West Coast Connection Forum
DUBCC - Tha Connection => West Coast Classics => Topic started by: TraceOneInfinite Flat Earther 96' on April 28, 2012, 08:32:19 AM
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Mack 10 repped the West harder and better than you could rep it in the 90's. He came in with Cube and immediately made his presence felt. Tracks/video's like "Westside Slaughterhouse" and "West Up" are some of the greatest West Coast battle anthems of all-time. And topping it all was "Bow Down" at the hieght of the East/West beef in 96. Mack 10 was still going strong even as the West was fading from the spotlight... in 98' he came with "Only In California" uniting the Coast with him and Snoop on a certified banger. His own label was up and running and he was promoting and selling West Coast artists like MC Eiht, doing his thing...
...and then he sold out after the 90's and went down South to Cash Money. His music became complete garbage and he lost all of his integrity he'd build over the years.
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so?
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That Cash Money album is one of his best... His album with Da Hood was good, so was his album with Glasses Malone.
I don't know what you're talking about. Dude's never dropped one wack album and fillers are hard to find on his projects. Mack 10 might be the most consistent rapper on the West Coast.
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That Cash Money album is one of his best... His album with Da Hood was good, so was his album with Glasses Malone.
I don't know what you're talking about. Dude's never dropped one wack album and fillers are hard to find on his projects. Mack 10 might be the most consistent rapper on the West Coast.
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That Cash Money album is one of his best... His album with Da Hood was good, so was his album with Glasses Malone.
I don't know what you're talking about. Dude's never dropped one wack album and fillers are hard to find on his projects. Mack 10 might be the most consistent rapper on the West Coast.
All I needed to hear was that Mack 10 was on Cash Money's label. That was enough for me to say he fell off and sold out. Then when I caught his video once the song was trash and the video was garbage. That was more than enough for me.
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so you admit to not listening to his music and just ASSUMING its sold out?
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That Cash Money album is one of his best... His album with Da Hood was good, so was his album with Glasses Malone.
I don't know what you're talking about. Dude's never dropped one wack album and fillers are hard to find on his projects. Mack 10 might be the most consistent rapper on the West Coast.
All I needed to hear was that Mack 10 was on Cash Money's label. That was enough for me to say he fell off and sold out. Then when I caught his video once the song was trash and the video was garbage. That was more than enough for me.
Dafuq is wrong with you? Your heart broke when you heard he's not @ WSC anymore or? The man is doing his job, only rapper for me who fell off hard time and went too much commercial is Snoop Dogg. Mack 10 is still doing his thing, he even signed Xzibit to his label.
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That Cash Money album is one of his best... His album with Da Hood was good, so was his album with Glasses Malone.
I don't know what you're talking about. Dude's never dropped one wack album and fillers are hard to find on his projects. Mack 10 might be the most consistent rapper on the West Coast.
All I needed to hear was that Mack 10 was on Cash Money's label. That was enough for me to say he fell off and sold out.
LOL! Do you have any idea how ridiculous that sounds? Anyways, I was never a big Mack 10 fan, he was always cool with WSC but I never really checked for his solo stuff much.
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Kurupt fell off a lot more than Mack 10.
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like mauzip said, mack 10 is probably one of the most consistent westcoast artists there is. I haven't heard his last album simply because I don't really care to check out any new music, but his first album on cash money is fucking solid. It has a very dope WSC song on it.
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I love Mack Dime but to say that he has been one of the most consistant West Coast rapper in recent memory is just laughable. It only shows the amount of high expectations you guys have for the other fellow West Coast rappers. I would even say that artists like WC and DJ Quik has been more consistant than Mack 10. I really hate the term sell out but to answer the question i would have to say that Mack 10 is neck and neck with Kurupt and maybe even Ice Cube, as much as i hate to say it all.
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Coolio was platinum rapper but fell way harder than mac 10. Mac 10 was wack after 98'. I never felt his raps after that. If you wanna go back further then there is mc hammer.
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snoop.
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coolio
ice cube
are both names that come to mind immediately
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Coolio was platinum rapper but fell way harder than mac 10. Mac 10 was wack after 98'. I never felt his raps after that. If you wanna go back further then there is mc hammer.
I think he's talking about actual skill though. The obvious scenario would've been Hammer otherwise bro. I'm pretty sure that he meant that he respected Mack 10 and possibibly held him
at a high account as an MC at some point until he, according to his opinion, sold out/fell off at another point.
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A lot of rappers output fell off as production values of the music dropped...Mack 10 is just one of many u could name.
Selling out is subjective tho.
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I wouldn't say that Mack 10 sold out... but the main thing I didn't like was when he did that video for Do the Damn Thing when he was on Cash Money and put them all in red outfits... who knows, maybe that's where it started for Baby and Lil Wayne wanting to be down, since I don't remember seeing them in red anything before that.
Also, I wouldn't say he fell off either. He's been pretty consistent, not that it's hard to do for him, since it's not like he was spitting crazy lyrical shit anyway. But I think he did have less of an ability to make big street hits... Backyard Boogie was fucking huge (I swear, when that dropped when I was in high school, I remember some Mexican gangbangers who rode in a clean black Impala used to bump that song loud as fuck on the way out everyday for almost a whole month). I even thought From the Streets got a lot of attention too, just not as much.
But whatever happened with that issue Mack had when he owed somebody six figures because he didn't go the court hearing and lost because he was a no-show?
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infinite...i can understand why you'd say mack 10 sold out, but in that case, you'd have to say snoop sold out, and sold out even harder.
really, though, mack 10 has been reppin the west from day 1. even when he signed with cash money, he had a bangin' dre track as a first single ("hate in yo eyez") and had a lot of west coast bangers on the album, as well...it was pretty much a snoop-to-no limitesque move, just without as much publicity surrounding it. also, mack 10 has stayed true to the west, especially when u consider the "mack 10 presents da hood" album, which was a good album with a buncha west coast acts. so yes, many westcoast rappers have fallen off and sold out worse than mack 10.
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selling out means doin things u dont want to do for money, tahts the defintion.
i dont think Mack is doin anythin he doesnt want to today. Snoop hasnt sold out either
regardless, Mack 10 has always been a wackass rapper tho i agree, the weak link in WSC
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That Cash Money album is one of his best... His album with Da Hood was good, so was his album with Glasses Malone.
I don't know what you're talking about. Dude's never dropped one wack album and fillers are hard to find on his projects. Mack 10 might be the most consistent rapper on the West Coast.
EXACTLY!
It always amazes me how people hate on that album just because of the logo on the back of the packaging. The album was dope and unlike Snoop's No Limit album, Mack didn't go to a South label and take on their style, he brought himself to the label. Mannie Fresh gave him West Coast bangers and he brought the proper guest features (Cube, WC, Xzibit, Scarface, Butch Cassidy, E-40).
His last album was frisbee worthy but don't front on the projects before, dude always drops bangin albums with that authentic home grown underground West Coast feel. He's never dropped successful commercial material and thats fine, dude has always known his role and played his part. I wish more artist could do the same and stop thinking they're Pac 2.0
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That Cash Money album is one of his best... His album with Da Hood was good, so was his album with Glasses Malone.
I don't know what you're talking about. Dude's never dropped one wack album and fillers are hard to find on his projects. Mack 10 might be the most consistent rapper on the West Coast.
EXACTLY!
It always amazes me how people hate on that album just because of the logo on the back of the packaging. The album was dope and unlike Snoop's No Limit album, Mack didn't go to a South label and take on their style, he brought himself to the label. Mannie Fresh gave him West Coast bangers and he brought the proper guest features (Cube, WC, Xzibit, Scarface, Butch Cassidy, E-40).
His last album was frisbee worthy but don't front on the projects before, dude always drops bangin albums with that authentic home grown underground West Coast feel. He's never dropped successful commercial material and thats fine, dude has always known his role and played his part. I wish more artist could do the same and stop thinking they're Pac 2.0
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infinite...i can understand why you'd say mack 10 sold out, but in that case, you'd have to say snoop sold out, and sold out even harder.
really, though, mack 10 has been reppin the west from day 1. even when he signed with cash money, he had a bangin' dre track as a first single ("hate in yo eyez") and had a lot of west coast bangers on the album, as well...it was pretty much a snoop-to-no limitesque move, just without as much publicity surrounding it. also, mack 10 has stayed true to the west, especially when u consider the "mack 10 presents da hood" album, which was a good album with a buncha west coast acts. so yes, many westcoast rappers have fallen off and sold out worse than mack 10.
Cash Money rappers make the shit Master P was doing in 98 sound like Malcolm X. No way you can compare Snoop going to No Limit with Mack 10 going to Cash Money.
...you did make a good point about "Hate In Your Eyes" being produced by Dre and him having a lot of West Coast shit on there. That's good. But after hearing he signed to Cash Money and seeing that trash video, I never gave the rest of the album a chance.
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Brian you are a fucking douchebag
nevermind the fact you don't feed your kid...you ASSUME a cd sucks because of a logo on the back and not the music itself?
fucking moron
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Kurupt fell off a lot more than Mack 10.
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you ASSUME a cd sucks because of a logo on the back and not the music itself?
fucking moron
It's hard for people who aren't conscious to understand. They fill their minds and bodies with trash and filth and never give it a moments thought. So I know it's hard for you to understand. But when you are listening to a Cash Money product you are ingesting a lot of auditory stimuli into your system. And I don't believe in what Cash Money Records stands for as a business and a record label. So I refuse to allow that garbage to enter my system.
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you ASSUME a cd sucks because of a logo on the back and not the music itself?
fucking moron
It's hard for people who aren't conscious to understand. They fill their minds and bodies with trash and filth and never give it a moments thought. So I know it's hard for you to understand. But when you are listening to a Cash Money product you are ingesting a lot of auditory stimuli into your system. And I don't believe in what Cash Money Records stands for as a business and a record label. So I refuse to allow that garbage to enter my system.
lmao at u dont want to let garbage enter your system yet your on a westcoast gangster rap music forum for 24 hours a day.. if u havent noticed 85 % of the subject matter in gangster rap is garbage..no matter what the label
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lmao at u dont want to let garbage enter your system yet your on a westcoast gangster rap music forum for 24 hours a day.. if u havent noticed 85 % of the subject matter in gangster rap is garbage..no matter what the label
The gangsta rap I listened to from the 90's was far from garbage.
Gangsta rap was sort of like a modern day version of tribalism. Back Ancient Africa and the Middle East, members of a tribe would have different titles and job duties. For example you would have your warrior wing of the tribe, you would have your hunter gatherers, and so on. One vital segment of the tribe were the poets. The poets would glorify the virtues of the tribe. The were the voice of the tribe and they communicated their aspirations to the outside world. Gangsta rappers were the same way. They were great poets and artists reppin where they were from and their virtues in heroism, courage, and valor.
Anyone who knows Snoop knows that Snoop has a good heart. Snoop is a righteous man. 2pac is a righteous man. The gangsta rap I was listening to growing up was mostly Death Row and it's affiliates. The weren't perfect, but for the most part it was positive.
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lmao at u dont want to let garbage enter your system yet your on a westcoast gangster rap music forum for 24 hours a day.. if u havent noticed 85 % of the subject matter in gangster rap is garbage..no matter what the label
The gangsta rap I listened to from the 90's was far from garbage.
Gangsta rap was sort of like a modern day version of tribalism. Back Ancient Africa and the Middle East, members of a tribe would have different titles and job duties. For example you would have your warrior wing of the tribe, you would have your hunter gatherers, and so on. One vital segment of the tribe were the poets. The poets would glorify the virtues of the tribe. The were the voice of the tribe and they communicated their aspirations to the outside world. Gangsta rappers were the same way. They were great poets and artists reppin where they were from and their virtues in heroism, courage, and valor.
Anyone who knows Snoop knows that Snoop has a good heart. Snoop is a righteous man. 2pac is a righteous man. The gangsta rap I was listening to growing up was mostly Death Row and it's affiliates. The weren't perfect, but for the most part it was positive.
Death Row...was positive?
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Kurupt went from arguably a top 5 MC in 95/96 to raps like "you're more of a bitch than a bitch".
That's falling off.
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lmao at u dont want to let garbage enter your system yet your on a westcoast gangster rap music forum for 24 hours a day.. if u havent noticed 85 % of the subject matter in gangster rap is garbage..no matter what the label
The gangsta rap I listened to from the 90's was far from garbage.
Gangsta rap was sort of like a modern day version of tribalism. Back Ancient Africa and the Middle East, members of a tribe would have different titles and job duties. For example you would have your warrior wing of the tribe, you would have your hunter gatherers, and so on. One vital segment of the tribe were the poets. The poets would glorify the virtues of the tribe. The were the voice of the tribe and they communicated their aspirations to the outside world. Gangsta rappers were the same way. They were great poets and artists reppin where they were from and their virtues in heroism, courage, and valor.
Anyone who knows Snoop knows that Snoop has a good heart. Snoop is a righteous man. 2pac is a righteous man. The gangsta rap I was listening to growing up was mostly Death Row and it's affiliates. The weren't perfect, but for the most part it was positive.
LMFAO... ur either the biggest delusional nerdy wigger ive ever seen or the biggest troll
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infinite...i can understand why you'd say mack 10 sold out, but in that case, you'd have to say snoop sold out, and sold out even harder.
really, though, mack 10 has been reppin the west from day 1. even when he signed with cash money, he had a bangin' dre track as a first single ("hate in yo eyez") and had a lot of west coast bangers on the album, as well...it was pretty much a snoop-to-no limitesque move, just without as much publicity surrounding it. also, mack 10 has stayed true to the west, especially when u consider the "mack 10 presents da hood" album, which was a good album with a buncha west coast acts. so yes, many westcoast rappers have fallen off and sold out worse than mack 10.
Cash Money rappers make the shit Master P was doing in 98 sound like Malcolm X. No way you can compare Snoop going to No Limit with Mack 10 going to Cash Money.
...you did make a good point about "Hate In Your Eyes" being produced by Dre and him having a lot of West Coast shit on there. That's good. But after hearing he signed to Cash Money and seeing that trash video, I never gave the rest of the album a chance.
i dunno about all that...cash money and no limit were pretty good rivals in the late 90's. while i do prefer master p's bay influenced style, cash money did have a pretty good producer in mannie fresh, and also had some pretty solid releases during that era ("400 degreez", "block is hot", "guerilla warfare", "got that work")...not my preference of music, but it definitely shits on anything comin out in the mainstream nowadays.
as for mack 10, he wasn't really with cash money for that long to begin with...after his short stint with them, he was right back to his hoo bangin' records, on both the major label and independant circuit. dude has actually put in a lot of work for the west coast, and while he's failed to produce classics like he did when he first came on the scene, he's still kept it west coast and had his share of solid releases.
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lmao at u dont want to let garbage enter your system yet your on a westcoast gangster rap music forum for 24 hours a day.. if u havent noticed 85 % of the subject matter in gangster rap is garbage..no matter what the label
The gangsta rap I listened to from the 90's was far from garbage.
Gangsta rap was sort of like a modern day version of tribalism. Back Ancient Africa and the Middle East, members of a tribe would have different titles and job duties. For example you would have your warrior wing of the tribe, you would have your hunter gatherers, and so on. One vital segment of the tribe were the poets. The poets would glorify the virtues of the tribe. The were the voice of the tribe and they communicated their aspirations to the outside world. Gangsta rappers were the same way. They were great poets and artists reppin where they were from and their virtues in heroism, courage, and valor.
Anyone who knows Snoop knows that Snoop has a good heart. Snoop is a righteous man. 2pac is a righteous man. The gangsta rap I was listening to growing up was mostly Death Row and it's affiliates. The weren't perfect, but for the most part it was positive.
LMFAO... ur either the biggest delusional nerdy wigger ive ever seen or the biggest troll
i'll take A for 500 Alex
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Kurupt fell off a lot more than Mack 10.
and a lot of other cats too.
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after hearing he signed to Cash Money and seeing that trash video, I never gave the rest of the album a chance.
Well shit, who's fault is that?
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regardless, Mack 10 has always been a wackass rapper tho i agree, the weak link in WSC
I don't think there were a weak link in WSCG.
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he fell off with his finances
but as a rapper hes pretty much kept it 100
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I've never been a massive fan of Mack 10 but I respect the man's hustle. I fail to see how him signing to Cash Money is this great artistic compromise that forever saddles him with the label of "sell-out". People wave that word around way too freely and the strong majority of them have no fucking clue what they are talking about. All these rappers basically work for MAJOR LABELS. They're all taking a paycheck from a major corporation to create popular music. How is Mack signing with Cash Money any worse than your boy, Nas signing to Def Jam when his long-time rival, Jay-Z, was running it at the time? It's all some silly shit. The artists at Death Row (Pac, Dr. Dre, Snoop) were all making commercial music. Most of these guys describe themselves as "businessmen" more than they do "artists". It's not that they won't do a song with Justin Bieber or Miley Cryus because it's "selling out". Quite the contrary. If you're a person with a hardcore hip-hop reputation, doing a duet with a pop singer would actually KILL your record sales. But a pop singer with a strong utban demographic? Money. Pretty sure, a few rappers worked with Paris Hilton and if Kim Kardashian's singing career had lasted more than one song, you can bet your ass every rapper would be jumping to get on the "street" remix of her next single. Most rappers will work with just about anyone as long as the people who buy their CD's will accept it. Nobody outside of Nelly was fucking with Timberlake when he was still N-Sync but the minute, he re-invented himself as a sort of "white Usher", he was the guy to go to for the crossover hit. Hip-hop had the illusion of artistic intergrity when other music genres needed it to help them come off as "edgy" and "hip". The fact is too many of you have your art confused with commerce.
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Your arguement totally failed when you compared Mack 10 signing to Cash Money with Nas signing to Def Jam. Def Jam is the pioneering label of hip-hop. You could not find a more respectable label that has done more for representing hiphop culture than Def Jam. Since the 80's with Kurtis Blow and Russel Simmons doing their thing to make hip-hop what it was I have nothing but love and repect for Russel Simmons.
Cash Money has done everything to destroy and ruin hip-hop and no label has done more to kill hip_hop than Cash Money has.
The two labels are like night and days.
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Cash Money has done everything to destroy and ruin hip-hop and no label has done more to kill hip_hop than Cash Money has.
they over-saturate the market with wack music but you must realize cash money records goes back to 1992
cash money was dope before their universal deal
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I don't know what you're talking about. Dude's never dropped one wack album and fillers are hard to find on his projects. Mack 10 might be the most consistent rapper on the West Coast.
I agree, i haven't heard the album with Glasses Malone though.
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I agree, i haven't heard the album with Glasses Malone though.
check it, not bad.
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you ASSUME a cd sucks because of a logo on the back and not the music itself?
fucking moron
It's hard for people who aren't conscious to understand. They fill their minds and bodies with trash and filth and never give it a moments thought. So I know it's hard for you to understand. But when you are listening to a Cash Money product you are ingesting a lot of auditory stimuli into your system. And I don't believe in what Cash Money Records stands for as a business and a record label. So I refuse to allow that garbage to enter my system.
lmao at u dont want to let garbage enter your system yet your on a westcoast gangster rap music forum for 24 hours a day.. if u havent noticed 85 % of the subject matter in gangster rap is garbage..no matter what the label
not true.
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he fell off with his finances
but as a rapper hes pretty much kept it 100
Next time I wanna know who has what on his bank account, I'll ask you. :)
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lmao at u dont want to let garbage enter your system yet your on a westcoast gangster rap music forum for 24 hours a day.. if u havent noticed 85 % of the subject matter in gangster rap is garbage..no matter what the label
The gangsta rap I listened to from the 90's was far from garbage.
Gangsta rap was sort of like a modern day version of tribalism. Back Ancient Africa and the Middle East, members of a tribe would have different titles and job duties. For example you would have your warrior wing of the tribe, you would have your hunter gatherers, and so on. One vital segment of the tribe were the poets. The poets would glorify the virtues of the tribe. The were the voice of the tribe and they communicated their aspirations to the outside world. Gangsta rappers were the same way. They were great poets and artists reppin where they were from and their virtues in heroism, courage, and valor.
Anyone who knows Snoop knows that Snoop has a good heart. Snoop is a righteous man. 2pac is a righteous man. The gangsta rap I was listening to growing up was mostly Death Row and it's affiliates. The weren't perfect, but for the most part it was positive.
no, it was garbage...even i can admit that.
its just it was the soundtrack to your youth so you cherish it like uncle rico.
songs like brenda had a baby etc dont hold a candle to songe like sam cookes change gon come....but unforuently in the 80 - 90s is when all music took a turn for the worst so a song like that is the closest thing this generation has to actual humaniatrian artists and shit like stevie wonder curtis mayfield etc. its a shame that to cats like brian this is the closest they will ever have to being truly inspired by music is listening to tupac rhyme enemy with hennesee over old isley samples.
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lmao at u dont want to let garbage enter your system yet your on a westcoast gangster rap music forum for 24 hours a day.. if u havent noticed 85 % of the subject matter in gangster rap is garbage..no matter what the label
The gangsta rap I listened to from the 90's was far from garbage.
Gangsta rap was sort of like a modern day version of tribalism. Back Ancient Africa and the Middle East, members of a tribe would have different titles and job duties. For example you would have your warrior wing of the tribe, you would have your hunter gatherers, and so on. One vital segment of the tribe were the poets. The poets would glorify the virtues of the tribe. The were the voice of the tribe and they communicated their aspirations to the outside world. Gangsta rappers were the same way. They were great poets and artists reppin where they were from and their virtues in heroism, courage, and valor.
Anyone who knows Snoop knows that Snoop has a good heart. Snoop is a righteous man. 2pac is a righteous man. The gangsta rap I was listening to growing up was mostly Death Row and it's affiliates. The weren't perfect, but for the most part it was positive.
songs like brenda had a baby etc dont hold a candle to songe like sam cookes change gon come....but unforuently in the 80 - 90s is when all music took a turn for the worst so a song like that is the closest thing this generation has to actual humaniatrian artists and shit like stevie wonder curtis mayfield etc. its a shame that to cats like brian this is the closest they will ever have to being truly inspired by music is listening to tupac rhyme enemy with hennesee over old isley samples.
Exactly, this is what I was trying to get across to this idiot in the best group of all time thread.
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i dunno...u sayin hip-hop is "garbage", but u postin on a hip-hop message board. i get what ur tryna say, but to call an entire genre "garbage" is more over-the-top than the point infinite is tryna make, considering you post here, as well as other hip-hop message boards...it's like saying basketball is garbage and claiming it isn't comparable to soccer with all of its history, yet you're posting on insidehoops.com...doesn't make sense. i think a lot of people say hip-hop is "garbage" because they're just repeating the sentiments of older generations. in reality, there was great music before hip-hop...but there is great music within hip-hop as well. hip-hop gave people a voice, whereas most other genres of music is more about instrumentation/melody. not really comparable.
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i dunno...u sayin hip-hop is "garbage", but u postin on a hip-hop message board. i get what ur tryna say, but to call an entire genre "garbage" is more over-the-top than the point infinite is tryna make, considering you post here, as well as other hip-hop message boards...it's like saying basketball is garbage and claiming it isn't comparable to soccer with all of its history, yet you're posting on insidehoops.com...doesn't make sense. i think a lot of people say hip-hop is "garbage" because they're just repeating the sentiments of older generations. in reality, there was great music before hip-hop...but there is great music within hip-hop as well. hip-hop gave people a voice, whereas most other genres of music is more about instrumentation/melody. not really comparable.
Having said that, it's fair to say the majority of music from any genre is gonna be average or mediocre ....or even 'garbage'.....if u wanna use the term. From the days of Curtis Mayfield and Marvin Gaye, there are a recognised number of great artists...and a massive bunch of others who are just forgotten about.
But yeah, just because you like rap, doesn't mean u like it all. Or rate it all.
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Kurupt fell off a lot more than Mack 10.
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i dunno...u sayin hip-hop is "garbage", but u postin on a hip-hop message board. i get what ur tryna say, but to call an entire genre "garbage" is more over-the-top than the point infinite is tryna make, considering you post here, as well as other hip-hop message boards...it's like saying basketball is garbage and claiming it isn't comparable to soccer with all of its history, yet you're posting on insidehoops.com...doesn't make sense. i think a lot of people say hip-hop is "garbage" because they're just repeating the sentiments of older generations. in reality, there was great music before hip-hop...but there is great music within hip-hop as well. hip-hop gave people a voice, whereas most other genres of music is more about instrumentation/melody. not really comparable.
nik dont be a hypocrite...you say all the time this board is full of assholes nerds and fags but yet you cling to it like it was life support. but you made some other decent points in this thread...
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lmao at u dont want to let garbage enter your system yet your on a westcoast gangster rap music forum for 24 hours a day.. if u havent noticed 85 % of the subject matter in gangster rap is garbage..no matter what the label
The gangsta rap I listened to from the 90's was far from garbage.
Gangsta rap was sort of like a modern day version of tribalism. Back Ancient Africa and the Middle East, members of a tribe would have different titles and job duties. For example you would have your warrior wing of the tribe, you would have your hunter gatherers, and so on. One vital segment of the tribe were the poets. The poets would glorify the virtues of the tribe. The were the voice of the tribe and they communicated their aspirations to the outside world. Gangsta rappers were the same way. They were great poets and artists reppin where they were from and their virtues in heroism, courage, and valor.
Anyone who knows Snoop knows that Snoop has a good heart. Snoop is a righteous man. 2pac is a righteous man. The gangsta rap I was listening to growing up was mostly Death Row and it's affiliates. The weren't perfect, but for the most part it was positive.
no, it was garbage...even i can admit that.
its just it was the soundtrack to your youth so you cherish it like uncle rico.
songs like brenda had a baby etc dont hold a candle to songe like sam cookes change gon come....but unforuently in the 80 - 90s is when all music took a turn for the worst so a song like that is the closest thing this generation has to actual humaniatrian artists and shit like stevie wonder curtis mayfield etc. its a shame that to cats like brian this is the closest they will ever have to being truly inspired by music is listening to tupac rhyme enemy with hennesee over old isley samples.
gangsta rap was far from garbage. it was talkin' about shit that happened in the ghettos of america. regardless of how the message was conveyed. ren's verses on always into somethin' or real niggaz was just as potent as a curtis mayfield lyric. just comin' from a different perspective. to say gangsta rap is garbage shows you've never experienced poverty at all....don't know what u are listenin' to cause there are a lot of gangsta rap classics out there.
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when i say its garbage i mean the exploitation and commercialization of it...making it a parody of itself.
artists hearts were in the right place they were working with the tools they were given. America promoted sterotypes and shushed conscious artists forcing a guy like tupac who very well may have rather recorded a whole album frull of brenda had a baby type records into making radio friendly pop diddys and pop fluff like alot of the shit on aeom
the media fueling bi costal wars shit like that. it cheapens the whole movement and as i get older and more mature id rather distance myself from it sometimes.
#truthhurts
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i dunno...u sayin hip-hop is "garbage", but u postin on a hip-hop message board. i get what ur tryna say, but to call an entire genre "garbage" is more over-the-top than the point infinite is tryna make, considering you post here, as well as other hip-hop message boards...it's like saying basketball is garbage and claiming it isn't comparable to soccer with all of its history, yet you're posting on insidehoops.com...doesn't make sense. i think a lot of people say hip-hop is "garbage" because they're just repeating the sentiments of older generations. in reality, there was great music before hip-hop...but there is great music within hip-hop as well. hip-hop gave people a voice, whereas most other genres of music is more about instrumentation/melody. not really comparable.
nik dont be a hypocrite...you say all the time this board is full of assholes nerds and fags but yet you cling to it like it was life support. but you made some other decent points in this thread...
that has nothin to do with what i'm sayin...this board IS fulla nerds and fags, but at the end of the day, the point of this board is still to discuss west coast hip-hop. if west coast hip-hop really was "garbage", u'd be pretty damn foolish to be a big enough fan that you go on message boards daily to talk about it. fact of the matter is, i still enjoy discussin west coast hip-hop, which is why i come here. i really don't think you believe hip-hop is "garbage" deep down inside, u just sayin that. maybe a part of you was made to subconsciously think like that, but at the end of the day, we all know hip-hop has produced lots of greatness, as did other genres of music. comparing hip-hop to jazz, soul, or any other genre of music is like comparing basketball to baseball. it's like comparing a car to a motorcycle. it's like saying that playing the clarinet is better than writing poetry......two completely different things, not really comparable.
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the word garbage gets thrown around as loosely as the word classic
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when i say its garbage i mean the exploitation and commercialization of it...making it a parody of itself.
artists hearts were in the right place they were working with the tools they were given. America promoted sterotypes and shushed conscious artists forcing a guy like tupac who very well may have rather recorded a whole album frull of brenda had a baby type records into making radio friendly pop diddys and pop fluff like alot of the shit on aeom
the media fueling bi costal wars shit like that. it cheapens the whole movement and as i get older and more mature id rather distance myself from it sometimes.
#truthhurts
but that's every genre...and if u wanna use an example of an artist who "forced" shit, 2Pac isn't the greatest example. dude was an artistic genius, anything he touched was at the very least solid. his radio hits were timeless classics. i know what u mean with the exploitation and commercialization, but 2pac is not a good example, and that goes for pretty much any genre of music, or anything in life, period.
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no hes a great example let me tell you why.
becasue he made brenda had a baby type records but as rap expanded you wouldnt even know it...they promoted his alize thug passion sipping image. they promoted the west vs east thing. they werent interested in his humanitarian ideas they wanted to know what was prison like how much do you hate biggie right now? shit like that.
after he died they brought those records back to the forefront to romanticize his posthumous image after the east/west bullshit war
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no hes a great example let me tell you why.
becasue he made brenda had a baby type records but as rap expanded you wouldnt even know it...they promoted his alize thug passion sipping image. they promoted the west vs east thing. they werent interested in his humanitarian ideas they wanted to know what was prison like how much do you hate biggie right now? shit like that.
after he died they brought those records back to the forefront to romanticize his posthumous image after the east/west bullshit war
who cares? that shit produced tons of classics and helped unleash a lot of artistic greatness. thats why i say it's not a good example....mc hammer or somethin woulda been a better one imo.
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Your arguement totally failed when you compared Mack 10 signing to Cash Money with Nas signing to Def Jam. Def Jam is the pioneering label of hip-hop. You could not find a more respectable label that has done more for representing hiphop culture than Def Jam. Since the 80's with Kurtis Blow and Russel Simmons doing their thing to make hip-hop what it was I have nothing but love and repect for Russel Simmons.
Cash Money has done everything to destroy and ruin hip-hop and no label has done more to kill hip_hop than Cash Money has.
The two labels are like night and days.
Talk about drinking the fucking kool-aid. We're not talking about "night and day" here. You seem to be greatly confusing Def Jam's history with its current incarnation. Likewise, the Cash Money that Mack 10 signed with and the one that exists today are greatly different but let's not get ahead of ourselves. Def Jam is several owners removed from being "Russel Simmons and Rick Rubin creating a label out of a dorm room". You may be shocked to learn that... wait for it... Def Jam and Cash Money are both OWNED by the same fucking company and serve the same general purpose... to act as a hip-hop subsidiary. My "comparison" was actually a question that you, for the most part, dodged. You have strong distate for Cash Money, we've established this but how does that make Mack 10 a sell-out for working over there? Are we now arguing that anybody who doesn't share your views is a "sell-out"? You're talking about Def Jam as this respectable force in hip-hop culture but are you talking about the label of the past 12 years or the first decade and change or so? It's kind of important to keep things in historical context. For instance, The Source magazine I grew up reading and the one of the last 10 years, are radically-different.
But back to the subject at hand, it's not Nas signing to Def Jam that is questionable, on the surface. It is Nas signing to a label that is being overseen by a public rival. I'm not declaring him a sell-out for this. I'm asking how he gets a pass in YOUR BOOK for working on the label when Jay hopped onboard yet Mack 10, who to my knowledge had never said one ill word about Baby or any of them before signing, is this big sell-out? It should also be noted that Nas' Def Jam debut ended up dropping around the same time as Jay-Z's big comeback solo project with the significantly-larger promotional budget going to Jay. His second Def Jam album was supposed to be the controversial "Nigger", which ended up being the slighly-less attention-grabbing "Untitled" because Def Jam wouldn't support the first name. Today, he's joined the list of pissed-off veterans who are struggling to get Def Jam to give them a release date on their projects. Read up on that whole "Lost Tapes 2" scenerio.
Def Jam does have a strong history as an important record label but very few of the acts and executives who were a part of that period are still strongly active in today's company or the one that Nas signed to in 2006. Today, they are the home of Rick Ross, Rihanna, Young Jeezy, Ne-Yo, Jennifer Lopez, and the like. Traditional hip-hop acts like Nas, Redman, Ghostface, and Method Man still work there but you may want to read up an interview or two on them from the last couple years or so and see how the requests for new projects have gone over with the office. Better yet, let's start naming some big records the company has been pushing on any of them. I'm drawing a blank. How bout you? There was that one song Meth had with the Laurynn Hill sample that was really dope that the label could never figure out if they actually wanted to be a single or not.
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I agree with Petey. Just listen to Whats ya Phone # and imagine the kind of songs Pac could have been making instead. There's a reason Changes was an unreleased studio session instead of coming out while he was alive. You might be nodding your head to 2Pac saying nothing over G Funk beats, but I know he could've done a lot more.
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I agree with Petey. Just listen to Whats ya Phone # and imagine the kind of songs Pac could have been making instead. There's a reason Changes was an unreleased studio session instead of coming out while he was alive. You might be nodding your head to 2Pac saying nothing over G Funk beats, but I know he could've done a lot more.
fact of the matter is, 2pac produced classics before and after signing with death row...if the music he released with death row was all garbage, u might have a great point. but i enjoy the death row 2pac's music as much (if not more) than the pre-death row 2pac's music, as do most west coast hip-hop heads.
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Kurupt fell off a lot more than Mack 10.
Glad there's someone else in this thread that has common sense. Mack 10 lyrically and content wise was consistent; he was never a top-5 MC in the game who's skills rapidly declined over the years.
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I agree with Petey. Just listen to Whats ya Phone # and imagine the kind of songs Pac could have been making instead. There's a reason Changes was an unreleased studio session instead of coming out while he was alive. You might be nodding your head to 2Pac saying nothing over G Funk beats, but I know he could've done a lot more.
fact of the matter is, 2pac produced classics before and after signing with death row...if the music he released with death row was all garbage, u might have a great point. but i enjoy the death row 2pac's music as much (if not more) than the pre-death row 2pac's music, as do most west coast hip-hop heads.
Really? there's no difference between party gangsta Pac and introspective Pac to you? Maybe his serious shit doesn't hold as much meaning to you.
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I agree with Petey. Just listen to Whats ya Phone # and imagine the kind of songs Pac could have been making instead. There's a reason Changes was an unreleased studio session instead of coming out while he was alive. You might be nodding your head to 2Pac saying nothing over G Funk beats, but I know he could've done a lot more.
fact of the matter is, 2pac produced classics before and after signing with death row...if the music he released with death row was all garbage, u might have a great point. but i enjoy the death row 2pac's music as much (if not more) than the pre-death row 2pac's music, as do most west coast hip-hop heads.
Really? there's no difference between party gangsta Pac and introspective Pac to you? Maybe his serious shit doesn't hold as much meaning to you.
yea...the introspective pac is shit u'd bump in your headphones while chillin. the gangsta pac is shit u'd knock in your ride with your peoples when u goin out to have a good time. both enjoyable in two different ways.
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I agree with Petey. Just listen to Whats ya Phone # and imagine the kind of songs Pac could have been making instead. There's a reason Changes was an unreleased studio session instead of coming out while he was alive. You might be nodding your head to 2Pac saying nothing over G Funk beats, but I know he could've done a lot more.
fact of the matter is, 2pac produced classics before and after signing with death row...if the music he released with death row was all garbage, u might have a great point. but i enjoy the death row 2pac's music as much (if not more) than the pre-death row 2pac's music, as do most west coast hip-hop heads.
Really? there's no difference between party gangsta Pac and introspective Pac to you? Maybe his serious shit doesn't hold as much meaning to you.
yea...the introspective pac is shit u'd bump in your headphones while chillin. the gangsta pac is shit u'd knock in your ride with your peoples when u goin out to have a good time. both enjoyable in two different ways.
See if I wanted gangsta shit, that's what I listen to Dre or Snoop for. Pac had the ability to do something else, to say something actually meaningful with his music. So for him to go that lane is a disappointment. California Love might as well have been a Dre and Snoop song, wouldn't have made a difference to me.
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I agree with Petey. Just listen to Whats ya Phone # and imagine the kind of songs Pac could have been making instead. There's a reason Changes was an unreleased studio session instead of coming out while he was alive. You might be nodding your head to 2Pac saying nothing over G Funk beats, but I know he could've done a lot more.
fact of the matter is, 2pac produced classics before and after signing with death row...if the music he released with death row was all garbage, u might have a great point. but i enjoy the death row 2pac's music as much (if not more) than the pre-death row 2pac's music, as do most west coast hip-hop heads.
Really? there's no difference between party gangsta Pac and introspective Pac to you? Maybe his serious shit doesn't hold as much meaning to you.
yea...the introspective pac is shit u'd bump in your headphones while chillin. the gangsta pac is shit u'd knock in your ride with your peoples when u goin out to have a good time. both enjoyable in two different ways.
See if I wanted gangsta shit, that's what I listen to Dre or Snoop for. Pac had the ability to do something else, to say something actually meaningful with his music. So for him to go that lane is a disappointment. California Love might as well have been a Dre and Snoop song, wouldn't have made a difference to me.
u may take it as that, but to me, it just shows versatility and the ability to venture out to different sub-genres of hip-hop. it's a talent, if anything. like i said, it'd be one thing if his death row hits weren't classic, but they are, so knockin him for bein able to come at an audience from both angles aint really legit, as long as he was tackling both angles at a high level.
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lmao, Inifnites hip hop posts are gold.
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I agree with Petey. Just listen to Whats ya Phone # and imagine the kind of songs Pac could have been making instead. There's a reason Changes was an unreleased studio session instead of coming out while he was alive. You might be nodding your head to 2Pac saying nothing over G Funk beats, but I know he could've done a lot more.
fact of the matter is, 2pac produced classics before and after signing with death row...if the music he released with death row was all garbage, u might have a great point. but i enjoy the death row 2pac's music as much (if not more) than the pre-death row 2pac's music, as do most west coast hip-hop heads.
Really? there's no difference between party gangsta Pac and introspective Pac to you? Maybe his serious shit doesn't hold as much meaning to you.
yea...the introspective pac is shit u'd bump in your headphones while chillin. the gangsta pac is shit u'd knock in your ride with your peoples when u goin out to have a good time. both enjoyable in two different ways.
See if I wanted gangsta shit, that's what I listen to Dre or Snoop for. Pac had the ability to do something else, to say something actually meaningful with his music. So for him to go that lane is a disappointment. California Love might as well have been a Dre and Snoop song, wouldn't have made a difference to me.
u may take it as that, but to me, it just shows versatility and the ability to venture out to different sub-genres of hip-hop. it's a talent, if anything. like i said, it'd be one thing if his death row hits weren't classic, but they are, so knockin him for bein able to come at an audience from both angles aint really legit, as long as he was tackling both angles at a high level.
But the bar to make those songs is so low compared to Pac's deeper stuff. I mean Dre didn't even write his own rhymes yet he was able to pump out gangsta shit and party jams like it was nothing. Those songs didn't require Pac's lyrical skill at all. Pac had a different kind of talent, but he stopped using it for the most part once he got with Death Row.
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lmao at u dont want to let garbage enter your system yet your on a westcoast gangster rap music forum for 24 hours a day.. if u havent noticed 85 % of the subject matter in gangster rap is garbage..no matter what the label
The gangsta rap I listened to from the 90's was far from garbage.
Gangsta rap was sort of like a modern day version of tribalism. Back Ancient Africa and the Middle East, members of a tribe would have different titles and job duties. For example you would have your warrior wing of the tribe, you would have your hunter gatherers, and so on. One vital segment of the tribe were the poets. The poets would glorify the virtues of the tribe. The were the voice of the tribe and they communicated their aspirations to the outside world. Gangsta rappers were the same way. They were great poets and artists reppin where they were from and their virtues in heroism, courage, and valor.
Anyone who knows Snoop knows that Snoop has a good heart. Snoop is a righteous man. 2pac is a righteous man. The gangsta rap I was listening to growing up was mostly Death Row and it's affiliates. The weren't perfect, but for the most part it was positive.
first this fool goes on and on about how slaves had it better than slave masters, and now hes relating death row records to ancient african poets. youve got a fucked up brain
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I agree with Petey. Just listen to Whats ya Phone # and imagine the kind of songs Pac could have been making instead. There's a reason Changes was an unreleased studio session instead of coming out while he was alive. You might be nodding your head to 2Pac saying nothing over G Funk beats, but I know he could've done a lot more.
fact of the matter is, 2pac produced classics before and after signing with death row...if the music he released with death row was all garbage, u might have a great point. but i enjoy the death row 2pac's music as much (if not more) than the pre-death row 2pac's music, as do most west coast hip-hop heads.
Really? there's no difference between party gangsta Pac and introspective Pac to you? Maybe his serious shit doesn't hold as much meaning to you.
yea...the introspective pac is shit u'd bump in your headphones while chillin. the gangsta pac is shit u'd knock in your ride with your peoples when u goin out to have a good time. both enjoyable in two different ways.
See if I wanted gangsta shit, that's what I listen to Dre or Snoop for. Pac had the ability to do something else, to say something actually meaningful with his music. So for him to go that lane is a disappointment. California Love might as well have been a Dre and Snoop song, wouldn't have made a difference to me.
u may take it as that, but to me, it just shows versatility and the ability to venture out to different sub-genres of hip-hop. it's a talent, if anything. like i said, it'd be one thing if his death row hits weren't classic, but they are, so knockin him for bein able to come at an audience from both angles aint really legit, as long as he was tackling both angles at a high level.
But the bar to make those songs is so low compared to Pac's deeper stuff. I mean Dre didn't even write his own rhymes yet he was able to pump out gangsta shit and party jams like it was nothing. Those songs didn't require Pac's lyrical skill at all. Pac had a different kind of talent, but he stopped using it for the most part once he got with Death Row.
i dunno...if it's so easy to knock out west coast party classics and timeless hits, why aren't more peeps doin it? fact of the matter is, songs like "how do you want it", "2 of amerikaz most wanted", "cali love", "hail mary", "to live and die in la" etc. are some of the greatest west coast hip-hop singles of all time and are still imitated until this very day. 2pac was on top of his game til the very day he died.
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lmao at u dont want to let garbage enter your system yet your on a westcoast gangster rap music forum for 24 hours a day.. if u havent noticed 85 % of the subject matter in gangster rap is garbage..no matter what the label
The gangsta rap I listened to from the 90's was far from garbage.
Gangsta rap was sort of like a modern day version of tribalism. Back Ancient Africa and the Middle East, members of a tribe would have different titles and job duties. For example you would have your warrior wing of the tribe, you would have your hunter gatherers, and so on. One vital segment of the tribe were the poets. The poets would glorify the virtues of the tribe. The were the voice of the tribe and they communicated their aspirations to the outside world. Gangsta rappers were the same way. They were great poets and artists reppin where they were from and their virtues in heroism, courage, and valor.
Anyone who knows Snoop knows that Snoop has a good heart. Snoop is a righteous man. 2pac is a righteous man. The gangsta rap I was listening to growing up was mostly Death Row and it's affiliates. The weren't perfect, but for the most part it was positive.
no, it was garbage...even i can admit that.
its just it was the soundtrack to your youth so you cherish it like uncle rico.
songs like brenda had a baby etc dont hold a candle to songe like sam cookes change gon come....but unforuently in the 80 - 90s is when all music took a turn for the worst so a song like that is the closest thing this generation has to actual humaniatrian artists and shit like stevie wonder curtis mayfield etc. its a shame that to cats like brian this is the closest they will ever have to being truly inspired by music is listening to tupac rhyme enemy with hennesee over old isley samples.
agree with that and ur subsequent posts, maybe not garbage but i definitely know where you're coming from. i mean i enjoy gangsta rap for what it is, but most gangsta rappers became parodies of themselves, thank god the music was dope.
as far as the topic is concerned, i would say that Infinite's opinion is irrelevant and invalidated by his bigotry and ignorance of the topic at hand.
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That Cash Money album is one of his best... His album with Da Hood was good, so was his album with Glasses Malone.
I don't know what you're talking about. Dude's never dropped one wack album and fillers are hard to find on his projects. Mack 10 might be the most consistent rapper on the West Coast.
All I needed to hear was that Mack 10 was on Cash Money's label. That was enough for me to say he fell off and sold out. Then when I caught his video once the song was trash and the video was garbage. That was more than enough for me.
You just admitted you hated it without even listening to it. Isn't that like racism Brian?
Ironically, Dre produced his lead single for that album "Hate in your eyes". So you hated that collab I guess.
And for the record, that is a great album. Manny Fresh dropped some serious heat on there. Mack 10 didn't sell out at all with that move.
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lmao at u dont want to let garbage enter your system yet your on a westcoast gangster rap music forum for 24 hours a day.. if u havent noticed 85 % of the subject matter in gangster rap is garbage..no matter what the label
The gangsta rap I listened to from the 90's was far from garbage.
Gangsta rap was sort of like a modern day version of tribalism. Back Ancient Africa and the Middle East, members of a tribe would have different titles and job duties. For example you would have your warrior wing of the tribe, you would have your hunter gatherers, and so on. One vital segment of the tribe were the poets. The poets would glorify the virtues of the tribe. The were the voice of the tribe and they communicated their aspirations to the outside world. Gangsta rappers were the same way. They were great poets and artists reppin where they were from and their virtues in heroism, courage, and valor.
Anyone who knows Snoop knows that Snoop has a good heart. Snoop is a righteous man. 2pac is a righteous man. The gangsta rap I was listening to growing up was mostly Death Row and it's affiliates. The weren't perfect, but for the most part it was positive.
[/quote]first this fool goes on and on about how slaves had it better than slave masters, and now hes relating death row records to ancient african poets. youve got a fucked up brain
LOL what?
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I agree with Petey. Just listen to Whats ya Phone # and imagine the kind of songs Pac could have been making instead. There's a reason Changes was an unreleased studio session instead of coming out while he was alive. You might be nodding your head to 2Pac saying nothing over G Funk beats, but I know he could've done a lot more.
But while a song like Changes was an unreleased song, it's not as if every other shelved track was just like it. The same thing applies to the Death Row stuff that was unreleased after All Eyez on Me and Makaveli. If we were to look up the unreleased tracks from both periods, a smaller portion of it would be the deeper, more introspective songs. So it's not like Pac recorded a bunch of thoughtful tracks that the record label, whether Interscope or Death Row, decided was not good enough while ordering him to go back and re-do an album to their liking. Pac did the party tracks, the thugged out tracks, all sorts of tracks... willingly, whether his idea or not.
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quite agree execpt for his fisrt album on cash money records .. it was pretty good , even better than his previous album . many fresh was the producer ..at this time, cash money records was a real good label .. but yeah then he fell off hard .. in the 90's hoobangin was the shit (cj mac , eiht, WC, techniec and one of the most underrated producer : young tray
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alot of you guys stopped blowing mack 10 the second he fell out with ice cube.
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first this fool goes on and on about how slaves had it better than slave masters, and now hes relating death row records to ancient african poets. youve got a fucked up brain
lol.... I never said slaves had it better than slave masters. I actually compared the plight of regular poor whites (not slave masters) with that of the slaves. The poor whites who worked in the North worked at a time in which there were no labor laws. They worked at factories in the North and would perform backbreaking labor for 12-16 hours a day, 6 days a week, and get paid very little. Also, beating were the order of the day. In that time period beatings were the primary form of punishment. So even if you were a white in the North your boss could and did beat the shit out of you as a method of punishment. It was just a brutal time period. The church dominated everything. Whites in the North had no sexual freedoms, they were forced into fighting in the armed forces and leaving their families and so on. In fact...Parents even beat the shit out of their kids back in those days. The church beat the shit out of people. Everybody was catching beatings back then... We can break it down like this....
Black slaves get beat as punishment - So do white workers in the North get beat as punishment
Blacks forced to separate from their families - So were a high percentage of whites forced to serve and die in war and spend lives away from family
...so this caused some whites to envy the freedoms blacks held on the plantation. Knowing that they always had three hots and a kot. The sexual freedoms that they were allowed on the plantation. Their music and dance and social gatherings that were often not allowed by the church in the case of whites. And so on.
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bro that was the coolest story ever.
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Spike Lee and other "black intellectuals" are always portraying the Slavery era minstrel shows as the ultimate evil in black entertainment. Whenever Spike wants to diss somebody like Tyler Perry or an ignorant rap artist, you will often hear them being compared to Minstrel Shows.
But there is another, hidden truth about Minstrel Shows and slavery that Spike Lee wouldn't very much like to admit. I'm going to point out 2 hidden truths, and open it up for discussion to see what ya'll think about this.
Hidden Truth #1. Minstrel Shows are often portrayed by black intellectuals as a way that whites would make fun of blacks. But they were actually a means in which WHITES ENVIED BLACKS. You have to understand that in that during the slavery era the church played a huge role in society. And life was not easy for white people. Whites worked very hard, and the church instructed them that idle time spent was evil and the work of the devil. Whites, ironically, envied blacks for their time spent in leisure, for their music, for their dance, for their sexual promiscuity, for their humor, for their FREEDOMS. Often, the only acceptable way for them to experience this was vicariously through the black-face minstrel shows.
Hidden Truth #2. Now the reason that "black intellectuals" don't like Minstrel Shows is they believe they portray stereotypes. Also, black intellectuals don't like to admit that many slaves spoke positively of their lives as a slave, and the larger percentage of freed slaves after the civil war chose to stay on the plantation, and even longed for the days of slavery. Black intellectuals don't like to admit this because they believe it depicts blacks as being inferior. See, black intellectuals like Spike Lee are focused primarily on BLACK POWER, so they fail to see that often life and lifestyles of whites in the slave era were MISERABLE, and that whites actually envied the joys of black life and the freedoms that black slaves had. Blacks had less responsibilities, and without an economic incentive, slaves would have their necessities taken care of whether or not they worked in sincerity. While whites and free blacks constantly worried over keeping a warm home and food on the table.
goddamn youre an idiot
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so you admit to not listening to his music and just ASSUMING its sold out?
This basically sums it up. :sign_banhim:
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Thread Fail.
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I agree with Petey. Just listen to Whats ya Phone # and imagine the kind of songs Pac could have been making instead. There's a reason Changes was an unreleased studio session instead of coming out while he was alive. You might be nodding your head to 2Pac saying nothing over G Funk beats, but I know he could've done a lot more.
fact of the matter is, 2pac produced classics before and after signing with death row...if the music he released with death row was all garbage, u might have a great point. but i enjoy the death row 2pac's music as much (if not more) than the pre-death row 2pac's music, as do most west coast hip-hop heads.
i like his death row shit more.
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One thing I know for a fact because I heard it from the promoter of that show Mack 10 did a few weeks back (& that is DJ Droops) is that he booked Macl 10 as a headliner & he barely played 30 minutes & left the building, no encore, no nothing.
That seems a little short for a headliner's performance & somewhat disrespectful to his fans who came to see him... (which is NOT saying he fell off but might have lost some of his hunger that made him a household name in West Coast music)
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One thing I know for a fact because I heard it from the promoter of that show Mack 10 did a few weeks back (& that is DJ Droops) is that he booked Macl 10 as a headliner & he barely played 30 minutes & left the building, no encore, no nothing.
That seems a little short for a headliner's performance & somewhat disrespectful to his fans who came to see him... (which is NOT saying he fell off but might have lost some of his hunger that made him a household name in West Coast music)
No offense to the promoter, but if Mack 10 is headlining a concert, you're scratching the bottom of the barrel.
Thread Fail.
The thread was a fail the minute the OP typed "Mack 10" instead of "Kurupt" when deciding to come up with this thread.
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One thing I know for a fact because I heard it from the promoter of that show Mack 10 did a few weeks back (& that is DJ Droops) is that he booked Macl 10 as a headliner & he barely played 30 minutes & left the building, no encore, no nothing.
That seems a little short for a headliner's performance & somewhat disrespectful to his fans who came to see him... (which is NOT saying he fell off but might have lost some of his hunger that made him a household name in West Coast music)
No offense to the promoter, but if Mack 10 is headlining a concert, you're scratching the bottom of the barrel.
Thread Fail.
why? Mack 10 wouldn't deserve top headline clubs at this point in his career? We ain't talking filling up stadiums of course, it's a club venue & Mack definitely filled the place. Promoter had no complaint whatsoever money-wise, just with the short length of the performance, him being a Mack 10 fan too.
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One thing I know for a fact because I heard it from the promoter of that show Mack 10 did a few weeks back (& that is DJ Droops) is that he booked Macl 10 as a headliner & he barely played 30 minutes & left the building, no encore, no nothing.
That seems a little short for a headliner's performance & somewhat disrespectful to his fans who came to see him... (which is NOT saying he fell off but might have lost some of his hunger that made him a household name in West Coast music)
No offense to the promoter, but if Mack 10 is headlining a concert, you're scratching the bottom of the barrel.
Thread Fail.
why? Mack 10 wouldn't deserve top headline clubs at this point in his career? We ain't talking filling up stadiums of course, it's a club venue & Mack definitely filled the place. Promoter had no complaint whatsoever money-wise, just with the short length of the performance, him being a Mack 10 fan too.
I don't get the point you were trying to make. My point was that there are people that have fallen off much worse than Mack, but more importantly Inifinte admitted that he decided all of this solely based on the fact that he signed to Cash Money without even listening to his material.
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One thing I know for a fact because I heard it from the promoter of that show Mack 10 did a few weeks back (& that is DJ Droops) is that he booked Macl 10 as a headliner & he barely played 30 minutes & left the building, no encore, no nothing.
That seems a little short for a headliner's performance & somewhat disrespectful to his fans who came to see him... (which is NOT saying he fell off but might have lost some of his hunger that made him a household name in West Coast music)
No offense to the promoter, but if Mack 10 is headlining a concert, you're scratching the bottom of the barrel.
Thread Fail.
why? Mack 10 wouldn't deserve top headline clubs at this point in his career? We ain't talking filling up stadiums of course, it's a club venue & Mack definitely filled the place. Promoter had no complaint whatsoever money-wise, just with the short length of the performance, him being a Mack 10 fan too.
I don't get the point you were trying to make. My point was that there are people that have fallen off much worse than Mack, but more importantly Inifinte admitted that he decided all of this solely based on the fact that he signed to Cash Money without even listening to his material.
My point is simple, I ain't saying he fell off or that he fell off just because he signed to Cash Money, even though personally I do prefer his early albums to his more recent ones. I'm simply stating a point of personal disapointment that I think (I might be wrong) illustrate a certain lack of respect (or interest) towards his own fans.
Matter of fact as one of those fans, I HOPE I'm wrong, but I don't think I am.
& It's more difficult to please your fans if you don't really respect them anymore, don't you think?
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One thing I know for a fact because I heard it from the promoter of that show Mack 10 did a few weeks back (& that is DJ Droops) is that he booked Macl 10 as a headliner & he barely played 30 minutes & left the building, no encore, no nothing.
That seems a little short for a headliner's performance & somewhat disrespectful to his fans who came to see him... (which is NOT saying he fell off but might have lost some of his hunger that made him a household name in West Coast music)
No offense to the promoter, but if Mack 10 is headlining a concert, you're scratching the bottom of the barrel.
why? Mack 10 wouldn't deserve top headline clubs at this point in his career? We ain't talking filling up stadiums of course, it's a club venue & Mack definitely filled the place. Promoter had no complaint whatsoever money-wise, just with the short length of the performance, him being a Mack 10 fan too.
Yea, small clubs I could see him being a top act. IMO when I hear the name "Mack 10", headliner isn't the first word that comes to mind
-
One thing I know for a fact because I heard it from the promoter of that show Mack 10 did a few weeks back (& that is DJ Droops) is that he booked Macl 10 as a headliner & he barely played 30 minutes & left the building, no encore, no nothing.
That seems a little short for a headliner's performance & somewhat disrespectful to his fans who came to see him... (which is NOT saying he fell off but might have lost some of his hunger that made him a household name in West Coast music)
No offense to the promoter, but if Mack 10 is headlining a concert, you're scratching the bottom of the barrel.
why? Mack 10 wouldn't deserve top headline clubs at this point in his career? We ain't talking filling up stadiums of course, it's a club venue & Mack definitely filled the place. Promoter had no complaint whatsoever money-wise, just with the short length of the performance, him being a Mack 10 fan too.
Yea, small clubs I could see him being a top act. IMO when I hear the name "Mack 10", headliner isn't the first word that comes to mind
Really depends on the size of the venue.. There are spots that headline unknown acts, and there are spots where Mack 10 couldn't even open at.
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So OK, like I said before, Mack 10 didn't fell off that hard like Kurupt or Snoop Dogg. Now I'm gonna get some weird hate thing on me because I mentioned Snoop but really, dude sold his soul to devil because of money. I know you're businessman, but hell with that, do tracks for your fans not for Kate Perry's fans, you ain't from Somalia or somethin' you're like Top 10 known names in Hip-Hop world. But enough with Snoop, it's about Mack 10. A lotta dudes here are saying that he fell off, but nah he didn't. It's just he went from WSC and he tried to do his own thang, so his promoting didn't work that well. For me, he goes in like top 15 most popular rappers from West of all times, hate on me I don't care... That guy keep't his style, never went commercial even knowing that would open a lotta of other doors for him. Today's Hip-Hop scene goes only about YMCM, what tricks me, it's same like Death Row was on Top of it in 90's. But again, Death Row made it's rappers legendary, and for what you gon' say Lil' Wayne is legendary? Because "she licks it like a lollipop"? Ah c'mon. Today's technology made this shit. Now days everyone can be a fucking rapper, just get some money, record a song, even a video and there you have it, you're a rapper. That's lame. I'm always gonna rather listen to some Mack 10's records than todays artists like LW or Drake or anyone from YMCM, just because they don't have that sense of Hip-Hop, their genre is not that, it's Hip-Pop they destroyed Hip-Hop like a genre made it go to another direction opposite to the direction it used to go. Mack 10 still got it, he's still out there, he can still drop bangers, he can shut mouths to bunch of rappers with a single song if he wanted, but man does his own thing so if you didn't saw him on TV for ages that means he sold out, fell off or whatever you mean with that? Look at Xzibit for example, guy had tv show, and now he's more known because of that show than like a rapper... It's this technology and these generations, they don't wanna hear about world;ghetto;jail;society problems... They just wanna go to clubs dance to some hip-pop shit and go back home, and like we know X, Cube, Mack, Dre, Slim The Mobster and all of those older cats in Hip-Hop doesn't make music like that. That's why you think 10 fell of.
-
So OK, like I said before, Mack 10 didn't fell off that hard like Kurupt or Snoop Dogg. Now I'm gonna get some weird hate thing on me because I mentioned Snoop but really, dude sold his soul to devil because of money. I know you're businessman, but hell with that, do tracks for your fans not for Kate Perry's fans, you ain't from Somalia or somethin' you're like Top 10 known names in Hip-Hop world. But enough with Snoop, it's about Mack 10. A lotta dudes here are saying that he fell off, but nah he didn't. It's just he went from WSC and he tried to do his own thang, so his promoting didn't work that well. For me, he goes in like top 15 most popular rappers from West of all times, hate on me I don't care... That guy keep't his style, never went commercial even knowing that would open a lotta of other doors for him. Today's Hip-Hop scene goes only about YMCM, what tricks me, it's same like Death Row was on Top of it in 90's. But again, Death Row made it's rappers legendary, and for what you gon' say Lil' Wayne is legendary? Because "she licks it like a lollipop"? Ah c'mon. Today's technology made this shit. Now days everyone can be a fucking rapper, just get some money, record a song, even a video and there you have it, you're a rapper. That's lame. I'm always gonna rather listen to some Mack 10's records than todays artists like LW or Drake or anyone from YMCM, just because they don't have that sense of Hip-Hop, their genre is not that, it's Hip-Pop they destroyed Hip-Hop like a genre made it go to another direction opposite to the direction it used to go. Mack 10 still got it, he's still out there, he can still drop bangers, he can shut mouths to bunch of rappers with a single song if he wanted, but man does his own thing so if you didn't saw him on TV for ages that means he sold out, fell off or whatever you mean with that? Look at Xzibit for example, guy had tv show, and now he's more known because of that show than like a rapper... It's this technology and these generations, they don't wanna hear about world;ghetto;jail;society problems... They just wanna go to clubs dance to some hip-pop shit and go back home, and like we know X, Cube, Mack, Dre, Slim The Mobster and all of those older cats in Hip-Hop doesn't make music like that. That's why you think 10 fell of.
using Lil Wayne as an example of a "todays rapper" is not goin to work,
he is a "legend/veteran" in his own right, more so than local westcoast-hoo banger Mack 10
-
So OK, like I said before, Mack 10 didn't fell off that hard like Kurupt or Snoop Dogg. Now I'm gonna get some weird hate thing on me because I mentioned Snoop but really, dude sold his soul to devil because of money. I know you're businessman, but hell with that, do tracks for your fans not for Kate Perry's fans, you ain't from Somalia or somethin' you're like Top 10 known names in Hip-Hop world. But enough with Snoop, it's about Mack 10. A lotta dudes here are saying that he fell off, but nah he didn't. It's just he went from WSC and he tried to do his own thang, so his promoting didn't work that well. For me, he goes in like top 15 most popular rappers from West of all times, hate on me I don't care... That guy keep't his style, never went commercial even knowing that would open a lotta of other doors for him. Today's Hip-Hop scene goes only about YMCM, what tricks me, it's same like Death Row was on Top of it in 90's. But again, Death Row made it's rappers legendary, and for what you gon' say Lil' Wayne is legendary? Because "she licks it like a lollipop"? Ah c'mon. Today's technology made this shit. Now days everyone can be a fucking rapper, just get some money, record a song, even a video and there you have it, you're a rapper. That's lame. I'm always gonna rather listen to some Mack 10's records than todays artists like LW or Drake or anyone from YMCM, just because they don't have that sense of Hip-Hop, their genre is not that, it's Hip-Pop they destroyed Hip-Hop like a genre made it go to another direction opposite to the direction it used to go. Mack 10 still got it, he's still out there, he can still drop bangers, he can shut mouths to bunch of rappers with a single song if he wanted, but man does his own thing so if you didn't saw him on TV for ages that means he sold out, fell off or whatever you mean with that? Look at Xzibit for example, guy had tv show, and now he's more known because of that show than like a rapper... It's this technology and these generations, they don't wanna hear about world;ghetto;jail;society problems... They just wanna go to clubs dance to some hip-pop shit and go back home, and like we know X, Cube, Mack, Dre, Slim The Mobster and all of those older cats in Hip-Hop doesn't make music like that. That's why you think 10 fell of.
using Lil Wayne as an example of a "todays rapper" is not goin to work,
he is a "legend/veteran" in his own right, more so than local westcoast-hoo banger Mack 10
hell no.
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Lil Wayne came out 15 years ago.
-
Bgz true story was Wayne's first album...it came out in 93 or 94 I believe
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Bgz true story was Wayne's first album...it came out in 93 or 94 I believe
so he came out before Mack 10?
-
So OK, like I said before, Mack 10 didn't fell off that hard like Kurupt or Snoop Dogg. Now I'm gonna get some weird hate thing on me because I mentioned Snoop but really, dude sold his soul to devil because of money. I know you're businessman, but hell with that, do tracks for your fans not for Kate Perry's fans, you ain't from Somalia or somethin' you're like Top 10 known names in Hip-Hop world. But enough with Snoop, it's about Mack 10. A lotta dudes here are saying that he fell off, but nah he didn't. It's just he went from WSC and he tried to do his own thang, so his promoting didn't work that well. For me, he goes in like top 15 most popular rappers from West of all times, hate on me I don't care... That guy keep't his style, never went commercial even knowing that would open a lotta of other doors for him. Today's Hip-Hop scene goes only about YMCM, what tricks me, it's same like Death Row was on Top of it in 90's. But again, Death Row made it's rappers legendary, and for what you gon' say Lil' Wayne is legendary? Because "she licks it like a lollipop"? Ah c'mon. Today's technology made this shit. Now days everyone can be a fucking rapper, just get some money, record a song, even a video and there you have it, you're a rapper. That's lame. I'm always gonna rather listen to some Mack 10's records than todays artists like LW or Drake or anyone from YMCM, just because they don't have that sense of Hip-Hop, their genre is not that, it's Hip-Pop they destroyed Hip-Hop like a genre made it go to another direction opposite to the direction it used to go. Mack 10 still got it, he's still out there, he can still drop bangers, he can shut mouths to bunch of rappers with a single song if he wanted, but man does his own thing so if you didn't saw him on TV for ages that means he sold out, fell off or whatever you mean with that? Look at Xzibit for example, guy had tv show, and now he's more known because of that show than like a rapper... It's this technology and these generations, they don't wanna hear about world;ghetto;jail;society problems... They just wanna go to clubs dance to some hip-pop shit and go back home, and like we know X, Cube, Mack, Dre, Slim The Mobster and all of those older cats in Hip-Hop doesn't make music like that. That's why you think 10 fell of.
using Lil Wayne as an example of a "todays rapper" is not goin to work,
he is a "legend/veteran" in his own right, more so than local westcoast-hoo banger Mack 10
Dude you should take some therapies or somethin'...
He came 15 years ago, OK, that's kool, and tell me why he didn't was such a big name 10 years ago? You knew about him? He was known on "World level"? Nah... He came with "Kill Hip-Hop songs" and he get known. Fuck him.
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^^^^^^^^^^^
not 15 years ago but 17
lool how much i dont like lil wayne u must have lived under the stone when Cash Money was popping they were at the same level of popularity or more than Mack 10 ever was, and it was around 1999 and if u didnt know about Hot Boyz and Cash Money around this time u were either small kid who has no clue or just plain ignorant - and that is said by some1 from overseas so he was well known worldwide
so mayeb u tell me u never heard about Juvenile or Hot bOyz that time too?
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using Lil Wayne as an example of a "todays rapper" is not goin to work,
he is a "legend/veteran" in his own right, more so than local westcoast-hoo banger Mack 10
Dude you should take some therapies or somethin'...
He came 15 years ago, OK, that's kool, and tell me why he didn't was such a big name 10 years ago? You knew about him? He was known on "World level"? Nah... He came with "Kill Hip-Hop songs" and he get known. Fuck him.
using Lil Wayne as an example of a "todays rapper" is not goin to work,
he is a "legend/veteran" in his own right, more so than local westcoast-hoo banger Mack 10
hell no.
Like it or not, Wayne has put in work and has vastly improved from when he first came out. If you ask the average Hip-Hop fan to name 5-10 songs from Mack 10, not including stuff he did with WSCG, they probably wouldn't be able to do so.
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Bgz true story was Wayne's first album...it came out in 93 or 94 I believe
so he came out before Mack 10?
yes
-
^^^^^^^^^^^
not 15 years ago but 17
lool how much i dont like lil wayne u must have lived under the stone when Cash Money was popping they were at the same level of popularity or more than Mack 10 ever was, and it was around 1999 and if u didnt know about Hot Boyz and Cash Money around this time u were either small kid who has no clue or just plain ignorant - and that is said by some1 from overseas so he was well known worldwide
so mayeb u tell me u never heard about Juvenile or Hot bOyz that time too?
True but it's a well known fact that Wayne was the least popular member of the Hot Boys back then, not saying that Lost Angels is right or whatever. I think that's one of the reasons why he was able to reinvent himself so well. People looked at him like the baby of the group so they didn't really take him seriously until Carter. BG and Juvenile were obviously the most popular members and even Baby was more popular than Wayne for alot of years.
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^^^^^^^^^^^
not 15 years ago but 17
lool how much i dont like lil wayne u must have lived under the stone when Cash Money was popping they were at the same level of popularity or more than Mack 10 ever was, and it was around 1999 and if u didnt know about Hot Boyz and Cash Money around this time u were either small kid who has no clue or just plain ignorant - and that is said by some1 from overseas so he was well known worldwide
so mayeb u tell me u never heard about Juvenile or Hot bOyz that time too?
True but it's a well known fact that Wayne was the least popular member of the Hot Boys back then, not saying that Lost Angels is right or whatever. I think that's one of the reasons why he was able to reinvent himself so well. People looked at him like the baby of the group so they didn't really take him seriously until Carter. BG and Juvenile were obviously the most popular members and even Baby was more popular than Wayne for alot of years.
Turk was the least popular member of the group. Wayne was known at that time, between the Hot Boys records and his first cd. You're correct though, he was able to reinvent himself with the Carter cd's; I give him some credit for the Squad Mixtapes as well.
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block is hot is was and will probably always be his best shit.
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Bgz true story was Wayne's first album...it came out in 93 or 94 I believe
so he came out before Mack 10?
yes
naah....lil wayne came out in 95, when he was 12. mack 10's debut also came out in 95, but it was earlier in the year.
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using Lil Wayne as an example of a "todays rapper" is not goin to work,
he is a "legend/veteran" in his own right, more so than local westcoast-hoo banger Mack 10
Dude you should take some therapies or somethin'...
He came 15 years ago, OK, that's kool, and tell me why he didn't was such a big name 10 years ago? You knew about him? He was known on "World level"? Nah... He came with "Kill Hip-Hop songs" and he get known. Fuck him.
using Lil Wayne as an example of a "todays rapper" is not goin to work,
he is a "legend/veteran" in his own right, more so than local westcoast-hoo banger Mack 10
hell no.
Like it or not, Wayne has put in work and has vastly improved from when he first came out. If you ask the average Hip-Hop fan to name 5-10 songs from Mack 10, not including stuff he did with WSCG, they probably wouldn't be able to do so.
i disagree...1999 lil wayne>>>>>current lil wayne
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block is hot is was and will probably always be his best shit.
yes
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Bgz true story was Wayne's first album...it came out in 93 or 94 I believe
so he came out before Mack 10?
yes
naah....lil wayne came out in 95, when he was 12. mack 10's debut also came out in 95, but it was earlier in the year.
that album was underground in new orleans before it got any regional distribution. that album was completed before 95 but mack10 was on a song of ice cubes in 93 i think so its all fair game for discussion.
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Bgz true story was Wayne's first album...it came out in 93 or 94 I believe
so he came out before Mack 10?
yes
naah....lil wayne came out in 95, when he was 12. mack 10's debut also came out in 95, but it was earlier in the year.
that album was underground in new orleans before it got any regional distribution. that album was completed before 95 but mack10 was on a song of ice cubes in 93 i think so its all fair game for discussion.
Mack 10 was on Ice Cube's "Bootleg and B-Sides" album that dropped in '94.
using Lil Wayne as an example of a "todays rapper" is not goin to work,
he is a "legend/veteran" in his own right, more so than local westcoast-hoo banger Mack 10
Dude you should take some therapies or somethin'...
He came 15 years ago, OK, that's kool, and tell me why he didn't was such a big name 10 years ago? You knew about him? He was known on "World level"? Nah... He came with "Kill Hip-Hop songs" and he get known. Fuck him.
using Lil Wayne as an example of a "todays rapper" is not goin to work,
he is a "legend/veteran" in his own right, more so than local westcoast-hoo banger Mack 10
hell no.
Like it or not, Wayne has put in work and has vastly improved from when he first came out. If you ask the average Hip-Hop fan to name 5-10 songs from Mack 10, not including stuff he did with WSCG, they probably wouldn't be able to do so.
i disagree...1999 lil wayne>>>>>current lil wayne
I'm not a Weezy fan, but dude now is better than he was at 15. Personally I like the Squad Mixtapes and Carter II over his most recent stuff.
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Like it or not, Wayne has put in work and has vastly improved from when he first came out. If you ask the average Hip-Hop fan to name 5-10 songs from Mack 10, not including stuff he did with WSCG, they probably wouldn't be able to do so.
I definitely acknowledge the fact that Lil Wayne has stepped up his game lyrically while also display an ability to make hit songs with greater appeal than before along with his work ethic. But being one of the hottest in the game doesn't make you a hip-hop legend.
His problem that will likely never be fixed (unless he continues rapping well into his 30s) is that he hasn't made any significant songs that either will stand the test of time and be classic forever or have meaning and capture the mind-state of a generation and/or specific time period. All of the hip-hop greats have done that at least once. With all of the records sold and hit songs that I hear from Lil Wayne, they just don't stick. Lollipop was a huge single that fueled platinum sales, but do you hear it anymore? Can you imagine it playing in clubs in five years? In Da Club is almost ten years old, and it still gets clubs going crazy when it starts playing. Not even Weezy's best shit has that kind of relevance. Even Puffy who has multiplatinum albums and $500 million to his name doesn't have shit that still gets play.
Oh yeah, and there's also that false flagging that he does. Ketchup ass motherfucker.
-
Like it or not, Wayne has put in work and has vastly improved from when he first came out. If you ask the average Hip-Hop fan to name 5-10 songs from Mack 10, not including stuff he did with WSCG, they probably wouldn't be able to do so.
I definitely acknowledge the fact that Lil Wayne has stepped up his game lyrically while also display an ability to make hit songs with greater appeal than before along with his work ethic. But being one of the hottest in the game doesn't make you a hip-hop legend.
His problem that will likely never be fixed (unless he continues rapping well into his 30s) is that he hasn't made any significant songs that either will stand the test of time and be classic forever or have meaning and capture the mind-state of a generation and/or specific time period. All of the hip-hop greats have done that at least once. With all of the records sold and hit songs that I hear from Lil Wayne, they just don't stick. Lollipop was a huge single that fueled platinum sales, but do you hear it anymore? Can you imagine it playing in clubs in five years? In Da Club is almost ten years old, and it still gets clubs going crazy when it starts playing. Not even Weezy's best shit has that kind of relevance. Even Puffy who has multiplatinum albums and $500 million to his name doesn't have shit that still gets play.
Oh yeah, and there's also that false flagging that he does. Ketchup ass motherfucker.
I never said anything about Weezy being a legend. I sure as hell don't view him as a legend. His solo work is a lot more well known than Mack 10 in the grand scheme of things though. That much is undeniable.
-
Like it or not, Wayne has put in work and has vastly improved from when he first came out. If you ask the average Hip-Hop fan to name 5-10 songs from Mack 10, not including stuff he did with WSCG, they probably wouldn't be able to do so.
I definitely acknowledge the fact that Lil Wayne has stepped up his game lyrically while also display an ability to make hit songs with greater appeal than before along with his work ethic. But being one of the hottest in the game doesn't make you a hip-hop legend.
His problem that will likely never be fixed (unless he continues rapping well into his 30s) is that he hasn't made any significant songs that either will stand the test of time and be classic forever or have meaning and capture the mind-state of a generation and/or specific time period. All of the hip-hop greats have done that at least once. With all of the records sold and hit songs that I hear from Lil Wayne, they just don't stick. Lollipop was a huge single that fueled platinum sales, but do you hear it anymore? Can you imagine it playing in clubs in five years? In Da Club is almost ten years old, and it still gets clubs going crazy when it starts playing. Not even Weezy's best shit has that kind of relevance. Even Puffy who has multiplatinum albums and $500 million to his name doesn't have shit that still gets play.
Oh yeah, and there's also that false flagging that he does. Ketchup ass motherfucker.
I couldn't write it better myself. Totally agree on this one!
-
Like it or not, Wayne has put in work and has vastly improved from when he first came out. If you ask the average Hip-Hop fan to name 5-10 songs from Mack 10, not including stuff he did with WSCG, they probably wouldn't be able to do so.
I definitely acknowledge the fact that Lil Wayne has stepped up his game lyrically while also display an ability to make hit songs with greater appeal than before along with his work ethic. But being one of the hottest in the game doesn't make you a hip-hop legend.
His problem that will likely never be fixed (unless he continues rapping well into his 30s) is that he hasn't made any significant songs that either will stand the test of time and be classic forever or have meaning and capture the mind-state of a generation and/or specific time period. All of the hip-hop greats have done that at least once. With all of the records sold and hit songs that I hear from Lil Wayne, they just don't stick. Lollipop was a huge single that fueled platinum sales, but do you hear it anymore? Can you imagine it playing in clubs in five years? In Da Club is almost ten years old, and it still gets clubs going crazy when it starts playing. Not even Weezy's best shit has that kind of relevance. Even Puffy who has multiplatinum albums and $500 million to his name doesn't have shit that still gets play.
Oh yeah, and there's also that false flagging that he does. Ketchup ass motherfucker.
I never said anything about Weezy being a legend. I sure as hell don't view him as a legend. His solo work is a lot more well known than Mack 10 in the grand scheme of things though. That much is undeniable.
Oh yeah, I know you didn't call him a legend... I was just saying that about what holds him back from getting his respect.
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That Cash Money album is one of his best... His album with Da Hood was good, so was his album with Glasses Malone.
I don't know what you're talking about. Dude's never dropped one wack album and fillers are hard to find on his projects. Mack 10 might be the most consistent rapper on the West Coast.
All I needed to hear was that Mack 10 was on Cash Money's label. That was enough for me to say he fell off and sold out. Then when I caught his video once the song was trash and the video was garbage. That was more than enough for me.
You just admitted you hated it without even listening to it. Isn't that like racism Brian?
Ironically, Dre produced his lead single for that album "Hate in your eyes". So you hated that collab I guess.
And for the record, that is a great album. Manny Fresh dropped some serious heat on there. Mack 10 didn't sell out at all with that move.
bump for bri
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Bgz true story was Wayne's first album...it came out in 93 or 94 I believe
so he came out before Mack 10?
yes
naah....lil wayne came out in 95, when he was 12. mack 10's debut also came out in 95, but it was earlier in the year.
that album was underground in new orleans before it got any regional distribution. that album was completed before 95 but mack10 was on a song of ice cubes in 93 i think so its all fair game for discussion.
Mack 10 was on Ice Cube's "Bootleg and B-Sides" album that dropped in '94.
using Lil Wayne as an example of a "todays rapper" is not goin to work,
he is a "legend/veteran" in his own right, more so than local westcoast-hoo banger Mack 10
Dude you should take some therapies or somethin'...
He came 15 years ago, OK, that's kool, and tell me why he didn't was such a big name 10 years ago? You knew about him? He was known on "World level"? Nah... He came with "Kill Hip-Hop songs" and he get known. Fuck him.
using Lil Wayne as an example of a "todays rapper" is not goin to work,
he is a "legend/veteran" in his own right, more so than local westcoast-hoo banger Mack 10
hell no.
Like it or not, Wayne has put in work and has vastly improved from when he first came out. If you ask the average Hip-Hop fan to name 5-10 songs from Mack 10, not including stuff he did with WSCG, they probably wouldn't be able to do so.
i disagree...1999 lil wayne>>>>>current lil wayne
I'm not a Weezy fan, but dude now is better than he was at 15. Personally I like the Squad Mixtapes and Carter II over his most recent stuff.
okay i was a year off so shoot me lol i dont use google or wikipedia when im talking my shit im going off memory and experience of working in record stores and being a rabid hip hop fan during this era
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Bgz true story was Wayne's first album...it came out in 93 or 94 I believe
so he came out before Mack 10?
yes
naah....lil wayne came out in 95, when he was 12. mack 10's debut also came out in 95, but it was earlier in the year.
that album was underground in new orleans before it got any regional distribution. that album was completed before 95 but mack10 was on a song of ice cubes in 93 i think so its all fair game for discussion.
Mack 10 was on Ice Cube's "Bootleg and B-Sides" album that dropped in '94.
using Lil Wayne as an example of a "todays rapper" is not goin to work,
he is a "legend/veteran" in his own right, more so than local westcoast-hoo banger Mack 10
Dude you should take some therapies or somethin'...
He came 15 years ago, OK, that's kool, and tell me why he didn't was such a big name 10 years ago? You knew about him? He was known on "World level"? Nah... He came with "Kill Hip-Hop songs" and he get known. Fuck him.
using Lil Wayne as an example of a "todays rapper" is not goin to work,
he is a "legend/veteran" in his own right, more so than local westcoast-hoo banger Mack 10
hell no.
Like it or not, Wayne has put in work and has vastly improved from when he first came out. If you ask the average Hip-Hop fan to name 5-10 songs from Mack 10, not including stuff he did with WSCG, they probably wouldn't be able to do so.
i disagree...1999 lil wayne>>>>>current lil wayne
I'm not a Weezy fan, but dude now is better than he was at 15. Personally I like the Squad Mixtapes and Carter II over his most recent stuff.
okay i was a year off so shoot me lol i dont use google or wikipedia when im talking my shit im going off memory and experience of working in record stores and being a rabid hip hop fan during this era
I had edited my original post. I had thought his first track was on the Friday OST but found out I was wrong
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That Cash Money album is one of his best... His album with Da Hood was good, so was his album with Glasses Malone.
I don't know what you're talking about. Dude's never dropped one wack album and fillers are hard to find on his projects. Mack 10 might be the most consistent rapper on the West Coast.
All I needed to hear was that Mack 10 was on Cash Money's label. That was enough for me to say he fell off and sold out. Then when I caught his video once the song was trash and the video was garbage. That was more than enough for me.
You just admitted you hated it without even listening to it. Isn't that like racism Brian?
Ironically, Dre produced his lead single for that album "Hate in your eyes". So you hated that collab I guess.
And for the record, that is a great album. Manny Fresh dropped some serious heat on there. Mack 10 didn't sell out at all with that move.
bump for bri
LOL.. at the idea of "Manny Fresh produced heat".
I wouldn't know because I'm not a bitch. I don't go to clubs and shake my ass to bullshit rap music. When I want to listen to rap music I want to hear that real shit, not that punk shit. I want to a mutherfucker bringin that hard core West Coast gangsta shit. That man's man shit.
Manny Fresh makes music for bitches, and since your more of a bitch than a bitch I can see why you like it. 80% of the fans of Cash money are women, and the rest are men who follow women. I ain't ever followed a bitch in my life.
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That Cash Money album is one of his best... His album with Da Hood was good, so was his album with Glasses Malone.
I don't know what you're talking about. Dude's never dropped one wack album and fillers are hard to find on his projects. Mack 10 might be the most consistent rapper on the West Coast.
All I needed to hear was that Mack 10 was on Cash Money's label. That was enough for me to say he fell off and sold out. Then when I caught his video once the song was trash and the video was garbage. That was more than enough for me.
You just admitted you hated it without even listening to it. Isn't that like racism Brian?
Ironically, Dre produced his lead single for that album "Hate in your eyes". So you hated that collab I guess.
And for the record, that is a great album. Manny Fresh dropped some serious heat on there. Mack 10 didn't sell out at all with that move.
bump for bri
LOL.. at the idea of "Manny Fresh produced heat".
I wouldn't know because I'm not a bitch. I don't go to clubs and shake my ass to bullshit rap music. When I want to listen to rap music I want to hear that real shit, not that punk shit. I want to a mutherfucker bringin that hard core West Coast gangsta shit. That man's man shit.
Manny Fresh makes music for bitches, and since your more of a bitch than a bitch I can see why you like it. 80% of the fans of Cash money are women, and the rest are men who follow women. I ain't ever followed a bitch in my life.
Manny Fresh made west coast gangsta shit:
http://www.youtube.com/v/gcvWQat7a98
8)
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When I want to listen to rap music I want to hear that real shit, not that punk shit. I want to a mutherfucker bringin that hard core West Coast gangsta shit. That man's man shit.
Manny Fresh makes music for bitches, and since your more of a bitch than a bitch I can see why you like it. 80% of the fans of Cash money are women, and the rest are men who follow women. I ain't ever followed a bitch in my life.
you sound pretty fuckin tough, especially for someone who still hasnt gotten over their first fuckin girlfriend and entered a fuckin arrainged marriage hahaha
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Manny Fresh made west coast gangsta shit:
http://www.youtube.com/v/gcvWQat7a98
8)
Making "gangsta shit" is more than coming to the studio and putting on a beat. To make gangsta shit you got to stand up and be a man. You can't be no bitch where 98% of your songs are for bitches in the club, and then one day you wake up and decide to be gangsta. That ain't a gansta, that's a bitch.
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i know where u comin from, but theres lotsa manny fresh beats that bumped... of course, he's not on the level of a quik or dre, but he was never a sub-par producer, like swizz beats or some shit.
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you sound pretty fuckin tough, especially for someone who still hasnt gotten over their first fuckin girlfriend and entered a fuckin arrainged marriage hahaha
See, you've never stood for nothing in your entire life. So the only possible way for you to have a voice is by riding other niccaz nutz like a bitch. See a man stands up on his principals, and sometimes he wins and sometimes he loses. Sometimes he succeeds and sometimes he fails. But at least he's never afraid to stand up like a man. Your nothing but a little bitch who has never stood up for anything in your life.
Your still shook from getting bullied in elementary school and your whole goal is to put negative attention on other people. Because if attention was ever focused on you, everyone would see you for the bitch you are. So all you can do is ride other niccaz nutz.
I was trying to represent Islam to the fullest. The only thing I am guilty of is I got married in the way orthodox Muslims get married. So anyone who was following Islam to the fullest like I was would of got married the same way. It's not arranged as in my mommy went and married me to someone. Your very uneducated and ignorant so I could see why you would think that. It is only arranged in the sense that orthodox Muslims put word out they want to get married and they are introduced to women who are also looking to get married. If you are introduced to one you like and they are also like you, then you discuss families, finances, etc. and then maybe go ahead and marry not long thereafter.
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i know where u comin from, but theres lotsa manny fresh beats that bumped... of course, he's not on the level of a quik or dre, but he was never a sub-par producer, like swizz beats or some shit.
I don't care if that nicca produced "California Love", I ain't bumpin that shit. Because he's a bitch and he makes music for bitches. So fuck um
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LOL
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Since when does Mannie Fresh make music for the bitches?
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resident = midwestryder?
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nope, just infinite, i'm guessin midwestryder actually likes mack 10
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nope, just infinite, i'm guessin midwestryder actually likes mack 10
Ah yeah, you're right. Midwestryder can't spell words correctly.
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motherfucker please manny fresh would out produce daz any fucking day.
they still imitating mannys style of beats fifteen years after he layed the blue print...turn your radio on nothing but tripled up high hats and 808 snare rolls and shit.
manny invented that shit...
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motherfucker please manny fresh would out produce daz any fucking day.
they still imitating mannys style of beats fifteen years after he layed the blue print...turn your radio on nothing but tripled up high hats and 808 snare rolls and shit.
manny invented that shit...
not Daz from 1992-1998
Mannie Fresh was producing for UNLV and Cash Money in the 1990s. notice how the shit Daz was producing on Dogg Pound is what Mannie Fresh was finally get into with UNLV in 1996?
examples:
UNLV before they were influecned by DPG sounded like this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uH37HbxYA9w
UNLV after they got influenced by DPG: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tUctqjHJN2Y
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lmfao thats not a "daz" influence its a westcoast influence i can agree with but daz aint the first person to use a moog synth and neither were dre or warren or quik. manny is quick to give dre his props though as an inspiration...
shit when i think of the moog synth i think of the beach boys more then anything...maybe the beachboys are the true founders of g funk?
and lets be real what would daz beats back then have sounded like if dudes like dre quik soopafly and barney rubble and all them dudes didnt touch em? i
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motherfucker please manny fresh would out produce daz any fucking day.
they still imitating mannys style of beats fifteen years after he layed the blue print...turn your radio on nothing but tripled up high hats and 808 snare rolls and shit.
manny invented that shit...
LOL..manny aint touchin death row daz. one can argue that death row daz had a team of musicians and co-producers behind him, but if u compare those era of daz beats to manny fresh, it's not even close.
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and lets be real what would daz beats back then have sounded like if dudes like dre quik soopafly and barney rubble and all them dudes didnt touch em? i
daz used to actually pound beats on a table and have soopafly recreate the track for him. hes not ill. his shit was just highly polished
daz had a long string of good luck
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and lets be real what would daz beats back then have sounded like if dudes like dre quik soopafly and barney rubble and all them dudes didnt touch em? i
daz used to actually pound beats on a table and have soopafly recreate the track for him. hes not ill. his shit was just highly polished
daz had a long string of good luck
regardless, daz production in death row era >>>>> manny fresh production of any era
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regardless, daz production in death row era >>>>> manny fresh production of any era
You're either hating, you don't know what you're talking about or you just don't like Mannie's style.
Mannie Fresh in his prime was untouchable in what he did: hard hitting beats.
Daz & Mannie Fresh had different styles, so I don't see why you would wanna compare them.
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regardless, daz production in death row era >>>>> manny fresh production of any era
You're either hating, you don't know what you're talking about or you just don't like Mannie's style.
Mannie Fresh in his prime was untouchable in what he did: hard hitting beats.
Daz & Mannie Fresh had different styles, so I don't see why you would wanna compare them.
Trust me, I think Mannie Fresh had some bangin beats. It's just that Daz beats mixed by Dre, Quik, etc. were much better. Personal preference.
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regardless, daz production in death row era >>>>> manny fresh production of any era
You're either hating, you don't know what you're talking about or you just don't like Mannie's style.
Mannie Fresh in his prime was untouchable in what he did: hard hitting beats.
Daz & Mannie Fresh had different styles, so I don't see why you would wanna compare them.
i think i made the first comparison between the two but its straight truth...daz said right in an interview the reason his beats aint what they was is "i just need some one to mix my shit right" and withthat one sentance daz degraded himself from a producer to a beatmaker.
manny mixes and engineers so does dre so does quik...shit like that separates producers from beat makers personally in my opinion.
you guys need to wake up and smell the coffee do you think some how after dillinger and young gotti part one he just woke up one morning and forgot how to make dope beats? no he lost his resources and equipment and shit...he ran out of old death row tracks to recycle and burnt his bridges with cats like dr dre and mike dean basically his string of good luck ran out.
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manny mixes and engineers so does dre so does quik...shit like that separates producers from beat makers personally in my opinion.
very true.
daz has incredible songs attached to his name but we know that 1) the credit system at death row was shady (either not accurate, or not detailed as to who did what) 2) dude had a bunch of co-producers & musicians.
one thing you can't take away from Daz is his own style of production, like if you listen to Daz's last song with Curren$y, his song on T.II.'s urban legend, that's Daz's touch right here (even though Shorty B. co-produced it and prolly took it to the next level)
fact of the matter is, Daz is probably a very good beat maker but not a great producer and sure as hell can't compare to game-changing producers like Dre, Quik & Mannie Fresh. he still has a dope C.V. as NIK pointed out (and very versatile if you compare the different styles of rap he produced). In my opinion, Daz is overrated in being underrated, people give him too much props because they think he was wronged by Dre and them credit wise in the Death Row days. if you wanna talk about a dope producer slept on, you need to talk about Chris "The Glove" Taylor, that man can do it all. also, Vicious Man Funk (VMF) from Dago.
I don't think he personally influenced Mannie Fresh though, Mannie was probably influenced by the trend of the day in 95 when he produced Bloody City or Chopper City, just like Jermaine Dupri was when he produced Funkdafied but it's not like Daz had an overwhelming style like say Big Hutch, Dre or Quik.
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regardless, daz production in death row era >>>>> manny fresh production of any era
You're either hating, you don't know what you're talking about or you just don't like Mannie's style.
Mannie Fresh in his prime was untouchable in what he did: hard hitting beats.
Daz & Mannie Fresh had different styles, so I don't see why you would wanna compare them.
i think i made the first comparison between the two but its straight truth...daz said right in an interview the reason his beats aint what they was is "i just need some one to mix my shit right" and withthat one sentance daz degraded himself from a producer to a beatmaker.
manny mixes and engineers so does dre so does quik...shit like that separates producers from beat makers personally in my opinion.
you guys need to wake up and smell the coffee do you think some how after dillinger and young gotti part one he just woke up one morning and forgot how to make dope beats? no he lost his resources and equipment and shit...he ran out of old death row tracks to recycle and burnt his bridges with cats like dr dre and mike dean basically his string of good luck ran out.
i agree, daz is at his best when he has top-notch producers mixin his shit...but all i'm sayin is daz production with dre or quik or mike dean mixin > manny fresh on his own
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lmfao thats not a "daz" influence its a westcoast influence i can agree with but daz aint the first person to use a moog synth and neither were dre or warren or quik. manny is quick to give dre his props though as an inspiration...
shit when i think of the moog synth i think of the beach boys more then anything...maybe the beachboys are the true founders of g funk?
and lets be real what would daz beats back then have sounded like if dudes like dre quik soopafly and barney rubble and all them dudes didnt touch em? i
But that's kind of the funny part about a lot of West Coast fans. They'll whine all day about how their favorite artists are being "robbed" by today's artist but completely ignore how much those same artists were influenced by those who came before them. I mean, how sensitive are people to anything artists do today that sounds remotely "West Coast" while nearly all of these people I can bet didn't know shit about the musical history that these 90's artists were borrowing from. How many of these "classic" West Coast joints didn't recycle elements from songs made by Stevie Wonder, Leon Haywood, The Ohio Players, Issac Hayes, George Clinton and Parliament Funkadelic, Roger Troutman, or any number of great artists and producers from prior decades? Shit. I can remember people seriously saying that Britney Spears' cover of "My Perogative" was ripping off Dogg Pound's "Gangsta Perogative". Most of today's shit ain't any more borrowed than the hit records from the 90's.
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Mack 10 repped the West harder and better than you could rep it in the 90's. He came in with Cube and immediately made his presence felt. Tracks/video's like "Westside Slaughterhouse" and "West Up" are some of the greatest West Coast battle anthems of all-time. And topping it all was "Bow Down" at the hieght of the East/West beef in 96. Mack 10 was still going strong even as the West was fading from the spotlight... in 98' he came with "Only In California" uniting the Coast with him and Snoop on a certified banger. His own label was up and running and he was promoting and selling West Coast artists like MC Eiht, doing his thing...
...and then he sold out after the 90's and went down South to Cash Money. His music became complete garbage and he lost all of his integrity he'd build over the years.
I agree
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lmfao thats not a "daz" influence its a westcoast influence i can agree with but daz aint the first person to use a moog synth and neither were dre or warren or quik. manny is quick to give dre his props though as an inspiration...
shit when i think of the moog synth i think of the beach boys more then anything...maybe the beachboys are the true founders of g funk?
and lets be real what would daz beats back then have sounded like if dudes like dre quik soopafly and barney rubble and all them dudes didnt touch em? i
But that's kind of the funny part about a lot of West Coast fans. They'll whine all day about how their favorite artists are being "robbed" by today's artist but completely ignore how much those same artists were influenced by those who came before them. I mean, how sensitive are people to anything artists do today that sounds remotely "West Coast" while nearly all of these people I can bet didn't know shit about the musical history that these 90's artists were borrowing from. How many of these "classic" West Coast joints didn't recycle elements from songs made by Stevie Wonder, Leon Haywood, The Ohio Players, Issac Hayes, George Clinton and Parliament Funkadelic, Roger Troutman, or any number of great artists and producers from prior decades? Shit. I can remember people seriously saying that Britney Spears' cover of "My Perogative" was ripping off Dogg Pound's "Gangsta Perogative". Most of today's shit ain't any more borrowed than the hit records from the 90's.
True. All the elements we associate with the west coast sound were taken from earlier artists not from the west coast.