West Coast Connection Forum
DUBCC - Tha Connection => Outbound Connection => Topic started by: TraceOneInfinite Flat Earther 96' on October 10, 2016, 08:11:46 PM
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So I did the thread best rappers to not have a classic album, now I'm doing worst rappers who were lucky and happened to register a classic. I will start it off with the most obvious...
50 Cent- Get Rich Or Die Trying - This album was a monster when it was released and Em and Dre were on a huge winning streak at the time and they put a battery in 50's back that couldn't fail. The Ja beef was great entertainment and I remember Nas saying in an interview not too long ago that that album was the last time he felt hiphop was "alive" and I agree with him. The album marked the last great era of rap.
Game - the documentary
I feel like game got better as a rapper over the years, but id still consider his rapping average. Still got classics, mainly thanks to dre.
Agreed. This album was a success for many of the same reasons that the 50 Cent's first Aftermath release was a success.
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Snoop Doggy Dogg~Doggystyle
This album is un-fuckwidable from intro to outro... He hasn't made 1 track since that album that could top any song on that album.
Doggystyle is in my top 5 hip hop albums. Any of his others aren't in my top 50 hip hop albums.
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T.I. or Jeezy
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Jay-Z with reasonable doubt
Always though jay was an average rapper, but that albums a classic
Master P with the ghettos tryna kill me
Great businessman but was never a good rapper .. Still had some classics when he was doin his thing in the bay
DMX with flesh of my flesh
X got unmatched charisma and personality on the mic, but as far as a straight rapper, he was never amongst the best
Mack 10 - self titled
Mack 10 not a bad rapper, but not a great one neither .. Production carried him in his early days tho and he had classic work
Game - the documentary
I feel like game got better as a rapper over the years, but id still consider his rapping average. Still got classics, mainly thanks to dre.
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Snoop Doggy Dogg~Doggystyle
This album is un-fuckwidable from intro to outro... He hasn't made 1 track since that album that could top any song on that album.
Doggystyle is in my top 5 hip hop albums. Any of his others aren't in my top 50 hip hop albums.
You said he hasn't made one song since then that could top any song on that album? I think you are forgetting Snoop never failed in his career up until the Doggfather album was released. Anything before Doggfather with Snoop's name on it was fire.
"21 Jumpstreet" with Tray Dee and "Whose Got Some Gangsta Shit" with Dogg Pound and LBC Crew were both up to Doggystyle standard, along with "Smooth" on the Dogg Pound album, and "2 of America's Most Wanted" with Pac.
Maybe you say those aren't solo tracks, but still if you take that, along with his work on the Chronic, and other solid albums like Top Dogg, Last Meal, and the first Eastsidaz album—there's no way you can't say he's not one of the all-time greats.
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Jay-Z with any album ....even though he possesses the necessary skills I very rarely hear them being put on audio ''display''. Always thought he was very mediocre and I feel like a lot of people are praising him just because their favourite rappers said he was good.
Surprised noone has mentioned Kanye yet? A very hit and miss rapper to me (mainly miss), but his college era albums were classic, no doubt
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Snoop Doggy Dogg~Doggystyle
This album is un-fuckwidable from intro to outro... He hasn't made 1 track since that album that could top any song on that album.
Doggystyle is in my top 5 hip hop albums. Any of his others aren't in my top 50 hip hop albums.
Snoop is very skilled as a rapper. Although he failed time and again to live up to expectations due to his incredible debut album, there's no way you can say he's the worst rapper to have a classic album.
TI is also very skilled from a technical and lyrical standpoint, far from the worst.
I think Master P is very likely to be the worst rapper with at least a defining classic under his belt, the type of album where the term classic isn't used because of the sheer quality of the project but moreso because of the impact it had on the game when it came out : Ice Cream Man & Ghetto D.
I really don't see anyone as bad as Master P with a classic album.
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Snoop Doggy Dogg~Doggystyle
This album is un-fuckwidable from intro to outro... He hasn't made 1 track since that album that could top any song on that album.
Doggystyle is in my top 5 hip hop albums. Any of his others aren't in my top 50 hip hop albums.
Snoop is very skilled as a rapper. Although he failed time and again to live up to expectations due to his incredible debut album, there's no way you can say he's the worst rapper to have a classic album.
TI is also very skilled from a technical and lyrical standpoint, far from the worst.
I think Master P is very likely to be the worst rapper with at least a defining classic under his belt, the type of album where the term classic isn't used because of the sheer quality of the project but moreso because of the impact it had on the game when it came out : Ice Cream Man & Ghetto D.
I really don't see anyone as bad as Master P with a classic album.
yeah actually I would put P as worse than T.I. or Jeezy technically lol but P has more than one classic album under his belt where as the others I named only have one
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that's a conservative figure, that's why I said at least... P may have more than 2 classic albums but in terms of game changers with a huge impact I'd say Ice Cream Man & Ghetto D are the real classics in his discography.
you're probably right about TI and Jeezy. I'd say Thug Motivation 101 is a very important album in hip hop.
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that's a conservative figure, that's why I said at least... P may have more than 2 classic albums but in terms of game changers with a huge impact I'd say Ice Cream Man & Ghetto D are the real classics in his discography.
you're probably right about TI and Jeezy. I'd say Thug Motivation 101 is a very important album in hip hop.
agreed on those P joints... and yeah TM101 is monumental, Trap Muzik is a classic too but definitely nowhere near the scope of Jeezy's musically and how much impact it made
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DMX with flesh of my flesh
X got unmatched charisma and personality on the mic, but as far as a straight rapper, he was never amongst the best
that album over It's Dark & Hell Is Hot?
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DMX with flesh of my flesh
X got unmatched charisma and personality on the mic, but as far as a straight rapper, he was never amongst the best
that album over It's Dark & Hell Is Hot?
I actually think they both on the same level, but I jus named one classic from each rapper
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Talib Kweli - Reflection Eternal
This one was definitely a classic and had a profound effect on my life. Hi Tek was doing stellar work behind the boards bringing the tracks to life and it came out as Rawkus was really making noise with that underground/backpacker scene which was kind of killed by the digital media era that followed.
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The fact that Game & Dmx is on the list... why not add pac, nas or eazy there to.
I hope you are trolling.
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The fact that Game & Dmx is on the list... why not add pac, nas or eazy there to.
I hope you are trolling.
Are you really suggesting that Game and DMX are on the level of Pac and Nas?
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Neither TIcor Jeezy have classic albums
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The fact that Game & Dmx is on the list... why not add pac, nas or eazy there to.
I hope you are trolling.
Are you really suggesting that Game and DMX are on the level of Pac and Nas?
Ofc look at x albums.. he was nr 1 every fuckin time, and made more classic albuns than Nas or Pac.
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surprised that Dre hasn't been mentioned
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I think Dre get's a pass. He's a producer. But with that said, Kanye too also is pretty bad, but has classics under his belt. Jay-Z might be the answer. Blueprint was WAY better than it had any business being, and Reasonable Doubt, I personally took it off my classics list, but I'd be lying to say it's not a 5 mic album and was way better than Jay-Z himself. Eazy E also has one classic album, and he's pretty bad, but you can see how he has one with that voice and Ren, DOC and Cube writing the whole album with Dre beats. That's a lot of support, and it was worth it.
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The fact that Game & Dmx is on the list... why not add pac, nas or eazy there too.
Now that you mentioned it - Eazy-E should really be on this list indeed
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I wouldn't qualify dudes who had ghostwriters for the majority of an album to make a list like this, saying Dr. Dre or Eazy is basically saying DOC, Cube, etc. lol
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The fact that Game & Dmx is on the list... why not add pac, nas or eazy there to.
I hope you are trolling.
Are you really suggesting that Game and DMX are on the level of Pac and Nas?
Ofc look at x albums.. he was nr 1 every fuckin time, and made more classic albuns than Nas or Pac.
Game technically would out-rap 2Pac and DMX with 'bars' but that doesn't mean he puts together better overall songs/projects than them, but he's paid enough dues and released enough quality in his career thus far to be mentioned in the same bracket as them... don't know what Nas' freestyle game is like these days but I still wouldn't say Game would out-rap him lol
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I wouldn't qualify dudes who had ghostwriters for the majority of an album to make a list like this, saying Dr. Dre or Eazy is basically saying DOC, Cube, etc. lol
I think the difference though is Eazy was pretty clumsy when rapping. It didn't matter who wrote it, Eazy was not a good rapper at all. He was a gimmick, and Cube, Ren and DOC wrote way better stuff for themselves. They gave Eazy what he could handle.
The fact that Game & Dmx is on the list... why not add pac, nas or eazy there to.
I hope you are trolling.
Are you really suggesting that Game and DMX are on the level of Pac and Nas?
Ofc look at x albums.. he was nr 1 every fuckin time, and made more classic albuns than Nas or Pac.
Game technically would out-rap 2Pac and DMX with 'bars' but that doesn't mean he puts together better overall songs/projects than them, but he's paid enough dues and released enough quality in his career thus far to be mentioned in the same bracket as them... don't know what Nas' freestyle game is like these days but I still wouldn't say Game would out-rap him lol
Game had bars, but he would not out rap 2Pac bar for bar. 2Pac bar for bar was as good as many rappers.
Allow me to introduce first: Makaveli the Don
Hysterical, spiritual lyrics like The Holy Qur'an
Niggas get shook like 5-0
My .45 is next to me when we ride, for survival
Money-making plans, pistol close at hand, swollen pockets
Let me introduce the topic, then we drop it
Expose snakes ‘cause they breed freely
See me ride! Located worldwide like the art of graffiti
I think I'm tougher than Nitti, my attitude is shitty
Born on a dope fiend's titty
With all this extra stressin'
The question I wonder is after death, after my last breath
When will I finally get to rest through this oppression?
They punish the people that's askin' questions. And those that possess steal from the ones without possessions
The message I stress: to make it stop, study your lessons
Don't settle for less, even the genius asks his questions
Be grateful for blessings, don't ever change, keep your essence
The power is in the people and politics we address
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I wouldn't qualify dudes who had ghostwriters for the majority of an album to make a list like this, saying Dr. Dre or Eazy is basically saying DOC, Cube, etc. lol
I think the difference though is Eazy was pretty clumsy when rapping. It didn't matter who wrote it, Eazy was not a good rapper at all. He was a gimmick, and Cube, Ren and DOC wrote way better stuff for themselves. They gave Eazy what he could handle.
The fact that Game & Dmx is on the list... why not add pac, nas or eazy there to.
I hope you are trolling.
Are you really suggesting that Game and DMX are on the level of Pac and Nas?
Ofc look at x albums.. he was nr 1 every fuckin time, and made more classic albuns than Nas or Pac.
Game technically would out-rap 2Pac and DMX with 'bars' but that doesn't mean he puts together better overall songs/projects than them, but he's paid enough dues and released enough quality in his career thus far to be mentioned in the same bracket as them... don't know what Nas' freestyle game is like these days but I still wouldn't say Game would out-rap him lol
Game had bars, but he would not out rap 2Pac bar for bar. 2Pac bar for bar was as good as many rappers.
Allow me to introduce first: Makaveli the Don
Hysterical, spiritual lyrics like The Holy Qur'an
Niggas get shook like 5-0
My .45 is next to me when we ride, for survival
Money-making plans, pistol close at hand, swollen pockets
Let me introduce the topic, then we drop it
Expose snakes ‘cause they breed freely
See me ride! Located worldwide like the art of graffiti
I think I'm tougher than Nitti, my attitude is shitty
Born on a dope fiend's titty
With all this extra stressin'
The question I wonder is after death, after my last breath
When will I finally get to rest through this oppression?
They punish the people that's askin' questions. And those that possess steal from the ones without possessions
The message I stress: to make it stop, study your lessons
Don't settle for less, even the genius asks his questions
Be grateful for blessings, don't ever change, keep your essence
The power is in the people and politics we address
2Pac is the GOAT to me and my personal favorite artist, but I still think Game would out-do him if it came down to a live cypher or a battle, but I do agree with what you're saying since most tend to have the misconception that 2Pac was just average as an MC who simply had a greater work ethic
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The fact that Game & Dmx is on the list... why not add pac, nas or eazy there to.
I hope you are trolling.
Cuz they are all leaps and bounds above game and DMX .. Eazy had ghostwriters, but his ghostwriters wrote better shit for him than what we heard from game or DMX .. To top that off, his voice and charisma are unmatched .. And did u seriously just say Nas and 2pac? Both considered top 5 rappers by the general consensus .. And u have the nerve to claim some1 else trollin? Smh
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I wouldn't qualify dudes who had ghostwriters for the majority of an album to make a list like this, saying Dr. Dre or Eazy is basically saying DOC, Cube, etc. lol
I think the difference though is Eazy was pretty clumsy when rapping. It didn't matter who wrote it, Eazy was not a good rapper at all. He was a gimmick, and Cube, Ren and DOC wrote way better stuff for themselves. They gave Eazy what he could handle.
The fact that Game & Dmx is on the list... why not add pac, nas or eazy there to.
I hope you are trolling.
Are you really suggesting that Game and DMX are on the level of Pac and Nas?
Ofc look at x albums.. he was nr 1 every fuckin time, and made more classic albuns than Nas or Pac.
Game technically would out-rap 2Pac and DMX with 'bars' but that doesn't mean he puts together better overall songs/projects than them, but he's paid enough dues and released enough quality in his career thus far to be mentioned in the same bracket as them... don't know what Nas' freestyle game is like these days but I still wouldn't say Game would out-rap him lol
Game had bars, but he would not out rap 2Pac bar for bar. 2Pac bar for bar was as good as many rappers.
Allow me to introduce first: Makaveli the Don
Hysterical, spiritual lyrics like The Holy Qur'an
Niggas get shook like 5-0
My .45 is next to me when we ride, for survival
Money-making plans, pistol close at hand, swollen pockets
Let me introduce the topic, then we drop it
Expose snakes ‘cause they breed freely
See me ride! Located worldwide like the art of graffiti
I think I'm tougher than Nitti, my attitude is shitty
Born on a dope fiend's titty
With all this extra stressin'
The question I wonder is after death, after my last breath
When will I finally get to rest through this oppression?
They punish the people that's askin' questions. And those that possess steal from the ones without possessions
The message I stress: to make it stop, study your lessons
Don't settle for less, even the genius asks his questions
Be grateful for blessings, don't ever change, keep your essence
The power is in the people and politics we address
2Pac is the GOAT to me and my personal favorite artist, but I still think Game would out-do him if it came down to a live cypher or a battle, but I do agree with what you're saying since most tend to have the misconception that 2Pac was just average as an MC who simply had a greater work ethic
2pac would shit on game .. Put hit me up against that new meek mill
diss n get back to me. Game is like a gimmick rapper, and the gimmick is pretty good .. But pac is the real deal.
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I think the difference though is Eazy was pretty clumsy when rapping. It didn't matter who wrote it, Eazy was not a good rapper at all. He was a gimmick, and Cube, Ren and DOC wrote way better stuff for themselves. They gave Eazy what he could handle.
Game had bars, but he would not out rap 2Pac bar for bar. 2Pac bar for bar was as good as many rappers.
Allow me to introduce first: Makaveli the Don
Hysterical, spiritual lyrics like The Holy Qur'an
Niggas get shook like 5-0
My .45 is next to me when we ride, for survival
Money-making plans, pistol close at hand, swollen pockets
Let me introduce the topic, then we drop it
Expose snakes ‘cause they breed freely
See me ride! Located worldwide like the art of graffiti
I think I'm tougher than Nitti, my attitude is shitty
Born on a dope fiend's titty
Yeah.. Eazy's a good name for the list.....
And I'm with you on Pac. I mean really this whole "BARS" thing is wayy over-rated. I mean multi's and metaphors are great but just cause you can rap some shit like "I'm gonna treat the shell-casings like a soccer-ball and kick the ballistics"... I think it is far superior when you can spit some real ass shit like Pac and every fuckin word your spittin is hella biographical, I mean for one most rappers could never live a life that extraordinary, and then #2 if they did live such a life they would never be able to have the range and depth that Pac did that's why no rapper can fuck with Pac on any level. When Pac uses metaphor/simile he's spitting real shit like "I'm like a fiend who finally sees when all the dope is gone".
I mean just peep this verse from "Picture Me Rollin". Notice the lyrical depth he is spitting and the fact that EVERYTHING HE'S SPITTIN IS ACTUALLY FACTUAL! He really did have a benz, he really was under surveillance, he really did have enemies out to take his life, he really was under watch like a drug dealer yet he wasn't selling, he really had been in prison, had homies who were inmates or dead and gone, he really was paranoid and shit like that, he really was an attic "fiend" but tried to maintain and be positive thru it all...and then through it all he has the lyrical range and depth to break out in prayer and call out to his Mom from the storm.... and today we still can close our eyez and Picture Pac Rollin!!
Picture me rollin in my 500 Benz
I got no love for these niggaz, there's no need to be friends
They got me under surveillance, that's what somebody be tellin
Know there's dope bein sold, but +I+ ain't the one sellin!
Don't want to be another number
I got a fuckin gang of weed to keep from goin under
The federales wanna see me dead - niggaz put prices on my head
Now I got two Rottwillers by me bed, I feed em lead
Now I'm released, how will I live? Will God forgive me
for all the dirt a nigga did, to feed kids?
One life to live, it's so hard to be positive
when niggaz shootin at your crib
Mama, I'm still thuggin, the world is a war zone
My homies is inmates, and most of them dead wrong
Full grown, finally a man, just scheamin on ways
to put some green inside the palms of my empty hands
Just picture me rollin
Flossin a Benz on rims that isn't stolen
My dreams is censored, my hopes are gone
I'm like a fiend that finally sees when all the dope is gone
My nerves is wrecked, heart beatin and my hands is swollen
thinkin of the G's I'll be holdin, picture me rollin
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Pac and DMX wack? What the fuck y'all smokin' on?
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DMX is not a bad rapper. Kanye West's first albums were good, even his rhymes were good back in the day. 2Pac shouldn't even be mentioned in this thread. Snoop made 1 classic album & multiple good albums.
Here are some perfect examples (imo):
Tim Dog - penicillin on wax
Tim Dog is really not a good rapper, but still he is very entertaining, both beeing hardcore & funny (because sometimes he overdoes his hardcore act). You either hate or love this album / Tim Dog, but I think it can still be considered as a classic.
Daz Dillinger
1 classic album (his first) and later on a lot of garbage with easy lyrics & topics
Mystikal
I don't have any albums from him, so I can't judge if he made something classic or not. But he is a bad rapper.
There must be more. Interesting topic btw!
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So, just looking at things, I think the top 3 have to be in order, Eazy, Dre, and Kanye. But all three did use ghostwriters on their classic albums, Eazy with Ren, Cube, and DOC, Dre with DOC, and Kanye with Rhymefest and Consequence (though Kanye did write some by himself too). So with that said, Dre and Kanye did produce their whole albums, so producers get a pass. So with that said, it's got to be Eazy.
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Pac and DMX wack? What the fuck y'all smokin' on?
DMX is not whack, but he's an average rapper
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So, just looking at things, I think the top 3 have to be in order, Eazy, Dre, and Kanye. But all three did use ghostwriters on their classic albums, Eazy with Ren, Cube, and DOC, Dre with DOC, and Kanye with Rhymefest and Consequence (though Kanye did write some by himself too). So with that said, Dre and Kanye did produce their whole albums, so producers get a pass. So with that said, it's got to be Eazy.
Eazy was a good rapper tho .. His voice and charisma is unmatched, and ghostwritten or not, he spit some dope rhymes with excellent storytelling .. Listen to a track like nobody moves or louisville slugger .. The notion that he was a bad rapper come from the fact that he didn't write, but that, in reality, doesn't make him a bad rapper .. I actually rather listen to eazy spit mc ren rhymes than to hear it from mc ren himself.. Legend
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So, just looking at things, I think the top 3 have to be in order, Eazy, Dre, and Kanye. But all three did use ghostwriters on their classic albums, Eazy with Ren, Cube, and DOC, Dre with DOC, and Kanye with Rhymefest and Consequence (though Kanye did write some by himself too). So with that said, Dre and Kanye did produce their whole albums, so producers get a pass. So with that said, it's got to be Eazy.
nah Master P definitely takes the crown in this discussion lol
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I wouldn't qualify dudes who had ghostwriters for the majority of an album to make a list like this, saying Dr. Dre or Eazy is basically saying DOC, Cube, etc. lol
I think the difference though is Eazy was pretty clumsy when rapping. It didn't matter who wrote it, Eazy was not a good rapper at all. He was a gimmick, and Cube, Ren and DOC wrote way better stuff for themselves. They gave Eazy what he could handle.
The fact that Game & Dmx is on the list... why not add pac, nas or eazy there to.
I hope you are trolling.
Are you really suggesting that Game and DMX are on the level of Pac and Nas?
Ofc look at x albums.. he was nr 1 every fuckin time, and made more classic albuns than Nas or Pac.
Game technically would out-rap 2Pac and DMX with 'bars' but that doesn't mean he puts together better overall songs/projects than them, but he's paid enough dues and released enough quality in his career thus far to be mentioned in the same bracket as them... don't know what Nas' freestyle game is like these days but I still wouldn't say Game would out-rap him lol
Game had bars, but he would not out rap 2Pac bar for bar. 2Pac bar for bar was as good as many rappers.
Allow me to introduce first: Makaveli the Don
Hysterical, spiritual lyrics like The Holy Qur'an
Niggas get shook like 5-0
My .45 is next to me when we ride, for survival
Money-making plans, pistol close at hand, swollen pockets
Let me introduce the topic, then we drop it
Expose snakes ‘cause they breed freely
See me ride! Located worldwide like the art of graffiti
I think I'm tougher than Nitti, my attitude is shitty
Born on a dope fiend's titty
With all this extra stressin'
The question I wonder is after death, after my last breath
When will I finally get to rest through this oppression?
They punish the people that's askin' questions. And those that possess steal from the ones without possessions
The message I stress: to make it stop, study your lessons
Don't settle for less, even the genius asks his questions
Be grateful for blessings, don't ever change, keep your essence
The power is in the people and politics we address
2Pac is the GOAT to me and my personal favorite artist, but I still think Game would out-do him if it came down to a live cypher or a battle, but I do agree with what you're saying since most tend to have the misconception that 2Pac was just average as an MC who simply had a greater work ethic
2pac would shit on game .. Put hit me up against that new meek mill
diss n get back to me. Game is like a gimmick rapper, and the gimmick is pretty good .. But pac is the real deal.
Game's had more diss lines that were harder and more direct but "Hit Em Up" is still the best diss track from the intensity alone and the barriers it broke as far as battle raps
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I wouldn't qualify dudes who had ghostwriters for the majority of an album to make a list like this, saying Dr. Dre or Eazy is basically saying DOC, Cube, etc. lol
I think the difference though is Eazy was pretty clumsy when rapping. It didn't matter who wrote it, Eazy was not a good rapper at all. He was a gimmick, and Cube, Ren and DOC wrote way better stuff for themselves. They gave Eazy what he could handle.
The fact that Game & Dmx is on the list... why not add pac, nas or eazy there to.
I hope you are trolling.
Are you really suggesting that Game and DMX are on the level of Pac and Nas?
Ofc look at x albums.. he was nr 1 every fuckin time, and made more classic albuns than Nas or Pac.
Game technically would out-rap 2Pac and DMX with 'bars' but that doesn't mean he puts together better overall songs/projects than them, but he's paid enough dues and released enough quality in his career thus far to be mentioned in the same bracket as them... don't know what Nas' freestyle game is like these days but I still wouldn't say Game would out-rap him lol
Game had bars, but he would not out rap 2Pac bar for bar. 2Pac bar for bar was as good as many rappers.
Allow me to introduce first: Makaveli the Don
Hysterical, spiritual lyrics like The Holy Qur'an
Niggas get shook like 5-0
My .45 is next to me when we ride, for survival
Money-making plans, pistol close at hand, swollen pockets
Let me introduce the topic, then we drop it
Expose snakes ‘cause they breed freely
See me ride! Located worldwide like the art of graffiti
I think I'm tougher than Nitti, my attitude is shitty
Born on a dope fiend's titty
With all this extra stressin'
The question I wonder is after death, after my last breath
When will I finally get to rest through this oppression?
They punish the people that's askin' questions. And those that possess steal from the ones without possessions
The message I stress: to make it stop, study your lessons
Don't settle for less, even the genius asks his questions
Be grateful for blessings, don't ever change, keep your essence
The power is in the people and politics we address
2Pac is the GOAT to me and my personal favorite artist, but I still think Game would out-do him if it came down to a live cypher or a battle, but I do agree with what you're saying since most tend to have the misconception that 2Pac was just average as an MC who simply had a greater work ethic
2pac would shit on game .. Put hit me up against that new meek mill
diss n get back to me. Game is like a gimmick rapper, and the gimmick is pretty good .. But pac is the real deal.
Game's had more diss lines that were harder and more direct but "Hit Em Up" is still the best diss track from the intensity alone and the barriers it broke as far as battle raps
AND THATS WHY PAC WOULD KILL HIM .. RAW ENERGY OVER BARS, ALL DAY
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First off, I can't think of one single Master P classic album, and on top of that looking back everyone thought he was wack and no one have him 5 mics or a XXL. So he don't count to me.
'Pac had bars and raw emotion. Please, plus he had so many diss songs it was unreal. Dude would eat Game and Game would tell you that too.
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First off, I can't think of one single Master P classic album, and on top of that looking back everyone thought he was wack and no one have him 5 mics or a XXL. So he don't count to me.
'Pac had bars and raw emotion. Please, plus he had so many diss songs it was unreal. Dude would eat Game and Game would tell you that too.
Ghetto tryna kill me and ice cream man
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First off, I can't think of one single Master P classic album, and on top of that looking back everyone thought he was wack and no one have him 5 mics or a XXL. So he don't count to me.
'Pac had bars and raw emotion. Please, plus he had so many diss songs it was unreal. Dude would eat Game and Game would tell you that too.
I'm willing to bet there's a few albums you think are classics that didn't get 5 Mics or a XXL
and of course Game would admit that, but while on that topic Game probably has the same amount if not more disses than 2Pac considering he had entire mixtapes dedicated to G-Unit lol
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How DMX is wack?? :o :o
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First off, I can't think of one single Master P classic album, and on top of that looking back everyone thought he was wack and no one have him 5 mics or a XXL. So he don't count to me.
'Pac had bars and raw emotion. Please, plus he had so many diss songs it was unreal. Dude would eat Game and Game would tell you that too.
Ghetto tryna kill me and ice cream man
Ice Cream Man was 4 mics, and that's a good rating for it. Bout It, Bout It was alright, and it set the foundation for a good 4 year No Limit run. But it wasn't a classic. I've never seen any Master P album on CREDIBLE hip-hop reviewers classic list. Putting any Master P album in any classic list really waters down the label classic, especially if no credible hip-hop journalist has any of his albums on any classics list.
With that said, that The Ghettos Tryin to Kill Me album cover, that has always been a personal classic since I was 16. LOL. I was trying to look at her too.
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I'm not tryin' to start beef with anyone BUT MASTER P WTF... His name and classic just don't go together not one of his albums are classic. NO LIMIT RECORDS doesn't even have a classic album out of the hundred or so they dropped. Ghetto D and Top Dogg were the closest by there standard....
Yeah JAY-Z Reasonable Doubt Album is in my top 10 it's str8 flames from intro to outro. Jay Z isn't in my top 100 MC's.... BUT OH BOY DOES HE GO OFF ON THAT....
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also consider pac didn't have the opportunity to evolve to his fullest like a 36 year old game btw he will be 37 next month
pac died at a young 25 years old
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First off, I can't think of one single Master P classic album, and on top of that looking back everyone thought he was wack and no one have him 5 mics or a XXL. So he don't count to me.
'Pac had bars and raw emotion. Please, plus he had so many diss songs it was unreal. Dude would eat Game and Game would tell you that too.
Ghetto tryna kill me and ice cream man
Ice Cream Man was 4 mics, and that's a good rating for it. Bout It, Bout It was alright, and it set the foundation for a good 4 year No Limit run. But it wasn't a classic. I've never seen any Master P album on CREDIBLE hip-hop reviewers classic list. Putting any Master P album in any classic list really waters down the label classic, especially if no credible hip-hop journalist has any of his albums on any classics list.
With that said, that The Ghettos Tryin to Kill Me album cover, that has always been a personal classic since I was 16. LOL. I was trying to look at her too.
Your average hip-hop reviewer is an east coast dick rider who doesn't even recognize the bay as a region
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I'm not tryin' to start beef with anyone BUT MASTER P WTF... His name and classic just don't go together not one of his albums are classic. NO LIMIT RECORDS doesn't even have a classic album out of the hundred or so they dropped. Ghetto D and Top Dogg were the closest by there standard....
Yeah JAY-Z Reasonable Doubt Album is in my top 10 it's str8 flames from intro to outro. Jay Z isn't in my top 100 MC's.... BUT OH BOY DOES HE GO OFF ON THAT....
What about celly cel and the jacka.. U like any of their albums?
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First off, I can't think of one single Master P classic album, and on top of that looking back everyone thought he was wack and no one have him 5 mics or a XXL. So he don't count to me.
'Pac had bars and raw emotion. Please, plus he had so many diss songs it was unreal. Dude would eat Game and Game would tell you that too.
Ghetto tryna kill me and ice cream man
Ice Cream Man was 4 mics, and that's a good rating for it. Bout It, Bout It was alright, and it set the foundation for a good 4 year No Limit run. But it wasn't a classic. I've never seen any Master P album on CREDIBLE hip-hop reviewers classic list. Putting any Master P album in any classic list really waters down the label classic, especially if no credible hip-hop journalist has any of his albums on any classics list.
With that said, that The Ghettos Tryin to Kill Me album cover, that has always been a personal classic since I was 16. LOL. I was trying to look at her too.
Your average hip-hop reviewer is an east coast dick rider who doesn't even recognize the bay as a region
100%
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Eazy was a good rapper tho .. His voice and charisma is unmatched, and ghostwritten or not, he spit some dope rhymes with excellent storytelling .. Listen to a track like nobody moves or louisville slugger .. The notion that he was a bad rapper come from the fact that he didn't write, but that, in reality, doesn't make him a bad rapper .. I actually rather listen to eazy spit mc ren rhymes than to hear it from mc ren himself.. Legend
Good point, Eazy is a legend, but I still think I'd keep him on the list just because a rapper like that needed a lot of support on his classic album. He needed Dre behind the boards and he needed a lot of guest appearances, skits, etc. to sort of camoflauge the fact that he wasn't a great M.C. Your right that when you factor in charisma and style and all that then it becomes a lot harder to say Eazy wasn't a great rapper.
If you compare Eazys classic to Eminem SSLP or Nas Illmatic or PAC Me Against the World or Ras Soul On Ice. Then you see the difference cause those albums didn't need a lot of help--their lyricism and mic skills were capable of carrying the full album from beginning to end.
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Eazy was a good rapper tho .. His voice and charisma is unmatched, and ghostwritten or not, he spit some dope rhymes with excellent storytelling .. Listen to a track like nobody moves or louisville slugger .. The notion that he was a bad rapper come from the fact that he didn't write, but that, in reality, doesn't make him a bad rapper .. I actually rather listen to eazy spit mc ren rhymes than to hear it from mc ren himself.. Legend
Good point, Eazy is a legend, but I still think I'd keep him on the list just because a rapper like that needed a lot of support on his classic album. He needed Dre behind the boards and he needed a lot of guest appearances, skits, etc. to sort of camoflauge the fact that he wasn't a great M.C. Your right that when you factor in charisma and style and all that then it becomes a lot harder to say Eazy wasn't a great rapper.
If you compare Eazys classic to Eminem SSLP or Nas Illmatic or PAC Me Against the World or Ras Soul On Ice. Then you see the difference cause those albums didn't need a lot of help--their lyricism and mic skills were capable of carrying the full album from beginning to end.
EAZY HAD A CLASSIC EVEN AFTER LEAVIN DRE'S CORNER THO .. AND HIS RAPPING ISNT ON THE LEVEL OF PAC OR NAS, BUT ITS DEFINITELY NOT AS LOW AS THE MASTER P'S AND 50 CENT'S ON THE LIST.
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Eazy was a good rapper tho .. His voice and charisma is unmatched, and ghostwritten or not, he spit some dope rhymes with excellent storytelling .. Listen to a track like nobody moves or louisville slugger .. The notion that he was a bad rapper come from the fact that he didn't write, but that, in reality, doesn't make him a bad rapper .. I actually rather listen to eazy spit mc ren rhymes than to hear it from mc ren himself.. Legend
Good point, Eazy is a legend, but I still think I'd keep him on the list just because a rapper like that needed a lot of support on his classic album. He needed Dre behind the boards and he needed a lot of guest appearances, skits, etc. to sort of camoflauge the fact that he wasn't a great M.C. Your right that when you factor in charisma and style and all that then it becomes a lot harder to say Eazy wasn't a great rapper.
If you compare Eazys classic to Eminem SSLP or Nas Illmatic or PAC Me Against the World or Ras Soul On Ice. Then you see the difference cause those albums didn't need a lot of help--their lyricism and mic skills were capable of carrying the full album from beginning to end.
EAZY HAD A CLASSIC EVEN AFTER LEAVIN DRE'S CORNER THO .. AND HIS RAPPING ISNT ON THE LEVEL OF PAC OR NAS, BUT ITS DEFINITELY NOT AS LOW AS THE MASTER P'S AND 50 CENT'S ON THE LIST.
Str8 Off Tha Streetz > Eazy Duz It
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Eazy was a good rapper tho .. His voice and charisma is unmatched, and ghostwritten or not, he spit some dope rhymes with excellent storytelling .. Listen to a track like nobody moves or louisville slugger .. The notion that he was a bad rapper come from the fact that he didn't write, but that, in reality, doesn't make him a bad rapper .. I actually rather listen to eazy spit mc ren rhymes than to hear it from mc ren himself.. Legend
Good point, Eazy is a legend, but I still think I'd keep him on the list just because a rapper like that needed a lot of support on his classic album. He needed Dre behind the boards and he needed a lot of guest appearances, skits, etc. to sort of camoflauge the fact that he wasn't a great M.C. Your right that when you factor in charisma and style and all that then it becomes a lot harder to say Eazy wasn't a great rapper.
If you compare Eazys classic to Eminem SSLP or Nas Illmatic or PAC Me Against the World or Ras Soul On Ice. Then you see the difference cause those albums didn't need a lot of help--their lyricism and mic skills were capable of carrying the full album from beginning to end.
EAZY HAD A CLASSIC EVEN AFTER LEAVIN DRE'S CORNER THO .. AND HIS RAPPING ISNT ON THE LEVEL OF PAC OR NAS, BUT ITS DEFINITELY NOT AS LOW AS THE MASTER P'S AND 50 CENT'S ON THE LIST.
Str8 Off Tha Streetz > Eazy Duz It
I agree. I like "It's On (Dr. Dre) 187Um Killa" the most though.
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Chamillionaire - Ultimate Victory
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Chamillionaire - Ultimate Victory
can't front, I regret selling that album and Sound Of Revenge years back lol dude was underrated for sure
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Chamillionaire is the quintessential example of a good rapper who made whack music
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Chamillionaire is the quintessential example of a good rapper who made whack music
I actually think that Chamillionaire is one of the most versatile artists to ever do it and it's a shame he never got to drop his final album
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Chamillionaire is the quintessential example of a good rapper who made whack music
I actually think that Chamillionaire is one of the most versatile artists to ever do it and it's a shame he never got to drop his final album
He's supposed to come out with an album next year.
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Chamillionaire is the quintessential example of a good rapper who made whack music
nah his albums were dope but I wouldn't say classic, mixtapes he was spitting harder though
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First off, I can't think of one single Master P classic album, and on top of that looking back everyone thought he was wack and no one have him 5 mics or a XXL. So he don't count to me.
'Pac had bars and raw emotion. Please, plus he had so many diss songs it was unreal. Dude would eat Game and Game would tell you that too.
Ghetto tryna kill me and ice cream man
Ice Cream Man was 4 mics, and that's a good rating for it. Bout It, Bout It was alright, and it set the foundation for a good 4 year No Limit run. But it wasn't a classic. I've never seen any Master P album on CREDIBLE hip-hop reviewers classic list. Putting any Master P album in any classic list really waters down the label classic, especially if no credible hip-hop journalist has any of his albums on any classics list.
With that said, that The Ghettos Tryin to Kill Me album cover, that has always been a personal classic since I was 16. LOL. I was trying to look at her too.
Your average hip-hop reviewer is an east coast dick rider who doesn't even recognize the bay as a region
Master P is from New Orleans.
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Chamillionaire is the quintessential example of a good rapper who made whack music
But this take, this take is brilliant. Like I hear Chamillionaire and I know I'm suppose to like him because he's a good rapper, but man, most his album is pretty meh.
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First off, I can't think of one single Master P classic album, and on top of that looking back everyone thought he was wack and no one have him 5 mics or a XXL. So he don't count to me.
'Pac had bars and raw emotion. Please, plus he had so many diss songs it was unreal. Dude would eat Game and Game would tell you that too.
Ghetto tryna kill me and ice cream man
Ice Cream Man was 4 mics, and that's a good rating for it. Bout It, Bout It was alright, and it set the foundation for a good 4 year No Limit run. But it wasn't a classic. I've never seen any Master P album on CREDIBLE hip-hop reviewers classic list. Putting any Master P album in any classic list really waters down the label classic, especially if no credible hip-hop journalist has any of his albums on any classics list.
With that said, that The Ghettos Tryin to Kill Me album cover, that has always been a personal classic since I was 16. LOL. I was trying to look at her too.
Your average hip-hop reviewer is an east coast dick rider who doesn't even recognize the bay as a region
Master P is from New Orleans.
His early music was bay shit
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First off, I can't think of one single Master P classic album, and on top of that looking back everyone thought he was wack and no one have him 5 mics or a XXL. So he don't count to me.
'Pac had bars and raw emotion. Please, plus he had so many diss songs it was unreal. Dude would eat Game and Game would tell you that too.
Ghetto tryna kill me and ice cream man
Ice Cream Man was 4 mics, and that's a good rating for it. Bout It, Bout It was alright, and it set the foundation for a good 4 year No Limit run. But it wasn't a classic. I've never seen any Master P album on CREDIBLE hip-hop reviewers classic list. Putting any Master P album in any classic list really waters down the label classic, especially if no credible hip-hop journalist has any of his albums on any classics list.
With that said, that The Ghettos Tryin to Kill Me album cover, that has always been a personal classic since I was 16. LOL. I was trying to look at her too.
Your average hip-hop reviewer is an east coast dick rider who doesn't even recognize the bay as a region
Master P is from New Orleans.
His early music was bay shit
But Ice Cream Man was clearly a southern album
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First off, I can't think of one single Master P classic album, and on top of that looking back everyone thought he was wack and no one have him 5 mics or a XXL. So he don't count to me.
'Pac had bars and raw emotion. Please, plus he had so many diss songs it was unreal. Dude would eat Game and Game would tell you that too.
Ghetto tryna kill me and ice cream man
Ice Cream Man was 4 mics, and that's a good rating for it. Bout It, Bout It was alright, and it set the foundation for a good 4 year No Limit run. But it wasn't a classic. I've never seen any Master P album on CREDIBLE hip-hop reviewers classic list. Putting any Master P album in any classic list really waters down the label classic, especially if no credible hip-hop journalist has any of his albums on any classics list.
With that said, that The Ghettos Tryin to Kill Me album cover, that has always been a personal classic since I was 16. LOL. I was trying to look at her too.
Your average hip-hop reviewer is an east coast dick rider who doesn't even recognize the bay as a region
Master P is from New Orleans.
His early music was bay shit
But Ice Cream Man was clearly a southern album
It's a mix .. U familiar with K-Lou?
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First off, I can't think of one single Master P classic album, and on top of that looking back everyone thought he was wack and no one have him 5 mics or a XXL. So he don't count to me.
'Pac had bars and raw emotion. Please, plus he had so many diss songs it was unreal. Dude would eat Game and Game would tell you that too.
Ghetto tryna kill me and ice cream man
Ice Cream Man was 4 mics, and that's a good rating for it. Bout It, Bout It was alright, and it set the foundation for a good 4 year No Limit run. But it wasn't a classic. I've never seen any Master P album on CREDIBLE hip-hop reviewers classic list. Putting any Master P album in any classic list really waters down the label classic, especially if no credible hip-hop journalist has any of his albums on any classics list.
With that said, that The Ghettos Tryin to Kill Me album cover, that has always been a personal classic since I was 16. LOL. I was trying to look at her too.
Your average hip-hop reviewer is an east coast dick rider who doesn't even recognize the bay as a region
Master P is from New Orleans.
His early music was bay shit
But Ice Cream Man was clearly a southern album
It's a mix .. U familiar with K-Lou?
I saw his name in a couple of credits, but I can't really say I know who he is or what his signature sound is.
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First off, I can't think of one single Master P classic album, and on top of that looking back everyone thought he was wack and no one have him 5 mics or a XXL. So he don't count to me.
'Pac had bars and raw emotion. Please, plus he had so many diss songs it was unreal. Dude would eat Game and Game would tell you that too.
Ghetto tryna kill me and ice cream man
Ice Cream Man was 4 mics, and that's a good rating for it. Bout It, Bout It was alright, and it set the foundation for a good 4 year No Limit run. But it wasn't a classic. I've never seen any Master P album on CREDIBLE hip-hop reviewers classic list. Putting any Master P album in any classic list really waters down the label classic, especially if no credible hip-hop journalist has any of his albums on any classics list.
With that said, that The Ghettos Tryin to Kill Me album cover, that has always been a personal classic since I was 16. LOL. I was trying to look at her too.
Your average hip-hop reviewer is an east coast dick rider who doesn't even recognize the bay as a region
Master P is from New Orleans.
His early music was bay shit
But Ice Cream Man was clearly a southern album
no it's not, the first real southern album from Master P was Ghetto D, and even then it still a couple of bay sounding songs on it. Ice Cream Man was a mixture between songs recorded in the Bay where he reps Richmond, and songs recorded in the South as P gradually moved back to Louisiana.
Bay songs :
- Ice Cream Man (produced by K-Lou)
- Playa from around the way
- Selling Ice Cream (hence the chorus "Just another day selling Ice Cream in the Bay)
- Things Ain't What They Used to Be
- Time for a 187 (produced by DJ Daryl of 2pac fame)
- Half on a Bag of Dank ("cali got that good ass weed)
- How G's Ride (produced by K-Lou featuring Big Ed, quintessential bay sound)
- Watch Deez Hoez
South songs :
- Never-ending Game
- Ghetto Heroes
- Bout It Bout It II
- No More Tears
- Break 'Em Off Something'
- Time to check my crackhouse
- Back Up Off Me
- Bout That Drama
- Killer Pussy
and among these songs, many have a mixture of both sounds as south producers like KLC and Mo B. Dick stayed in Richmond with P and K-Lou and soaked up musical influences from there (and vice versa). Songs like Back Up off Me or Back Up Off Me have elements often used in g-funk / mobb music.
as for the Ghetto's Tryin' To Kill, it's a genuine, 100% bay area album. nothing but bay producers and features : JT The Bigga Figga, San Quinn, Lil Ric, K-Lou, EA Ski, etc.
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First off, I can't think of one single Master P classic album, and on top of that looking back everyone thought he was wack and no one have him 5 mics or a XXL. So he don't count to me.
'Pac had bars and raw emotion. Please, plus he had so many diss songs it was unreal. Dude would eat Game and Game would tell you that too.
Ghetto tryna kill me and ice cream man
Ice Cream Man was 4 mics, and that's a good rating for it. Bout It, Bout It was alright, and it set the foundation for a good 4 year No Limit run. But it wasn't a classic. I've never seen any Master P album on CREDIBLE hip-hop reviewers classic list. Putting any Master P album in any classic list really waters down the label classic, especially if no credible hip-hop journalist has any of his albums on any classics list.
With that said, that The Ghettos Tryin to Kill Me album cover, that has always been a personal classic since I was 16. LOL. I was trying to look at her too.
Your average hip-hop reviewer is an east coast dick rider who doesn't even recognize the bay as a region
Master P is from New Orleans.
His early music was bay shit
But Ice Cream Man was clearly a southern album
no it's not, the first real southern album from Master P was Ghetto D, and even then it still a couple of bay sounding songs on it. Ice Cream Man was a mixture between songs recorded in the Bay where he reps Richmond, and songs recorded in the South as P gradually moved back to Louisiana.
Bay songs :
- Ice Cream Man (produced by K-Lou)
- Playa from around the way
- Selling Ice Cream (hence the chorus "Just another day selling Ice Cream in the Bay)
- Things Ain't What They Used to Be
- Time for a 187 (produced by DJ Daryl of 2pac fame)
- Half on a Bag of Dank ("cali got that good ass weed)
- How G's Ride (produced by K-Lou featuring Big Ed, quintessential bay sound)
- Watch Deez Hoez
South songs :
- Never-ending Game
- Ghetto Heroes
- Bout It Bout It II
- No More Tears
- Break 'Em Off Something'
- Time to check my crackhouse
- Back Up Off Me
- Bout That Drama
- Killer Pussy
and among these songs, many have a mixture of both sounds as south producers like KLC and Mo B. Dick stayed in Richmond with P and K-Lou and soaked up musical influences from there (and vice versa). Songs like Back Up off Me or Back Up Off Me have elements often used in g-funk / mobb music.
as for the Ghetto's Tryin' To Kill, it's a genuine, 100% bay area album. nothing but bay producers and features : JT The Bigga Figga, San Quinn, Lil Ric, K-Lou, EA Ski, etc.
And yet, with all that said, I still ain't heard no one claim it's a classic. Ice Cream Man to me, when I heard it in the 90's, it was a southern album. Maybe because back then the south wasn't as big, and the sound wasn't as defined. But I personally wasn't feeling it, and no one else was feeling it in terms of calling it a classic. So clearly it wasn't a classic. Bottomline. Even if half the album was Bay influenced, it wasn't a classic. Bay Area or not, it wasn't a 5 mic album. The Ghetto Is Trying to Kill Me, not a classic. It was a regional album next to Lil' Half Dead's album at the Wherehouse, but no one I know was going, Pick up that new Master P, it's tight. It was only known because it was re-released and no one called it a classic.
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i wasn't discussing whether it's a classic or not. you said it was clearly a southern album, when it's a little more complicated than that. i simply explained why.
it's not a classic in the musical sense of the term, i.e. the word classic doesn't equate good in this case but it's a classic in the sense a "staple", a game changer. Ice Cream Man and Ghetto D. were the blueprint for successful independent albums and marked the shift from music trends dictated by music execs, a&r, and industry people to music dictated by street marketing tactics. it showed the industry that you could it yourself, not cater to any standard (musically, lyrically), be country and be successful.
in that sense, Ice Cream Man matches the original sense of the world "classic" : a reference, a go to album, a staple, irrespective of its intrinsic quality. and to this day Master P is still known as Mr Ice Cream Man, it's no coincidence. Ice Cream Man, despite being a half bay album (whose local scene always had ties with the South), is one of the most important albums from a historical standpoint. It launched No Limit onto a whole bigger sphere.
without Ice Cream Man, it's safe to say that No Limit wouldn't have evolved into the independent, self made and owned hit making machine that it later became by transitioning from a west coast sound to a south sound at the right time, especially since Ice Cream Man was a ground breaking album cause it changed the rules of the distribution deals between independent labels and majors.
so yeah, Ice Cream Man is a classic because its release marked a shift of power between independent labels and majors, and because its release resonated in the industry, maybe not in IE or San Bernardino, but in the South and the East. That's why you got Nas and Jay Z to jump on the No Limit Bandwagon when it's clear they didn't think much (to say the least) of No Limit's music (understandably so from their perspective). You don't have to be a 5 mic album to be a classic.
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i wasn't discussing whether it's a classic or not. you said it was clearly a southern album, when it's a little more complicated than that. i simply explained why.
it's not a classic in the musical sense of the term, i.e. the word classic doesn't equate good in this case but it's a classic in the sense a "staple", a game changer. Ice Cream Man and Ghetto D. were the blueprint for successful independent albums and marked the shift from music trends dictated by music execs, a&r, and industry people to music dictated by street marketing tactics. it showed the industry that you could it yourself, not cater to any standard (musically, lyrically), be country and be successful.
in that sense, Ice Cream Man matches the original sense of the world "classic" : a reference, a go to album, a staple, irrespective of its intrinsic quality. and to this day Master P is still known as Mr Ice Cream Man, it's no coincidence. Ice Cream Man, despite being a half bay album (whose local scene always had ties with the South), is one of the most important albums from a historical standpoint. It launched No Limit onto a whole bigger sphere.
without Ice Cream Man, it's safe to say that No Limit wouldn't have evolved into the independent, self made and owned hit making machine that it later became by transitioning from a west coast sound to a south sound at the right time, especially since Ice Cream Man was a ground breaking album cause it changed the rules of the distribution deals between independent labels and majors.
so yeah, Ice Cream Man is a classic because its release marked a shift of power between independent labels and majors, and because its release resonated in the industry, maybe not in IE or San Bernardino, but in the South and the East. That's why you got Nas and Jay Z to jump on the No Limit Bandwagon when it's clear they didn't think much (to say the least) of No Limit's music (understandably so from their perspective). You don't have to be a 5 mic album to be a classic.
all facts
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No Limit was not the first independent label to go big. The problem with the narrative Master P sells is that it forgets that Death Row was an independent, he really copied Eazy E'z blueprint as Ruthless being an independent and even used Priority which worked with all independents in distribution deals.
I wrote a LOT about this in old Junkyards about this time period. What you are talking about in terms of independent influence also is unfounded. No Limit was one of the LAST independents to do major deals. You forget about Def Jam being an independent label, I'd say Rap-A-Lot Records was WAY more important for promoting southern rap and it was an independent label, Luke Records, which crossed over with Anquette. In the late-90's, record labels were merging with major labels as major labels saw that Hip-Hop was more than a fade so they wanted a larger piece of it. RCA took greater control of Jive, Warner Bros. took greater control of Tommy Boy, EMI bought Priority Records in 1998, Interscope Records was bought by MCA in 1995 (Interscope itself was considered an independent label as they focused on alternative rock and hip-hop and really had no major label backing), Def Jam Records was merged into MCA Records in 1998. The game was changing, and Master P did what he could to keep No Limit afloat as an independent label. But Master P had very little to do with how independent labels operate, other than do what was already done.
With all of that said, there is not much to support any Master P album being called classic other than a small number of people want it to be a classic. With that said, you can find a small number of people who want almost any artist to have their album be called a classic. You can find a bunch of 16 year olds right now who'd call Drake's Take Care a classic. It's the closest he has to a classic, but I have seen hardly anyone call it a classic. Maybe in this new world of social media, I'm looking in the wrong places, but I haven't seen it. But I DO know all the old places to look in the 90's, I read them every month. And I saw NO ONE call anything Master P did a classic, and I saw NO ONE call it classic in retrospect. Even Lil' Wayne stuff gets put up in retrospect. But not Master P.
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I guess we can agree to disagree but the way No Limit took the game by storm really had a lasting impact and Ice Cream Man and Ghetto D are still references of P's streak.
P was not the first independent label but it was the first of a new era of independent label with COMPLETE freedom, the ability to keep all of his masters, to get a huge advance and get the lion's share of the sales profits. The No Limit/Priority deal was 75/25 which was unheard of at the time except for E-40's deal with Jive and E-40's deal with Jive was modest because E-40 didn't have the success No Limit and Master P reached. Jive was mostly interested in buying market shares. Then came the ridiculous Cash Money deal brokered by the same person behind Master P's deal. It was a very different business model from Def Jam's, Death Row's and Ruthless's. You're right about Rap-a-Lot too.
You're still missing the point about the difference between a "quality" classic and a classic in the original sense of the term though. An album that paved the way and still gets talked about and had a lasting impact one way or another on the culture. Master P doesn't have the most obvious of classics but his successful run is symbolized by two quintessential albums : Ice Cream Man and Ghetto D. Solid albums, excellent for some, mediocre for others but it changed the way rappers promoted their music, the way labels advertised their other music ad features (even though it was started on a more minor scale by Tony Draper).
Same goes for Trap Muzik and Thug Motivation 101 : Let's Get It! We can discuss the actual quality of these albums, but their monumental impact on the culture cannot be denied. They really set a pattern and a standard which has been duplicated and derivated by many influential rappers since.
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Sorry, but to say no one calls any of master p's work classic is ridiculous:
http://rapmusic.com/threads/master-p-ghetto-d-classic.1230939/
https://www.pinterest.com/pin/411727590909999146/
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Sorry, but to say no one calls any of master p's work classic is ridiculous:
http://rapmusic.com/threads/master-p-ghetto-d-classic.1230939/
https://www.pinterest.com/pin/411727590909999146/
A forum thread and a pinterest link that doesn't work... hahahaha....
Here are articles that say Drake has a classic.
https://medium.com/@Kperez85/why-drake-s-take-care-will-always-be-a-classic-18f9f69afbed#.yo1u87iyz
http://www.mtv.com/news/1674577/x-factor-astro-drake-take-care/
http://www.kanyetothe.com/forum/index.php?topic=166865.0
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http://www.ign.com/boards/threads/whats-the-hhbs-consensus-on-how-many-classic-albums-lil-b-has.453930471/page-2
A thread that says at least 3 of Lil B's albums were absolute classics. No pressure
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a classic album isn't a classic unless some hipster nerd that worked for The Source in the 1990s says so, end of thread
the people in the streets and word of mouth have no value in hip-hop
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a classic album isn't a classic unless some hipster nerd that worked for The Source in the 1990s says so, end of thread
the people in the streets and word of mouth have no value in hip-hop
It'd be one thing if there was some dispute .. But literally every post in that thread I linked called it classic. Now, I don't even really consider it a classic myself, because I define classic by quality above impact. But to me, ghettos tryna kill me is a bay classic, either way, and I won't fault someone for claimin ghetto d a classic.
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a classic album isn't a classic unless some hipster nerd that worked for The Source in the 1990s says so, end of thread
the people in the streets and word of mouth have no value in hip-hop
It'd be one thing if there was some dispute .. But literally every post in that thread I linked called it classic. Now, I don't even really consider it a classic myself, because I define classic by quality above impact. But to me, ghettos tryna kill me is a bay classic, either way, and I won't fault someone for claimin ghetto d a classic.
this thread made me have to put on Mr. Ice Cream Man in the ride earlier lol I actually haven't played that one in full in awhile