West Coast Connection Forum
Lifestyle => Sports & Entertainment => Topic started by: Hack Wilson - real on September 11, 2013, 05:42:44 PM
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133 RBI in 133 games, leads the league in batting, on base percentage and slugging average. also is going to finish 2nd in home runs.
is there anything Chris Davis, Mike Trout or Robinson Cano could do over the next 3 weeks? i don't think so.
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Chris Davis and Robinson Cano had no shot from day one.
At this point the MVP is Cabrera's to lose. The only way he doesn't win is if he gets caught for using PEDs or steroids.
And yes, I do think he's a cheater and I'd love it if that happened.
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Chris Davis and Robinson Cano had no shot from day one.
At this point the MVP is Cabrera's to lose. The only way he doesn't win is if he gets caught for using PEDs or steroids.
And yes, I do think he's a cheater and I'd love it if that happened.
I don't think he's a cheater but nobody surprises me at this point.
I could still see Chris Davis winning it if he gets close to 60 homers and the Orioles make the playoffs. But neither of those is happening.
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I could still see Chris Davis winning it if he gets close to 60 homers and the Orioles make the playoffs. But neither of those is happening.
No chance. At this point all Davis can do is to just finish the season with the most HRs in the bigs and keep Cabrera's PED-induced hands away from another triple crown (then again who's to say Davis himself isn't juicing?).
Anyway if Cabrera doesn't get the MVP for some reason, it'll go to Trout. He's everybody's plan-B.
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what's with the hate for Miggy??
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Locked.
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what's with the hate for Miggy??
He looks like he's on steroids.
He stole the MVP last year from Mike Trout who was the more deserving candidate.
I hate anybody who wears a Tigers uniform. I've always despised that team and the thought of the best hitter in baseball being on that team pisses me off to no end.
I've also hated him since his alchohol issues came to light. Now I realise that he's human and he deserves to injest some alchohol every once in a while. But then he had to put innocent lives at risk by driving under the influence. Or he was planning to (I think the police stopped him before he actually drove a car). I'm willing to defend steroid users/PED users since they never hurt or could've potientially hurt anybody but themselves but not players who get drunk and threaten innocent lives by driving under the influence (or if they're like Delmon Young and they just beat up random people on the street and call them racially insensitive slurs).
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mike trout is a pussy, he deserved nothing more than a nice contract which he doesn't have ironically
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Steroids or not, Miggy is an amazing hitter. His numbers have always been very consistent. At some point, he would've had a positive test or popped up on numerous lists. It's more speculation.
I'd say Chris Davis gets caught on roids way before Miggy.
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what's with the hate for Miggy??
He looks like he's on steroids.
He stole the MVP last year from Mike Trout who was the more deserving candidate.
I hate anybody who wears a Tigers uniform. I've always despised that team and the thought of the best hitter in baseball being on that team pisses me off to no end.
I've also hated him since his alchohol issues came to light. Now I realise that he's human and he deserves to injest some alchohol every once in a while. But then he had to put innocent lives at risk by driving under the influence. Or he was planning to (I think the police stopped him before he actually drove a car). I'm willing to defend steroid users/PED users since they never hurt or could've potientially hurt anybody but themselves but not players who get drunk and threaten innocent lives by driving under the influence (or if they're like Delmon Young and they just beat up random people on the street and call them racially insensitive slurs).
you've got some deep seeded hatred issues for Tigers players
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Mike Trout should win, and he should have won last year. Too bad the Angels are weak as fuck. He can blame Pooholes, and Drunkington for ruining his chances.
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Mike Trout should win, and he should have won last year. Too bad the Angels are weak as fuck. He can blame Pooholes, and Drunkington for ruining his chances.
win based on what?
cabrera hits more homers, RBI, has a better batting average, on base percentage and a far better slugging %
miggy plays 3rd base...not well but a-rod is the only person to play 3rd to put up a full season as good as Miggy this year, EVER. mike schmidt's best year was during a strike and only played 110 games.
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Mike Trout should win, and he should have won last year. Too bad the Angels are weak as fuck. He can blame Pooholes, and Drunkington for ruining his chances.
win based on what?
cabrera hits more homers, RBI, has a better batting average, on base percentage and a far better slugging %
miggy plays 3rd base...not well but a-rod is the only person to play 3rd to put up a full season as good as Miggy this year, EVER. mike schmidt's best year was during a strike and only played 110 games.
RBI is a bullshit stat, and Trout has more hits, more doubles, triples, and stolen bases. They are very close in obp, and not that far off in average. Trout plays exceptional defense in a premier position as well. His defense saves enough runs that overall he is a much more complete player. Migg should be a DH at this point. He may be a better hitter, but he is not the better player.
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their OPS's are not close and RBI is not a bullshit stat considering Cabrera destroys everybody else in the entire MLB in that category too.
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their OPS's are not close and RBI is not a bullshit stat considering Cabrera destroys everybody else in the entire MLB in that category too.
False.
Consider how completely different the two lineups are and different methods the pitchers use to pitch to these two. With Trout and the shitty Angels he's got no line-up protection and rarely ever has anyone on base before him to drive in. With Cabrera and the Tigers he has line-up protection with Prince Fielder and Victor Martinez hitting behind him and guys like Torii Hunter and Austin Jackson are frequently on base before he comes up to the plate.
Try and imagine how much better Trout's RBI stat would be if he played on a team with a stacked lineup like the Cardinals, Pirates or Reds.
And if you still aren't convinced, look at the Reds. Brandon Phillips has the most RBIs on that team yet it's clear that Joey Votto is the best hitter on that team.
That said, the way Cabrera makes up for his terrible defense with his bat is amazing. But Trout doesn't have to make up for terrible defense because he's not a shitty ass defender. When you compare the complete package (offense, defense and everything else) they're pretty equal. With Trout getting a slight edge due to his age.
And yes I have a deep hatred for Tigers players. But only when they're Tigers players wearing that awful uniform. I didn't mind Cabrera when he was a Marlin, I didn't mind Fielder when he was a Brewer, I didn't mind Scherzer when he was a Diamondback, I didn't mind Jackson when he was a Yankee, I loved Hunter when he was a Twin and on the other side of it I didn't mind Boesch when he became a Yankee, I loved Granderson when he became a Yankee and I didn't mind Turner when he became a Marlin. But when you play for that team and wear that uniform you're a terrible person (IMO).
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trout doesn't even have more home runs than mark trumbo
and RBI is not a BS stat, Trout just isn't G enough to bat 3rd like Miggy
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trout doesn't even have more home runs than mark trumbo
and RBI is not a BS stat, Trout just isn't G enough to bat 3rd like Miggy
RBI is a BS stat if you want to judge an individual player's performance on it. The only time RBI can be considered a legit stat is when you think of it as a team stat, nothing else. It doesn't show how good or bad a certain player is because any player, no matter how shitty, can get an RBI. Just look at the Astros, even they have players who have RBIs.
And the amount of HRs a hitter hits doesn't show he good he is either. If we were to judge players based on home run totals then Chris Davis would be the best player in all of baseball right now, and we all know who factual that is.
And yes Mike Trout is "G" enough to hit third in a good lineup. Just put 2 high OBP guys like Shin Soo Choo in front of him and let him drive those guys in. Some actual protection behind him won't hurt either.
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trout doesn't even have more home runs than mark trumbo
and RBI is not a BS stat, Trout just isn't G enough to bat 3rd like Miggy
RBI is a BS stat if you want to judge an individual player's performance on it. The only time RBI can be considered a legit stat is when you think of it as a team stat, nothing else. It doesn't show how good or bad a certain player is because any player, no matter how shitty, can get an RBI. Just look at the Astros, even they have players who have RBIs.
And the amount of HRs a hitter hits doesn't show he good he is either. If we were to judge players based on home run totals then Chris Davis would be the best player in all of baseball right now, and we all know who factual that is.
And yes Mike Trout is "G" enough to hit third in a good lineup. Just put 2 high OBP guys like Shin Soo Choo in front of him and let him drive those guys in. Some actual protection behind him won't hurt either.
RBI says a lot about a guys value at knocking in runs
why do you think guys like Adam Dunn and Dave Kingman are worthless? because the only RBI they get are from home runs.
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RBI says a lot about a guys value at knocking in runs
why do you think guys like Adam Dunn and Dave Kingman are worthless? because the only RBI they get are from home runs.
No it doesn't. It just shows that the player who got the RBI put at least 1 run on the board.
RBI is a team stat because it takes a team effort to earn a lot of them. I'll use the Reds again. The only reason Brandon Phillips has as many RBIs as he does is because he's got Shin Soo Choo and Joey Votto, two very high OBP guys, batting before him and they're always on base. And just the other day the Reds tried having Phillips bat 2nd in their lineup and had Jay Bruce hit behind Votto. Lo and behold Phillips had zero RBIs to speak of while Bruce picked up at least 5 (I can't remember the exact number) in that game.
Bottom line, RBIs don't matter when it comes to judging players individually. They tell us absolutely nothing about how valuable they are to their team, just that they happened to make contact at the right time. If you think otherwise than you're too attached to all those "old-school baseball" cliches.
It's the 21st century, all those old stats like .AVG, RBIs, HRs, Wins, Losses, ERAs, SOs don't matter nowadays as they once did. There's all sorts of new stats now to help better determine how valuable a player is like babip, iso, so/bb ratio, those to show how valuable players are defensively like UZR and those to kind of show how valuable the player is the team like WAR.
Anyway, if you're looking for a stat that'll judge how good a player is in a "clutch" situation where the player could potentially get an RBI, there's this stat called .RISP (runners in scoring position) which measures a player's batting average with runners in scoring position. That's a lot more credible as an individual stat than RBI will ever be.
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Trout is a much more complete player than Miggy and would have been MVP last year and this year if not for the fact that Angels are awful.
Miggy is the best hitter in the league, no question, but there's far more to baseball than just batting.
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Trout is a much more complete player than Miggy and would have been MVP last year and this year if not for the fact that Angels are awful.
Miggy is the best hitter in the league, no question, but there's far more to baseball than just batting.
miggy plays 3rd base, that's a lot tougher than playing any outfield spot
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RBI says a lot about a guys value at knocking in runs
why do you think guys like Adam Dunn and Dave Kingman are worthless? because the only RBI they get are from home runs.
No it doesn't. It just shows that the player who got the RBI put at least 1 run on the board.
RBI is a team stat because it takes a team effort to earn a lot of them. I'll use the Reds again. The only reason Brandon Phillips has as many RBIs as he does is because he's got Shin Soo Choo and Joey Votto, two very high OBP guys, batting before him and they're always on base. And just the other day the Reds tried having Phillips bat 2nd in their lineup and had Jay Bruce hit behind Votto. Lo and behold Phillips had zero RBIs to speak of while Bruce picked up at least 5 (I can't remember the exact number) in that game.
Bottom line, RBIs don't matter when it comes to judging players individually. They tell us absolutely nothing about how valuable they are to their team, just that they happened to make contact at the right time. If you think otherwise than you're too attached to all those "old-school baseball" cliches.
It's the 21st century, all those old stats like .AVG, RBIs, HRs, Wins, Losses, ERAs, SOs don't matter nowadays as they once did. There's all sorts of new stats now to help better determine how valuable a player is like babip, iso, so/bb ratio, those to show how valuable players are defensively like UZR and those to kind of show how valuable the player is the team like WAR.
Anyway, if you're looking for a stat that'll judge how good a player is in a "clutch" situation where the player could potentially get an RBI, there's this stat called .RISP (runners in scoring position) which measures a player's batting average with runners in scoring position. That's a lot more credible as an individual stat than RBI will ever be.
Miggy all day. MVP. Go Tigers.
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Trout is a much more complete player than Miggy and would have been MVP last year and this year if not for the fact that Angels are awful.
Miggy is the best hitter in the league, no question, but there's far more to baseball than just batting.
miggy plays 3rd base, that's a lot tougher than playing any outfield spot
You are wrong so much in this thread it hurts. RBI's are a byproduct of hits. Trout has more hits, so the fact he has less RBI's is meaningless. It is a team stat, not an individual stat. They bat in different positions as well. If you think that 3rd base is more important defensively than centerfield then you should go choke yourself.
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3rd base is more valuable...all of the infield is harder to play outside of 1st base
and Trout has ONE more hit in many more at-bats...that ain't shit
RBI's are important...you can't win without knocking runners in, can you?
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3rd base is more valuable...all of the infield is harder to play outside of 1st base
and Trout has ONE more hit in many more at-bats...that ain't shit
RBI's are important...you can't win without knocking runners in, can you?
You make my head hurt. RBI's are not a measure of a batters performance. A batter could bat leadoff get over 200 hits and have shit for RBI's because no one is on base, Ichiro is a great example. Does that mean he is less of a hitter than a guy who may get 100 hits with people on 2nd and 3rd so they will have many more RBI's? I mean do you really think that Trout has more runners on base batting lead off and second for the lowly Angels, than Cabrera does batting 4th for the Tigers??? They are NOT a valid stat for measuring individual performance, because they are influenced by outside variables, such as the quality of the players surrounding him. Now I'm sure you are going to argue that counts for other stats too like HR's with no one protecting the player, but overall, RBI's are not used any longer as a yardstick of performance.
And it's common knowledge that A good quality centerfielder will get more outs per game than a good quality 3rd baseman. More balls are hit to a wide range having centerfielder on average, thus more outs are produced. You would not say a SS is less important than a 3rd baseman, and this is the same logic.
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Trout is a much more complete player than Miggy and would have been MVP last year and this year if not for the fact that Angels are awful.
Miggy is the best hitter in the league, no question, but there's far more to baseball than just batting.
miggy plays 3rd base, that's a lot tougher than playing any outfield spot
You are wrong so much in this thread it hurts. RBI's are a byproduct of hits. Trout has more hits, so the fact he has less RBI's is meaningless. It is a team stat, not an individual stat. They bat in different positions as well. If you think that 3rd base is more important defensively than centerfield then you should go choke yourself.
hahahahaha
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the hardest positions to play are shortstop and catcher. then comes 2nd base, then 3rd. then centerfield and the other 3 are all equal (maybe 1st is tougher because you see the ball the most).
centerfield used to be a lot tougher when the ballparks were 500 feet deep but now they are only 400-420 ish most places. the reaction time playing 3rd is a lot tougher than anywhere in the outfield.
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RBI's are important...you can't win without knocking runners in, can you?
Again, RBIs are only important when it comes to evaluating TEAMS AS A WHOLE. You can make a case and say that "This team is good because all of it's players have combined for 1000+ RBIs" or something like that but you CAN'T say "this player is good because he's got 100 RBIs." You will be laughed at and ridiculed by anyone who has a clue about baseball.
And you brought up "worthless" Adam Dunn a while back, let's look at his career stats. He's had several 100 RBI seasons under his belt and has aprox 1,100 RBIs to his name. If RBIs are so important then Adam Dunn should be one of the top 10 players in the MLB.
And no, the three outfield spots are not equal in the least. As centerfielder your reactions are constantly tested as you're in charge of various actions. Such as deciding whether or not you're going to catch the ball yourself or let one of the other fielders get it. Plus in right field you need to have quick reflexes and have the ability to throw the ball as soon as the ball reaches your glove/hand, otherwise base runners in scoring position will always score on you and you will lose your job. Hack, you are underestimating how hard and important being an outfielder is. It's not like they're just standing around waiting for fly balls, they're just as important as infielders.
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the hardest positions to play are shortstop and catcher. then comes 2nd base, then 3rd. then centerfield and the other 3 are all equal (maybe 1st is tougher because you see the ball the most).
centerfield used to be a lot tougher when the ballparks were 500 feet deep but now they are only 400-420 ish most places. the reaction time playing 3rd is a lot tougher than anywhere in the outfield.
You need to make like fat joe and lean back with this argument. The more you try and rationalize your points, the more I realize that you lack anything beyond the basic knowledge of the game. Your original post was good. It's legit to argue about individual players and how they compare to each other. But you are now trying to argue about facts of the game. Just take the L and walk it off.
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have you ever even played baseball before? 3rd base is a lot tougher to field than any outfield position.
and back to the point of the thread...Trout isn't even a top 3 candidate because he hasn't played a meaningful game in 3-4 months
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have you ever even played baseball before? 3rd base is a lot tougher to field than any outfield position.
and back to the point of the thread...Trout isn't even a top 3 candidate because he hasn't played a meaningful game in 3-4 months
Lol you may think I'm bullshitting but I played 3rd base from tee ball through high school:). 3rd base might be scary but its not as important as up the middle positions. Think about it ss, 2nd, c, and cf are the most prized defensive positions for a reason
And yeah even though I think trout deserves it the angels stink on ice:(
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Trout isn't even a top 3 candidate because he hasn't played a meaningful game in 3-4 months
Then who are the other two besides Cabrera then?
Davis? Fuck no.
Cano? Fucking no again.
Trout is a MVP contender regardless of whether or not his team sucks ass. He's having a season that's just as good as the one he had last year, and last year the MVP voting was very close between him and Cabrera.
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have you ever even played baseball before? 3rd base is a lot tougher to field than any outfield position.
and back to the point of the thread...Trout isn't even a top 3 candidate because he hasn't played a meaningful game in 3-4 months
CF takes much more athleticism. Can you imagine a guy like Adrian Beltre playing CF? LOL, not saying it's a simple position by any means, but you're really underestimating the value of CF.
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we'll agree to disagree then, fellas.
i couldn't imagine Andruw Jones playing 3rd base but he was one of the best ever defensive CFers
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we'll agree to disagree then, fellas.
i couldn't imagine Andruw Jones playing 3rd base but he was one of the best ever defensive CFers
At the same token I can't imagine Miguel Cabrera playing CF. He's terrible at fielding anything that comes within a 5 block radius of him.
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miguel cabrera shouldn't be playing defense period...anywhere