West Coast Connection Forum
Lifestyle => Train of Thought => Topic started by: J Bananas on April 18, 2006, 12:44:42 PM
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i mean, since youre all so preachy about being muslim 24/7...
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lol what a stupid fucking topic
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dont hate mexican, I'm just trying to rival the amount of other bs i see around here, its all in good fun
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I'm an American.
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i mean, since youre all so preachy about being muslim 24/7...
First of all, I don't know if what you are describing constitutes suicide. The Qu'ran condemns suicide, in the sense that one selfishly takes their own life because they are dissatisfied with what Allah has given them. Many scholars believe that sacrificing one's own life in battle, in defense of oppressed people is not suicide but rather that it is martyrdom.
The Noble Qu'ran explains the Islamic perspective that if you die for the sake of Allah in resistance against oppression, then your sins are forgiven and you attain paradise.
2:154 Do not say of those who are killed in the cause of GOD, "They are dead." They are alive at their Lord, but you do not perceive.
...So you see, a Muslim lives and dies in submission to Allah.
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I think Infinite explained it best when he said...
If you gathered up the whole world to do harm to somebody you could only afflict them with something Allah had already perscribed for them...
So it dosen't matter if you harm someone becuase that's what Allah wants. Otherwise he wouldn't let you.
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So it dosen't matter if you harm someone becuase that's what Allah wants. Otherwise he wouldn't let you.
No, it does matter, a Muslim can not be the aggressor. A Muslim's only beef is with the oppressor.
2:159 You may fight in the cause of GOD against those who attack you, but do not aggress. GOD does not love the aggressors.
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2:159 You may fight in the cause of GOD against those who attack you, but do not aggress. GOD does not love the aggressors.
If you gathered up the whole world to do harm to somebody you could only afflict them with something Allah had already perscribed for them...
If you can only do harm to someone prescribed by Allah and Allah dosen't love aggresors then you're saying EVERY person who has ever recieved harm is an aggresor. Therefore I can come to your house and beat the living shit out of you. Allah prescribed the harm onto you; that's the only way I could of harm you.
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i mean, since youre all so preachy about being muslim 24/7...
First of all, I don't know if what you are describing constitutes suicide. The Qu'ran condemns suicide, in the sense that one selfishly takes their own life because they are dissatisfied with what Allah has given them. Many scholars believe that sacrificing one's own life in battle, in defense of oppressed people is not suicide but rather that it is martyrdom.
The Noble Qu'ran explains the Islamic perspective that if you die for the sake of Allah in resistance against oppression, then your sins are forgiven and you attain paradise.
2:154 Do not say of those who are killed in the cause of GOD, "They are dead." They are alive at their Lord, but you do not perceive.
...So you see, a Muslim lives and dies in submission to Allah.
i love this guy
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dont hate mexican, I'm just trying to rival the amount of other bs i see around here, its all in good fun
why are u getting affected by it, u feeling the urges to convert to islam but u scared or wat
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If you can only do harm to someone prescribed by Allah and Allah dosen't love aggressors then you're saying EVERY person who has ever recieved harm is an aggressor.
cute, but not quite. the qu'ran does not suggest that god only allows ill to fall on those he does not love or is angry with; the qu'ran states clearly that life is a test. muslims & mumins like all else must be subjected to such tests in life, especially in order to demonstrate their faith. if muslims had it easy than everyone would be a muslim and this would circumvent the purpose of life, which is a test. suffering is a part of life, and should be accepted as such and not deplored.
now, god would not allow a person to be seriously injured or killed if god had a specific purpose for that person at some later date. and without question god does not love aggressors; but they too serve a purpose.
Therefore I can come to your house and beat the living shit out of you. Allah prescribed the harm onto you; that's the only way I could of harm you.
you could try that, and if you succeeded then god allowed it; and if you fail, for whatever reason, then god prevented it. either way you would be the aggressor, why would you give god a reason to deny you love?
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2:154 Do not say of those who are killed in the cause of GOD, "They are dead." They are alive at their Lord, but you do not perceive.
...So you see, a Muslim lives and dies in submission to Allah.
You wanna rephrase that sentence. ;)
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Therefore I can come to your house and beat the living shit out of you. Allah prescribed the harm onto you; that's the only way I could of harm you.
you could try that, and if you succeeded then god allowed it; and if you fail, for whatever reason, then god prevented it. either way you would be the aggressor, why would you give god a reason to deny you love?
But Allah (or God, since we seem to be using them almost interchangably) prescribed this harm on to the person I beat up (in this hypothetical case, Infinte). So how can I be the aggersor (or how can I be the only aggresor invloved if Allah/God prescribed it).
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Therefore I can come to your house and beat the living shit out of you. Allah prescribed the harm onto you; that's the only way I could of harm you.
you could try that, and if you succeeded then god allowed it; and if you fail, for whatever reason, then god prevented it. either way you would be the aggressor, why would you give god a reason to deny you love?
But Allah (or God, since we seem to be using them almost interchangably) prescribed this harm on to the person I beat up (in this hypothetical case, Infinte). So how can I be the aggersor (or how can I be the only aggresor invloved if Allah/God prescribed it).
all u second grade kids. just imagine that u had ur life once before this time ,allah had it videotaped , knows what happens and can edit it if he wants. and know we are living the editing
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But Allah (or God, since we seem to be using them almost interchangably)
they are interchangeable.
But Allah prescribed this harm on to the person I beat up (in this hypothetical case, Infinte). So how can I be the aggersor (or how can I be the only aggresor invloved if Allah/God prescribed it).
you chose to be the aggressor. god allows and directs your aggression. do you play chess? it's like a chess board. you define your rank, god makes the moves. if you choose to be an aggressor; god will use you when aggression is needed. if you choose not to be the aggressor, god will use another of his pawns.
the choice is yours to define (and redefine) your role in life...
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But Allah (or God, since we seem to be using them almost interchangably)
they are interchangeable.
I agree. But some people are senstive about it being used that way.
But Allah prescribed this harm on to the person I beat up (in this hypothetical case, Infinte). So how can I be the aggersor (or how can I be the only aggresor invloved if Allah/God prescribed it).
you chose to be the aggressor. god allows and directs your aggression. do you play chess? it's like a chess board. you define your rank, god makes the moves. if you choose to be an aggressor; god will use you when aggression is needed. if you choose not to be the aggressor, god will use another of his pawns.
the choice is yours to define (and redefine) your role in life...
That makes more sence then what Inifite was saing. He used the word perscribed
pre·scribe Pronunciation (pr-skrb)
v. pre·scribed, pre·scrib·ing, pre·scribes
v. tr.
1. To set down as a rule or guide; enjoin. See Synonyms at dictate.
2. To order the use of (a medicine or other treatment).
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That makes more sence then what Inifite was saing. He used the word prescribed
pre·scribe Pronunciation (pr-skrb)
v. pre·scribed, pre·scrib·ing, pre·scribes
v. tr.
1. To set down as a rule or guide; enjoin. See Synonyms at dictate.
2. To order the use of (a medicine or other treatment).
this is a similar issue to the discussion in the easter thread. will you argue the semantics of his choice of vocabulary and ignore the gist of what he is saying?
the second definition of prescribe is actually the definition infinite was using. he said "allah prescribed for them"; thus "a prescription for the victim", and not "a rule/command for the aggressor"; as you interpretted it in your original refutation. you misinterpretted his usage.
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That makes more sence then what Inifite was saing. He used the word prescribed
pre·scribe Pronunciation (pr-skrb)
v. pre·scribed, pre·scrib·ing, pre·scribes
v. tr.
1. To set down as a rule or guide; enjoin. See Synonyms at dictate.
2. To order the use of (a medicine or other treatment).
this is a similar issue to the discussion in the easter thread. will you argue the semantics of his choice of vocabulary and ignore the gist of what he is saying?
the second definition of prescribe is actually the definition infinite was using. he said "allah prescribed for them"; thus "a prescription for the victim", and not "a rule/command for the aggressor"; as you interpretted it in your original refutation. you misinterpretted his usage.
I would have been ignoring the gist of what he was saying if I was argueing about how America dosen't not = livng a lie. (I thought he already discussed this) But I wanted to address this because Infitie ignored my responce to his "Allah perscribing harm" statement in it's original post. The thread was about "Afgan May Get Death Sentance for Converting To Christianity" and Infinite posts what he did. And I seriously needed some clerification from him (check my response in the same thread), because to me it just seemed like he was accepting this man's death because it was Allah's will. But he just left it at that. But I still beilive that your explination (which I agree with) is a lot better then his (none).
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i mean, since youre all so preachy about being muslim 24/7...
First of all, I don't know if what you are describing constitutes suicide. The Qu'ran condemns suicide, in the sense that one selfishly takes their own life because they are dissatisfied with what Allah has given them. Many scholars believe that sacrificing one's own life in battle, in defense of oppressed people is not suicide but rather that it is martyrdom.
The Noble Qu'ran explains the Islamic perspective that if you die for the sake of Allah in resistance against oppression, then your sins are forgiven and you attain paradise.
2:154 Do not say of those who are killed in the cause of GOD, "They are dead." They are alive at their Lord, but you do not perceive.
...So you see, a Muslim lives and dies in submission to Allah.
this is the no.1 main problem with islam... crazy terrorists have nothing to live for, so they think if they blow themselves up, they are guaranteed paradise... works beautiful for terrorist leaders, they have an unlimitied supply of walking bombs.
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this is the no.1 main problem with islam... crazy terrorists have nothing to live for, so they think if they blow themselves up, they are guaranteed paradise... works beautiful for terrorist leaders, they have an unlimitied supply of walking bombs.
naw...youre off....
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^ enlighten me oh great one.