West Coast Connection Forum
DUBCC - Tha Connection => West Coast Classics => Topic started by: Cross Em Out on June 07, 2011, 12:17:06 PM
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Exclusive: The veteran west coast consigliore tells DX about Dr. Dre�(TM)s early days, his upcoming box set audio-biography and says "Fuck Jerry Heller."
You know you have been in the Rap game a long time when your earliest memories of Dr. Dre are not of a globally-known producer, but of a local b-boy.
Recalling Dr. Dre The Teenager
“I been knowing Dre since like ’80, ’81,” recalled Laylaw recently to HipHopDX of the two future producer’s initial South Central connection. “I stayed down the street from his cousin, on 76th Street, right across the street from Fremont [High School]. I played football for Fremont… and [Dre] would dance at halftime with some other brothers, some pop-locker dudes.”
“We was aware of each other,” he continued, “’cause we both had an interest in deejaying and music when a lot of people wasn’t doing it back then. So we was aware of each other. And … he was just a little cat from the neighborhood, just a regular little dude from the hood. Nothing like stood out or nothing like that, we just had common interests.”
Fast forward a few years to the mid-‘80s and the Fremont alums had cut their first record together: the Dracula-inspired “Monster Rapping.”
“Man, we fucked around,” replied ‘Law when asked if the seemingly comical cut was supposed to be serious. “I did that like as respect to my homeboy. My homeboy rapped on that first, my homeboy named Paraquise. Paraquise got life in the pen. And Dre said, ‘Man, go ahead and put ya voice on it.’ We bullshittin’ and I put it on there. And we had so much leeway at the radio station that I was able to get it played during Halloween [1985]. I wasn’t even trying to do nothing with it at all. That’s not indicative of no style or nothing like that.”
Laylaw’s short-lived career as an artist continued the following year with “What’s Your Name,” and Electro-driven dance cut produced by “The Mechanic,” which was an alias Dr. Dre adopted at the time to avoid any conflict with his deal with Epic Records, as part of The World Class Wreckin’ Cru, while working with ‘Law.
“I was a writer,” explained Laylaw of why his time in front of the mic was confined to just a couple of Dr. Dre produced 12” singles. “I was just writing. I was writing … and then, I come across Alonzo [Williams] and Wreckin’ Cru and they’re rapping. … I’m not a rapper. I’m a writer. I can write a rap, but I don’t consider myself a rapper. So, it was weird trying to figure out what I was gonna do.”
What ‘Law had already figured out on his own to do to make a living had nothing to do with making music.
“I was a hustler, man,” he noted. “Everybody knew Laylaw from getting money. I was the only nigga they knew had a Rolex. That’s why my label was Rolex [Records]. … I had money, so [Eazy-E] used to fuck with me to get money. So I knew Eazy.”
Helping Build Classics For Eazy E's Ruthless Records
The hustler/writer subsequently began rollin’ with Eazy and the rest of the Ruthless Records posse. After penning singer Michel’le’s 1989 smash “No More Lies,” Laylaw began grooming the second gangstafied group to emerge on Ruthless after N.W.A.: Above The Law.
“With [Big Hutch], we’d be doing some music and [N.W.A. would] hear it and next thing you know our music would end up on N.W.A.’s records,” revealed ‘Law. “ ‘100 Miles And Runnin,’’ that’s an Above The Law beat.”
After a few years of allegedly having credit stripped from him for songs he wrote for Michel’le, Eazy-E and others, Laylaw left the west coast’s first powerhouse Rap label prior to Above The Law’s sophomore full-length, Black Mafia Life.
“There was nothing good there,” he noted of the environment at Ruthless Records by the early ‘90s. “The public enjoyed the music and everything, but to be doing it on the other side of it, we was going through hell.”
And was the hell being created at Ruthless more the work of Eazy-E or the often criticized label co-founder Jerry Heller?
“It was both of ‘em,” replied Laylaw. “I don’t kiss nobody ass, man. I mean, Eazy was cool as fuck. I loved Eazy. I miss Eazy. But then when Eazy got schooled by Jerry [Heller] … All of the sudden I gotta talk to Jerry about shit I’ve never talked to Jerry about? Fuck Jerry, man. I’m not talking to Jerry about nothing. You couldn’t get me to respect Jerry. That was the problem. [I was like], ‘How you gonna just throw this muthafucka in the mix, Eazy? You used to buy dope from me muthafucka. I used to give you dope on consignment. Now you got me talking to this white fool about this bullshit?’”
Post-Ruthless, ‘Law kept getting that legal drug money by producing the title-track to 2Pac’s Strictly 4 My N.I.G.G.A.Z, along with the subsequent B-side to ‘Pac’s “Keep Ya Head Up” single, “I Wonda If Heaven’s Got A Ghetto.”
“I was kinda fuckin’ with ‘Pac while I was still at Ruthless,” recalled ‘Law. “Me and ‘Pac was already friends. Atron Gregory was [Above The Law’s] road manager. Atron Gregory found Digital Underground …. And ‘Pac used to come around. Dude used to come down and sleep on my couch and shit, kick it, and we end up doing some music together.”
Unfortunately for Laylaw, industry rule #4080 once again reared its ugly head in regards to his work for an up-and-coming act.
“‘I Wonda If Heaven’s Got A Ghetto,’ and there’s a song called ‘Troublesome,’ I did … a couple other songs I can’t remember the titles to,” revealed ‘Law of his complete contribution to 2Pac’s sophomore album. “There’s about five songs [total I did] for Tupac. The name of the album was originally called Troublesome, but for whatever reason they pulled off all my songs except one. Like, mines was too much or some shit. I don’t know what the fuck they was trippin’ on. So, they pulled off four of my five songs and they just left ‘Strictly 4 My N.I.G.G.A.Z.’ So ‘Pac said, ‘Well, we gonna name the album Strictly 4 My N.I.G.G.A.Z.’ Why? ‘Cause they raped the album.”
Unfortunately, yet again, Laylaw would see his work for 2Pac “raped,” but this time it would be in part at the hands of his old friend from Fremont.
The Real Story Behind 2Pac & Dr. Dre's "California Love (Remix)"
“I went on and played some music for him,” began ‘Law as he recalled his reunion with Dr. Dre in the mid-‘90s. “He heard a beat that he wanted, and it was the ‘California Love (Remix)’ beat. He was officially working on The Chronic 2 way back then. And that song was supposed to have been for his album. … So Dre did the song, a couple days later Roger [Troutman] come out [and] get on it. … A couple days later, ‘Pac hear it [and] ‘Pac get on it. A couple days later now it’s ‘Pac’s single. The very next day they wanna shoot the video. So within a week of us doing it, it became ‘Pac’s single.”
“So I’m like, ‘Alright, what’chu gonna do with my version? ‘Cause we have two versions of the song,’” he continued. “[Dre] said, ‘Your version’s the remix.’ I did it with my partner at the time, [D’Maq]. … [Dr. Dre] told me that he sent the credits into Suge [Knight] and Suge fucked it up. I called Suge. Suge said, ‘Dre never gave me the credits, ‘Law.’ … Mind you, Suge ain’t really worrying about putting my name on shit. So I get in touch with Tupac, and ‘Pac telling me he trying to leave [Death Row Records], he just wanna finish these extra albums and he wanna leave. So, we just kicked back and just let [the situation] marinate.”
Although he has endured his fair share of industry shenanigans through the years, Laylaw is still going strong in the business of music. The Westside O.G. is currently preparing the release of Lawhouse Greatest Hitz, a 3-disc box set of both previously released and unreleased ‘Law assisted creations for Ice Cube, 2Pac, DJ Quik, E-40, Nas and more.
“I’m getting a new one from Quik,” he noted of some planned new additions to the Hitz. “I’m getting a new one from Cube. And I’m gonna release some stuff that never came out, some ‘Pac that never came out. It’s gonna be interesting.”
Dr Dre has to be one of the biggest frauds in hip hop. :grumpy: I dont understand why he continues to get praise when history has shown all he ever does is rob and steal from other producers. Im convinced he has never done one beat for himself. Even in the NWA days it seems that Big Hutch and Erotic D were doing all the work
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Not saying that these stories are true or false, but it's funny how many of these stories we've heard these past few months. Sam Sneed, DOC, Laylaw, Budda, Snoop etc etc have all said revealed things that makes Dre look bad in the public eye. Must be something goin' on.
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Not saying that these stories are true or false, but it's funny how many of these stories we've heard these past few months. Sam Sneed, DOC, Laylaw, Budda, Snoop etc etc have all said revealed things that makes Dre look bad in the public eye. Must be something goin' on.
They mad that Dre ditched them for his favorite white boy, Eminem
lol
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Not saying that these stories are true or false, but it's funny how many of these stories we've heard these past few months. Sam Sneed, DOC, Laylaw, Budda, Snoop etc etc have all said revealed things that makes Dre look bad in the public eye. Must be something goin' on.
They mad that Dre ditched them for his favorite white boy, Eminem
lol
lol.
but seriously i think it has to do with Dre "acting Hollywood" as they say. Like it seems like Dre has become more of a shady record executive or something rather than a homeboy, an artist or whatever you wanna call it.
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I think niggas is finally tired of the bullshit and rightfully want thier place in the history books. Dre's whole career is just a front for more talented producers. You never hear this many stories about other producers considered legendary
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probably the truth
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Not saying that these stories are true or false, but it's funny how many of these stories we've heard these past few months. Sam Sneed, DOC, Laylaw, Budda, Snoop etc etc have all said revealed things that makes Dre look bad in the public eye. Must be something goin' on.
They mad that Dre ditched them for his favorite white boy, Eminem
lol
lol.
but seriously i think it has to do with Dre "acting Hollywood" as they say. Like it seems like Dre has become more of a shady record executive or something rather than a homeboy, an artist or whatever you wanna call it.
I guess, he seems to be really into marketing his products. That Dr Pepper commercial, Pacquiao vs Mosley snippet, Chrysler commercial. Probably other one's but I can't remember. And yea, it doesn't seem like he's cool with anyone where he just gives a few beats to some artist that he's cool with (besides eminem, game and maybe 50 but they're on Aftermath so doesn't really count).
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I think niggas is finally tired of the bullshit and rightfully want thier place in the history books. Dre's whole career is just a front for more talented producers. You never hear this many stories about other producers considered legendary
True but at the same time they aren't as big and famous as Dre. I mean not saying they're lyin' but it seems weird that so many stories has come out between 2010-2011. More than 1 or 2 i mean we've heard like 6-7 stories just recently one after the other.
Why didn't most of these stories come out in like 2003? or maybe 2001? I know there's been similar stories before but this many?!!! and at the same time?? I dont know.
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Not saying that these stories are true or false, but it's funny how many of these stories we've heard these past few months. Sam Sneed, DOC, Laylaw, Budda, Snoop etc etc have all said revealed things that makes Dre look bad in the public eye. Must be something goin' on.
They mad that Dre ditched them for his favorite white boy, Eminem
lol
lol.
but seriously i think it has to do with Dre "acting Hollywood" as they say. Like it seems like Dre has become more of a shady record executive or something rather than a homeboy, an artist or whatever you wanna call it.
I guess, he seems to be really into marketing his products. That Dr Pepper commercial, Pacquiao vs Mosley snippet, Chrysler commercial. Probably other one's but I can't remember. And yea, it doesn't seem like he's cool with anyone where he just gives a few beats to some artist that he's cool with (besides eminem, game and maybe 50 but they're on Aftermath so doesn't really count).
Yeah exactly. But it really does seem like Iovine has been pulling his strings for a few years now. Maybe it has something to do with Dre selling his owning rights of Aftermath to Jimmy a few years ago..
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I think their is some serious player hating going on. Dave Chappelle could make a new skit out of it. It's true, there are a lot of stories, but one very important question remains that never has or even will be answered????
As Nas puts it "Where are they now?"
If Dre is jackin all these beats then how come they can't make the same hits when he's not in the picture? :-\
Where's Mel Man at? Storch? Khalil? I'm talking solo style. These guys can make beats on their own with their own teams but none of them have come even close to Dre's success. This is in the past so let it be. How can yous till feel burnt if you've never made a hit even 1/10th the size?
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I think their is some serious player hating going on. Dave Chappelle could make a new skit out of it. It's true, there are a lot of stories, but one very important question remains that never has or even will be answered????
As Nas puts it "Where are they now?"
If Dre is jackin all these beats then how come they can't make the same hits when he's not in the picture? :-\
Where's Mel Man at? Storch? Khalil? I'm talking solo style. These guys can make beats on their own with their own teams but none of them have come even close to Dre's success. This is in the past so let it be. How can yous till feel burnt if you've never made a hit even 1/10th the size?
He blackballed Mel-man like he did Neff-U
At one point Scott Storch was bigger than Dre. Are you seriously questioning Scott Storch's solo hit making abilities? (Chris Brown, Fat Joe, Christina Aguilera, 50 cent, Beyonce etc) Do your research
Khalil has done solo beats for Jay Z, 50 Cent, Eminem, Game, Snoop Dogg and even Dr Dre, alot of which has been better than the recent beats that have Dre's name on it.
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i don't see why hutch wouldn't get credit if he was involved.
besides, 100 miles & runnin' sounds like Dr.Dre & Yella to me.Not saying that these stories are true or false, but it's funny how many of these stories we've heard these past few months. Sam Sneed, DOC, Laylaw, Budda, Snoop etc etc have all said revealed things that makes Dre look bad in the public eye. Must be something goin' on.
yeah lots of stories lately.
really strange
http://www.cover.dk/blog/motherfuckers-who-forgot-about-dre
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i don't see why hutch wouldn't get credit if he was involved.
besides, 100 miles & runnin' sounds like Dr.Dre & Yella to me.Not saying that these stories are true or false, but it's funny how many of these stories we've heard these past few months. Sam Sneed, DOC, Laylaw, Budda, Snoop etc etc have all said revealed things that makes Dre look bad in the public eye. Must be something goin' on.
yeah lots of stories lately.
really strange
http://www.cover.dk/blog/motherfuckers-who-forgot-about-dre
come on man you know its not always as straightforward as that. credit has been fucked up before when it comes to Dre so why wouldnt Hutch be victim of the same thing? besides Kokane confrmed in an old interview that Hutch gave Dre breakbeats for NWA albums and showed him a lot off other stuff too and went uncredited, so I dont think Laylaw is lying
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He blackballed Mel-man like he did Neff-U
At one point Scott Storch was bigger than Dre. Are you seriously questioning Scott Storch's solo hit making abilities? (Chris Brown, Fat Joe, Christina Aguilera, 50 cent, Beyonce etc) Do your research
Khalil has done solo beats for Jay Z, 50 Cent, Eminem, Game, Snoop Dogg and even Dr Dre, alot of which has been better than the recent beats that have Dre's name on it.
Storch? Maybe for six months when he took a vacation. Fat Joe cough terror squad had a one hit wonder. I know he did some work with Christina but nothing mind-blowing. She was who she was before him.
The difference is Dre makes stars they don't. I think that is why he has that giant persona. No one in the rap game has created an umbrella of talent like he has ... no one has that clout. I remember when Timberland produced 2 albums and was tha shit 5 years ago, but come to think of it Justin Timberlake and Nelly Furtado were already big stars.
Also these stories imply Dre is a professional beat-jacker and I just don't get why ANY of them have't had careers even 1/10th the size of his. Seems a little far fetched ...
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I think their is some serious player hating going on. Dave Chappelle could make a new skit out of it. It's true, there are a lot of stories, but one very important question remains that never has or even will be answered????
As Nas puts it "Where are they now?"
If Dre is jackin all these beats then how come they can't make the same hits when he's not in the picture? :-\
Where's Mel Man at? Storch? Khalil? I'm talking solo style. These guys can make beats on their own with their own teams but none of them have come even close to Dre's success. This is in the past so let it be. How can yous till feel burnt if you've never made a hit even 1/10th the size?
while some of that may be true you have to remember if u have a good ear for music (like myself) and can pull unheard/fresh tracks from unknown (and known) producers and writers, mix em down 2 tha way u like it then it's not hard 2 make shit a classic.
it's kinda like if I had:
Timbaland
DJ Quik
DJ Premier
Pete Rock
No I.D.
Battlecat
or whoever really
and decided to take their BEST material, mix it down (and maybe add little elements here and there) and have the authority to call it my own I would literally be considered 1 of those greatest producers of all time (maybe even the greatest).
like if I had:
Lex Luger
JUSTICE LEAGUE
Khao
Shawty Redd
Monsta Beatz
Drake's producers
Drumma Boy
Zaytoven
all under my belt as my "behind the scenes" production STAFF and all I did was take their BEST beats and add some little touches here n there (if that) and released them then I'd be the greatest hip hop producer in this day and age and nobody couldn't tell me shit about it. all of you niggaz might hate that my shit sounds a little Southern (tho i disagree with that term) but none of u could deny that I have talent that's worth a shit and you couldn't deny that without me Hip Hop wouldn't be as good as it is today, music wouldn't as good today.
from all of the information we've gathered over the years that's pretty much what Dr. Dre has done ALL of these years.
- with all of that said i still want to hear "Detox". if Dre really is doing that then "Detox" will be the greatest album invented this past decade.
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only tell stories to those who listen...
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thanks for the interview
interestn info about the uncredited Laylaw-song prod by Dre
here it is.
funky disco from the 80's
12'' release
song, ext remix and instrumental
Laylaw - What's Your Name? [Prod by The Mechanic a.k.a. Dr. Dre]
http://dc202.4shared.com/download/JSGhnG6_/Lay_Law_-_Whats_Your_Name.rar?tsid=20110607-220107-cddea86c
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He blackballed Mel-man like he did Neff-U
At one point Scott Storch was bigger than Dre. Are you seriously questioning Scott Storch's solo hit making abilities? (Chris Brown, Fat Joe, Christina Aguilera, 50 cent, Beyonce etc) Do your research
Khalil has done solo beats for Jay Z, 50 Cent, Eminem, Game, Snoop Dogg and even Dr Dre, alot of which has been better than the recent beats that have Dre's name on it.
Storch? Maybe for six months when he took a vacation. Fat Joe cough terror squad had a one hit wonder. I know he did some work with Christina but nothing mind-blowing. She was who she was before him.
The difference is Dre makes stars they don't. I think that is why he has that giant persona. No one in the rap game has created an umbrella of talent like he has ... no one has that clout. I remember when Timberland produced 2 albums and was tha shit 5 years ago, but come to think of it Justin Timberlake and Nelly Furtado were already big stars.
Also these stories imply Dre is a professional beat-jacker and I just don't get why ANY of them have't had careers even 1/10th the size of his. Seems a little far fetched ...
6 months while Dre took a vacation? try 4 years
2002
Justin Timberlake - Justified
07. "Cry Me A River" (produced by Timbaland, co-produced by Scott Storch)
10. "(And She Said) Take Me Now (feat. Janet Jackson)" (produced by Timbaland, co-produced by Scott Storch)
Pink - Missundaztood
07. "Family Portrait"
Christina Aguilera - Stripped
02. "Can't Hold Us Down (feat. Lil' Kim)"
04. "Fighter"
2003
Beyoncé - Dangerously in Love
02. "Naughty Girl"
03. "Baby Boy (feat. Sean Paul)"
05. "Me, Myself and I"
Ja Rule - Blood In My Eye
03. "Clap Back" (Co-produced by Irv Gotti)
G-Unit - Beg For Mercy
02. "Poppin' Them Thangs" (Produced with Dr. Dre)
2004
Jadakiss - Kiss Of Death
05. "Time's Up (feat. Nate Dogg)"
07. "U Make Me Wanna (feat. Mariah Carey)"
Terror Squad - True Story
04. "Lean Back"
The Roots - The Tipping Point
03. "Don't Say Nuthin'"
Mario - Turning Point
02. "Let Me Love You"
2005
50 Cent - The Massacre
07. "Candy Shop (feat. Olivia)"
14. "Just A Lil Bit"
18. "Build You Up (feat. Jamie Foxx)"
Fat Joe - All Or Nothing
08. "Get It Poppin'" (feat. Nelly)
R. Kelly - TP-3: Reloaded
01. "Playa's Only" (feat. The Game)
Lil' Kim - The Naked Truth
03. "Lighters Up"
Chris Brown - Chris Brown
02. "Run It! (feat. Juelz Santana)"
05. "Gimme That (feat. Lil' Wayne)"
Chamillionaire - The Sound Of Revenge
03. Turn It Up (feat. Lil' Flip)"
During that same time period the only hits Dre had were In Da Club, How We Do Just Lose It, Rich Girl and Poppin Them Thangs
All you Dre apologists just need to face facts you have been idiolizing a fraud. At least the west still has DJ Quik. A REAL musician who hasnt spent his whole career stealing from other people
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^^ And of all the mighty stars you listed how many is Storch responsible for? How many careers has he started? This is the x factor that isn't explained when people talk about beat jacking.
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i keep telling ya'll Battlecat is the best in the West.... 8)
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^^ And of all the mighty stars you listed how many is Storch responsible for? How many careers has he started? This is the x factor that isn't explained when people talk about beat jacking.
Dre starting someone's career has nothing to do with beat jacking. if i find a star, but use somebody elses beat to launch that artist and then say im responsile for that beat, im STILL JACKING SOMEONE ELSES BEAT REGARDLESS. i see no point in going back and forth with you, as you keep avoiding the main issue at hand. Him launching so many careers just makes him a good A and R/ Record Executive. That doesnt mean he's a good producer
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i keep telling ya'll Battlecat is the best in the West.... 8)
Yep. Him and DJ Quik. Alchemist too even though all his beats are NY sounding
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Dr Dre has to be one of the biggest frauds in hip hop. :grumpy: I dont understand why he continues to get praise when history has shown all he ever does is rob and steal from other producers. Im convinced he has never done one beat for himself. Even in the NWA days it seems that Big Hutch and Erotic D were doing all the work
i didn't hear him badmouth dre in the interview ???
If Hutch and Erotic D were doing all the work surely Ice Cube and Ren wouldn't be giving Dre all the credit for N.W.A all these years.
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Dr Dre has to be one of the biggest frauds in hip hop. :grumpy: I dont understand why he continues to get praise when history has shown all he ever does is rob and steal from other producers. Im convinced he has never done one beat for himself. Even in the NWA days it seems that Big Hutch and Erotic D were doing all the work
i didn't hear him badmouth dre in the interview ???
If Hutch and Erotic D were doing all the work surely Ice Cube and Ren wouldn't be giving Dre all the credit for N.W.A all these years.
He implicates that Dre stole music from Hutch for NWA's album. That doesnt exactly paint Dre in a positive light
Cube and Ren are still cool with Dre and dont want to possibly step on his toes to protect 2 lesser known producers
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^^ And of all the mighty stars you listed how many is Storch responsible for? How many careers has he started? This is the x factor that isn't explained when people talk about beat jacking.
How many records would those artists have sold without those singles Storch produced? A lot of those songs were pretty big hits, you under a rock for those four years?
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Dr Dre has to be one of the biggest frauds in hip hop. :grumpy: I dont understand why he continues to get praise when history has shown all he ever does is rob and steal from other producers. Im convinced he has never done one beat for himself. Even in the NWA days it seems that Big Hutch and Erotic D were doing all the work
i didn't hear him badmouth dre in the interview ???
If Hutch and Erotic D were doing all the work surely Ice Cube and Ren wouldn't be giving Dre all the credit for N.W.A all these years.
He implicates that Dre stole music from Hutch for NWA's album. That doesnt exactly paint Dre in a positive light
Cube and Ren are still cool with Dre and dont want to possibly step on his toes to protect 2 lesser known producers
There's no mention of Dre individually. It says N.W.A. would use some of Hutch's beats. It's also unlikely the beats were stolen considering Hutch remained on Ruthless.
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Great feedback! We got more coming from Laylaw/LAWHOUSE Records!
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I agree that a lot of light is shedding on the real dre
Lmao @ dre being a cheerleader in high school
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After reading this all I can say is wow. I thought doc got screwed, this dude, erotic d, and a few others got fucked over so bad that their names are barely memorable. That california love story is interesting tho. They made moves real fast at tha row.
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i don't see why hutch wouldn't get credit if he was involved.
besides, 100 miles & runnin' sounds like Dr.Dre & Yella to me.Not saying that these stories are true or false, but it's funny how many of these stories we've heard these past few months. Sam Sneed, DOC, Laylaw, Budda, Snoop etc etc have all said revealed things that makes Dre look bad in the public eye. Must be something goin' on.
yeah lots of stories lately.
really strange
http://www.cover.dk/blog/motherfuckers-who-forgot-about-dre
come on man you know its not always as straightforward as that. credit has been fucked up before when it comes to Dre so why wouldnt Hutch be victim of the same thing? besides Kokane confrmed in an old interview that Hutch gave Dre breakbeats for NWA albums and showed him a lot off other stuff too and went uncredited, so I dont think Laylaw is lying
well hutch gave eazy a lot of props for ruthless, he wouldn't do that if he got ripped off.
he ain't the type to hold back, just look at all the bickering about who invented g funk.
giving breakbeats is not the same as getting the beats stolen. you're free to believe what you want, but don't forget about the (former) partners that gave dre props, like dawaun parker, scott storch, mike elizondo, dj yella, hi tek, dj khalil, nottz, focus, j.r. rotem etc.
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i don't see why hutch wouldn't get credit if he was involved.
besides, 100 miles & runnin' sounds like Dr.Dre & Yella to me.Not saying that these stories are true or false, but it's funny how many of these stories we've heard these past few months. Sam Sneed, DOC, Laylaw, Budda, Snoop etc etc have all said revealed things that makes Dre look bad in the public eye. Must be something goin' on.
yeah lots of stories lately.
really strange
http://www.cover.dk/blog/motherfuckers-who-forgot-about-dre
come on man you know its not always as straightforward as that. credit has been fucked up before when it comes to Dre so why wouldnt Hutch be victim of the same thing? besides Kokane confrmed in an old interview that Hutch gave Dre breakbeats for NWA albums and showed him a lot off other stuff too and went uncredited, so I dont think Laylaw is lying
well hutch gave eazy a lot of props for ruthless, he wouldn't do that if he got ripped off.
he ain't the type to hold back, just look at all the bickering about who invented g funk.
giving breakbeats is not the same as getting the beats stolen. you're free to believe what you want, but don't forget about the (former) partners that gave dre props, like dawaun parker, scott storch, mike elizondo, dj yella, hi tek, dj khalil, nottz, focus, j.r. rotem etc.
exactly, thats why i dont believe Dre is a fraud. he is producin his records
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I think their is some serious player hating going on. Dave Chappelle could make a new skit out of it. It's true, there are a lot of stories, but one very important question remains that never has or even will be answered????
As Nas puts it "Where are they now?"
If Dre is jackin all these beats then how come they can't make the same hits when he's not in the picture? :-\
Where's Mel Man at? Storch? Khalil? I'm talking solo style. These guys can make beats on their own with their own teams but none of them have come even close to Dre's success. This is in the past so let it be. How can yous till feel burnt if you've never made a hit even 1/10th the size?
stop thinking like it's the skills what makes you succesful. Actually the difference between them and Dre was Iovine....
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i don't see why hutch wouldn't get credit if he was involved.
besides, 100 miles & runnin' sounds like Dr.Dre & Yella to me.Not saying that these stories are true or false, but it's funny how many of these stories we've heard these past few months. Sam Sneed, DOC, Laylaw, Budda, Snoop etc etc have all said revealed things that makes Dre look bad in the public eye. Must be something goin' on.
yeah lots of stories lately.
really strange
http://www.cover.dk/blog/motherfuckers-who-forgot-about-dre
come on man you know its not always as straightforward as that. credit has been fucked up before when it comes to Dre so why wouldnt Hutch be victim of the same thing? besides Kokane confrmed in an old interview that Hutch gave Dre breakbeats for NWA albums and showed him a lot off other stuff too and went uncredited, so I dont think Laylaw is lying
well hutch gave eazy a lot of props for ruthless, he wouldn't do that if he got ripped off.
he ain't the type to hold back, just look at all the bickering about who invented g funk.
giving breakbeats is not the same as getting the beats stolen. you're free to believe what you want, but don't forget about the (former) partners that gave dre props, like dawaun parker, scott storch, mike elizondo, dj yella, hi tek, dj khalil, nottz, focus, j.r. rotem etc.
exactly, thats why i dont believe Dre is a fraud. he is producin his records
yeah, i don't believe he can get away with stealing for 20+ years, that's impossible.
I think their is some serious player hating going on. Dave Chappelle could make a new skit out of it. It's true, there are a lot of stories, but one very important question remains that never has or even will be answered????
As Nas puts it "Where are they now?"
If Dre is jackin all these beats then how come they can't make the same hits when he's not in the picture? :-\
Where's Mel Man at? Storch? Khalil? I'm talking solo style. These guys can make beats on their own with their own teams but none of them have come even close to Dre's success. This is in the past so let it be. How can yous till feel burnt if you've never made a hit even 1/10th the size?
stop thinking like it's the skills what makes you successful. Actually the difference between them and Dre was Iovine....
dre was already successful before iovine came into the picture.
sure jimmy helped a lot with death row & aftermath. but don't forget that the chronic saved interscope from bankruptcy
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just like Daz did the second half of Doggystyle ::)
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The word "stealing" is not the right term. I doubt Dre ever stole any beat. However, Radiotube's post makes a lot of sense. The argument using Dre's career as the proof everybody going against him lies is ludicrous. I think we have to look at the broader picture. With everything that has been said we can sort out what is likely to be true and what is bullshit. I think Radiotube's post does that.
So basically
1) Dre's longevity doesn't dismiss his once collaborators' testimonies. I think Dre (and the people surrounding him like Suge) was once very neglecting about giving people credit. So in the beginning, those who did the bulk of the work (whatever you wanna call them beatmakers, ghostproducers, etc.) weren't credited (so supposedly Lay Law, Big Hutch in some instances, Chris The Glove Taylor, Barney Rubble) (and some didn't find that outrageous, like The Glove). It also depended on the importance of the co-producer. I remember a Snoop interview where he said that Suge wanted Snoop to take the credit for the Who Got Some Gangsta Shit beat because Soopafly wasn't signed and was basically a nobody in the industry. I think over the years Dre has been more careful to include his collaborators in the credits, whether as co-producer or musician. It started with Daz on Afro Puffs, then Bud'da, Mel Man, Mike Elizondo, Focus and so on were all credited. And I think that's the reason why today Dre is only credited as the mixer for Kush and INAD. I guess that 15 years ago Dre would have taken at least a co-producer credit on Kush.
2) Dre "forgetting" to mention people in the credits does not make him a thief or a fraud. Dre was most of the time responsible for the final product more than the original beatmaker. Contributors should have been credited too.
3) Just because a person is bitter doesn't make him a liar or a wack producer. But he's more likely to exaggerate to prove his point.
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^^^ Dre had been giving a lot of producers credit for a long time now, shit Khalil even said see completely revamped the sound of kush and only took mixing credits, it seems like hes taking a step back, giving other producers their shine and "detoxing" from the game. It seems like a lot of this dispute comes from the death row period so maybe it was suges involvement, he didn't mind sharing vo producer credits with yella before death row and Mel mam after for whole albums.
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i think Khalil was just being humble. everything about that song besides tha Piano sounds like Khalil. everything from tha drums to Kobe's part and tha way its punched in to tha background sounds. Dre sounds like he guided Snoops verse just based off their more recent efforts and maybe it was his idea to put Sly in there but everything about that song screams DJ Khalil.
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i think Khalil was just being humble. everything about that song besides tha Piano sounds like Khalil. everything from tha drums to Kobe's part and tha way its punched in to tha background sounds. Dre sounds like he guided Snoops verse just based off their more recent efforts and maybe it was his idea to put Sly in there but everything about that song screams DJ Khalil.
Why can't we believe the words from Khalils mouth?
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Dr Dre has to be one of the biggest frauds in hip hop. :grumpy: I dont understand why he continues to get praise when history has shown all he ever does is rob and steal from other producers. Im convinced he has never done one beat for himself. Even in the NWA days it seems that Big Hutch and Erotic D were doing all the work
MC Ren and Yella both said that Dr. Dre made the beats for NWA and there's even some footage of him workin' on the 2nd album in the studio, but Ren said that Dre took credit for the Above The Law album and didn't actually make those beats. Bad Azz said this same shit about Dr. Dre years ago in an interview with DubCNN.
dubcnn.com : The Neptunes ain't as dope as Dre though man..
Shiiit.. It's opinionated, I ain't gonna try and force my opinion on you, but I say it, write it down in my interview, Bad Azz said The Neptunes are as dope as Dr. Dre. And I didn't say doper, and they're new, they ain't as old as Dre, but on me, they PRODUCED all they songs, Dre don't produce all his songs, look Dre gets props for songs that he didn't produce! So who's doper? The Neptunes produce allllll they're songs, Dre gets props for.. Focus produces Dre songs, Mel Man produces Dre songs, Daz produced Dre songs, Warren G has produced Dre songs, like remember that Watcher song? Dre didn't do that beat! Dre did not do that beat! 50% of the shit Dre does, he doesn't really do! He has this little kid named Ryan right now, that nigga is DOPE as fuck! He has this guy named Focus that produces beats.. You know who else like got a song compilation wit Dre.. Khalil, Khalil has been producin for Dre. Dre needs dope producers, and he'll take a rough track
that they did and he'll fix it up and he produced it. The Neptunes are way doper than Dre, Battlecat is way doper, I'm talkin' about niggas like Jelly Roll, that produce, really produce they're own tracks. Did you hear that song Jelly Roll produced for Dre? On the Wash soundtrack? Comon now, Dr. Dre hasn't made a beat that dope in years, and that's Jelly Roll! But people think Dre did it! Even The Wash, what about that, that's the last beat Dre did that I can honestly say Dre did, and that's a sample! Dre did that, that's a Dre beat, but c'mon man I can name a gang of beats that are tighter than that that people think Dre did, so I feel you when you say like "Dre! He's the greatest!" but believe me man, alotta these young niggas are doper than him, but he has the credit, he as the power, he's the man, he's the credible producer that says "I did more work, I did produce more songs than you guys" So it's not like these niggas ain't better, caues Jelly Roll, I'ma be honest with you, Jelly Roll, BattleCat, Fredwreck, The Neptunes, Just
Blaze, those niggas are fuckin wit Dre man. And these new dope ass producers
that are really makin the hits right now, they fuckin wit him man! Mel Man..
have you heard Mel Mans shit?
dubcnn.com : Of course!
Mel Man is fuckin vicious, and now Mel Mans still produces shit that Dre gets credit for right now! And that's why I say The Neptunes is nobody that produces for them! The Neptunes are Chad, Hugo and Pharrell Williams and thats it. They make ALL the beats, that little chinese dude thats behind Pharell, he makes, he programs beats, Pharell does the keyboard and the hook, and that's the beat. And they produce for Michael Jackson, they produce for Justin Timberlake, they killin Dre! They REALLY get 100Gs a track, Dre don't get 100 Gs a track! From who? Who does Dre sell? He sellin to Eminem for 100 Gs a track? Nooo, he GIVIN Eminem beats? Snoop ain't buyin no tracks from Dre for 100 Gs, The Neptunes are really sellin beats to people for 100 Gs. Pass The Courvoisier, they got 100 Gs for that, Beautiful, they got 100 Gs for that, that other song Snoop did, they got a 100 Gs for that. They got $200,000 from Snoop for his record, for that. Dre ain't gettin paid like that! He's not, I swear to god, and the reason why I say that is that Dre makes DEAL. Like Jay-Z is gonna say look Dre, gimme 2 beats I'll write you two verses. So he ain't gettin 100 Gs a beat, I mean he's worth a 100Gs a
beat, they gonna sell enough copies for him to make 100 Gs, but he ain't gettin paid believe me, mark my words, he ain't gettin paid like the neptunes. Like Rodney Jerkins, he produces R&B, he gets 150-200 Gs a TRACK! Dre ain't gettin that! And even though like I said Dre is worth it, but he ain't gettin that. If we name all the artists Dre produced for recently, 50 Cent ain't payed 100 Gs for these tracks, Dre gave him those beats! He might have got 40 or 50 a beat because Interscope probably paid him.. All in all Dre ain't even workin for no outside people that would! Anybody thats big enough to pay 100 Gs for a Dre track, if they do they stupid because like if Tony Braxton want a Dre beat, all she has to do is say "look Dre I'll do you a favor you'll give me a beat" Or they gonna get it discounted, that's why I say The Neptunes are really gettin 100 Gs a beat. But that's just because I give credit where credit is due, I don't say nothing against Dre dog, Dre is the greatest producer that ever touched the game, but because of alotta reasons, not because he's the best beat maker right now because he's not. And I know it, I swear to god I know it. He gets dope beats from all the dope niggas that's out there! He gets beats from Battlecat, he gets beats from Jelly Roll, and he changes them up a little bit and putsh is name on
them. He gets beats from this little nigga named Ryan. He plays in the church, he plays in the fuckin church, and this dude named Focus, he was makin beats at his house, and he was so killer, somebody took a beat to Dre, like listen to this beat. And he was like "Who made that?" Listens to this other one and he was so dope Dre was like "Man bring him to me!" You understand what I'm sayin? But Dre is smart, that's smart, that's how I am, I can't produce a beat, I'ma be like Dr. Dre, I'ma hook up wit every dope producer and put it out under my jurisdiction!
http://www.dubcnn.com/interviews/badazz/
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The word "stealing" is not the right term. I doubt Dre ever stole any beat. However, Radiotube's post makes a lot of sense. The argument using Dre's career as the proof everybody going against him lies is ludicrous. I think we have to look at the broader picture. With everything that has been said we can sort out what is likely to be true and what is bullshit. I think Radiotube's post does that.
So basically
1) Dre's longevity doesn't dismiss his once collaborators' testimonies. I think Dre (and the people surrounding him like Suge) was once very neglecting about giving people credit. So in the beginning, those who did the bulk of the work (whatever you wanna call them beatmakers, ghostproducers, etc.) weren't credited (so supposedly Lay Law, Big Hutch in some instances, Chris The Glove Taylor, Barney Rubble) (and some didn't find that outrageous, like The Glove). It also depended on the importance of the co-producer. I remember a Snoop interview where he said that Suge wanted Snoop to take the credit for the Who Got Some Gangsta Shit beat because Soopafly wasn't signed and was basically a nobody in the industry. I think over the years Dre has been more careful to include his collaborators in the credits, whether as co-producer or musician. It started with Daz on Afro Puffs, then Bud'da, Mel Man, Mike Elizondo, Focus and so on were all credited. And I think that's the reason why today Dre is only credited as the mixer for Kush and INAD. I guess that 15 years ago Dre would have taken at least a co-producer credit on Kush.
2) Dre "forgetting" to mention people in the credits does not make him a thief or a fraud. Dre was most of the time responsible for the final product more than the original beatmaker. Contributors should have been credited too.
3) Just because a person is bitter doesn't make him a liar or a wack producer. But he's more likely to exaggerate to prove his point.
a lot of collaborations are credited :P
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Dr Dre has to be one of the biggest frauds in hip hop. :grumpy: I dont understand why he continues to get praise when history has shown all he ever does is rob and steal from other producers. Im convinced he has never done one beat for himself. Even in the NWA days it seems that Big Hutch and Erotic D were doing all the work
MC Ren and Yella both said that Dr. Dre made the beats for NWA and there's even some footage of him workin' on the 2nd album in the studio, but Ren said that Dre took credit for the Above The Law album and didn't actually make those beats. Bad Azz said this same shit about Dr. Dre years ago in an interview with DubCNN.
dubcnn.com : The Neptunes ain't as dope as Dre though man..
Shiiit.. It's opinionated, I ain't gonna try and force my opinion on you, but I say it, write it down in my interview, Bad Azz said The Neptunes are as dope as Dr. Dre. And I didn't say doper, and they're new, they ain't as old as Dre, but on me, they PRODUCED all they songs, Dre don't produce all his songs, look Dre gets props for songs that he didn't produce! So who's doper? The Neptunes produce allllll they're songs, Dre gets props for.. Focus produces Dre songs, Mel Man produces Dre songs, Daz produced Dre songs, Warren G has produced Dre songs, like remember that Watcher song? Dre didn't do that beat! Dre did not do that beat! 50% of the shit Dre does, he doesn't really do! He has this little kid named Ryan right now, that nigga is DOPE as fuck! He has this guy named Focus that produces beats.. You know who else like got a song compilation wit Dre.. Khalil, Khalil has been producin for Dre. Dre needs dope producers, and he'll take a rough track
that they did and he'll fix it up and he produced it. The Neptunes are way doper than Dre, Battlecat is way doper, I'm talkin' about niggas like Jelly Roll, that produce, really produce they're own tracks. Did you hear that song Jelly Roll produced for Dre? On the Wash soundtrack? Comon now, Dr. Dre hasn't made a beat that dope in years, and that's Jelly Roll! But people think Dre did it! Even The Wash, what about that, that's the last beat Dre did that I can honestly say Dre did, and that's a sample! Dre did that, that's a Dre beat, but c'mon man I can name a gang of beats that are tighter than that that people think Dre did, so I feel you when you say like "Dre! He's the greatest!" but believe me man, alotta these young niggas are doper than him, but he has the credit, he as the power, he's the man, he's the credible producer that says "I did more work, I did produce more songs than you guys" So it's not like these niggas ain't better, caues Jelly Roll, I'ma be honest with you, Jelly Roll, BattleCat, Fredwreck, The Neptunes, Just
Blaze, those niggas are fuckin wit Dre man. And these new dope ass producers
that are really makin the hits right now, they fuckin wit him man! Mel Man..
have you heard Mel Mans shit?
dubcnn.com : Of course!
Mel Man is fuckin vicious, and now Mel Mans still produces shit that Dre gets credit for right now! And that's why I say The Neptunes is nobody that produces for them! The Neptunes are Chad, Hugo and Pharrell Williams and thats it. They make ALL the beats, that little chinese dude thats behind Pharell, he makes, he programs beats, Pharell does the keyboard and the hook, and that's the beat. And they produce for Michael Jackson, they produce for Justin Timberlake, they killin Dre! They REALLY get 100Gs a track, Dre don't get 100 Gs a track! From who? Who does Dre sell? He sellin to Eminem for 100 Gs a track? Nooo, he GIVIN Eminem beats? Snoop ain't buyin no tracks from Dre for 100 Gs, The Neptunes are really sellin beats to people for 100 Gs. Pass The Courvoisier, they got 100 Gs for that, Beautiful, they got 100 Gs for that, that other song Snoop did, they got a 100 Gs for that. They got $200,000 from Snoop for his record, for that. Dre ain't gettin paid like that! He's not, I swear to god, and the reason why I say that is that Dre makes DEAL. Like Jay-Z is gonna say look Dre, gimme 2 beats I'll write you two verses. So he ain't gettin 100 Gs a beat, I mean he's worth a 100Gs a
beat, they gonna sell enough copies for him to make 100 Gs, but he ain't gettin paid believe me, mark my words, he ain't gettin paid like the neptunes. Like Rodney Jerkins, he produces R&B, he gets 150-200 Gs a TRACK! Dre ain't gettin that! And even though like I said Dre is worth it, but he ain't gettin that. If we name all the artists Dre produced for recently, 50 Cent ain't payed 100 Gs for these tracks, Dre gave him those beats! He might have got 40 or 50 a beat because Interscope probably paid him.. All in all Dre ain't even workin for no outside people that would! Anybody thats big enough to pay 100 Gs for a Dre track, if they do they stupid because like if Tony Braxton want a Dre beat, all she has to do is say "look Dre I'll do you a favor you'll give me a beat" Or they gonna get it discounted, that's why I say The Neptunes are really gettin 100 Gs a beat. But that's just because I give credit where credit is due, I don't say nothing against Dre dog, Dre is the greatest producer that ever touched the game, but because of alotta reasons, not because he's the best beat maker right now because he's not. And I know it, I swear to god I know it. He gets dope beats from all the dope niggas that's out there! He gets beats from Battlecat, he gets beats from Jelly Roll, and he changes them up a little bit and putsh is name on
them. He gets beats from this little nigga named Ryan. He plays in the church, he plays in the fuckin church, and this dude named Focus, he was makin beats at his house, and he was so killer, somebody took a beat to Dre, like listen to this beat. And he was like "Who made that?" Listens to this other one and he was so dope Dre was like "Man bring him to me!" You understand what I'm sayin? But Dre is smart, that's smart, that's how I am, I can't produce a beat, I'ma be like Dr. Dre, I'ma hook up wit every dope producer and put it out under my jurisdiction!
http://www.dubcnn.com/interviews/badazz/
hmm, u think Bad Azz is credible?
he probly never been in a studio wit Dre in his life
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well you can see him in the booklet of 2001
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i think hes just bitter or some shit. Bad azz reached out to Dre for a beat at one point,
doc never got back to him.. (same interview Okka quoted)
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Why you wont work with the man if he rob you once? ???
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yall do know its not that hard to put together a hip hop beat right? whether its good or not is a whole different story. i believe Bad Azz just like i believe tha millions of other people who say they made those beats and I believe tha entire rap world when they said they worked on Detox. Dre got good ears and he's probably sittin on all this hot music thats been accumulating until sum random ass new nigga comes in and kills em.
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I remember that bad azz interview. I believe the part about him not making the beats but the part about him not making more than 200k? Stoppit.
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Why you wont work with the man if he rob you once? ???
This is where the logic of Dre robbing people doesn't pay off. This is all coming from people who Dre doesn't fuck with anymore. All Dre would have to do is reach out and they would hop right back in the studio with him. Would you do that to someone who had did you wrong?
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After all of this my man Dre has yet to comment...
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After all of this my man Dre has yet to comment...
That's never been dres style. I believe him and em are of the same train of thought that less press makes you more of an illusive and intriguing artist with longer career stability, I dont know why they didn't teach this to fifty.
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I remember that bad azz interview. I believe the part about him not making the beats but the part about him not making more than 200k? Stoppit.
Not saying he's right but i get what he was saying and i could see his point.
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Not that I really care but I can't see a single mistake Dre has made in his career. He is my type of dude, handle business, get paid. He got longevity and people can't wait to hear his shit. not only that, he's still alive.
If that is bad, can I get some?
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Yup^^^ ... On another note I heard the Mel-Man track from the The Wash featuring Ox. Bringing it up cuz Bad Azz mentioned The Wash. That was Mel-Man solo and guess what! That song was WACK as fuck! You can hear the 2001 elements in it but something is missing ... its clear but it just doesn't bang like a Dre track. I bet Dre could've made that one way better but what's the point... if makes it better he's robbing people right ::)
If that's what he does (I don't know) then so be it. Takes a B- track and makes it A+ who gives a fuck?! All these people complaining have never made A+ tracks consistently without Dre. Storch makes some bangers with already established artists but I've never seen him and his team makes stars ... just like the other people complaining
I'll give Timbo and Neptunes credit though of course on career longevity and $$$
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I'll give Timbo and Neptunes credit though of course on career longevity and $$$
VA baby! We breed legends over here.
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Why you wont work with the man if he rob you once? ???
This is where the logic of Dre robbing people doesn't pay off. This is all coming from people who Dre doesn't fuck with anymore. All Dre would have to do is reach out and they would hop right back in the studio with him. Would you do that to someone who had did you wrong?
Thats what im saying. why you came again and again, and he's fuck you up once, twice, and you keep coming back, fuck is wrong with you?
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That melman track on the wash was indeed ass. So were the songs he did for truth hurts.
But what about the "gangsta" joint he did for joe beast? Tell me he didn't fool you into thinkin that was dre...
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If Dre is jackin all these beats then how come they can't make the same hits when he's not in the picture? :-\
I don't agree on this.
U hear what are his last leaks & works. Doesn't sound dope at all, so how come can't he make those dope ass sounds from backintheday when all those mentionned are not in the picture anymore ?
It all depends from where you're going to consider the question.
My understanding is that Dre is rather a dope mixer than a dope producer. Don't make me saying what I didn't say, he can produce as well, but it's like a lot of times he ACTUALLY take someone else's songs & add some instrument, or some effect, etc which MAKE those songs sounded dope. Therefore IMO some of them entourage saying this or that like a Cold187um, Daz, I mean u know, shits like taking credit from other's work.
Like what is common believed & everyone sayin its dope, that intro & outro beat from Cali Love video is from him, when actually that is NOT from him.
What made The Chronic wasn't based on Dre on his own, but on all that entourage, u do know this. Like Dre + Snoop is bananas, but Dre alone is meh. Snoop alone is meh, ya know what Im sayin?
It seems like for this last album Detox, he's trying to work out a new sound which to be honest is nothing special or incredible. Those artists/producers actually surrounded him may provide an environment that may sound like "meh"
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If Dre is jackin all these beats then how come they can't make the same hits when he's not in the picture? :-\
I don't agree on this.
U hear what are his last leaks & works. Doesn't sound dope at all, so how come can't he make those dope ass sounds from backintheday when all those mentionned are not in the picture anymore ?
It all depends from where you're going to consider the question.
My understanding is that Dre is rather a dope mixer than a dope producer. Don't make me saying what I didn't say, he can produce as well, but it's like a lot of times he ACTUALLY take someone else's songs & add some instrument, or some effect, etc which MAKE those songs sounded dope. Therefore IMO some of them entourage saying this or that like a Cold187um, Daz, I mean u know, shits like taking credit from other's work.
[/b]Like what is common believed & everyone sayin its dope, that intro & outro beat from Cali Love video is from him, when actually that is NOT from him.
What made The Chronic wasn't based on Dre on his own, but on all that entourage, u do know this. Like Dre + Snoop is bananas, but Dre alone is meh. Snoop alone is meh, ya know what Im sayin?
It seems like for this last album Detox, he's trying to work out a new sound which to be honest is nothing special or incredible. Those artists/producers actually surrounded him may provide an environment that may sound like "meh"
Budda-beat? not sure, seems like its just speculation tho
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After all of this my man Dre has yet to comment...
That's never been dres style. I believe him and em are of the same train of thought that less press makes you more of an illusive and intriguing artist with longer career stability, I dont know why they didn't teach this to fifty.
because 50 is an attention whore
If Dre is jackin all these beats then how come they can't make the same hits when he's not in the picture? :-\
I don't agree on this.
U hear what are his last leaks & works. Doesn't sound dope at all, so how come can't he make those dope ass sounds from backintheday when all those mentionned are not in the picture anymore ?
It all depends from where you're going to consider the question.
My understanding is that Dre is rather a dope mixer than a dope producer. Don't make me saying what I didn't say, he can produce as well, but it's like a lot of times he ACTUALLY take someone else's songs & add some instrument, or some effect, etc which MAKE those songs sounded dope. Therefore IMO some of them entourage saying this or that like a Cold187um, Daz, I mean u know, shits like taking credit from other's work.
Like what is common believed & everyone sayin its dope, that intro & outro beat from Cali Love video is from him, when actually that is NOT from him.
What made The Chronic wasn't based on Dre on his own, but on all that entourage, u do know this. Like Dre + Snoop is bananas, but Dre alone is meh. Snoop alone is meh, ya know what Im sayin?
It seems like for this last album Detox, he's trying to work out a new sound which to be honest is nothing special or incredible. Those artists/producers actually surrounded him may provide an environment that may sound like "meh"
because he seems insecure about the direction of Detox, you can't blame his partners for that.
anyway, off course dre is not the only one responsible for the success of the chronic, but he did have a lot to do with it. you can discredit him all you want, but history speaks for itself
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If Dre is jackin all these beats then how come they can't make the same hits when he's not in the picture? :-\
I don't agree on this.
U hear what are his last leaks & works. Doesn't sound dope at all, so how come can't he make those dope ass sounds from backintheday when all those mentionned are not in the picture anymore ?
It all depends from where you're going to consider the question.
My understanding is that Dre is rather a dope mixer than a dope producer. Don't make me saying what I didn't say, he can produce as well, but it's like a lot of times he ACTUALLY take someone else's songs & add some instrument, or some effect, etc which MAKE those songs sounded dope. Therefore IMO some of them entourage saying this or that like a Cold187um, Daz, I mean u know, shits like taking credit from other's work.
[/b]Like what is common believed & everyone sayin its dope, that intro & outro beat from Cali Love video is from him, when actually that is NOT from him.
What made The Chronic wasn't based on Dre on his own, but on all that entourage, u do know this. Like Dre + Snoop is bananas, but Dre alone is meh. Snoop alone is meh, ya know what Im sayin?
It seems like for this last album Detox, he's trying to work out a new sound which to be honest is nothing special or incredible. Those artists/producers actually surrounded him may provide an environment that may sound like "meh"
Budda-beat? not sure, seems like its just speculation tho
bud'da said he did the beat in his latest interview with hip hop dx
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Bilderberg, Cross em out, and a few other player-haters from the first two pages... A quote, most recently, Str8 from the horse's mouth asked by myself:
Stan: "A lot of player haters on this forum are saying Dr. Dre is nothin but beat-jacker and his whole career is phony. As a producer that has worked with him what is your opinion? Should Dre be legitimately responsible for all the hits he's made? Is he fair?"
EasSki: "dre is the best that's done it, he has been able to take production and make it sound bigger then anyone, dre knows how to take others production in a direction that it would never go if it was not for his approach."
So, like above, that's my point. A lot of people can have C or B level tracks that would go nowhere without his touch. Again why he makes stars ...
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I don't see many people hating on dre on this thread. a couple called him a fraud but that's it. if asking legitimate questions and making observations is hating then damn we're all haters to some extent lol.
if anything, u're the one hating on his collaborators like Scott Storch.
Ski's response is appreciated but doesn't take away the testimonies made by other people who have worked with him. everybody's entitled to their opinions, and Ski's is credible but so are some of the observations made by countless others.
granted Dre is responsible for many long careers. but that's not solely due to his production skills. it's also due to the way he conducts business, his ability to capitalize on his popularity to create anticipation for the artists under his umbrella. in short, Dre's career making skills (lol) owe a lot to marketing savvy too.
not being able to create stars doesn't make you a worthless producer. you know a producer's first task is to produce good music. whether it sells or not depends on a lot of factors. and Dre's stroke of genius (other than his evident musical ear and producing/mixing talent) is his ability to arouse people's excitement about his upcoming projects. the way he shaped and reshaped his image are important factors in his success. so this image of a minute producer serious about his craft overshadows the fact that a lot are involved in the process. for example many say that the piano sound that Dre's so famous for comes actually from Scott Storch who was his keyboardist during the 2001 era.
the point i'm trying to make is that everything that's being said about Dre not producing his music/stealing beats is over-exaggerated, however, dismissing his other (former) producers' work is as exaggerated. just because they didn't meet commercial success doesn't mean their music is trash. they're not mere minions and they've pretty much all proven they can musically hold their own. when i say pretty much all i mean : Yella, Big Hutch, Chris The Glove Taylor, Colin Wolfe, Warren G, Daz, Sean Barney Thomas, Bud'da, Sam Sneed, Scott Storch, Focus. I don't know about Mel-Man (i liked I Pledge Allegiance on Nate's Music & Me though) and the others though.
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I agree that a lot of light is shedding on the real dre
Lmao @ dre being a cheerleader in high school
see homie that's how niggas get mislead by pure hate...he never once said dre was a "cheerleader"..Dre was a b-boy(BREAK DANCER ,pop locker)which is all part of hip hop...don't start making shit up..stay focus on the subject cuzz...not trying to break ya balls,but damn my nigga u reaching deep. :-\
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^^^ wow ... don't put words in my mouth. Storch is great, I love him, but his beats aren't nearly as good as the ones he's made with Dre. I was talking about how the first poster said DRE had to be one of the biggest frauds then someone else said all he's done is taken the best beats from other producers ALL his career ....
Sorry, I don't buy it. If these guys are so worried about it (obviously not as much as we are) then why do they give him their stuff? Plain and simple he can take it to the next level that's it!! We're goin in circles now.
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Yup^^^ ... On another note I heard the Mel-Man track from the The Wash featuring Ox. Bringing it up cuz Bad Azz mentioned The Wash. That was Mel-Man solo and guess what! That song was WACK as fuck! You can hear the 2001 elements in it but something is missing ... its clear but it just doesn't bang like a Dre track. I bet Dre could've made that one way better but what's the point... if makes it better he's robbing people right ::)
If that's what he does (I don't know) then so be it. Takes a B- track and makes it A+ who gives a fuck?! All these people complaining have never made A+ tracks consistently without Dre. Storch makes some bangers with already established artists but I've never seen him and his team makes stars ... just like the other people complaining
I'll give Timbo and Neptunes credit though of course on career longevity and $$$
naw dude that mel-track was banging.ox brought the pain to that track...where he at???
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That melman track on the wash was indeed ass. So were the songs he did for truth hurts.
But what about the "gangsta" joint he did for joe beast? Tell me he didn't fool you into thinkin that was dre...
That joe track was nasty!!damn!!where he at???
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My understanding is that Dre is rather a dope mixer than a dope producer. Don't make me saying what I didn't say, he can produce as well, but it's like a lot of times he ACTUALLY take someone else's songs & add some instrument, or some effect, etc which MAKE those songs sounded dope. Therefore IMO some of them entourage saying this or that like a Cold187um, Daz, I mean u know, shits like taking credit from other's work.
Do you know what a producer is?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Record_producer
A producer is the person responsible for the final sound of the product. Dre is a producer in every sense of the word.
What's ironic is that you will take credit away from Dre when it's not like Hutch or Daz were coming up with original instrumentals. So why are you giving credit to these guys for pulling out samples? If you're going to talk about beatmakers, shouldn't you be giving credit to the person who made the sample? 95% of hip hop is taking some oldass song and adding shit to it to make it bump. Isn't that what Dre does?
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It's the fraud thing that doesn't wash. The game is too competitive for people like Just Blaze, Timbaland, DJ Quik, or anyone else that rightfully could be holding Dre's spot to bow down and call him "the greatest" if he's nothing more than a good mixer who jacks other people's shit. I mean, even the people who didn't get their credit on some of those tracks, are saying Dre is a great producer so you have to put two and two together.
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A producer is the person responsible for the final sound of the product. Dre is a producer in every sense of the word.
What's ironic is that you will take credit away from Dre when it's not like Hutch or Daz were coming up with original instrumentals. So why are you giving credit to these guys for pulling out samples? If you're going to talk about beatmakers, shouldn't you be giving credit to the person who made the sample?
Yea no kidding. I read all this bickering about producing Doggystyle and how warren g or daz brought the sample for ain't no fun. Who gives a fuck!!! Wow I can rip off a couple of samples and add some kicks to it. Look at Kanye... He is the king of sampling and he is a dope producer right?
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very dope thread that 2pac part is nuts. 8)
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My understanding is that Dre is rather a dope mixer than a dope producer. Don't make me saying what I didn't say, he can produce as well, but it's like a lot of times he ACTUALLY take someone else's songs & add some instrument, or some effect, etc which MAKE those songs sounded dope. Therefore IMO some of them entourage saying this or that like a Cold187um, Daz, I mean u know, shits like taking credit from other's work.
Do you know what a producer is?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Record_producer
A producer is the person responsible for the final sound of the product. Dre is a producer in every sense of the word.
What's ironic is that you will take credit away from Dre when it's not like Hutch or Daz were coming up with original instrumentals. So why are you giving credit to these guys for pulling out samples? If you're going to talk about beatmakers, shouldn't you be giving credit to the person who made the sample? 95% of hip hop is taking some oldass song and adding shit to it to make it bump. Isn't that what Dre does?
yeah, since when is bringing break beats and samples, producing
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^^well, its alright though lol, don't get upset because y'all dig Dre guys.
So, your saying is that "How coming with the sample or the structure of the beat should give u credits" now, Dre did just mix a thing or 2, and that alone should give him 90% credit, wait no, entire credit as in booklets?
I don't agree for real, somehow, I understand where those who did like complain coming from.
Until he remade everything from track he was given, I don't understand how adding an instrument or remade that one should give him THE credit for the final song.
Just imagine YOU often coming with dope structure beats that you works ur ass to find it, & next dude saying wait, Im adding this, slowing that, & take credits for it ?
ok im exagerating, but just to get an idea u know
I mean
wait, lol nevermind just look out for detox right
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Just imagine YOU often coming with dope structure beats that you works ur ass to find it, & next dude saying wait, Im adding this, slowing that, & take credits for it ?
ok im exagerating, but just to get an idea u know
But they didn't come up with it. They ripped it off of some P-Funk song from the 70s. According to your logic, if Dre doesn't get credit for not originating every part of the song, then neither should the people who brought him the samples.
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That's the thing, I doubt if these dudes are that upset over not being credited for finding a sample. I mean shit I've never read the credits to an album and saw "sample found by..."
My guess is these dudes basically make the beats and dre comes in and, as snoop puts it, takes them "to another level". I'm sure they enjoy working with a legend but not being credited for your work has to suck.
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I guess you could liken it to all these screenwriters who do "polishes" or "uncredited rewrites" on big Hollywood scripts.
But there's also a lot of ideas that go into making a record. If you oversaw the whole song conceptually, I can understand you being pissed about not getting a producer credit but just making a beat that someone else came along and switched up completely, I don't know. To me, that's like comparing a garage band's demo version of a song to the one they make in a big studio with a producer enhancing everything. But again... every situation is different. Maybe some of these dudes did get ganked without compensation but on the other hand, maybe they're overplaying their role. Who's to say?
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^^well, its alright though lol, don't get upset because y'all dig Dre guys.
So, your saying is that "How coming with the sample or the structure of the beat should give u credits" now, Dre did just mix a thing or 2, and that alone should give him 90% credit, wait no, entire credit as in booklets?
I don't agree for real, somehow, I understand where those who did like complain coming from.
Until he remade everything from track he was given, I don't understand how adding an instrument or remade that one should give him THE credit for the final song.
Just imagine YOU often coming with dope structure beats that you works ur ass to find it, & next dude saying wait, Im adding this, slowing that, & take credits for it ?
ok im exagerating, but just to get an idea u know
I mean
wait, lol nevermind just look out for detox right
im not upset. i like dre's music, yes. does that make me biased? i could accuse you of the same thing.
i just don't see the point of accepting allcrap.com stories as facts.
That's the thing, I doubt if these dudes are that upset over not being credited for finding a sample. I mean shit I've never read the credits to an album and saw "sample found by..."
My guess is these dudes basically make the beats and dre comes in and, as snoop puts it, takes them "to another level". I'm sure they enjoy working with a legend but not being credited for your work has to suck.
dre works with musicians, together they make the beat.