West Coast Connection Forum
DUBCC - Tha Connection => Outbound Connection => Topic started by: Doggystylin on April 07, 2004, 05:45:50 PM
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Yes, it is true, I hate to admit it, but its true, I mean some of you just dont understand the energy these people are sending out with their voice and lyrics, even if you are not listening to the music, just the energy in the songs.
hip-hop rarely brings across good messages and good vibes, and those are the conscious heads like talib kweli and mos def.
I mean what I cant understand is how an artist like dr dre can be STILL talking about the same shit he was talking about a decade ago and NOT GROW. The guy is damn near 40 years old, I would feel stupid as hell if i was him. After a while I just get fed up with these gangsta tales, I find it childish.
Then there is the influence this music has on society, which i will not get into too much because i feel like the listener has a resposibility of NOT BEING STUPID. but then the person making the music should be aware of the effects he will have with every word he says, well OF COURSE, a musician does not want you go out and kill people or do drugs and get in trouble or whatever, but he has to know his power. and a lot of rappers are ignorant to this.
I have been a defender of hip hop my whole life, i have always loved it and defended it like it was my family but now i have come to the realization that just about 90% of rap is negative and has negative effects. after reading a interview between cam'ron dame dash and bill o reilly, there really was no way to defend cam.
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i agree with your post...though i could care less...sounds good to my ears thats all i care
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i agree with your post...though i could care less...sounds good to my ears thats all i care
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I agree, lately I have tended to steer more towards positive hip-hop.
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yeah most of hip hop is negative and its gettin rediculous...most of the time its about killing or drugs or its just unbelievably offensive. but even people like mos def are negative...i mean...i love mos defs music and i'd say he's positive more than negative...but a lot of his stuff is negative in a totally different sense than the rest of hip hop...its really hard to find positive artists at all.
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Sure, there are negative messages in hip hop, what is new? Is this a news flask to ya'll???? Some people are unbeleivable to me. DId you realize there is also a lot of negative energy in movies, and even other forms of music.
Besides, there are PLENTY of intelligent rappers to listen to, who make incredible music. Sure, there are ignorant, arrogant, half-retarded idiots like Camron, but there are very intelligent people in hiphop too.
I just find this amusing that you just realized half of rap is negative though, it is just too funny. peace, and if you want a list of 20 rappers who do mostly positive music, holler .
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Sure, there are negative messages in hip hop, what is new? Is this a news flask to ya'll???? Some people are unbeleivable to me. DId you realize there is also a lot of negative energy in movies, and even other forms of music.
Besides, there are PLENTY of intelligent rappers to listen to, who make incredible music. Sure, there are ignorant, arrogant, half-retarded idiots like Camron, but there are very intelligent people in hiphop too.
I just find this amusing that you just realized half of rap is negative though, it is just too funny. peace, and if you want a list of 20 rappers who do mostly positive music, holler .
read what we were saying next time...times have changed...hip hop has grown...but yet some rappers are still stuck in the "fuck the police" "kill everything that walks" days.
yes you're right...other music forms are very negative...but theres a ton of positive (oh lets say...rock) to make up for it. go ahead though...i want a list of 20 rappers that do mostly positive music.
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hip hop isnt like how it used to be when it was balanced out you had peolpe like P.E. even though they were pretty angry but at least they had a message
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hip hop isnt like how it used to be when it was balanced out you had peolpe like P.E. even though they were pretty angry but at least they had a message
theres still tons of rappers with a message...just because they have a message doesnt mean they are positive.
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Rock music is mostly negative too...but here's a reality check....SO WHAT?
bottom line, HIP HOP is not for the SOFT!
even the positive rappers, they talk about real issues, again, not for the SOFT! reality is harsh, reality is negative....hip hop not 4 tha muthafucaz that feel like their ears are being molested when they hear 'fuc tha police'.
man y'all gotta realize...hip hop was made by and for the lower/working class...it's the music of the struggle...middle/high class people became fans and fascinated by it, they have no right to criticize all krayzie...
there are music for every occasion...there's rap music for the clubs, there's shit for tha blocs, yall ever posted on a real 'bloc'? wat do muthafucaz talk about, what do they get into? it's reality and U soft doods just have to accept it...U talkin bout it's negative for tha 'kids'? what kids? u talkin bout little kids? well so what? every damm movie out there is negative for kids, it is not made for them...but most still sneak in or buy and watch em...it works exactly the same way with music...don't gimme that pussy bullshit...it's reality and U soft doods just have to accept that...I can see your point of views, yall sit there on yur computers, and yur adrenaline aint pumping, yur environment is a 4 cornered bedroom and U dun wanna bump no gangsta shit...so U go ahead and bump your concious stuff, your kwelis, your mos defs, your atmospheres, you pissed at some shit? work? school? society? so then u bump your dead prez, your coups etc....I'm exactly tha same way....there's a right place and right time for EVERYTHING in this world...
what is positive anyway? really, think about it....do U even wanna hear that shit? I mean expressing how U feel inside, talkin down upon society etc...dats positive hip hop rite? well...news flash, dats not even positive either when u think about it...not even Ja Rule's love songs are positive...NOTHING is positive...but SO WHAT? the world is not a positive place...positive is a man made word anyway...so positive means nothing....enjoy the music and be you.
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actually rock is less negative than rap...
on the outside when you see bands like:
AC DC
Metallica
Black Sabbath
you think that they're satanic and promote evil and shit
i use to for years say "fuck rock, that shit is for white boy satanists....i like rap because it's real" the reality is rap is the least real music when you compare how much BS is out there....yeah rap has chuck d, pac, and Mos Def, and such but those artists are few and far between. most of the subject matter in hip hop is the glorification of drugs, violence, and selfishness. the majority of hits and classics that come from rap contain negativity. Alot of songs in other genres promote the same stuff too but no other genre celebrates it as much as hip hop.
now i can put out the same rock artists and name the meaning behind some of their most famous songs and you'd be amazed at the subject matter, it's just as hard as NWA but check the message:
master of puppets-Metallica; an anti drug song
War Pigs-Black Sabbath; Hypocracy of the Government,protest against vietnam
Hells Bells- ACDC; song about Alcaholism
in my opinon you can still be HARD without being deconstructive
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Dr. Dre is still making the same music, but Steven Spielberg is still making the same movies, while Stephen King is still writing the same books...Frankly, I don't see a difference...It's all entertainment.
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some of y'all are acting real ignorant right now...but i guess that's why y'all like hiphop, right? really, what's the point in listening to an emcee that promote's everything that you would never accept as acceptable? life isn't negative, it's all a person's perspective. and people haven't just realised it or even thought that times are changing, maybe they're just growing...who wants to listen to gangsta shouting profanity forever? what gangsta actually wants to be gangsta forever? hiphop is the most extreme and fake cult in the world. intelligence doesn't automatically equal positivity, you could be a criminal mastermind and brainwash kids for the government...lol
what i'm saying is, i'm sure everyone who agreed actually meant they're sick of the bullshit and want something with substance, point blank.
the bit i made bold.....the fact is does everyone find the same things acceptable?...i dunno about yall but i was raised to be like "fuck the police" an this is before i even was a rap fan....thats jus what its like round here....so when i hear a rapper sayin that im gunna relate cus it fits my mentality....
jus my 2cents...
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yeah it's negative....
but i went through a stage similar to that a while ago, and i sold a bunch of my cds. the past few years have been spent trying to find those cds again. for me, hip hop is like a nostalgia. i couldn't stop listening to it even if (and when) i tried. it's a part of my growing up and learning experience. and even if i decide not to listen to any new rap anymore, i'm always gonna think that the stuff that i've always liked is dope, cuz it's a part of me.
it's good to realize that rap is negative, cuz it broadens your horizons to other forms of music....but back to your point, i think we've all felt that one time or another
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I'm glad most of you realize what I'm talking about and see it the same way.
and to those who are arguing against me, let me tell you, all of you have that weak, oh rap is negative? well so are movies? so what? its still negative, its not going be positive just cause movie are bad too.
and if its pussy shit to not want to listen to music that praises all sorts of sin and destruction which what satan bassicly praises, then yeah im with that pussy shit. I might find it entertaining myself, yeah, but you know what the difference between a negative movie and a negative song is? you listen to songs constantly, and way more than you watch a movie, and that negative energy is constantly getting to you and YOU DONT EVEN KNOW IT!
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^^ no need to preach homie
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I can't speak for others, but i have turned out just fine DESPITE growing up on GANGSTER rap since i was in grade 6-7. I graduated highschool, i graduated university, i am a teacher, i am engaged, i do not drugs, i dont commit crimes, i dont swear every second word, i have a positive outlook on life, i have a positive self image, i respect women and people of all races.
All of the above despite the fact i constantly listened to NWA, Dre, Snoop, BIggie, Cube, Ren, Eazy, Too Short, WC, etc etc while growing up. My point, only people who are easily influenced and experienceing other problems in life will be susceptible to the negative messages in hiphop. Others will just enjoy the way a beat bumps, the way a mc flips his lyrics, the way a chorus is scratched in, etc.
BOttom line, its only entertainment. And for the first time ever, i agree with NIK: " Dr. Dre is still making the same music, but Steven Spielberg is still making the same movies, while Stephen King is still writing the same books...Frankly, I don't see a difference...It's all entertainment"
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I can't speak for others, but i have turned out just fine DESPITE growing up on GANGSTER rap since i was in grade 6-7. I graduated highschool, i graduated university, i am a teacher, i am engaged, i do not drugs, i dont commit crimes, i dont swear every second word, i have a positive outlook on life, i have a positive self image, i respect women and people of all races.
All of the above despite the fact i constantly listened to NWA, Dre, Snoop, BIggie, Cube, Ren, Eazy, Too Short, WC, etc etc while growing up. My point, only people who are easily influenced and experienceing other problems in life will be susceptible to the negative messages in hiphop. Others will just enjoy the way a beat bumps, the way a mc flips his lyrics, the way a chorus is scratched in, etc.
BOttom line, its only entertainment. And for the first time ever, i agree with NIK: " Dr. Dre is still making the same music, but Steven Spielberg is still making the same movies, while Stephen King is still writing the same books...Frankly, I don't see a difference...It's all entertainment"
bottom line: couldn't have said it better
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I hate to say this but...hip-hop/rap is negative music
LMAO
Man You are right almost. Hip Hop is the culture Rap is the music that explains the culture. If you thinks Gangster's don't cuss everyday. Your wrong. People have to stay true to self. If you want positive Rap listen to different Rappers. Listen to Kanye West, Talib, Mos Def etc. if you want something Different even Outkast they try something new some kids that come from where they come from will not be afraid to try something different. No one wants to hear love songs all day. But if you listen to Rock, R&B Country, & Blues That is most of what you will hear. Love & Love gone wrong songs. That happens to everyone. Getting Harassed by the cops does not happen to everyone. I was getting Harassed by the cops everyday for a while. I would listen to 2PAC, NWA, and Ice Cube everyday just to get by(All old music but still valid). I was not doing anything wrong didn't dress a certain way, didn't break any laws. All they could do is pull me over & detain me for a while then let me go. I can't blame some people for not giving up the Fuck the Police mentality. Shit hasn't changed it is just getting covered up. http://www.usdoj.gov/crt/voting/intro/intro_b.htm It ain't all good. So don't fool your self. It has pretty much always been negative. Why do you think Negativity sells more. People what something they can relate too. If not then their will be some riots in a minute. 8)
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none of you really have a strong arument against mine
JT said dont preach
teecee said it hasnt effected him, well guess what man, not everyone in the world is like you, and ill be it HAS effected you in ways you can not tell. The energy in the songs can build up anger, frustration and many other negative engergies when the rappers are sending that type of vibe out to the listener. Well you, ok you might be able to handle those energies because you are in control, but so many other people are not and rappers just ignorantly send out these messages. I mean you can talk about your hood and what goes on, but dont glorify carrying guns and selling cocaine while you fuck a bitch without a condom and then down a 40 and drive with a blunt in your mouth. Ok maybe one or two songs because its entertaining but not on every song on every album
I bet many other artists in the music industry drink alcohol, have sex and smoke weed too, but they dont promote it on every damn song, with rappers its almost a guarantee you will hear references like that in a song. damn man, 1. its not healthy, 2. its really dull and getting old, infact it got old in the late nineties.
and then Neji Huga, well i dont see how you are justifying rap's negativity, your saying it sells more? well of course it does, but it is destroying people from the inside. what im saying is that negativity is glorified and its wrong, rappers might as well promote rape and drunk driving too. Of course guys will like it when girls are getting slutty and giving it up, but think of the future and how it can effect your kids. Stop being ignorant and think about it before you all reply, im not saying agree with me, but i think you should think about what im saying atleast.
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some of y'all are acting real ignorant right now...but i guess that's why y'all like hiphop, right? really, what's the point in listening to an emcee that promote's everything that you would never accept as acceptable? life isn't negative, it's all a person's perspective. and people haven't just realised it or even thought that times are changing, maybe they're just growing...who wants to listen to gangsta shouting profanity forever? what gangsta actually wants to be gangsta forever? hiphop is the most extreme and fake cult in the world. intelligence doesn't automatically equal positivity, you could be a criminal mastermind and brainwash kids for the government...lol
what i'm saying is, i'm sure everyone who agreed actually meant they're sick of the bullshit and want something with substance, point blank.
Oh yeah and everyone, READ THIS AGAIN!, that bassicly kills anything anyone has said and will say in this thread. props man
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I can't speak for others, but i have turned out just fine DESPITE growing up on GANGSTER rap since i was in grade 6-7. I graduated highschool, i graduated university, i am a teacher, i am engaged, i do not drugs, i dont commit crimes, i dont swear every second word, i have a positive outlook on life, i have a positive self image, i respect women and people of all races.
All of the above despite the fact i constantly listened to NWA, Dre, Snoop, BIggie, Cube, Ren, Eazy, Too Short, WC, etc etc while growing up. My point, only people who are easily influenced and experienceing other problems in life will be susceptible to the negative messages in hiphop. Others will just enjoy the way a beat bumps, the way a mc flips his lyrics, the way a chorus is scratched in, etc.
BOttom line, its only entertainment. And for the first time ever, i agree with NIK: " Dr. Dre is still making the same music, but Steven Spielberg is still making the same movies, while Stephen King is still writing the same books...Frankly, I don't see a difference...It's all entertainment"
Im feelin that right there... the lyrics and shit fron rap, will only get to you or change you, if your weak minded... ain't none of them forcing you to do anything... it's entertainment, straight up...
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Doggy, i respect what you are trying to say, and it sucks that hiphop has negatiely impacted you. As for hiphop, it is still a relatively new type of music and i am willing to bet it will grow a lot more and become more well-rounded. If you dont like the negative music though, i would suggest listening to other artists or another music genre. And yo, negativity is always gonna be around us, you just gotta get your head right to the point where it doesnt effect you, ya feel me? As for preaching to others, i think most of us are smart enough to realize hiphop has negative messages.
I teach students who think eminem or 50 cent are gods, and i actually have discussions with then outside of the classroom to let them know these guys arent good role models....i dont think it is bad for young people to listen to rap, i just think they have a parent explain to them this isnt to be taken to serious.
And i have never cared which rappers are the "realest", cuz if any of these rappers arae actually still gangsters than they have fucking problems. Thats why i respect DRE, he is not even close to a gangster in real life, he just makes gangster music. Whether you like it or not, it is the same thing as what a Stephen King does.
What drew me to hiphop in the first place was the "gangster" attitude. Since then, i have aquired more well-rounded tastes in regards to rap, and artists like Talib and Last Emperor stay in my rotation as much as Dre or Snoop...peace man, and take it easy
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U still haven't answered my question....
SO WHAT?
cmon doggy, U and I kno U go thru phases....U go thru more phases than anyone I have ever known and U will come outta this one sooner or later....are U tellin me yur never going to listen 2 yur favorite group anymore because they're always rappin bout "murder"? Or are U just simply informing us that rap is negative.
mark my words....ANYTHING in this world CAN be negative, depends on that individual, little kids, they might listen 2 rap and get influenced but that can happen wit religion or anything else to that matter....There's no possible way U can argue against that....and i'm not justifying anything....
Mouse over here stressing bout how hip hop is a fake cult....now wat tha fuc does that mean? do U even know tha essense of hip hop? maybe hip hop just isn't for U because U was brought up in a different environment....how can U say something like this and be on this forum? dats what's ignorant to me....
Like I said, there's music for EVERY occasion....U don't have to constantly bump gangsta shit, wat kinda bullshit is this?....if it ain't for U, then it ain't for U....DON'T bump it....there needs to be more substance? dats true....but there is MORE substance in rap than EVER before rite now....go find em....jesus, y'all actin ignorant as fuc....
SO WHAT? SO WHAT? SO WHAT?
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and then Neji Huga, well i dont see how you are justifying rap's negativity, your saying it sells more? well of course it does, but it is destroying people from the inside. what im saying is that negativity is glorified and its wrong, rappers might as well promote rape and drunk driving too. Of course guys will like it when girls are getting slutty and giving it up, but think of the future and how it can effect your kids. Stop being ignorant and think about it before you all reply, im not saying agree with me, but i think you should think about what im saying atleast.
You need to read your own words! What I said was "Rap is explaining the Culture". If a lot of things are negative. Then Rap will be negative. Like it was in the Late 80's & early 90's. It's getting more negative because The culture is getting more negative. Like I stated "it ain't all good". The Link was about Black people losing their right to vote in 2007. I don't see how you can say "it is destroying people from the inside." People talking about the choices they would make, is not glorifying negativity. It's letting people know that sometimes people, have the same frame of mind in a Certain situations. btw Eminem rapped about Rape on his first CD. "Susan, stop cryin, I don't hate ya, The world's not against you, I'm sorry your father raped you, So what you had your little coochie in your dad's mouth? That ain't no reason to start wiggin and spaz out..." My Fault - Track 11. My Point is The overall theme of the Ghetto is negative. Anytime someone says "Ghetto" no one's thought is positive. If you music comes from the ghetto the only a few songs will be positive and the majority will be negative.
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ok, first of all i wanna thank everyone for keeping this conversation respectable
ok, first to teecee, yes rap is entertainment and i agree that people should be resposible, but so many young people that dont have a parent out there look up to these people as idols, I don't know about any of you but when i was 13, I sure as hell wanted to be like snoop and i think that rappers should take these things into consideration, because when you have as much power as someone who is reaching out to so many people, why doest the ARTIST HIMSELF, let the kids know, hey you know this is just entertainment. I'm tired of 50 brag about gettin shot like its a good thing, thats what i hate about rappers, you say they dont glorify negativity, but just listen to their music man. but then you have your entertainment arugment which is a strong argument, but i just dont like the vibes they give out to people. i mean a lot of people just dont understand the energy system, and how you can give bad energy to someone.
I'm not saying im never going to listen to hip hop again, I NEVER said that, I'm just noting, hip hop is negative, and it can really effect you if you listen to it too much, let it be entertainment and nothing else, so many people look at songs and albums as guidebooks, its crazy.
Will i listen to hip-hop less? yeah, i probably will. because to be honest, i dont see much growth in hip hop, i see so much negativity and repetition and its just real dull and redundant, so ill probably check out that hot creative album that gets released every once in a while, while i expand my horizons and listen to other types of music instead of listening to hiphop all the time.
Now neija huga, rap from the ghetto DOES NOT have to be negative, nothing HAS to be negative,almost everything can be flipped and turned into something positive, but that is not the case, i dont mind rappers explaining their environment, but once a rapper is rich and living in the suburbs i really doubt their environment is still so negative, rappers just have that negative mentality.
Rap, CAN be positive music, it has been proven, but it is not, so aslong as you accept all the heat rap is getting with no problem, then ok, but dont think that rappers are victimised, because they bring it upon themselves.
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I'll reply more on this in a minute, but you must know that almost all entertainment in this country relays a negetive message. We are living in a country of unbelief, anything for a dollar. Sex, violence, and sensationalism sells. It's even on your 5 oclock news, murder, rape, fear. They are selling the product of fear on your 10 oclock news! So don't single out hip-hop! Atleast rappers try to be honest with themselves.
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^thank you.
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lol for what^
Infinite said nothing new or anything that defends hip-hop. He said atleast hip hop is honest, ummm, thats laughable. Since when is hip hop honest, hip hop is filled with fairy tales about the hood. Of course there is truth in some hip-hop but then again there is some truth in movies and all other forms of entertainment. Rappers aren't even honest with themselves, with every rapper out there claiming their greater than others and trying to prove their gangsta. I've seen about a handfull of artists be honest with themselves. One of them is Kanye West who admits hes self-conscious and an asshole, but when have you seen Dre admit he has a big ego, infact he made a song about others having big ego's LMAO, again, very laughable comment. Next please.......
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lol for what^
Infinite said nothing new or anything that defends hip-hop. He said atleast hip hop is honest, ummm, thats laughable. Since when is hip hop honest, hip hop is filled with fairy tales about the hood. Of course there is truth in some hip-hop but then again there is some truth in movies and all other forms of entertainment. Rappers aren't even honest with themselves, with every rapper out there claiming their greater than others and trying to prove their gangsta. I've seen about a handfull of artists be honest with themselves. One of them is Kanye West who admits hes self-conscious and an asshole, but when have you seen Dre admit he has a big ego, infact he made a song about others having big ego's LMAO, again, very laughable comment. Next please.......
The meat of my argument is that hip-hop is negetive just like almost all entertainment in America is negetive. Argue that point. And what I meant about rappers being honest with themselves is that they will tell you from the get go that they don't "give a fuck". That they are saying whatever the fuck they want and that they are just talkin shit. Most rappers admit that they are all about money and hoes. They will tell you that. It's different when a news reporter gets on CNN and wears a suit and tie and promotes and claims to represent moral good to the world.
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The meat of my argument is that hip-hop is negetive just like almost all entertainment in America is negetive. Argue that point.
he already did...he said something to the effect of...
"yes movies are negative but theres a difference...you don't watch a movie anywhere near as much as you listen to a song..."
basically saying that not only do you not hear it as much but you don't memorize entire movies and play parts of them in your head when there is dead silence like you do with music. i don't agree with those faggots who think that we should blame marilyn manson for the columbine shootings or blame eminem when some kids smacks his mom...the listener has a responsibilty to not buy into this shit...but when this shit is "whats cool" then it gets kinda hard...peer pressure's a muhfucka.
and whoever said it earlier...im still waiting for my list of 20 positive artists ::)
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The meat of my argument is that hip-hop is negetive just like almost all entertainment in America is negetive. Argue that point.
Just cause one thing is wrong doesnt make the other thing right, I have argued that, read the thread. That has been everyone's argument.
Also, Hip-hop artists say they represent the hood, yeah I'm sure the hood is real proud of Snoop right now. That is just as bad as your news reporter argument.
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do i even know the essense of hip hop? are you kidding me? atleast rappers are honest with themselves? how? they know what they're doing is wrong but they'll keep doing it for money? they'll look for beef to get shot so they can become a superstar? hip hop is a fake cult. alotta of people that are "hip hop heads" are obsessed with it. it's fake because 99% of the shit gangsta raoppers spit is bullshit. it might happen, but they don't do it. and how can anyone say they aren't promoting negativity? half these rappers brag about how many hoes they get, how much expensive alcohol and imported smoke they can get thier hands on, how much heat they hold and people they'll gat down, how many bullets they can handle and how many times they dodge death. and most of this is just in an average song. when do they ever say it's just entertainment? they boast about the sins they commit expecting praise. i wasn't bought up in a different enviroment, i'm still in the mindframe of fuck the police, matter of fact, i'm more on some fuck the governement shit. how can i say some shit like this? because, i still love hip hop, i still listen to some shit i don't nessacerily agree with every once and a while but shit dogg, hip hop isn't honest. c'mon, be onest with yourself. i bet the shit you rhyme about ain't even honest... you know why? because, that's how you've been conditioned. infinite is right, saying all entertainment is negative etc. but that isn't what this post is about. everything equals money these days. don't fool yourself thinking you're listening to something real. what's real is when you go out and do an honest day's work to support your fam. what's real is when your girl dumps you for some asshole who claims to be gangsta. what's real is when you want to get out the gang but the gang members ain't having it so they hunt you down to kill you. living your life like a made man isn't real...
aiight, good answer, agreed 151%
especially wit tha 2nd part of tha paragraph....
but oh well....it's nothin 2 me....I've actually dwelled on this issue many times in my life....I just make it seem like I haven't because of the fact that I've come 2 realize that's just tha way it is and I don't want people coming in here bad mouthing hip hop and not appreciating for what it is....U just gotta see life in a bigger picture and charge tha pity shit to tha game....like dead prez I use alot as an example....they're always complaining about shit and they're right about those issues most of tha time....but so what? It's good to get people 2 be aware what's REAL....what's not good is 2 come in here and say 'hey, hip hop is too offensive, let's find other genres'....that would be the downfall of hip hop as we kno it....and I see it already too....I feel like hip hop has reached it's prime and is slowly fallin....I don't think it will ever fall completely too soon because urban america will always exist....but mainstream wise, it will slowly fall as people grow and generations change....but then again, how could it? what would replace it? hmmm....I dunno, it's an interesting subject....I still would like to stick to my point that ALL OF US in here arguing will still bump tha offensive shit at certain times just like we bump reflective/concious shit at other times....This thread is good to remind people and get people to be aware tho....dats where it ends pretty much....tha rest is so what?
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of course rap is negative, I've known that ever since I started listening to it. it doesn't bother me tho. I'm not stupid, I don't take to heart what these guys say, its just entertainment.
Look at California's Governor - Arnold. How many negative movies has he been in? The Terminator movies are negative as hell. There are tons of negative movies out that are very popular.
Look at video games. First person shooters are the biggest thing in video games, and have been for years. All you do is kill people. That is extremely negative. Look how popular the GTA games are, they are extremely negative. Remember how popular Mortal Kombat was when it first came out?
Just watch the news. How often is the news positive? More stories on the news are negative instead of positive. In fact I hardly ever see anything positive on the news, its pretty depressing. And this shit ain't made up entertainment, its real fuckin life shit.
Look at our world today, its majorly negative. Wars goin on, terrorist attatcks, homeless people, starving ass people, jobless people, people dying all the time. Our prisons in USA are overpopulated, meanwhile schools can't even get enuff funding. We can't even trust our own damn government here in the USA.
Shit look at American Idol, and that Judge Simon. Look how he treats people. I mean you really can't get anymore negative than that. He just shoots people's dreams down, and probably makes them feel like shit.
People luv drama and they luv negativity. How many people want to watch a movie where everything is all good, and there is no drama, no climax, nothing negative.
There is a lot of negative shit in the world, and I am surprised how people don't notice it. Rap is one of the very least negative things that society should be concerned with imo.
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Sorry, but if you let music affect your everyday life, you're probably a weak person...You're telling me that if a rapper bragged about how cool it is to get shot, you'd wanna get shot too? You say rap influenced you as a child, but do you know how many kids I've seen running around screaming "I'm Tony Montana!"...Fact is, that's not gunna stop me from watching gangster movies, and when i do watch gangster movies, I sure as hell wont let it affect my everyday life, like some idiots I know...What I'm basically saying is, you got to have self control...PeACe
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This is actually a very interesting thread, props to all for expressing their views.
I gotta say this: i was first attracted to hiphop BECAUSE of the negativity! I always knew it was negative, i never took it as gospel.
And for the person who says what we see on the news is just as bad, major props, because the way they package those stories is bullshit. Its all shock value, all fear, its always been that way but if it comes from respectable journalists then it must be accurate.'
And to the guy saying rappers dont rap about real things, listen to some Last Emperor, Masta Ace (Disposable Arts), Nas (at times), and even Kanye (you may not like him, but know one else raps about working at the Gap and being the "token blackie" when black people walked in.....
Lastly, look for the positive in hiphop, because there is more than you think. In any aspect of life, you can dwell on the negative of you want, but there is usually positive involved as well. Take Nas, he has made some completely ignorant songs, but listen to the lyrics of Rule or I Can, that is some real shit right there.
Just a question? What is a positive music genre?
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yup rap is negative, its funny why ppl are surprised that the police have special taskforces investigating rappers when they kill some1 in every song and rap about million dollar drug deals etc.
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This is actually a very interesting thread, props to all for expressing their views.
I gotta say this: i was first attracted to hiphop BECAUSE of the negativity! I always knew it was negative, i never took it as gospel.
And for the person who says what we see on the news is just as bad, major props, because the way they package those stories is bullshit. Its all shock value, all fear, its always been that way but if it comes from respectable journalists then it must be accurate.'
And to the guy saying rappers dont rap about real things, listen to some Last Emperor, Masta Ace (Disposable Arts), Nas (at times), and even Kanye (you may not like him, but know one else raps about working at the Gap and being the "token blackie" when black people walked in.....
Lastly, look for the positive in hiphop, because there is more than you think. In any aspect of life, you can dwell on the negative of you want, but there is usually positive involved as well. Take Nas, he has made some completely ignorant songs, but listen to the lyrics of Rule or I Can, that is some real shit right there.
Just a question? What is a positive music genre?
8)
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ok, first of all i wanna thank everyone for keeping this conversation respectable
Now neija huga, rap from the ghetto DOES NOT have to be negative, nothing HAS to be negative,almost everything can be flipped and turned into something positive, but that is not the case, i dont mind rappers explaining their environment, but once a rapper is rich and living in the suburbs i really doubt their environment is still so negative, rappers just have that negative mentality.
Rap, CAN be positive music, it has been proven, but it is not, so aslong as you accept all the heat rap is getting with no problem, then ok, but dont think that rappers are victimised, because they bring it upon themselves.
You know Pitbull you have called out my name but have not read my post. When did I say "rap from the ghetto have to be negative". Don't put your words in my Post. When did I say anything HAS to be Negative. I stated why sometings are negative. Like I stated earlier take your advice and read everone's words. I am not God so I can not tell people what has to be and does not have to be. READ MY POST Again! then read yours they don't match. You are just arguing nothing. I'm not justitfing I am explaning one reason for negativity, not all of them. Also I did state some of it will be postive. You would know that if you read my post. btw Jay-Z said it best ", how would you explain? I'm ten years removed, still the vibe is in my veins I got a hustler spirit, nigga period Check out my hat yo, peep the way I wear it Check out my swag' yo, I walk like a ballplayer No matter where you go, you are what you are player And you can try to change but that's just as hot player Man, you was who you was 'fore you got here Only God can judge me, so I'm gone Either love me, or leave me alone" - Album: The Black Album Song: Public Service Announcement (Interlude) 8)
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Hiphop is life and life is negative.
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Hiphop is life and life is negative.
life's only negative if you let it be
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Hiphop is life and life is negative.
life's only negative if you let it be
get the fuck outta here wit that... look what grundy said, he's basically right too.
Entertainment: Negative. So is Rap. See: comedy is mainly making fun of ppl --> negative.
movies: mainly ppl in trouble, drama, ppl getting killed, hurt etc --> negative.
music, Rap..: negative.
Entertainment is negative.
Our World: negative.
News: terrorist attacks, war in the middle east, rapes of little children, murderers, lies of presidents.. --> Negative.
My life: no job, bad grades at school, parents have hardly any money to support me with, my sister has to raise her 3 kids in a 3-Room-Flat on the 5th floor together with her husband, etc.... --> Negative.
Bottom Line: it is what it is. hiphop is negative, but so is life. and it's not like you let life be, it is just negative as a fact. of course you can ignore all the negative stuff and be happy or whatever, but c'mon, open your fuckin eyes.
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your the one who has to open your eyes, you think, oh everythings so bad, everythings so negative, everythings so rough,oh grow up, that type of mentality is childish.
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If you can't stand the heat, why don't you just become a hippy? 8)
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shut up dude, its stupid ass immature shit like that, that makes me come here less and less. ohwell though, peace, im done with this conversation, we've all said what we had to and if anyone learned anything then cool, if not then too bad.
oh yeah, i never really pay attention to my karma but ive noticed its really taken a plunge ever since i made this thread.....lol kids.
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your the one who has to open your eyes, you think, oh everythings so bad, everythings so negative, everythings so rough,oh grow up, that type of mentality is childish.
naw mane, it is ruff, it ain't no childish mentality, he's expressin how it is, dats real....if it don't apply to yur life, then don't speak on it....shit's ruff, but we don't need 2 be reminded by these type of threads....
bottomline doggy, U don't have a solution....what rapper is gone make songs about happy things on his whole album? lol....and if it's so stupid when certain rappers speak about they hood and how they came up, then don't listen, what is the big deal? U can't change anything....and yur still gone be listenin 2 tha same negative stuff....so end this bullshit.
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Hiphop is life and life is negative.
life's only negative if you let it be
get the fuck outta here wit that... look what grundy said, he's basically right too.
Entertainment: Negative. So is Rap. See: comedy is mainly making fun of ppl --> negative.
movies: mainly ppl in trouble, drama, ppl getting killed, hurt etc --> negative.
music, Rap..: negative.
Entertainment is negative.
Our World: negative.
News: terrorist attacks, war in the middle east, rapes of little children, murderers, lies of presidents.. --> Negative.
My life: no job, bad grades at school, parents have hardly any money to support me with, my sister has to raise her 3 kids in a 3-Room-Flat on the 5th floor together with her husband, etc.... --> Negative.
Bottom Line: it is what it is. hiphop is negative, but so is life. and it's not like you let life be, it is just negative as a fact. of course you can ignore all the negative stuff and be happy or whatever, but c'mon, open your fuckin eyes.
god damn...you really are getting fucked by the media arent you? for every negative thing in entertainment there is an equally positive one to make up for it...hip hop being the exception because there isnt much positivity in it...but movies...theres tons of postive ones, games....theres tons of games like GTA yes...but then theres tons of games like GT3, Crazy Taxi, NBA Street, etc...where they arent negative at all (minus a little trash talk ;D),
then you say life is negative? no...the only negative parts of life are what you see on tv...as i said...life's only negative if you let it be and thats probably the realest thing anyone has said out of this entire thread...stop acting like this is hell on earth....think about how worse off you could be...i dunno bout you but i sure as hell thank god for not being homeless, or retarded, or even being a drunk or something like that...those people have it way worse off than we do.
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damn, no disrespect intended, cos i dont know u but, some of those things u said about ur life i.e. bad grades at school, no job...are things that are kind of self inflicted...like, no matter what people say, everyone is capable of getting good grades, even if not in all subjects, and so job prospects are a follow on from that. i agree with Luke, there are a lot of people who are worse off in this world, for example i work with the a Red Cross project near where i live, with guys who are severely disabled, who are unable to walk, talk, have no control over there limbs etc etc...and they attend college to try and better themselves rather than focusing on the negativity...
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damn, no disrespect intended, cos i dont know u but, some of those things u said about ur life i.e. bad grades at school, no job...are things that are kind of self inflicted...like, no matter what people say, everyone is capable of getting good grades, even if not in all subjects, and so job prospects are a follow on from that. i agree with Luke, there are a lot of people who are worse off in this world, for example i work with the a Red Cross project near where i live, with guys who are severely disabled, who are unable to walk, talk, have no control over there limbs etc etc...and they attend college to try and better themselves rather than focusing on the negativity...
exactly...i worked at a place for a few weeks (volunteered) at Delta Rehab Center...where theres a couple hundered residents who either can't walk, can't talk, can't think...or all three...because of stupid shit they did in their lives before...and i gotta say seeing that shit makes you really think about how good your life is.
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Yes, it is true, I hate to admit it, but its true, I mean some of you just dont understand the energy these people are sending out with their voice and lyrics, even if you are not listening to the music, just the energy in the songs.
hip-hop rarely brings across good messages and good vibes, and those are the conscious heads like talib kweli and mos def.
I mean what I cant understand is how an artist like dr dre can be STILL talking about the same shit he was talking about a decade ago and NOT GROW. The guy is damn near 40 years old, I would feel stupid as hell if i was him. After a while I just get fed up with these gangsta tales, I find it childish.
Then there is the influence this music has on society, which i will not get into too much because i feel like the listener has a resposibility of NOT BEING STUPID. but then the person making the music should be aware of the effects he will have with every word he says, well OF COURSE, a musician does not want you go out and kill people or do drugs and get in trouble or whatever, but he has to know his power. and a lot of rappers are ignorant to this.
I have been a defender of hip hop my whole life, i have always loved it and defended it like it was my family but now i have come to the realization that just about 90% of rap is negative and has negative effects. after reading a interview between cam'ron dame dash and bill o reilly, there really was no way to defend cam.
Of course you're right, and of course many will disagree with you.... but it's the truth, people have known things like this forever. why do you think you feel good when you hear a good song? It's because it has an effect on you. Obviously, a negative song is going to have a negative effect on you, too, anybody should be able to figure that one out. Anybody that's ever heard a metallica song and ended up going 90 miles an hour down the freeway listening to it KNOWS music has an effect on your state of mind.
I totally agree with the evaluation of Dre, too, it's getting to the point it's embarassing. At least the young guys have an excuse, they can say they're ignorant. Dre should know better.
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Hiphop is life and life is negative.
life's only negative if you let it be
Exactly... in the end, it attracts two elements. Doggy's generally an upbeat optimistic person (or he's trying to be), so he realizes that Rap is negative, and life doesn't have to be like that.
Others feel that life is negative, and they think they relate to rap better.
Personally, I left most rap behind long ago, I know the shit's negative, and I'm just bored with negativity. It doesn't interest me. I don't know if it holds me back, but I just don't have an interest in it, so I don't listen to most of it.
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damn, no disrespect intended, cos i dont know u but, some of those things u said about ur life i.e. bad grades at school, no job...are things that are kind of self inflicted...like, no matter what people say, everyone is capable of getting good grades, even if not in all subjects, and so job prospects are a follow on from that. i agree with Luke, there are a lot of people who are worse off in this world, for example i work with the a Red Cross project near where i live, with guys who are severely disabled, who are unable to walk, talk, have no control over there limbs etc etc...and they attend college to try and better themselves rather than focusing on the negativity...
see... I know I talked about some things that only concern me and some of them I might even be capable to change, but most things concern all of us and most things arent changeable. I know that I dont have the worst life and shit, and that's what makes the world so damn negative, get it? My post wasnt intended to say how bad my life is, ppl who got it that way got it wrong... it was intended to describe how negative this whole fuckin globe is. you rather complete my theory wit your post instead of backin up Luke's without even knowing it.
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Good thread Doggy, props, I respect it. A lot of hip hop is negative, and it's understandable to some degree. We know how hip hop originated, and where most of the rappers came from. We understand the situations in the ghettos, and respect the fact that they shed light on them, brought some harsh reality to music, which is really an expression of self. But what gets annoying, is how rappers, to this day, still keep rapping about the same thing. We know how hard it is in the hood, and many people have experienced it, we know how messed up things are, its reality. But now it seems as if its a gimmick, people are just rapping about it, for the heck of it. It gets tiring to hear about fucking bitches, getting high, drinkin and about life is hard. It gets to the point when you're basically just hearing complaints over a beat. Hearing some one speak out and challange the fakeness in the media, show the reality of life instead of making music an escapist form of art is commendable and very interesting, but its the same thing over and over, its getting tiring. Heck, most rappers who talk about how hard life was in the hood didn't even have it that bad, compared to some living in countries like Africa or India. It's almost selfish.
There is negativity in the world, its a well known fact, but complaing about it isn't going to make a difference, wether you make a song about it, or a speech. I understand music is an expression of self, but instead of just complaning, maybe they should talk about how to make things better. I don't want someone rapping like they're in some sort of magical fantasy place where everything is always alright, and I don't want to hear someone constantly moaning and complaining about life, always looking at the darker side. Saying 'fuck the world' never helped anyone. And like I said earlier, the saddest thing is, most rappers just use it as a gimmick, a way to make money. Suddenly getting shot is cool, being "ghetto'" is cool (to all the people who are still in school, how many times have you heard someone say "ghetto" as a replacement for "cool" or "dope"?) Now it just gets pathetic, insulting to the people who really suffer.
And yes, I realize there are songs for different ocasions, a club song might have sexual references in it, or getting drunk etc. I can kinda understand that, and I don't care, but it gets annoying when thats ALLL a rapper ever talks about. Where is the originality? The content? Now days, theres not really much difference between one rapper or the other. Even if both claim to be rivals, when you get down to it, they really rap about the same damn stuff.
Yes we know life is hard, yes we know a lot of things suck, and we all enjoy sex, so its getting tiring to hear about these things in every track. If you really WANT to talk about how the world is messed up, also talk about what you can do about it. Or if you just want to complain, then stop talking solely about "the hood" and talk about how other people have it tougher.
As far as the influence upon children goes, personally I beleive that one of the most important gifts of man, is the ability to choose. You CHOOSE to be affected by a person or a thing, you make decisions every day, and you alone are responsible for your actions.
-V[ X ]
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damn, no disrespect intended, cos i dont know u but, some of those things u said about ur life i.e. bad grades at school, no job...are things that are kind of self inflicted...like, no matter what people say, everyone is capable of getting good grades, even if not in all subjects, and so job prospects are a follow on from that. i agree with Luke, there are a lot of people who are worse off in this world, for example i work with the a Red Cross project near where i live, with guys who are severely disabled, who are unable to walk, talk, have no control over there limbs etc etc...and they attend college to try and better themselves rather than focusing on the negativity...
see... I know I talked about some things that only concern me and some of them I might even be capable to change, but most things concern all of us and most things arent changeable. I know that I dont have the worst life and shit, and that's what makes the world so damn negative, get it? My post wasnt intended to say how bad my life is, ppl who got it that way got it wrong... it was intended to describe how negative this whole fuckin globe is. you rather complete my theory wit your post instead of backin up Luke's without even knowing it.
but the thing is there are very few things that are negative in life that you can't change....like obviously you can't change the fact that there is war....but look at the war this way...we're over there helping out other people so that we can make their lives a little bit more positive (GOD I WANT TO BELIEVE THAT). the fact is for every negative thing about life i could think of 100 positive things to cancel it out.
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damn, no disrespect intended, cos i dont know u but, some of those things u said about ur life i.e. bad grades at school, no job...are things that are kind of self inflicted...like, no matter what people say, everyone is capable of getting good grades, even if not in all subjects, and so job prospects are a follow on from that. i agree with Luke, there are a lot of people who are worse off in this world, for example i work with the a Red Cross project near where i live, with guys who are severely disabled, who are unable to walk, talk, have no control over there limbs etc etc...and they attend college to try and better themselves rather than focusing on the negativity...
see... I know I talked about some things that only concern me and some of them I might even be capable to change, but most things concern all of us and most things arent changeable. I know that I dont have the worst life and shit, and that's what makes the world so damn negative, get it? My post wasnt intended to say how bad my life is, ppl who got it that way got it wrong... it was intended to describe how negative this whole fuckin globe is. you rather complete my theory wit your post instead of backin up Luke's without even knowing it.
but the thing is there are very few things that are negative in life that you can't change....like obviously you can't change the fact that there is war....but look at the war this way...we're over there helping out other people so that we can make their lives a little bit more positive (GOD I WANT TO BELIEVE THAT). the fact is for every negative thing about life i could think of 100 positive things to cancel it out.
1. I want to believe that too, but I cant. Making yourself more naive than you actually are isnt the best solution I can think of.
2. I cant think of more positive things.
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damn, no disrespect intended, cos i dont know u but, some of those things u said about ur life i.e. bad grades at school, no job...are things that are kind of self inflicted...like, no matter what people say, everyone is capable of getting good grades, even if not in all subjects, and so job prospects are a follow on from that. i agree with Luke, there are a lot of people who are worse off in this world, for example i work with the a Red Cross project near where i live, with guys who are severely disabled, who are unable to walk, talk, have no control over there limbs etc etc...and they attend college to try and better themselves rather than focusing on the negativity...
see... I know I talked about some things that only concern me and some of them I might even be capable to change, but most things concern all of us and most things arent changeable. I know that I dont have the worst life and shit, and that's what makes the world so damn negative, get it? My post wasnt intended to say how bad my life is, ppl who got it that way got it wrong... it was intended to describe how negative this whole fuckin globe is. you rather complete my theory wit your post instead of backin up Luke's without even knowing it.
but the thing is there are very few things that are negative in life that you can't change....like obviously you can't change the fact that there is war....but look at the war this way...we're over there helping out other people so that we can make their lives a little bit more positive (GOD I WANT TO BELIEVE THAT). the fact is for every negative thing about life i could think of 100 positive things to cancel it out.
1. I want to believe that too, but I cant. Making yourself more naive than your isnt the best solution I can think of.
2. I cant think of more positive things.
what i meant by i want to believe that is i'd like to believe thats the reason we went there in the first place and its not...but if you look at it that is the outcome...saddam is out of power...therefore we have helped make some peoples lives a little better.
the reason you can't think of more positive things is because you have your mind dead set on thinking life is nothing but negativity...and its not...open it up a bit and i bet you'll find life is a lot more positive than you think...for instance...in 2 weeks i lost my girl, my job, and i had to go to the doctor tons of times for health problems...of course i was thinking negatively...but then it all turned out good in the end...i got a new job, health shit went away...im over the girl...and i feel great...the fact is everything turns out ok at some point.
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bit off topic but can u throw me a link for that particular cam/dame dash interview man?
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Tray Deee's almost 40 too isn't he?
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bit off topic but can u throw me a link for that particular cam/dame dash interview man?
It was posted on the board a while back, it was pretty embarassing. Bill O'Reilly had a school teacher on, and they were specifically asking Cam about lyrics, and he just came off as a total dumbass. EVEN Dame Dash was coming down on O'reilly's side because Cam was just saying STUPID shit.
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I mean what I cant understand is how an artist like dr dre can be STILL talking about the same shit he was talking about a decade ago and NOT GROW. The guy is damn near 40 years old, I would feel stupid as hell if i was him. After a while I just get fed up with these gangsta tales, I find it childish.
Then there is the influence this music has on society, which i will not get into too much because i feel like the listener has a resposibility of NOT BEING STUPID. but then the person making the music should be aware of the effects he will have with every word he says, well OF COURSE, a musician does not want you go out and kill people or do drugs and get in trouble or whatever, but he has to know his power. and a lot of rappers are ignorant to this.
I have been a defender of hip hop my whole life, i have always loved it and defended it like it was my family but now i have come to the realization that just about 90% of rap is negative and has negative effects. after reading a interview between cam'ron dame dash and bill o reilly, there really was no way to defend cam.
I totally agree with the evaluation of Dre, too, it's getting to the point it's embarassing. At least the young guys have an excuse, they can say they're ignorant. Dre should know better.
DRE did try to change, but his album flopped...remember "The Aftermath" Remember "Been There, Done That"??? It didnt sell at all.....
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Yup. His album didn't sell, so he made sure his next album was a sell ou... urgh, sold out.