Lifestyle > Train of Thought
Why does Palestine not have the right to exist?
TraceOneInfinite:
--- Quote from: Don Rizzle on August 01, 2006, 12:31:55 PM ---
the ottoman empire collapsed from within, ww1 just put the final nail in their coffin
--- End quote ---
No, they were sabatoged from the outside AND from within. Europe and Russia were attacking them from the outside, and Britian was also formenting rebellion from within, by giving weapons and financial aid to all of the enemies of the Empire, and spreading nationalism throughout the Islamic Empire. Because of Europe's racist influences, nationalism started to spread throughout the Empire. The Arabs told British operative T.E. Lawrence that they had no reason to rebel against an Islamic government, but T.E. Lawrence told them that they needed to fight in the name of Arab nationalism.
T.E. Lawrence wrote in his diaries of Britian's plan to divide and conquer the Muslim lands, and the efforts to aid Sharif Hussien in his rebellion (Sharif Hussien is a family member of today's Saudi and Jordanian royal families, who were the puppet dictators installed by Britian to lead Arabia after the fall of the Ottoman Empire).
"Sharif Hussien's activities in Arabia are beneficial to us, because they march in step with our immediate aims, which is the breakup of the Islamic bloc, and the defeat and disruption of the Ottoman Empire. The Arabs are even less stable than the Turks. If this is properly handled, they will remain in a state of political mosaic, a tissue of jealous principalities, incapable of political cohesion."
I TO DA GEEZY:
I'm not denying a people's existence due to absence of nationalist narrative, God forbid.
I recognize the historical land of "Palestine" per se, as a legitimate basis for nationalist claims. This isn't even my point. Here it is:
--- Quote ---Before 1967 the Palestinians which are known today as Palestinians, the ones who you call Palestinians, the ones claiming to be an inseparable part of the Arab Nation, didn't exist.
--- End quote ---
Today's "Palestinians" view themselves as an inseparable part of the Arab Nation. Even though the historical land of "Palestine" existed before, yes before, the Arabization of the region and before the massive immigration of Arabs from Syria and Arabia to Palestine during the Ottoman Empire. Before that, the Arab population did not have the prominence it had later. The Ottoman empire per se was also a conquest (although an Islamic one) of the land, as was the British conquest centuries later. The charter of the current Palestinian leadership states their final goal is Arab Unition under a single sovereignty, as opposed to Palestinian sovereignty. Question is what made "Palestinian Arab" leaders distinguish the "Palestinian Arabs" from the Arab Nation, when all they want is really Arab unition. Another question is what made them use the term "Palestinian" in an exclusive application to the Arabs of the region, when the name Palestine was there before the Arabization of the region (BEFORE the Arab prominence in the region) and included other groups as well among which were also Jews. I recall the Palestinian Charter made a reference to a possibility of non-Arab Palestinians, true, although it also stated the inseparability of the "Palestinian People" from the Arab Nation. All I'm saying is that today's Palestinians are merely a political token in the fight for Arab Unition. Even without the Zionist movement there would be "Palestine" today, like it was there centuries ago, before Zionism and before the Ottoman Empire. However, hadn't there been an Islamic conquest of this and other regions, there would be no Arab claim to the land now, hence no Palestinian Arab claim to the land.
Don Rizzle:
--- Quote from: Hajj Abdul-Infinite...BANNED FOR SPEAKING TRUTH! on August 01, 2006, 11:56:39 PM ---
--- Quote from: Don Rizzle on August 01, 2006, 12:31:55 PM ---
the ottoman empire collapsed from within, ww1 just put the final nail in their coffin
--- End quote ---
No, they were sabatoged from the outside AND from within. Europe and Russia were attacking them from the outside, and Britian was also formenting rebellion from within, by giving weapons and financial aid to all of the enemies of the Empire, and spreading nationalism throughout the Islamic Empire. Because of Europe's racist influences, nationalism started to spread throughout the Empire. The Arabs told British operative T.E. Lawrence that they had no reason to rebel against an Islamic government, but T.E. Lawrence told them that they needed to fight in the name of Arab nationalism.
T.E. Lawrence wrote in his diaries of Britian's plan to divide and conquer the Muslim lands, and the efforts to aid Sharif Hussien in his rebellion (Sharif Hussien is a family member of today's Saudi and Jordanian royal families, who were the puppet dictators installed by Britian to lead Arabia after the fall of the Ottoman Empire).
"Sharif Hussien's activities in Arabia are beneficial to us, because they march in step with our immediate aims,which is the breakup of the Islamic bloc, and the defeat and disruption of the Ottoman Empire.The Arabs are even less stable than the Turks. If this is properly handled, they will remain in a state of political mosaic, a tissue of jealous principalities, incapable of political cohesion."
--- End quote ---
the turks were not stable in their last century of empire, they were like an imparla surrounded by lions, with no real source of wealth their richest countries were the baltic states which were relatively poor compared to europe which is where their grip was also weakest..........
Don Rizzle:
and the reason we encourage mutany in the ottoman empire was because they allied themselves with germany, heence they dug their own grave
TraceOneInfinite:
--- Quote from: Don Rizzle on August 02, 2006, 01:21:37 AM ---and the reason we encourage mutany in the ottoman empire was because they allied themselves with germany, heence they dug their own grave
--- End quote ---
No, the unbelievers (British, etc.) had been against the Kalifah for quite some time, and even now Tony Blair says Britian will never allow and accept the emergence of another Kalifah. The reason why is because the disbelievers will never be pleased with those who believe until they change their way. It is their goal to spread emnity and hate amongst those who believe. The Arabs, Africans, Indians, and Turks were united by the rope of Allah but it was the goal of people like Lawrence of Arabia to divide them along the lines of racial lines, and draw for them new boundaries of nationalism.
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