West Coast Connection Forum
DUBCC - Tha Connection => West Coast Classics => Topic started by: Desert Lord on April 10, 2014, 05:33:22 AM
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http://smokingsection.uproxx.com/TSS/2014/04/dr-dre-10-best-co-producers#page/1
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Dre's aftermath staff seemed to have gotten more credit then say Daz and Glove have. But it was part of them paying dues. And both have still yet to come out and drop shit now that can compete with all the work they did with Dre. Daz is an exception but since he left Death Row he has not been a major player in production In nearly a decade, and now is the time where producers are appreciated the most put the mic down and lay some beats and hooks. That's what daz was great at with death row he wrote to the beats as well I heard that is why he always got writing credit eve on trackage didn't produce at death row.
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I think it's more about Dre admitting to session players and co producers but he keeps secret when big name/established producers do his stuff
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I think it's more likely that this new generation of producers learned from the mistakes Daz, Warren G, Sam Sneed, Glove, etc made. They have their business game down and aren't in a position where Dre (or anyone) can just come along and take their shit and stamp his name on it.
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Pretty interesting article but DJ Yella didn't co-produce on the D.O.C. shit. Dre is credited as the producer only and it makes sense because it sounds nothing like Eazy's or NWA's albums.
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i think daz got enough credit over time. The Glove really does deserve more credit because that guy does it all, from playing the keys to engineering and mixing down the songs. and you really have to look into things to find out he's co-produced classics like stranded on death row, doggy dogg world, hello or xxxplosive. say daz's name to casual rap fans, a lot of them will at least identify who he is, say chris the glove taylor to them, i bet ya not even one out of twenty recognizes his name lol.
Soopafly needs more credit too cause he came up under Dre too.
what GangstaBoogy says is right, according to The Glove, his differences and legal turmoil with Dre regarding him not getting the proper credit and payment for the early Aftermath releases which led him to be removed altogether from the Math is the reason why Mel Man was credited as the co-producer on every song of 2001, and therefore why every Dre song was credited with other co producers (mike elizondo, scott storch, kamara kambon, etc.)
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I don't know. From being someone who actually reads production credits, I recognize pretty much all these people from their years of working on Dr. Dre's team but in the end, if you're the man behind the man, how much credit do you expect? The role is always going to be what it is. It's a similar situation with someone like Neal Brennan who wrote "Chappelle's Show" with Dave or Roger Avary who was an early writing collaborator with Quentin Tarantino or any number of people who wrote "The Simpsons" for Matt Groening or "Family Guy" for Seth McFarlane or the uncredited writers who came up with the concepts that helped Vince McMahon build his WWF/WWE empire.
In the end if you're involved in someone else's brand, you get whatever you're going to get but you're never going to get the level of credit that is going to equal out to the person who is the face of that brand. Fact is none of those people get publicly pissed on when Dre is slumping so they gotta take the good with the bad.
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I don't know. From being someone who actually reads production credits, I recognize pretty much all these people from their years of working on Dr. Dre's team but in the end, if you're the man behind the man, how much credit do you expect? The role is always going to be what it is. It's a similar situation with someone like Neal Brennan who wrote "Chappelle's Show" with Dave or Roger Avary who was an early writing collaborator with Quentin Tarantino or any number of people who wrote "The Simpsons" for Matt Groening or "Family Guy" for Seth McFarlane or the uncredited writers who came up with the concepts that helped Vince McMahon build his WWF/WWE empire.
In the end if you're involved in someone else's brand, you get whatever you're going to get but you're never going to get the level of credit that is going to equal out to the person who is the face of that brand. Fact is none of those people get publicly pissed on when Dre is slumping so they gotta take the good with the bad.
Bottom line is, its envy. They want to be where Dre is and understandably so. But the thing is, it comes down to that IT factor. Dre has always had that IT. He was destined for greatness. He has the complete package and he wasn't going to let anyone stop him.
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I was expecting to see Cold 187um on the list. Didn't he have a hand in the Ruthless productions and some of the later NWA beats?
In regard to the rest of the list, I think all of those producers/musicians, except maybe Chris Taylor, received the credit they deserved. Dre helped them get recognition that they otherwise might not have had. There is nothing stopping any of them from going out and producing hits or using the exposure to produce songs for other artists. It sucks that some of them have assisted with incredible beats, but can't seem to replicate another hit to save their lives. I wonder how a producer like Daz goes from producing Ambitionz az a Ridah, Dogg Food, and Doggystyle to seeking help from Jermaine Dupri, and not being able to put another solid beat together.
Their next list should be, producers that Dre helped and deserves more credit. 8)
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Has Hutch ever really claimed to be a co-producer on any of Dre's hits? I think his biggest contention was always that he was the true innovator of G-Funk. I mean, what is a specific Dr. Dre record that Hutch produced with Dre?
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I don't think Dr. Dre ever had a problem with giving the credit to whoever deserves it. I think the problem early on as his bass player Tony Green and a few other of his session musicians have said, is in the beginning they didn't know how to give proper credits the right way. Which makes sense because if you look at early album covers from ruthless to Dre's run at Death Row, you will see minimal credit (from writers, to engineers, to co-producers) on the booklets. Dre being a producer himself, I don't think he ever wanted to intentionally steal anyone's shine. On the flip side of that, with no proper credits it's easy for someone to come later on down the line & say "I did this, I did that". But the story remains, whoever is credited as a co-producer or whatever, any beat others have done with Dre sounds like a Dre beat regardless of who helped him so it's no denying he put just as much work, if not more, as whoever is co-producing with him. I think now the credits are proper now that he knows what he's doing as far as album notes. Just look at Relapse for example, some tracks are credited to a co-producer, some are solely credited to Dre so it's clear that who did what is being credited. And to my knowledge the only thing Dre & Hutch worked on together at Ruthless was Above the Law's first album & both were credited as producers on the album, just not individual songs weren't credited so we don't know who actually did what. But if you have a good ear you can tell who did what.
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Also, at the same time, it's not like the original beats were always as great as they became once Dre worked his magic. Yes, you can absolutely tell that the beats are similar, but the differences are sometimes huge in terms of overall quality. And it's not like a ton of those guys could have done it without Dre... some of them were wise enough to use what they learned and continue their momentum, like Scott Storch. Daz could've, if Death Row didn't fall apart and shit didn't sour between him and Suge so bad.
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Has Hutch ever really claimed to be a co-producer on any of Dre's hits? I think his biggest contention was always that he was the true innovator of G-Funk. I mean, what is a specific Dr. Dre record that Hutch produced with Dre?
yeah he was/is mostly bickering about g funk.
he did talk about giving breakbeats to Dre for NWA. i don't remember the source of the interview though
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Hutch made this claim a few years ago
http://www.hiphopdx.com/index/news/id.20178/title.big-hutch-releases-video-regarding-eve-dr-dre-love-is-blind-lawsuit
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Hutch made this claim a few years ago
http://www.hiphopdx.com/index/news/id.20178/title.big-hutch-releases-video-regarding-eve-dr-dre-love-is-blind-lawsuit
i wonder what happened to that lawsuit.
anyway that article has a link to an older interview too, but hutch seems very humble towards dre in that interview
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Hutch made this claim a few years ago
http://www.hiphopdx.com/index/news/id.20178/title.big-hutch-releases-video-regarding-eve-dr-dre-love-is-blind-lawsuit
Yeah, but with Hutch, I've never heard him make claims about co-producing songs with Dre. With the other artists, you have people who claim they didn't get credit for work on Dre-produced songs. Dre was given no production credit on "Love Is Blind" to my knowledge. It's credited to Swizz Beatz. That doesn't mean Dre didn't steal it from Hutch but if he did, he didn't take credit for it.
The G-Funk claim seems more over "innovating a style" than specific songs. Hutch said he and Dre worked with each other at Ruthless and Dre borrowed some of his influences without naming him as the innovator. This is a much different claim than saying you gave someone the skeleton for a track and they didn't give you the right credit. Again, this isn't to say that Dre didn't do this with Hutch as well but if he has, Hutch has never cited examples.
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Hutch made this claim a few years ago
http://www.hiphopdx.com/index/news/id.20178/title.big-hutch-releases-video-regarding-eve-dr-dre-love-is-blind-lawsuit
i wonder what happened to that lawsuit.
anyway that article has a link to an older interview too, but hutch seems very humble towards dre in that interview
yeah but Hutch has made claims for years about him innovating GFunk, it seems that he goes back and forthHutch made this claim a few years ago
http://www.hiphopdx.com/index/news/id.20178/title.big-hutch-releases-video-regarding-eve-dr-dre-love-is-blind-lawsuit
Yeah, but with Hutch, I've never heard him make claims about co-producing songs with Dre. With the other artists, you have people who claim they didn't get credit for work on Dre-produced songs. Dre was given no production credit on "Love Is Blind" to my knowledge. It's credited to Swizz Beatz. That doesn't mean Dre didn't steal it from Hutch but if he did, he didn't take credit for it.
The G-Funk claim seems more over "innovating a style" than specific songs. Hutch said he and Dre worked with each other at Ruthless and Dre borrowed some of his influences without naming him as the innovator. This is a much different claim than saying you gave someone the skeleton for a track and they didn't give you the right credit. Again, this isn't to say that Dre didn't do this with Hutch as well but if he has, Hutch has never cited examples.
the only thing that I can think of was the "Livin like hustlaz" album which they were both producers on but I dont have the credits so I dont know if they were listed as coproducers on some of the same tracks and Hutch has never named specifics
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Hutch made this claim a few years ago
http://www.hiphopdx.com/index/news/id.20178/title.big-hutch-releases-video-regarding-eve-dr-dre-love-is-blind-lawsuit
i wonder what happened to that lawsuit.
anyway that article has a link to an older interview too, but hutch seems very humble towards dre in that interview
yeah but Hutch has made claims for years about him innovating GFunk, it seems that he goes back and forthHutch made this claim a few years ago
http://www.hiphopdx.com/index/news/id.20178/title.big-hutch-releases-video-regarding-eve-dr-dre-love-is-blind-lawsuit
Yeah, but with Hutch, I've never heard him make claims about co-producing songs with Dre. With the other artists, you have people who claim they didn't get credit for work on Dre-produced songs. Dre was given no production credit on "Love Is Blind" to my knowledge. It's credited to Swizz Beatz. That doesn't mean Dre didn't steal it from Hutch but if he did, he didn't take credit for it.
The G-Funk claim seems more over "innovating a style" than specific songs. Hutch said he and Dre worked with each other at Ruthless and Dre borrowed some of his influences without naming him as the innovator. This is a much different claim than saying you gave someone the skeleton for a track and they didn't give you the right credit. Again, this isn't to say that Dre didn't do this with Hutch as well but if he has, Hutch has never cited examples.
the only thing that I can think of was the "Livin like hustlaz" album which they were both producers on but I dont have the credits so I dont know if they were listed as coproducers on some of the same tracks and Hutch has never named specifics
I'm fairly sure that the only track that Dre and Cold 187um produced together was 'Murder Rap' on that album (probably 'The Last Song' as well). They're the only two tracks in the booklet that specifically have Dr. Dre's name listed underneath.
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Also, at the same time, it's not like the original beats were always as great as they became once Dre worked his magic. Yes, you can absolutely tell that the beats are similar, but the differences are sometimes huge in terms of overall quality. And it's not like a ton of those guys could have done it without Dre... some of them were wise enough to use what they learned and continue their momentum, like Scott Storch. Daz could've, if Death Row didn't fall apart and shit didn't sour between him and Suge so bad.
But to play devil's advocate for a second...you can also make a case that a lot of non-Dre beats sound IDENTICAL to his shit. My favorite examples...
WC - Tha Streetz
Conway - Nutcracka
Dr. Dre & Snoop - On the Blvd
Shaunta & Truth Hurts - Benefit of the Doubt
Misteeq - Scandalous
Nas - Got Urself a Gun
Joe Beast - Gangsta
the list goes on.
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interesting that Mel-Man produced that Freek-Nasty hit... he had a couple other lead singles he produced that may not have been huge pop hits but West Coast fans loved them. "Year 2000" for Xzibit was a great song, and he produced the lead single for Snoop in Bones.
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Oh shit and don't forget these
Young Buck - Haters (I'm still in disbelief this wasn't a Dre beat, Buck even shouted him out on the track)
Tony Yayo - Live By the Gun (Yayo himself was promoting that as a Dre track)
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Also, at the same time, it's not like the original beats were always as great as they became once Dre worked his magic. Yes, you can absolutely tell that the beats are similar, but the differences are sometimes huge in terms of overall quality. And it's not like a ton of those guys could have done it without Dre... some of them were wise enough to use what they learned and continue their momentum, like Scott Storch. Daz could've, if Death Row didn't fall apart and shit didn't sour between him and Suge so bad.
But to play devil's advocate for a second...you can also make a case that a lot of non-Dre beats sound IDENTICAL to his shit. My favorite examples...
WC - Tha Streetz
Conway - Nutcracka
Dr. Dre & Snoop - On the Blvd
Shaunta & Truth Hurts - Benefit of the Doubt
Misteeq - Scandalous
Nas - Got Urself a Gun
Joe Beast - Gangsta
the list goes on.
u can tell none of those are dre beats