West Coast Connection Forum
DUBCC - Tha Connection => West Coast Classics => Topic started by: love33 on August 28, 2011, 09:22:49 PM
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All I know is that it's a complete travesty for the MTV Music Awards to be held in LOS ANGELES and Game just dropped his smash album and NO PERFORMANCE by THE GAME? Are you kidding me? How much more can the West be dry hated on? No Dr. Dre, No Snoop, and No Game after a fresh album. They could have had him perform "Change Your Life" and "Pot Of Gold" and "I'm On." They could have even got all three on the stage and had them do the "Drug Test." Nothing. Zero. No songs off "R.E.D." or "Hoodmorning." Nothing.
This just kind of kicks the West one more time which MTV has been doing since 1997. He's signed to a major Interscope and got nothing lined up. Lady Gaga got her performance and she's signed to Interscope and got hers. Nice job for the PR department and Jimmy Iovine getting his artist signed up.
I guess this certifies the fact that Game is leaving Interscope and on his way to Cash Money. Baby aka the #1 stunna got his artists all signed up -- Lil Wayne performed and Drake & Nikki Minaj made appearances. Why wasn't Game promoted like this by Interscope after a fresh album just dropped? Baby even got Wayne huge promos telling people to go download the Carter 4. If Game could've had something like this or a commercial it would've been huge for his sales. Game's videos get banned all the time and now this, no appearance in Los Angeles on MTV Award Show. This is just shit. Another problem is that the people in LA don't do anything to stop this from going down. If the tide was reversed, NY would never allow them to hold the show in NYC with no mention of Jay-Z a week after he drops an album. Give me a break. The people in LA need to do something about this.
Show is in Los Angeles, and no Game. I'm at a loss for words. Why would people in LA even support or go to this shit when they don't even show no love to a premier top 5 rapper and no performance? This should be boycotted 100%. What a shame!
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& people call me a Game hater. Anything would come across as hating when you have groupism of this magnitude.
"I'm at a loss for words" LMFAO.
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i rather have jay rock, g malone, or nipsey hussle performing than that name dropper / pay taxes to bang his own brother even said he wasnt a damu
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Game wasn't blackballed, he's just not making noise on a national level like some of the other guys. When I go to bars and clubs, I don't really hear anything of Game's.
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i rather have jay rock, g malone, or nipsey hussle performing than that name dropper / pay taxes to bang his own brother even said he wasnt a damu
damn homie u RRRRRREEEEEEEEEEEAAAAAAAAAAAALLLLLLLLLLLLLYYYYYYYYYYYYYY need to put a period in that last sentence of yours, somebody might read it too fast.
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Yea Game kinda fell off
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Love33 continues to embarass himself again with this crap. Just because it's held in Los Angeles does not mean that it's a stage for local artists. The VMAs are one of the biggest music-related shows of the year and Game isn't on that mainstream level where it matters. Gaga was there because she equals ratings. People talk about that outlandish shit she does like wear a meat dress and all that. It has nothing to do with Interscope. And Game being blackballed? Shut the fuck up. MTV just wants to have a show that people are talking about.
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Love33 continues to embarass himself again with this crap. Just because it's held in Los Angeles does not mean that it's a stage for local artists. The VMAs are one of the biggest music-related shows of the year and Game isn't on that mainstream level where it matters. Gaga was there because she equals ratings. People talk about that outlandish shit she does like wear a meat dress and all that. It has nothing to do with Interscope. And Game being blackballed? Shut the fuck up. MTV just wants to have a show that people are talking about.
Game isn't "on that mainstream level"? He's a top 5 rapper and he's signed to the major leagues. People want to see him he just dropped an album.
And this isn’t just about Game, it’s about any artist from the West. Here’s an artist with over 10 million records sold and he reps the LA area and the award show is right in Los Angeles and he just drops a fresh album and doesn’t even get a look? This isn’t some meat and potatoe artist he is signed to Interscope.
Imagine Jay-Z drops an album a week before MTV Awards and they are held in NY and no mention. Imagine Kanye droppin an album a week before in Chicago and the awards are held there and no mention.
Cube has been sayin this for years and even touched on it on “I Rep That West”: “rub the shit all in our face, this award show all at our place, damn, can’t a nigga get a lil taste of some of that shine, it look like mine”
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i rather have jay rock, g malone, or nipsey hussle performing than that name dropper / pay taxes to bang his own brother even said he wasnt a damu
His brother never actually said that
He gave his tickets away btw and Tyler the creator won best new artist
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But again, MTV is not some LA company putting on events to showcase local talent. In addition, they are not solely about hip-hop. There are a lot of other artists from other genres who they had to cut out since everyone probably wants to perform. It just happens to be in LA this time around.
Like I said, Game isn't making much noise. So what if he's sold 10 million in the past six years? It's a tremendous achievement, but if you think that MTV is going to put Game on instead of Jay-Z or Lil Wayne, then you are being biased. They have a whole country to satisfy, not just California.
For the record, I think Lil Wayne is a faggot, but I will say that he is far more relevant in the music world than Game. Same thing with Jay-Z.
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Exactly. Why would a record company sabotage its own money? People need to get past that stupid regional shit. People don't give a fuck anymore. It's not the 90's. I'm a Game fan and bought his new album and liked it and I, hand to bible, could not tell you what his current single is without looking it up. He's still doing his thing and getting his money but he hasn't had a top 40 radio single in awhile.
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But Game's not a "regional" artist, he's a national artist. He has Lil Wayne, Chris Brown, E-40, Young Jeezy, and Rick Ross on his album. He had the #1 single on 106 & Park for multiple weeks when L.A.X. dropped, since when did he become a "regional" act who happens to be signed to the Interscope machine? I mean he's sold shoes, been allover tv, done interviews with Sway, rapped on everyone's album, recorded with justin timberlake, etc.
They could've had him come out and do "pot of gold" with Chris Brown or "R.E.D. Nation" with Lil Wayne but they shut the door on him tonite.
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But Game's not a "regional" artist, he's a national artist. He has Lil Wayne, Chris Brown, E-40, Young Jeezy, and Rick Ross on his album. He had the #1 single on 106 & Park for multiple weeks when L.A.X. dropped, since when did he become a "regional" act who happens to be signed to the Interscope machine? I mean he's sold shoes, been allover tv, done interviews with Sway, rapped on everyone's album, recorded with justin timberlake, etc.
They could've had him come out and do "pot of gold" with Chris Brown or "R.E.D. Nation" with Lil Wayne but they shut the door on him tonite.
L.A.X. was 3 years ago. In 2011 Game doesn't have a mainstream buzz and doesn't have a successful single. That = MTV not giving a fuck about him. Lol @ expecting them to want Game there to perform two songs that failed on the charts.
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how you kno they jus didnt wanna show up
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Somebody buy this boy a clue. No, Game is not a "regional" artist. However, in terms of mainstream acts, he's not on the top of the hill right now. Your problem is you want to use his region as a basis for him being featured and it doesn't work. It's not an L.A. hip-hop show. It's a mainstream popular music show. How about we do it this way. Game's been in the spotlight for over six years, yes? What is his most memorable VMA appearance in the last 6 years? Don't look it up now. What is it?
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(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6187/6091465517_b52ff67f90_z.jpg) ::) ::) ::) ::)
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Matter of fact, you CAN look it up. Google it. Find me Game's big memorable VMA performance. The one people talked about for months. And let's open up the discussion. Not just love33. Can anyone name a show-stealing VMA performance by The Game?
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(http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6187/6091465517_b52ff67f90_z.jpg) ::) ::) ::) ::)
What shoes are those?
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tyler wins over wiz who's song had way more impact and sold more, yet we get a equal on here crying about a guy who just dropped and has the same old gangsta image not getting recognized lol, my equal a west coast artist fuccing won and you crying about game? Haha man off you so bout the west congratulate tyler and say jed showing different shit can win from the west. Again these fools don't count nothing as west if it's not typical smh yell
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tyler wins over wiz who's song had way more impact and sold more, yet we get a equal on here crying about a guy who just dropped and has the same old gangsta image not getting recognized lol, my equal a west coast artist fuccing won and you crying about game? Haha man off you so bout the west congratulate tyler and say jed showing different shit can win from the west. Again these fools don't count nothing as west if it's not typical smh yell
real talk. It's crazy that not only did a dude from the west win, but an artist who's bringing a different sound than everyone else. Not only that but 4 people from the west were nominated for new artist out of 5. Now that's pretty cool.
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Matter of fact, you CAN look it up. Google it. Find me Game's big memorable VMA performance. The one people talked about for months. And let's open up the discussion. Not just love33. Can anyone name a show-stealing VMA performance by The Game?
Even though i disagree with t/s even when The Documentary came out he never got a perfomance even with "Hate It Or Love It". I'd say his most memorable award show performance was BET Awards 05. But you're off point talking like it's about "show stealing", it's about ratings that's all. If it was about performances then alot of these artists wouldn't even be up there.
But at the same time remember when BET did fuck him over in 2008 though at the Hip-Hop awards and claimed it was because of his sister getting shot, even though it happened AFTER it was announced that they decided not to have him perform with Ice Cube. That's why Cube even performed in the first place.
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tyler wins over wiz who's song had way more impact and sold more, yet we get a equal on here crying about a guy who just dropped and has the same old gangsta image not getting recognized lol, my equal a west coast artist fuccing won and you crying about game? Haha man off you so bout the west congratulate tyler and say jed showing different shit can win from the west. Again these fools don't count nothing as west if it's not typical smh yell
real talk. It's crazy that not only did a dude from the west win, but an artist who's bringing a different sound than everyone else. Not only that but 4 people from the west were nominated for new artist out of 5. Now that's pretty cool.
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tyler wins over wiz who's song had way more impact and sold more, yet we get a equal on here crying about a guy who just dropped and has the same old gangsta image not getting recognized lol, my equal a west coast artist fuccing won and you crying about game? Haha man off you so bout the west congratulate tyler and say jed showing different shit can win from the west. Again these fools don't count nothing as west if it's not typical smh yell
real talk. It's crazy that not only did a dude from the west win, but an artist who's bringing a different sound than everyone else. Not only that but 4 people from the west were nominated for new artist out of 5. Now that's pretty cool.
I counted Tyler who's the other 4?
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Not only that but 4 people from the west were nominated for new artist out of 5. Now that's pretty cool.
4? I counted only Tyler, Foster The People (for those that don't know they're not hip hop but they are from L.A.) and Kreayshawn. Is there another list?
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Not only that but 4 people from the west were nominated for new artist out of 5. Now that's pretty cool.
4? I counted only Tyler, Foster The People (for those that don't know they're not hip hop but they are from L.A.) and Kreayshawn. Is there another list?
Big Sean is Cali born. Though I guess that doesn't count.
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Game wasn't blackballed, he's just not making noise on a national level like some of the other guys. When I go to bars and clubs, I don't really hear anything of Game's.
Exactly. He wasn't nominated for anything and none of his 43 lead singles from "Red Album" caught on, so why waste a spot on the show for him when you can feature someone the mainstream actually cares about?
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Even though i disagree with t/s even when The Documentary came out he never got a perfomance even with "Hate It Or Love It". I'd say his most memorable award show performance was BET Awards 05. But you're off point talking like it's about "show stealing", it's about ratings that's all. If it was about performances then alot of these artists wouldn't even be up there.
But at the same time remember when BET did fuck him over in 2008 though at the Hip-Hop awards and claimed it was because of his sister getting shot, even though it happened AFTER it was announced that they decided not to have him perform with Ice Cube. That's why Cube even performed in the first place.
I don't feel I'm "off point". Yes, it is about ratings and how do the VMA's sell their show to viewers? Every year, they run these clip shows where they talk about "big VMA moments". I haven't seen this year's show but I did catch one of those specials where they went into all the craziest moments. The point I'm getting at is this dude acts like Lady Gaga is up there because she's on Interscope when the reality is she's there because she's established herself as an artist who people don't know what to expect. It was the same deal with Britney when she was doing the striptease or kissing Madonna or all that other shit. MTV wants artists that are going to make people talk about their show.
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Game needs to start interrupting some speeches and complain how [insert west coast rapper] didn't win. Maybe then they'll pay attention to him.
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does it really surprise anyone that they didnt put him on the show? his career is dwindling
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Man all those award shows are janky. After the Biggie and Pac feud the West got blackballed and we still are.....but people will never be able to deny the quality of music coming from the West right now. We runnin' this shit....!!!
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Enough with the blackball shit. Like I said before, nobody gives a flying fuck about coasts anymore! Just because MC Eiht's not performing at the VMA's doesn't mean the West Coast is blackballed.
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Game needs to start interrupting some speeches and complain how [insert west coast rapper] didn't win. Maybe then they'll pay attention to him.
Yeah, people who aren't big hip-hop fans will be like, who is he?
Only Kanye can interrupt speeches like that. Game will get rushed by security haha.
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Man all those award shows are janky. After the Biggie and Pac feud the West got blackballed and we still are.....but people will never be able to deny the quality of music coming from the West right now. We runnin' this shit....!!!
Agree 100, MTV gave the West the death sentence after B.I.G. got dropped
Enough with the blackball shit. Like I said before, nobody gives a flying fuck about coasts anymore!
I guess you missed "I Rep That West"
Same thing, different day. Game is a top 5 artist -- him, Drake, and Lil Wayne are probably the biggest three right now --
Drake hasn't sold as many records as Game (no diss, just provin my point) and he found his way on stage at the award show (give Baby credit too for gettin his artists on there)
"Pain" on his last album rode number 1 for weeks on 106 & Park and someone on here says that it was "years ago", okay with that logic then Dr. Dre shouldnt have been invited on stage at the grammy's to perform because he hasn't had a huge record at that time in years.
You didn't see Jay-Z get denied invites to award shows when he dropped "American Gangster." And 'R.E.D.' out-sold Snoop's entire sales of "Doggumentary" with just his first week.
That's like Pac not getting invited after he drops an album on Interscope a week earlier and he would've never left that happen he wouldve demanded Jimmy to get him there. I think it's fair to say that Game is on his way to Cash Money Records.
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equals crying about glam not being there and the west blacc balled are still ignoring the fact a west equal won,you equals still ain't say congrats to tyler, hell yall hero game even put him on his new record!!!! haha, and why would a show want to showcase gangsta's who don't bring in big viewer ship? when snoop and dr was on they was running the game, glam is just a artist who makes some music some folks like but not everybody, hell if anyone should complain it should have been 50, he sold all those records was in the public eye,had a story,is an engaging interview and the grammys in them ain't even nominate that equal, so it is what it is, this is mtv not the street awards. stop putting so much stocc into a damn channel that don't really show video's haha, oh yeah congrats tyler the west did it! yell
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Maybe because nobody gives a fuck about Game anymore. The nigga made himself irrelevant with all the bullshit he's been doin over the years.
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Maybe because nobody gives a fuck about Game anymore. The nigga made himself irrelevant with all the bullshit he's been doin over the years.
He just sold around 100k his first week, that's hardly irrelevant. This sounds like a hater.
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Maybe because nobody gives a fuck about Game anymore. The nigga made himself irrelevant with all the bullshit he's been doin over the years.
He just sold around 100k his first week, that's hardly irrelevant. This sounds like a hater.
What if you compare it to the first week sales of the artists who did perform last night?
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haha, and why would a show want to showcase gangsta's who don't bring in big viewer ship?
Gotta say that many have drew ratings who rap about the streets all the way from Dr. Dre to Fabolous to Slim Thug, Game puts people in the seats he's the best selling rapper in the West. Even Jay-Z was rappin 'crip or blood' at one point in his music and Wayne is bleedin all over reppin gangsta culture and he got his invite. What's the next reason game wasn't invited was it because there was an earthquake in virginia or the tsunami in japan?
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If you dont have a hot single the tv or radio doesnt give a fuck about you, its simple. Game still has a great following and can sell records without it. We just witnessed that. My bet is he stops at gold. If game didnt drop mixtape after mixtape he would be irrelevent. Props to game for being on his mixtape grind, proved he still had a good fan base with the success of all the tapes and interscope gave him the green light to release the album without a hot single. Who knows what would of happened if he wasn't on the mixtape grind. His mixtapes seem to buzz harder than his album. From now on he should keep releasing material to keep a float and have somewhat of a name in the mainstream.
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Maybe because nobody gives a fuck about Game anymore. The nigga made himself irrelevant with all the bullshit he's been doin over the years.
He just sold around 100k his first week, that's hardly irrelevant. This sounds like a hater.
What if you compare it to the first week sales of the artists who did perform last night?
Yeah, like Jay & Kanye; just to stay in the genre.
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The threadstarter has completely ignored the point why Game was not performing this year: he hasn't been relevant and hasn't had an album out in the time period eligible for the VMA's.
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Agree 100, MTV gave the West the death sentence after B.I.G. got dropped
Funny because they were produced a special on Death Row after Biggie died. In 1999, the VMA's were also the stage for Dre and Snoop's first live public appearance.
Same thing, different day. Game is a top 5 artist -- him, Drake, and Lil Wayne are probably the biggest three right now --
Game isn't a top 5 artist. Eminem. Jay-Z. Kanye West. Lil' Wayne. Drake. And that's just "rappers". That's not putting into account. The Lady Gagas, Katy Perrys, Miley Cryus, Justin Biebers, and so and so forth.
Drake hasn't sold as many records as Game (no diss, just provin my point) and he found his way on stage at the award show (give Baby credit too for gettin his artists on there)
Drake is featured on four songs that are on the Billboard Top 40. Game doesn't have one single song that is even in the top 100. Drake's debut album in 2010 was #1 and was certified platinum. L.A.X. went #2 in 2008 and never got platinum certification.
"Pain" on his last album rode number 1 for weeks on 106 & Park and someone on here says that it was "years ago", okay with that logic then Dr. Dre shouldnt have been invited on stage at the grammy's to perform because he hasn't had a huge record at that time in years.
Dre is a 25-year music veteran. It's like having Prince, Madonna, Elton John, whoever. He is at a point in his career where he can dissapear from music for five or six years and he can come back and still be releveant. Game doesn't have the reputation. 50 Cent still outsells Game and you don't hear nobody crying about him being blackballed.
You didn't see Jay-Z get denied invites to award shows when he dropped "American Gangster."
Who says Game was denied an invite?
And 'R.E.D.' out-sold Snoop's entire sales of "Doggumentary" with just his first week.
What's your source on that? And even if this were the truth, what the fuck does it have to do with anything?
That's like Pac not getting invited after he drops an album on Interscope a week earlier and he would've never left that happen he wouldve demanded Jimmy to get him there.
How the hell do you know? His only major VMA appearance was in 1996 when he was just coming off having a #1 album and the biggest-selling project of his career. In other words, he was at the height of his commercial success. Game hasn't had a #1 album since Doctor's Advocate in 2006. Each album has had a steady decline in sales since.
I think it's fair to say that Game is on his way to Cash Money Records.
It's not fair to say anything. For starters, we don't know how many albums he still owes Interscope. Secondly, Game is someone who makes bold statements on impulse then changes directions quickly. Doctor's Advocate was supposed to be an Aftermath album with Dre production. He was supposed to retire after LAX. If he did come back, it was supposed to be for an album called "Diary Of Compton" with all Compton rappers invovled. R.E.D. album was supposed to be an Aftermath album with Dre and Pharrell co-executive producing. He's made a lot of statements in regard to his career that have never come to fruition so to say "it's fair" to believe that this is going to be where he's going based on what he's saying during the press run for the album he just finished is bullshit.
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Gotta say that many have drew ratings who rap about the streets all the way from Dr. Dre to Fabolous to Slim Thug, Game puts people in the seats he's the best selling rapper in the West. Even Jay-Z was rappin 'crip or blood' at one point in his music and Wayne is bleedin all over reppin gangsta culture and he got his invite. What's the next reason game wasn't invited was it because there was an earthquake in virginia or the tsunami in japan?
The gangbang shit doesn't really matter, in reference to Jay-Z or Lil Wayne. Jay-Z will pretty much always be relevant and will always bring the heat and sell records (plus it helps that he's married to Beyonce so even if he didn't do shit he'd still be there). Like I said before, Lil Wayne is a faggot but he's had some songs getting pretty decent rotation, plus there's at least a little bit of hype about him, with this being his first appearance since getting locked up then released from prison. The fact that Jay-Z said "Crip or Blood" on a song or two or that Lil Wayne has a red rag in his pocket doesn't change any of that or mean that MTV is making exceptions for them despite that. I don't see what that's so hard to comprehend.
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Game puts people in the seats he's the best selling rapper in the West.
Once again, this isn't a show about rap or the West Coast. It's not about regions or genres. What was Game's last major crossover hit?
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GOLF WANG
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Maybe because nobody gives a fuck about Game anymore. The nigga made himself irrelevant with all the bullshit he's been doin over the years.
He just sold around 100k his first week, that's hardly irrelevant. This sounds like a hater.
Those are facts, not hate. Game is not important enough for me to hate. He's not even important enough to be at the same award show that invited a bunch of Nickelodeon and Disney rejects, so I ain't the only one who feels that way. Fact of the matter is this ain't 2000 and nobody is interested in the recycled, regurgitated gangsta shit that your beloved Game has to offer (that 100k he sold doesn't hold a candle to the majority of people who were actually at the VMAs so stop over inflating the "impact" of his sales).
Obviously you hold him in a higher regard than most by "being shocked" and "at a loss for words" by the way MTV treated Game so I'ma let you keep him up on that golden pedestal that exists in your make believe world.
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Fuck the MTV awards..............can't believe mahfukas still watch dat bullshit.
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hip hop isnt real music so they shouldnt play it at the awards show
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Just to let evryone know Pot Of Gold is doing really well on 106 n park it was at #3 today, and its doind decent on radios, But Game performing obviously wasnt gunna happen, MTV dont cater to gangsta rap and hes not as big as artist that performed. PROPS to Tlyer tho!!!
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Just to let evryone know Pot Of Gold is doing really well on 106 n park it was at #3 today, and its doind decent on radios, But Game performing obviously wasnt gunna happen, MTV dont cater to gangsta rap
Which proves the point they are blackballed. When they let Daz & Kurupt on stage and Snoop performs "Murder Was The Case" at VMA, but they won't let Game perform "R.E.D. Nation" and they ban his video proves it. I don't know how much more evidence some of these people need?!
Some people act as if Jay-Z is beyond criticism. He's had a few average albums but he didn't have half the people in NY going "he's irrelevant," "he fell off," "he's rappin 2000 music." An artist who fell off is like Chingy or Knoc'Turnal -- Game is not close to that. In fact, when Jay-Z drops a weak album they beg him to come back and drop another album that's better and get behind him. NY gets behind Jay-Z; Half of LA loves the Game, the other half hates on him. Game has given us R.E.D. for free all year long droppin free bangers like "Purp and Patron," "Candy Coronas Mixtape," "Daytona 500," and then the final release "R.E.D." was the cherry on top. And 50% of you thank him with negative remarks after all this free music he's giving us. He's one of the only artists in today's rap game making good raw rap music.
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They already gave Wayne mic time. They don't need him to do hooks for a mediocre Game single.
You don't get it, do you? Game is not a commodity on MTV. I like his music and enjoyed RED Album personally, but I don't have puppy love for the nigga. I can see him for what he's worth. And in today's current music climate, it ain't about being "raw" or "grimey". It's about havin swag and coming up with a goofy dance for your shit. It ain't the way I like it either, but it is what it is. Stop complaining and accept it.
They got those corny cali swag fuckers eatin off the dougie song for fuckin years already. That's what's MTV wants. Not some name dropping cornball rapping colors like its a 1988 Sean Penn movie and jockin' every rapper's style.
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Funny because they were produced a special on Death Row after Biggie died. In 1999, the VMA's were also the stage for Dre and Snoop's first live public appearance.
Lets see....
--no video play for Warren G's "Lookin At You" off his big Universal release "Return of Regulator" album (Warren was a superstar heading into that album where he fell)
--no play for Mr. Short Khop "Dollaz, Drank, and Dank" smash video
--minimal airplay for "Who Ride Wit Us" which was huge on the 'Up In Smoke Tour' and went Gold
--"Fall Down" video by Chico and Coolwadda -- zero air play after they had a buzz from 'High Come Down' single with Nate Dogg from the first album
--Shade Shiest with Kurupt & Nate Dogg "Where I Wanna Be" (had to watch this one at 2am on BET cause MTV wouldnt play it)
--Too Short "I Luv" with Scarface, Scarface, & Daz (Video was apparently too raw for MTV they played it on BET Uncut)
--Game "One Blood" banned by MTV
--Ice Cube -- I Rep That West -- no video play; this is what happens when you diss Lil Wayne
--Knoc'Turnal -- The Way I Am with Snoop (excellent video; very minimal play, this held his career down IMO)
--Ice Cube -- Drink The Kool Aid -- No Video play for the legend
--Crooked I "Still Tha Row" video banned by MTV
--Snoop Dogg "Boom" ft. T-Pain; this one wasn't banned, but it sure wasn't given much of a chance
--213 "Groupie Luv" & WSC "Gangsta Nation" got a little sprinkle of play on MTV -- BET played the videos to be fair
--Too Short "Blow The Whistle" huge radio hit and mtv had the video on their web site but no love on tv; BET played it a little to be fair
--Snoop Dogg & Too Short -- Life of the Party (same as above)
--Game ft. Lil Wayne "R.E.D. Nation" banned by MTV
--Naughty by Nature "Mourn You Til I Join You [Tupac Tribute]" one of the greatest vids of all time; MTV was too busy playin Puffy "Missin You"
Had this trend went the other way we probably might have saw videos for tracks like: DJ Quik ft. Dr. Dre "Put It On Me," "Black Mercedes," "High Come Down" by Chico & Coolwadda, Luniz "A Piece Of Me" ft. Fat Joe, DJ Quik "50 Wayz," Hi-C "I Don't Wanna Know" ft. Nate Dogg. A lot of artists quit doing videos because they knew they were going to get "overlooked" by MTV.
We basically lost a whole era of priceless music that should be now-classics. And there's more I'm just too tired to keep typing this shit. They blackballed a whole era of great music.
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Nobody is being blackballed. Buy a clue, bro.
Some people act as if Jay-Z is beyond criticism. He's had a few average albums but he didn't have half the people in NY going "he's irrelevant," "he fell off," "he's rappin 2000 music."
Nobody is saying Jay-Z is beyond criticism. You can call his albums "weak" or "overrated" but the fact remains he's dropped the most consecutive #1 albums in music. He beat out Elvis Presley. When was he "not relevenat"? When has he not pushed more than 400,000 copies of an album on the first week? When has he not done over a million worldwide ever? I mean, "certified", within the year. Jay's sales figures CRUSH Game's. The only mainstream artist coming close to touching him in hip-hop is Eminem.
In fact, when Jay-Z drops a weak album they beg him to come back and drop another album that's better and get behind him.
Stop exaggerating. It's not about love or hate. It's about money. Game's last three solo albums haven't broken 400,000. Jay's last eleven have all sold north of that. You could make this complaint if you had numbers to back it up but all you have blind fanboy emotion. 106 & Park is a hip-hop show which means it caters specifically to rap fans. The VMA's is a national show that is watched by like twelve times the audience of that show. Just because the venue is in Los Angeles and Game has an album out doesn't mean he gets a spot on the show. Quit being a child and get with the picture, bro.
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You have to be one of the dillusional people around, brother. Let's see.
--no video play for Warren G's "Lookin At You" off his big Universal release "Return of Regulator" album (Warren was a superstar heading into that album where he fell)
No video for Sticky Fingaz either. He was on Universal at the same time and had basically the same budget. And Warren was a superstar heading in, huh? His last two albums before that went "gold". He hadn't a platinum album or a hit radio single in six years.
--Ice Cube -- I Rep That West -- no video play; this is what happens when you diss Lil Wayne
MTV and VH1 are both owned by the same company. If the plan was to BLACKBALL Cube, why did they dedicate a brand-new "Behind The Music" video special to him, which included clips and discussion of the new album.
--Crooked I "Still Tha Row" video banned by MTV
Eminem and 50 Cent have had videos BANNED too. Are they being blackballed?
--Naughty by Nature "Mourn You Til I Join You [Tupac Tribute]" one of the greatest vids of all time; MTV was too busy playin Puffy "Missin You"
Puffy was a bigger-selling artist than Naughty By Nature at the time. This one is just the icing on the stupid cake as far as you're concerned. They're blackballing the West by not playing music from a group from Jersey. I know the agrument you're trying to make is that they are trying to "blackball" Pac or something but please, use your head. They played the shit out of "Changes" a year later and distributed the fucking "Resurrection" film.
You keep bringing up this "minimum play" thing and I'll ask you this. If they played enough times for you to see it, shouldn't logical wisdom suggest that if the results of said airplay resulted in more requests and views that they would have played it MORE? You don't blackball something by allowing it to be shown a little bit, you outright cut it off the knees from the start. That's how it works.
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The only mainstream artist coming close to touching him in hip-hop is Eminem.
i agree with you about jay-z but I think Em has sold more albums to date than Jay-Z. estimations say jay-z has sold 50 mil albums worldwide while Em is said to have sold more than 85 mil albums.
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Nobody is being blackballed. Buy a clue, bro.
Some people act as if Jay-Z is beyond criticism. He's had a few average albums but he didn't have half the people in NY going "he's irrelevant," "he fell off," "he's rappin 2000 music."
Nobody is saying Jay-Z is beyond criticism. You can call his albums "weak" or "overrated" but the fact remains he's dropped the most consecutive #1 albums in music. He beat out Elvis Presley. When was he "not relevenat"? When has he not pushed more than 400,000 copies of an album on the first week? When has he not done over a million worldwide ever? I mean, "certified", within the year. Jay's sales figures CRUSH Game's. The only mainstream artist coming close to touching him in hip-hop is Eminem.
In fact, when Jay-Z drops a weak album they beg him to come back and drop another album that's better and get behind him.
Stop exaggerating. It's not about love or hate. It's about money. Game's last three solo albums haven't broken 400,000. Jay's last eleven have all sold north of that. You could make this complaint if you had numbers to back it up but all you have blind fanboy emotion. 106 & Park is a hip-hop show which means it caters specifically to rap fans. The VMA's is a national show that is watched by like twelve times the audience of that show. Just because the venue is in Los Angeles and Game has an album out doesn't mean he gets a spot on the show. Quit being a child and get with the picture, bro.
LOL at the amount of bs and wrong facts in this post.
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Nobody is being blackballed. Buy a clue, bro.
Some people act as if Jay-Z is beyond criticism. He's had a few average albums but he didn't have half the people in NY going "he's irrelevant," "he fell off," "he's rappin 2000 music."
Nobody is saying Jay-Z is beyond criticism. You can call his albums "weak" or "overrated" but the fact remains he's dropped the most consecutive #1 albums in music. He beat out Elvis Presley. When was he "not relevenat"? When has he not pushed more than 400,000 copies of an album on the first week? When has he not done over a million worldwide ever? I mean, "certified", within the year. Jay's sales figures CRUSH Game's. The only mainstream artist coming close to touching him in hip-hop is Eminem.
In fact, when Jay-Z drops a weak album they beg him to come back and drop another album that's better and get behind him.
Stop exaggerating. It's not about love or hate. It's about money. Game's last three solo albums haven't broken 400,000. Jay's last eleven have all sold north of that. You could make this complaint if you had numbers to back it up but all you have blind fanboy emotion. 106 & Park is a hip-hop show which means it caters specifically to rap fans. The VMA's is a national show that is watched by like twelve times the audience of that show. Just because the venue is in Los Angeles and Game has an album out doesn't mean he gets a spot on the show. Quit being a child and get with the picture, bro.
LOL at the amount of bs and wrong facts in this post.
such as?
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--no video play for Warren G's "Lookin At You" off his big Universal release "Return of Regulator" album (Warren was a superstar heading into that album where he fell)
Superstar? No he wasn't. Maybe after Regulate... G Funk Era, but Take a Look Over Your Shoulder was wack as fuck, but MTV still played I Shot the Sheriff. I Want It All wasn't that dope either. It's not a surprise that he didn't get much rotation after that.
--minimal airplay for "Who Ride Wit Us" which was huge on the 'Up In Smoke Tour' and went Gold
The video wasn't good at all... complete mismatch for such a dope song.
--Shade Shiest with Kurupt & Nate Dogg "Where I Wanna Be" (had to watch this one at 2am on BET cause MTV wouldnt play it)
The song had hardly any buzz in the mainstream outside of California.
--Game "One Blood" banned by MTV
MTV doesn't want to participate in the obvious display of gang affiliation. HOWEVER, they did have Game perform One Blood on TRL, though he was just saying "One" instead of "Blood."
--Crooked I "Still Tha Row" video banned by MTV
That song wasn't gonna blow, plus outside of the West Coast, very few people gave a fuck about Crooked I.
--Game ft. Lil Wayne "R.E.D. Nation" banned by MTV
...for the same reason as One Blood
--Naughty by Nature "Mourn You Til I Join You [Tupac Tribute]" one of the greatest vids of all time; MTV was too busy playin Puffy "Missin You"
Naturally a Puffy song is going to get more attention, especially since that was an '80s sample-happy period. His single alone did 2 or 3 million. What did NBN do? They're not even West Coast anyway, so I don't know why they came up. Sure, it's a Pac tribute, but still not West Coast.
Had this trend went the other way we probably might have saw videos for tracks like: DJ Quik ft. Dr. Dre "Put It On Me," "Black Mercedes," "High Come Down" by Chico & Coolwadda, Luniz "A Piece Of Me" ft. Fat Joe, DJ Quik "50 Wayz," Hi-C "I Don't Wanna Know" ft. Nate Dogg. A lot of artists quit doing videos because they knew they were going to get "overlooked" by MTV.
Not that those songs were bad, but they just weren't trendy. MTV's not about playing stuff that appeals to a very small audience that doesn't even watch MTV anyway, but BET. So it makes sense.
We basically lost a whole era of priceless music that should be now-classics. And there's more I'm just too tired to keep typing this shit. They blackballed a whole era of great music.
How does MTV not giving heavy rotation to West Coats songs mean that we "lost a whole era of priceless music"? We got the music, it just didn't get played on ONE channel.
In addition, I bet you could find two or three times as many East Coast rappers and their songs that got looked over by MTV as well. Same thing with other regions. Bone Thugs got heavy rotation before, but not after The Art of War. Why? Because their buzz was dying down, and their new stuff wasn't as good. Same thing with the Game as of recent. HOWEVER, they did still play Wouldn't Get Far, so you can't hate on them.
Also, MTV banned Hit 'Em Up for reasons that I understand. Does that mean that they blackballed Pac back in the day? No. His other videos got heavy rotation, and later videos like I Ain't Mad at Cha and To Live & Die in L.A. got HEAVY rotation.
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And on top of that, I read that Lil Wayne held a release party for Tha Carter IV in LA. I looked through some of the pictures, and I didn't see Game there either. I saw Rick Ross, DJ Khaled, Drake, etc.
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The threadstarter doesn't know the difference between the word "blackballed" and the phrase "currently irrelevant".
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Game aint been blackballed.
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And on top of that, I read that Lil Wayne held a release party for Tha Carter IV in LA. I looked through some of the pictures, and I didn't see Game there either. I saw Rick Ross, DJ Khaled, Drake, etc.
Nah he was i heard Snoop was there too. I think someone from Wayne's crew tweeted about it.
He gave his ticket to 2 females, he did the same at the BET awards. Game always been like that though he rarely shows up to
award shows unless he performs or does something at the actual awards (like present or some shit).
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Nobody is saying Jay-Z is beyond criticism. You can call his albums "weak" or "overrated" but the fact remains he's dropped the most consecutive #1 albums in music. He beat out Elvis Presley. When was he "not relevenat"? When has he not pushed more than 400,000 copies of an album on the first week? When has he not done over a million worldwide ever? I mean, "certified", within the year. Jay's sales figures CRUSH Game's. The only mainstream artist coming close to touching him in hip-hop is Eminem.
You gotta be kidding me man did you ever actually take a look at the numbers before you wrote this senseless shit? Game's debut album CRUSHED Jay-Z's "Reasonable Doubt" in sales. Look at the numbers head up -- Game opened at nearly 600k units with "The Documentary" and quickly went to platinum status and Jay-Z took until 2002 to get certified platinum for Reasonable Doubt (which was due to all the MTV dickriding, nobody paid attention to his shit until after Pac died). It took Jigga 7 years for his debut to go platinum.
Jay-Z's big break came from MTV pushing him hard with "Can I Get A..." and his feature with Jermaine Dupri on "Money Ain't A Thang" was really when his career was born on the main stage. After that, his career tookoff like a rocket but thanks to MTV and people being done with Pac (R.I.P) weren't going to listen to Will Smith for the next 5 years so they were looking to MTV for the next big thing.
The Game also outsold Jay-Z if you want to compare their second albums head up as well (Game debuted at #1 and sold over 4 million worldwide). It wasn't until the third and fourth album that Jay-Z beats Game head up in sales (and if you look at the number of spins and video spins you will see a huge difference).
Jay-Z is a solid artist no doubt with a boatload of platinum records, but tell the truth next time you post. Game isn't some peanut butter artist.
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Game's only video prior to like a month ago (well after they planned the award show) was "Red Nation" & that was banned from TV.
The songs nominated for male artists are over a year old & honestly, more deserving than Game's recent efforts & hands down more popular.
As for Game performing, Jay & Kanye are award shows, they get the nod over Game & Wayne was going to get his turn to rap; he's fucking Lil' Wayne. That was it. Eminem & Drake didn't. Rick Ross didn't. I know you want to act like Hip Hip is the only genre, but Beyonce gets her turn, Pitbull & Ne-Yo had a huge song. Adele made big moves this year. They needed to get other people in of different genres. Lady Gaga is the biggest name in music; obviously got one. LMFAO "Party Rock Anthem" is arguably the biggest song of the year & wasn't played once or nominated the entire night; unless I missed something.
We might as well be making a thread saying Eminem, 50 Cent & Dr. Dre got backballed, especially Em & Dre because "I Need A Doctor" wasn't even spoken about & that released perfectly in time for this show. You're just a moron, love33.
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The threadstarter doesn't know the difference between the word "blackballed" and the phrase "currently irrelevant".
Guess Love33 is going to ignore this fact.
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The threadstarter doesn't know the difference between the word "blackballed" and the phrase "currently irrelevant".
Guess Love33 is going to ignore this fact.
The word "irrelevant" is used loosely on here.
You're not "irrelevant" if you just sold 100k units in a week with no major video in rotation. If he's irrelevant than so is Snoop Dogg because "Doggumentary" sold 80,000 units to date and Game outsold him in one week. Dr. Dre would be irrelevant too than because he hasn't had an album go platinum since 1999. This is the logic of some of the people on this forum. They make a rule then they go against that rule for certain artists. If Game is irrelevant, every artist on the West Coast is irrelevant because he sold the most of anyone from the West since 2000. Check the resume.
If he's irrelevant, he wouldn't have songs with Drake, Rick Ross, Young Jeezy, E-40, Justin Timberlake, Trey Songz, Chris Brown, Lil Wayne, etc.
Irrelevant rappers are people like: Messy Marv, Cadillac Tah, Spider, Swoop G, Hittman, etc.
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Theres only one way to put this your a Stan you can use what ever dumb logic to justify your self
but facts are facts hes old news im a fan of the Game btw.
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You gotta be kidding me man did you ever actually take a look at the numbers before you wrote this senseless shit? Game's debut album CRUSHED Jay-Z's "Reasonable Doubt" in sales. Look at the numbers head up -- Game opened at nearly 600k units with "The Documentary" and quickly went to platinum status and Jay-Z took until 2002 to get certified platinum for Reasonable Doubt (which was due to all the MTV dickriding, nobody paid attention to his shit until after Pac died). It took Jigga 7 years for his debut to go platinum.
Jay-Z's big break came from MTV pushing him hard with "Can I Get A..." and his feature with Jermaine Dupri on "Money Ain't A Thang" was really when his career was born on the main stage. After that, his career tookoff like a rocket but thanks to MTV and people being done with Pac (R.I.P) weren't going to listen to Will Smith for the next 5 years so they were looking to MTV for the next big thing.
The Game also outsold Jay-Z if you want to compare their second albums head up as well (Game debuted at #1 and sold over 4 million worldwide). It wasn't until the third and fourth album that Jay-Z beats Game head up in sales (and if you look at the number of spins and video spins you will see a huge difference).
Jay-Z is a solid artist no doubt with a boatload of platinum records, but tell the truth next time you post. Game isn't some peanut butter artist.
Yes, genius idea. Let's compare Jay before he blew up (in a completely different decade) to Game in 2005. If we're going debut for debut, I guess Vanilla Ice should be rocking the VMA's since he outsold Jay, Game, and Eminem combined on his mainstream debut.
But since you want to play the "funnyman" card. Alright, let's use first four albums of Jay as a comparison to Game. Alright, here we go.
JAY-Z
Reasonable Doubt, debuted at #23 (sales figures unlisted)
In My Lifetime, debuted at #3
Vol. 2: Hard Knock Life, debuted at #1
Vol. 3: Life and Times of Shawn Carter, debuted at #1 (sold 462,000 copies)
GAME
The Documentary, debuted at #1 (sold 586,000 copies)
Doctor's Advocate, debuted at #1 (sold 358,000 copies)
LAX, debuted at #2 (sold 238,00 copies)
The R.E.D. Album, number not in, (sold 97,000 copies)
Now, looking at those figures, which one is RISING and which one is DECREASING? Alright then, now let's look at this from a more accurate point.
Jay didn't start showing up at the VMA's until he BLEW UP. Correct? Alright, then now the point you're trying to beat home is that Jay is allowed to drop albums that brick and still get invited to the award shows. Alright, now leaving regions and all bullshit out of it. Name me a fucking year where Jay-Z dropped an album that sold less than 100,000 copies on its first week and was still invited to perform?
You're not "irrelevant" if you just sold 100k units in a week with no major video in rotation. If he's irrelevant than so is Snoop Dogg because "Doggumentary" sold 80,000 units to date and Game outsold him in one week. Dr. Dre would be irrelevant too than because he hasn't had an album go platinum since 1999. This is the logic of some of the people on this forum. They make a rule then they go against that rule for certain artists. If Game is irrelevant, every artist on the West Coast is irrelevant because he sold the most of anyone from the West since 2000. Check the resume.
Once again if anyone on here is using "flawed logic", it's you. I'm not saying Game is IRRELEVANT but you're trying to argue that he's doing a lot BIGGER than he in actuality is. He's doing well commercially but he's not so high up that him not being at the VMA's is so baffling. MTV has supported him his entire career. BLACKBALLING is an idiotic scapegoat term used by people who have no clue what it actually means. People who are blackballed get "zero" support from the commodity in question. That's how it operates. They don't do business with you. Period. It's basically like disowning somebody on a business level.
Your argument that MTV is blackballing the West is fucking retarded. Xzibit blew up off of MTV. He then became a household name off of a reality show they gave him, which operated out of.... drum roll... WEST COAST CUSTOMS!!!! I could go on and on but I've wasted enough time throwing facts and numbers at you and watching them fly right off your head. Game is a great artist and a solid-seller but he hasn't had a cross-over single in almost a half decade. He doesn't have a major outside business venture that is blowing up. He doesn't have a reality TV series. He hasn't jumped on an outside artist's hit single (like Snoop with Katy Perry). He's been in the industry too long to be considered "new" but doesn't have a long enough run with consistently hot projects to get by on career longevity. Comparing him to Jay is asinine. Jay is a much bigger artist commercially. Slice it any fucking way you want. Jay-Z generates way more revenue than Game. His lowest-selling solo in the last five years did 420,000 copies on its first week. Game just did under 100,000. Again, when you take these numbers and try to translate it into me "hating" or saying "Game is irrelevant", you manipulate the argument into something that it isn't. Obviously, he IS relevant. However, he isn't a game-changer. He sells a lot but he's never outsold his older sales record, let alone broken any new ones. Jay-Z's music crosses over into the pop charts. He breaks sales records.
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The threadstarter doesn't know the difference between the word "blackballed" and the phrase "currently irrelevant".
Guess Love33 is going to ignore this fact.
The word "irrelevant" is used loosely on here.
You're not "irrelevant" if you just sold 100k units in a week with no major video in rotation. If he's irrelevant than so is Snoop Dogg because "Doggumentary" sold 80,000 units to date and Game outsold him in one week. Dr. Dre would be irrelevant too than because he hasn't had an album go platinum since 1999. This is the logic of some of the people on this forum. They make a rule then they go against that rule for certain artists. If Game is irrelevant, every artist on the West Coast is irrelevant because he sold the most of anyone from the West since 2000. Check the resume.
If he's irrelevant, he wouldn't have songs with Drake, Rick Ross, Young Jeezy, E-40, Justin Timberlake, Trey Songz, Chris Brown, Lil Wayne, etc.
Irrelevant rappers are people like: Messy Marv, Cadillac Tah, Spider, Swoop G, Hittman, etc.
You don't get it, let me bold it and italicize for you (and underline the word currently because you obviously missed that).
HE WAS NOT CURRENTLY RELEVANT DURING THE TIME PERIOD ELIGIBLE TO BE NOMINATED FOR A VMA.
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Slice it any fucking way you want. Jay-Z generates way more revenue than Game. His lowest-selling solo in the last five years did 420,000 copies on its first week. Game just did under 100,000. Again, when you take these numbers and try to translate it into me "hating" or saying "Game is irrelevant", you manipulate the argument into something that it isn't. Obviously, he IS relevant. However, he isn't a game-changer. He sells a lot but he's never outsold his older sales record, let alone broken any new ones. Jay-Z's music crosses over into the pop charts. He breaks sales records.
I agree with you that Jay-Z sells more right now, but it's also because:
1. He has the whole city of NY behind him (walk into NY and say some of the shit people say here about Game calling him "fake," a "namedropper," "washed up," "irrelevant," whatever and poeple would smack you in NY if you said that about Jigga -- he gets mad respect on his territory) -- Game even said it in interviews, the biggest problem on the West is that the West hates the West. So a hot artist from Cali drops an album and only a quarter of the people support it. Where in the East and especially the South, the people support the artists. People love Jay-Z in NY. Go read some of the topics here and 50% of the people hate The Game. Except for 2Pac, there's barely any Westcoast artists that get close to a unanimous curtain call.
2. Getting his main video banned (again) didn't help his cause -- the R.E.D. Nation being banned just cut right into his sales as that video was going to be the main piece that pushed the project. The Lil Wayne track he had on L.A.X. helped give him a late push --
3. Game doesn't make shit off his mixtapes. His mixtapes don't put food on the table, but he has given us enough good free tracks the past year to make 3-4 good albums.
4. He doesn't make nearly close to the amount of television appearances that Jay-Z gets.
5. He doesn't get free promotion from ESPN all the time (Jay-Z gets mentioned on ESPN constantly because he owns the 40/40 club in NY and he owns part of the NJ Nets). The Sportscenter announcers even use his rhymes in their highlights and they show his face all the time like they are told to dickride him by their higher ups.
6. Jay-Z gets more Hollywood mention because he is with Beyonce so TMZ is always following her around and when he's with her it keeps his name in people's mouths and his face in people's minds.
7. Jay-Z has the largest media market in the country on his side. NY is the biggest media giant and pumps his music, promotes his local events. LA is no cow town either, but it's not nearly the mass size of the NY media market which also ties in the New Jersey market and outreaches all the way to DC and Boston. Covering that kind of population and the radio power gives any NY artist an advantage whether it's Jay-Z or LL Cool J. That's a machine over there and they always try to blow their own artists up rather than play everyone else's music like most of the West stations.
And that's why I give him his props because nobody on the West is dropping the amount of quality material that Game has dropped all year on us that you can just pump into your cd player and let play. "Hoodmorning" and "Purp and Patron" were like album releases in themselves and they all fit the "R.E.D." theme Game has been working off of this year so you gotta give him props musically for being consistent in 2011.
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MTV has fell off. MTV IS NO LONGER RELAVENT. They dont even play music videos anymore. They only skim through a few of them. BET is on the same route that MTV went down too. ITs all about reality television. Why should it matter if Game was there or not.
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--no video play for Warren G's "Lookin At You" off his big Universal release "Return of Regulator" album (Warren was a superstar heading into that album where he fell)
Superstar? No he wasn't. Maybe after Regulate... G Funk Era, but Take a Look Over Your Shoulder was wack as fuck, but MTV still played I Shot the Sheriff. I Want It All wasn't that dope either. It's not a surprise that he didn't get much rotation after that.
--minimal airplay for "Who Ride Wit Us" which was huge on the 'Up In Smoke Tour' and went Gold
The video wasn't good at all... complete mismatch for such a dope song.
--Shade Shiest with Kurupt & Nate Dogg "Where I Wanna Be" (had to watch this one at 2am on BET cause MTV wouldnt play it)
The song had hardly any buzz in the mainstream outside of California.
--Game "One Blood" banned by MTV
MTV doesn't want to participate in the obvious display of gang affiliation. HOWEVER, they did have Game perform One Blood on TRL, though he was just saying "One" instead of "Blood."
--Crooked I "Still Tha Row" video banned by MTV
That song wasn't gonna blow, plus outside of the West Coast, very few people gave a fuck about Crooked I.
--Game ft. Lil Wayne "R.E.D. Nation" banned by MTV
...for the same reason as One Blood
--Naughty by Nature "Mourn You Til I Join You [Tupac Tribute]" one of the greatest vids of all time; MTV was too busy playin Puffy "Missin You"
Naturally a Puffy song is going to get more attention, especially since that was an '80s sample-happy period. His single alone did 2 or 3 million. What did NBN do? They're not even West Coast anyway, so I don't know why they came up. Sure, it's a Pac tribute, but still not West Coast.
Had this trend went the other way we probably might have saw videos for tracks like: DJ Quik ft. Dr. Dre "Put It On Me," "Black Mercedes," "High Come Down" by Chico & Coolwadda, Luniz "A Piece Of Me" ft. Fat Joe, DJ Quik "50 Wayz," Hi-C "I Don't Wanna Know" ft. Nate Dogg. A lot of artists quit doing videos because they knew they were going to get "overlooked" by MTV.
Not that those songs were bad, but they just weren't trendy. MTV's not about playing stuff that appeals to a very small audience that doesn't even watch MTV anyway, but BET. So it makes sense.
We basically lost a whole era of priceless music that should be now-classics. And there's more I'm just too tired to keep typing this shit. They blackballed a whole era of great music.
How does MTV not giving heavy rotation to West Coats songs mean that we "lost a whole era of priceless music"? We got the music, it just didn't get played on ONE channel.
In addition, I bet you could find two or three times as many East Coast rappers and their songs that got looked over by MTV as well. Same thing with other regions. Bone Thugs got heavy rotation before, but not after The Art of War. Why? Because their buzz was dying down, and their new stuff wasn't as good. Same thing with the Game as of recent. HOWEVER, they did still play Wouldn't Get Far, so you can't hate on them.
Also, MTV banned Hit 'Em Up for reasons that I understand. Does that mean that they blackballed Pac back in the day? No. His other videos got heavy rotation, and later videos like I Ain't Mad at Cha and To Live & Die in L.A. got HEAVY rotation.
This and them jimmy h post are some networth, and I must add for the 90's cats, when all rap city and yo mtv raps started playing 90% of west coast all the time was that fair in yall eyes and did that mean they was blackballing the south and the east underground artist? Yell
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MTV has fell off. MTV IS NO LONGER RELAVENT. They dont even play music videos anymore. They only skim through a few of them. BET is on the same route that MTV went down too. ITs all about reality television. Why should it matter if Game was there or not.
You don't think that helped Lil Wayne sell mad units when MTV told everyone on their award show to go buy the Carter IV on ITunes? Imagine had Game got his mention also.
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This and them jimmy h post are some networth, and I must add for the 90's cats, when all rap city and yo mtv raps started playing 90% of west coast all the time was that fair in yall eyes and did that mean they was blackballing the south and the east underground artist? Yell
The South didnt really have an identity until Crunk came along with the finger snappin and deep southern base. Eightball & MJG, Outkast, Bushwick Bill, Scarface were mostly rappin over Westcoast beats and some were even usin G-Funk tracks in the South in the 90's. Even when No Limit came along they were still "West Coast Bad Boyz."
On the East, Nas, LL, Naughty, Wu Tang, and B.I.G. was the big faces and they got their play.
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This and them jimmy h post are some networth, and I must add for the 90's cats, when all rap city and yo mtv raps started playing 90% of west coast all the time was that fair in yall eyes and did that mean they was blackballing the south and the east underground artist? Yell
The South didnt really have an identity until Crunk came along with the finger snappin and deep southern base. Eightball & MJG, Outkast, Bushwick Bill, Scarface were mostly rappin over Westcoast beats and some were even usin G-Funk tracks in the South in the 90's. Even when No Limit came along they were still "West Coast Bad Boyz."
On the East, Nas, LL, Naughty, Wu Tang, and B.I.G. was the big faces and they got their play.
i dont know, alot of that old south shit still had its own kinda sound to it but it definitely had a lot of g funk influence. and when no limit was doing the westcoast bad boys it was actually out of richmond, ca and had good shit like rbl, cougnut, c bo ray luv and all of that
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MTV has fell off. MTV IS NO LONGER RELAVENT. They dont even play music videos anymore. They only skim through a few of them. BET is on the same route that MTV went down too. ITs all about reality television. Why should it matter if Game was there or not.
You don't think that helped Lil Wayne sell mad units when MTV told everyone on their award show to go buy the Carter IV on ITunes? Imagine had Game got his mention also.
Sure it helped because all the little Jimmys and Jennys that are still in Junior High who still watch MTV will get their hands on it. But to true fans of music MTV is nothing more than a disappointment. I can still remember the days when they had like 4 or 5 different countdown shows playing different music throughout. These days you gotta tune into MTV2 in the butt crack of dawn to watch videos. Its a shame. MTV turned their back on music because they saw that the whole damn country was goo goo for reality TV. Okay BET came in and took advantage but that only lasted a few years. BET is BLACK ENTERTAINMENT TELEVISION. So you cant argue them making television series and movies and what not. Its their brand but MTV is MUSIC TELEVISION. They turned their back on the Music part. They dont even play the full length of the videos anymore.
who cares about their award shows.
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The South didnt really have an identity until Crunk came along with the finger snappin and deep southern base. Eightball & MJG, Outkast, Bushwick Bill, Scarface were mostly rappin over Westcoast beats and some were even usin G-Funk tracks in the South in the 90's. Even when No Limit came along they were still "West Coast Bad Boyz."
That doesn't matter all that much. It's about the rappers, not the producers. Ice Cube had A LOT of East Coast beats on his solo debut... it's still West Coast rap. But I think the South did have their own sound, though it didn't end up as unique until crunk, though it was just kind of similar to West Coast, but it was still different.
On the East, Nas, LL, Naughty, Wu Tang, and B.I.G. was the big faces and they got their play.
And on the West, we had Ice Cube, Cypress Hill, Dr. Dre, Snoop, Tha Dogg Pound, 2Pac, Coolio, etc. who had videos getting rotation on MTV at that time.
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what the hell u guys talking about mtv dont play no videos, am i the only one with mtv jams all they do is play videos. no need for trl when u got like 4 channels constantly playing videos, i rather watch teen mom anyway lol
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MTV has fell off. MTV IS NO LONGER RELAVENT. They dont even play music videos anymore. They only skim through a few of them. BET is on the same route that MTV went down too. ITs all about reality television. Why should it matter if Game was there or not.
You don't think that helped Lil Wayne sell mad units when MTV told everyone on their award show to go buy the Carter IV on ITunes? Imagine had Game got his mention also.
Sure it helped because all the little Jimmys and Jennys that are still in Junior High who still watch MTV will get their hands on it. But to true fans of music MTV is nothing more than a disappointment. I can still remember the days when they had like 4 or 5 different countdown shows playing different music throughout. These days you gotta tune into MTV2 in the butt crack of dawn to watch videos. Its a shame. MTV turned their back on music because they saw that the whole damn country was goo goo for reality TV. Okay BET came in and took advantage but that only lasted a few years. BET is BLACK ENTERTAINMENT TELEVISION. So you cant argue them making television series and movies and what not. Its their brand but MTV is MUSIC TELEVISION. They turned their back on the Music part. They dont even play the full length of the videos anymore.
who cares about their award shows.
I agree 100% about this post, but there's still something iconic about the Music Television Award Show. Call me old school, but back in the day there was something exciting about gettin home from school, puttin your backpack down, and throwin on mtv's most wanted to watch bill bellemy countdown cube, warren g, and dr dre videos....and when the award show comes there was that mad hype to see snoop, dogg pound, dre, warren g, and nate get on stage and run the show. Now, its a fraction of what the show used to represent amongst music culture. Cross your fingers and close your eyes and pray "Hey will they invite my favorite rappers to the show or did Lady Gaga take their spot."
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So yeah, bottom line. He didn't get Blackballed, he just isn't as big of a name in Hip Hop. Kanye, Jay & Wayne represented Hip Hop. Gaga represented Pop. Adele represented whatever you want to call her music. Beyonce was there for Pop.
There was just no room for Game & his no hit records. I mean "Red Nation" & "Pot Of Gold" are INSANELY less popular & successful as Wayne & Jay/Kanye's singles...
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I agree with you that Jay-Z sells more right now, but it's also because:
1. He has the whole city of NY behind him (walk into NY and say some of the shit people say here about Game calling him "fake," a "namedropper," "washed up," "irrelevant," whatever and poeple would smack you in NY if you said that about Jigga -- he gets mad respect on his territory) -- Game even said it in interviews, the biggest problem on the West is that the West hates the West. So a hot artist from Cali drops an album and only a quarter of the people support it. Where in the East and especially the South, the people support the artists. People love Jay-Z in NY. Go read some of the topics here and 50% of the people hate The Game. Except for 2Pac, there's barely any Westcoast artists that get close to a unanimous curtain call.
2. Getting his main video banned (again) didn't help his cause -- the R.E.D. Nation being banned just cut right into his sales as that video was going to be the main piece that pushed the project. The Lil Wayne track he had on L.A.X. helped give him a late push --
3. Game doesn't make shit off his mixtapes. His mixtapes don't put food on the table, but he has given us enough good free tracks the past year to make 3-4 good albums.
4. He doesn't make nearly close to the amount of television appearances that Jay-Z gets.
5. He doesn't get free promotion from ESPN all the time (Jay-Z gets mentioned on ESPN constantly because he owns the 40/40 club in NY and he owns part of the NJ Nets). The Sportscenter announcers even use his rhymes in their highlights and they show his face all the time like they are told to dickride him by their higher ups.
6. Jay-Z gets more Hollywood mention because he is with Beyonce so TMZ is always following her around and when he's with her it keeps his name in people's mouths and his face in people's minds.
7. Jay-Z has the largest media market in the country on his side. NY is the biggest media giant and pumps his music, promotes his local events. LA is no cow town either, but it's not nearly the mass size of the NY media market which also ties in the New Jersey market and outreaches all the way to DC and Boston. Covering that kind of population and the radio power gives any NY artist an advantage whether it's Jay-Z or LL Cool J. That's a machine over there and they always try to blow their own artists up rather than play everyone else's music like most of the West stations.
And that's why I give him his props because nobody on the West is dropping the amount of quality material that Game has dropped all year on us that you can just pump into your cd player and let play. "Hoodmorning" and "Purp and Patron" were like album releases in themselves and they all fit the "R.E.D." theme Game has been working off of this year so you gotta give him props musically for being consistent in 2011.
He doesn't have the WHOLE CITY of New York behind him. In coming up, he got way more backlash than a Game did from anyone. It was the same with Eminem. Cats just fucking hated them. Game is big as a rap artist but he hasn't quite crossed over into popular culture as the kind of household name that say an Eminem or Jay-Z or Snoop Dogg or 50 Cent has. And part that is just the fact that them dudes know how to keep their name poppin'.
The reality is Game killed his own momentum going at 50. I think the most costly thing he ever did was creating that G-Unot campaign after him and 50 squashed their enitial problems. He was already free of being involved with G-Unit at that point and it was a rare instance where 50 extended an olive branch. When he went all-out to try and smash them, he basically just killed both their sales in the long run.
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Cross your fingers and close your eyes and pray "Hey will they invite my favorite rappers to the show or did Lady Gaga take their spot."
Oh, Lady Gaga who sells more albums than all of your favorite rappers, gets more YouTube views, etc.? MTV must be out of their minds to give her a spot over Game and your other favorite rappers.
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MTV has fell off. MTV IS NO LONGER RELAVENT. They dont even play music videos anymore. They only skim through a few of them. BET is on the same route that MTV went down too. ITs all about reality television. Why should it matter if Game was there or not.
You don't think that helped Lil Wayne sell mad units when MTV told everyone on their award show to go buy the Carter IV on ITunes? Imagine had Game got his mention also.
Sure it helped because all the little Jimmys and Jennys that are still in Junior High who still watch MTV will get their hands on it. But to true fans of music MTV is nothing more than a disappointment. I can still remember the days when they had like 4 or 5 different countdown shows playing different music throughout. These days you gotta tune into MTV2 in the butt crack of dawn to watch videos. Its a shame. MTV turned their back on music because they saw that the whole damn country was goo goo for reality TV. Okay BET came in and took advantage but that only lasted a few years. BET is BLACK ENTERTAINMENT TELEVISION. So you cant argue them making television series and movies and what not. Its their brand but MTV is MUSIC TELEVISION. They turned their back on the Music part. They dont even play the full length of the videos anymore.
who cares about their award shows.
I agree 100% about this post, but there's still something iconic about the Music Television Award Show. Call me old school, but back in the day there was something exciting about gettin home from school, puttin your backpack down, and throwin on mtv's most wanted to watch bill bellemy countdown cube, warren g, and dr dre videos....and when the award show comes there was that mad hype to see snoop, dogg pound, dre, warren g, and nate get on stage and run the show. Now, its a fraction of what the show used to represent amongst music culture. Cross your fingers and close your eyes and pray "Hey will they invite my favorite rappers to the show or did Lady Gaga take their spot."
Gangsta rap was big in the 90s, now its not. The same reason you weren't seeing any alternative rappers on MTV "back in the day." Don't you think The Pharcyde fans in 1995 were pissed off that your cliche gangsta music was taking up all the spots?
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what the hell u guys talking about mtv dont play no videos, am i the only one with mtv jams all they do is play videos. no need for trl when u got like 4 channels constantly playing videos, i rather watch teen mom anyway lol
Yeah that seems to be a fact that gets overlooked a lot. MTV Jams actually plays some decent videos too from a lot of artists you wouldn't expect.
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west west yall
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what the hell u guys talking about mtv dont play no videos, am i the only one with mtv jams all they do is play videos. no need for trl when u got like 4 channels constantly playing videos, i rather watch teen mom anyway lol
Yeah that seems to be a fact that gets overlooked a lot. MTV Jams actually plays some decent videos too from a lot of artists you wouldn't expect.
They actually did an entire run on the "New West" not too long ago which included Jay Rock's video with Kendrick Lamar. Odd that they would do that when they're supposedly BLACKBALLING the entire coast.
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MTV has fell off. MTV IS NO LONGER RELAVENT. They dont even play music videos anymore. They only skim through a few of them. BET is on the same route that MTV went down too. ITs all about reality television. Why should it matter if Game was there or not.
You don't think that helped Lil Wayne sell mad units when MTV told everyone on their award show to go buy the Carter IV on ITunes? Imagine had Game got his mention also.
Sure it helped because all the little Jimmys and Jennys that are still in Junior High who still watch MTV will get their hands on it. But to true fans of music MTV is nothing more than a disappointment. I can still remember the days when they had like 4 or 5 different countdown shows playing different music throughout. These days you gotta tune into MTV2 in the butt crack of dawn to watch videos. Its a shame. MTV turned their back on music because they saw that the whole damn country was goo goo for reality TV. Okay BET came in and took advantage but that only lasted a few years. BET is BLACK ENTERTAINMENT TELEVISION. So you cant argue them making television series and movies and what not. Its their brand but MTV is MUSIC TELEVISION. They turned their back on the Music part. They dont even play the full length of the videos anymore.
who cares about their award shows.
I agree 100% about this post, but there's still something iconic about the Music Television Award Show. Call me old school, but back in the day there was something exciting about gettin home from school, puttin your backpack down, and throwin on mtv's most wanted to watch bill bellemy countdown cube, warren g, and dr dre videos....and when the award show comes there was that mad hype to see snoop, dogg pound, dre, warren g, and nate get on stage and run the show. Now, its a fraction of what the show used to represent amongst music culture. Cross your fingers and close your eyes and pray "Hey will they invite my favorite rappers to the show or did Lady Gaga take their spot."
Gangsta rap was big in the 90s, now its not. The same reason you weren't seeing any alternative rappers on MTV "back in the day." Don't you think The Pharcyde fans in 1995 were pissed off that your cliche gangsta music was taking up all the spots?
thank god for spice yell
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MTV has fell off. MTV IS NO LONGER RELAVENT. They dont even play music videos anymore. They only skim through a few of them. BET is on the same route that MTV went down too. ITs all about reality television. Why should it matter if Game was there or not.
You don't think that helped Lil Wayne sell mad units when MTV told everyone on their award show to go buy the Carter IV on ITunes? Imagine had Game got his mention also.
Sure it helped because all the little Jimmys and Jennys that are still in Junior High who still watch MTV will get their hands on it. But to true fans of music MTV is nothing more than a disappointment. I can still remember the days when they had like 4 or 5 different countdown shows playing different music throughout. These days you gotta tune into MTV2 in the butt crack of dawn to watch videos. Its a shame. MTV turned their back on music because they saw that the whole damn country was goo goo for reality TV. Okay BET came in and took advantage but that only lasted a few years. BET is BLACK ENTERTAINMENT TELEVISION. So you cant argue them making television series and movies and what not. Its their brand but MTV is MUSIC TELEVISION. They turned their back on the Music part. They dont even play the full length of the videos anymore.
who cares about their award shows.
I agree 100% about this post, but there's still something iconic about the Music Television Award Show. Call me old school, but back in the day there was something exciting about gettin home from school, puttin your backpack down, and throwin on mtv's most wanted to watch bill bellemy countdown cube, warren g, and dr dre videos....and when the award show comes there was that mad hype to see snoop, dogg pound, dre, warren g, and nate get on stage and run the show. Now, its a fraction of what the show used to represent amongst music culture. Cross your fingers and close your eyes and pray "Hey will they invite my favorite rappers to the show or did Lady Gaga take their spot."
Gangsta rap was big in the 90s, now its not. The same reason you weren't seeing any alternative rappers on MTV "back in the day." Don't you think The Pharcyde fans in 1995 were pissed off that your cliche gangsta music was taking up all the spots?
MTV contributed to both the rising and downfall of Gangsta Rap. There's no doubt there was a movement to phase out Gangsta Rap after the East/West war (promoted by the media) and Pac and B.I.G. ended up passing away. Suge said in an interview that they came to him and told him to soften his artists lyrics. You saw Dre drop the Aftermath compilation which was soft compared to his past releases lyrically. We saw the MTV and radio playlist go from Luniz and Mack 10 to Will Smith and Puffy & Mase dancing in space suits.
It was obvious the media made a huge attempt to scale back gangsta rap. And to this day, they have given small glimpses but never promoted it to the extent they did before. They used to allow rappers to carry guns, point guns, use "hooker," "hoe," "ass," "blood," "crip,"......now they will even distort gang signs. When they replay old videos they don't show them in their raw form. Take Dre Day for example, they blank out more curse words that they used to show and they edit out the gun Dr. Dre is carrying.
We've seen videos banned by Game and Crooked I. They would rather have young americans imitating swag and jay-z than imitating BG Knoccout and Dre'sta.
Nobody in their right mind can deny there have been efforts in the media against gangsta rap and to scale back violence in mainstream music.
"DJs need to let the ghetto back in the club"--Westside Connection
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So during the 90s they were promoting the hard shit and scaling back the softer music, now its the opposite. Seems like a fair trade. Not something to be whining about unless you want to go back to the 90s and apologize to all the alternative rappers who got ignored in favor of gangsta posing in videos. Game's type of music isn't popular now, just like Kanye's music wouldn't have been popular back then.
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You make it sound like Mack 10 and the Luniz were all over fucking MTV and the radio then Pac and Biggie died and they dissapeared. Luniz had one major commericial hit. Saying that the East-West feud contributed to them not having more is like arguing that the L.A. Riots were responsible for the downfall of Hammer and Vanilla Ice. You've tried throwing out this theory before and it just doesn't hold water. Puffy and Bad Boy were all over MTV in 1994. They didn't pop up there after the fact.
And who the fuck was telling Suge anything about his content? Biggie died while he was locked up in prison. I doubt high-ranking music and television executives were going through the metal detectors at a State penitentery so they could explain to him how he could run his label. Suge, in fact, said on the day of his sentence that he had met with C. DeLeros Tucker and agreed that Death Row would no longer use the "N" word on future releases. Obviously, this never came to fruition but it should be noted that 1) Tucker was not affiliated with any radio or TV outlet and 2) that Suge was sentenced months before Biggie had been murdered.
Fact is music goes through cycles. It went from Hammer and Vanilla Ice to hardcore Death Row music to Puffy and his shiny suits to DMX and his angry, grimey shit then to the softer, duet-oriented Ja Rule to 50 Cent with his gangsta music. Music content is going to change based on the demands of the consumer and maybe I'm a different kind of human being in my thinking here but I think it's far more acceptable to believe that maybe the public didn't want to listen to rappers talking about murdering each other after two of the rap game's biggest stars were killed than the industry just decided to blackball the shit out of L.A. for no good reason.
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what happened was gangsta rap got out of control.......and then what happened....was it started to become a marketing machine.....then it took on a life of its own
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You make it sound like Mack 10 and the Luniz were all over fucking MTV and the radio then Pac and Biggie died and they dissapeared. Luniz had one major commericial hit. Saying that the East-West feud contributed to them not having more is like arguing that the L.A. Riots were responsible for the downfall of Hammer and Vanilla Ice. You've tried throwing out this theory before and it just doesn't hold water. Puffy and Bad Boy were all over MTV in 1994. They didn't pop up there after the fact.
maybe the public didn't want to listen to rappers talking about murdering each other after two of the rap game's biggest stars were killed than the industry just decided to blackball the shit out of L.A. for no good reason.
Music is no more powerful than an R-Rated movie. How can you say there was a lack of interest? If anything everyone was talkin about it. Tons of people were fiending for more of it as there was a huge cult following for people trying to get unreleased death row and pac music in 1997-1999. Mack 10 was huge with "Foe Life," "Only In California," "On Them Thangs," "Backyard Boogie," "Westside Slaughterhouse." After B.I.G. was dropped all of a sudden he was faded out and you didn't hear tracks like "Westside Slaughterhouse." Luniz were huge with "5 on It," "Playa Hata (Too Short diss)" and the "5 on it remix." They went Platinum with that shit and then "Lunitik Musik" drops and they get no national airplay and still go Gold so people were lookin for it. "Silver and Black" was their big huge supposed to be smash with "A Piece Of Me" and "Oakland Raiders" and they played it in Cali but didnt give it national play and it was a bomb album.
Suge said in a 2000 interview that Jimmy and Interscope came to him and asked him to soften his lyrics and he said he wouldn't do it thus he left for Priority. Suge said you'll notice Dr. Dre soften his content with "Dr. Dre presents The Aftermath" and then it didn't sell like they thought it would so he went back to a harder approach for "Dr. Dre 2001."
Also, do a google search and there are numerous topics about it. Why would there be songs about it if it wasn't true?? To name a few that come to mind:
1. E-A Ski -- The Manuscript
2. Clyde Carson/Game -- California State of Mind (touches on how the media closed the door on the West)
3. Ice Cube -- I Rep That West (touches on what this topic talks about)
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Music is no more powerful than an R-Rated movie.
Fine. Let's go with that theory. Arnold Schwarzenegger had an R-Rated movie about terrorists blowing up a building and killing people that was supposed to come out in 2001 but then 9/11 happened so they pushed it back for quite a bit of time because the feeling was that nobody would find that entertaining in the wake of such a real-life tragedy. It's the same deal.
How can you say there was a lack of interest?
Well, let's see. If the majority of the public demands something, convential wisdom says that in a consumer-driven market, the record labels would feed that demand, no?
If anything everyone was talkin about it. Tons of people were fiending for more of it as there was a huge cult following for people trying to get unreleased death row and pac music in 1997-1999.
A "cult following" actually implies a small but loyal fanbase that operates outside of the mainstream. Succesful indy acts have cult following. Major labels that go platinum and have videos on MTV have a mainstream following.
Mack 10 was huge with "Foe Life," "Only In California," "On Them Thangs," "Backyard Boogie," "Westside Slaughterhouse." After B.I.G. was dropped all of a sudden he was faded out and you didn't hear tracks like "Westside Slaughterhouse."
Uh, "Backyard Boogie" and "Only In California" both dropped AFTER Biggie got killed. They performed modestly on the charts but Mack 10 was far from HUGE. The reason they weren't playing tracks like "Westside Slaughterhouse" was because the song was on an album that had been on store shelves for close to two years at that point. Once again, you overplay how big a lot of these West Coast acts were.
Luniz were huge with "5 on It," "Playa Hata (Too Short diss)" and the "5 on it remix." They went Platinum with that shit and then "Lunitik Musik" drops and they get no national airplay and still go Gold so people were lookin for it. "Silver and Black" was their big huge supposed to be smash with "A Piece Of Me" and "Oakland Raiders" and they played it in Cali but didnt give it national play and it was a bomb album.
The Luniz went platinum off the strength of "I Got A Five On It". They had one major hit. "Playa Hata" is a great song but it didn't make a massive impact on the charts. Same deal happened with Onyx after "Slam" or Sisqo after "The Thong Song". Just because people LOVE one song you make does not mean that everything you put out is guaranteed that same success.
Suge said in a 2000 interview that Jimmy and Interscope came to him and asked him to soften his lyrics and he said he wouldn't do it thus he left for Priority. Suge said you'll notice Dr. Dre soften his content with "Dr. Dre presents The Aftermath" and then it didn't sell like they thought it would so he went back to a harder approach for "Dr. Dre 2001."
Maybe that's what Suge said but the timing is questionable. Priority was already moving in as a distributor in 1997. The last Interscope-distributed album was Lady Of Rage, which fail to get RIAA certification. 2Pac's music continued to sell well for Death Row, no matter who was distributing it. Death Row's decline, as I've mentioned before, was likely due to the fact that they had no established stars to fill in for the departures of Dre and Snoop and the death of Tupac.
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Regarding MTV Jams ..... It's not available on Dish Network or DirecTV ... and on Time Warner it's only available thru their former Adelphia systems.
That's A LOT of people missing out. So although MTV does play videos thru MTV Jams, it's really not the same as the main network or MTV2 playing it.
Just thought I'd throw that in there....
Continue on.... or actually don't. This topic has been going on for weeks now. lol