxes of Cuban cigars legally by way companies outside of the US, and now both countries trade agricultural and medical necessities on a wide scale. Cuba isn't trying to aim missles at us anymore so I don't really care what happens with the embargo, I just think Russia needs to mind their own business.
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Russia and America still don't see eye to eye. Nuking the world would be a very bad idea so both countries are more diplomatic, but don't pretend everyone gets along now.
I can still buy up to 2 boxes of Cuban cigars legally by way companies outside of the US, and now both countries trade agricultural and medical necessities on a wide scale. Cuba isn't trying to aim missles at us anymore so I don't really care what happens with the embargo, I just think Russia needs to mind their own business.
i do care about that childish and evil embargo that only effects cuban brothers and sisters trying to survive and take care of there family's on the ground, the general population, no one else, i care deeply about that, an embargo put on them just because Castro stopped a handful of foreigners to stop stealing Cuba's resources
relations wit the US and Russia were very good after they squashed there cold war beef, Russia respected and looked up to US in a certain way certain times, things all changed when Bush came to power and saw this as a weakness(in his warmongering eyes, being peaceful is a weakness, yeah right) on Russia parts and started to surround Russia wit missle plans and capture all the resources surrounding Russia in central Asia, Georgia was the last straw for Russia and they put there foot down in face of Bush's intimidation and called his bluff
hopefully Obama can calm things down now and stop another cold war because i can't see a nuclear war popin off anytime soon, i can't see that happening at all, fingers crossed
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Russia and America still don't see eye to eye. Nuking the world would be a very bad idea so both countries are more diplomatic, but don't pretend everyone gets along now.
I can still buy up to 2 boxes of Cuban cigars legally by way companies outside of the US, and now both countries trade agricultural and medical necessities on a wide scale. Cuba isn't trying to aim missles at us anymore so I don't really care what happens with the embargo, I just think Russia needs to mind their own business.
i do care about that childish and evil embargo that only effects cuban brothers and sisters trying to survive and take care of there family's on the ground, the general population, no one else, i care deeply about that, an embargo put on them just because Castro stopped a handful of foreigners to stop stealing Cuba's resources
relations wit the US and Russia were very good after they squashed there cold war beef, Russia respected and looked up to US in a certain way certain times, things all changed when Bush came to power and saw this as a weakness(in his warmongering eyes, being peaceful is a weakness, yeah right) on Russia parts and started to surround Russia wit missle plans and capture all the resources surrounding Russia in central Asia, Georgia was the last straw for Russia and they put there foot down in face of Bush's intimidation and called his bluff
hopefully Obama can calm things down now and stop another cold war because i can't see a nuclear war popin off anytime soon, i can't see that happening at all, fingers crossed
Why are you trying to tell me about America when I live in the country and you don't?
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...because history has shown US citizens don't deserve the benefit of the doubt when it comes to unerstanding their own country within the context of the rest of the world.
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...because history has shown US citizens don't deserve the benefit of the doubt when it comes to unerstanding their own country within the context of the rest of the world.
That's a very sweeping generalization. Just because you have only seen what the media has shown you from the outside doesn't mean we all live with our heads up our asses.
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True, true, its a politically incorrect statement.
Why are you trying to tell me about America when I live in the country and you don't?
^
I just found that bizarre tho, when the terms 'USA' and 'Coca-cola' are probably the most widely recognised worldwide across all languages, when anything happens in the US (let alone what the US does outside the US) we all can't avoid hearing about it and being affected by it in some way how could people outside the country not be entitled to an opinion on the United States of America.
Whenever the USG does anything (contra-terrorist funding, destruction of democratically elected governments, supporting dictators who boil their opponents alive in vats of hot oil such as the Uzbekistan regime although an ally in the 'war on terror' so recieved $500 million in US grants in 2002) its not necessarily your fault you don't hear about it only until its totally unavoidable, its more the media's fault and the government for having a natural, understandable aversion to its own nasty shit like a hit and run driver. Theres so much the USG does and you would never know about it unless you were outside the US. I was just talking to some relatives in the Philippines who were telling me about the sites where the US used to have military bases in the 80s (huge swathes of land 100s of kilometres of ex-naval base land) where the bases used to be the land is now so toxic nothing grows and kids are born with deformities, but you will never hear these little testimonies in the local filipino media let alone the US media. So being inside the US will not provide you with the same perspective on the US as say the Uzbeki man in the boiling pot or the local filo kid living on the land that used to be US Fort Bonafacio.
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Did those same relatives tell about what the Japanese did there? Makes anything the USG could think of look nice in comparison. Just saying if you want to find bad in things you will. Find me anyone in the PI that thinks they would have been better off with out the USG.
Now that being said I know that you already know these things Rugged monk. You bring a lot of knowledge in your posts. I only bring that up because I tire of people who want perfection in all things. You may argue that the USG imposing its will on others in a bad thing and there have been many instances of the USG doing bad things, but I only ask you to imagine what if the USG did nothing..... thats a little different right?
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True, true, its a politically incorrect statement.
Why are you trying to tell me about America when I live in the country and you don't?
^
I just found that bizarre tho, when the terms 'USA' and 'Coca-cola' are probably the most widely recognised worldwide across all languages, when anything happens in the US (let alone what the US does outside the US) we all can't avoid hearing about it and being affected by it in some way how could people outside the country not be entitled to an opinion on the United States of America.
Please, I emplore you, as part of the international community, to express your opinion on American policy. I just asked a question as to why London is trying to give me an education on American history when I already know a good majority of it. In my experience outside of this website, there have been many citizens who don't live in America, yet constantly try to convey they know more than I do about my own country and how it should be run. Rather than arguing about who knows more about this or that, I think it would be far more beneficial to discuss how to fix the problem. We might not agree on every issue, but at least it's something other than bickering, which is something I detest.
Whenever the USG does anything (contra-terrorist funding, destruction of democratically elected governments, supporting dictators who boil their opponents alive in vats of hot oil such as the Uzbekistan regime although an ally in the 'war on terror' so recieved $500 million in US grants in 2002) its not necessarily your fault you don't hear about it only until its totally unavoidable, its more the media's fault and the government for having a natural, understandable aversion to its own nasty shit like a hit and run driver. Theres so much the USG does and you would never know about it unless you were outside the US. I was just talking to some relatives in the Philippines who were telling me about the sites where the US used to have military bases in the 80s (huge swathes of land 100s of kilometres of ex-naval base land) where the bases used to be the land is now so toxic nothing grows and kids are born with deformities, but you will never hear these little testimonies in the local filipino media let alone the US media. So being inside the US will not provide you with the same perspective on the US as say the Uzbeki man in the boiling pot or the local filo kid living on the land that used to be US Fort Bonafacio.
There are so many anti-government conspirators inside our country that those who regularly follow politics, such as myself, eventually hears or reads about what America is doing in other countries. As a counterpoint, there are also those who will use any excuse they can to whine and complain about any type of injustice, as frivolous as it may seem. We all know how horrible the fallout of war can be, even in ally countries like the Phillipines where we had bases. But the fact of the matter is, unless there is another form of political party or complete reform of current administrating bodies in America, no one will care, even Barak Obama. The war ended many decades ago, and neither republcans or democrats who have been in power since have addressed any of these issues. We, as a nation, are more caught up in how fucked up the government can be to it's own constituants than with the injustices they cause around the world. We should know and care about what is happening outside of our own country, but when the American government decides to do something, they go all out, causing major harm within our own society which needs to be addressed as well, so that is all the average American is informed about.
As far as the Uzbekistan situation goes, every country has been an ally at some point in time with other countries that do or has done dispicable things, even Australia and England. Every single superpower and/or first world nation has turned a blind eye to smaller countries who take part in that sort of stuff if it helps their cause. I'm certainly not advocating such misdeeds, but pointing fingers at America for things like that is hypocritical. The only solace I can give you is that the Iraq War has almost come to a close and no more blood money will be given.
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I can imagine many many instances in history (and i bet you probably can too) where it would of been better if the US did nothing at all....Its not that i want perfection in all things; its just we should hold high aspirations for what we can be.
"...I never rejected him inspite of all his imperfections...I'm a humanist. Maybe the last humanist."
-Satan, played by Al Pacino, the devil's advocate
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Russia and America still don't see eye to eye. Nuking the world would be a very bad idea so both countries are more diplomatic, but don't pretend everyone gets along now.
I can still buy up to 2 boxes of Cuban cigars legally by way companies outside of the US, and now both countries trade agricultural and medical necessities on a wide scale. Cuba isn't trying to aim missles at us anymore so I don't really care what happens with the embargo, I just think Russia needs to mind their own business.
i do care about that childish and evil embargo that only effects cuban brothers and sisters trying to survive and take care of there family's on the ground, the general population, no one else, i care deeply about that, an embargo put on them just because Castro stopped a handful of foreigners to stop stealing Cuba's resources
relations wit the US and Russia were very good after they squashed there cold war beef, Russia respected and looked up to US in a certain way certain times, things all changed when Bush came to power and saw this as a weakness(in his warmongering eyes, being peaceful is a weakness, yeah right) on Russia parts and started to surround Russia wit missle plans and capture all the resources surrounding Russia in central Asia, Georgia was the last straw for Russia and they put there foot down in face of Bush's intimidation and called his bluff
hopefully Obama can calm things down now and stop another cold war because i can't see a nuclear war popin off anytime soon, i can't see that happening at all, fingers crossed
Why are you trying to tell me about America when I live in the country and you don't?
i'll talk on that evil, childish embargo all day, everyday, thats standard
i'll break down how i see it is on this planet, from my viewpoint, all day, everday, because its a free world, its nuthin
lastly of all, i'm a international brother, my community is borderless, whoever sits in that white house, affects the world globally, my viewpoint is global in everything i do and in the way i roll, truss me on that
anyone can take that however you want to take it, its a free world, i couldn't give a shit, our always break down the truth how i see it, from my viewpoint and the way i see shit
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Russia and America still don't see eye to eye. Nuking the world would be a very bad idea so both countries are more diplomatic, but don't pretend everyone gets along now.
I can still buy up to 2 boxes of Cuban cigars legally by way companies outside of the US, and now both countries trade agricultural and medical necessities on a wide scale. Cuba isn't trying to aim missles at us anymore so I don't really care what happens with the embargo, I just think Russia needs to mind their own business.
i do care about that childish and evil embargo that only effects cuban brothers and sisters trying to survive and take care of there family's on the ground, the general population, no one else, i care deeply about that, an embargo put on them just because Castro stopped a handful of foreigners to stop stealing Cuba's resources
relations wit the US and Russia were very good after they squashed there cold war beef, Russia respected and looked up to US in a certain way certain times, things all changed when Bush came to power and saw this as a weakness(in his warmongering eyes, being peaceful is a weakness, yeah right) on Russia parts and started to surround Russia wit missle plans and capture all the resources surrounding Russia in central Asia, Georgia was the last straw for Russia and they put there foot down in face of Bush's intimidation and called his bluff
hopefully Obama can calm things down now and stop another cold war because i can't see a nuclear war popin off anytime soon, i can't see that happening at all, fingers crossed
Why are you trying to tell me about America when I live in the country and you don't?
i'll talk on that evil, childish embargo all day, everyday, thats standard
i'll break down how i see it is on this planet, from my viewpoint, all day, everday, because its a free world, its nuthin
lastly of all, i'm a international brother, my community is borderless, whoever sits in that white house, affects the world globally, my viewpoint is global in everything i do and in the way i roll, truss me on that
anyone can take that however you want to take it, its a free world, i couldn't give a shit, our always break down the truth how i see it, from my viewpoint and the way i see shit
As I expressed to Rugged Monk, your opinion wasn't what bothered me. You are perfectly entitled to your opinion, just as I am to mine. But what I don't need is a history lesson about a subject I already learned in school. Let's get past this BS and talk about solutions to the problem rather than just talking about the problem itself.
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Well 'fuck Russia' never seemed like a solution bruva! Haha, but it is good to discuss these things because it is truly building. Human beings are the custodians of the world, in all seriousness.
The solution would be to lift the embargo and for Cuba to hold democratic elections, Castro said Cuba will inevitablly have to become a democracy...
But democracy isn't really the issue, what Amerikkka can't accept is nationalised sectors of the Cuban economy maintained by a Cuban constitution. People find issue with anything nationalised because people have been conditioned into supporting a totally global economy. However, history has shown a country with no countrol over it's own resources has no control over it's own destiny.
Heres an interesting piece of photojournalism:
(http://i261.photobucket.com/albums/ii48/YGZ_2008/610x.jpg)
First prize in the Spot News Singles category of the 2007 World Press Photo contest by Nigerian photographer Akintunde Akinleye for Reuters, showing a man rinsing his face after a gas pipeline explosion in Lagos, Nigeria.
Nigeria is the world's 8th largest exporter of gas, yet it is one of the world's poorest. The oil industry is totally privatised. The man in that picture is washing his dome; after an armed gang had just hijacked a gas pipeline and syphoned off gas, locals moved in after the militia left to get some from the burst pipeline, however the shit exploded killing over 300 people....that picture shows some of the aftermath.
People in that country stay in poverty while foreign corporations steal the resources from the earth God gave them.
-Rugged Monk.
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exactly
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^I just read about that today in one of those things people leave on coffee tables...magazines.
Nigeria is dirt poor, the population lives in poverty while a small few live in filthy luxury.
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I said fuck Russia because I feel they should butt out of something that doesn't affect them. That is my opinion, and certainly while slightly boarish, it's still conducive to the discussion and moves it forward.
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Fuck Russia. They were one of the reasons why America and Cuba don't get along in the first place.
Capitalism is just as evil as communism. Fuck the US. All of you morons didn't learn after Sep.11, and look where the country is now. 2 wars, and a recession. All because not one person, learned a thing. America is evil, religion is evil, capitalism is evil, and every single person is evil for living shallow, pointless, material driven lives.
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Fuck Russia. They were one of the reasons why America and Cuba don't get along in the first place.
Capitalism is just as evil as communism. Fuck the US. All of you morons didn't learn after Sep.11, and look where the country is now. 2 wars, and a recession. All because not one person, learned a thing. America is evil, religion is evil, capitalism is evil, and every single person is evil for living shallow, pointless, material driven lives.
Then move the fuck out if you hate this country so much. When you find that utopia where people aren't mindless douche bags, the government isn't corrupt, and the economic system is simplisticly perfect, please let me know.
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Fuck Russia. They were one of the reasons why America and Cuba don't get along in the first place.
Capitalism is just as evil as communism. Fuck the US. All of you morons didn't learn after Sep.11, and look where the country is now. 2 wars, and a recession. All because not one person, learned a thing. America is evil, religion is evil, capitalism is evil, and every single person is evil for living shallow, pointless, material driven lives.
Then move the fuck out if you hate this country so much. When you find that utopia where people aren't mindless douche bags, the government isn't corrupt, and the economic system is simplisticly perfect, please let me know.
I'm lucky enough not to live in the shit hole you call America. And the only reason you are acting defensive is because you've been brainwashed since the day you've been born. The economic system isn't real. The recession isn't real. The only reason theirs a recession is because billionaires have lost "confidence" in the markets. The US economy is based on the emotions of billionaires. As first world countries go, America is beyond the worst. Religious nut balls running every system of government. And with religion, you get people with faith. And you can't trust someone with faith. If someone believes in God, what else could they possibly believe? Maybe they believe capitalism is the way to the American dream. Capitalism has two purposes. Keeping the rich richer, and keeping people like you, from getting rich. Yet you'll defend America to the day you die right? Move around a bit, meet some real human beings, take a trip to a country with some common sense.
If America had anything but 300 million blind fools, individuals would storm the mansions of these CEO's and behead them in the streets. That's what I want to see. That's what should happen. People killing the rich, for ruining people's lives. That's the true American way. Too bad everyone's too soft. It used to be people were accountable for their actions. America is the land of pussies for letting these rich people take advantage of you. Do you're part as a decent member of society, and kill a billionaire.
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america is the land of the free, the american dream. barack obama being elected is a historic moment and there is so many problems in the world for him to give really good speeches on. he's given the people hope again. america is not run by imperialistic jews and satanic occultists - you'd have to be some kind of tin foil hat conspiracy nut to believe that so many people could be manipulated on such a masisve scale.
YES WE CAN!
now pass me the tin foil and the blunt 8)
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I said fuck Russia because I feel they should butt out of something that doesn't affect them. That is my opinion, and certainly while slightly boarish, it's still conducive to the discussion and moves it forward.
you just ethered your own country...
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america is the land of the free, the american dream. barack obama being elected is a historic moment and there is so many problems in the world for him to give really good speeches on. he's given the people hope again. america is not run by imperialistic jews and satanic occultists - you'd have to be some kind of tin foil hat conspiracy nut to believe that so many people could be manipulated on such a masisve scale.
YES WE CAN!
now pass me the tin foil and the blunt 8)
yes good speeches is what we need...im with king on this one
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I said fuck Russia because I feel they should butt out of something that doesn't affect them. That is my opinion, and certainly while slightly boarish, it's still conducive to the discussion and moves it forward.
you just ethered your own country...
I don't see how when the embargo is between the US and Cuba. Sounds like it directly affects my country to me.
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I said fuck Russia because I feel they should butt out of something that doesn't affect them. That is my opinion, and certainly while slightly boarish, it's still conducive to the discussion and moves it forward.
you just ethered your own country...
I don't see how when the embargo is between the US and Cuba. Sounds like it directly affects my country to me.
that does though not half as much as it does cubans....but when has america EVER kept its nose out out of anything??
oh yeah when theres no resources to be plundered
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I said fuck Russia because I feel they should butt out of something that doesn't affect them. That is my opinion, and certainly while slightly boarish, it's still conducive to the discussion and moves it forward.
you just ethered your own country...
I don't see how when the embargo is between the US and Cuba. Sounds like it directly affects my country to me.
that does though not half as much as it does cubans....but when has america EVER kept its nose out out of anything??
oh yeah when theres no resources to be plundered
Every other country in the world still trades with Cuba. Besides, what is made in the US anymore that Cuba can't get from another country, probably for cheaper? It's not America who is keeping Cuba down, it's their own dictator who refuses to allow certain things amongst the Cuban public. I mean, cell phones were outlawed up until this year unless you worked for the government.