It's May 23, 2024, 08:09:56 AM
If I was to try and somehow explain how some Muslims have gotten away from the Qu'ran, my perception is this. What happened is some Muslims believe that the best way to understand Islam is to understand it the same way that the companions (Sahabah) of the Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) understood Islam. So therefore they don't read the Qu'ran and draw their own conclusions, but rather they look into old narrations of stories from the lifetime of the Prophet Muhammad and his companions and try to imitate them.
I understand their logic in doing so, and some of the best Muslims I know take this approach. However, the problem arrises when they fail to realize that Qu'ran was a revelation that is timeless and universal. Therefore, you should not insist in applying the same approach to the Qu'ran as was taken 1400 years ago.
I think what your describing is kind of an internal issue amongst Muslims. We should generally be inclined towards discussing and dealing with these things internally amongst each other.
I think what your describing is kind of an internal issue amongst Muslims. We should generally be inclined towards discussing and dealing with these things internally amongst eachother. I'll send you a Personal Message.
Quote from: Don Rizzle on May 10, 2006, 03:16:12 AMiraq would just get annexed by iranThat would be a great solution. If Iran and the majority of Iraqi's are pleased with it, then why shouldn't they do it?
iraq would just get annexed by iran
see this is the problem of muslims today they are not tolerant of other religions like you tryna question easter when everyone is celebrating it, but someone questioning how islam is practised is suddenly private matter. your mind is warped my friend.
Nibs, I was going to look for examples from Qu'ran to illucidate my point, and then I realized I can just use the same examples you used in your opening post. You may not have understood fully what I was saying in my opening response, I think the examples might help....
sura 2:62Those who believe (in the Qur'an), and those who follow the Jewish (scriptures), and the Christians and the Sabians,- any who believe in God and the Last Day, and work righteousness, shall have their reward with their Lord; on them shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve.
sura 33:59O Prophet ! tell thy wives and thy daughters, and the women of the believers, that they should pull down upon them of their outer cloaks from their heads over their faces. That is more likely that they may thus be recognized and not molested. And ALLAH is Most Forgiving, Merciful.
Quote from: Don Rizzle on April 17, 2006, 01:38:37 AMsee this is the problem of muslims today they are not tolerant of other religions like you tryna question easter when everyone is celebrating it, but someone questioning how islam is practised is suddenly private matter. your mind is warped my friend.The problem wasn't in the post or the question. Infact, Nibs and I are coming from the same perspective. The problem is that there are always people waiting in the wings for any oppurtunity to exploit Muslims. If they find any dispute amongst Muslims they will try to exploit it. For example, look at the way you guys always try to make a discord between Tech and I. In some istances you'll say I'm not a real Muslim cause I'm white, then in other instances you'll say he's not a real Muslim because he doesn't proclaim Islam at the forum the way I do.
Quote from: nibs on April 16, 2006, 08:22:40 PMsura 2:62Those who believe (in the Qur'an), and those who follow the Jewish (scriptures), and the Christians and the Sabians,- any who believe in God and the Last Day, and work righteousness, shall have their reward with their Lord; on them shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve.^^One viewpoint, is Muslims who won't even try to understand this verse themselves. They will go straight to what a famous 9th century scholar of the past has said concerning the subject. On this verse for example, one major scholar of that time period ruled that this verse is talking about Christians of the past who believed in 1 God and that it no longer applied to them since the coming of Muhammad (pbuh). Now obviously, you and I reading this verse, would not come to this conclusion. We would read it and understand it as is. But the scholar ruling on this verse may not even be looking at the verse directly, he may may be reading through thousands of narrations and stories about the Prophet Muhammad and his companions and their dealings and sayings concerning Christians. The problem is, those narrations may be innacurate or they may only be talking about that specific time period, place, and cirumstances, but the Qu'ran was sent for all ages and all of mankind so it shouldn't be limited to just one specific place, time, and circumstance.You feel me? Quote from: nibs on April 16, 2006, 08:22:40 PMsura 33:59O Prophet ! tell thy wives and thy daughters, and the women of the believers, that they should pull down upon them of their outer cloaks from their heads over their faces. That is more likely that they may thus be recognized and not molested. And ALLAH is Most Forgiving, Merciful.^^Only Sher Ali translated this verse to mean faces: Check a couple other translations:Khalifa O prophet, tell your wives, your daughters, and the wives of the believers that they shall lengthen their garments. Thus, they will be recognized (as righteous women) and avoid being insulted. GOD is Forgiver, Most Merciful. Yusuf Ali O Prophet! Tell thy wives and daughters, and the believing women, that they should cast their outer garments over their persons (when abroad): that is most convenient, that they should be known (as such) and not molested. And God is Oft- Forgiving, Most Merciful. Pickthal O Prophet! Tell thy wives and thy daughters and the women of the believers to draw their cloaks close round them (when they go abroad). That will be better, so that they may be recognised and not annoyed. Allah is ever Forgiving, Merciful. Shakir O Prophet! say to your wives and your daughters and the women of the believers that they let down upon them their over-garments; this will be more proper, that they may be known, and thus they will not be given trouble; and Allah is Forgiving, Merciful. Sher Ali O Prophet ! tell thy wives and thy daughters, and the women of the believers, that they should pull down upon them of their outer cloaks from their heads over their faces. That is more likely that they may thus be recognized and not molested. And Allah is Most Forgiving, Merciful. "Progressive Muslims" O prophet, tell your wives, your daughters, and the wives of the believers that they should draw their cloaks about themselves. That is better so that they would be recognized and not harmed. God is Forgiver, Merciful. ^^Anyway... that's not the point I want to make. The point I want to make is that many Muslims won't try to understand this verse directly from the Qu'ran anyway. They will go to stories and narrations from the Prophet Muhammad and his companions, and begin imitating them. Most women did not cover their faces, but the Prophet Muhammad's wives did cover their faces. Some women feel that it's best to imitate the Prophet Muhammad's wives so they cover their faces.You feel where I'm coming from now? Many Muslims don't try to read and understand the Qu'ran like you and I do, they just try to read stories from the Prophet's liftetime (Hadith, Seerah, Sunnah) and imitate the Prophet Muhammad and his companions or they follow the jurispudence of a scholar.