Author Topic: Evolution  (Read 2172 times)

BG Rapsodie

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Re: Evolution
« Reply #15 on: December 01, 2009, 09:36:01 AM »
Well I guess I got into something else here, but I will say that the more I learn about evolution, the more I am led to believe that there is something that created this.  Things are almost too complex to insist that it "just happened".  Now I don't think whatever created everything is some church's idea of God, but I think there is someone/thing that is responsible.
Real fuckin' got damn talk.


And who don't agree wit evolution?? We don't believe we EVOLVED FROM MONKEYS. How Christians reject the idea of advancing? We know we evolve. Look at fuckin' race got damn it. Evolution in the context of 'ape to man' is what we reject. In THAT context of evolution.

no one says we evolved from apes. Its that we evolved from a common ancestor.

also, monkey isn't the same as ape.

Aight, Technical Timothy, but wasn't you the other nigga in that thread implying you believe we evolved from an ape??

No...the theory is that we and apes evolved from the same thing. I'm going to use a word you like to use. Coincidence. Do you think its a coincidence that we are physically so similarly to apes? What about all fossils that have been found of Homo Erectus, Neanderthal, etc, other intelligent humanoids? None of this supports your belief that humans were "created".


Here's my problem, (not that I care one way or another what actually happened); Just because we have found fossils from a long time ago of skeletons that are similar to ours', and just because there may have one time been species that no longer exist today, doesn't mean out species wasn't created, just like the other species were created.

I'm not a scientist, but neither is anyone here, and my problem with people that argue evolution is the word proof and fact. For me proof and fact requires something a lot more concrete than theories based on theories.

But I'd say theories based on evidence are more logical and believable than something based on no evidence, right? Evolution is fact, because we see it happen and we know species have evolved from other species. The actual way it happened has yet to be fully resolved. Not being completely sure of the full details is not a logical reason to turn to religion, which doesn't use any empirical evidence. It's equivalent to the pilgrims believing in witchcraft because they couldn't "understand" why their crops kept dying.

Everyone is welcome to believe in religion, but trying to say it is logical is ridiculous. It's called faith for a reason, precisely because it isn't logical. The theory that says man and ape have a common ancestor may be still just a theory, but its entirely logical because its based on DNA similarities, fossil records, and what we know about evolution, and draws the likely conclusion based on the evidence.

« Last Edit: December 01, 2009, 09:41:36 AM by rapsodie, the troll prince »
 

BG Rapsodie

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Re: Evolution
« Reply #16 on: December 01, 2009, 09:37:58 AM »
Aight, Technical Timothy

Gotta try to use that one on someone tomorrow lol


 :D


Well I guess I got into something else here, but I will say that the more I learn about evolution, the more I am led to believe that there is something that created this.  Things are almost too complex to insist that it "just happened".  Now I don't think whatever created everything is some church's idea of God, but I think there is someone/thing that is responsible.
Real fuckin' got damn talk.


And who don't agree wit evolution?? We don't believe we EVOLVED FROM MONKEYS. How Christians reject the idea of advancing? We know we evolve. Look at fuckin' race got damn it. Evolution in the context of 'ape to man' is what we reject. In THAT context of evolution.

no one says we evolved from apes. Its that we evolved from a common ancestor.

also, monkey isn't the same as ape.

Aight, Technical Timothy, but wasn't you the other nigga in that thread implying you believe we evolved from an ape??

No...the theory is that we and apes evolved from the same thing. I'm going to use a word you like to use. Coincidence. Do you think its a coincidence that we are physically so similarly to apes? What about all fossils that have been found of Homo Erectus, Neanderthal, etc, other intelligent humanoids? None of this supports your belief that humans were "created".
So who created the apes?

Like I and others on this board have already said, pick up a book. It ain't my job to explain evolution to someone who isn't willing to learn beyond what they have been conditioned for.
 

QuietTruth

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Re: Evolution
« Reply #17 on: December 01, 2009, 09:48:01 AM »
Aight, Technical Timothy

Gotta try to use that one on someone tomorrow lol


 :D


Well I guess I got into something else here, but I will say that the more I learn about evolution, the more I am led to believe that there is something that created this.  Things are almost too complex to insist that it "just happened".  Now I don't think whatever created everything is some church's idea of God, but I think there is someone/thing that is responsible.
Real fuckin' got damn talk.


And who don't agree wit evolution?? We don't believe we EVOLVED FROM MONKEYS. How Christians reject the idea of advancing? We know we evolve. Look at fuckin' race got damn it. Evolution in the context of 'ape to man' is what we reject. In THAT context of evolution.

no one says we evolved from apes. Its that we evolved from a common ancestor.

also, monkey isn't the same as ape.

Aight, Technical Timothy, but wasn't you the other nigga in that thread implying you believe we evolved from an ape??

No...the theory is that we and apes evolved from the same thing. I'm going to use a word you like to use. Coincidence. Do you think its a coincidence that we are physically so similarly to apes? What about all fossils that have been found of Homo Erectus, Neanderthal, etc, other intelligent humanoids? None of this supports your belief that humans were "created".
So who created the apes?

Like I and others on this board have already said, pick up a book. It ain't my job to explain evolution to someone who isn't willing to learn beyond what they have been conditioned for.

Looks like you're stumped. Aww, damn.
 

Shallow

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Re: Evolution
« Reply #18 on: December 01, 2009, 10:43:07 AM »
Well I guess I got into something else here, but I will say that the more I learn about evolution, the more I am led to believe that there is something that created this.  Things are almost too complex to insist that it "just happened".  Now I don't think whatever created everything is some church's idea of God, but I think there is someone/thing that is responsible.
Real fuckin' got damn talk.


And who don't agree wit evolution?? We don't believe we EVOLVED FROM MONKEYS. How Christians reject the idea of advancing? We know we evolve. Look at fuckin' race got damn it. Evolution in the context of 'ape to man' is what we reject. In THAT context of evolution.

no one says we evolved from apes. Its that we evolved from a common ancestor.

also, monkey isn't the same as ape.

Aight, Technical Timothy, but wasn't you the other nigga in that thread implying you believe we evolved from an ape??

No...the theory is that we and apes evolved from the same thing. I'm going to use a word you like to use. Coincidence. Do you think its a coincidence that we are physically so similarly to apes? What about all fossils that have been found of Homo Erectus, Neanderthal, etc, other intelligent humanoids? None of this supports your belief that humans were "created".


Here's my problem, (not that I care one way or another what actually happened); Just because we have found fossils from a long time ago of skeletons that are similar to ours', and just because there may have one time been species that no longer exist today, doesn't mean out species wasn't created, just like the other species were created.

I'm not a scientist, but neither is anyone here, and my problem with people that argue evolution is the word proof and fact. For me proof and fact requires something a lot more concrete than theories based on theories.

But I'd say theories based on evidence are more logical and believable than something based on no evidence, right? Evolution is fact, because we see it happen and we know species have evolved from other species. The actual way it happened has yet to be fully resolved. Not being completely sure of the full details is not a logical reason to turn to religion, which doesn't use any empirical evidence. It's equivalent to the pilgrims believing in witchcraft because they couldn't "understand" why their crops kept dying.

Everyone is welcome to believe in religion, but trying to say it is logical is ridiculous. It's called faith for a reason, precisely because it isn't logical. The theory that says man and ape have a common ancestor may be still just a theory, but its entirely logical because its based on DNA similarities, fossil records, and what we know about evolution, and draws the likely conclusion based on the evidence.



Who said anything about religion? I said there is no proof, as in there can be no alternative to what happened and you say because it is the most logical we should use it. Ok great, we agree. The difference between me and you I think is you say unless something else comes along we use evolution, and I say until something else comes along we use evolution.

Your "faith" in modern science is much stronger than my "faith" in God. I don't go out in the streets assuring people of God's word. Your side of the argument says it's ridiculous not to think we all evolved from the same things and that anything else isn't possible. Here is the only thing I know for sure about Science; every 100 years or so the current scientists look back at the old ones and call them idiots, more or less.

I'm not saying there is anything other than evolution that should be taught in a science class. There isn't. But to teach evolution the same way you teach physics is wrong. You can't really teach it scientifically or mathematically. At best it should be taught more like archeology would be taught; with the understanding that we cannot know for sure and we cannot assume we'll never find a new discovery that doesn't change everything about what we think of it. When you shoot an arrow at a falling object and you shoot it at the same time it starts to fall you have to aim where it was sitting before it fell in order to hit the object, because gravity will make the arrow fall at the same rate as the object. We will never discover something new about gravity that will make us change that theory. The very world around us would have to change. We can study it and practice it a million times to the same result. With evolution we can only observe and try and find patterns. We cannot control or test out the patterns, or create the patterns. We can someday find a new pattern or a change in the pattern that makes us question everything about what we knew as "fact".
 

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Re: Evolution
« Reply #19 on: December 01, 2009, 11:50:37 AM »
People who try to turn evolution vs. creation into some kind of retarded east coast vs. west coast beef when the idea of evolution doesn't even support or hurt religion are even worse and should be treated accordingly.
The first setence is outright harsh. What happened to "respecting other people's beliefs"? Should only religious believers be held to that standard? Props to you (for the second sentence) and MDogg for speaking the truth.
The first sentence is not harsh. At least we could take a group of useless people and make them useful.

It's not about beliefs, its about facts. If I tell you the sky is blue, take you outside, point upwards at the blue sky and you say, "I dunno.......it could be red or yellow", then that would make you a fucking moron......by choice.

I'm all for respecting people's beliefs as long as it seems somewhat logical or as long as there isn't any concrete evidence against it. Somebody who is unwilling to accept proven fact usually will never do anything but burden you and me somehow.
Just like it use to be a fact that the Earth was falt or that the Sun revolved around the Earth. :P Facts change, certainty is nonexistent.
 

BG Rapsodie

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Re: Evolution
« Reply #20 on: December 01, 2009, 12:25:14 PM »
Aight, Technical Timothy

Gotta try to use that one on someone tomorrow lol


 :D


Well I guess I got into something else here, but I will say that the more I learn about evolution, the more I am led to believe that there is something that created this.  Things are almost too complex to insist that it "just happened".  Now I don't think whatever created everything is some church's idea of God, but I think there is someone/thing that is responsible.
Real fuckin' got damn talk.


And who don't agree wit evolution?? We don't believe we EVOLVED FROM MONKEYS. How Christians reject the idea of advancing? We know we evolve. Look at fuckin' race got damn it. Evolution in the context of 'ape to man' is what we reject. In THAT context of evolution.

no one says we evolved from apes. Its that we evolved from a common ancestor.

also, monkey isn't the same as ape.

Aight, Technical Timothy, but wasn't you the other nigga in that thread implying you believe we evolved from an ape??

No...the theory is that we and apes evolved from the same thing. I'm going to use a word you like to use. Coincidence. Do you think its a coincidence that we are physically so similarly to apes? What about all fossils that have been found of Homo Erectus, Neanderthal, etc, other intelligent humanoids? None of this supports your belief that humans were "created".
So who created the apes?

Like I and others on this board have already said, pick up a book. It ain't my job to explain evolution to someone who isn't willing to learn beyond what they have been conditioned for.

Looks like you're stumped. Aww, damn.

I'm not the one who's stumped. Google the shit. it ain't my job to do your research for you. You shouldn't be involved in the conversation if you don't understand what's being discussed.
« Last Edit: December 01, 2009, 12:29:12 PM by rapsodie, the troll prince »
 

BG Rapsodie

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Re: Evolution
« Reply #21 on: December 01, 2009, 12:51:00 PM »
Well I guess I got into something else here, but I will say that the more I learn about evolution, the more I am led to believe that there is something that created this.  Things are almost too complex to insist that it "just happened".  Now I don't think whatever created everything is some church's idea of God, but I think there is someone/thing that is responsible.
Real fuckin' got damn talk.


And who don't agree wit evolution?? We don't believe we EVOLVED FROM MONKEYS. How Christians reject the idea of advancing? We know we evolve. Look at fuckin' race got damn it. Evolution in the context of 'ape to man' is what we reject. In THAT context of evolution.

no one says we evolved from apes. Its that we evolved from a common ancestor.

also, monkey isn't the same as ape.

Aight, Technical Timothy, but wasn't you the other nigga in that thread implying you believe we evolved from an ape??

No...the theory is that we and apes evolved from the same thing. I'm going to use a word you like to use. Coincidence. Do you think its a coincidence that we are physically so similarly to apes? What about all fossils that have been found of Homo Erectus, Neanderthal, etc, other intelligent humanoids? None of this supports your belief that humans were "created".


Here's my problem, (not that I care one way or another what actually happened); Just because we have found fossils from a long time ago of skeletons that are similar to ours', and just because there may have one time been species that no longer exist today, doesn't mean out species wasn't created, just like the other species were created.

I'm not a scientist, but neither is anyone here, and my problem with people that argue evolution is the word proof and fact. For me proof and fact requires something a lot more concrete than theories based on theories.

But I'd say theories based on evidence are more logical and believable than something based on no evidence, right? Evolution is fact, because we see it happen and we know species have evolved from other species. The actual way it happened has yet to be fully resolved. Not being completely sure of the full details is not a logical reason to turn to religion, which doesn't use any empirical evidence. It's equivalent to the pilgrims believing in witchcraft because they couldn't "understand" why their crops kept dying.

Everyone is welcome to believe in religion, but trying to say it is logical is ridiculous. It's called faith for a reason, precisely because it isn't logical. The theory that says man and ape have a common ancestor may be still just a theory, but its entirely logical because its based on DNA similarities, fossil records, and what we know about evolution, and draws the likely conclusion based on the evidence.



Who said anything about religion? I said there is no proof, as in there can be no alternative to what happened and you say because it is the most logical we should use it. Ok great, we agree. The difference between me and you I think is you say unless something else comes along we use evolution, and I say until something else comes along we use evolution.

Your "faith" in modern science is much stronger than my "faith" in God. I don't go out in the streets assuring people of God's word. Your side of the argument says it's ridiculous not to think we all evolved from the same things and that anything else isn't possible. Here is the only thing I know for sure about Science; every 100 years or so the current scientists look back at the old ones and call them idiots, more or less.

I'm not saying there is anything other than evolution that should be taught in a science class. There isn't. But to teach evolution the same way you teach physics is wrong. You can't really teach it scientifically or mathematically. At best it should be taught more like archeology would be taught; with the understanding that we cannot know for sure and we cannot assume we'll never find a new discovery that doesn't change everything about what we think of it. When you shoot an arrow at a falling object and you shoot it at the same time it starts to fall you have to aim where it was sitting before it fell in order to hit the object, because gravity will make the arrow fall at the same rate as the object. We will never discover something new about gravity that will make us change that theory. The very world around us would have to change. We can study it and practice it a million times to the same result. With evolution we can only observe and try and find patterns. We cannot control or test out the patterns, or create the patterns. We can someday find a new pattern or a change in the pattern that makes us question everything about what we knew as "fact".

I think you are misunderstanding what I'm saying. Evolution is scientific fact. There's no reason it shouldn't be taught. Its as factual as gravity, or the earth revolving around the sun. The current explanation of how human's have evolved is what is the theory (with a lot of evidence I might add), and as far as I'm aware, its taught as a theory. I haven't taken science in a while.

I didn't say its ridiculous to believe in god. Everyone has things they hope are true, like luck and superstition. For some people, believing in a religion gives them a sense of purpose and makes them feel better. What I did say, is that its ridiculous to believe that belief in religion is a logical conclusion (which is more along the lines of what QT has been saying). When someone signs on with a religion, they are stepping away from logical reasoning and into something based on complete faith.

 

Shallow

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Re: Evolution
« Reply #22 on: December 01, 2009, 03:23:11 PM »
That's wrong. Gravity and Evolution are not the same. You can use the scientific method to study gravity in a way you cannot for evolution. The math doesn't exist in the same way. A lot of evolution has to do with the best logical answer based on unseen history. Gravity has nothing to do with history. It is now and we can study it. I'm not saying certain things aren't currently evolving, but saying the human race was once homo erectus is based on faith, logical faith, but faith. Saying on two objects of different mass fall at the same rate is based complete on math and science, and certainty.
 

C-BLUE

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Re: Evolution
« Reply #23 on: December 01, 2009, 03:59:14 PM »
I can't believe you muthafuccas are debating the same goddamn thing in every other thread now. I almost want there to be a hell now. I'll take all of you with me.
 

BG Rapsodie

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Re: Evolution
« Reply #24 on: December 01, 2009, 04:11:28 PM »
That's wrong. Gravity and Evolution are not the same. You can use the scientific method to study gravity in a way you cannot for evolution. The math doesn't exist in the same way. A lot of evolution has to do with the best logical answer based on unseen history. Gravity has nothing to do with history. It is now and we can study it. I'm not saying certain things aren't currently evolving, but saying the human race was once homo erectus is based on faith, logical faith, but faith. Saying on two objects of different mass fall at the same rate is based complete on math and science, and certainty.

wtf are you talking about? Homo Erectus is extinct.

Evolution is a fact. We have seen evolution occur.

And the theory part of it as it pertains to humans, has nothing to do with faith. Faith doesn't use evidence. There is overwhelming evidence to support that humans evolved from a more primitive ape-like species. That is the logical and most likely conclusion, not "faith."
« Last Edit: December 01, 2009, 04:16:24 PM by rapsodie, the troll prince »
 

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Re: Evolution
« Reply #25 on: December 01, 2009, 04:14:54 PM »
doesn't bacteria mutate/evolve based on its environment? It's a living organism, and so are we. Most atheists try to bring up evolution to discredit faith in religion, but evolution is one of the reasons I have faith. these people think they're making fun of religious ignorance, but instead they're being even more ignorant.
 

Shallow

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Re: Evolution
« Reply #26 on: December 01, 2009, 04:45:05 PM »
That's wrong. Gravity and Evolution are not the same. You can use the scientific method to study gravity in a way you cannot for evolution. The math doesn't exist in the same way. A lot of evolution has to do with the best logical answer based on unseen history. Gravity has nothing to do with history. It is now and we can study it. I'm not saying certain things aren't currently evolving, but saying the human race was once homo erectus is based on faith, logical faith, but faith. Saying on two objects of different mass fall at the same rate is based complete on math and science, and certainty.

wtf are you talking about? Homo Erectus is extinct.

Evolution is a fact. We have seen evolution occur.

And the theory part of it as it pertains to humans, has nothing to do with faith. Faith doesn't use evidence. There is overwhelming evidence to support that humans evolved from a more primitive ape-like species. That is the logical and most likely conclusion, not "faith."


The fact that you say most likely proves that it is faith. That's what fact and proof are. You said most likely, there is no dispute, and the idea that something is most likely and not certain means it is faith. Thank you for arguing in my favor. Only when there is no doubt what so ever does faith cease to exist.

And of course faith uses evidence. Faith doesn't mean crazy Christians talking about men living in whales. It means believing in something that you aren't 100% sure of and cannot show to anyone to prove. If evolution were like gravity you could show it to all these nuts and convince them otherwise. But evolution, just like carbon dating is not as solid as gravity. That's my only point. I am not arguing for creationism or intelligent design.
 

BG Rapsodie

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Re: Evolution
« Reply #27 on: December 01, 2009, 04:52:28 PM »
That's wrong. Gravity and Evolution are not the same. You can use the scientific method to study gravity in a way you cannot for evolution. The math doesn't exist in the same way. A lot of evolution has to do with the best logical answer based on unseen history. Gravity has nothing to do with history. It is now and we can study it. I'm not saying certain things aren't currently evolving, but saying the human race was once homo erectus is based on faith, logical faith, but faith. Saying on two objects of different mass fall at the same rate is based complete on math and science, and certainty.

wtf are you talking about? Homo Erectus is extinct.

Evolution is a fact. We have seen evolution occur.

And the theory part of it as it pertains to humans, has nothing to do with faith. Faith doesn't use evidence. There is overwhelming evidence to support that humans evolved from a more primitive ape-like species. That is the logical and most likely conclusion, not "faith."


The fact that you say most likely proves that it is faith. That's what fact and proof are. You said most likely, there is no dispute, and the idea that something is most likely and not certain means it is faith. Thank you for arguing in my favor. Only when there is no doubt what so ever does faith cease to exist.

And of course faith uses evidence. Faith doesn't mean crazy Christians talking about men living in whales. It means believing in something that you aren't 100% sure of and cannot show to anyone to prove. If evolution were like gravity you could show it to all these nuts and convince them otherwise. But evolution, just like carbon dating is not as solid as gravity. That's my only point. I am not arguing for creationism or intelligent design.

Quote
Faith is the confident belief or trust in the truth or trustworthiness of a person, idea, or thing.[1][2] The word "faith" can refer to a religion itself or to religion in general. As with "trust", faith involves a concept of future events or outcomes, and is used conversely for a belief "not resting on logical proof or material evidence."

The theory of human evolution has an overwhelming amount of material evidence to support it. Faith has nothing to do with evidence. They are two completely different things and not comparable at all. The theory of human evolution relies on evidence and the logical conclusion from said evidence. Religion is based on absolute faith with absolutely no logical reasoning. How many times am I going to have to say this?

Evolution has been proven because we have witnessed it. Evolution is fact, just as much as gravity. You are confusing this with the theory of human evolution, which cannot have been witnessed because it happened over millions of years. Regardless of whether you are talking about evolution as a fact, or the theory of human evolution, neither are comparable to faith in the slightest.
« Last Edit: December 01, 2009, 04:59:39 PM by rapsodie, the troll prince »
 

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Re: Evolution
« Reply #28 on: December 01, 2009, 04:59:11 PM »
The theory of human evolution has an overwhelming amount of evidence to support it. Faith has nothing to do with evidence.

real talkkkkkkkk!!!!!!!!!! my nigga real talkkkkkkkk!!!!. sorry i just wanted to do that once.
 

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Re: Evolution
« Reply #29 on: December 01, 2009, 05:11:01 PM »
evolution is false.  here is the proof...be ready to get pwnd....

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/7sanplNTr6c&amp;hl=en_US&amp;fs=1&amp;" target="_blank" class="new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/7sanplNTr6c&amp;hl=en_US&amp;fs=1&amp;</a>



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Prove to me the wind. Show me the wind man. I want proof of that shit. Cuz I don't see it.