West Coast Connection Forum
DUBCC - Tha Connection => West Coast Classics => Topic started by: Crown on March 18, 2006, 06:07:02 PM
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NY claims that THEY invented EVERYTHING in Hip Hop culture but, DJing and Rapping started in Jamaica, Popping and Locking were the 1st forms of Hip Hop dancing (Los Angeles), and the 1st Grafiti Writer tagged Cornbread and he was from Philly. SO TECHNICALLY NEW YORK INNOVATED HIP HOP NOT INVENTED IT, AND EXCEPT FOR THE WORD ITSELF DIDNT MAKE SHITUP AT ALL. BLACK PEOPLE FROM ALL OVER WERE ALREADY DOING THIS SHIT BEFORE AFRICA BAMBATTA ORGANIZED IT INTO A CULTURE.
NOW ALL YOU KIDS WHO WANT TO ARGUE BE READY CUZ I HAVE ACURATE SOURCES FOR MY ARGUEMENTS. FUKK WIT ME AND GET SONNNNED!!!!!!!!!
Oh and for my West Coast Niggas
Locking and Popping (Electric Boogie)
Electric boogie is a style of popping (ticking). Both locking and popping or ticking originally came from Los Angeles. Popping was created by street dance crew ñElectric Boogaloo. Locking was created by ñThe Lockersî Both locking and popping existed a long time before breaking was born. During breaking era, b-boys started to put popping and locking into their dance. Mr. Wiggles says, since people in NY twisted popping and made it more funky and something different from original popping, they call it electric boogie instead of popping. (This comment about Electric Boogie is different from the following artilce, though. I am not sure which is ture.) Nowadays, so-called "Breakdance" consists of breaking, locking, and electric boogie or popping. The following article is about history of locking and Electric boogie from a book "BREAKING AND THE NEW YORK CITY BREAKERS" written by Michael Holman in early 80s. I also put an article from Doc Boogaloo who is a member of Electric Boogaloo. He sent this artilce to me. This is very good article. Please check this out.
History
It was the robots on TV shows in the early '60s like "Lost in Space" that inspired the black kids in Los Angels to invent the dance the Robot. I don't think mime was as great an influence, after all, how many live shows has Marcel Marceau done in Watts?
Obviously mime was inspirational in the development and perfecting of the Robot. The sense of animation and futurism is strong in most poor inner-city kids because it's an escape to a world where everything is perfect, sharp, and in control. The hydraulic movements of the robot danced to music which was becoming more and more mechanically rhythmic, like James Brown's "Goodfoot" (1969), was a natural development in Los Angeles, a city of major street dance creations.
In 1969, a young black man by the name of Don Campbell was becoming known among street dancers in Los Angeles for inventing a dance called the Campbellock (he put out a record called "Do the Campbellock"). Don Campbell took the hydraulic robotic movements, which were all about total control and mixed it with wild, out of control body movement dances of the tap-flash dance days plus exact stop and start movements and spiced it all with comic facial expressions and clown-like costumes to develop a whole new dance movement which is still going strong called "Locking" (Campbellocking to us old guys. I lived in L.A. when it first came out and was a pretty good Campbellocker myself.)
The best way to describe the movement of locking would be thus: You know those little-figured toys that are like inside-out puppets on small plastic circular platforms or pedestals, and if you press the bottom of the platform the figure collapses real fast, then when you let your finger up it goes back into shape? Well that's what locking looks like. The body moves out of control then back into control snapping into position, collapsing then snapping back.
By the Early '70s Don Campbell had put together a whole crew of lockers called "The Lockers." One of the lockers was Shabadoo, the star of "Breaking," and Penguin, who was the chubby locker named "Rerun" on the TV show "What's Happening." The lockers of the early '70s wore platform shoes, loud striped socks, pegged pants that stopped at the knees, bright colorful satin shirts with big collars, big colorful bow ties, gigantic Apple Boy hats, and white gloves.
Around that time a known TV choreographer named Toni Basil, who was famous for shows like "Shindig," and "Hullaballoo," discovered Don Campbell and his Lockers and helped bring them to international fame. She was an incredible dancer herself and soon learned to lock. She became a member of The Lockers, helped develop their dance act, and got them on TV shows like "Saturday Night Live" and commercials such as Schlitz Malt Liquor Beer (the one with the bull).
I remember seeing her and Don Campbell dance live at a nightclub called Crenshaw Flats in Los Angeles. I was blown away. She was actually better than he was!
Also around the time "Soul Train" hit the air (1972) and it became an instant media hit by featuring street dancers, especially The Lockers, of Los Angeles. The nightclub Crenshaw Flats the apartment on Crenshaw Boulevard in Los Angels was where the "Soul Train" gang hung out.
At the time breaking was developing in New York, locking the The Robot were getting popular in southern California. During 1972 and '73 in Fresno, California, a small city halfway between Los Angeles and Dan Francisco, a black family of all boys were inventing something new of their own. They called their dance the Electric Boogaloo. Pistol Pete (who also starred in the film "Breaking" and was involved with Toni Basil and The Lockers and "Soul Train" in the early days) and his brothers had created The Electric Boogaloo by combining locking. The Robot, and the more smooth and controlled movements of mime. Instead of throwing their bodies in and out of control like locking, or in total hydraulic control like The Robot, they passed energy through their bodies popping and snapping elbows, wrists, necks, hips and just about all the body joints along the way. Electric Boogaloo was more like mime in the sense that it pantomimed a live wire of electrical current, but it still needed the control of The Robot to give it style. The Electric Boogaloo became big in San Francisco even before it hit Los Angeles but when it did hit L.A., the TV capital of the world, it was introduced through "Soul Train" as the new dance form and challenged the popularity of locking. The Electric Boogaloo (or Electric Boogie as it's called now) has since spread to New York as breaking later hit Los Angeles. It's interesting to see breaking and locking existing in the same sub-cultures. I think it's partly because they complement each other as opposites. The Electric Boogie is in control and tends to imitate the movements of nature like a lightning bolt or a rippling river, whereas breaking is more out of control and anti-nature or anti-gravitational like a flying saucer. Another reason they're done together with the same kids may also be that they're both competitive dances where dancers battle each other to determine who's best. "If my breaker can't beat you, my boogie can." They live in the same competitive atmosphere.
Because of its competitive nature, I see Electric Boogie also becoming a competitive sport. This might seem odd because unlike breaking, it's hard to judge, but it will go the way of breaking because they have become inseparable in a cultural dance movement. It will evolve into a competitive thing.
Written by Michael Holman in early 80s.
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yea NY elitists think they're in the center of the hip hop world... shit's universal, not just one city.
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wow, some 1 has done their homework!! Props tho
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yeah props on the info. interesting read.
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Very intresting. I've got to re-read this.
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cool read.
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NY claims that THEY invented EVERYTHING in Hip Hop culture but, DJing and Rapping started in Jamaica
I know this part is definately true and i was lookin' at something on a channel i can't remember right now and they mentioend that as well. I'm on different message boards and anytime someone says some shit like you from St. Kitts (Da Caribbean) you shouldn't be talking about Hip Hop. I just point out how many rappers are actually from Da Caribbean.
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no one or one place invented hip hop. People say blacks in new york invented it. There is alot of evidence that latinos had alot to do wit it and then you hear that it never started in NY. ???
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i dont think anybody invented hip hop, it is something that was in the blood of black people since ever
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no one or one place invented hip hop. People say blacks in new york invented it. There is alot of evidence that latinos had alot to do wit it and then you hear that it never started in NY. ???
You are correct. I am only interested in the truth not race. There is no Hip Hop as we know it without Latinos. New York , L.A., Miami. The first 3 places where Hip Hop culture stuck has a significant Latino population. By the way I am Black.
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Guess what....It doesn't matter what region its from, what country, what race invented it. It's important to know history, but its origins shouldn't detract from the love of the music. I love any hip hop that reflects true artistic expression, whether its from the states, jamaica, europe, east, south, west, whatever.
Hip hop needs to get back to focusing on skills and not hype.
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The reason why it matters is bcuz of ppl scorning other regions for having a different style or claiming to be the "exclusive tastemakers" for the culture. If there was no hate it would not matter.
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The reason why it matters is bcuz of ppl scorning other regions for having a different style or claiming to be the "exclusive tastemakers" for the culture. If there was no hate it would not matter.
Well New York has come with some of the dopest hip hop ever. But so has the south and west, and so has other countries. If niggas in NY think they're the best because they allegedly invented it, then they're wrong. I can name you 10 songs from NY in recent years that is definitely enough to embarass the region that "invented" hip hop. They're as guilty as anybody for bastardizing the music.
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The reason why it matters is bcuz of ppl scorning other regions for having a different style or claiming to be the "exclusive tastemakers" for the culture. If there was no hate it would not matter.
Well New York has come with some of the dopest hip hop ever. But so has the south and west, and so has other countries. If niggas in NY think they're the best because they allegedly invented it, then they're wrong. I can name you 10 songs from NY in recent years that is definitely enough to embarass the region that "invented" hip hop. They're as guilty as anybody for bastardizing the music.
Im not dissing NY. Im only stating what is true.
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New York put the culture together. It was always out there, but it was New York that it finally became a culture, something that was whole and represented the poor people of New York. Old School Hip-Hop people will also tell you that Latinos had HUGE impact of Hip-Hop and how it came together in New York. Kool Herc was a Jamacian immigrant, and he was the father of the culture, as he brough something very Jamacian to New York, to complete what was already there from other regions. And I've talked to Hip-Hop professors, and they'll tell you how each region added something to the culture, the west was popping and locking along with mural art from Mexican gang culture. But it came together in New York.
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New York put the culture together. It was always out there, but it was New York that it finally became a culture, something that was whole and represented the poor people of New York. Old School Hip-Hop people will also tell you that Latinos had HUGE impact of Hip-Hop and how it came together in New York. Kool Herc was a Jamacian immigrant, and he was the father of the culture, as he brough something very Jamacian to New York, to complete what was already there from other regions. And I've talked to Hip-Hop professors, and they'll tell you how each region added something to the culture, the west was popping and locking along with mural art from Mexican gang culture. But it came together in New York.
That's basically what I would say. Even if hip-hop consists of elements that came from outside of New York originally, NY was where it became an actual culture in the first place.
As far as which region's the best, I dunno, but generally speaking, the East Coast has a far more diverse range of styles and has shown a better ability to adapt to the times, unlike the West (and unlike the South, as we'll probably see in a few years or so). And the West and South both have reputations for being more about style than substance.
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(http://www.thetearsofthings.net/archives/Statue-of-Liberty-3.jpg)
she got a mic, book of rhymes, a throwback jersey & an old school french durag. looks pretty hood 2 me ;)
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I think most people outside of NY would have no problem with givin NY credit for what they did with Hip Hop, even if they weren't the original inventors. I am sure that if you researched it even more, you'd probably find that the Jamaicans probably got the concept from slaves, and the slaves probably brought it from Africa with them, and it's probably a stlye of music or speech/poetry that resembles rap that was around a long ass time ago.
However...the fact that many NY people are so conceited about how "they started this hip hop shit" and the way that they think NY rap is ALWAYS better than anything else will make people find reasons to knock them and take credit away from them for any reason.
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New York put the culture together. It was always out there, but it was New York that it finally became a culture, something that was whole and represented the poor people of New York. Old School Hip-Hop people will also tell you that Latinos had HUGE impact of Hip-Hop and how it came together in New York. Kool Herc was a Jamacian immigrant, and he was the father of the culture, as he brough something very Jamacian to New York, to complete what was already there from other regions. And I've talked to Hip-Hop professors, and they'll tell you how each region added something to the culture, the west was popping and locking along with mural art from Mexican gang culture. But it came together in New York.
thank you mdogg, and mdogg is from cali
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popping (electric boogaloo style atleast, electric boogie is a name given to what cats in ny were doing which somewhat resemled this) and locking come before hip-hop and are not part of it, they are part of a seperate movements influenced by westcoast funk music and earlier mime performances as that extract states. they are funk styles that got grouped under the hip hop umbrella once people saw the dances or imitations of these dances next to eachother in the media when hip-hop first exploded.
locking has a clear cut history but popping due to the dozens of substyles and og's that stake a claim to it is still a highly contested debate. pm me if you want to learn more truth.
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I'll post my thoughts on that later... but from what i know it really started in NYC Afrika Baambataa and all that
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I'll post my thoughts on that later... but from what i know it really started in NYC Afrika Baambataa and all that
Afrika Baambataa organized things that black people was already doing in other places anyway and developed it into a cultural movement called Hip Hop, which is an incredible feat, but NY took styles that originated in other places.[/i][/u]
My point is that New York cannot dictate what is real and what is not real bcuz they got this from somewhere else JUST LIKE THE REST OF US!
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popping (electric boogaloo style atleast, electric boogie is a name given to what cats in ny were doing which somewhat resemled this) and locking come before hip-hop and are not part of it, they are part of a seperate movements influenced by westcoast funk music and earlier mime performances as that extract states. they are funk styles that got grouped under the hip hop umbrella once people saw the dances or imitations of these dances next to eachother in the media when hip-hop first exploded.
locking has a clear cut history but popping due to the dozens of substyles and og's that stake a claim to it is still a highly contested debate. pm me if you want to learn more truth.
I dont believe that ALL of those different styles out of the Bay was related to popping, plus the Robot was first and thats L.A. all the way, and from Roboting & Mime most of the other styles emerged.
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Guess what....It doesn't matter what region its from, what country, what race invented it. It's important to know history, but its origins shouldn't detract from the love of the music. I love any hip hop that reflects true artistic expression, whether its from the states, jamaica, europe, east, south, west, whatever.
Hip hop needs to get back to focusing on skills and not hype.
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I love reading about how hip hop emerged and the influences it had as far as how it began. I knew that many of the basic elements of hip hop culture came from Jamaica, as Kool Herc brought that influence to the hip hop culture. Also grafitti was done pretty much everywhere. Someone with more knowledge elaborate on how grafitti became an element of hip hop culture?
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I love reading about how hip hop emerged and the influences it had as far as how it began. I knew that many of the basic elements of hip hop culture came from Jamaica, as Kool Herc brought that influence to the hip hop culture. Also grafitti was done pretty much everywhere. Someone with more knowledge elaborate on how grafitti became an element of hip hop culture?
http://www.subwayoutlaws.com/History/History.htm[url
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thats was a good reading
It doesnt really matter if it's from NY or not but when the money comes into the picture to fullfill ur bank account this is diffirent shit & so far I always heard NY was the ''source'' at least for the graffitis but i guess its wrong.
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Crown, nice pasted article although i dont hink it supports your arguement even if i do agree with you
lmao dullard
your article aint bout hiphop as a music but as a culture ? and if thats that then why not take it back to the church with the preachers call outs and the "crowds" response...or even further back to the days of slavery when ways to "sing" and talk bout life was life...surely thats what the essence telling the story thru music or representin
and bout hiphop almost as we see it today what about the watts prophets...
...before you diss and tar everyone with the same brush...maybe you better use that brush to sweep your own preconcieved conceptions about other peoples knowledge away
;D
peace tho nicca you arguement is weak but your point behind it is true
but this arguement can go on for time and time
* because it depends on what your own true representation of hiphop is...if u talking mixin / djing the kool herc et al were the first cutting it up in a style the jamaicans hadnt by using new techniques ...
...ya get me bro ? ;)
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Every music fan knows hip-hop and its elements started in the BRONX, NY in the 70s.
Enough said
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Every music fan knows hip-hop and its elements started in the BRONX, NY in the 70s.
Enough said
chuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuurch
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Crown, nice pasted article although i dont hink it supports your arguement even if i do agree with you
lmao dullard
your article aint bout hiphop as a music but as a culture ? and if thats that then why not take it back to the church with the preachers call outs and the "crowds" response...or even further back to the days of slavery when ways to "sing" and talk bout life was life...surely thats what the essence telling the story thru music or representin
and bout hiphop almost as we see it today what about the watts prophets...
...before you diss and tar everyone with the same brush...maybe you better use that brush to sweep your own preconcieved conceptions about other peoples knowledge away
;D
peace tho nicca you arguement is weak but your point behind it is true
but this arguement can go on for time and time
* because it depends on what your own true representation of hiphop is...if u talking mixin / djing the kool herc et al were the first cutting it up in a style the jamaicans hadnt by using new techniques ...
...ya get me bro ? ;)
If you want to get technical about it, we can trace Hip Hop all the way back to Africa. Hip Hop style music from the 70s comes directly to New York from a Jamaican immigrant called KOOL HERC, his style was based off of the Soundsystem Dancehall DJs in his hometown of Kingston. He just used James Brown and Funk record breaks instead of Reaggae records. They also chant or toast in dancehall music and KOOL HERC along with COKE LAROCK began rapping.
Muhammad Ali, born Cassius Clay in 1942 in Louisville, Ky., won a gold medal in the 1960 Olympics and then turned professional. In one of the most famous boxing matches of the century, Clay in 1965 stunned the world by beating apparently invincible, world heavyweight champion Sonny Liston in six rounds. Before the match, a supremely confident Clay, spun out one of his to be famous rhymes: “Sonny Liston is great, but he'll fall in eight.” After defeating Liston, Clay announced his conversion to Islam and changed his name to Muhammad Ali.
Clay would also go on to say the famous "Float like a butterfly, sting like a bee" rhymes, that also helped influence what is now called RAP.
Clay comes out to meet Liston
And Liston starts to retreat
If Liston goes back any further
He'll end up in a ringside seat.
Clay swings with a left,
Clay swings with a right,
Look at young Cassius
Carry the fight.
Liston keeps backing
But there's not enough room
It's a matter of time.
There, Clay lowers the boom.
Now Clay swings with a right,
What a beautiful swing,
And the punch raises the bear,
Clear out of the ring.
Liston is still rising
And the ref wears a frown,
For he can't start counting,
Till Sonny comes down.
Now Liston disappears from view.
The crowd is getting frantic,
But our radar stations have picked him up
He's somewhere over the Atlantic.
Who would have thought
When they came to the fight
That they'd witness the launching
Of a human satellite?
Yes, the crowd did not dream
When they laid down their money
That they would see
A total eclipse of the Sonny!
I am the greatest!
Throughout history here in America there has always been some form of verbal acrobatics or jousting involving rhymes within the Afro-American community. Signifying, testifying, Shining of the Titanic, the Dozens, school yard rhymes, prison 'jail house' rhymes and double Dutch jump rope' rhymes are some of the names and ways that various forms of rap have manifested.
The first Rap song I ever heard was Mr. Cool by Issac Hayes,Parliament Funkadelic used to also put little funky rhymes in their songs. Toasting is a tradition that has existed in black america for many years in the South, in Jail, and Pimps (example.Dolemite). I THINK THAT YOU ARE MISSING MY POINT.
I DID NOT SAY THAT NEW YORK DIDNT INNOVATE HIP HOP. I AM SAYING THAT RAP, DJ, GRAF, STREET DANCE, ALREADY EXISTED B4 NEW YORK IN THE 1970S!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
UNDERSTAND!!!!!!! CREATE AND INNOVATE ARE 2 DIFFERENT THINGS!
ALSO UNDERSTAND THAT THE WHOLE CULTURE OF HIP HOP IS BASED OFF OF TAKING SOMETHING THAT ALREADY EXIST AND FLIPPING IT. SO IF L.A. OR THE SOUTH OR ANY BODY ELSE DOES IT DIFERENTLY. NEW YORK DOES NOT HAVE THE RIGHT TO JUDGE IT ON THEIR STANDARDS, BECAUSE IT EXISTED B4 KOOL HERC TOUCHED NEW YORK.
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thats was a good reading
It doesnt really matter if it's from NY or not but when the money comes into the picture to fullfill ur bank account this is diffirent shit & so far I always heard NY was the ''source'' at least for the graffitis but i guess its wrong.
I agree cuz mis-information can cause ppl to not wanna fuck with you cuz you aint "the real", but who is the real? This shit belongs to ALL OF US!
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Crown, nice pasted article although i dont hink it supports your arguement even if i do agree with you
lmao dullard
your article aint bout hiphop as a music but as a culture ? and if thats that then why not take it back to the church with the preachers call outs and the "crowds" response...or even further back to the days of slavery when ways to "sing" and talk bout life was life...surely thats what the essence telling the story thru music or representin
and bout hiphop almost as we see it today what about the watts prophets...
...before you diss and tar everyone with the same brush...maybe you better use that brush to sweep your own preconcieved conceptions about other peoples knowledge away
;D
peace tho nicca you arguement is weak but your point behind it is true
but this arguement can go on for time and time
* because it depends on what your own true representation of hiphop is...if u talking mixin / djing the kool herc et al were the first cutting it up in a style the jamaicans hadnt by using new techniques ...
...ya get me bro ? ;)
If you want to get technical about it, we can trace Hip Hop all the way back to Africa. Hip Hop style music from the 70s comes directly to New York from a Jamaican immigrant called KOOL HERC, his style was based off of the Soundsystem Dancehall DJs in his hometown of Kingston. He just used James Brown and Funk record breaks instead of Reaggae records. They also chant or toast in dancehall music and KOOL HERC along with COKE LAROCK began rapping.
Muhammad Ali, born Cassius Clay in 1942 in Louisville, Ky., won a gold medal in the 1960 Olympics and then turned professional. In one of the most famous boxing matches of the century, Clay in 1965 stunned the world by beating apparently invincible, world heavyweight champion Sonny Liston in six rounds. Before the match, a supremely confident Clay, spun out one of his to be famous rhymes: “Sonny Liston is great, but he'll fall in eight.” After defeating Liston, Clay announced his conversion to Islam and changed his name to Muhammad Ali.
Clay would also go on to say the famous "Float like a butterfly, sting like a bee" rhymes, that also helped influence what is now called RAP.
Clay comes out to meet Liston
And Liston starts to retreat
If Liston goes back any further
He'll end up in a ringside seat.
Clay swings with a left,
Clay swings with a right,
Look at young Cassius
Carry the fight.
Liston keeps backing
But there's not enough room
It's a matter of time.
There, Clay lowers the boom.
Now Clay swings with a right,
What a beautiful swing,
And the punch raises the bear,
Clear out of the ring.
Liston is still rising
And the ref wears a frown,
For he can't start counting,
Till Sonny comes down.
Now Liston disappears from view.
The crowd is getting frantic,
But our radar stations have picked him up
He's somewhere over the Atlantic.
Who would have thought
When they came to the fight
That they'd witness the launching
Of a human satellite?
Yes, the crowd did not dream
When they laid down their money
That they would see
A total eclipse of the Sonny!
I am the greatest!
Throughout history here in America there has always been some form of verbal acrobatics or jousting involving rhymes within the Afro-American community. Signifying, testifying, Shining of the Titanic, the Dozens, school yard rhymes, prison 'jail house' rhymes and double Dutch jump rope' rhymes are some of the names and ways that various forms of rap have manifested.
The first Rap song I ever heard was Mr. Cool by Issac Hayes,Parliament Funkadelic used to also put little funky rhymes in their songs. Toasting is a tradition that has existed in black america for many years in the South, in Jail, and Pimps (example.Dolemite). I THINK THAT YOU ARE MISSING MY POINT.
I DID NOT SAY THAT NEW YORK DIDNT INNOVATE HIP HOP. I AM SAYING THAT RAP, DJ, GRAF, STREET DANCE, ALREADY EXISTED B4 NEW YORK IN THE 1970S!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
UNDERSTAND!!!!!!! CREATE AND INNOVATE ARE 2 DIFFERENT THINGS!
ALSO UNDERSTAND THAT THE WHOLE CULTURE OF HIP HOP IS BASED OFF OF TAKING SOMETHING THAT ALREADY EXIST AND FLIPPING IT. SO IF L.A. OR THE SOUTH OR ANY BODY ELSE DOES IT DIFERENTLY. NEW YORK DOES NOT HAVE THE RIGHT TO JUDGE IT ON THEIR STANDARDS, BECAUSE IT EXISTED B4 KOOL HERC TOUCHED NEW YORK.
And again you just re-iterate what ive said ::)
lmfao we aint arguing i just picked on what u initially said bout NY DID NOT INVENT HIP_HOP...then pasting an article on a differing area to the whole genre
;D
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Crown, nice pasted article although i dont hink it supports your arguement even if i do agree with you
lmao dullard
your article aint bout hiphop as a music but as a culture ? and if thats that then why not take it back to the church with the preachers call outs and the "crowds" response...or even further back to the days of slavery when ways to "sing" and talk bout life was life...surely thats what the essence telling the story thru music or representin
and bout hiphop almost as we see it today what about the watts prophets...
...before you diss and tar everyone with the same brush...maybe you better use that brush to sweep your own preconcieved conceptions about other peoples knowledge away
;D
peace tho nicca you arguement is weak but your point behind it is true
but this arguement can go on for time and time
* because it depends on what your own true representation of hiphop is...if u talking mixin / djing the kool herc et al were the first cutting it up in a style the jamaicans hadnt by using new techniques ...
...ya get me bro ? ;)
If you want to get technical about it, we can trace Hip Hop all the way back to Africa. Hip Hop style music from the 70s comes directly to New York from a Jamaican immigrant called KOOL HERC, his style was based off of the Soundsystem Dancehall DJs in his hometown of Kingston. He just used James Brown and Funk record breaks instead of Reaggae records. They also chant or toast in dancehall music and KOOL HERC along with COKE LAROCK began rapping.
Muhammad Ali, born Cassius Clay in 1942 in Louisville, Ky., won a gold medal in the 1960 Olympics and then turned professional. In one of the most famous boxing matches of the century, Clay in 1965 stunned the world by beating apparently invincible, world heavyweight champion Sonny Liston in six rounds. Before the match, a supremely confident Clay, spun out one of his to be famous rhymes: “Sonny Liston is great, but he'll fall in eight.” After defeating Liston, Clay announced his conversion to Islam and changed his name to Muhammad Ali.
Clay would also go on to say the famous "Float like a butterfly, sting like a bee" rhymes, that also helped influence what is now called RAP.
Clay comes out to meet Liston
And Liston starts to retreat
If Liston goes back any further
He'll end up in a ringside seat.
Clay swings with a left,
Clay swings with a right,
Look at young Cassius
Carry the fight.
Liston keeps backing
But there's not enough room
It's a matter of time.
There, Clay lowers the boom.
Now Clay swings with a right,
What a beautiful swing,
And the punch raises the bear,
Clear out of the ring.
Liston is still rising
And the ref wears a frown,
For he can't start counting,
Till Sonny comes down.
Now Liston disappears from view.
The crowd is getting frantic,
But our radar stations have picked him up
He's somewhere over the Atlantic.
Who would have thought
When they came to the fight
That they'd witness the launching
Of a human satellite?
Yes, the crowd did not dream
When they laid down their money
That they would see
A total eclipse of the Sonny!
I am the greatest!
Throughout history here in America there has always been some form of verbal acrobatics or jousting involving rhymes within the Afro-American community. Signifying, testifying, Shining of the Titanic, the Dozens, school yard rhymes, prison 'jail house' rhymes and double Dutch jump rope' rhymes are some of the names and ways that various forms of rap have manifested.
The first Rap song I ever heard was Mr. Cool by Issac Hayes,Parliament Funkadelic used to also put little funky rhymes in their songs. Toasting is a tradition that has existed in black america for many years in the South, in Jail, and Pimps (example.Dolemite). I THINK THAT YOU ARE MISSING MY POINT.
I DID NOT SAY THAT NEW YORK DIDNT INNOVATE HIP HOP. I AM SAYING THAT RAP, DJ, GRAF, STREET DANCE, ALREADY EXISTED B4 NEW YORK IN THE 1970S!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
UNDERSTAND!!!!!!! CREATE AND INNOVATE ARE 2 DIFFERENT THINGS!
ALSO UNDERSTAND THAT THE WHOLE CULTURE OF HIP HOP IS BASED OFF OF TAKING SOMETHING THAT ALREADY EXIST AND FLIPPING IT. SO IF L.A. OR THE SOUTH OR ANY BODY ELSE DOES IT DIFERENTLY. NEW YORK DOES NOT HAVE THE RIGHT TO JUDGE IT ON THEIR STANDARDS, BECAUSE IT EXISTED B4 KOOL HERC TOUCHED NEW YORK.
And again you just re-iterate what ive said ::)
lmfao we aint arguing i just picked on what u initially said bout NY DID NOT INVENT HIP_HOP...then pasting an article on a differing area to the whole genre
;D
O.K. No Prob. ;)