West Coast Connection Forum
DUBCC - Tha Connection => West Coast Classics => Topic started by: The Black Bossalini on February 11, 2008, 02:12:13 AM
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its all got to do wit beats, think about it, obv the 90s was the best for hip hop & in the west. dr dre productions wer off the hook, daz was the best producr i would say in 96/97. u expect dre to produce classics for whoevr but now ther nutn compard 2 bak then, daz aint producn that much and is nutn compard 2 wat he done bak then too. the same can be said about dj pooh, cold187, qd3 who dont produce no more, johhny j who produces for an austrilian rapr, not american anymor, mike mosley was tight too but not anymor, i cant think of any1 else at the moment.
ther all tryn difrnt things & its not workn, fans kno wat they wana hear & they wana hear beats that they'l remembr & that can be considered classics. new producrs are comn up but ther not as gd as the guys that i hav mentiond above wen they startd off.
wat u think? u think all these producrs should go bak 2 old ways?
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only pac could rip johnny j man.
scott storch can make some classic wc bangers.
where quik at?
fred wreck can definitely bang some hot shit.
meech, lt hutton, battlecat, j-ro, jelly roll, rick rock can definitely bring some heat.
cant wait to hear the next shit from mr porter, teek the beatsmith and dee underdue - these niggaz killed gba.
>> bottom line, i dont think any producer will ever be able to recapture the classic shit from 92-98, that was a unique era man, but the catz out now definitely have the potential to bring their own heat and create a new generation of classics.
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In a way I agree with you. What makes Dre so great particularly with the artists that he has broken in the past is the fact that he pulled double duty of being both producer and A&R. He actually took the time to develop and fine tune these artists to fit his productions.
What the new generation of West Coast emcees seem to lack is proper artist development. Don't get me wrong, I've heard a song or two from a lot of dope up-and-coming rappers on the left side, but they're lacking something. I hear the potential, but it just lacks that wholeness, whether in the overall song itself, the production, the voice, charisma, etc. but it isn't hitting me head on like the first time I heard Nas, Snoop, Jay-Z or Eminem over a dope Dre or Premier beat.
A lot of these new artists aren't being properly educated and challenged to exceed what they're already capable of. No one is pushing rappers to better themselves, skillwise; songwriting, hook writing, a good ear for picking beats to fit the emotion and concept of a song, etc. I mean new rappers are already full of themselves when they first start out, and that's part of the problem because they're only hearing themselves without any constructive criticism and coaching. This is where good A&R comes in. Part of their job is to develop and better what the artist already brings to the table. A good A&R can marry the skills between a certain rapper with a certain producer to help break them through. A great producer can make a mediocre rapper a great rapper if properly developed. It's one thing being a dope rapper with hot lines here and there. It's quite another being a dope rapper with hot lines consistently for a whole album. Artist development takes time. Some artists will peak sooner than others, but regardless everyone needs to put in work to get anything out of it.
Right now part of the problem is that there are too many dope artists with potential and not enough dope A&R's on the West. Another thing too is that the South and Midwest are popping off like crazy, so the $$ for artist development resources reside in those areas at the moment, which is why they're not checking for West or East artists at the moment. It's a cycle though, because until they deplete and kill off their resources in those respective regions when it ceases to make profit like it used to, someone will pick up and move shop to the East & West to scoop up the hotbed of hungry talent just waiting for their chance to pop off.
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who is the rapper Johnny J produces for now????
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only pac could rip johnny j man.
scott storch can make some classic wc bangers.
where quik at?
fred wreck can definitely bang some hot shit.
meech, lt hutton, battlecat, j-ro, jelly roll, rick rock can definitely bring some heat.
cant wait to hear the next shit from mr porter, teek the beatsmith and dee underdue - these niggaz killed gba.
>> bottom line, i dont think any producer will ever be able to recapture the classic shit from 92-98, that was a unique era man, but the catz out now definitely have the potential to bring their own heat and create a new generation of classics.
those producrs stil got it but they aint big as dre or daz. scot storch is big and so is quik, they both stil got it. daz needs 2 b in the studio for a long time & try 2 go bak 2 old ways, this is wer he was best at.
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maybe modern day music isnt good for you bosssalini, in the 90s producers were sample based
this topics been discussed a grip.. its not the producers, its not the artists its the powers that be at the top
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Daz needs to get his mixing game straight, back at Death Row every track he produced was heat, and then even after he left on his first 2 albums even though alot of those tracks were recorded while he was still at Death Row were also great productions. He then hooked up with Mike Dean and his sound even went up a notch but after that around say 2003 he started being very inconsistent. I know he was using this dude Ivan Johnson as a coproducer alot lately and they came out with some dope music but again very inconsistent. His best production of recent times was on Kurupts "Same Day Different Shit" in 2006.
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its fell off because people dont buy the music! west coast has got a strong fanbase.. but there broke
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I dnt think they should all go back to theyre old way's..
that music had it's time and era.. it has to evolve..
and for the reason.. why the west is down.. is do to the fact.. that right now people are into simple dance music.. like that soulja boy.. and shit.. which sux but thats life..
although the west has the most talented producers.. it's just we need somethin new..
and i see the west on an upswing right now..
i honestly view the west on a come back..
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lol@this topic again,and again muthafuccas name'n the same people, like all we had was gangsta shit and g-funk hahaha yall lame as fucc yell
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I dnt think they should all go back to theyre old way's..
that music had it's time and era.. it has to evolve..
and for the reason.. why the west is down.. is do to the fact.. that right now people are into simple dance music.. like that soulja boy.. and shit.. which sux but thats life..
although the west has the most talented producers.. it's just we need somethin new..
and i see the west on an upswing right now..
i honestly view the west on a come back..
props
everybody knows the west has great producers let's wait till some of these albums drop and then see how this year goes
that soulja boy and all that is just music for the moment he will be gone in a few years anybody remember Chingy?
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anybody remember skee-lo, anybody remember la nash? anybody remember paper boy?, stop acting like everything we made out here last long as well,hell how much props do west coast fans show the la dream team? do yall even know who romeo and rhyme was? suga and spice? alot of muthafuccas out here have no history? and when i named them cats i talking bout from a world wide view,just like yall doing with these artist now yell
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I dnt think they should all go back to theyre old way's..
that music had it's time and era.. it has to evolve..
and for the reason.. why the west is down.. is do to the fact.. that right now people are into simple dance music.. like that soulja boy.. and shit.. which sux but thats life..
although the west has the most talented producers.. it's just we need somethin new..
and i see the west on an upswing right now..
i honestly view the west on a come back..
props
everybody knows the west has great producers let's wait till some of these albums drop and then see how this year goes
that soulja boy and all that is just music for the moment he will be gone in a few years anybody remember Chingy?
lmao
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yea.. couple years ago he did pullin me back with tyrese huge record.. he worked with dj quik too... hes good at makin songs for ladies and the club he'll be back
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2 thoughts:
1) West coast music didn't really fall off, it just stopped being a dominant force in the mainstream and on radio/video. 1992-1998 is a good range of that classic era, probably peaking around 1995-96 like the other poster said. 1998 had albums like Streetz Iz A Mutha and Rhythm-al-ism that maintained the classic sound. After that came Chronic 2001, which still fit in the west coast category but was obviously trying to change the soundscape. It had traditional west coat synth/bass/funk elements but only in limited amounts, and shifted towards a more symphonic-type sound.
2) The change in the way tradiional west coast rap sounded was a combination of different things: 2Pac's death, downfall of Death Row, rise in mainstream popularity of Southern rap, west coast artists/producers trying to cash in on current trends (i.e. dirty south, bling era), the list goes on and on.
The bottom line is, the west coast sound doesn't make money anymore. That's why it's not what it used to be. Making something danceable for the clubs = radio play = record sales = ITunes sales = profit. 10 years ago, Snoop would've been laughed at for releasing something like Sexual Eruption, but today its one of his biggest hits in years. The blame doesn't fall on the artist, it falls on the younger listeners and their taste in music. Basically, their taste in music sucks.
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The small glimmer of hope is if artists would follow Ice Cube's lead he's taking with his upcoming "Raw Footage" album. He's said in interviews that he's using this album to make music the way he wants, with no record company exec telling him he needs a club-ready single or that he needs to get a hot-artist-of-the-moment to guest on a song, cause he's doing it independently with his own money and is already filthy rich as it is. There's no guarantee that Raw Footage is going to be a throwback to the west coast sound, but there's a better chance you'll hear an album full of songs that sound like the teaser single "Gangster Rap Made Me Do It".
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its fell off because people dont buy the music! west coast has got a strong fanbase.. but there broke
It's not that people are broke it's that they're cheap as hell. This board is a PRIME example of that.
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its fell off because people dont buy the music! west coast has got a strong fanbase.. but there broke
u cant say that, people download/bootleg everywhere. But the thing with south is they support each other they
buy each others records, which makes BET, MTV and all those mufuckas play the shit cuz they see that thats what people want,
thats what ppl wanna hear. Everybody know Wayne a fake gangster and all that cuz he was signed when he was a youngin' and all that, but no one cares about it, they all support him, buy his albums, the kids vote for him..and the same thing goes for T.I., Soulja Boy, Luda etc etc. Ova here its "u fake, u aint gangsta...u aint gangsta so im not goin to buy your MUSIC, im with this label so im not fuckin wit u" and bullshit like dat. All these lil ass punk beefs and shit...LMAO look at the westcoast. How many cats actually fuck with each other (n/h)? Old cats dont fuck the new cats, this cat dont fuck with that cat but his homie fuck with both of em or sum shit like dat. Niggas just can't get along on the west cuz everybody wanna judje or speak about the next man, and tell ppl how hard they are and bla bla.
Wheneva a new cat blows up on the west, rappers here dont think "thats wazup maybe we can do a track with dude and kick it for the westcoast"..naw fuck that they rather make up 2 diss songs about how that cat aint this aint that, aint the right person to be on top, aint reppin
the streets right or whateva, n im not talkin about Game or anything if u ppl think that, but ive seen it more than once to know.
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2 thoughts:
1) West coast music didn't really fall off, it just stopped being a dominant force in the mainstream and on radio/video. 1992-1998 is a good range of that classic era, probably peaking around 1995-96 like the other poster said. 1998 had albums like Streetz Iz A Mutha and Rhythm-al-ism that maintained the classic sound. After that came Chronic 2001, which still fit in the west coast category but was obviously trying to change the soundscape. It had traditional west coat synth/bass/funk elements but only in limited amounts, and shifted towards a more symphonic-type sound.
2) The change in the way tradiional west coast rap sounded was a combination of different things: 2Pac's death, downfall of Death Row, rise in mainstream popularity of Southern rap, west coast artists/producers trying to cash in on current trends (i.e. dirty south, bling era), the list goes on and on.
The bottom line is, the west coast sound doesn't make money anymore. That's why it's not what it used to be. Making something danceable for the clubs = radio play = record sales = ITunes sales = profit. 10 years ago, Snoop would've been laughed at for releasing something like Sexual Eruption, but today its one of his biggest hits in years. The blame doesn't fall on the artist, it falls on the younger listeners and their taste in music. Basically, their taste in music sucks.
Agreed and agreed. Good points. Point #1 is especially true.
And another thing that some may have forgotten: Around 1995-96, politicians trying to get elected (Bob Dole, Jack Kemp, Joe Lieberman, William Bennett, etc). and other folks like C. Delores Tucker started the whole "gangsta rap is evil, it's destroying our children, blah blah blah" bullshit movement. Even though gangsta rap was still selling very well around the end of 1996 and the start of 1997, Tupac and Biggie's deaths and the bad publicity that consequently ensued gave these politicians an "excuse" (so to speak) to do a "we-told-you-so" kind of routine. Because of this, I think that the major labels felt that West Coast rap (gangsta rap in particular) was a black eye on the industry, so they dissassociated themselves w/ it. The majors nowadays are thus probably afraid to put out anything too "real," because they don't want any controversy directed their way. Thus, the safer the subject matter, the more likely the majors will put it out, and the more dance-oriented stuff is an example.
So, to me, West Coast rap didn't really "die"--it was just deemphasized by the majors and the media. Some West Coast artists who had signed to major labels still came out, but many of them were not given much promotion or fanfare (RBL Posse's AN EYE FOR AN EYE, the Get Low projects that were distributed by Priority, etc) the way they might have been during the 1992-95 period. People didn't buy a lot of West Coast rap after 1997 (w/ few exceptions) because it wasn't being promoted or given any push. By 1997-98, Puff Daddy, DMX, Jay-Z, Southern rap (No Limit, Cash Money, etc). and stuff like that was being given the huge fanfare that West Coast rap used to receive, but didn't anymore. Thus, fans bought more East and South music and less West music, because that's all that they were aware of, in many cases. You could have the best project, but if it isn't promoted, people won't know that it's out there, and consequently, they won't buy it. Just my opinion, though.
PEACE!
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2 thoughts:
1) West coast music didn't really fall off, it just stopped being a dominant force in the mainstream and on radio/video. 1992-1998 is a good range of that classic era, probably peaking around 1995-96 like the other poster said. 1998 had albums like Streetz Iz A Mutha and Rhythm-al-ism that maintained the classic sound. After that came Chronic 2001, which still fit in the west coast category but was obviously trying to change the soundscape. It had traditional west coat synth/bass/funk elements but only in limited amounts, and shifted towards a more symphonic-type sound.
2) The change in the way tradiional west coast rap sounded was a combination of different things: 2Pac's death, downfall of Death Row, rise in mainstream popularity of Southern rap, west coast artists/producers trying to cash in on current trends (i.e. dirty south, bling era), the list goes on and on.
The bottom line is, the west coast sound doesn't make money anymore. That's why it's not what it used to be. Making something danceable for the clubs = radio play = record sales = ITunes sales = profit. 10 years ago, Snoop would've been laughed at for releasing something like Sexual Eruption, but today its one of his biggest hits in years. The blame doesn't fall on the artist, it falls on the younger listeners and their taste in music. Basically, their taste in music sucks.
Agreed and agreed. Good points. Point #1 is especially true.
And another thing that some may have forgotten: Around 1995-96, politicians trying to get elected (Bob Dole, Jack Kemp, Joe Lieberman, William Bennett, etc). and other folks like C. Delores Tucker started the whole "gangsta rap is evil, it's destroying our children, blah blah blah" bullshit movement. Even though gangsta rap was still selling very well around the end of 1996 and the start of 1997, Tupac and Biggie's deaths and the bad publicity that consequently ensued gave these politicians an "excuse" (so to speak) to do a "we-told-you-so" kind of routine. Because of this, I think that the major labels felt that West Coast rap (gangsta rap in particular) was a black eye on the industry, so they dissassociated themselves w/ it. The majors nowadays are thus probably afraid to put out anything too "real," because they don't want any controversy directed their way. Thus, the safer the subject matter, the more likely the majors will put it out, and the more dance-oriented stuff is an example.
So, to me, West Coast rap didn't really "die"--it was just deemphasized by the majors and the media. Some West Coast artists who had signed to major labels still came out, but many of them were not given much promotion or fanfare (RBL Posse's AN EYE FOR AN EYE, the Get Low projects that were distributed by Priority, etc) the way they might have been during the 1992-95 period. People didn't buy a lot of West Coast rap after 1997 (w/ few exceptions) because it wasn't being promoted or given any push. By 1997-98, Puff Daddy, DMX, Jay-Z, Southern rap (No Limit, Cash Money, etc). and stuff like that was being given the huge fanfare that West Coast rap used to receive, but didn't anymore. Thus, fans bought more East and South music and less West music, because that's all that they were aware of, in many cases. You could have the best project, but if it isn't promoted, people won't know that it's out there, and consequently, they won't buy it. Just my opinion, though.
PEACE!
Great point sav-man