West Coast Connection Forum
Lifestyle => Sports & Entertainment => Topic started by: OneHittaSpitta on June 09, 2005, 10:46:53 PM
-
http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/050608&num=0
OK ok...i know how a lot of u will respond. But i feel a lot of what this guy is sayin. Even though i am a Spurs fan tho, i dont see him as the best yet. But i think he's DEFINETELY got the chance to be.
-
http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/050608&num=0
OK ok...i know how a lot of u will respond. But i feel a lot of what this guy is sayin. Even though i am a Spurs fan tho, i dont see him as the best yet. But i think he's DEFINETELY got the chance to be.
no dumbass. that title belongs to karl malone u stupid piece of shit.
-
http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=simmons/050608&num=0
OK ok...i know how a lot of u will respond. But i feel a lot of what this guy is sayin. Even though i am a Spurs fan tho, i dont see him as the best yet. But i think he's DEFINETELY got the chance to be.
no dumbass. that title belongs to karl malone u stupid piece of shit.
lol righhh little boy...
-
Eventually Duncan can become the greatest PF of all time.
-
Eventually Duncan can become the greatest PF of all time.
too bad hes to much of a pussy to play center.
-
Eventually Duncan can become the greatest PF of all time.
too bad hes to much of a pussy to play center.
You call it Pussy...Greg Popovich calls it strategy
-
KG is the best in my books....
-
but soon Amare will become the best
-
KG is the best in my books....
lol
naw duncan's not the best i dont think, Moses Malone, Karl Malone, and Sir Charles are my top three
-
Maybe he isn't as unstoppable in the low-post as KG; maybe he isn't the defender that KG is; maybe he isn't as good a passer as KG; maybe he doesn't rebound like KG; maybe he isn't as explosive as KG; maybe he doesn't put up big numbers quite as consistently the KG .
???
-
ha but how many championships and playoff series has KG won, lol
-
naw duncan's not the best i dont think, Moses Malone, Karl Malone, and Sir Charles are my top three
ha but how many championships has KG won, lol
???
lol
how many championships did Moses Malone, Karl Malone, and Sir Charles win?
(btw i dont know who the fuck Moses is)
KG still has a chance
-
^^maybe Duncan is considered better then KG, because he's the far smarter player...and typically gets the best of KG in head to heads. KG is good, i love his game. But Duncan is definetely a better power forward then him. As far as Jake...i dont think Duncan is the best ever YET, but by the end of his career (if he avoids any major injuries and whatnot) he'll definetely be the best. Like dood said in the article, all those players had amazing aspects to their games....but as an overall player, Duncan in his prime is better then them in theirs. He has far more aspects to his game then ALL of them really....including stepping it up in the playoffs which Malone and Charles didnt always do. If you were to take every major category to measure a power forward, i guarentee you Duncan would excell in a bigger variety of them....then any of those guys. The Mailman is the closest to the best IMO, but he was a pussy in the playoffs basically. Not that he didnt play hard, but he wasnt a winner...and he had some good teams, plus, John Stockton.
-
you got to remember one thing though about Malone and Barkley , they were playing in the Jordan era. you have to admit that if the bulls weren't the team they where they'd(malone and barkley) have their ring(s)
-
you got to remember one thing though about Malone and Barkley , they were playing in the Jordan era. you have to admit that if the bulls weren't the team they where they'd(malone and barkley) have their ring(s)
maybe so, u never know though. I always wish my team had the chance to play against Jordan in the finals. As far as Malone and Barkley getting rings if Jordan wasnt there, its so hard to say. The entire league revolved around Jordan. Teams in the East signed and released players strictly on ways to defend Jordan. So who knows what alot of those teams woulda looked like without Jordan in the league. Who knows how good the Knicks would have been? They had a pretty solid team for a few years, they just got killed by Jordan every year. Besides, according to u Laker fans....Shaq was the most "dominant" player ever (not that i agree), and we won 2 championships during that time.
-
Duncan is a great player, and he gets the job done which is what counts I guess but hes such a boring/dull player. The style that he plays makes me fall asleep. His play has no spark or excitement to it, he gets 28 points each game and I dont even notice it. I dont think I've ever seen him catch a alley oop and dunk it in the air. Thats the only reason I don't like him that much, it doesn't mean he isn't a great player, its just my reason.
-
Duncan is a great player, and he gets the job done which is what counts I guess but hes such a boring/dull player. The style that he plays makes me fall asleep. His play has no spark or excitement to it, he gets 28 points each game and I dont even notice it. I dont think I've ever seen him catch a alley oop and dunk it in the air. Thats the only reason I don't like him that much, it doesn't mean he isn't a great player, its just my reason.
so youd like him better if he got 5 alley oops per game, and only scored 10 points? lol
-
Eventually Duncan can become the greatest PF of all time.
-
Saying that is like saying Kobe is the best Guard ever...You can say it, but there's no way to tell until it's all said and done.
-
Eventually Duncan can become the greatest PF of all time.
too bad hes to much of a pussy to play center.
U MAKE LAKER FANS LOOK BAD
-
Eventually Duncan can become the greatest PF of all time.
too bad hes to much of a pussy to play center.
U MAKE LAKER FANS LOOK BAD
A person can only make themselves look bad...
-
Saying that is like saying Kobe is the best Guard ever...You can say it, but there's no way to tell until it's all said and done.
naw...cus im not saying he's the best already. Im saying, take any of those Great power forwards BEST aspects to their individual game....and Duncan can come close to all of them on their BEST category, but he takes them in every other category (not just numbers). Not ONE of them was as well rounded a player as he is. Not one. Obviously he has to finish of his career first, but barring some major injury i dont see him slowing down really. The players who typically slow it down a LOT are the ones who rely solely on athletisism. Thats why i have a hard time backing Amare just yet. He reminds me of Kemp so much. Skill doesnt dissapear, athletisism does. And VERY few players who relied on their athletisism early in their career...were able to completely adjust their game to fit the loss of it toward the end. MJ is one of the only ones i can think of.
-
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2074360
-
^^^whats this article about?
-
^^^whats this article about?
it was just a buncha ESPN analysts rating the top power forwards of all time...
-
I have to go with Karl Malone on this one. Duncan is too soft to be the best PF ever. The Spurs have won 2 championships and most likely will win another one this year so he has that going for him.
-
Duncun has the championships...3-5 more years of good numbers...he'll be considered the BEST
Unless Garnett wins a championship anytim soon...then Garnett has the title 8)
-
Duncan is a great player, and he gets the job done which is what counts I guess but hes such a boring/dull player. The style that he plays makes me fall asleep. His play has no spark or excitement to it, he gets 28 points each game and I dont even notice it. I dont think I've ever seen him catch a alley oop and dunk it in the air. Thats the only reason I don't like him that much, it doesn't mean he isn't a great player, its just my reason.
so youd like him better if he got 5 alley oops per game, and only scored 10 points? lol
why couldnt he get 5 alley oops and get 10 points plus 18 more of his boring ass points
-
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Who cares if he's fancy as long as he's winning? If he wins this year and one or two more he may make the top ten list all time for players. Definately the top 50.
Karl Malone relied a lot on Stockton. I'd like to see Malone's career without one of the best stealers and set up men in the league. Moses was incerdible. I'm not sure about him vs Duncan just yet. I can't believe the guy who posted he didn't know who Moses Malone was. Garnett's got nothing on Duncan.
Also, people actually call Shaq the most dominant ever? Bill Russel was the most dominat ever, hands down. 11 championship in 13 years, and only missed the finals once. The last two years of his career he won, he was the coach and the team captain. 5 time MVP winner, and really should have been 6 or 7 times. I'd like to see someone argue a guy being more dominant than that.
-
you can't really compare the NBA of those days to the NBA of now, the game is so different now.
-
Tim is better then shaq but i think karl is the best
-
I have to go with Karl Malone on this one. Duncan is too soft to be the best PF ever. The Spurs have won 2 championships and most likely will win another one this year so he has that going for him.
i see Malone as soft, Duncan steps up during playoff time...Malone folded. Besides, Duncans been to like 8 strait all defensive teams, how does a "soft" player end up on the all defensive team every year? He isnt soft, he just doesnt talk a bunch of shit....some people get that confuzed. Denver and Seattle both, had the defensive plan to try and muscle Duncan....get physical with him. Thats everybodies strategy, and its never worked.
Quiet doesnt equal soft. While everyone else acts tough on the court, talks a ganga shit, and cant control their emotions....Duncan keeps quiet, and beats them.
-
you can't really compare the NBA of those days to the NBA of now, the game is so different now.
That's a cop out. The bottom line is that no one dominated like Russel.
-
I have to go with Karl Malone on this one. Duncan is too soft to be the best PF ever. The Spurs have won 2 championships and most likely will win another one this year so he has that going for him.
i see Malone as soft, Duncan steps up during playoff time...Malone folded. Besides, Duncans been to like 8 strait all defensive teams, how does a "soft" player end up on the all defensive team every year? He isnt soft, he just doesnt talk a bunch of shit....some people get that confuzed. Denver and Seattle both, had the defensive plan to try and muscle Duncan....get physical with him. Thats everybodies strategy, and its never worked.
Quiet doesnt equal soft. While everyone else acts tough on the court, talks a ganga shit, and cant control their emotions....Duncan keeps quiet, and beats them.
What I mean by soft is that Tim gets rattled real easily, loses composure and then he just sulks around. In the 01 playoffs against the Lakers, he gave up after game 2. he just pouted around the court. The same thing happened to him last year after Malone checked him on D.
-
well if it wasnt for Dereks .4 shot, Duncan would have been the hero of that LakerSpurs series.
-
I have to go with Karl Malone on this one. Duncan is too soft to be the best PF ever. The Spurs have won 2 championships and most likely will win another one this year so he has that going for him.
i see Malone as soft, Duncan steps up during playoff time...Malone folded. Besides, Duncans been to like 8 strait all defensive teams, how does a "soft" player end up on the all defensive team every year? He isnt soft, he just doesnt talk a bunch of shit....some people get that confuzed. Denver and Seattle both, had the defensive plan to try and muscle Duncan....get physical with him. Thats everybodies strategy, and its never worked.
Quiet doesnt equal soft. While everyone else acts tough on the court, talks a ganga shit, and cant control their emotions....Duncan keeps quiet, and beats them.
What I mean by soft is that Tim gets rattled real easily, loses composure and then he just sulks around. In the 01 playoffs against the Lakers, he gave up after game 2. he just pouted around the court. The same thing happened to him last year after Malone checked him on D.
Malone didnt check him on D. Malone has never really been able to stop him. Also like i said, people take his personality and expressions too far. He gets that look on his face, but it doesnt mean he's quitting. If he gets rattled so easy, then how come no one seems to be able to rattle him? I mean, he's gone through round one with Camby and Kenyon Martin, both two of the better defending big men in the league....and Martin very physical. Round 2, having Fortson basically just taking cheap shots at him whenever possible...and knows as kind of a dirty player. Round 3, Amare...who's defense is wack, but a tough matchup on the other end. And now Ben and Rasheed Wallace in the finals. If he dominates this series again, like he has all the others....what else does he need to do against the big men in the league? He kills em. Even in past Laker series, he's stepped up to Guard Shaq....and actually did a better job then anyone else on the team, and offensively was unstoppable. Every player goes through spurts where they arent ontop of their game. Duncan is more consistent then any of those big men....but when he has one, very rare moment of weakness...he's soft? lol. How come none of those other bigmen were considered "soft" when they folded every year in the post season?
-
well if it wasnt for Dereks .4 shot, Duncan would have been the hero of that LakerSpurs series.
lol yeah....the one that broke every shot clock rule in the book. A turn around, fade away, falling down jumper with .4 on the clock? hmm...oh well though. I was SURE that the winner of the Spurs/Lakers series last year was takin the title.
-
well if it wasnt for Dereks .4 shot, Duncan would have been the hero of that LakerSpurs series.
lol yeah....the one that broke every shot clock rule in the book. A turn around, fade away, falling down jumper with .4 on the clock? hmm...oh well though. I was SURE that the winner of the Spurs/Lakers series last year was takin the title.
LMAO...You think the refs cheated? Come on now, don't tell me you haven't gotten over it yet...
-
well if it wasnt for Dereks .4 shot, Duncan would have been the hero of that LakerSpurs series.
lol yeah....the one that broke every shot clock rule in the book. A turn around, fade away, falling down jumper with .4 on the clock? hmm...oh well though. I was SURE that the winner of the Spurs/Lakers series last year was takin the title.
LMAO...You think the refs cheated? Come on now, don't tell me you haven't gotten over it yet...
just goin on what ive heard out of the mouths of other NBA players, etc. Btw...naw, i dont think the refs cheated. I think they made a mistake on that shot. I blame us regardless so dont trip, we should have finished off that series...and didnt. You guys played the whole series...so i give u credit.
-
well if it wasnt for Dereks .4 shot, Duncan would have been the hero of that LakerSpurs series.
lol yeah....the one that broke every shot clock rule in the book. A turn around, fade away, falling down jumper with .4 on the clock? hmm...oh well though. I was SURE that the winner of the Spurs/Lakers series last year was takin the title.
LMAO...You think the refs cheated? Come on now, don't tell me you haven't gotten over it yet...
just goin on what ive heard out of the mouths of other NBA players, etc. Btw...naw, i dont think the refs cheated. I think they made a mistake on that shot. I blame us regardless so dont trip, we should have finished off that series...and didnt. You guys played the whole series...so i give u credit.
Why you keep getting new names?
-
well if it wasnt for Dereks .4 shot, Duncan would have been the hero of that LakerSpurs series.
lol yeah....the one that broke every shot clock rule in the book. A turn around, fade away, falling down jumper with .4 on the clock? hmm...oh well though. I was SURE that the winner of the Spurs/Lakers series last year was takin the title.
LMAO...You think the refs cheated? Come on now, don't tell me you haven't gotten over it yet...
just goin on what ive heard out of the mouths of other NBA players, etc. Btw...naw, i dont think the refs cheated. I think they made a mistake on that shot. I blame us regardless so dont trip, we should have finished off that series...and didnt. You guys played the whole series...so i give u credit.
Why you keep getting new names?
had to restore my computer and it logged me outta the forum. for some reason tha forum still had my ol email address on here that i aint even got anymore and i couldnt remember my password. So i just made a new account.
-
since finals is "where legends are born" I have to say no.
-
since finals is "where legends are born" I have to say no.
sooo....it would be Malone? Sir Charles? Garnett? lol
-
since finals is "where legends are born" I have to say no.
sooo....it would be Malone? Sir Charles? Garnett? lol
if the spurs had the opponents the jazz had in 99 and 2003, no way they wouldve won.. just as they didnt win shit when lakers were strong. plus malone didnt suck balls in the finals did he? and nobody is talking about garnett, at least I don't.
-
Tim Duncan
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia.
Timothy Theodore Duncan (born April 25, 1976) is an NBA basketball player for the San Antonio Spurs, playing at the power forward position. He is noted for his poise, scoring and positioning ability in the offensive post, and effectiveness using some of the most basic and fundamental basketball moves.
Two-time NBA champ
Tim is the son of William and Ione Duncan and is a native of Christiansted, Saint Croix of the United States Virgin Islands. As a child there, he was a nationally-ranked swimmer at St. Dunstan's Episcopal High School. In 1989, after the island's only Olympic-size pool was destroyed by Hurricane Hugo, Duncan switched his focus to basketball.
NCAA career
Tim Duncan was a two-time ACC Player of the Year with the Wake Forest Demon Deacons and had extensive international experience playing with the USA Basketball team. He didn't begin playing organized basketball until the ninth grade.
Tim was an All-American at Wake Forest University. The psychology major (with honors) was winner of the 1997 John Wooden Award, awarded to the NCAA's overall best male player based on the votes of sportscasters and newswriters. In that season, Duncan averaged 20.8 points per game and led the nation with 14.7 rebounds per game.
Duncan finished his college career as the second best shot blocker in NCAA history, and he is one of only 10 players with more than 2,000 career points and 1,500 career rebounds. Duncan was also the first player in NCAA history to reach 1,500 points, 1,000 rebounds, 400 blocked shots and 200 assists.
NBA career
He was drafted with the first pick of the 1997 NBA Draft by the San Antonio Spurs and immediately had an impact, averaging 21.1 points per game his first season. The Spurs were able to pick Duncan (the first senior to be selected first overall since Larry Johnson) due to the fact that they were coming off a 20-62 season.
During the strike shortened 1999 NBA season, Duncan and David Robinson formed the Spurs "Twin Towers" and both led the Spurs to the franchise's NBA Finals victory. They almost swept the New York Knicks, winning in just five games that season.
In the 2001-2002 season, Duncan was named the league's MVP, joining teammate David Robinson as Spurs members who have earned this award. After 2002-2003, Duncan was named MVP for the second season in a row. Duncan and his Spurs teammates made it to the NBA finals once again, defeating the New Jersey Nets 88-77 in Game Six to win the NBA championship. Duncan was named Finals' MVP, and he and Robinson shared Sports Illustrated magazine's 2003 "Sportsmen of the Year" award. His lifetime averages in points, blocks, assists, and rebounds are higher in the playoffs than in the regular season. In the last game of the 2002-2003 NBA finals, Duncan was two blocks away from a quadruple double, finishing with 21 points, 18 rebounds, 10 assists and 8 blocks.
Duncan is famous for his graceful finesse on the court and for his low key demeanor. Possessing a sound all-around game, he has been dubbed "The Big Fundamental" by fellow NBA player Shaquille O'Neal. His signature offensive moves are his smooth footwork and his accurate bank shot. Duncan scored 53 points in an NBA game on December 26, 2001 in a home game against the Dallas Mavericks.
Statistics As of August 2004
NBA career totals
* Points: 11,862
* Rebounds: 6,407
* Assists: 1,660
* Blocks: 1,314
Per-game averages
* Points: 22.8
* Rebounds: 12.3
* Assists: 3.2
* Blocks: 2.5
Comparisons
Duncan is six feet-eleven inches tall (although prior to the 2004/05 season he was registered as a seven-footer) and weighs 260 pounds. The following compares Duncan with other current prominent big men in the NBA:
* Kevin Garnett:
Garnett is an outstanding player who relies on his athleticism and guard-like skills.
* Kenyon Martin:
Martin is a superb defender in the low block with very quick hands.
* Yao Ming:
Yao is a very consistent player, averaging 15 points a game and 8 rebounds a game throughout his career.
* Dirk Nowitzki:
Nowitzki is a member of the Dallas Mavericks. Although he often plays the power forward position, his shooting range makes him a threat from anywhere on the floor.
* Jermaine O'Neal:
Both players put up similar numbers, however Jermaine O'Neal is doing so in the weaker of the two conferences in the NBA. He is somewhat less consistent in the post.
* Shaquille O'Neal:
O'Neal's perfect defense was negated by two spectacular shots made by Duncan in game 5 of the 2004 Western Conference Semi-Finals. Both are very effective in the low block and while Shaquille O'Neal possesses a much larger body (by at least 80 pounds), Shaq is a poor outside shooter and free throw shooter. Duncan is a good shooting big man who may have cured his free throw shooting woes over the 2004 summer.
* Chris Webber:
Both of these players were known as the best power forwards in the game in the 1999-2000 season. Webber, in the 2003 playoffs, suffered a serious injury that has hampered his playing ability however.
Olympics
Duncan played with the United States national team in the Championship of The Americas in Puerto Rico, helping them qualify for the 2000 Summer Olympics. However, a knee injury forced him to stay out of the Olympic Games.
Four years later, Duncan was a member of Dream Team IV, competing in basketball at the 2004 Summer Olympics. The team lost its right to the "Dream Team" nickname by losing three games on their way to a bronze medal. That record represented more losses in a single year than in the 68 previous years combined. It was also the first time since NBA professionals became eligible that the U.S. men's basketball team returned home without gold medals. After their last game Duncan provided a concise summary of his experience on the team:
I am about 95 percent sure my FIBA career is over. I'll try not to share my experiences with anyone.[1] (http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2004/olympics/2004/basketball/08/28/usa.lithuania.ap/index.html)
Trivia
Before she succumbed to breast cancer, Tim promised his mother he would complete his university degree before playing basketball professionally.
His wife Amy was a cheerleader at Wake Forest University ;D She now oversees the Tim Duncan Foundation, which has been established to serve the areas of health awareness/research, education, and youth sports/recreation in San Antonio, Winston-Salem, and the United States Virgin Islands. She is currently expecting the couple's first child.
He is known for a calm, cool demeanor on the court, choosing to emphatically discuss calls with the referees rather than ranting and raving ;D. This in turn has granted him a large amount of respect from fellow players, broadcasters, and fans.
-
I tried to avoid this topic but let me just say Karl Malone is the best PF of All time
-
since finals is "where legends are born" I have to say no.
sooo....it would be Malone? Sir Charles? Garnett? lol
if the spurs had the opponents the jazz had in 99 and 2003, no way they wouldve won.. just as they didnt win shit when lakers were strong. plus malone didnt suck balls in the finals did he? and nobody is talking about garnett, at least I don't.
Malone NEVER got over the hump, NEVER. And he had another hall of famer on his team, and probably one of the best 2 or 3 point guards of ALL time on his team. Duncan can still win this years title, and probably a couple more in his career. Malone didnt do shit, but score a lotta points in a system geared towards getting him wide open jumpers and layups in a pick n roll. Malone was a great player, but as a well rounded power forward, Duncan is far better.
-
since finals is "where legends are born" I have to say no.
sooo....it would be Malone? Sir Charles? Garnett? lol
if the spurs had the opponents the jazz had in 99 and 2003, no way they wouldve won.. just as they didnt win shit when lakers were strong. plus malone didnt suck balls in the finals did he? and nobody is talking about garnett, at least I don't.
Malone NEVER got over the hump, NEVER. And he had another hall of famer on his team, and probably one of the best 2 or 3 point guards of ALL time on his team. Duncan can still win this years title, and probably a couple more in his career. Malone didnt do shit, but score a lotta points in a system geared towards getting him wide open jumpers and layups in a pick n roll. Malone was a great player, but as a well rounded power forward, Duncan is far better.
Replace Malone in his prime with Duncan for the Spurs right now...You think the Spurs wouldn't be in the same situation? Maybe even ahead in the series...
-
yeah the mail man, then you've got barkley sir charles... carried his team like malone
duncan is a good case for an argument though
-
It was too early following the 1999 season, when Tim Duncan won his first NBA championship.
It was premature even after the 2003 season, one in which Duncan won the MVP and his second NBA title.
But I'm not sure that I'm not jumping the gun now, with Duncan one win away from his third championship.
Tim Duncan is the greatest forward of all time.
When my book, Who's Better, Who's Best in Basketball? was published in the fall of 2003, the most difficult ranking concerned the Duncan. The last revision I made was to jump Duncan over Bob Pettit and Karl Malone into the top 10 players of all time.
Tim Duncan on the verge of his third NBA championship. (Andrew D. Bernstein / Getty Images)
It was difficult to put Duncan (after only six seasons) ahead of the Mailman, but now, it is time. And it's also time to acknowledge Duncan as the greatest forward of all time, edging past Larry Bird.
Bird won three MVP awards (consecutively, in his fifth, sixth, and seventh seasons.)
Duncan has won two MVP awards (consecutively, in his fifth and sixth seasons).
Bird not only won those three MVPs, but he was in the top three in voting in each of his first eight seasons.
Duncan has played eight seasons in the NBA, and has never finished lower than fifth.
Bird won three NBA championships.
Duncan has won two NBA championships, and is on the verge of his third.
Bird was first team All-NBA for nine consecutive seasons, beginning in 1980.
Duncan was first team All-NBA for eight consecutive seasons, beginning in 1998.
In his first eight seasons, Bird's teams were 20-5 in playoff series, losing twice to powerhouse Lakers teams.
In his first eight seasons, Duncan's teams are 16-4 in playoff series, losing three times to powerhouse Lakers teams.
And Duncan's humility is unquestioned.
"He's amazingly unaffected," said longtime hoops writer Peter Vecsey. "Of all the superstars in the history of the game, he's the No. 1 teammate in terms of ability, personality, quality of person, work ethic, likeability ... he's No. 1. Not even close."
In every season that Duncan plays, his team rates among the top teams in defensive rankings for fewest points allowed and opponent field-goal percentage.
Duncan is always on the first or second all-defensive teams. Now, Bird was one of the greatest free-throw shooters of all time. I'm sure he never had playoff games where he missed 9 out of 12 free throws, as Duncan has done. And Bird was a better passer, who often led his team in points, rebounds, assists, and steals.
Bird did most of his damage in the first eight years of his career. Duncan — especially if he wins his third NBA title this season — has virtually matched him.
Duncan has shown some vulnerability to injuries the last two seasons, and his career has probably peaked.
However, if the Spurs win the NBA championship, it is my contention that Duncan should be considered the greatest forward of all time. Either way, it is a wonderful debate: The perfect Celtic, against the man (Duncan) who was favored to be a Celtic, until the ping-pong balls went the wrong way for Boston.
There are only four other men on the planet who deserve to be in the same solar system as Bird and Duncan.
Their names are Elgin Baylor, Karl Malone, Bob Pettit, and Julius Erving.
And all that said, here is my ranking of the NBA's greatest forwards:
1. Duncan
Almost from his first week in camp, he was the best player on the Spurs. He's won a title with David Robinson playing Robin to his Batman. He's won a title with Tony Parker playing that role. And he might win this year with Manu Ginobili playing second fiddle.
Duncan missed the 2000 postseason with a torn left lateral meniscus. If he wasn't hurt, the Spurs might have won another title.
2. Bird
Larry Bird and Dr. J., two of the top 10, go head to head. (Jerry Wachter / Getty Images)
In an era of great players, he was first or second in MVP voting for six consecutive seasons. He didn't have the athleticism that many of the other great forwards had. In fact, Bill Walton says that Bird was an unbelievable rebounder who knew where the ball was going before the ball knew. And he "did all this without being able to jump over two pieces of paper."
3. Bob Pettit
It's hard to jump Duncan over Pettit, who played between 1954 and 1965. In that time, Pettit won two MVPs, an NBA championship, and was first team All-NBA 10 times. When he retired, he did so as the league's all-time leading scorer. In other words, he did everything Karl Malone did — and a little more.
4. Elgin Baylor
He put up incredible numbers for the Lakers in the 1960s, until knee injuries caught up to him. He scored 40-plus points in a game 87 times, and only Chamberlain and Jordan bettered that.
"Baylor revolutionized the game, taking a mostly horizontal game and making it diagonal," Bob Ryan of the Boston Globe says. "He brought in all the reverse layups, the double fakes. And he was a great rebounder despite his 6-foot-5 size."
5. Julius Erving
You can't judge him by his 11 NBA seasons. You have to take into account his five ABA seasons, when he was at his best. He probably deferred to teammates too much in his first few NBA seasons, as well.
6. Karl Malone
He had a peak (two MVP awards, sandwiched around a second-place finish in 1998 to Jordan), and a consistent career value which is hard to overlook. He led the Western Conference in scoring seven times, and was second four other seasons. But like Baylor, the Mailman didn't deliver in his championship appearances.
7. Charles Barkley
For five seasons he was a first-team All-NBA pick. For five other years he was a second-team pick. He was MVP in 1993, and deserved it in 1990. He didn't have the talent around him in his peak years, as the six forwards ahead of him had.
8. Rick Barry
He did everything Bird did, but was intensely disliked by many. He carried NBA teams and ABA teams to championships, and like Duncan and Bird, he took a bad team and made them contenders almost immediately.
9. Scottie Pippen
Six NBA titles can't be ignored. They make up for the lack of MVPs, appearances on All-NBA teams, etc. Pippen was a great defender. His teams won 137 playoff games. Oh, by the way. Michael Jordan played five seasons without Pippen as his teammate. He won exactly one playoff game (compiling a 1-9 postseason record) without him. Scottie, on the other hand, was 13-17 in the postseason without Jordan, and came within a furious rally by the Lakers of leading the Blazers into the NBA Finals.
10. A toss-up
This is the toughest choice of all. Dolph Schayes was the best player in the league in the mid-50s. John Havlicek won eight NBA championships, and was the Celtics' leading scorer in four of those seasons. He was a great big-game player, as well. Dennis Rodman was the greatest defensive forward of all time. And Kevin Garnett has done everything but lead his team into the NBA Finals.
I'll choose Schayes. Why? Late NBA writer and historian Leonard Koppett told me that Schayes was even better than Bob Pettit.
And in this case, I'll defer to Koppett.
Elliott Kalb is a frequent FOXSports.com contributor.
http://msn.foxsports.com/nba/story/3653506
-
^lol now he's even the best FORWARD ever. this shit is getting outta hand. ridiculous.
-
since finals is "where legends are born" I have to say no.
sooo....it would be Malone? Sir Charles? Garnett? lol
if the spurs had the opponents the jazz had in 99 and 2003, no way they wouldve won.. just as they didnt win shit when lakers were strong. plus malone didnt suck balls in the finals did he? and nobody is talking about garnett, at least I don't.
Malone NEVER got over the hump, NEVER. And he had another hall of famer on his team, and probably one of the best 2 or 3 point guards of ALL time on his team. Duncan can still win this years title, and probably a couple more in his career. Malone didnt do shit, but score a lotta points in a system geared towards getting him wide open jumpers and layups in a pick n roll. Malone was a great player, but as a well rounded power forward, Duncan is far better.
Replace Malone in his prime with Duncan for the Spurs right now...You think the Spurs wouldn't be in the same situation? Maybe even ahead in the series...
No. Malone was good, but he wasnt the ALL around team player that Duncan is. He was a score first player. Not the best fit for SA. Duncans game is so unselfish its unbelievable. The easy thing to do would be for Tim to just shoot over 30 times a game and score over 30 points a game like Malone. But then, that wouldnt give them the best chance of winning (it IS a team game and all). Malone was on some VERY good teams. And what power forwards wouldnt want to play with one of, if not the best point guard ever...in a strait up pick and roll offense? Bottom line, Malone never lead his teams to championships. And it wasnt like he was on shitty teams. Utah was always one of the top teams in the west. He doesnt have the individual awards that Tim has, OR the championships. So wheres the comparisons? All Malone has the advantage on as a player, are points per game. And like i said, score first....win second. A pick and role offense with the best point guard to ever run that offense, who plays pass first score second. Meaning...Malone was ALWAYS the first option, and usually with a lay up down the lane, or a wide open 10-15 foot jumper. Easy to put up numbers like that...
-
^lol now he's even the best FORWARD ever. this shit is getting outta hand. ridiculous.
btw, dont get me twisted...i said best power forward ever. And everyone disagreeing really have no argument. Charles and Malone are the only candidates and its obvious theyre numbers/awards/championships just dont match up...period. As for best forward ever, i still say Bird.
-
since finals is "where legends are born" I have to say no.
sooo....it would be Malone? Sir Charles? Garnett? lol
if the spurs had the opponents the jazz had in 99 and 2003, no way they wouldve won.. just as they didnt win shit when lakers were strong. plus malone didnt suck balls in the finals did he? and nobody is talking about garnett, at least I don't.
Malone NEVER got over the hump, NEVER. And he had another hall of famer on his team, and probably one of the best 2 or 3 point guards of ALL time on his team. Duncan can still win this years title, and probably a couple more in his career. Malone didnt do shit, but score a lotta points in a system geared towards getting him wide open jumpers and layups in a pick n roll. Malone was a great player, but as a well rounded power forward, Duncan is far better.
Replace Malone in his prime with Duncan for the Spurs right now...You think the Spurs wouldn't be in the same situation? Maybe even ahead in the series...
No. Malone was good, but he wasnt the ALL around team player that Duncan is. He was a score first player. Not the best fit for SA. Duncans game is so unselfish its unbelievable. The easy thing to do would be for Tim to just shoot over 30 times a game and score over 30 points a game like Malone. But then, that wouldnt give them the best chance of winning (it IS a team game and all). Malone was on some VERY good teams. And what power forwards wouldnt want to play with one of, if not the best point guard ever...in a strait up pick and roll offense? Bottom line, Malone never lead his teams to championships. And it wasnt like he was on shitty teams. Utah was always one of the top teams in the west. He doesnt have the individual awards that Tim has, OR the championships. So wheres the comparisons? All Malone has the advantage on as a player, are points per game. And like i said, score first....win second. A pick and role offense with the best point guard to ever run that offense, who plays pass first score second. Meaning...Malone was ALWAYS the first option, and usually with a lay up down the lane, or a wide open 10-15 foot jumper. Easy to put up numbers like that...
I like Malone's style more...