West Coast Connection Forum
DUBCC - Tha Connection => Outbound Connection => Topic started by: King Tech Quadafi on September 04, 2002, 02:06:59 PM
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i know its old, but Takeover served Ether
i know how yall feel,
see i was like most of yall
i didnt particularly care for both Jay Z or Nas,
they both disappointed me, but i liked Nas laot more, i thought Jay Z was so commercialized
so based on this biased, i biged up ether and slept on Takeover, the people gave this battle to Nas cuz he more "lyrical" and cuz Jay Z was so arrogant,
but the fact is Takeover clowned Nas, Ether was just nonsense
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Um, no. And..........uh, NO.
Jay lost the beef, everyone knows that.
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yup yup, Takeover served Ether.
And Nas only won the Hot97 poll with 2% so they're basically equal.
And WCC is so Nas-affiliated that a poll here would be unfair.
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yup yup, Takeover served Ether.
And Nas only won the Hot97 poll with 2% so they're basically equal.
And WCC is so Nas-affiliated that a poll here would be unfair.
Actually, everywhere I go, everyone says Ether shits all over Takeover. Matter of fact, you're one of the VERY few cats Ive met that thinks Takeover is better, and not just on the internet, but in general.
Nas won the hot 97 poll, almost every hiphop fan agrees Ether is better, and almost every rapper in the industry says Nas won the beef. Id say its safe TO SAY that Ether is the better song, by a general consensus.
I happen to think so anyway, since Takeover doesnt have any lines that can fuck with the following:
"How many of Biggies rhymes are gonna come out your fat lips" <------------this is oh so true, Jay bites every Biggie line in sight.
"Rocafella died of aids/that was the end of his chapter/and thats the guy yall chose to name your company after?/put it together/I rock hoes/yall roc fellas" [lyrically slaughtering Jay here]
Plus, Jay lost brownie points when he said "if im not better than Big, im the closest one", and he also had the nerve to say only streets cats were feelin Pac and DMX, even though both of those artists have outsold Jay [especially Pac]. Then he lost more points when he was behind that whole Summer Jam incident when he tried to boycott Nas from performing Ether. What a little bitch.
Nas won, Jay Z lost..........pure and simple. Period.
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everyone always forgets but TAKEOVER only had 1 verse dissin nas, the whole song ether was about jigga,,,,and jayz destroyed nas wit one verse!
also takeover is a waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaayyyy better beat
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they were both weak.
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me n tech are always on the same page...ive been sayin that nas got served good n plenty by takeover...cmon i cant stand jayz and he had me busting up...the ether shit was ok...it only had a few good punches...takeover was jam packed full of punches and witty ass remarks....plus the beat was sampled from one of the greatest rock songs preformed by one of the greatest rock bands period....5 to 1 baaaaaaaaaaby!!!!....the doors
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"Ether" was the better diss.
"Takeover" was the better song.
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I liked them both, but I think that Takeover was better.
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both 2 week overatted songs i didnt feel either one. i skip over both of them. Only fucked up thing is peeps this jay-z served prodigy but if peeps knew tha whole situation they would look at it differently. but thaT LIne was funny where he's like i got money stacks bigger than u
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Jay-Z vs. Nas
Stillmatic freestyle - 3.5
A little diss to Jay-Z. Very short, but very powerful. Nas openned up the battle after Jigga called him out, and this was the perfect way to open.
key punch:
"And bring it back up top, remove the fake king of New York
You show off, I count off when you sample my voice
I rule you, before, you used to rap like the FU-SHNICKENS
NAS designed your BLUEPRINT, who you kidding?"
"Is he H TO THE IZZO, M TO THE IZZO?
For shizzle you phony, the rapping version of SISQO"
Takeover - 4.5
A perfect responds to Stillmatic, as the orginal Takeover was a call out to Nas, this time Jay-Z baited Nas into a very hard diss that showed New York who's king. Honestly, I never heard a diss and thought a career was ended, until this one. Every punch was laided on top of another, set to end Nas.
key punches:
"Fell from top ten to not mentioned at all
to your bodyguard's "Oochie Wally" verse better than yours
Matter fact you had the worst flow on the whole fuckin song
but I know - the sun don't shine, then son don't shine"
"So yeah I sampled your voice, you was usin it wrong
You made it a hot line, I made it a hot song"
"Four albums in ten years nigga? I can divide
That's one every let's say two, two of them shits was due
One was - NAHHH, the other was "Illmatic"
That's a one hot album every ten year average"
Ether - 4.5
The only way to comeback. Nas was battling for his career, and he knew it. Set up a song, as oppose to a verse, as everyone knew it would come to that. From the second verse on, Nas would explode onto Jay-Z very forcefully, almost perfectly. His fantasy though is a minus, but hip-hop is about wit, not much facts.
key punches:
"This for dolo and his manuscript just sound stupid
When KRS already made an album called "Blueprint"
First, Biggie's ya man, then you got the nerve to say that you better than Big
Dick suckin lips, whyn't you let the late, great veteran live"
"You seem to be only concerned with dissin women
Were you abused as a child, scared to smile, they called you ugly?
Well life is harsh, hug me, don't reject me
or make records to disrespect me, blatant or indirectly""
You a fan, a phony, a fake, a pussy, a Stan
I still whip your ass, you thirty-six in a karate class
You Tae-bo hoe"
"Foxy got you hot 'cause you kept your face in her puss
What you think, you gettin girls now 'cause of your looks?
Ne-gro please"
"You a dick-ridin faggot, you love the attention
Queens niggas run you niggas, ask Russell Simmons"
Super Ugly - 2
The reason why Jay-Z lost what was a great battle. Jay-Z had a very coky, half hearted responds to Ether, and suffered dearly. No one's to blame but Jay-Z, as if Jigga was half the M.C. he claims, then he would have been able to have a better comeback.
key punches:
"Niggas will tie you up on the colliseum roof
And open beer bottles off the boy chipped tooth, look here"
"Listen, I'm the J, the A to the fuck this broad
Nigga never sold aspirin how you Escobar"
"And since you infatuated with sayin that gay shit
Yes you was kissin my dick when you was kissin that bitch"
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Nas won the war.
Stillmatic (my fav of the beef) & Ether were dope.
Takeover was good but only one verse (which did heavy damage) and Superugly sucked.
If there is a tie-breaker, take their albums at the time, Stillmatic is better than The Blueprint.
P.S. Prodigy verse on Takeover sucked, Jay had nothing to say. He is short and his album didn't sell as much. That's it. :D
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Takeover had a better beat, but I definitely think that Ether was better lyrically (even though some of it was unrealistic).
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I think Ether and Takeover were close... as seen above.
The tie breaker was Stillmatic vs. Super Ugly, which was no contest.
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Nar NAs won fair and square.
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Then we all agree that Takeover served Nas.
And Hellrazor: Jigga didn't try to stop Nas, DAME DASH did.
and that "Lil bitch" remark shows off your hate for Jigga, as compared to Nas, you taking sides even before the diss-war.
I got the a couple of Nas-albums, so I ain't judging before I hear the tracks.
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"Ether" was the better diss.
"Takeover" was the better song.
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jay's a nice lyricist, but he can't fuck with nas.
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"Ether" has and will always be considered the better diss song to me, it was more of a complete diss, Nas took very witty shots at Jay and they were also truthful. When Jay came back with "Super Ugly" it made him look like a fool, "Takeover" couldn't compare to "Ether", what the hell made him think "Super Ugly" would?? And with "Super Ugly" it also proved that Jay couldn't really make a proper diss song aimed only at Nas, "Takeover" didn't say all that much about Nas imo, and since SU was aimed specifically at Nas it really showed that as an MC Jay doesn't hold anything on Nas.
Also, I think the "Stillmatic" freestyle was a better and harder diss to Jay than "Takeover" was to Nas.
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they were both weak.
I kinda agree, they both had good parts, but dissapointed me. That line from Nas where he says the Roccafella stuff is unbelievable though, man, he clowned him.
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Ether had the better disses therefore it's the better diss song IMO
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nah Nas served him up... lol at Jay being all vague and then catching feelings when he gets dished... i dont see how "Ether" is nonsense compared to "Takeover"... there's a lot more known factual base to what Nas was saying than what Jigga was saying... Nas served him colder, Takeover was saved by its hot beat.
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Ether is way better imo
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On point TECH. and I hope some day these other cats will finally open their eyes, u see, Jay din't even need "super ugly" he knew that, so I think he simply put it out just to keep the battle going or something cause he obviouslly din't put much effort into it, since "takeoever" was so much superior to ether...while NAS was simply Playing with simplistic and almost childish remarks (lol, I thought he was gonna start talking about his momma at some point ;D) Jay was actually battling wit some heavy artillery punches filled with humour and wit.
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On point TECH. and I hope some day these other cats will finally open their eyes, u see, Jay din't even need "super ugly" he knew that, so I think he simply put it out just to keep the battle going or something cause he obviouslly din't put much effort into it, since "takeoever" was so much superior to ether...while NAS was simply Playing with simplistic and almost childish remarks (lol, I thought he was gonna start talking about his momma at some point ;D) Jay was actually battling wit some heavy artillery punches filled with humour and wit.
what exactly did Jay-Z hit him with that was heavy? drop some of these impressive lines because i certainly missed them...
Jay-Z was the one who showed up crying like a little girl on the radio... so i guess he doesn't feel that "Ether" was as uneffective as some of y'all do.
"i embrace y'all with napalm,
blowed up, no guts, left chest face gone,
how can nas be garbage?
semi-auto's at your cottage
burner at the side of your dome
come out of my throne
i got this locked since 91, i am the truest
name a rapper that i aint influenced
gave y'all chapters but now i keep my eyes on the Judas
with Hawaiian Sophie fame kept my name in his music"
"heard it in my sleep
that this Gay-Z and Cockafella Records wanted beef
started cockin' up this weapon slowly loadin up this ammo
to unload it on this camel
and his soldiers i can handle
diss for dolo
and your manuscript just sound stupid
when KRS already made an album called Blueprint
first you say that Biggie's your man
then you got the nerve to say that you're better than Big
won't you let the late great veteran live?"
"y'all niggas deal with emotions like bitches
whats sad is i love you cause you're my brother you traded your soul for riches
my child i've watched you grow up to be famous
now i smile like a proud dad watchin his only son that made it"
you seem to be only concerned with dissin women
were you abused as a child? scared to smile they called you ugly
while life is harsh, hug me, don't reject me
or make records to disrespect me
blatant or indirectly
in 88 you was gettin chased to your building
callin my crib when i aint even give you my number
all i did was give you a style for you to run with
smilin in my face glad to break bread with the god
wearin Jaz chains, no cash, no techs, no cars
no jailbars jigga, no pies no case
just hawaiian shirts, hangin with lil chase
you a fan, a phoney a fake a pussy a stan
i'll still whip your ass
you 36 in a karate class
you tae-bo hoe
tryin to work it out
you tryin to get brolic
ask me if im tryin to kick knowledge
naw, im tryin to kick this shit you need to learn though
that ether, that shit that make your soul burn slow
is he dame diddy, dame daddy or dame dummy
oh i get it, you biggie and he's puffy
rocafella died of aids that was the end of his chapter
and thats the dude y'all chose to name your company after?
put it together, i rock hoes y'all rock fellas
and now you're tryin to take my spot fellas?
phillys hot rock fellas
put you in a dry spot fellas
in a pine box with 9 shots from my glock fellas
foxy kept you hot cause you kept your face in her puss
what you think you gettin girls now cause of your looks?
negro please
you no mustache havin
with whiskers like a rat
compared to beans you wack
an your man stabbed Un and made you take the blame
your ass went from Jaz to hangin with Kane
to Irv to Big and Eminem murdered you on your own shit
yous a dick riding faggot, you love the attention
Queens niggas run you niggas ask russell simmons"
"how much of Biggies rhymes is gonna come out your fat lips?"
now to me, that's all dope shit... what exactly did Jigga say that was so ill? if Takeover didn't have the dope beat, it would get much less attention.
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everyone always forgets but TAKEOVER only had 1 verse dissin nas, the whole song ether was about jigga,,,,and jayz destroyed nas wit one verse!
also takeover is a waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaayyyy better beat
Word...
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man, Im real sorry you need me to point that out for you, just look for yourself: Jay had this FAN point of view consept on "takeover", that logiclly hurts the most for an artist, He wasn't just spraying venom with no bite like NAS did on "ether" at times...He had structure. "fell from top10 to not mentioned at all", "1 hot album every 10 years averrage", "one was EHHH the other was Illmatic"....These are all lethal, Plus Shit had alot of humour in it showing Jay's cool and not-dependent atidute towards the isue shining with confidence without taking chip-childish-simplistic shots.
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man, Im real sorry you need me to point that out for you, just look for yourself: Jay had this FAN point of view consept on "takeover", that logiclly hurts the most for an artist, He wasn't just spraying venom with no bite like NAS did on "ether" at times...He had structure. "fell from top10 to not mentioned at all", "1 hot album every 10 years averrage", "one was EHHH the other was Illmatic"....These are all lethal, Plus Shit had alot of humour in it showing Jay's cool and not-dependent atidute towards the isue shining with confidence without taking chip-childish-simplistic shots.
Honestly, I don't understand where Jay got that 'hot album every 10 years average' nonsense from. Nas dropped an amazing, flawless classic (something Jay has never dropped may I add), an almost classic (hotter than hot), a solid album, ONE wack album and then another classic. And as for 'fell from top 10 to not mentioned at all', Jay's never been in my top 10, and probably never will be, he's good, but not that good. Plus, Nas has and probably always will have a spot in the top 10 due to "Illmatic", and now "Stillmatic", plus numerous spotless guest appearences that account to his gifted lyricism. Nas is done with this beef anyways, it seems to me like Jigga is the one holding onto this. Just watch, he'll probably have another diss song aimed at Nas on his next effort.
Oh and Jay was coming from a fan's perspective because that's all he is compared to Nas, a fan that can't touch Nas, which Nas pointed out in "Ether".
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the difference being that Jay's talking shit "one hot album every ten year average".. Jay's been around since before Nas dropped, and he's got 3 utterly wack joints, one dope album, and one good album...
"you made it a hot line, i made it a hot song" ... too bad Jigga never has and never will make anything on the level of "The World Is Yours"...
when exactly did Nas stop getting mentioned as a top MC? i must have missed that...
yeah you can tell Jigga didn't care about the beef... cat had a breakdown on the damn radio for christs sake.
but hey i guess if you're a jigga fan you're gonna feel a certain way...
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>= link=board=outbound;num=1031184419;start=20#27 date=09/08/02 at 08:58:46]
Honestly, I don't understand where Jay got that 'hot album every 10 years average' nonsense from. Nas dropped an amazing, flawless classic (something Jay has never dropped may I add), an almost classic (hotter than hot), a solid album, ONE wack album and then another classic. And as for 'fell from top 10 to not mentioned at all', Jay's never been in my top 10, and probably never will be, he's good, but not that good. Plus, Nas has and probably always will have a spot in the top 10 due to "Illmatic", and now "Stillmatic", plus numerous spotless guest appearences that account to his gifted lyricism. Nas is done with this beef anyways, it seems to me like Jigga is the one holding onto this. Just watch, he'll probably have another diss song aimed at Nas on his next effort.
Oh and Jay was coming from a fan's perspective because that's all he is compared to Nas, a fan that can't touch Nas, which Nas pointed out in "Ether".
Lets see, RD classic, VOL1 near classic, VOL2 -downside wack, VOL3-near classic, Familia-SOLID, Blueprint- Classic...
Nas-Illmatic-classic, IWW- garbage, I am- Garbage(an improvement from the previous one tho), Nastradamus- garbage , Stillmatic-solid and may be even near classic.
Facts in Disses always hit harder of course, But it's not crusial if u know how to speculate right(if some Nas fans don't agree with it, it doesn't mean it wasn't true as well but hell with it), When Jay said what he said on takeover it did feel, smell and sounded like the truth even to the most denieing NAS fan, Because that's what he was trying to do- SHOW NAS how his averrage fan thought of him.
what you're sayin as for jigga only being A FAN compared to NAS is simply reciting ETHER'z atempt to trash takeover's consept without having one itself.
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;D
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the cat was a fan. he openly jocked Nas up until "Takeover". Yeah he was coming from the perspective of a fan :rolleyes
Where else could he come from? It's obvious who the better MC is (that's Nas for you youngsters playing at home). Jay got served, straight up. The best part about the beef was that they both managed to sound somewhat motivated for a whole album... personally i think their new joints will be a big step backwards.
as for Vol 1. and Vol 3 being "near classic" and Blueprint being "classic" while IWW is "garbage"... lets just say we have a disagreement in taste.
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I don't know why people think "Takeover" was a better or harder diss than "Ether", I just don't understand. The only conclusion I can come to is that they love Jay that much that they have become brainwashed by him and believe anything and support everything that he does, almost like having a cult following, lol. Seriously, I know people that hate both Nas & Jay equally but they still recognise that Nas served Jay. I'm not gonna bash someones opinion though, I have mine and thats that "Ether" was straight up the better diss, and no-one can or will change my mind. I'm obviously gonna look biased to the Jay fans because I myself am a Nas fan but I believe anyone with ears and knowledge of what it takes to be a good MC should be able to recognise the better diss which in this case is "Ether" ;D
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>= link=board=outbound;num=1031184419;start=20#32 date=09/14/02 at 07:00:50]I don't know why people think "Takeover" was a better or harder diss than "Ether", I just don't understand. The only conclusion I can come to is that they love Jay that much that they have become brainwashed by him and believe anything and support everything that he does, almost like having a cult following, lol. Seriously, I know people that hate both Nas & Jay equally but they still recognise that Nas served Jay. I'm not gonna bash someones opinion though, I have mine and thats that "Ether" was straight up the better diss, and no-one can or will change my mind. I'm obviously gonna look biased to the Jay fans because I myself am a Nas fan but I believe anyone with ears and knowledge of what it takes to be a good MC should be able to recognise the better diss which in this case is "Ether" ;D
100% agreed. I think massive dickriding causes mental issues.
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i know its old, but Takeover served Ether
i know how yall feel,
see i was like most of yall
i didnt particularly care for both Jay Z or Nas,
they both disappointed me, but i liked Nas laot more, i thought Jay Z was so commercialized
so based on this biased, i biged up ether and slept on Takeover, the people gave this battle to Nas cuz he more "lyrical" and cuz Jay Z was so arrogant,
but the fact is Takeover clowned Nas, Ether was just nonsense
Another rare moment where Infinite disagree's with Tech..... okay, so we disagree on Ether vs. Takeover and Eminem... still not more then you can count on one hand..lol... peace
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Yuuuup..."Takeover" destroyed "Ether" just like "Whitey's Revenge" destroyed "Quitter"....riggghhhttt...
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All he was saying be4 was that he admired Illmatic and he never took his words back, he still thinks Illmatic was a great album.
Now as obvious as it seemz to some people that ETHER was better and same as for NAS being the better MC...hmmm... what can I say, I guess the more acsessable to the averrage listener's ear will always seem obvious, actually this is why JAY is gettin so much hate ever since he switched his vocal delivery\flow from that fast stacato style he was using in the begining, People don't even stop to realise that this is the same MC simply rapping about other themes(a thing that shouldn't metter to the opened mind, but hey...) and in a diffrend way, Unlike NAS, JAY has no problem with structuring his lyrics, He never tries to recycle past glory in his writing like NAS does with his overused poetic elements(while, btw, claiming to have moved forwards) that fail to make much conseptual sence when put together and are simply used as Illmatic-reminder gimmicks, The massages JAY stresses (for whatever they may be, without making a diffrence) in his lyrics are cristal clear and are not blured like NASz deep-alike lyrical hints that seem like many introes to a deep tune all put together on one cut.
Some people tend to think that whatever they find hard to comprehand plasticlly in their head is deep,I can tell you this for sure, It's the other way around, you need to be more secure in your taste.
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Unlike NAS, JAY has no problem with structuring his lyrics, He never tries to recycle past glory in his writing like NAS does with his overused poetic elements
Naw, Jay just bites other peoples lyrics, namely Biggie and then claims to be the greatest ::)
Some people tend to think that whatever they find hard to comprehand plasticlly in their head is deep,I can tell you this for sure, It's the other way around, you need to be more secure in your taste.
Maybe it's just some people aren't intelligent enough to appreciate thought provoking and deep lyrics like others ::)
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>= link=board=outbound;num=1031184419;start=20#27 date=09/08/02 at 08:58:46]
Honestly, I don't understand where Jay got that 'hot album every 10 years average' nonsense from. Nas dropped an amazing, flawless classic (something Jay has never dropped may I add), an almost classic (hotter than hot), a solid album, ONE wack album and then another classic. And as for 'fell from top 10 to not mentioned at all', Jay's never been in my top 10, and probably never will be, he's good, but not that good. Plus, Nas has and probably always will have a spot in the top 10 due to "Illmatic", and now "Stillmatic", plus numerous spotless guest appearences that account to his gifted lyricism. Nas is done with this beef anyways, it seems to me like Jigga is the one holding onto this. Just watch, he'll probably have another diss song aimed at Nas on his next effort.
Oh and Jay was coming from a fan's perspective because that's all he is compared to Nas, a fan that can't touch Nas, which Nas pointed out in "Ether".
I couldnt of said it better. Nas shits all over Jay Z, in every possible way. Ether is by far a better diss song than Takeover is. Jay's only argument was that he sold more than Nas, and we all know sales dont mean shit....Nas actually had some truth behind his disses [Jay Z does have fat lips, he DOES bite Biggie every line, he has bitten Nas and even took Nas's line from Represent and put in his song "Rap Game/Crack Game", among others].
Nas is a better MC than Jigga. Nas won the beef with Jigga. Ether is a better song than Takeover. Thanks for playing everyone. Neeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeext??
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LoL @ all the Nas-*******s vs. I Geezy.
Jay Z doesn't stand a chance... on this board.
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LoL @ all the Nas-*******s vs. I Geezy.
Jay Z doesn't stand a chance... on this board.
Jay doesnt stand a chance ANYWHERE. Every board I post says the same thing: Nas won the beef. Its the same thing with everyone I meet in person: Nas won the beef. And most rappers seem to agree that Nas won the beef, including Eminem. Even most Jay Z fans I meet say that Nas won.
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>= link=board=outbound;num=1031184419;start=20#37 date=09/15/02 at 09:58:32]
Maybe it's just some people aren't intelligent enough to appreciate thought provoking and deep lyrics like others ::)
this is exactlly tha kind of thing I was talking about, yes there are rappers who ARE actually deep(not in what they say but in how they say whatever they choose to say)- and an intelegent listener knowes when he hears deepness, HEll!! nas himself was one of those rappers on ILLMATIC...but a good listener knowes to differ DEEP from gimmicky DEEP-alike(what NAS has been doing for 3 albums).
p.s
The easiest thing is to hide behind this "Im deep, FOO'- yall can't hate on me" mask...NAS been doing it real well, Plus, he never lost his vocal abillities(always remained supreme in this erea) so I suppose he was one of the least lyriclly hard working people in the game for those 3 albums, basiclly telling his fans to simply like him cause he is tha guy who ONCE made Illmatic.
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LoL @ all the Nas-*******s vs. I Geezy.
Jay Z doesn't stand a chance... on this board.
LOL... I give I-Geezy props... even when it's I-Geezy vs. the world he never becomes disrespectful.
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>= link=board=outbound;num=1031184419;start=20#37 date=09/15/02 at 09:58:32]
Naw, Jay just bites other peoples lyrics, namely Biggie and then claims to be the greatest ::)
I would hardly call using single lines here and there mainlly for the sake of keeping one's memory alive as biting...And do you really think that one previouslly used line on a track is what makes the effect when it's by a lyricist of JAYz calliber?, NAS bit Rakim's whole vocal style and no one cared about that, Every rapper has been using previouslly used lines here and there, this isn't what I was talking about, I was talking about Recycling old lyrical patterns and tactics into lower quallity lyrical constructions only for the sake of reminding past glory.
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Jay doesnt stand a chance ANYWHERE. Every board I post says the same thing: Nas won the beef. Its the same thing with everyone I meet in person: Nas won the beef. And most rappers seem to agree that Nas won the beef, including Eminem. Even most Jay Z fans I meet say that Nas won.
So this is how you construct your opinions, you ask other people what they think?....Im also sure u personally know all the rappers and their opinions, I personally saw a show on the beef where people in the industry where all being politiclly correct saying that "right now both are on top" all I heared in NASz favour was from DJz who said "super ugly" wasn't really on par, But when I speak on the beef I refer to TAKEOVER, I also think JAY never even needed to drop "Super Ugly" cause he already had it locked.
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So this is how you construct your opinions, you ask other people what they think?....Im also sure u personally know all the rappers and their opinions, I personally saw a show on the beef where people in the industry where all being politiclly correct saying that "right now both are on top" all I heared in NASz favour was from DJz who said "super ugly" wasn't really on par, But when I speak on the beef I refer to TAKEOVER, I also think JAY never even needed to drop "Super Ugly" cause he already had it locked.
Oh please. I never thought Takeover was all that anyway, and when Nas dropped Ether, I knew it was all over. Even before all the votes were called in to hot 97', before the general consensus said Nas won, before Damon Dash/Jigga tried to pull that bitch move at Summer Jam [boycotting Nas from performing Ether]...before ALL that. The bottomline is, everything Jay said in Takeover was fictional, or half truth at best.....most of what Nas said in Ether was most definatly true. In addition to all that, Jay lost brownie points with me when said "If I Aint better than Big, im the closest one" and when he told Nas that only streets cats were feelin X and Pac......so no, I dont base my opinions on what other people think. It just so happens my opinion on THIS matter happens to agree with the majority.
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if anything jay jacked his style from big L
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. The bottomline is, everything Jay said in Takeover was fictional, or half truth at best.....most of what Nas said in Ether was most definatly true. In addition to all that, Jay lost brownie points with me when said "If I Aint better than Big, im the closest one" and when he told Nas that only streets cats were feelin X and Pac......so no, I dont base my opinions on what other people think. It just so happens my opinion on THIS matter happens to agree with the majority.
First of all, if we're talking about facts( a thing that shouldn't be the defining factor in dis trackz- u should know this u prefer "ether") TAKEOVER takes it by far, ETHER was mostlly childish jabs and some facts JAY never even tried to denie...Takeover actually put on the table what many NAS fans were feeling under the surface, while somehow mannaging to denie it. The FACT NAS was inconsistent, The FACT- Illmatic was his only sucsess, The FACT- all of what NAS has been rapping at the time were mostlly gimmicks to keep his fans in denile while reminding them he was the one to once drop ILLMATIC,among others. Jay din't even feel the need to spend the whole track on pointless childish disses, like NAS did on ETHER, He simply came wit FACTz.
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First of all, if we're talking about facts( a thing that shouldn't be the defining factor in dis trackz- u should know this u prefer "ether") TAKEOVER takes it by far, ETHER was mostlly childish jabs and some facts JAY never even tried to denie...Takeover actually put on the table what many NAS fans were feeling under the surface, while somehow mannaging to denie it. The FACT NAS was inconsistent, The FACT- Illmatic was his only sucsess, The FACT- all of what NAS has been rapping at the time were mostlly gimmicks to keep his fans in denile while reminding them he was the one to once drop ILLMATIC. Jay din't even feel the need to spend the whole track on pointless childish disses, like NAS did on ETHER, He simply came wit FACTz.
Ok everyone, watch carefully as Razor destroys Geezy's argument effortlessly. *clears throat*
First off, Jigga didnt spit ANY facts in Takeover whatsoever.
The things you claim to be fact, I hate to say it, ARENT fact, but an opinion.
Nas being inconsistant is a fact?? WROOOOONG!!!!!!! That is an opinion. Illmatic = 5 mics, It Was Written = 4 mics, I Am = 4 mics, Nastradamus = 3 mics, Stillmatic = 4.5 mics.......if you ask me, thats pretty consistant. Nas has made ONE sub-par album, while Jay has made at least 3 or 4 sub par albums. And on top of that, Illmatic shits all over ANY of Jay's albums anyday of the week.
Illmatic was his only success?? Um, wrong AGAIN. Illmatic is his most critically acclaimed album, but to say its his only success is just stupid, since its actually his lowest selling album.
Nas raps about gimmicks?? Pleeeeeeeeeeasssse!!! What the hell do you think Jay Z raps about?? He raps about how much dough he has, what kind of car he drives, and how much ice he wears, with an OCCASIONAL deep song. Nas is a far less gimmicky rapper than Jigga is. Jay Z is only good for making commercial songs.
And Takevover is better than Ether as an overall song?? How?? Lyrically?? No way. Ether is 10 x nicer lyrically. Production? Maybe so. Takeover definatly had nice production, but other than that, its not that great of a song [though the diss to Mobb Deep was good, but his lines against Nas, in his own words, were LAAAAAAAAMMMMEEE!!!!!]
c'mon Geezy, I know you can do better than this.....you're not gonna let me win this easily are you??
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[though the diss to Mobb Deep was good, but his lines against Nas, in his own words, were LAAAAAAAAMMMMEEE!!!!!]
fuck jay if peeps knew tha whole deal on it they would look at it completely differently but since im a mobb deep fan no1 will believe me. now if jay wanted to diss nas good he should dwell on tha fact of how much of a hypocrit nas is.
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bottom line- nas won tha beef cuz when takeover dropped he came on tha radio an didnt even sound fazed by it. when ether leaked jay was on hot 97 an sounded shook as fuck an than he dropped that joke of a song, suger ugly an to make matters worse he went on tha radio an apologized for tha one line cuz his mom forced him to or some shit. Now if u think takeover was better or ether was better thats ur opinion but it was obvious ether had shaken jay
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Ok everyone, watch carefully as Razor destroys Geezy's argument effortlessly. *clears throat*
First off, Jigga didnt spit ANY facts in Takeover whatsoever.
The things you claim to be fact, I hate to say it, ARENT fact, but an opinion.
Nas being inconsistant is a fact?? WROOOOONG!!!!!!! That is an opinion. Illmatic = 5 mics, It Was Written = 4 mics, I Am = 4 mics, Nastradamus = 3 mics, Stillmatic = 4.5 mics.......if you ask me, thats pretty consistant. Nas has made ONE sub-par album, while Jay has made at least 3 or 4 sub par albums. And on top of that, Illmatic shits all over ANY of Jay's albums anyday of the week.
Illmatic was his only success?? Um, wrong AGAIN. Illmatic is his most critically acclaimed album, but to say its his only success is just stupid, since its actually his lowest selling album.
Nas raps about gimmicks?? Pleeeeeeeeeeasssse!!! What the hell do you think Jay Z raps about?? He raps about how much dough he has, what kind of car he drives, and how much ice he wears, with an OCCASIONAL deep song. Nas is a far less gimmicky rapper than Jigga is. Jay Z is only good for making commercial songs.
And Takevover is better than Ether as an overall song?? How?? Lyrically?? No way. Ether is 10 x nicer lyrically. Production? Maybe so. Takeover definatly had nice production, but other than that, its not that great of a song [though the diss to Mobb Deep was good, but his lines against Nas, in his own words, were LAAAAAAAAMMMMEEE!!!!!]
c'mon Geezy, I know you can do better than this.....you're not gonna let me win this easily are you??
*watches razor fighting with the wall*...lol, funny how you make it a battle arguement...
anyways, when you hear the word sucsess, why the imidiate asosiation is seilz?....who said that a sucsessfull album is a selling one as well, I never said Illmatic was a comersially sucsessfull album, u gotta watch what u reading, I said it was his only sucsesfull album to that point(be4 Stillmatic droped). What JAY was saying on Takeover was the truth(even tho this isn't what makes Takeover the better dis, but since this is what u cought on, fine...) for many devoted NAS
fanz this was the truth, argueable or not, This is what made it so effective.
as for the albums ILLMATIC-5 , IWW-2.5, I am- 2.9, Nastradamus-1 Stillmatic-4.25-4.5.
RD-5, VOL1- 4.5, vol2-2.5, vol3-4.5, familia-4-4.25, blueprint-5
if u asking for my point of view.
According to what u've said, it spears as if u don't know what gimmicks actually are. As a lyrics listener I know that for 3 albums NAS was in a lyrical coma, all his lyrics where poorlly structured and trackz seemed like collections of recycled cliche's failing to paint vivid pictures, all blured unfocused and pointless. Gimmickz are the poetical seeming parts which were made by NAS to remind listeners that this is tha same guy who made ILLMATIC without even touching that same lyrical level in actuallity, Gimmicks were Topics he only hinted at(becuase he failed to paint them fully) on tracks to atract serious-topic metter seekers. Jay can actually talk about whatever he wants, since he doesn't have structuring problems He can tell u about how he was fuckin a bitch and it will be better than NAS tring to tell you about some serious isue he hasn't really thought out how to tell yet.
it's what Ive been saying for years, it's not about the topic, it's about how well the rapper can tell it.
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I would hardly call using single lines here and there mainlly for the sake of keeping one's memory alive as biting...And do you really think that one previouslly used line on a track is what makes the effect when it's by a lyricist of JAYz calliber?, NAS bit Rakim's whole vocal style and no one cared about that, Every rapper has been using previouslly used lines here and there, this isn't what I was talking about, I was talking about Recycling old lyrical patterns and tactics into lower quallity lyrical constructions only for the sake of reminding past glory.
If Jay was such a great MC then he wouldn't need to use other MC' lines in every other song, he would make his own trendsetting lines, but no, no-one hardly ever uses his lines because they're not worth using, lol. Plus, he basically suggested that he was better than Big when infact he's not even on Biggies level, and he's not the best because there are alot of other MC's out there that would be crowned the G.O.A.T over him.
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For real, yall need to understand that before Jay Z resurected Nas' career, he was going down down down like a mutha
His career was in a rut, Nastradumus ?Ooochie Wally?
Cmon, Takeover was Jay Z simply poking Nas' career with a stick,
speaking of facts
- Queens niggaz run you nigggaz (Not really, Cohens the check writer up at Island/Def Jam)
- Rocafella died of AIDS (no, he didnt)
- you're a fake, a pussy, a stan ( ::))
- you 36 in a Karate class (36?)
- and here it is.....the greatest line of all time
"you tae bo hoe"
::)
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For real, yall need to understand that before Jay Z resurected Nas' career, he was going down down down like a mutha
His career was in a rut, Nastradumus ?Ooochie Wally?
Cmon, Takeover was Jay Z simply poking Nas' career with a stick,
speaking of facts
- Queens niggaz run you nigggaz (Not really, Cohens the check writer up at Island/Def Jam)
- Rocafella died of AIDS (no, he didnt)
- you're a fake, a pussy, a stan ( ::))
- you 36 in a Karate class (36?)
- and here it is.....the greatest line of all time
"you tae bo hoe"
::)
Jay Z was in a rut too.....Hardknock Life, anyone?? That album was total trash. Vol 3?? Another piece of commercial garbage. The Dynasty?? Slightly better, but still pretty weak. The Blueprint?? Much better than his last few albums, but 5 mics?? No way. 4 mics tops. And then he made that wack shit with R. Kelly best of both worlds.
Nas owns Jay Z, as an MC and as far as making albums go.
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Jay Zs the King of Hip Hop, hows he in a rut
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the king of hip-hop? you must have a different perspective on hip-hop.
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Jay Zs the King of Hip Hop, hows he in a rut
Jay Z the king of hip hop?? ROFLMAO......first of all, I can name 30 MC's off the top of my head who are better than Jay Z, second of all, the king of hip hop for ALL TIME is dead, and he went by the name of Tupac Shakur last I saw [please dont even try to say Jigga is better than Pac, its bad enough you already think he's better than Nas].........and as for MC's who are alive. Jay isnt the king in that case either. Its probably Eminem.
Jigga is extremely overrated. He made ONE arguable classic [Reasonable Doubt], and two decent albums [Vol.1, and the Blueprint]. Almost everything else he's made has been commercial trash.
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[though the diss to Mobb Deep was good, but his lines against Nas, in his own words, were LAAAAAAAAMMMMEEE!!!!!]
Can't believe this, I think Nas won for sure but I do give props to Jay for his verse on Takeover, it was dope and the part for Prodigy was terrible. He didn't say shit except making fun his height and that his album sold more.
Nas part was good, but the Prodigy part is weak.
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Yo Hellrazor, you're so biased towards Nas, it's not even funny.
If I consider myself 60% towards Jay Z vs. 40% Nas, then you are
99% Nas, and 1% tie.
That COULD go for Cliche & Euthinasia as well, but they seem to have a broader perspective on rap, especially Euthinasia.
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Yo Hellrazor, you're so biased towards Nas, it's not even funny.
If I consider myself 60% towards Jay Z vs. 40% Nas, then you are
99% Nas, and 1% tie.
That COULD go for Cliche & Euthinasia as well, but they seem to have a broader perspective on rap, especially Euthinasia.
Of course im biased towards Nas, cuz I think he's 100 x the MC that Jigga ever will be.
And by the way, Nas aint even my fav MC..........that title goes to the late, great 2Pac....But I could hate Nas, and I would still say that he won the battle with Jigga, because he DID.
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>= link=board=outbound;num=1031184419;start=40#52 date=09/16/02 at 09:09:33]
If Jay was such a great MC then he wouldn't need to use other MC' lines in every other song, he would make his own trendsetting lines, but no, no-one hardly ever uses his lines because they're not worth using, lol. Plus, he basically suggested that he was better than Big when infact he's not even on Biggies level, and he's not the best because there are alot of other MC's out there that would be crowned the G.O.A.T over him.
eeeeeehh. WRONG. If someone tried to use one of JAYz lines u could imidiatlly tell it was a JAY-line, cause as far as single lines GO(not even mentioning overall structure) JAY is one of the most outstanding MCz, and it's not even argueable.
As for him using B.I.G. lines, When NAS does his "the n to the a to the s-i-r and if I wasn't I must"ve been Escobar",
or when u recognise Ra'z flow\delivery paterns in NASz shit u don't seem to mind, but when JAY simply quotes a line while filling the track to the top with his most suffisticated punchlines and smilies filled with his own personallity and feel- do u really think that BIG line is what made the track?!!
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jay-z destroyed nas period and with one verse
jay-z was more relevant and he was saying shit that was more truthful or more in reality while nas was saying some fantasy shit....if nas shit was "true" then yeah, nas shit would be wayy more tighter but it obviously ain't...
oh yeah on the side note everyone DO NOT listen to this groupid faggot name hellrazor...this fool claims he would suck pac's dead dick, that layzie bone can "fart an album" and still beat rakim, and bone thugs n harmony can drop ONE LINE and beat any of the wu members....he also thinks that an INTERNET ARGUMENT is a real war battle and he gets very intense and put all of his passion into it(aka psycho) and he has comments like "oh nas is better cuz of GENERAL CONSENSUS"...LOL wtf??
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oh yeah on the side note everyone DO NOT listen to this groupid faggot name hellrazor...this fool claims he would suck pac's dead dick, that layzie bone can "fart an album" and still beat rakim, and bone thugs n harmony can drop ONE LINE and beat any of the wu members....
You're joking right? he didn't really say all that shit, did he?
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You're joking right? he didn't really say all that shit, did he?
Apparently he did.. :-/
There was a big azz thread about it, some months ago.
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ether was the shit.
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jay-z destroyed nas period and with one verse
jay-z was more relevant and he was saying shit that was more truthful or more in reality while nas was saying some fantasy shit....if nas shit was "true" then yeah, nas shit would be wayy more tighter but it obviously ain't...
once again, im lost as to what Jay-Z said in "truth" while nas said in "fantasy"... "ether" contained many a true statement...