West Coast Connection Forum
Lifestyle => Sports & Entertainment => Topic started by: WC Iz Active on December 06, 2006, 01:37:48 AM
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Is having another great year, over 20ppg and over 10apg, I cant even hate, Nash is amazing.
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20 assists last night, that's plain crazy yet not even a shocker if you know who it is. that nigga is nuts.
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i hate the dude but those are mvp numbers... ::damn it, fucking nash!::
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Lakers are 12-5
Phoenix is 10-6
That's all i care about.
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^you didnt sound like this when Lakers had a negative season
hypocrite.
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Lakers are 12-5
Phoenix is 10-6
That's all i care about.
not a big difference
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Fuck that asshole.
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Nash= :o
he really gave it to us (kings) last night.. >:(
3 losses in a row to the three best in the west without Artest :-\
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those are mvp numbers...
Not when you only play one end of the floor. ::)
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Those are great numbers no doubt
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20 assist! that guy just won me the assist battle in the fantasy league
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those are mvp numbers...
Not when you only play one end of the floor. ::)
all the SUNS play like that...That doesnt change how VALUABLE he is to the team...
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those are mvp numbers...
Not when you only play one end of the floor. ::)
all the SUNS play like that...That doesnt change how VALUABLE he is to the team...
It changes how valuable he is as a player, and it definitely means he can't be the MOST valuable...PeACe
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those are mvp numbers...
Not when you only play one end of the floor. ::)
all the SUNS play like that...That doesnt change how VALUABLE he is to the team...
It changes how valuable he is as a player, and it definitely means he can't be the MOST valuable...PeACe
I dont think he should have won either, But he did..I think the League felt that with Amare out Nash was even more valuable...And when Nash doesnt play the Suns are a WAY different team...
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those are mvp numbers...
Not when you only play one end of the floor. ::)
all the SUNS play like that...That doesnt change how VALUABLE he is to the team...
It changes how valuable he is as a player, and it definitely means he can't be the MOST valuable...PeACe
I dont think he should have won either, But he did..I think the League felt that with Amare out Nash was even more valuable...And when Nash doesnt play the Suns are a WAY different team...
yeah i agree, i was shocked when he won the 2nd straight mvp because i honestly thought Kobe had it, though you can make cases for both players. But i also believe...
Suns without Nash = Lakers without Kobe, both are very valuable to their teams.
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^you didnt sound like this when Lakers had a negative season
hypocrite.
How am i hypocrite when i'm STILL saying the results is all i care? I was critical two years ago cause the team didn't have a good strategy for the future and they were doing embarassing results. Then i was critical at the beginning of the last season (the first 20-25 games) cause i wasn't seing a better strategy other than "let's call Phil back" but then i started to see it. And i stopped being critic. Now i'm not critic at all. About the MVP trophy i was mad last year when they didn't give it to Kobe, right, but now i don't care about it no more, since they just won't give it to Kobe. So what i care AGAIN is the results. I dream about Kobe leading the Lakers to a title. If Miami did it, we can do it too.
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those are mvp numbers...
Not when you only play one end of the floor. ::)
all the SUNS play like that...That doesnt change how VALUABLE he is to the team...
It changes how valuable he is as a player, and it definitely means he can't be the MOST valuable...PeACe
I dont think he should have won either, But he did..I think the League felt that with Amare out Nash was even more valuable...And when Nash doesnt play the Suns are a WAY different team...
yeah i agree, i was shocked when he won the 2nd straight mvp because i honestly thought Kobe had it, though you can make cases for both players. But i also believe...
Suns without Nash = Lakers without Kobe, both are very valuable to their teams.
so very true..
Kobe>Nash
I think the NBA has a boner for Nash tho, for real...
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Nash is killing em
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KOBE>>>>NASH
ALL DAY
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Kobe is a better basketball player than Nash but SN is more valuable to his team, no doubt.
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^ Yes, people act as if they don't know what "valuable" means.
The Lakers did hella good this year in the games without Kobe. Didnt they win like all of them?
Now look at the Suns before Nash came.
Nobody is argueing that Kobe is the better player, but Nash makes a huge difference for his team.
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I'm not a fan of those arguments. You can have playbooks based on a certain player, so if you cut him from the team the team will suffer. It doesn't mean the player is God, but just very important for the team. Take the Suns: they're totally based on Steve Nash. It's Steve Nash's team. Obviously if you cut him the team will suffer. But that doesn't mean Nash is the best player in the team or the only one who can play with great results in their system. He's just the key player, the one who starts the offensive play and who dishes the ball to the right guy. The Lakers are based on the triangle. So even if Kobe is out, they can find a different way to score trying to involve other players more (Odom?). It's not a team based on Kobe. Kobe is just the guy who makes the difference because he's the best player in the NBA. That said, the "MVP" trophy is bullshit. How can you give a trophy to a player who ain't the best in the league? No, let me say it better: he's not even the best of his team. Bullshit.
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if youd simply give it to the best player it would be boring. it would be the same players over and over... according to you laker fans kobe wouldve gotten the trophy like 6 times already with another 6 coming, yes, that would be a great thing.
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Kobe is a better basketball player than Nash but SN is more valuable to his team, no doubt.
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if youd simply give it to the best player it would be boring. it would be the same players over and over... according to you laker fans kobe wouldve gotten the trophy like 6 times already with another 6 coming, yes, that would be a great thing.
Man the only real MVP Trophy who shouldn't be revoked is the NBA Finals one. Cause it means you're giving credits to the player most valuable for the team who won the NBA. But what's the point giving a MVP Trophy for the Regular season? I mean even Paul is fundamental for the Hornets. Why Nash and not Paul?
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if youd simply give it to the best player it would be boring. it would be the same players over and over... according to you laker fans kobe wouldve gotten the trophy like 6 times already with another 6 coming, yes, that would be a great thing.
Man the only real MVP Trophy who shouldn't be revoked is the NBA Finals one. Cause it means you're giving credits to the player most valuable for the team who won the NBA. But what's the point giving a MVP Trophy for the Regular season? I mean even Paul is fundamental for the Hornets. Why Nash and not Paul?
cmon man whats wrong with you? Nash has more PPG and assists than Paul, plus, his team is going to win about 20 more games.
Are you serious dude?
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if youd simply give it to the best player it would be boring. it would be the same players over and over... according to you laker fans kobe wouldve gotten the trophy like 6 times already with another 6 coming, yes, that would be a great thing.
Man the only real MVP Trophy who shouldn't be revoked is the NBA Finals one. Cause it means you're giving credits to the player most valuable for the team who won the NBA. But what's the point giving a MVP Trophy for the Regular season? I mean even Paul is fundamental for the Hornets. Why Nash and not Paul?
cmon man whats wrong with you? Nash has more PPG and assists than Paul, plus, his team is going to win about 20 more games.
Are you serious dude?
Real Talk
and Nash has proven that he can CARRY a team and take them deep in the playoffs and 2 the playoffs! Paul is in his 2nd year and hasnt really done shit..A great young player, yes! But lets not get out of hand here..Kobe and Nash are both sooo valuable to there team. The Lakers woud not win 40 games without Kobe...
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Bad english. No, i'm not saying Paul has done more than Nash in his career or that he's a better PG. Obviously he's not. I'm saying i don't see a reason to give a trophy to the Most Valuable player, since for example Paul is very important for the Hornets, and without him the Hornets are basically a lottery team. So what's the point selecting an MVP? MVP for which team? And why the Suns and not the Bulls, or the Kings, or the Hornets. Artest is fundamental for the Kings. Without him the Kings are a lottery team. With him they are a playoff team. So why Nash and not Artest? I simply don't see a reason to give it to the "M.V.P.". I'd rater give a trophy to the best player in the league (i mean the one who has had the best season). But the "M.V.P." thing is stupid. Wade (and his friends in black and white) is as important for his team than Nash. It's pointless to say Nash is more important for his own team. Biased. Stupid. Let's argue about who's the best player and about who's having a better season. That's more interesting to me.
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Kobe is a better basketball player than Nash but SN is more valuable to his team, no doubt.
That's not good, it means the Suns are not a balanced team. Being the MVP doesn't mean your team depends on you the most...
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^ Yes, people act as if they don't know what "valuable" means.
The Lakers did hella good this year in the games without Kobe. Didnt they win like all of them?
Now look at the Suns before Nash came.
Nobody is argueing that Kobe is the better player, but Nash makes a huge difference for his team.
That's not what being the most valuable player in the league means. ::)
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if youd simply give it to the best player it would be boring. it would be the same players over and over... according to you laker fans kobe wouldve gotten the trophy like 6 times already with another 6 coming, yes, that would be a great thing.
Shoot yourself in the teeth.
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both players are great in their own ways. you can't really compare them, their roles are just too different. it's like when you compare duncan in his prime to bryant, obviously bryant it a lot more fun to watch, much more athletic, better shooter, etc... but does that mean he shits all over duncan? I don't think so man
That's not what being the most valuable player in the league means. Roll Eyes
o rly? what does it mean then? are all those people whose votes count insane for putting billups over kobe and shit then?
Shoot yourself in the teeth.
dont get mad get glad, I know you would find it completely normal for kobe to already have a bunch of trophies. look in the mirror and you can't deny it
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Bad english. No, i'm not saying Paul has done more than Nash in his career or that he's a better PG. Obviously he's not. I'm saying i don't see a reason to give a trophy to the Most Valuable player, since for example Paul is very important for the Hornets, and without him the Hornets are basically a lottery team. So what's the point selecting an MVP? MVP for which team? And why the Suns and not the Bulls, or the Kings, or the Hornets. Artest is fundamental for the Kings. Without him the Kings are a lottery team. With him they are a playoff team. So why Nash and not Artest? I simply don't see a reason to give it to the "M.V.P.". I'd rater give a trophy to the best player in the league (i mean the one who has had the best season). But the "M.V.P." thing is stupid. Wade (and his friends in black and white) is as important for his team than Nash. It's pointless to say Nash is more important for his own team. Biased. Stupid. Let's argue about who's the best player and about who's having a better season. That's more interesting to me.
Dude, don't listen to these idiots, they have no idea what they're talking about...the MVP trophy IS about the most valuable player in the league, they just don't get that and like to make gay arguments for Nash that makes no sense...PeACe
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doesn't jordan only have like 2 mvp trophies?
owned.
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both players are great in their own ways. you can't really compare them, their roles are just too different. it's like when you compare duncan in his prime to bryant, obviously bryant it a lot more fun to watch, much more athletic, better shooter, etc... but does that mean he shits all over duncan? I don't think so man
That's not what being the most valuable player in the league means. Roll Eyes
o rly? what does it mean then? are all those people whose votes count insane for putting billups over kobe and shit then?
Shoot yourself in the teeth.
dont get mad get glad, I know you would find it completely normal for kobe to already have a bunch of trophies. look in the mirror and you can't deny it
Are you stupid? wait, what the fuck am I asking...Nash and Kobe are not comparable because Nash only plays one end of the court...Duncan, fine, but Nash? :stupid:
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Also, with Billups you're talking about Finals MVP, which is a completely different thing...Get your shit together, homie. ::)
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Kobe is a better basketball player than Nash but SN is more valuable to his team, no doubt.
That's not good, it means the Suns are not a balanced team. Being the MVP doesn't mean your team depends on you the most...
what kinda shit are you smoking on dawg?
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doesn't jordan only have like 2 mvp trophies?
owned.
You're done, man...Jordan has 5 MVPs...Never enter this topic again. :-X
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Kobe is a better basketball player than Nash but SN is more valuable to his team, no doubt.
That's not good, it means the Suns are not a balanced team. Being the MVP doesn't mean your team depends on you the most...
what kinda shit are you smoking on dawg?
OG Kush...Now come with something useful, or don't say shit.
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Kobe is a better basketball player than Nash but SN is more valuable to his team, no doubt.
That's not good, it means the Suns are not a balanced team. Being the MVP doesn't mean your team depends on you the most...
what kinda shit are you smoking on dawg?
OG Kush...Now come with something useful, or don't say shit.
all I have to say is grow up
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Kobe is a better basketball player than Nash but SN is more valuable to his team, no doubt.
That's not good, it means the Suns are not a balanced team. Being the MVP doesn't mean your team depends on you the most...
what kinda shit are you smoking on dawg?
OG Kush...Now come with something useful, or don't say shit.
all I have to say is grow up
Translation- "I have nothing to say"
8)
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Kobe is a better basketball player than Nash but SN is more valuable to his team, no doubt.
That's not good, it means the Suns are not a balanced team. Being the MVP doesn't mean your team depends on you the most...
what kinda shit are you smoking on dawg?
OG Kush...Now come with something useful, or don't say shit.
all I have to say is grow up
Translation- "I have nothing to say"
8)
whats the point?
grow up man ....I could go on and on going over the same shit weve already discussed 10 times, but I wont waste my time with you about anything that has to do with the Lakers....actually. the thread is about Steve Nash - somehow you always want to talk about Kobe? suprise suprise
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Kobe is a better basketball player than Nash but SN is more valuable to his team, no doubt.
That's not good, it means the Suns are not a balanced team. Being the MVP doesn't mean your team depends on you the most...
what kinda shit are you smoking on dawg?
OG Kush...Now come with something useful, or don't say shit.
all I have to say is grow up
Translation- "I have nothing to say"
8)
whats the point?
grow up man ....I could go on and on going over the same shit weve already discussed 10 times, but I wont waste my time with you about anything that has to do with the Lakers....actually. the thread is about Steve Nash - somehow you always want to talk about Kobe? suprise suprise
LOL@you sonning yourself...What I said had NOTHING to do with the Lakers. "Being the MVP doesn't mean your team depends on you the most" <<that's what I said, and you're too slow to come up with something logical against it, so you defer to the same old lame off-topic disses...I'm sure I got 7even working on his game as we speak, now it's your turn to try and step it up. :-*
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you are such a douchebag and all of dubcc knows it
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I should have just mailed you a huge bag of shit and told you to smoke that...cant believe i wasted a half quarter on you man
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I should have just mailed you a huge bag of shit and told you to smoke that...cant believe i wasted a half quarter on you man
LMAO! you piece of shit, everyone knows your ass never sent that shit cuz you're a punk BITCH with no balls. and thanks for proving my point about being a moron with nothing useful to say...Now stick to the topic or shut the fuck up, bitch-made snake with no self-respect. :-X
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I should have just mailed you a huge bag of shit and told you to smoke that...cant believe i wasted a half quarter on you man
LMAO! you piece of shit, everyone knows your ass never sent that shit cuz you're a punk BITCH with no balls. and thanks for proving my point about being a moron with nothing useful to say...Now stick to the topic or shut the fuck up, bitch-made snake with no self-respect. :-X
who is everyone? youre the only punk bitch in here....nobody respects your opinion or what you have to say because everyone knows all you see is purple and gold and all you taste is kobe nuts all day 24/7 you little fag
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From my PM inbox...
I bet he never sent it and is gona make some excuse or some other bullshit, but if he did send it then you are a lucky man, I would love a free 8th
^^That's while I still believed you "sent it"
then later when I already realized you were a bitch-made faggot with no balls I got this one VV
plants post proves that he never sent it and this was his plan all along ::) the way he got so defensive gave him away
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And everyone knows I have great knowledge regarding the sport of basketball and everything I say is reasonable, never illogical... if not, get to proving me wrong and quit with the bitching, punk ass snake...You have nothing to say, admit it, you know deep down on the inside that you're a bitch, I'm willing to bet. Actually, no I'm not, cuz you have no dignity and squeal out of bets to begin with...How someone can do what you did and still feel secure with their manhood is beyond me. B I T C H.
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all i know is that kobe should have won it last year. period. forget the 81 points . forget the scoring title and game winning shots. IMO the MVP is 1)the player who leads his team to a more impressive record than the year before 2) the most crucial player to his team and kobe did/was both of those things last year no doubt. kobe should've been mvp
as far as this year goes, the mvp so far is carlos boozer, but we've only played like 1/4th of the season so it's not really worth debating this year YET who knows maybe in 5 months we'll be arguing that ron artest should be the MVP
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both players are great in their own ways. you can't really compare them, their roles are just too different. it's like when you compare duncan in his prime to bryant, obviously bryant it a lot more fun to watch, much more athletic, better shooter, etc... but does that mean he shits all over duncan? I don't think so man
That's why i said the only MVP trophy who is acceptable is the NBA Finals one.
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wtf... aight I was misinformed about that Jordan thing, Im glad that made your day, Im sure it did
I wasnt referring to that finals mvp title with billups, the fact just is that some voters put him over kobe in the regular season mvp shit last year. if everyone had the defintion of "mvp" you have, nobody would do that. ever. now, maybe the ones who actually have a say when it comes to who becomes mvp are off when it comes to the definition of mvp. or maybe you are. who will ever know?
oh and one last thing for you, because I kinda like you. you should really take this advice seriously because it would help you a lot:
never hate your enemies, it affects your judgement. <- classic
well, never love purple and gold too much, either. affects your judgement as well
and also never call people who disagree stupid for disagreeing, that kind of kills your chance to actually embrace another view of things for one time's sake.
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wtf... aight I was misinformed about that Jordan thing, Im glad that made your day, Im sure it did
I wasnt referring to that finals mvp title with billups, the fact just is that some voters put him over kobe in the regular season mvp shit last year. if everyone had the defintion of "mvp" you have, nobody would do that. ever. now, maybe the ones who actually have a say when it comes to who becomes mvp are off when it comes to the definition of mvp. or maybe you are. who will ever know?
oh and one last thing for you, because I kinda like you. you should really take this advice seriously because it would help you a lot:
never hate your enemies, it affects your judgement. <- classic
well, never love purple and gold too much, either. affects your judgement as well
and also never call people who disagree stupid for disagreeing, that kind of kills your chance to actually embrace another view of things for one time's sake.
You just have trouble understanding...You're not my "enemy". LOL. I don't hate Steve Nash (I actually think he's a great player [offensively]), and there's no such thing as loving your team "too much"...Nothing clouds my judgement either, cuz I'm a fair person and I use logic with everything...People voted for Billups over Kobe because the treatment Kobe gets from the media. come on man, even you should know that. It's not a TEAM MVP award, homie, it's a LEAGUE MVP award...Maybe the journalists voting for this are using your logic when voting or maybe they just have such a boner for Nash that they make themselves actually believe that...I don't know what it is, but one thing I do know is that Kobe had a historical and untouched season last year, pretty much flawless, and at the same time was just as valuable to the Lakers as Nash was to the Suns (this year we're more balanced, so that changed it and is also why Kobe is scoring way less)...One thing though, I can respect that you know how to defend your beliefs and explained what you thought I was wrong about, unlike Plant who came in here acting like a clueless moron and calling me a child when he was blatantly being the childish one...But just know that you're wrong about the MVP award not being a LEAGUE honor...PeACe
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One thing though, I can respect that you know how to defend your beliefs and explained what you thought I was wrong about, unlike Plant who came in here acting like a clueless moron and calling me a child when he was blatantly being the childish one...But just know that you're wrong about the MVP award not being a LEAGUE honor...PeACe
buddy, just shut your hole already....youre still talking shit :sleep:
I could defend my opinion easily but like I already said there is no point wasting my time talking to you because you are an ignorant prick and you will never go against Kobe or the Lakers. Im not the only person on dubcc who can make a case for Nash being the MVP. And if he wins it again this year, I already know you wont give him any credit because your boy Kobe wont be the winner.
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One thing though, I can respect that you know how to defend your beliefs and explained what you thought I was wrong about, unlike Plant who came in here acting like a clueless moron and calling me a child when he was blatantly being the childish one...But just know that you're wrong about the MVP award not being a LEAGUE honor...PeACe
buddy, just shut your hthe Lakers/Kobe...Actole already....youre still talking shit :sleep:
I could defend my opinion easily but like I already said there is no point wasting my time talking to you because you are an ignorant prick and you will never go against Kobe or the Lakers. Im not the only person on dubcc who can make a case for Nash being the MVP. And if he wins it again this year, I already know you wont give him any credit because your boy Kobe wont be the winner.
LMAO@"if Nash wins the MVP again this year". :puke: That would be dumber than you believing you have something on me when it comes to knowledge of the game, despite the fact that you have no real points and haven't said anything yet. This discussion has nothing to do with Kobe, it's about what it means to be the MVP...In fact, I didn't bring Kobe into this until YOU mentioned him...PLEASE come with something better, so I at least feel the need to think when I reply.
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One thing though, I can respect that you know how to defend your beliefs and explained what you thought I was wrong about, unlike Plant who came in here acting like a clueless moron and calling me a child when he was blatantly being the childish one...But just know that you're wrong about the MVP award not being a LEAGUE honor...PeACe
buddy, just shut your hthe Lakers/Kobe...Actole already....youre still talking shit :sleep:
I could defend my opinion easily but like I already said there is no point wasting my time talking to you because you are an ignorant prick and you will never go against Kobe or the Lakers. Im not the only person on dubcc who can make a case for Nash being the MVP. And if he wins it again this year, I already know you wont give him any credit because your boy Kobe wont be the winner.
LMAO@"if Nash wins the MVP again this year". :puke: That would be dumber than you believing you have something on me when it comes to knowledge of the game, despite the fact that you have no real points and haven't said anything yet. This discussion has nothing to do with Kobe, it's about what it means to be the MVP...In fact, I didn't bring Kobe into this until YOU mentioned him...PLEASE come with something better, so I at least feel the need to think when I reply.
How dumb is it to think Nash could possibly win the MVP again this year? Dude is averaging 21 PPG and almost 12 assists....The only player that comes to mind who put up those numbers is Magic Johnson. Nash is putting up better numbers than the previous 2 seasons he won the award. The Suns have now won 9 games in a row (all lead by Nash) and by then end of next week, I predict they will be ahead of the Lakers for 1st place in the division. For someone who claims they know so much about basketball and watches so much ball, you really seem like an idiot right now. I think you were blinded by those purple and gold shades you wear 24/7
The 4 front runners right now Id say are Melo, Dirk and Steve Nash & Yao.....Boozer is putting up the same numbers as Bosh, sure hes doing alot for his team but Id also give credit to Deron Williams, the guy is playing outstanding ball right now.
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MVP titles are meaningless for me.... only MVP of the Finals mean something... at the end of the day, you can win 2 or 3 MVP titles and don't have one single NBA title ( Malone, KG... and Nash)
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MVP titles are meaningless for me.... only MVP of the Finals mean something... at the end of the day, you can win 2 or 3 MVP titles and don't have one single NBA title ( Malone, KG... and Nash)
how is an MVP meaningless? the most valuable player for the regular season is a huge achievement....thru an 82 game season that player has to be consistant all year long and carry his team to greatness....Anyone who wins and MVP (regular season or Finals) gets huge props in my book. Being the MVP is as good as it gets as far as individual awards go.
MVP Award>>>All NBA>>>Defensive Player>>>6th Man>>> Most Improved>>>Coach
so if the MVP is meaningless, you might aswell not even hand out awards because to me, the MVP is the most important award they give out.
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One thing though, I can respect that you know how to defend your beliefs and explained what you thought I was wrong about, unlike Plant who came in here acting like a clueless moron and calling me a child when he was blatantly being the childish one...But just know that you're wrong about the MVP award not being a LEAGUE honor...PeACe
buddy, just shut your hthe Lakers/Kobe...Actole already....youre still talking shit :sleep:
I could defend my opinion easily but like I already said there is no point wasting my time talking to you because you are an ignorant prick and you will never go against Kobe or the Lakers. Im not the only person on dubcc who can make a case for Nash being the MVP. And if he wins it again this year, I already know you wont give him any credit because your boy Kobe wont be the winner.
LMAO@"if Nash wins the MVP again this year". :puke: That would be dumber than you believing you have something on me when it comes to knowledge of the game, despite the fact that you have no real points and haven't said anything yet. This discussion has nothing to do with Kobe, it's about what it means to be the MVP...In fact, I didn't bring Kobe into this until YOU mentioned him...PLEASE come with something better, so I at least feel the need to think when I reply.
How dumb is it to think Nash could possibly win the MVP again this year? Dude is averaging 21 PPG and almost 12 assists....The only player that comes to mind who put up those numbers is Magic Johnson. Nash is putting up better numbers than the previous 2 seasons he won the award. The Suns have now won 9 games in a row (all lead by Nash) and by then end of next week, I predict they will be ahead of the Lakers for 1st place in the division. For someone who claims they know so much about basketball and watches so much ball, you really seem like an idiot right now. I think you were blinded by those purple and gold shades you wear 24/7
The 4 front runners right now Id say are Melo, Dirk and Steve Nash & Yao.....Boozer is putting up the same numbers as Bosh, sure hes doing alot for his team but Id also give credit to Deron Williams, the guy is playing outstanding ball right now.
Holy shit, it's like you're too slow to understand anything. NASH CAN NEVER BE THE BEST PLAYER IN THE LEAGUE BECAUSE HE EXPANDS ALL HIS ENERGY ON ONE SIDE OF THE COURT. He's producing high numbers because of the system he's playing in, the same system he's been playing in for the last few years...Hell, even a rookie like Jordan Farmar would be averaging AT LEAST 15 points and 8 assists if he was given the lead point guard role in the Suns' system...You think those numbers make Nash the best player in the league? Hell no. Dude runs the offense extremely well, I'll give him that, but he's not even the best player on his TEAM! Numbers don't mean shit, once again, the Suns play in a stat-inflating system, and if you still don't get what I'm saying, then there's no hope for you...PeACe
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MVP titles are meaningless for me.... only MVP of the Finals mean something... at the end of the day, you can win 2 or 3 MVP titles and don't have one single NBA title ( Malone, KG... and Nash)
how is an MVP meaningless? the most valuable player for the regular season is a huge achievement....thru an 82 game season that player has to be consistant all year long and carry his team to greatness....Anyone who wins and MVP (regular season or Finals) gets huge props in my book. Being the MVP is as good as it gets as far as individual awards go.
MVP Award>>>All NBA>>>Defensive Player>>>6th Man>>> Most Improved>>>Coach
so if the MVP is meaningless, you might aswell not even hand out awards because to me, the MVP is the most important award they give out.
It's meaningless because it's a popularity contest, whoever is liked the most by the media gets it, because that's who votes for it...A bunch of little white guys with mics and pens, why do you think NASH won twice in a row when Kobe was first team all-NBA, first team all-defense, scoring champ, steal leader, historical broken records, etc. etc. It's because Kobe is way less liked...I mean, there's no arguing it, it's not like Kobe came in 2nd with that historical season, he came in FOURTH! Disgusting. And for you to say that the MVP award is greater than an All-NBA or All-Defense honor is BULLSHIT, because you know who votes for that? The coaches! And that means a lot more than a gayass popularity contest held by the media AKA the MVP award...PeACe
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you are a fuckin joke man
dont ever comment or respond to any of my posts again
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LOL@this idiot getting sonned left and right. Never has logical shit to say, always posts without saying shit. DUDE, I OWN YOU IN BASKETBALL KNOWLEDGE, quit acting like you know something, you just have NOTHING to say. LOL!
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Anyway Sergio Rodriguez from Portland is averaging 3.9 assists per 12.5 minutes, so that means if he had the same minutes of playing time of Nash he was averaging 11.7 assists too. :P
Oh, Sergio is actually a better defender than Nash.
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^Don't act like a dick. It doesn't suit you.
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MVP titles are meaningless for me.... only MVP of the Finals mean something... at the end of the day, you can win 2 or 3 MVP titles and don't have one single NBA title ( Malone, KG... and Nash)
how is an MVP meaningless? the most valuable player for the regular season is a huge achievement....thru an 82 game season that player has to be consistant all year long and carry his team to greatness....Anyone who wins and MVP (regular season or Finals) gets huge props in my book. Being the MVP is as good as it gets as far as individual awards go.
MVP Award>>>All NBA>>>Defensive Player>>>6th Man>>> Most Improved>>>Coach
so if the MVP is meaningless, you might aswell not even hand out awards because to me, the MVP is the most important award they give out.
I really don't care about the awards coz the votes come from the medias, and we all know how they 're objective... plus at the end of the day only the NBA title really counts .. this is a team game... if you had to choose, would u prefer to have a carreer like Steve Nash or like Robert Horry ??
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MVP titles are meaningless for me.... only MVP of the Finals mean something... at the end of the day, you can win 2 or 3 MVP titles and don't have one single NBA title ( Malone, KG... and Nash)
how is an MVP meaningless? the most valuable player for the regular season is a huge achievement....thru an 82 game season that player has to be consistant all year long and carry his team to greatness....Anyone who wins and MVP (regular season or Finals) gets huge props in my book. Being the MVP is as good as it gets as far as individual awards go.
MVP Award>>>All NBA>>>Defensive Player>>>6th Man>>> Most Improved>>>Coach
so if the MVP is meaningless, you might aswell not even hand out awards because to me, the MVP is the most important award they give out.
I really don't care about the awards coz the votes come from the medias, and we all know how they 're objective... plus at the end of the day only the NBA title really counts .. this is a team game... if you had to choose, would u prefer to have a carreer like Steve Nash or like Robert Horry ??
Well being Canadian, Id say Steve Nash....easily....Dude is the biggest icon in our country
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^Don't act like a dick. It doesn't suit you.
How exactly is he being a dick?
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^Don't act like a dick. It doesn't suit you.
How exactly is he being a dick?
By pretending to think Sergio Rodriguez is in the same league as Nash is.
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^Don't act like a dick. It doesn't suit you.
How exactly is he being a dick?
By pretending to think Sergio Rodriguez is in the same league as Nash is.
I don't think that's the point he's making...
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What else could it be? That numbers ain't shit? I guess 81 isn't shit as a number either then, is it? 21/12 are impressive numbers, no matter how you slice it. It's easier to get those numbers on a team like the Suns of course, but it is still a remarkable achievement. And they are winning, too. Nash is no Iverson or Garnett.
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MVP titles are meaningless for me.... only MVP of the Finals mean something... at the end of the day, you can win 2 or 3 MVP titles and don't have one single NBA title ( Malone, KG... and Nash)
how is an MVP meaningless? the most valuable player for the regular season is a huge achievement....thru an 82 game season that player has to be consistant all year long and carry his team to greatness....Anyone who wins and MVP (regular season or Finals) gets huge props in my book. Being the MVP is as good as it gets as far as individual awards go.
MVP Award>>>All NBA>>>Defensive Player>>>6th Man>>> Most Improved>>>Coach
so if the MVP is meaningless, you might aswell not even hand out awards because to me, the MVP is the most important award they give out.
it is meaningless nowdays. kobe got robbed of 2 well deserved mvp trophies. i give nash his props, but there's no way you can say he had a better season that kobe did (05-06 season).
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^Don't act like a dick. It doesn't suit you.
LOL didn't you see the :P smile?
Of course I did, that's why I said what I said. You were being a dick. But you're usually such an unconfronting, understanding, self-conscious nice guy. So I told you that being a dick doesn't suit your image, so you should just get rid of that dick-being-behaviour for your own good. I was just trying to give advice.
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What else could it be? That numbers ain't shit? I guess 81 isn't shit as a number either then, is it? 21/12 are impressive numbers, no matter how you slice it. It's easier to get those numbers on a team like the Suns of course, but it is still a remarkable achievement. And they are winning, too. Nash is no Iverson or Garnett.
Are you completely ignoring what I'm saying? NASH PLAYS ONE END OF THE COURT. NASH PLAYS IN A STAT-INFLATING SYSTEM. Not saying he's not great at what he does, but he's a number 2 option on a team like Dallas, and even now he's not the best on his team...Don't be moronicly illogical like Plant, I know you're above that level...PeACe
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What else could it be? That numbers ain't shit? I guess 81 isn't shit as a number either then, is it? 21/12 are impressive numbers, no matter how you slice it. It's easier to get those numbers on a team like the Suns of course, but it is still a remarkable achievement. And they are winning, too. Nash is no Iverson or Garnett.
Are you completely ignoring what I'm saying? NASH PLAYS ONE END OF THE COURT. NASH PLAYS IN A STAT-INFLATING SYSTEM. Not saying he's not great at what he does, but he's a number 2 option on a team like Dallas, and even now he's not the best on his team...Don't be moronicly illogical like Plant, I know you're above that level...PeACe
Nash does what people expect him to do and he does that really well. He plays his role, he knows his role and he does what he does well. You don't expect Ron Artest to shoot and hit clutch 3s now do you. The Suns don't rely much on defense and if they do they have other people to shut the opponent down, they don't even need Nash for great defense. He's old, it would be horrific if he hustled his ass off on the defensive end, cause his offensive game would suffer dramatically.
He's no Magic, no Stockton, no Kidd. Still a great player.
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^Don't act like a dick. It doesn't suit you.
LOL didn't you see the :P smile?
Of course I did, that's why I said what I said. You were being a dick. But you're usually such an unconfronting, understanding, self-conscious nice guy. So I told you that being a dick doesn't suit your image, so you should just get rid of that dick-being-behaviour for your own good. I was just trying to give advice.
Ok. Let me try to add something more interesting to the discussion. Let me try. Let me explain you a pair of things about Nash's stats. It's math. The Suns are a 112.1 points per game (best in the League, obviously) team. Well.. to average almost 12 assists there shouldn't be that impressive, since he's doing it from 3 years in a row. He averaged 5.8 assists per game before he returned back to Phoenix 3 years ago, and all of a sudden he's starting to average 11+. Isn't it suspicious to you? They have 3 players in the top 30 of the League in assists (the other two are Barbosa and Diaw, not exactly Magic & Thomas) and they average an unreal 26.44 assists per game (best in the League, obviously). Yes, he's dishing the ball very well, but Phoenix system helps. He's averaging 11.7 assists out of 26.44 total assists of his team. It's the 44.2% of the team. Chris Paul, since i named him in a previous post, is averaging 8.9 assists out of 16.8 of his team. Which means he's making almost 53% of the assists of his team. That's more impressive to me. And we can do the same funny game about points. Nash is making 21 points out of 112.1 (18.7%) while Chris Paul is making 18.2 points out of 91.5 (19.9%). See? Math is funny sometimes. Who clowned me about Paul being more MVP (most valuable player) than Nash?
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Aight one general statement first: Smart people always know how to use certain statistics to "prove" something, but well it's not always as plain as the stats might make it look.
Next, I never denied that playing for the Suns might boost your stats. It's obvious that offensive players get more credit when it comes to stats than defensive players, and well the Suns are a very offense-minded team.
But then again I don't think that there is any PG in the league that would make the Suns better while putting up better numbers than Nash at the same time. And that does say something.
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I'm just saying that playing for the Suns boost your offensive stats. He's a good player, arguably the best PG in the league at the moment, but if i have to judge his career and then the one of.. i don't know.. Jason Kidd (dude is an 8-time All-Defensive selection and he led the Nets to 2 NBA Finals!!!).. well.. it's like comparing Ben Gordon to Michael Jordan, you know what i mean? Nash is a good player, but damn he's probably one of the most overrated ever with his back-to-back MVP titles. And, about your last sentence, what's the big deal? I mean you can say the same thing about Kobe and the Lakers, or Wade and the Heat, or Melo and the Nuggets, or KG and Minnesota. Why the NBA chosed Nash over those ones?
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What else could it be? That numbers ain't shit? I guess 81 isn't shit as a number either then, is it? 21/12 are impressive numbers, no matter how you slice it. It's easier to get those numbers on a team like the Suns of course, but it is still a remarkable achievement. And they are winning, too. Nash is no Iverson or Garnett.
Are you completely ignoring what I'm saying? NASH PLAYS ONE END OF THE COURT. NASH PLAYS IN A STAT-INFLATING SYSTEM. Not saying he's not great at what he does, but he's a number 2 option on a team like Dallas, and even now he's not the best on his team...Don't be moronicly illogical like Plant, I know you're above that level...PeACe
Nash does what people expect him to do and he does that really well. He plays his role, he knows his role and he does what he does well. You don't expect Ron Artest to shoot and hit clutch 3s now do you. The Suns don't rely much on defense and if they do they have other people to shut the opponent down, they don't even need Nash for great defense. He's old, it would be horrific if he hustled his ass off on the defensive end, cause his offensive game would suffer dramatically.
He's no Magic, no Stockton, no Kidd. Still a great player.
Yes, and the point is that basketball is a game played on both ends of the court, which is why Steve Nash can't be the best in the game only excelling in half of the game while beng pretty much non-existant in the other half...PeACe
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I'm not so sure about Wade, Melo and Garnett. But that is another story. Let's not get into too many arguments, I'm tired. Aren't you?
Of course Kidd's career is "better". Him not getting an MVP award is another story alltogether.
As far as Nash being MVP I think it's understandable. I mean, before he came to the Suns, the team was embarrassing to watch. They had a horrible win-loss record. They flat out sucked. Then Nash comes and they go to the WEST FINALS after a GREAT regular season. Then they lose Amare for good and they go to the WEST FINALS YET AGAIN. If that's not an achievement, I don't know what is. It can be argued that players like Kobe have been more worthy of that honor last year, but I think several players deserved it, but only one could get it and that's that. Kobe deserved it, yes. But so did Nash in his own kind of way.
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Kobe deserved it, yes.
(http://www.juvefans.org/images/smilies/sisi.gif)
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Kobe deserved it, yes.
(http://www.juvefans.org/images/smilies/sisi.gif)
yep yep
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I'm not so sure about Wade, Melo and Garnett. But that is another story. Let's not get into too many arguments, I'm tired. Aren't you?
Of course Kidd's career is "better". Him not getting an MVP award is another story alltogether.
As far as Nash being MVP I think it's understandable. I mean, before he came to the Suns, the team was embarrassing to watch. They had a horrible win-loss record. They flat out sucked. Then Nash comes and they go to the WEST FINALS after a GREAT regular season. Then they lose Amare for good and they go to the WEST FINALS YET AGAIN. If that's not an achievement, I don't know what is. It can be argued that players like Kobe have been more worthy of that honor last year, but I think several players deserved it, but only one could get it and that's that. Kobe deserved it, yes. But so did Nash in his own kind of way.
I agree, what Nash did last season was impressive considering no Amare, you can't deny that.
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all you guys who act like Nash aint all that, you need to name me one PG in the league (beside J Kidd) who would be doing what Nash is doing, has done....There is no one. No other PG can make those kind of sneaky passes that Nash makes for all his teamates to get those easy buckets....Amare and Marion are spoonfed at least half of there points every game....Its wack wehn NIK sits here and says its all about the system, that fn bullshit....Nash IS the system. If J Kidd was in Pheonix he might put up those kind of numbers, and If he won MVP, I would give him his props, no problem....Nash is a better shooter and offensive player than Kidd tho. 22 and 12 is pretty sick numbers, and even better when you are the sole reason why your team is winning games.
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all you guys who act like Nash aint all that, you need to name me one PG in the league (beside J Kidd) who would be doing what Nash is doing, has done....There is no one. No other PG can make those kind of sneaky passes that Nash makes for all his teamates to get those easy buckets....Amare and Marion are spoonfed at least half of there points every game....Its wack wehn NIK sits here and says its all about the system, that fn bullshit....Nash IS the system. If J Kidd was in Pheonix he might put up those kind of numbers, and If he won MVP, I would give him his props, no problem....Nash is a better shooter and offensive player than Kidd tho. 22 and 12 is pretty sick numbers, and even better when you are the sole reason why your team is winning games.
Your dumbness is causing you to ignore the whole point, NASH DOESNT PLAY DEFENSE. Nash might be a better shooter, but Kidd is a better all-around player, even at age 34, because he plays BOTH ENDS of the court. Nobody denied he was great on offense (despite playing in a stat-inflating system), but it's the lack of DEFENSE that's keeping him back from being anywhere close to the greatest...Get it yet? ::)
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all you guys who act like Nash aint all that, you need to name me one PG in the league (beside J Kidd) who would be doing what Nash is doing, has done....There is no one. No other PG can make those kind of sneaky passes that Nash makes for all his teamates to get those easy buckets....Amare and Marion are spoonfed at least half of there points every game....Its wack wehn NIK sits here and says its all about the system, that fn bullshit....Nash IS the system. If J Kidd was in Pheonix he might put up those kind of numbers, and If he won MVP, I would give him his props, no problem....Nash is a better shooter and offensive player than Kidd tho. 22 and 12 is pretty sick numbers, and even better when you are the sole reason why your team is winning games.
Your dumbness is causing you to ignore the whole point, NASH DOESNT PLAY DEFENSE. Nash might be a better shooter, but Kidd is a better all-around player, even at age 34, because he plays BOTH ENDS of the court. Nobody denied he was great on offense (despite playing in a stat-inflating system), but it's the lack of DEFENSE that's keeping him back from being anywhere close to the greatest...Get it yet? ::)
this is the dumbest shit Ive ever heard. Was Magic Johnson EVER a good defensive player? Did he ever make the all defensive team? Fuck no. Dont give me that bullshit. Dirk isnt the best defender either, but I sure wouldnt be suprised if he won MVP. Face it man, your just the biggest dickrider and all you can do is hate on any player who is a non-laker. Just give it up already, I dont think anyone really takes your opinion serious. Everyone knows your going to win the nutrider of the year at the 2006 dubcc awards.
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Wait, I finally figured it out...It must have been "the system" that made Magic so good...He was playing with Kareem and James Worthy, shit...he wasnt even the best player on his team!
douchebag
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all you guys who act like Nash aint all that, you need to name me one PG in the league (beside J Kidd) who would be doing what Nash is doing, has done....There is no one. No other PG can make those kind of sneaky passes that Nash makes for all his teamates to get those easy buckets....Amare and Marion are spoonfed at least half of there points every game....Its wack wehn NIK sits here and says its all about the system, that fn bullshit....Nash IS the system. If J Kidd was in Pheonix he might put up those kind of numbers, and If he won MVP, I would give him his props, no problem....Nash is a better shooter and offensive player than Kidd tho. 22 and 12 is pretty sick numbers, and even better when you are the sole reason why your team is winning games.
Your dumbness is causing you to ignore the whole point, NASH DOESNT PLAY DEFENSE. Nash might be a better shooter, but Kidd is a better all-around player, even at age 34, because he plays BOTH ENDS of the court. Nobody denied he was great on offense (despite playing in a stat-inflating system), but it's the lack of DEFENSE that's keeping him back from being anywhere close to the greatest...Get it yet? ::)
this is the dumbest shit Ive ever heard. Was Magic Johnson EVER a good defensive player? Did he ever make the all defensive team? Fuck no. Dont give me that bullshit. Dirk isnt the best defender either, but I sure wouldnt be suprised if he won MVP. Face it man, your just the biggest dickrider and all you can do is hate on any player who is a non-laker. Just give it up already, I dont think anyone really takes your opinion serious. Everyone knows your going to win the nutrider of the year at the 2006 dubcc awards.
lmao! +1 plant
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all you guys who act like Nash aint all that, you need to name me one PG in the league (beside J Kidd) who would be doing what Nash is doing, has done....There is no one. No other PG can make those kind of sneaky passes that Nash makes for all his teamates to get those easy buckets....Amare and Marion are spoonfed at least half of there points every game....Its wack wehn NIK sits here and says its all about the system, that fn bullshit....Nash IS the system. If J Kidd was in Pheonix he might put up those kind of numbers, and If he won MVP, I would give him his props, no problem....Nash is a better shooter and offensive player than Kidd tho. 22 and 12 is pretty sick numbers, and even better when you are the sole reason why your team is winning games.
Oh Jesus!! This is getting personal, i'm starting to get tired of this discussion. You both grow up: we're in a public forum, not on the phone! Man i already told you WHY it's all about the system. I wrote you stats, not impressions. It's the (let's call it with the right name) "Mike D'Antoni's system" (i know him cause he played/coached here in Italy for half of his life) where everybody gotta run to give the PG an easy option to make a pass or a shot. Mike was like Nash, as a player. The same type of player. Actually a better defender, but we're talking about points and assists here. That said, i personally wrote Nash is STILL probably the best PG in the league, or a top3 selection for sure. So i'm not saying he sucks. I'm just saying 50% of the reason why he's averaging those numbers is because of his skills, and 50% because of "Mike's system". He's not Stock, no Magic, no Kidd. Matter of fact he had a good but not impressing career before Mike (D'Antoni). But he's the perfect player in the perfect place, and yes, he's fundamental to his team. But Jesus, y'all are acting like if he's really the best player in the league!!! Nik is right: he's not even the best player in his team! He's a great PG for Phoenix, and he led the team to good records and shit.
Kobe is different. Kobe is BY FAR the best SG AND player of the league. Who already won 3 titles, and who's trying to prove he can do it again without Shaq. In 10 years people will talk about Kobe, not about Nash. Nash will be forgotten as soon as he'll retire, cause he ain't in the group of the best PG ever. No way. Like i said he's no Stock, no Thomas, no Magic, no Kidd, no.. (big list). Kobe, on the other hand, is being compared to Jordan since his first day in the League, and even if he's still not on his level, after he'll retire people will start to compare young players to him AND Jordan. Cause he's one of the best SG ever. That's the big deal. That a player like Kobe will probably get no MVP trophies in his career, while a player like Nash can win 3 in a row. He's not bad. He's amazing. But.... But Dallas proved you can have a great/wonderful season without him too.
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Wait, I finally figured it out...It must have been "the system" that made Magic so good...He was playing with Kareem and James Worthy, shit...he wasnt even the best player on his team!
douchebag
I know you're joking. But i'll still give you a -1 for disrespecting a true legend like Magic to prove a (personal opinion: wrong) point.
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^Don't act like a dick. It doesn't suit you.
LOL didn't you see the :P smile?
Of course I did, that's why I said what I said. You were being a dick. But you're usually such an unconfronting, understanding, self-conscious nice guy. So I told you that being a dick doesn't suit your image, so you should just get rid of that dick-being-behaviour for your own good. I was just trying to give advice.
Ok. Let me try to add something more interesting to the discussion. Let me try. Let me explain you a pair of things about Nash's stats. It's math. The Suns are a 112.1 points per game (best in the League, obviously) team. Well.. to average almost 12 assists there shouldn't be that impressive, since he's doing it from 3 years in a row. He averaged 5.8 assists per game before he returned back to Phoenix 3 years ago, and all of a sudden he's starting to average 11+. Isn't it suspicious to you? They have 3 players in the top 30 of the League in assists (the other two are Barbosa and Diaw, not exactly Magic & Thomas) and they average an unreal 26.44 assists per game (best in the League, obviously). Yes, he's dishing the ball very well, but Phoenix system helps. He's averaging 11.7 assists out of 26.44 total assists of his team. It's the 44.2% of the team. Chris Paul, since i named him in a previous post, is averaging 8.9 assists out of 16.8 of his team. Which means he's making almost 53% of the assists of his team. That's more impressive to me. And we can do the same funny game about points. Nash is making 21 points out of 112.1 (18.7%) while Chris Paul is making 18.2 points out of 91.5 (19.9%). See? Math is funny sometimes. Who clowned me about Paul being more MVP (most valuable player) than Nash?
I did and i'll clown you again. Throw all these numbers in my face blah blah blah. IF you wanna go by numbers Efficiecny says Kevin Martin is the best 2 gaurd in the NBA and we know that isnt true. If you think Paul is as good as Nash right now, maybe you should start watching a little more. Give Paul a few more years..
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Was Magic Johnson EVER a good defensive player? Fuck no.
LMAO. Never post about basketball again. The end.
PS... Dirk plays defense. He might not be the best defender, but his defense has improved from when he stepped in the league, thus pushing him to an MVP-caliber player...If he still ONLY played one end like he did when he first arrived, no way he'd be MVP material. Still ROFLMFAO@comparing Magic's defense to Nash's... :-X
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Showtime Lakers were an EXCELLENT defensive team, PLANT's basketball-discussion pass has officially been revoked:
Magic may not be as active as Michael Cooper or Jordan (on the defensive end), but he is among the top ten in career steals and has led the league twice. Part of Magic's defense that hasn't been recognized much since he entered the league is his height. At 6'9", smaller guards can't easily lob passes into the post or shoot over him, forcing extra perimeter passing and repositioning of the post men. Also, Magic can play good defense against a lot of forwards in the league, which allows the Lakers to play three guards without suffering against taller teams. He also has a tremendous advantage on defensive rebounds, which has translated into plenty of fast breaks on the offensive end. Magic's height advantage sort of makes his defense 'defense by default', but that is mostly what Mark Eaton's defense is and he is the most dominant defensive force in the league.
http://www.rawbw.com/~deano/hoopla/lalp1.html
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all you guys who act like Nash aint all that, you need to name me one PG in the league (beside J Kidd) who would be doing what Nash is doing, has done....There is no one. No other PG can make those kind of sneaky passes that Nash makes for all his teamates to get those easy buckets....Amare and Marion are spoonfed at least half of there points every game....Its wack wehn NIK sits here and says its all about the system, that fn bullshit....Nash IS the system. If J Kidd was in Pheonix he might put up those kind of numbers, and If he won MVP, I would give him his props, no problem....Nash is a better shooter and offensive player than Kidd tho. 22 and 12 is pretty sick numbers, and even better when you are the sole reason why your team is winning games.
Oh Jesus!! This is getting personal, i'm starting to get tired of this discussion. You both grow up: we're in a public forum, not on the phone! Man i already told you WHY it's all about the system. I wrote you stats, not impressions. It's the (let's call it with the right name) "Mike D'Antoni's system" (i know him cause he played/coached here in Italy for half of his life) where everybody gotta run to give the PG an easy option to make a pass or a shot. Mike was like Nash, as a player. The same type of player. Actually a better defender, but we're talking about points and assists here. That said, i personally wrote Nash is STILL probably the best PG in the league, or a top3 selection for sure. So i'm not saying he sucks. I'm just saying 50% of the reason why he's averaging those numbers is because of his skills, and 50% because of "Mike's system". He's not Stock, no Magic, no Kidd. Matter of fact he had a good but not impressing career before Mike (D'Antoni). But he's the perfect player in the perfect place, and yes, he's fundamental to his team. But Jesus, y'all are acting like if he's really the best player in the league!!! Nik is right: he's not even the best player in his team! He's a great PG for Phoenix, and he led the team to good records and shit.
Kobe is different. Kobe is BY FAR the best SG AND player of the league. Who already won 3 titles, and who's trying to prove he can do it again without Shaq. In 10 years people will talk about Kobe, not about Nash. Nash will be forgotten as soon as he'll retire, cause he ain't in the group of the best PG ever. No way. Like i said he's no Stock, no Thomas, no Magic, no Kidd, no.. (big list). Kobe, on the other hand, is being compared to Jordan since his first day in the League, and even if he's still not on his level, after he'll retire people will start to compare young players to him AND Jordan. Cause he's one of the best SG ever. That's the big deal. That a player like Kobe will probably get no MVP trophies in his career, while a player like Nash can win 3 in a row. He's not bad. He's amazing. But.... But Dallas proved you can have a great/wonderful season without him too.
Dude, don't everrrrrr take PLANT seriously again in basketball discussion, he compared Magic Johnson's defense to Steve Nash's :puke:...That just goes to show you where he's placed on the basketball knowledge chart, and it's not too high now, is it? He'll never understand what you're saying, cuz he's Canadian and has a hard-on for Nash that will never go away...PeACe
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^Don't act like a dick. It doesn't suit you.
LOL didn't you see the :P smile?
Of course I did, that's why I said what I said. You were being a dick. But you're usually such an unconfronting, understanding, self-conscious nice guy. So I told you that being a dick doesn't suit your image, so you should just get rid of that dick-being-behaviour for your own good. I was just trying to give advice.
Ok. Let me try to add something more interesting to the discussion. Let me try. Let me explain you a pair of things about Nash's stats. It's math. The Suns are a 112.1 points per game (best in the League, obviously) team. Well.. to average almost 12 assists there shouldn't be that impressive, since he's doing it from 3 years in a row. He averaged 5.8 assists per game before he returned back to Phoenix 3 years ago, and all of a sudden he's starting to average 11+. Isn't it suspicious to you? They have 3 players in the top 30 of the League in assists (the other two are Barbosa and Diaw, not exactly Magic & Thomas) and they average an unreal 26.44 assists per game (best in the League, obviously). Yes, he's dishing the ball very well, but Phoenix system helps. He's averaging 11.7 assists out of 26.44 total assists of his team. It's the 44.2% of the team. Chris Paul, since i named him in a previous post, is averaging 8.9 assists out of 16.8 of his team. Which means he's making almost 53% of the assists of his team. That's more impressive to me. And we can do the same funny game about points. Nash is making 21 points out of 112.1 (18.7%) while Chris Paul is making 18.2 points out of 91.5 (19.9%). See? Math is funny sometimes. Who clowned me about Paul being more MVP (most valuable player) than Nash?
I did and i'll clown you again. Throw all these numbers in my face blah blah blah. IF you wanna go by numbers Efficiecny says Kevin Martin is the best 2 gaurd in the NBA and we know that isnt true. If you think Paul is as good as Nash right now, maybe you should start watching a little more. Give Paul a few more years..
Speaking of "watching more", you thought Kenyon Martin, Keith Van Horn, and Kerry Kittles were still on the Nets...LOL.
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^Don't act like a dick. It doesn't suit you.
LOL didn't you see the :P smile?
Of course I did, that's why I said what I said. You were being a dick. But you're usually such an unconfronting, understanding, self-conscious nice guy. So I told you that being a dick doesn't suit your image, so you should just get rid of that dick-being-behaviour for your own good. I was just trying to give advice.
Ok. Let me try to add something more interesting to the discussion. Let me try. Let me explain you a pair of things about Nash's stats. It's math. The Suns are a 112.1 points per game (best in the League, obviously) team. Well.. to average almost 12 assists there shouldn't be that impressive, since he's doing it from 3 years in a row. He averaged 5.8 assists per game before he returned back to Phoenix 3 years ago, and all of a sudden he's starting to average 11+. Isn't it suspicious to you? They have 3 players in the top 30 of the League in assists (the other two are Barbosa and Diaw, not exactly Magic & Thomas) and they average an unreal 26.44 assists per game (best in the League, obviously). Yes, he's dishing the ball very well, but Phoenix system helps. He's averaging 11.7 assists out of 26.44 total assists of his team. It's the 44.2% of the team. Chris Paul, since i named him in a previous post, is averaging 8.9 assists out of 16.8 of his team. Which means he's making almost 53% of the assists of his team. That's more impressive to me. And we can do the same funny game about points. Nash is making 21 points out of 112.1 (18.7%) while Chris Paul is making 18.2 points out of 91.5 (19.9%). See? Math is funny sometimes. Who clowned me about Paul being more MVP (most valuable player) than Nash?
I did and i'll clown you again. Throw all these numbers in my face blah blah blah. IF you wanna go by numbers Efficiecny says Kevin Martin is the best 2 gaurd in the NBA and we know that isnt true. If you think Paul is as good as Nash right now, maybe you should start watching a little more. Give Paul a few more years..
Speaking of "watching more", you thought Kenyon Martin, Keith Van Horn, and Kerry Kittles were still on the Nets...LOL.
alright NIK, i told you i was just playing around with it..You dont know me if you think i think that 8)
Trust me i have always thought KMART was overrated, and people tried to act like hed put the nuggets over the top..LOL!
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^Don't act like a dick. It doesn't suit you.
LOL didn't you see the :P smile?
Of course I did, that's why I said what I said. You were being a dick. But you're usually such an unconfronting, understanding, self-conscious nice guy. So I told you that being a dick doesn't suit your image, so you should just get rid of that dick-being-behaviour for your own good. I was just trying to give advice.
Ok. Let me try to add something more interesting to the discussion. Let me try. Let me explain you a pair of things about Nash's stats. It's math. The Suns are a 112.1 points per game (best in the League, obviously) team. Well.. to average almost 12 assists there shouldn't be that impressive, since he's doing it from 3 years in a row. He averaged 5.8 assists per game before he returned back to Phoenix 3 years ago, and all of a sudden he's starting to average 11+. Isn't it suspicious to you? They have 3 players in the top 30 of the League in assists (the other two are Barbosa and Diaw, not exactly Magic & Thomas) and they average an unreal 26.44 assists per game (best in the League, obviously). Yes, he's dishing the ball very well, but Phoenix system helps. He's averaging 11.7 assists out of 26.44 total assists of his team. It's the 44.2% of the team. Chris Paul, since i named him in a previous post, is averaging 8.9 assists out of 16.8 of his team. Which means he's making almost 53% of the assists of his team. That's more impressive to me. And we can do the same funny game about points. Nash is making 21 points out of 112.1 (18.7%) while Chris Paul is making 18.2 points out of 91.5 (19.9%). See? Math is funny sometimes. Who clowned me about Paul being more MVP (most valuable player) than Nash?
I did and i'll clown you again. Throw all these numbers in my face blah blah blah. IF you wanna go by numbers Efficiecny says Kevin Martin is the best 2 gaurd in the NBA and we know that isnt true. If you think Paul is as good as Nash right now, maybe you should start watching a little more. Give Paul a few more years..
Why you want me to repeat the same thing over and over again? I already replied to you 20-25 posts ago. I'll just re-quote myself.
Bad english. No, i'm not saying Paul has done more than Nash in his career or that he's a better PG. Obviously he's not. I'm saying i don't see a reason to give a trophy to the Most Valuable player, since for example Paul is very important for the Hornets, and without him the Hornets are basically a lottery team. So what's the point selecting an MVP? MVP for which team? And why the Suns and not the Bulls, or the Kings, or the Hornets. Artest is fundamental for the Kings. Without him the Kings are a lottery team. With him they are a playoff team. So why Nash and not Artest? I simply don't see a reason to give it to the "M.V.P.". I'd rater give a trophy to the best player in the league (i mean the one who has had the best season). But the "M.V.P." thing is stupid. Wade (and his friends in black and white) is as important for his team than Nash. It's pointless to say Nash is more important for his own team. Biased. Stupid. Let's argue about who's the best player and about who's having a better season. That's more interesting to me.
Please add something interesting to the discussion and don't repeat always the same shit. It's boring.
P.S. You clowned nobody but yourself, boy. Grow up!
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^^guess i didnt read close enough ;D
you got me doggy +1
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I was just trying to prove that stats can be read in different ways, man. You can see 21+12 and say "damn, MVP!!!". But you can also go a little bit deeper asking yourself "why".
Don't let the stats control your mind. You americans love them too much. It's just stats.
Like you said Martin ain't the best SG in the league.
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I was just trying to prove that stats can be read in different ways, man. You can see 21+12 and say "damn, MVP!!!". But you can also go a little bit deeper asking yourself "why".
Don't let the stats control your mind. You americans love them too much. It's just stats.
Like you said Martin ain't the best SG in the league.
i dont let stats control my mind, i just thought you said Paul was better then Nash which i would still disagree with, not cuz of stats, cuz ive seen em both play...But stats do matter, you cant say they dont, however stats dont tell the whole story...
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They are important. But if you take them really "so" seriously then analize them deeper, like i did. If you're gonna give the MVP trophy to the most important player for his team judging only the stats of the top players then judge them correctly, like i did. Stats says that Paul makes more assists in percentage for NO than Nash does for the Suns (i mean total assists/player assists), and he does more points too. So to say Nash is more decisive for the Suns than Paul is for the Hornets is statistically wrong. Get it? SO..... what i'm saying is that:
1) the MVP trophy itself is bullshit. They gave it to Nash but they could have given it to at least 2-3 other players.
2) the only one i take seriously is the NBA Finals one, cause you don't choose a team, but a player from the winning team.
2) stats don't tell 100% the truth.
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They are important. But if you take them really "so" seriously then analize them deeper, like i did. If you're gonna give the MVP trophy to the most important player for his team judging only the stats of the top players then judge them correctly, like i did. Stats says that Paul makes more assists in percentage for NO than Nash does for the Suns (i mean total assists/player assists), and he does more points too. So to say Nash is more decisive for the Suns than Paul is for the Hornets is statistically wrong. Get it? SO..... what i'm saying is that:
1) the MVP trophy itself is bullshit. They gave it to Nash but they could have given it to at least 2-3 other players.
2) the only one i take seriously is the NBA Finals one, cause you don't choose a team, but a player from the winning team.
2) stats don't tell 100% the truth.
you are right ;)
already said that!
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I'm glad Mosav and Antonio can debate in a logical way, I wish everyone was like that...7even has also impressed me with his maturity in this topic.
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this is for you NIK
http://www.nba.com/features/player_rankings_061212.html
at least Kobe is ahead of LeBron (for now), that oughta make ya happy
:-*
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this is for you NIK
http://www.nba.com/features/player_rankings_061212.html
at least Kobe is ahead of LeBron (for now), that oughta make ya happy
:-*
LOL...We already know the NBA has a boner for Nash, you're not saying anything.
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this is for you NIK
http://www.nba.com/features/player_rankings_061212.html
at least Kobe is ahead of LeBron (for now), that oughta make ya happy
:-*
LOL...We already know the NBA has a boner for Nash, you're not saying anything.
You say the same shit about D Wade. Its getting old, and tiring. Give props and respect where its due. Dont be a hater.
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this is for you NIK
http://www.nba.com/features/player_rankings_061212.html
at least Kobe is ahead of LeBron (for now), that oughta make ya happy
:-*
LOL...We already know the NBA has a boner for Nash, you're not saying anything.
You say the same shit about D Wade. Its getting old, and tiring. Give props and respect where its due. Dont be a hater.
It's true...LMAO. EVERYONE knows it besides you. I give props to Nash for being a great offensive point guard...
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its not like hes THAT bad of a defender.....Sure, J Kidd scored 38 on Nash in a double OT loss to Pheonix, but Nash had 42 on Kidd the same night. Hes averaging a steal a game, his defense is not terrible. The way he runs the suns and makes his teamates better makes up for any weakness (if any) on the defensive end.
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its not like hes THAT bad of a defender.....Sure, J Kidd scored 38 on Nash in a double OT loss to Pheonix, but Nash had 42 on Kidd the same night. Hes averaging a steal a game, his defense is not terrible.
You think if a point guard averages 1 steal a game that means they're not horrible on defense? LOLLLL! With the minutes he's getting and the pace Phoenix play the game at, he BETTER average at least 1 steal a game to even be let on the court. It's not that Nash is just bad at defense, it's that he's pretty much non-existant...Would you consider Bruce Bowen the MVP? Cuz he excels at the defensive end of the court and has pretty much been anchoring the Spurs' defense, though he doesn't have a real offensive game...But you CANT be an MVP playing one end of the court, whether it's offense or defense, and if you don't get that, then read it again...PeACe
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The way he runs the suns and makes his teamates better makes up for any weakness (if any) on the defensive end.
LMFAOOOOO. Please, stop! LOLLLLL :laugh: :laugh:
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I dont really see how he is a weak defender. You just keep using that point against him becuase Kobe is an all defensive team player. Thats really your only comeback to Nash being a legit MVP. Kobe's game isnt perfect, neither is anyones for that matter. Where was Kobe in the playoffs lastyear against Nash' Suns when it was all on the line? You remember that, dont you? I wouldnt want my MVP sitting there watching his team lose, doing NOTHING about it.
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I dont really see how he is a weak defender. You just keep using that point against him becuase Kobe is an all defensive team player. Thats really your only comeback to Nash being a legit MVP. Kobe's game isnt perfect, neither is anyones for that matter. Where was Kobe in the playoffs lastyear against Nash' Suns when it was all on the line? You remember that, dont you? I wouldnt want my MVP sitting there watching his team lose, doing NOTHING about it.
How do you not see Nash as a weak defender? Are you retarded or do you just not watch basketball? ANY POINT GUARD IN THE LEAGUE can just blow right by Nash at will, he's the worst defender I've ever watched play, he depends on the secondary defender pretty much every single time on defense...Please, dawg, honestly, I thought you knew a lot more than this about the game...Basketball is a team game, so if everybody is off (like the Lakers were in game 7 due to inexperience), then it is impossible for one player to take over and win 1-5, ESPECIALLY on the road...That's ALSO something else you shoulda' known...Lakers coulda' won that series with ONE rebound though, and THEN what would you have been saying about Nash? ::)
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Lakers coulda' won that series with ONE rebound though, and THEN what would you have been saying about Nash? ::)
coulda shoulda woulda...but they didnt
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I do agree w/ NIK about Nash's defense, Nash is a terrible defender.
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Nash IS a terrible defender... he can't stop the opposite point guard... take a look 4 example at each Suns-Spurs game, Nash is owned by T.P really bad
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I do agree w/ NIK about Nash's defense, Nash is a terrible defender.
It's not really debatable to the average basketball fan, I've never seen anyone who didn't think Nash's defense was atrocious until PLANT...I honestly think he's just one of those dudes who likes the individual players, but doesn't understand much about the game...
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It's not really debatable
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I do agree w/ NIK about Nash's defense, Nash is a terrible defender.
It's not really debatable to the average basketball fan, I've never seen anyone who didn't think Nash's defense was atrocious until PLANT...I honestly think he's just one of those dudes who likes the individual players, but doesn't understand much about the game...
LOL ur a joke man....I could go on and on about how I think your one of those dudes who just dickrides and nutrides even more than he dickrides....But Ive already said to much, so Ill stop. I prolly know more about the game than you, Ive played ball all my life, started when I was four and played all the way thru highschool and still play once a week now. So dont sit here and tell me I dont know shit about ball. Ur trying to use the same little crappy argument in every post about how U dont think Nash is deserving of MVP....Well I do, so fuck off. Like I said in my original post in this thread, its pointless to discuss with you about anything becuase you will never see where anyone else is coming from becuase you are blinded. Ive never really seen you agree w anyone about nothing, you just claim u are mr know it all and think everyone else doesnt know shit.....Well I dont even know why I got into this discussion becuase it was a huge waste of time. Ur still doing the same shit and going in circles. Just respect my opinion for once, try that. Its not really a bad thing that Id rather have the two time MVP on my team than Kobe....Its just what I prefer. Obviously your gona go with Kobe, Im not asking you to bow down to SN, just respect my opinion that hesa a legit MVP. And you never have. So whatever, just keep on Kobinating and Ill continue to think Nash Is a really good player who is worthy of MVP status. end of the day, nothings changed.
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I do agree w/ NIK about Nash's defense, Nash is a terrible defender.
It's not really debatable to the average basketball fan, I've never seen anyone who didn't think Nash's defense was atrocious until PLANT...I honestly think he's just one of those dudes who likes the individual players, but doesn't understand much about the game...
LOL ur a joke man....I could go on and on about how I think your one of those dudes who just dickrides and nutrides even more than he dickrides....But Ive already said to much, so Ill stop. I prolly know more about the game than you, Ive played ball all my life, started when I was four and played all the way thru highschool and still play once a week now. So dont sit here and tell me I dont know shit about ball. Ur trying to use the same little crappy argument in every post about how U dont think Nash is deserving of MVP....Well I do, so fuck off. Like I said in my original post in this thread, its pointless to discuss with you about anything becuase you will never see where anyone else is coming from becuase you are blinded. Ive never really seen you agree w anyone about nothing, you just claim u are mr know it all and think everyone else doesnt know shit.....Well I dont even know why I got into this discussion becuase it was a huge waste of time. Ur still doing the same shit and going in circles. Just respect my opinion for once, try that. Its not really a bad thing that Id rather have the two time MVP on my team than Kobe....Its just what I prefer. Obviously your gona go with Kobe, Im not asking you to bow down to SN, just respect my opinion that hesa a legit MVP. And you never have. So whatever, just keep on Kobinating and Ill continue to think Nash Is a really good player who is worthy of MVP status. end of the day, nothings changed.
Damn, I musta really hit home there...I don't care if it's your opinion, good for you. MY OPINION is that Nash ISN'T deserving of the MVP, and that Kobe is lightyears ahead of him as an NBA player. Can YOU respect that? I think not, because the media (and I can't begin to imagine how it is in Canada) has you brainwashed about Nash, and even about Kobe. Look at Boris Diaw, he was never a great player, he looked great as a key piece in the Suns' offense though. now Amare is back and Diaw is regarded as less than average. That's what everyone is trying to tell you here. Yes, Nash is a great offensive weapon. Yes, he's a top player. No, he's not an all-time great. No, he's not back-to-back MVP material. Put him on Dallas, he's a second option. Put him on the Lakers, he's a second option. Put him on Cleveland, Miami, Denver, fuck, almost any team, and he's a SECOND OPTION. I'm sorry man, but Mike D'Antonio's system and the media has you fooled...I'll let your opinion be, but that's MY OPINION (as well as MANY MANY basketball heads), and you gotta respect it as well...PeACe
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I do agree w/ NIK about Nash's defense, Nash is a terrible defender.
It's not really debatable to the average basketball fan, I've never seen anyone who didn't think Nash's defense was atrocious until PLANT...I honestly think he's just one of those dudes who likes the individual players, but doesn't understand much about the game...
If Nash wasnt from Canada, PLANT would have stopped arguing along time ago.. I know it, you know it, he knows it, and Danny Tanner even knows it