West Coast Connection Forum
DUBCC - Tha Connection => West Coast Classics => Topic started by: Doggystylin on November 16, 2002, 02:21:27 PM
-
1. Afeni and Suge are takin off the original guests on the songs and replacing them with the gay ass outlaws everytime!! Bizzy Bone was takin off "Breathin", Bad Azz was takin off Ghetto Star, Tha Dogg Pound was taken off "This Life I Lead", now of course all of these guest artists SHIT on the gay ass outlawz but yet they still replace them with the outlawz.
2.they are changin up verses, beats, their bassicly tearing apart the original versions of the songs, and those were the versions pac made and those were the versions he liked!, he never would have made a song with nas back in the day, or with trick daddy, this is a insult to pac's music!, his mom is ruining his legacy!!!
they arent her songs, what the hell does she think shes doin, does she think shes some pro in the music biz? just realease it how pac originally made it, thats the pac people loved!
so bassicly what im tryin to say is, these people that fuck with pac's music should suffer!!!!!, lol, no but think of all the tight tracks we could have had that have gotten ruined, i mean pac's shit didnt get changed on R U Still Down and Still I Rise and i love those albums, so why the hell did they have to fuck with these albums??
RELEASE THE TRACKS UNTOUCHED!!!!!!!
-
You're right! And I'm sayin it again and again: Forget Afeni's new shit, and buy 2pac's old shit! That were really good album!
-
Shut the fuck up
-
RELEASE THE TRACKS UNTOUCHED!!!!!!!
-
Because its 2002, times change, music change, your underwear should change.
Deal with it, up to date
-
Because its 2002, times change, music change, your underwear should change.
Deal with it, up to date
when somethins good how it is why change it?
-
Doggy, I ususally agree with you, but this time I cant......
I like the originals [most of them] better the ones that they are putting on his albums, but its basically our fault, the 2Pac fans, that they are being remixed. Had the originals never been leaked, Afeni and Suge probably woulda never remixed them and released them as they were. But since they were leaked, that would mean nobody would buy them, since everyone already has the originals, thus they remix them. So yea, as much as I hate to say it, its the bootleggers fault, not Afenis fault. Now, I think they could do a better job at remixing the songs, but thats a whole nother topic.
Anyway, I think Better Dayz is a bangin' ass album. Yea, its remixed, but the beats on this album are much better than on UTEOT. The new beat for Ghetto Star is fucking dope [not as good as the original, but its still dope]. The production is alot less poppy this time around, and their are less guest appearances, and the guest appearances that are on there are better. If they gonna remix Pac's music, the way they did it on this album is much better than they did on Still I Rise or UTEOT.
-
Doggy, I ususally agree with you, but this time I cant......
I like the originals [most of them] better the ones that they are putting on his albums, but its basically our fault, the 2Pac fans, that they are being remixed. Had the originals never been leaked, Afeni and Suge probably woulda never remixed them and released them as they were. But since they were leaked, that would mean nobody would buy them, since everyone already has the originals, thus they remix them. So yea, as much as I hate to say it, its the bootleggers fault, not Afenis fault. Now, I think they could do a better job at remixing the songs, but thats a whole nother topic.
Anyway, I think Better Dayz is a bangin' ass album. Yea, its remixed, but the beats on this album are much better than on UTEOT. The new beat for Ghetto Star is fucking dope [not as good as the original, but its still dope]. The production is alot less poppy this time around, and their are less guest appearances, and the guest appearances that are on there are better. If they gonna remix Pac's music, the way they did it on this album is much better than they did on Still I Rise or UTEOT.
ok i see where your coming from but what about the old guest appearences, are you saying the outlawz come tighter than bizzy bone, bad azz, tha dogg pound, and who knows who else he had on those songs we never heard, but it sure as hell would have been better than trick daddy
-
yeah fuck em they fucked up "Watcha gon Do" the original was way better >:( >:( >:( >:( >:( >:(
-
better dayz is the shittiest 2pac album 2 date, there rapein pac's legacy like theres no shame. Alot of people like the trash they release because they bacame pac fans after he died. NO self respecting 2pac fan from before his death would post a thread sayin some shit like "OMG Better dayz is a classic" LOL haha, shit makes me laugh every time. There just lil' kids who to them, UTEOT was like there first real 2pac album that came out as they were fans of him. In my opinion, there have only been a handfull of songs released after his death that (for the most part) are good.
"High Speed"
"Friends" (Off Too Gangsta)
"Thug Nature" (Off Too Gangsta)
"They Dont give a fuck about us"
"Until The End of Time (RP Remix)"
"Running on E"
"Let em Have It" (With out SKG)
"Fuckin' with the Wrong Nigga"
"Good Life"
"Lil Homies"
"Better Dayz"
"Never Call U Bitch Again"
plus all the shit on those deathrow movie soundtracks. Everything else trash or too redone/edited to consider good.
peace
-
why I disagree:
1. the massive, massive bootlegging of Pac's shit. Everyone bitches about current albums being bootlegged, but Pac's unreleased shit has been bootlegged WAAAAAY longer than any artist out now. If no bootlegs surfaced, then every person in here would not be bitching about Afeni messin with the tracks.
2. about "Ghetto Star", why would they release essentially the same version Bad Azz released 4 years ago? Bad Azz had the same beat, and his same4 verses, along with the same hook as the bootleg. Why re-release the song? Also with "The Life I lead", think about this for a second. Why would Afeni put Daz on there when he tried bootlegging Pac tracks and why would Suge let Daz be on there after Daz has talked all this shit about Tha Row? Use common sense.
3. the bootlegs were not finished works. A perfect example is the original beat to "First 2 Bomb". That beat was a simple, low key beat with it's prime purpose of just laying down vocals over a beat. Tha Outlawz have said that most of the bootlegged shit weren't what the final product would have turned out to be. Basically the beats were scrap beats which were not going to be used anyways.
4. It's not 1996 anymore, sadly. Time moves on, and so must music. If they released the originals, it would sound very dated and would not appeal to the mainstream.
this is the problem with the bootlegs, people think it was the final products yet i'm willing to bet half of the unreleased songs that were bootlegged were finished. 2pac could have gone back and rewritten some of the lyrics. Imagine what Snoop's songs sound like after they first record it. That product is about equal to the bootlegged songs when it comes to quality.
-
better dayz is the shittiest 2pac album 2 date, there rapein pac's legacy like theres no shame. Alot of people like the trash they release because they bacame pac fans after he died. NO self respecting 2pac fan from before his death would post a thread sayin some shit like "OMG Better dayz is a classic" LOL haha, shit makes me laugh every time. There just lil' kids who to them, UTEOT was like there first real 2pac album that came out as they were fans of him. In my opinion, there have only been a handfull of songs released after his death that (for the most part) are good.
"High Speed"
"Friends" (Off Too Gangsta)
"Thug Nature" (Off Too Gangsta)
"They Dont give a fuck about us"
"Until The End of Time (RP Remix)"
"Running on E"
"Let em Have It" (With out SKG)
"Fuckin' with the Wrong Nigga"
"Good Life"
"Lil Homies"
"Better Dayz"
"Never Call U Bitch Again"
plus all the shit on those deathrow movie soundtracks. Everything else trash or too redone/edited to consider good.
peace
I dont see how anyone can say this is the worst 2Pac album ever. This album is EASILY better than UTEOT and Still I Rise. EASILY better.
And guess what?? Ive been a 2Pac fan since Me Against The World came out, so there goes your theory about how any "self respecting Pac fan" would like this album. Is it a classic?? Naw, but its definalty a solid 4 mic album.
I really dont understand you cats sometimes. First yall bitch about how bad UTEOT was, because they fucked up the beats and the choruses. Ok, fine. I myself thought UTEOT was a huge dissappointment. But when they put some hot new beats over his songs [some of which are better than the originals], and less trashy hooks, yall STILL complain. Tupac fans have been spoiled with too many AEOM, MATW, and Makaveli type albums, and anything less is no good. Its fucking bullshit!!!!! Get over it, and just be happy with what you get. Better Dayz is a bangin ass album, and anyone who says otherwise is too nit picky, period.
-
ok i see where your coming from but what about the old guest appearences, are you saying the outlawz come tighter than bizzy bone, bad azz, tha dogg pound, and who knows who else he had on those songs we never heard, but it sure as hell would have been better than trick daddy
hey hellrazor, you still havent answered that?^^^, i wanna know what you think of that
-
1. Afeni and Suge are takin off the original guests on the songs and replacing them with the gay ass outlaws everytime!! Bizzy Bone was takin off "Breathin", Bad Azz was takin off Ghetto Star, Tha Dogg Pound was taken off "This Life I Lead", now of course all of these guest artists SHIT on the gay ass outlawz but yet they still replace them with the outlawz.
2.they are changin up verses, beats, their bassicly tearing apart the original versions of the songs, and those were the versions pac made and those were the versions he liked!, he never would have made a song with nas back in the day, or with trick daddy, this is a insult to pac's music!, his mom is ruining his legacy!!!
they arent her songs, what the hell does she think shes doin, does she think shes some pro in the music biz? just realease it how pac originally made it, thats the pac people loved!
so bassicly what im tryin to say is, these people that fuck with pac's music should suffer!!!!!, lol, no but think of all the tight tracks we could have had that have gotten ruined, i mean pac's shit didnt get changed on R U Still Down and Still I Rise and i love those albums, so why the hell did they have to fuck with these albums??
RELEASE THE TRACKS UNTOUCHED!!!!!!!
Still I Rise And R U Still Down were mixed like the last 2 Pac cds.
-
aint the version with Quik on the Chronic 2000 album
-
so bassicly what im tryin to say is, these people that fuck with pac's music should suffer!!!!!, lol, no but think of all the tight tracks we could have had that have gotten ruined, i mean pac's shit didnt get changed on R U Still Down and Still I Rise and i love those albums, so why the hell did they have to fuck with these albums??
RELEASE THE TRACKS UNTOUCHED!!!!!!!
Still I Rise And R U Still Down were mixed like the last 2 Pac cds.
Well on both albums, the songs were slightly touched, not totally remixed, and on Still I Rise, a couple of new Outlawz verses, but that was to help lead off their seprate career. The new total remixes, I'm straight with, 'cause it is cool to upgrade sound, and 'Pac said he could give a fuck about beats, let him spit and change the beats before the songs are released. As for the quests on the songs, that shouldn't be touched, I've always disagreed with people appearing in 'Pac's CD's that had nothing to do with 'Pac. I don't mind the 'Lawz, Thug Life, or any old 'Pac homie like Treach or Richie Rich, but people like Ja Rule and shit, fuck that. Maybe Nas, 'cause they supposibly made peace and were going to work together accourding to Suge and Nas, but others, nah.
-
I dont see how anyone can say this is the worst 2Pac album ever. This album is EASILY better than UTEOT and Still I Rise. EASILY better.
And guess what?? Ive been a 2Pac fan since Me Against The World came out, so there goes your theory about how any "self respecting Pac fan" would like this album. Is it a classic?? Naw, but its definalty a solid 4 mic album.
I really dont understand you cats sometimes. First yall bitch about how bad UTEOT was, because they fucked up the beats and the choruses. Ok, fine. I myself thought UTEOT was a huge dissappointment. But when they put some hot new beats over his songs [some of which are better than the originals], and less trashy hooks, yall STILL complain. Tupac fans have been spoiled with too many AEOM, MATW, and Makaveli type albums, and anything less is no good. Its fucking bullshit!!!!! Get over it, and just be happy with what you get. Better Dayz is a bangin ass album, and anyone who says otherwise is too nit picky, period.
Ok, I respect your opinion and all but I think most of what your saying is bull shit. Lemme brake it down for you why better dayz is garbage. It's a 20 track album (- the 7 songs that are remix's or were previously released) and of those twenty songs like 1/3 are acceptable. And by that I mean you can MAYBE listen to them through without a strong urge to change the song. You say this album is good because it has maybe 5 rely good songs out of 27 which is better than UTEOT which had 4 good out of 29, or some shit like that. Well Fuck that, that ratio is beyond terrible for a 2pac album. All Eyez on me had 27 songs and all but 2 or 3 were rely rely good, Makaveli had 12 songs all of which were incredible. Well these unreleased songs have the same quality lyrics, from the same era, why shouldn’t they be held to the same standards?
Yes, there are a few songs (maybe 7) on better dayz that are good, but the problem is in the OVERWELMING amount of songs that are not only bad... there soo fucking horrible it either makes you laugh or flat out sickened. Case in point,
"There U Go" - Wack outlaw verses and that hook! Omg.
"This Life I lead" - another classic gone forever.
"What Ya Gonna Do" - lol LISTEN TO IT...nuff said
"Never be peace" - keep on draggin' that legacy through the mud
"Still Ballin"... um, you realize that’s featuring trick daddy right?
"Fame" - Do Noble and Kastro need to take a shit?
"Changed Man" someone needs to smack the shit outta that wack ass southern rapper and whoever wrote that hook 4 real. Christ, rapping about Escalades and bling bling on a 2pac record is your style that weak? have some fucking respect.
"Thugz mansion remix" - featuring Nas. Lemme say that again.. Featuring NAS.
And I don't understand YALL cats sometimes, yea Until the end of time was bad, and this one is to. There all bad. Do they have to be? NO!! But people like you lay down and take it and say stupid shit like "be happy with what you get" what type of bullshit is that? be happy with what I get, fuck that. The music is trash and there’s no need for it to be. They consciously make extreme executive decisions to alter these records for there own financial and personal gains. Why should I support that? they do this shit then force feed us their remix's and "updated" tracks that they know we'll buy because of our respect for 2pac, that’s not fucking cool man.
And the worst part... I mean rely the saddest part of it all is that us as 2pac fans come accustom to this like its acceptable. If you rely think about it in terms of other artists that have died and released posthumous material the whole concept of "updating" 2pac music is rely bullshit. Ask yourself honestly, do you think "updating" would fly with unreleased Beatles records? Can you imagine if they released an old unreleased John Lennon record and:
1) Edited out any controversial lyrics
2) Brought in Moby to remix the beat
3) Asked Dave Mathews to re-do the hook and add vocals
People would be shocked, appalled ...OUTRAGED! I mean something like that happening is soooooo far from a possibility that its impossible to even fathom... but if your a 2pac fan its not only a reality that something like that could happen, its a strong possibility something like that WILL happen. So it becomes accepted. Fuck that, I'm not supporting that shit.
Man, me.. I'm just happy this better dayz album came out, cause now out of the 27 tracks on it and the 29 tracks on UTEOT (56 SONGS TOTAL!) I finally have enough decent songs to make ONE full mix cd of posthumous material.
-
plain and simple:
THEY CAN"T GET THE SAMPLES CLEARED!!!!!!!!!!!!
That's why they can't release it like it was origionally made, so don't hate.
-
^^^^
I have 2 disagree with you on some level. I've just replyed on another post on this forum (about betta dayz). OK some samples may not be cleared, but did ALL of his original tracks contain that many samples? If so, why completely change the beat, the guest appearences, outlaw verses, the hooks etc. Like I said on the other post, slighlt change the sample, but keep it to the orignal sound as possible, eg Friends on the too gansta for radio has a very simlar beat to the original. I know that 2pacs albums have been heavily bootlegged, but I haven't got all his bootlegs, plus I want to hear his music in CDq.
I still respeact your opinions though.
-
Sorry phellas but my theory is ITS ALL ABOUT THE MONEY. They know that people will go out and by this album even if it toally sucked just because basically its 2PAC. You gotta remember there is only a limited number of songs that will be available for release and I think that once they have all been used up then the albums containing the original beats will start appearing.
-
i definetly see where your coming from, but most of the diehard 2pac fans have already heard most of the bootlegged unreleased tracks. i even know people who bought the bootlegs thinking that they were official albums. would it be fair to them to release the exact same version of that song again? i mean, ill admit, some of the originals are better than the new ones, some of the new ones are better than the originals. i'd say its about 50/50. im a really big 2pac fan and ive bought all of his cds that have been officially released. ive also heard just about all of the unreleased tracks that are bootlegged on the internet. i'd say about half of the unreleased bootleg tracks on the net sound like they were never finished, it seems like the producers never finished the beats. and as for the ones that DID sound good and DID sound finished, ive listened to them sooooooo many times and im sure a lot of other 2pac fans have too. thats why i enjoy the fact that they remix the tracks for the most part. even though they might not be better all the time, its still something new and exciting, you know? i mean, if they were all originals, i'd probably buy it but i wouldnt be so excited and i would feel like i was buying a cd that i already own. for example, the "fuck friends" remix on uteot wasnt as good as the original, but im glad that they did remix it cause ive heard the original a thousand times and i own too gangsta for radio which is a compilation that has a version to that song that is similar to the original, so its nice to have 3 versions of the song, its almost like 3 different songs, kinda cool if you ask me. i havent heard better dayz yet but ive heard some clips, and from what i heard on the clips, the beats varied from "good" to "awesome", a lot better than i expected actually. as far as uteot goes, i liked most of the beats, a few of them werent so great, but atleast they were something new rather than the originals that ive heard a thousand times. who knows, maybe releasing the originals would be cool for the pop fans and the new 2pac fans who never heard the originals. but i think the diehard fans who have already heard the originals a million times might want something fresh even if they dont always want to admit it. i mean, think about it, even if you think the remixes are "wack" or whatever, would you really be excited if the new 2pac album was just a whole bunch of original tracks that you've heard a billion times? probably not, you probably wouldnt even be talking about the album, and you might not even buy it.
another thing you have to take into consideration is that 2pac's tracks were ALL his, 99% percent of them were COLLABORATIONS. whether they were collaborations between the other PERFORMERS or PRODUCERS, the COLLABORATORS have the right to redo their parts if they want to. imagine if you were a rapper and you did a song with a producer and some other rappers. and then before you were gonna release the song, the producer came and was like "yo i wanna do another beat, i aint satisfied with that one", and the other rappers on there were like "yo man we're gonna redo our verses we think we can do em better". would you be like "NO! i wanna keep them ORIGINAL!!!!!!! MWAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!" or would you be like "sure man, go ahead". im sure you'd probably let them redo their parts. well thats how 2pac's mom feels. most of those songs WERE originally done with the outlawz and produced by johnny j, and im sure if 2pac was here today and he was approached johnny j was like "yo pac i wanna redo that beat and the outlawz wanna redo their verses" 2pac would probably be like "yeah sure hurry up" or something like that (i dont know exactly what he'd say since i never met him, but im pretty sure he'd let them redo their stuff if they thought it would be best). so what's 2pac's mom supposed to say? these were 2pac's FRIENDS and they actually WORKED ON THE TRACKS. its more their tracks than it is hers, so of course shes gonna let johnny j redo his beats and the outlawz redo their verses, she trusts them because 2pac trusted them.
as far as adding new people in and adding new verses, i guess it depends on how you look at it. the way i look at it is that they just wanna give it a new cool feeling, some people like it and some people dont. i happen to like the neptunes, jazzy pha, and i think trick daddy's ok, so ill probably like it or atleast wont mind it, i think its cool to hear 2pac over some new style stuff. also they way i look at it is that 2pac's in heaven probably recording new stuff up there for his new heaven friends or something, so he could care less about what their doing with his stuff down here since it had a lot of "sinful" material that they probably wouldnt really care for up there.
bottom line is, im surprised and delighted that they are even still releasing 2pac CDs. 2pac's mom could easily live the rest of her life work free and buy whatever she wants off 2pac's already released work, so shes probably just releasing this stuff for the fans and for his legacy and for her 2pac artist center or whatever. so its cool, i think most mothers in her position wouldnt have released any more albums at all since shes in a position where she gets paid off all his albums he released when he was alive. so im happy with any new 2pac stuff. as far as ruining his legacy goes, i dont think his legacy can be ruined. his legacy ended the day he died, everything that comes out after he died is just extra stuff, everyone knows that, no ones gonna be mad at 2pac for stuff he didnt release. anyway, no disrespect to anyone on this post we're all 2pac fans and want the best.
-
Because its 2002, times change, music change, your underwear should change.
Deal with it, up to date
ha yea i understand your opinion cuz u like shakira and other pop acts too so its all good. ;D ;)