Goldie Loc and Tray Dee arnt shit without Snoop, has Goldie retired?

[Eihtball]

First of all, in the letter ATL wrote to "The Source" where they complained about not being on the Top 100 artists of all time list, they claimed it was "Black Mafia Life" that Dre copied.  Not the "Vocally Pimpin" EP or any of Kokane's albums, but "BML" specifically.  It's kinda odd that they would say that, no?  You'd think they would be more familiar with their own catalog of work.

Second, I've heard both of those albums (I even used to have "Vocally Pimpin" on 12" years ago), and while I will say that there are some samples and production techniques that might be associated with G-Funk, the overall production approach doesn't follow a unified template (this is also true of "BML") - it's clear that even if Hutch was experimenting with new sounds, he hadn't yet figured out a definitive style (which is what G-Funk represents).  In particular, note the lack of synth layers and the obvious lack of attempts to create a more melodic sound on almost every track (using the long keyboard melodies and live instrumention that is common in Dre's work).  You noted earlier that you thought "The Chronic" sounded "cleaner" than "BML" - that's because Hutch was obviously not trying to do the same thing as Dre.  Even if Dre did borrow some ideas from Hutch (and I'll admit that's possible), the simple fact is that in terms of sonic detail, Dre was light-years ahead of Hutch - and this is evident on all of his tracks.  And finally, I've already argued that "Alwayz Into Something" could be considered a G-Funk precursor track - meaning Dre had G-Funk out in '91 as well, if you count these "precursors".

Third, "Deep Cover" wasn't on "The Chronic", but it IS a G-Funk single - it has every single production element that Dre used "The Chronic".  And if you think half of that album is an extension of the N.W.A. sound, you're greatly mistaken - the only songs I'll admit sound a lot less like G-Funk are "The Day The Niggaz Took Over", "Stranded On Death Row", and "Lyrical Gangbang" (I included this one only because the drums are sampled from Led Zeppelin rather than James Brown or any other soul/R&B records - those whiny synthesizers that pop up between verses are very much a characteristic of G-Funk).  Everything Dre had done on that record was a complete departure from what he'd done with N.W.A. (except, of course, "Alwayz Into Something", which I've referred to repeatdly) - the main difference, as I've said before, is that G-Funk emphasizes the softer, more melodic qualities of funk to create a more laid-back, down-tempo sound, whereas Dre's previous work (and that work of gangsta producers in general beforehand) was harder-edged and more up-tempo.

Oh, yeah, and if you think those Monie Love and Naughty By Nature joints are G-Funk, you're mistaken.  You don't have to be a musician or a producer to know what G-Funk is - trust me, I've worked as a music critic (I'm currently a teacher) before, and I'm quite familiar with the G-Funk sound.  I've also been listening to those kinds of records for a very long time now, and I can assure you, when that sound came out, it was so distinctive that it was impossible not to know what it was as soon as you heard it.

[nibs]

First of all, in the letter ATL wrote to "The Source" where they complained about not being on the Top 100 artists of all time list, they claimed it was "Black Mafia Life" that Dre copied.  Not the "Vocally Pimpin" EP or any of Kokane's albums, but "BML" specifically.  It's kinda odd that they would say that, no?  You'd think they would be more familiar with their own catalog of work.

i believe "dre day" jacks a beat directly off "black mafia life" (uses the same sample) and this this the the most eggregious example of dre's copying.

Second, I've heard both of those albums (I even used to have "Vocally Pimpin" on 12" years ago), and while I will say that there are some samples and production techniques that might be associated with G-Funk, the overall production approach doesn't follow a unified template (this is also true of "BML")

sure.  you can see cold 187um developing his sound from album to album, hutch stated that dre heard "black mafia life" while they were developing it and this is when he stole the sound, ran with it and did "dre day" and the rest.  i think dre's sound on the chronic was far more polished than what hutch was doing on "black mafia life".  all i'm saying is you can see hutch developing the sound all along, andhutch had g-funk precursors atleast out first.

it's clear that even if Hutch was experimenting with new sounds, he hadn't yet figured out a definitive style (which is what G-Funk represents).

i agree with you here. 

the simple fact is that in terms of sonic detail, Dre was light-years ahead of Hutch - and this is evident on all of his tracks.

i believe dre took hutch's sound and improved on it.  in that sense i agree with your statements.

Oh, yeah, and if you think those Monie Love and Naughty By Nature joints are G-Funk, you're mistaken.  You don't have to be a musician or a producer to know what G-Funk is - trust me, I've worked as a music critic (I'm currently a teacher) before, and I'm quite familiar with the G-Funk sound.

i don't think we agree on what g-funk is.  i think the monie love track, and certainly the naughty track are much more pure forms of g-funk than something like "rat-tat-tat-tat" or even "deep cover".

[snoopdoggfan32002]

Yeah, I liked Tray Deee as well, and it's too bad he got himself into some shit and won't be outta prison till he's 50.

is that all???  tray deee is old as fuck.  he's like 49 right now.  tray deee will be 50 in march.  he could have the album out by summer...

lol

you guys have been on point in this thread.  goldie was always the weakest link in the group, and a tray deee solo album would be hot.  i'm curious what tray would rhyme about for a full album.  16 tracks about groupies and og shit, or would he expand his subject matter?  i'd like to see a tray deee solo album.

tray deee isn't better than ras kass though.  whoever said that needs to hook me up with a hit off whatever they're smoking.  that must be some bomb shit.

is tray deee 49?
I tought he was 39

[nibs]

Yeah, I liked Tray Deee as well, and it's too bad he got himself into some shit and won't be outta prison till he's 50.

is that all???  tray deee is old as fuck.  he's like 49 right now.  tray deee will be 50 in march.  he could have the album out by summer...

lol

is tray deee 49?
I tought he was 39

i was joking about tray deee's age.  i don't know how old he is but the consensus seems to be 39.