West Coast Connection Forum
DUBCC - Tha Connection => West Coast Classics => Topic started by: SGV on October 30, 2003, 10:31:56 PM
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First: Don't step in here on some childish name-calling-insulting bullshit. If you disagree, say it, but be mature about it. Don't come in here on no other topics. You got another topic, make a thread, don't fuck this one up.
The West won't blow up until Dre and Snoop start bringing more artits to the forefront. Snoop tried with Tha Eastsidaz, but being on TVT didn't help. As tight as Tha Eastsidaz are, they're not commercial material. They're too gangsta. Being gangsta is coo, now, but not when you're a real gangsta. They want rhinestone rags and shit like that. Snoop's gets props for that. Then he tried with Doggystyle All-Stars, but they were going nowhere with that single. He chose a horrible single. Plus, nobody knew who E-White and the rest were. That was poor marketing. Again, Snoop gets props.
Dre, well Dre hasn't helped anyone on the West, commericially, since Xzibit. He gave Knoc a pretty weak track. It was tight, but nothing that would make him a star. And, he gave Xzibit wack shit, too.
So, now that I've pointed out what they have done, let me point out what they need to do and why.
The commericial audience won't accept anything from the West Coast if it's too gangsta. This is a known fact. The only acts from the West making a splash are Dre and Snoop. Xzibit is mildly up there, but he falls under the same category. Studio muthafuckas. So, people like to hear from them, they're not that threatening. What Snoop and Dre need to do is this.
Grab some of the brightest acts out West, F.A.B., Locksmith, Sly Boogy, Planet Asia, Chace In, Ahmad, all the respectable emcees, and help bring them up. Dre and Snoop don't need the sales no more, they're already rich. Throw some of these cats on your albums, your singles. Pop up on their albums, lace them with tight beats(like Dre did 50) and tight hooks(like Snoop did Chingy) and let them do the rest. Dre and Snoop need to walk these cats into the labels and say "hey check out this cat, he got spits." It's that simple. A label would listen to, say, Chace Infinite, if Snoop or Dre walked him in. If Chace came with the same lyrics, but no Snoop/Dre, the label wouldn't give him the time of day.
Now, do Dre and Snoop have to do this? No. But, if they want to be, and if people want to call them, the Kings of the West Coast, they're going to have to. It's plain and simple. If you call Dre and Snoop the Kings of the West, and say they don't need to support out talent, then I can't take you serious.
That's all it is. Dre and Snoop are SUPPOSED to be the Kings of the West, but they're not leading their Kingdom, like a King is supposed to.
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LOL @ Snoop & Dre...
I'ma say it FUCK THEM..lol
The talent is way beyond those foo's..
Fuck them.
Hatesrats 2oooTre
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I appreciate ure' point's SGV...
Westcoast don't need those fucken washed up bitches anymore tho..
ImO..
Fuck Em'..
Hatesrats 2oooTre
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As a whole, we don't need them. But, to blow up, we do. That's the only way. The West will never be accepted without Dre or Snoop. It's a fact. A shame too. Regardless of how tight artists like DJ Quik, E-40, Jayo Felony, Alkoholiks, etc. are, they will never bring the West up to the commercial status it once was. Dre and Snoop are the only ones that are accepted.
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I appreciate ure' point's SGV...
Westcoast don't need those fucken washed up bitches anymore tho..
ImO..
Fuck Em'..
Hatesrats 2oooTre
This is why you're one of the realest cats on this board. Speaking your mind. If I could add on to your props I would.
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Wow, So True....But I Also feel that the media is not ready for the west coast to come back, because they are afraid of how "Gangsta" The West Really is...IMO
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As a whole, we don't need them. But, to blow up, we do. That's the only way. The West will never be accepted without Dre or Snoop. It's a fact. A shame too. Regardless of how tight artists like DJ Quik, E-40, Jayo Felony, Alkoholiks, etc. are, they will never bring the West up to the commercial status it once was. Dre and Snoop are the only ones that are accepted.
And once the West has the commercial status it once had everybody will start complaining that they have either too much success or they have too much bling bling :-\
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I really don't think Snoop and Dre, especially Snoop, are needed anymore. Maybe Dre because he can produce, but Snoop, unless his cleaning up his business, really isn't needed. But to see Sly Boogie, Hittman (remember him) Knoc'Turn'al, Ras Kass and all the true westcoast talent blow up would be tight. Hell, but who knows if you need Dre and Snoop, shit, Baby Beesh (now Baby Bash) blew up on his damn self, Suga Suga is heating up airwaves, and gets video play. Now that's what I'm talking about.
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I really don't think Snoop and Dre, especially Snoop, are needed anymore. Maybe Dre because he can produce, but Snoop, unless his cleaning up his business, really isn't needed. But to see Sly Boogie, Hittman (remember him) Knoc'Turn'al, Ras Kass and all the true westcoast talent blow up would be tight. Hell, but who knows if you need Dre and Snoop, shit, Baby Beesh (now Baby Bash) blew up on his damn self, Suga Suga is heating up airwaves, and gets video play. Now that's what I'm talking about.
I've never heard Baby Bash on the radio or seen him on tv. Actually, I can't even name a song that he made.
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Baby Beesh (now Baby Bash) blew up on his damn self, Suga Suga is heating up airwaves, and gets video play. Now that's what I'm talking about.
There's a catch there. He's not being promoted as a Bay rapper. He's being promoted as a Houston rapper. Even Universal's websites states he's from Houston. Of course, we're getting short changed on that.
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I really don't think Snoop and Dre, especially Snoop, are needed anymore. Maybe Dre because he can produce, but Snoop, unless his cleaning up his business, really isn't needed. But to see Sly Boogie, Hittman (remember him) Knoc'Turn'al, Ras Kass and all the true westcoast talent blow up would be tight. Hell, but who knows if you need Dre and Snoop, shit, Baby Beesh (now Baby Bash) blew up on his damn self, Suga Suga is heating up airwaves, and gets video play. Now that's what I'm talking about.
I've never heard Baby Bash on the radio or seen him on tv. Actually, I can't even name a song that he made.
you from Europe muthaphukka. They listen to Black Eye Peas over 2Pac, and TQ over DJ Quik. That's not saying much.
And yeah SGV, I hear what your saying, but he has claimed Bay Area rapper, and stated that his went back to his westcoast sound for this album. Though a major lable is going to try and ride the Southern Explosion that has happen in hip-hop for money. Fuck that, we all know that's a westcoast Bay rapper.
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to be honest i really don't want the west to blow up and become pop. i like listening to thier shit and have other people like "who's that?" it's like having a restaraunt that has good ass food and you and a couple of friends know about it. once they start to be like mcdonald's then it loses it touch....
you named dj quik, e 40, and jayo cause they are doing thier shit, they're original and no one can fuck with what they do....if they were to become pop then they'd just be like everyone else....
i'm a fan of westcoast music period, if i wanted pop shit, then i'd have no problem turning on the radio...
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I really don't think Snoop and Dre, especially Snoop, are needed anymore. Maybe Dre because he can produce, but Snoop, unless his cleaning up his business, really isn't needed. But to see Sly Boogie, Hittman (remember him) Knoc'Turn'al, Ras Kass and all the true westcoast talent blow up would be tight. Hell, but who knows if you need Dre and Snoop, shit, Baby Beesh (now Baby Bash) blew up on his damn self, Suga Suga is heating up airwaves, and gets video play. Now that's what I'm talking about.
I've never heard Baby Bash on the radio or seen him on tv. Actually, I can't even name a song that he made.
you from Europe muthaphukka. They listen to Black Eye Peas over 2Pac, and TQ over DJ Quik. That's not saying much.
And yeah SGV, I hear what your saying, but he has claimed Bay Area rapper, and stated that his went back to his westcoast sound for this album. Though a major lable is going to try and ride the Southern Explosion that has happen in hip-hop for money. Fuck that, we all know that's a westcoast Bay rapper.
I also lived a year in America muthaphukka
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Yeah its all snoop+dre's fault... ::)
What about...
Dilated Peoples? They rep LA and do just fine... right?
People Under The Stairs? bay cats doin just fine without screamin wessssydeeeee non stop
ok those 2 arent typical 'west coast gangsta shit'.. more into the backpacker zone.. strong affiliation would probably hurt their market.. but why?
because of the past the west coast is associated mainly with ignorant ass disses and gangstaism.
Shade Sheist damn near did it on this own (if you discount the payola accusations..) until his album release fucked up..
Nates got huge exposure through tracks like 'next episode' and 'Oh no' (and a zillion others..) oh but theres a strong snoop + dre affiil.. so its all because of that, not because he can sing his ass off.. ::) ..on his own he's never been that big, but often his guest spots are stellar... funny huh?
Here's what I believe is a strong case that proves Dre+Snoop affiliation wont blow you up.
Dj Quik... Quik shoulda got better exposure from Addictive.. in a way Dre put him on there.
So.. lets see.. Dre.. super-producer acussed of having a big assed ego.. let another producer have the first single track on a project from his own label...
Oh and what about Dre putting Quik on 'put it on me'?
The song was on the Dre+Snoop affil'd movie Training Day, it was on the soundtrack for that movie! and had a video.. and that video's on the DVD.. and quik even put the song on this own album and Quik later worked with Truth Hurts and put another track with her on his own album.
Dre put quik on two large songs in relatively quick succession showing both sides of him, one as a rapper, one as a producer..
Did this blow Quik up? naww not really? I mean what else can they do unless they sign quik's ass and pump loadsa money into promoting him? but quik's been in the game too long.. he gotta have his own shit right?
Can you imagine a Quik album with a lot of guest producers?
Can you imagine a Quik album without all his people all over it?
I think Quik's done the right thing here, but hell.. he gotta be frustrated.
I mean damn.. if all that didnt work for Quik who everyone admits is talented and shoulda blown up.. what the hell can you do?!
Why you think people need Snoop+Dre to hold their hands?
Commercially 'straight gangsta' is played out, and has been for years.]
(but we still love it!.. but in the public eye its gone)
These days I think the industry is scared of certain west coast mentalities and stereotypes.
Why are the always pushing a gimmick... mackin, flossing, blingin.. poppin ya colla.. ridin on spinners, pimpin.. stuntin.. etc etc..
whats next? having the name of your crew tattoo'd on ya forehead?
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Blaming Snoop & Dre again Im tired of this shit :-\
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SGV for ya...
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Then he tried with Doggystyle All-Stars, but they were going nowhere with that single. He chose a horrible single. Plus, nobody knew who E-White and the rest were. That was poor marketing.
Grab some of the brightest acts out West, F.A.B., Locksmith, Sly Boogy, Planet Asia, Chace In, Ahmad, all the respectable emcees, and help bring them up.
Don't you think singles with these 'brightest acts' would end up exactly the same way as E-White,Soopafly & RBX on the Doggystyle-Allstars singles?I don't see the difference between them.
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Blaming Snoop & Dre again Im tired of this shit :-\
that too
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I'll tell you exactly why the west won't blow up...
It's because hip-hop is dead. It doesn't have any of the potential of any of the other genres of music, and the shit Dre & Snoop helped found is what killed it. When hiphop started, it had hope and was inspiring, because people were rapping about real issues. You had people like Big Daddy Kane dissing people and bragging and shit on wax, but most rap was just harmless uplifting "lets have a party" type shit. Then you had public Enemy who helped evolve it into a deeper theme, this is ALL similar to how other music genres evolved (started off mainstream, grew more complex)... then NWA came along, and brought all kinds of negativity into rap, they're gonna kill you, they're gonna rape her, fuck this, fuck that.
Flash forward 15 years later, all the shit on the radio (or at least a big part of it) is pretty dark, talking about killing people, violence, women are bitches now, and ho's...That shit ain't reality. Maybe it's the world these guys are livin' in, but it's not the world most of america is living in.
If rap keeps on like that, it's gonna die. The reason the west is already dead is because their whole negative tendencies on a whole are flawed and dead. Negativity will never win out over positive uplifting music.
Classical
Jazz
Blues
R&B
Country
Folk
Rock
Funk
Disco
Dance
Techno
EVERY other type of music is positive and uplifting. Hiphop is depressing & negative. The artists that aren't don't generally even get played, and get overshadowed by the sensationalism of the girls shaking their ass in the music video of the other stuff.
Yall may not believe me, but when you get older, I'll bet you'll realize that a guy saying "Anybody disrespect me, there's gonna be bottles flyin' in the V.I.P." is some negative shit, and it DOES have a negative effect on you.
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OH, and you don't believe me? When was the last time you heard a Nirvana-style Alternative track do well? Same thing, depressing negative shit about how you want to die, people don't want to hear that shit. It's already killed Grunge & alternative music. The Human race no matter where you are longs to grow and succeed, and subconsciously we reject negativity.
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bring on the party tracks then!
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So we just need a song that makes people dance and feel happy.
And that will bring the West Back.
It sounds so simple ;D
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hip hop is not gonna die anytime soon..Its influences are everywhere..
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Good Topic SGV.
I could feel SGV when the homie says its sort of Dr Dre's fault. Dr Dre has been doing alot of exposures from Westcoast artists to the public, most of their carreers are forgotten (Hittman, Knoc'turnal, ...). Dr Dre warmend up the public for these cats carreers & then thats were Shady Records should come to play, but Eminem doesnt care too much for cats on the Leftcoast or they have to be close to him (Xzibit). See if Dre did not got them East cats, he wouldnt be were he is today. Dr Dre currently rules the Rap scene, hes the big brain behind it. Only because of hes Eastcoast exposures. See... Snoop on the other hand kept it Westcoast with hes Doggystyle artists. Now tell me, where is Snoop & were is Dre? Snoop is singing RnB songs with Pharrell & B2K to keep hes name in the media. Dre is making big dollars from behind hes keyboard. See Dre wouldnt bring in any Westcoast act untill Eminem is down to handle the WC cat's further carreer. When you start tripping on that "Bring Back The West" BS your talking a death case.
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Good Topic SGV.
One of the 8453413587 topics about this subject :P
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Good Topic SGV.
One of the 8453413587 topics about this subject :P
Yeah but finally somebody's giving out names.
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Dre and Snoop cant carry every one on the West and making them obligated to do so is kinda "upid, sta" (pig latin all up in ya!)
Good music is very much beyond Dre and Snoop. I wouldnt want them to have their hands in everything out the West. We gotta keep creativity flowing even if it means the project doesnt sell well. Id rather that then a plat plaque. Just my opinion.
Ax
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Dre and Snoop cant carry every one on the West and making them obligated to do so is kinda "upid, sta" (pig latin all up in ya!)
Good music is very much beyond Dre and Snoop. I wouldnt want them to have their hands in everything out the West. We gotta keep creativity flowing even if it means the project doesnt sell well. Id rather that then a plat plaque. Just my opinion.
Ax
Exactly..(prop's)
That's what I ment by "FUCK EM" in my post...
They do not need to be involved in everything WEST.
or shitt get's stale just like people claim it is right now.
but like a homie said in an earlier post...
I listen to this regardless..
If I want pop i'll drink a Pepsi or turn on that box
with all the chick music blarrin' out...lol
OnE
Hatesrats 2oooTre
(100% Dre & Snoop fan)
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Now, do Dre and Snoop have to do this? No. But, if they want to be, and if people want to call them, the Kings of the West Coast, they're going to have to. It's plain and simple. If you call Dre and Snoop the Kings of the West, and say they don't need to support out talent, then I can't take you serious.
That's all it is. Dre and Snoop are SUPPOSED to be the Kings of the West, but they're not leading their Kingdom, like a King is supposed to.
Agreed, especially with this part.
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Yeah its all snoop+dre's fault... ::)
What about...
Dilated Peoples? They rep LA and do just fine... right?
People Under The Stairs? bay cats doin just fine without screamin wessssydeeeee non stop
Yea, Dilated are the biggest act on the West. ::). People Under The Stairs, oh yea, everyone knows them. They can walk anyone into a record label office and get them signed on the spot, thanks to their huge status. ::) Horrible, and I mean horrible, examples.
ok those 2 arent typical 'west coast gangsta shit'.. more into the backpacker zone.. strong affiliation would probably hurt their market.. but why?
because of the past the west coast is associated mainly with ignorant ass disses and gangstaism.
Shade Sheist damn near did it on this own (if you discount the payola accusations..) until his album release fucked up..
On his own? LMAO. No. He had Damizza, and Shade is still not a house hold name. Not even with the Programmer of L.A.'s number 1 station could Shade blow up.
Nates got huge exposure through tracks like 'next episode' and 'Oh no' (and a zillion others..) oh but theres a strong snoop + dre affiil.. so its all because of that, not because he can sing his ass off.. ::) ..on his own he's never been that big, but often his guest spots are stellar... funny huh? Nate is a feature artist. Nothing more, nothing less. He can't break any artists.
Here's what I believe is a strong case that proves Dre+Snoop affiliation wont blow you up.
Dj Quik... Quik shoulda got better exposure from Addictive.. in a way Dre put him on there.
So.. lets see.. Dre.. super-producer acussed of having a big assed ego.. let another producer have the first single track on a project from his own label...
Yea, I remember everyone giving Dre props for that beat. Was Dre denying it? I don't remember him bigging up Quik for it. LMAO.
Oh and what about Dre putting Quik on 'put it on me'?
The song was on the Dre+Snoop affil'd movie Training Day, it was on the soundtrack for that movie! and had a video.. and that video's on the DVD.. and quik even put the song on this own album and Quik later worked with Truth Hurts and put another track with her on his own album.
"Put It On Me" is putting someone on? If you say so. Dre gave Quik a very mediocre beat there. And, I never seen the video, so obviously it wasn't released to the mainstream.
Dre put quik on two large songs in relatively quick succession showing both sides of him, one as a rapper, one as a producer..
Large? Oh yea, I remember everyone from Cali to Maine was bumping "Put It On Me." It was crazy.
Did this blow Quik up? naww not really? I mean what else can they do unless they sign quik's ass and pump loadsa money into promoting him? but quik's been in the game too long.. he gotta have his own shit right?
Quik is established, but with his sound.
Can you imagine a Quik album with a lot of guest producers?
Can you imagine a Quik album without all his people all over it?
I think Quik's done the right thing here, but hell.. he gotta be frustrated.
If Quik could get a real good deal, he'd blow up. Good promotion and good marketing. Dre could help there.
I mean damn.. if all that didnt work for Quik who everyone admits is talented and shoulda blown up.. what the hell can you do?!
Why you think people need Snoop+Dre to hold their hands?
Commercially 'straight gangsta' is played out, and has been for years.]
(but we still love it!.. but in the public eye its gone)
These days I think the industry is scared of certain west coast mentalities and stereotypes.
Why are the always pushing a gimmick... mackin, flossing, blingin.. poppin ya colla.. ridin on spinners, pimpin.. stuntin.. etc etc..
Certain West Coast mentalities? Stereotypes? Macking?! LMAO. Everyone's on that shit. Flossing, Blinging, Riding Spinners, Pimping, Stunin, that's the whole industry. What kind of bullshit is this?
whats next? having the name of your crew tattoo'd on ya forehead?
Dre and Snoop are supposed to be leaders of the our team. Jordan was the leader of the Bulls, if he didn't want to play, would the Bulls have won? Hell no! Even better example. If Kobe and Shaq don't play, will the Lakers win? Not a chance. Dre and Snoop are SUPPOSED TO BE the Kobe and Shaq of the Hip Hop. But, they're not helping out. They watch out for themselves and rarely help out new talent on the West.
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Z-Virus: Someone like Sly Boogy, Strong Arm Steady, etc, they got names for themselves in the Underground. They're building a buzz. E-White was just some scumbag who nobody knew ANYTHING about. Soopafly, too. He wasn't really known outside of DPG fans. RBX hadn't made moves since that Aftermath track. So, that crew was full of nothing.
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Good Topic SGV.
One of the 8453413587 topics about this subject :P
Yeah but finally somebody's giving out names.
finally..
in fact I was kinda shocked readin these 2 names being blamed for this..
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Fuck this is a stupid topic that we have done about a BILLION fucking times and it is starting to get fucking annoying you dumb muthafuckas who keep repeating this muthafucking post! lol
I mean, one one hand you have the idiots who say that SNoop and Dre need to save the west blah blah blah , and on the other hand you have the fools who say the west doesnt need SNoop and Dre. Personally, it is somewhere in the middle. REgardless of what people think, Snoop and Dre have inspired many westcoast rappers and have had a positive effect on the westcoast scene. It isnt there fault noone else on the West cant blow up! I mean, when the east wasnt blowing up in like 94, 95, Black Moon, Wu-tang, NAs, Jayz and Biggie all came through, without ANY AFFILIATIONS to any of the then current eastcoast kings (LL, KRS, BDK, Public Enemy etc) and changed the game and blew up. These guys didnt ask to be babysat and groomed for success, they brought something dope to hiphop and blowing up just happened. WHo cares anyway, you all act like you own the labels these rappers release music on! Seriously, if you like rappers like Planet Asia, Aceyalone, Dilated, etc, and you enjoy their music, why would you want them to work with dre and snoop anyway. If these artists were really meant to blow, they would, thats that.
FOr the last time, Dre and SNoop can not be counted on to babysit other westcoast artists, this shit is getting pathetic! Sure, Nate woulda ripped the Family Affair beat, or Xzibit coulda become a superstar off te In Da Club beat, but Dre didnt give them the beats so now he doesnt help out the west? Dre has done more for the westcoast than anyone else in history, and last time i checked Snoop still represents occasionally also. These guys are legends wo have been in the game, if they never worked wit anothher westcaost artists they would still both be top 5 all time artists from the west coast (along with cube, Ras kass, and eazy e).
Dre works with people he thinks will blow up, and he rightfully sees that most of the artists on the west dont have a fucking chance right now. WEll there is a plethora of talent on te west, when it comes to making hit music it is ridiculous to think even 5 percent of these rappers should be enjoying commercial success.
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Another ting, DJ QUIK has had a GREAT CAREER and sold millions of records and makes beats for some of the most establishe artists in R&B and Rap, so why does he need anyones help? WEll his music is still very good, there is no way in hell Under te influence had a chance of blowing up; if Quik wants to blow up so bad, try keeping a beat like Addictive, Bagg up (by Chingy), or Put it in the Air (talib) for his album, and he will enjoy some freaking success.
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I don't really care if cats like Planet Asia, Alkaholiks, Foreign Legion, Chace Infinite, etc. don't blow up, as long as they keep making dope music.
They don't need Snoop & Dre to hold theri hands.
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bring on the party tracks then!
It doesn't necessarily have to be party tracks, but even you alluded to it in your post when you said the gangsta vibe is played out. People don't want to hear all that negativity, and even though it'll be popular for a little while, it'll eventually die out, after the group of kids listening to it grows out of their rebellious phase.
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This may sounds weird to some but 6 months ago I though the one who would bring populairity to the West was WC. WC isnt the played out "Thug Life" type that the west trade marked. WC had the better version of a Xzibit/Dre production feel... How do you feel about this?
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The song was on the Dre+Snoop affil'd movie Training Day, it was on the soundtrack for that movie! and had a video.. and that video's on the DVD..
Damn, why doesn't my copy have that video on the DVD? I just got Pharoahe Monch - Got You and then that wack ass Nelly #1 song. I want your version.
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there is a video for Put It On me???? :o :o :o
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my bad.. ignore that.. i musta been on crack... :)
(i think i was thinkin of bad intentions with knoc.. which is on the wash dvd)
damn.. shoulda been a video... for it though!
SGV for you sure talkin a lot for a person who said he aint posting here anymore, rehashign the same 'not dickriding' thing.. hell no u aint... u a straight hater, hating on those who are succesful. most people can see that these threads you make every 2 days always say "dre+snoop sold out" "dre+snoop suck.. xxx is better.. " etc etc
IMO the most 'on point' person on this thread is 'teecee' and I aint even gonna speak on SGVs attitude anymore.
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LOL @ Snoop & Dre...
I'ma say it FUCK THEM..lol
The talent is way beyond those foo's..
Fuck them.
Hatesrats 2oooTre
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my bad.. ignore that.. i musta been on crack... :)
(i think i was thinkin of bad intentions with knoc.. which is on the wash dvd)
damn.. shoulda been a video... for it though!
SGV for you sure talkin a lot for a person who said he aint posting here anymore, rehashign the same 'not dickriding' thing.. hell no u aint... u a straight hater, hating on those who are succesful. most people can see that these threads you make every 2 days always say "dre+snoop sold out" "dre+snoop suck.. xxx is better.. " etc etc
IMO the most 'on point' person on this thread is 'teecee' and I aint even gonna speak on SGVs attitude anymore.
LMAO @ you. I've never said Dre and Snoop sold out. I never said Dre and Snoop suck. Shut the fuck up. You really got nothing to say. I could give a fuck about you. I know you don't like me, so why don't you stop being a fake ass and just say it? Fuck the bullshit man. Be real.
Teecee: The East Coast doesn't need any help because that's where ALL the major labels are at. So, that's a horrible example. Loud, Bad Boy, Def Jam etc that's all in NY. The cats out there have an easier time getting signed.
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man just because the west dont be havin shit thats always on tv and or radio doesnt mean they aint holdin down the west u know. i mean i live far away from cali but i sure do find my self some wicked ass west coast music. i mean sure dre and snoop havent been reppin the west as much as they did when pac was around but they still hold der shit down. i mean lil c-style, knoc-turnal, crooked i, daz, kurupt, xzibit all does g's are holdin it down for the west. just because it aint all over the radio and tv like pop artists such as ja rule and b2k doesnt mean they arent holdin it down it jus means they keepin it real on da low.
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the reason the west isn't blowing up is because they already blew up last decade with this music. They are still putting out the same stuff, just not as good, or fresh sounding. Its the same old stuff.
examples:
Daz- rr&gb compared to his latest effort. same album just dpgc is not half as good. full of dpg rappers as guests, gangsta topics, sex, drugs, gangs, guns, murders, dpg, westcoast are what both albums are all about. same type of production just dpgc ain't very good.
the same can be said for many westcoast artists who are still in the game- spice 1, C-BO, e-a-ski, mack 10, etc.
New westcoast acts need to come up with something new and refreshing. Sly Boogy is cool, but nothing major or mindblowing. Peeps say crooked I will blow up. Same story with him. His album is gonna be nothing new. As much as I luv the new eastsidaz new bootleg, it is still nothing new. I am luvin the strong arm steady shit, but it's not really gonna stand out among other westcoast rap. I am guessing that the avg person who likes rap and doesn't live in cali, doesn't really pay attention to what the west is bringing (with exceptions) because they figure its nothing new. They liked that style of rap when it was popular back in the mid 90's. Even myself, who luvs westcoast gangsta rap, am bored of it. 90% of all albums that I have either d/l or bought within the last couple of years get very few plays from me. Some I probably haven't even listend to all the way through. Sometimes they might sound really hot the first listen or two, but they just can't hold my attention for long after that. I would rather just listen to the older better albums.
the same goes for new artists too:
sly boogy- his album is good, but nothing to blow up off of, nothing real refreshing
roscoe- great album, but just another typical westcoast album, its been done b4
Ecay Uno-I luv his album, but again, people have heard this same shit already
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sly boogy- his album is good, but nothing to blow up off of, nothing real refreshing
Nothing real refreshing? With all the crap coming out from all areas, how is not refreshing? Lyricism at it's finest.
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lyrics dont sell tho... respect yes, sales no.
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lyrics dont sell tho... respect yes, sales no.
That's fine and dandy. But, to say it's not refreshing is just wrong.
I'd rather hear a great lyricist than some mumble mouth scumbag who rhymes like Dr. Seuss.
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lyrics dont sell tho... respect yes, sales no.
exactly. most artists that blow up are not lyrical at all. You need beats people love, a flow people love, excellent choruses/hooks, a distinguished voice, and then I would say lyrics come in last.
Nothing real refreshing? With all the crap coming out from all areas, how is not refreshing? Lyricism at it's finest.
that may be your opinion, but its not mine. His album is completely average imo. Sure he has some really good lyricsm, but there is much more to making a great album than that. His album is good, I bought it, and I listen to it, but its nothing I get excited over, or can keep playing intro to outro over and over. there is no song on the album that I want to put on repeat because I can't get enough of it. Its not an album that would get a party goin. None of his songs really stick in my head.
that is what makes an album for me. when it's exciting to hear, when I can listen to it over and over and not get bored with it. When there is songs that I just want to hear all the time. His album just doesn't stand out from the crowd. its just another west coast album.
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lyrics dont sell tho... respect yes, sales no.
exactly. most artists that blow up are not lyrical at all. You need beats people love, a flow people love, excellent choruses/hooks, a distinguished voice, and then I would say lyrics come in last.
Nothing real refreshing? With all the crap coming out from all areas, how is not refreshing? Lyricism at it's finest.
that may be your opinion, but its not mine. His album is completely average imo. Sure he has some really good lyricsm, but there is much more to making a great album than that. His album is good, I bought it, and I listen to it, but its nothing I get excited over, or can keep playing intro to outro over and over. there is no song on the album that I want to put on repeat because I can't get enough of it. Its not an album that would get a party goin. None of his songs really stick in my head.
that is what makes an album for me. when it's exciting to hear, when I can listen to it over and over and not get bored with it. When there is songs that I just want to hear all the time. His album just doesn't stand out from the crowd. its just another west coast album.
Lyrics aren't last for me.
Sly's album is average? I don't remember hearing vivid story tales and a lot of concept songs on every album. That album is what emceeing is about. "Walk Wit My Dogs" is far from average. Same with "Haters, "Ridiculous," "Fatal Mistake" and plenty of jams on there. And, "California" gets a crowd popping.
Last time I checked, I haven't heard someone as creative or skilled on the West since Del.
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lyrics dont sell tho... respect yes, sales no.
That's fine and dandy. But, to say it's not refreshing is just wrong.
I'd rather hear a great lyricist than some mumble mouth scumbag who rhymes like Dr. Seuss.
I never said that :-*
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the west is not creative and clever enough business wise plus they are not able to produce radio shit....they are even not able to bring some good/ceative/fresh westcoast stuff anymore. none of the lastest releases are on a level from the shit they dropped back in the days when they all were successful. the guys who could bring it back are wastin their time on bullshit labels or are busy with producing pop and eastcoast artists.
i dont get it...crooked i is (or was) full of talent and he has a different flow then all other rappers out there...he could easily blow up with a dope producer in the back. now its a bit too late...the west had a chance but its fucked up now...thanks.
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lyrics dont sell tho... respect yes, sales no.
its the package what sells...lyrics and beats. thats also a problem of the west...not enough good packages.
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No need to blow anymore...
Check the top artists out today.
The "Quote" biggest Eastcoast artists..
are all using/used that Westcoast style and want to live the Cali lifestyle.
check their car's...check their content...check their dress.
It's all Cali.
Gone is IE:
Where is the Big Boot's?
The camoflauge?
The Leather jacket's?
The Thick gold ropes?
The SuBway video's?
The Grimey ish?
ect...
all I see is white T-shirt's & our style.
+
every video shot is either in California..
or on a beach somewhere...
but not in the ice cold NYC.
+
The South has immitated the Bay Area sound and style 4 years...I call it Baby Yay!.
Blowin' up is a matter of opinion..
cause everytime I turn on the radio one of our's in on aswell.
FUCK Mtv it's always been that way.
FUCK Radio it's alway's been that way.
Just play what u play..ImO
Hatesrats 2oooTre
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Lyrics aren't last for me.
Sly's album is average? I don't remember hearing vivid story tales and a lot of concept songs on every album. That album is what emceeing is about. "Walk Wit My Dogs" is far from average. Same with "Haters, "Ridiculous," "Fatal Mistake" and plenty of jams on there. And, "California" gets a crowd popping.
Last time I checked, I haven't heard someone as creative or skilled on the West since Del.
the topic is about west coast cats blowin up. Lyrics are last when it comes to blowing up. Nelly, ja rule, snoop, dre, missy, lil bow wow, fabulous all sell a shitload of albums. None of them have any lyricism to speak of. Ras Kass has very dope lyrics, but hardly anyone knows who he is outside of cali. when's the last time you heard a really lyrical song on the radio, mtv, or at a club/party? thats what it takes to blow up. constant radio, tv, and club play. If you don't get that then you are not gonna sell there is no question about it. When's the last time you heard Del on the radio, or ras kass at the clubs, or saw a crooked I video? Eazy E had some of the simplest lyrics ever, yet he was extremely popular. I think having simple lyrics these days actually will help you blow up, because its mostly kids buying rap music these days.
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screw all dat, if u need these established cats to make u blow up, then hip hop is a sad state right now......they dont need dre or snoop, just the right single, right promotion, and right connections, and they will blow up...PLAIN AND SIMPLE.....look at rappers like chingy, he had sum unknown producer produce his song "right thurr", it was catchy, it got video/radio/club play, and he blew up like anything, AND HE HAD THE RIGHT PROMOTION n he basically blew up by himself,....they need to stop relyin on others to b low up, make ur own path n make ur own moves, get wit the right labels, right single, and u can be commercial material...im out
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FUCK Mtv it's always been that way.
FUCK Radio it's alway's been that way.
thats bullshit. back in the day the west got tons of video and radio play. the west simply does not make music which appeals to the majority of the rap music audience. its as simple as that. Back in the day westcoast gangsta rap was the most popular form of rap, and it sold a lot, got radio play, got video play, got club play. Most of them still makin the same kind of rap today. How you expect it to still be popular almost 10 years later? gangsta/g-funk/thug/street/hardcore rap does not sell anymore, its not popular. How hard is that to see you people? Snoop doesn't do gangsta rap anymore, he works wit lil kids and pop singers, and does songs for girls and kids. that is why he sells. Its not hard to figure out, if a westcoast rapper wants to sell, they can't do gangsta rap. they almost have to do commercial sounding rap.
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lyrics and beats aare the first things that i look for in a song. if respect matters that much i prolly wouldnt listen to half da shit i do. if the beat dont go good with wat there sayin den the song will blow hardcore but if theyy match up like most of dre's and em's produced shit does. most of the lyracists out in cali have the dopest flows and beats but kurupt can suc a dick tradin gangs and shit
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screw all dat, if u need these established cats to make u blow up, then hip hop is a sad state right now......they dont need dre or snoop, just the right single, right promotion, and right connections, and they will blow up...PLAIN AND SIMPLE.....look at rappers like chingy, he had sum unknown producer produce his song "right thurr", it was catchy, it got video/radio/club play, and he blew up like anything, AND HE HAD THE RIGHT PROMOTION n he basically blew up by himself,....they need to stop relyin on others to b low up, make ur own path n make ur own moves, get wit the right labels, right single, and u can be commercial material...im out
Um, I hardly think Chingy did it by himself. The fact that he is signed to Ludacris's label which has backing from Def Jam gives you a pretty good idea why his wack single blew up.
I dunno why you all want the west to blow up anyway. You'll say all this, but when a rapper from the west makes some corny commercial single aimed at kids then you will all say, oh, such as such sold out. You don't really want the west to blow up, and it isn't going to unless it goes all corny. If you like gangsta rap, then you can still buy gangsta rap, but you must realise that it will never be popular again in the mainstream.
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Um, I hardly think Chingy did it by himself. The fact that he is signed to Ludacris's label which has backing from Def Jam gives you a pretty good idea why his wack single blew up.
I dunno why you all want the west to blow up anyway. You'll say all this, but when a rapper from the west makes some corny commercial single aimed at kids then you will all say, oh, such as such sold out. You don't really want the west to blow up, and it isn't going to unless it goes all corny. If you like gangsta rap, then you can still buy gangsta rap, but you must realise that it will never be popular again in the mainstream.
i totally agree with that. if most artist didnt have a backbone to lean on then they prolly would never have made it. the only reason chingy made it was because luda found him and helped him out. if lloyd banks didnt get wit 50 he would have had a hard ass time trying to get into the game because he never says much to anyone but he has the tightest lyrics even though hes on the east coast but they all got west coast beats.
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I dunno why you all want the west to blow up anyway. You'll say all this, but when a rapper from the west makes some corny commercial single aimed at kids then you will all say, oh, such as such sold out. You don't really want the west to blow up, and it isn't going to unless it goes all corny. If you like gangsta rap, then you can still buy gangsta rap, but you must realise that it will never be popular again in the mainstream.
I totally agree. I hate 90% of the popular rap. I think mainstream commercial rap sucks balls. and any already established gangsta rappers who want to be popular right now would have to sell out.
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if any gangsta rappers wanna go mainstream they will have to seel out in order to have there music played on tv or radio cuz da lyrics are too hardcore and everyother fuckin word is blanked out. since the consumer which is us like the way that gansta rap is goin why would we want them to go mainstream then it would be a bunch of ja rules and shit. i like the way the music is going in the west its so thugin and i dont think that going mainstream would help it i think it would hurt it
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the topic is about west coast cats blowin up. Lyrics are last when it comes to blowing up. Nelly, ja rule, snoop, dre, missy, lil bow wow, fabulous all sell a shitload of albums. None of them have any lyricism to speak of. Ras Kass has very dope lyrics, but hardly anyone knows who he is outside of cali. when's the last time you heard a really lyrical song on the radio, mtv, or at a club/party? thats what it takes to blow up. constant radio, tv, and club play. If you don't get that then you are not gonna sell there is no question about it. When's the last time you heard Del on the radio, or ras kass at the clubs, or saw a crooked I video? Eazy E had some of the simplest lyrics ever, yet he was extremely popular. I think having simple lyrics these days actually will help you blow up, because its mostly kids buying rap music these days.
What about someone like Eminem? Nas? They're lyrical and they're selling.
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ya wat about them though there from the east coast but they are dope i was jus listenin to nas the other night. they have dope lyrics but em has come up from a battle carrier not like the style in cali. nas is from new york ans has his own original flow that no one in new york can really touch except for 50 cent who is now following em's lyrical flow and is making killer music because his beats are from cali from dre.
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ya wat about them though there from the east coast but they are dope i was jus listenin to nas the other night. they have dope lyrics but em has come up from a battle carrier not like the style in cali. nas is from new york ans has his own original flow that no one in new york can really touch except for 50 cent who is now following em's lyrical flow and is making killer music because his beats are from cali from dre.
50 can touch Nas? LMAO. I'm not even a Nas fan, but that's a HUGE lie. Nas would make 50 look like a foo.
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What I want to know is this. Why is it when the West cats talk about G shit, it's able to be played on the radio or tv. But, you got cats like The Lox, Mobb Deep and Beanie Sigel who are talking about slanging, murdering and robbing and they're getting much radio play.
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What about someone like Eminem? Nas? They're lyrical and they're selling.
I'm not saying if your lyrical you won't sell, but if lyricism is your strongest point more than likely your not gonna sell well.
I don't think I need to explain how much else eminem and nas got going for them besides lyrics.
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man 50 can rhyme in a total differeent way than nas does. if nas rhymed like 50 he wouldnt be half as good and if 50 rapped like nas it would be shitty
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I'm not saying if your lyrical you won't sell, but if lyricism is your strongest point more than likely your not gonna sell well.
I don't think I need to explain how much else eminem and nas got going for them besides lyrics.
Nas' strong point is his lyricism. Point blank. If it wasn't, then Illmatic wouldn't get brought up so much. Em's strong point is his skin color first, then his lyrics second.
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why jus cuz hes white. wtf is that about. he is one of the strongest mc's out there right now if someone gets at him he gets back at them 10 times harder
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why jus cuz hes white. wtf is that about. he is one of the strongest mc's out there right now if someone gets at him he gets back at them 10 times harder
LMAO. The last part I find funny, but I won't touch that.
Eminem is so popular because he's white. People like Ras Kass, Pharoahe Monch, Chino XL, they all have the same amount of skill that Em has, but they're just looked at as other emcees. If Em was black he'd be Ras Kass.
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i dont think so man jus cuz ur white dont mean shit. look at vanilla ice he was a bitch that no one liked and he did shitty he had no talent ems got some krazy talent and ya ras kass has some krazy skill but jus cuz an emcees white dont mean thats why he's makin it big thats jus fucked
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Nas' strong point is his lyricism. Point blank. If it wasn't, then Illmatic wouldn't get brought up so much. Em's strong point is his skin color first, then his lyrics second.
nas has a tight flow and delivery imo. also he has made songs such as If I Ruled the world, you can hate me now, street dreams, and more. these songs were very popular nationwide and they got lots of radio and tv play. they had some really catchy hooks and the beats were good. You can play any of those songs in the club and hella people will get into it.
eminem has dre behind him. all his first album singles have been super radio and mtv friendly.
again I am not saying a good lyricist won't blow up. You need a lot more than that. You could bring out a genius when it comes to lyrics, but if the beats suck and his voice and flow is boring then not many people are gonna like it. You also gotta have a super hot song that millions of people are gonna bump.
like I said I like sly's album. it's not a bad album at all. but its not outstanding at all either. the beats are not bad at all, but not one is amazing. his voice and flow are fine too, but again nothing out of the ordinary. There is hundreds if not thousands of rappers out there trying to get big. You have to distinguish yourself away from everyone else in order to make it big. Rappers have these things to do it with:
beat
flow/delivery
lyrics
concepts
voice
energy
If you are only gonna be strong in one or two of those areas, and want to be big, lyrics is gonna be one of the last things to make you big.
Luniz- operation stakola is certainly not as lyrical as judgement day. but imo, (and many other peoples) it is a much better album. It is a lot more entertaining and fun to listen to.
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Admittedly, i do not usually agree with Ac Grundy, but almost everything u have said in this thread is right on the money.
Props to g funka also!
SGV SGV SGV
EMINEM IS NOT ONLY POPULAR BECAUSE HE IS WHITE!!! THAT IS A LOAD OF FUCKING BULLSHIT!!! EMINEM is popular because he makes commercially friendly music and has catchy singles.
I personally like Pharoah, Ras, and CHino more than Eminem, but when it comes to making popular music they do not have the talent that eminem has, point blank. None of them have ever made a song even a tenth as catchy (thank god!) as Without Me or Lose Yourself, and that is the end of the story. U can make excuses saying its because of Dre or cuz ems white, but in reality he makes music accesible to the average music listener, and that is a huge market.
I AM GLAD chino, ras and pharoah dont make music like this, why do you want them to blow up so bad SGV????
Blowing up has tons to do with marketing and connections, but it cant be overlooked that u have to make something catchy and accesible to more than just your neighborood.
Artists like E40 and Suga Free and Yukmouth, while talented and putting out quality music, do not have styles that everyone is gonna love. WE LOVE IT CUZ MOST OF US LOVE WEST COAST SHIT, so we are all biased. But if you were new to hiphop and of course most kids are gonna like a song like In Da club or Without me over Quarterbacking by 50 cent or some Acey Alone song!!! Anyone who thinks otherwise is too wrapped up in there love for the west, the underground, the underdog, or all of those three together! peace
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I think the west, like the other coast, is going to blow up with updated production. Shade Sheist, Nocc'Turnal, Light's Out by WSCG, Dr. Dre, Baby Beesh, WC and others have updated the sound and have seen increase in sales. When the other lyrist upgrade, it'll be all gravy. And also they don't have to sell out and go R&B, Jay-Z, Nas, and others have done a good job of updating their sound, and keeping their traditional vibe to it. It's 2003, a new millennium, artist like Ras Kass, Chino XL, Pharoah, Yukmouth and others shouldn't feel bad by making sounds that are up to date. After all, in 1993, everyone else had to change with the new sound Dr. Dre made, and in 1999, everyone then updated production techniques that Dr. Dre introducted. Although maybe holding out on updated 'till Dexot is the best thing... lol
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i dont think dre can help anyone shoot to fame, as good as he is.
eminem and 50 were helped by dre but they both kinda made it on their own.
eminem was unique and very talented and 50 was making a lotta noise even before he signed with aftermath/shady. why didnt truth hurts blow up even witha single like addictive? i honestly dont think hittman would have sold shit if dropped an album on aftermath.
i still have hope tho. maybe he'll drop the game album soon and he'll be accepted.
peace
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the fact dat chingy was wit DTP didnt mean much, luda wasnt in teh 1st single, or nuttin, its the fact dat chingy was wit def jam..like i said, u need the right label n promotion...and defjam has it!!
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the west simply does not make music which appeals to the majority of the rap music audience. its as simple as that.
there you have it, the answer everybodys lookin for. plain and simple as grundy said. most ppl will like 50 cent or ludacris over some WSCG or Suga Free shit
I dunno why you all want the west to blow up anyway. You'll say all this, but when a rapper from the west makes some corny commercial single aimed at kids then you will all say, oh, such as such sold out. You don't really want the west to blow up, and it isn't going to unless it goes all corny. If you like gangsta rap, then you can still buy gangsta rap, but you must realise that it will never be popular again in the mainstream.
good point. and once your famous djs will play your singles no matter what. they play it a million times in clubs and people will end up liking it cause they heard it so many times. look at ludacris recent singles, all of them sound the same and they are nothing special, but they get tons of play. guest appearances and affiliation will help you big time. look at g unit, or chingy, all their future singles gonna be popular just because they had first singles that blew em up. the west has put out way better tracks this year but they never get any airplay.